Non-debating religious thread...let's learn!! :)

I am curious as to which faith you belong? you have certainly opened up a can of worms for discussion here, I have to say I could not disagree with you more , especially on your last statement about men making the final decisions and women not holding positions in any church, and women submitting to their husbands, this is 2004, regardless of your faith surely you can see this is wrong to have women still treated as second class citizens, however I respect your beliefs and you have a right to them, I just feel completely the opposite to you in most of the things you said, except that people can be christians without going to church, that one I agree with 100 per cent.

I'm usually all for healthy debates. But, don't forget the title of this thread. I think another thread could be started, or pms could be sent, but, this thread has been really civil and strictly for learning purposes. It's been really nice so far, let's keep it that way. Peace....

Quote:

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Originally posted by KBlaix


What does it mean to baptize a child? What do you do in this process, and what does it symbolize? To be baptized as a baby means nothing,

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I was with you up to this statement. Obviously, this goes against your personal beliefs, and may mean nothing to you, but that does not mean it means nothing.

When child is baptised, their parents are dedicating their child to God and promising to raise their child in the church. They are asking God to accept their child into his family.

I was raised Roman Catholic, so I can not speak for other religions that baptise children, but in the Catholic faith, Baptisim is reaffirmed in Confirmation. This is when the "child" can now speak for themselves and makes an adult decision to be part of the church. When I was in school, this was done in the 8th grade (too early to make an adult decision in my opinion) and now many churches are doing it even earlier. I think that confirmation should happen when and if the "child" chooses, not at the age the church dictates. Just my opinion.




As I said, I was raised Roman Catholic, although I do not regularly attend church now. I have vistied many different churches, and was active in a Baptist youth group, although I was not a member of the church.

My biggest problem with religions in general is that everyone thinks they are right. "If you don't go to church X, you will not go to heaven" I do not believe that. I also think that while some people's intentions are good, they are so dedicated to their particular religious denomination they close their minds to all other views. I have sen or been in many discussions where people will quote the Bible left and right to defend their view, but when an opposite view supported by a Bible quote no response is made or the topic is changed.

Hey hey now...I started this to LEARN about different faiths...it's a discussion and exchange of information, and while technically this still fits those criteria. I don't want to see this thread get locked, because I've been ENTHRALLED so far! :)

Quote:

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Originally posted by GoldenRetrLuver
I'm technically Catholic. I was baptized in a Catholic church, had my first communion, and went to CCD for five years. (A sort of 'program' to learn more about the religion, and what you have to take in order to have your first communion.) I could honestly say, that I forgot *most* of what I learned. :o

I don't consider myself an athiest; I do believe in a God, but I don't agree with what the religon teaches.

I have a question for Christians- Is it true that you have to be 'saved' in order to enter heaven? if so, could you explain a little bit about that, please? Just wondering. :)

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Maybe this is a trifle late to be answering this, but I'd like to take a shot just the same.

Using the term "saved" generally implies making a decision for Christ. Some denominations of Christianity believe in this, some don't.

I believe that we get to heaven only by the grace of God. I believe we are all horrible, wretched people. We cannot make a decision to follow God, we can only turn away from Him. We have to have faith, but our faith comes from God.

Does this make sense?

I thought I'd try to "lighten" the mood a bit. This came by email this morning.

This is worth reading!!

Subject: Children Letters to God

> 1. Dear God,
> >
> > Please put another holiday between Christmas and Easter.
> > There is nothing good in there now.
> >
> > Amanda
> > **************************************
> > 2. Dear God,
> >
> > Thank you for the baby brother but what I asked for was a
> > puppy. I never asked for anything before. You can look it up.
> >
> > Joyce
> > **************************************
> > 3. Dear Mr. God,
> >
> > I wish you would not make it so easy for people to come apart.
> > I had to have 3 stitches and a shot.
> >
> > Janet
> > **************************************
> > 4. Dear God,
> >
> > If we come back as somebody else, please don't let me be
> > Jennifer Horton - because I hate her.
> >
> > Denise
> > **************************************6. God,
> > Dear God,
> >
> > I read the bible. What does begat mean? Nobody will tell me.
> >
> > Love, Alison
> > **************************************
> > 7. Dear God,
> >
> > How did you know you were God? Who told you?
> >
> > Charlene
> > **************************************
> > 8. Dear God,
> >
> > Is it true my Father won't get in Heaven if he uses his golf
> > words in the house?
> >
> > Anita
> > **************************************
> > 9. Dear God,
> >
> > I bet it's very hard for you to love all of everybody in the
> > whole world. There are only 4 people in our family and I can never
> > do it.
> >
> > Nan
> > **************************************
> > 10. Dear God,
> >
> > Did you really mean, Do Unto Others As They Do Unto You? If you
> > did then I'm going to get even with my brother.
> >
> > Darla
> > **************************************
> > 11. Dear God,
> >
> > I like the story about Chanukah the best of all of them. You
> > really made up some good ones. I like walking on water, too.
> >
> > Glenn
> > **************************************
> > 12. Dear God,
> >
> > My Grandpa says you were around when he was a little boy. How
> > far back do you go?
> >
> > Love, Dennis
> > *************************************
> > 13. Dear God,
> >
> > Do you draw the lines around the countries? If you don't, who
> > does?
> >
> > Nan
> > *************************************
> > 14. Dear God,
> >
> > It's O. K. that you made different religions but don't you get
> > mixed up sometimes?
> >
> > Arnold
> >
> > *************************************
> > 15. Dear God,
> >
> > Did you mean for giraffes to look like that or was it an
> > accident?
> >
> > Norma
> > *************************************
> > 16. Dear God,
> >
> > In bible times, did they really talk that fancy?
> >
> > Jennifer
> > *************************************
> > 17. Dear God,
> >
> > What does it mean you are a jealous God? I thought you had
> > everything you wanted.
> >
> > Jane
> > *************************************
> > 18. Dear God,
> >
> > How come you did all those miracles in the old days and don't do
> > many now?
> >
> > Seymour
> > *************************************
> > 19. Dear God,
> >
> > Please send Dennis to a different summer camp this year.
> >
> > Peter
> > *************************************
> > 20. Dear God,
> >
> > Maybe Cain and Abel would not kill each other so much if they
> > each had their own rooms. It works out OK with me and my brother.
> >
> > Larry
> > ************************************
> > 21. Dear God,
> >
> > I keep waiting for spring, but it never did come yet. What's up?
> > Don't forget.
> >
> > Mark
> > ************************************
> > 22. Dear God,
> >
> > You don't have to worry about me. I always look both ways before
> > I cross the street.
> >
> > Dean
> > ************************************
> > 23. Dear God,
> >
> > My brother told me about how you are born but it just doesn't
> > sound right. What do you say?
> >
> > Martha
> > ************************************
> > 24. Dear God,
> >
> > If you watch in Church on Sunday I will show you my new shoes.
> >
> > ************************************
> > 25. Dear God,
> >
> > Is Reverend Coe a friend of yours, or do you just know him
> > through the business?
> >
> > Donny
> > ************************************
> > 26. Dear God,
> >
> > In Sunday School they told us what you do for a job.
> > Who does it when you are on vacation?
> >
> > Jane
> > ************************************
> > 27. Dear God,
> >
> > In school we read that Thomas Edison made light, but in Sundaym
> > School they said you did it first. Did he steal your idea?
> >
> > Sincerely, Donna
> > ************************************
> > 28. Dear God,
> >
> > I do not think anybody could be a better God than you. Well, I
> > just want you to know that. I am not just saying that because you
are
> > already God.
> >
> > Charles
> > ***********************************
> > 29. Dear God,
> >
> > It is great the way you always get the stars in the right place.
> > Why can't you do that with the moon?
> >
> > Jeff
> > ***********************************
> > 30. Dear God,
> >
> > I am doing the best I can. Really.
> >
> > Frank
> > ***********************************
> > 31. Dear God,
> >
> > I didn't think orange went with purple until I saw the sunset you
> > made on Tuesday night. That was really cool.
> >
> > Carol

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Originally posted by sirrahved


Using the term "saved" generally implies making a decision for Christ.

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Or...

Having a real good pitcher come out of the bullpen late in a game-when the outcome is in question.

Or....

Having a hockey goalie make a real good stop on a point blank shot....;)

----------------------------------

?????

Ship of Fools to run 3D church service

The world's first "three-dimensional" internet church service is being launched next month.

The service, on the Ship of Fools satirical Christian website, will have cartoon characters for a congregation. It will also feature wooden pews.

The service will be celebrated by a priest who will appear in cartoon form and who will be able to move around the church.

The congregation will be able to log on and see themselves as cartoon characters on the screen.

Simon Jenkins, the website's editor said: "We're running this as an experiment for three months and we are looking forward to seeing how people use the church and what they get out of it."

The service begins on May 11.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Cincy'sMom
I was with you up to this statement. Obviously, this goes against your personal beliefs, and may mean nothing to you, but that does not mean it means nothing.

When child is baptised, their parents are dedicating their child to God and promising to raise their child in the church. They are asking God to accept their child into his family.

I was raised Roman Catholic, so I can not speak for other religions that baptise children, but in the Catholic faith, Baptisim is reaffirmed in Confirmation. This is when the "child" can now speak for themselves and makes an adult decision to be part of the church. When I was in school, this was done in the 8th grade (too early to make an adult decision in my opinion) and now many churches are doing it even earlier. I think that confirmation should happen when and if the "child" chooses, not at the age the church dictates. Just my opinion.

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I'm Baptist. We do have a ceremony in which parents dedicate their baby to the Lord and vow to love and raise them in his name. However baptism is totally different we don't baptize a person until they are saved. I didn't mean to offend you or any one, that is just the way and beliefs of a baptist.

Quote:

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I am curious as to which faith you belong? you have certainly opened up a can of worms for discussion here, I have to say I could not disagree with you more , especially on your last statement about men making the final decisions and women not holding positions in any church, and women submitting to their husbands, this is 2004, regardless of your faith surely you can see this is wrong to have women still treated as second class citizens, however I respect your beliefs and you have a right to them, I just feel completely the opposite to you in most of the things you said, except that people can be christians without going to church, that one I agree with 100 per cent.

---

I don't want to turn this into a big thing, this is just what I believe, which is what this thread is about. I never said that a woman shouldn't or couldn't hold a position in any church. What I said was I don't believe that a woman should be a pastor. I understand that this is 2004 but I think there is a lot wrong in 2004.

Kblaix, I think you stated your opinion and your views, which is what this thread is all about, whether somoene agrees or disagrees.

In the Methodist faith, which I follow, we baptize infants, and it is as ceremony that involves the parents, loved ones, and the whole congregation, who are all agreeing to bring up this infant in our faith, and to support their parents, much like the dedication in the Baptist fait.

Logan

I wish to say I am sorry, I realise this is not mean't to be a debating thread, and I was doing that, I really never mean't to come across that way, and I do respect each individuals opinions, I Did not mean to challenge your views, I have no intention of turning this thread into something its not mean't to be.

I have found it interesting to read about what people believe, its been quite an eye-opener to me.

As a presbyterian, we also follow the baptism of infants, with a vow from the family/congregation to bring the infant up as a child of God. Then, in 7th or 8th grade, we go through Confirmation, and make a personal statement to the church of our faith.

Quote:

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Originally posted by KBlaix
I'm Baptist. We do have a ceremony in which parents dedicate their baby to the Lord and vow to love and raise them in his name. However baptism is totally different we don't baptize a person until they are saved. I didn't mean to offend you or any one, that is just the way and beliefs of a baptist.

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KBlaix,

I assumed from your post that you were batptist or something simliar, becuase I have many friends with your same beliefs and they are. (I know never assume!) I have no problem with your belifes. I was just trying to point out ( and I think I did so poorly) that while baptism as a child means nothing in your religion, it does have a meaning to others. Since Popcornbird was asking and she is not a christian, your answer could have been interpretted to mean it is a pointless thing to all christian religions. Maybe a better explain by you would have been, "while my religion does not recognize a baptsim as a child others do blah blah blah" I did not mean to offened or imply that I was offended. Just trying to clear up the point for a non-christian.

Does that make any sense?

This thread is neat.

I was brought up Congregationalist, and there's a lot to like about that brand of Christianity. It is a quite simple denomination, in terms of ceremony. We had baptisms of infants, Holy Communion, and special Christmas and Lenten/Easter services. One went through Sunday school and confirmation, and affirmed themselves as a member, typically on Maundy Thursday, which was also first Communion.

I don't attend church regularly, but sing with a group who performs as a guest choir at different churches so I see a number of variations of the theme of Christianity. They are more similar than different.

My personal beliefs would be considered convoluted at best. I don't think you can fully describe God. I believe there is a Supreme Being, who shows different faces at different times to individuals and/or groups. My view of the whole Trinity thing is that it's a matter of faith, and one can go nuts trying to make logic of it. There's logic, but it's God's not of man.

My "religion" doesn't really have a name, I guess. I do believe in the many equivalents of the Golden Rule, and most definitely in karma, or you reap what you sow.

How many sects are there in Christianity? I always knew there were several, but I didn't know they differ so much. :o

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Originally posted by popcornbird
How many sects are there in Christianity? I always knew there were several, but I didn't know they differ so much. :o

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I've never tried to count, but there are quite a few!!

Quote:

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Originally posted by popcornbird
How many sects are there in Christianity?

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There is alot of sects in Christianity.

The problem is they don't believe in birth control.:rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally posted by RICHARD
There is alot of sects in Christianity.

The problem is they don't believe in birth control.:rolleyes:

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Richard!!! :eek: You are too funny for your own good!!! LOL!!

Popcornbird, that is not true, although there are some people of Christian faith who do not believe in birth control, most are not that way.

Logan

Quote:

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Originally posted by Logan
Richard!!! :eek: You are too funny for your own good!!! LOL!!

Popcornbird, that is not true, although there are some people of Christian faith who do not believe in birth control, most are not that way.

Logan

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I knew I didn't need to believe Richard anyway, Logan. ;);)

LOL!

Quote:

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Originally posted by popcornbird
How many sects are there in Christianity? I always knew there were several, but I didn't know they differ so much. :o

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I would be interesting to know, but I am not sure it would be possible to count.

Even within Catholic, there is Roman, and Eastern Orthodox. Some catholic churches are very traditionalist and others are more "modern" . And that is true of any christian religion.
My ex-boyfriend could only go to Baptist churches that belonged to the Council of Regular Baptist churches ( or a name similiar to that).
I have two friends who both go to fundalmentalist churches and their beliefs are almost indentical, expect that one friend believes in speaking in tongues, the other does not. Tothe non-tongues speaking friend, that is a major point and she would not consider dating someone on that point alone.

Quote:

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Originally posted by ChrisH
Great thread WolfChan! :) And special thanks to you, Kimmy, and Popcornbird, very interesting. :)

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Awww. Thank you Chris. :)

Kudos to all. :D

As a Lutheran (LCMS), we believe in grace alone saving through faith. We baptize infants, believe that women should not be pastors, elders, or the president of a congregation. Most of us believe that speaking in tongues was something that had a specific purpose when it was used, and God no longer uses it. We believe in the trinity, that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three beings and one being. I can't think of anything else particularly special...

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Originally posted by Cincy'sMom
KBlaix,

I assumed from your post that you were batptist or something simliar, becuase I have many friends with your same beliefs and they are. (I know never assume!) I have no problem with your belifes. I was just trying to point out ( and I think I did so poorly) that while baptism as a child means nothing in your religion, it does have a meaning to others. Since Popcornbird was asking and she is not a christian, your answer could have been interpretted to mean it is a pointless thing to all christian religions. Maybe a better explain by you would have been, "while my religion does not recognize a baptsim as a child others do blah blah blah" I did not mean to offened or imply that I was offended. Just trying to clear up the point for a non-christian.

Does that make any sense?

---

I apologize, I did say that very poorly.
I do have a question, do you have a second baptism after you've been saved?

Quote:

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Originally posted by KBlaix

I do have a question, do you have a second baptism after you've been saved?

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In general, most Catholics, will say they have been Confirmed, not saved. In my interpretation, the underlying meaning is the same. You are making an adult to decision to live your life in the teachings of the church, you ask God into your heart and to help guide you. There is no second Baptism associated with this, and no Baptism by submiersion is done at any stage. There is, however, a renewal of baptism vows, in which you state these intentions and promsie to reject Satan and all his evil ways. You are also anoited with a special oil.

How on earth did I miss this thread? ;)

My beliefs are similar to those of Sirrahbed and Sara.

Some beliefs I'd like to add:

-I don't like to call myself anything more than Christian...even then, that's only because I believe in Jesus Christ.

-The woman/church thing. I believe that if God called me to a leadership role in a church, I'd take it. I'm a big time feminist, but also close to God. I pray all the time and go to Him for everything...I feel that if I were wrong, it would have been put on my heart a long time ago. My inlaws do believe women shouldn't hold certain leadership roles in church, my husband may very well believe the same...but they all know not to utter even the slightest opinion around me. ;)

-Baptism. I was baptised a year ago. I believe baptism is something one should do when they are old enough to fully grasp what it is. Baptism is desplay of one's faith in Jesus and God. I personally don't feel a child is capable of doing that and having it truly mean something.

-Children and sin. I think Sara and Serrahbed explained it exactly how I would have. Its kind of like if someone living in some remote wilderness dies....what if they didn't know God (any religion), would they go to hell? No, God bases where we're going on our heart...if one that died in that desolate wilderness enjoyed torturing animals, they most likely wouldn't meet me in heaven. ;) Does that make sense?

-Here's a hot topic...tithing. I feel that by giving $$ to God's children "counts" in the giving category. Not all giving needs to be at a church. I believe God puts certain things on people hearts, for me its His animals and sick children.

-Another hot topic...church membership. Its not for me. I think its good that people join together, they are stronger and can accomplish a lot more. Its great, but not for me. I don't feel I need to be tied to ONE specific church or religous label to be the person God wants me to be. I love attending church because I learn more every time and I get to praise the Lord through song. But I don't feel I need to stay in one place to do that. I can praise Him at home or at my grandmother's church.

Those are just my beliefs, not those of Sara or Sirrahbed. Don't want to sound like I was talking for them. :D

This is a great thread. I didn't know ANYTHING about Paganism and I find it so very interesting. Thanks for starting this thread. :)

This is a great thread! I didn't get a chance to read through it all but I did learn quite a bit. Thanks for starting it WolfChan.

I am also a Christian.

Quote:

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Some beliefs I'd like to add:
-I don't like to call myself anything more than Christian...even then, that's only because I believe in Jesus Christ.

-The woman/church thing. I believe that if God called me to a leadership role in a church, I'd take it. I'm a big time feminist, but also close to God. I pray all the time and go to Him for everything...I feel that if I were wrong, it would have been put on my heart a long time ago. My inlaws do believe women shouldn't hold certain leadership roles in church, my husband may very well believe the same...but they all know not to utter even the slightest opinion around me.

-Baptism. I was baptised a year ago. I believe baptism is something one should do when they are old enough to fully grasp what it is. Baptism is desplay of one's faith in Jesus and God. I personally don't feel a child is capable of doing that and having it truly mean something.

-Children and sin. I think Sara and Serrahbed explained it exactly how I would have. Its kind of like if someone living in some remote wilderness dies....what if they didn't know God (any religion), would they go to hell? No, God bases where we're going on our heart...if one that died in that desolate wilderness enjoyed torturing animals, they most likely wouldn't meet me in heaven. Does that make sense?

-Here's a hot topic...tithing. I feel that by giving $$ to God's children "counts" in the giving category. Not all giving needs to be at a church. I believe God puts certain things on people hearts, for me its His animals and sick children.

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I totally agree. As for attending church, I haven't been in a while and I don't think you need to go to church to be a "good Christian". Maybe I feel this way because our local church bothers me...the priests mutter everything and I just sit there not learning at all. I actually feel more comfortable praying to God at home. I pray during the day but mostly at night. I feel like I have a good relationship with God and He has truly helped me through some difficult times. :) Faith is just important to me.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by NoahsMommy

Baptism is desplay of one's faith in Jesus and God.
That is a denominational difference - I do not believe baptism is a display or symbol - but rather a sacrament - a means of grace that is done by God and a miracle. My belief is that the outward show of faith is done later at confirmation and reaffirmed continually throughout life. Not a matter of salvation - just a difference. .

-Here's a hot topic...tithing. I feel that by giving $$ to God's children "counts" in the giving category. Not all giving needs to be at a church. I believe God puts certain things on people hearts, for me its His animals and sick children.
Yes, tithing has become pretty legalistic. To me and my understanding of the Bible, tithing is not just $$ - it includes time, talent, etc - just as Kelly has said. It does not mean 10% either. It *can* but that would be legalism IMHO.

-Another hot topic...church membership.
The Bible says we are not to neglect the gathering together - but church membership - I dunno. I did a search on Google and found that there are over 1000 denominations of Christians!! Sheesh! And of course each is the RIGHT one! (just kidding) I believe we need to gather with others who have similar beliefs but I have been burned by the institutional church but still belong to the Church with a "C". The closest thing I can claim is Lutheran but I do not belong to a Lutheran church. I am just a Christian.

This is a great thread. I didn't know ANYTHING about Paganism and I find it so very interesting. Thanks for starting this thread. :)

I agree - I have also enjoyed hearing about LDS, Muslims etc. Hope it continues!

I am a Born Again Christian.

I was raised in the Methodist church, and was also baptized as an infant (sprinkled with water). I find nothing wrong with that...i believe it is just a statement from the parents to God, saying that they want to raise up the child to be a follower of Him...it doesn't make the child become saved, and of course there is no guarentee by doing that, that the child will walk with God in their future years.

I now attend a Baptist church and feel that once you are saved (have repented, accepted Christ and want to live your life for Him), that it is important to become baptized as an adult (or whenever that time was that you became a Christian). This baptism is a public display of your faith to God...before the congregation...if you are not truely saved, and have not asked God to take over your life, and truely walk with Him, then you shouldn't become baptised. This baptism is by submersion.

I, as a child, asked Christ to come into my life an save me. However, for me personally, i don't believe that i actually became "born again", until i was older (early teens), and i was sitting in a conference in my school (Christian school), and a man teaching there one day, just said some things that clicked with me, and i felt that i had been calling myself a Christian all of those years, but not truely walking with the Lord. And no one, but myself and the Lord would ever have known...but i just felt like, now i am really gonna start living my life for Christ. And i truely became a born again Christian at that point in my life. You might ask what i mean by becoming "born again"...i had believed in God before, and read the bible, attended church, but i was lacking the personal, close relationship that I now have with Jesus...and i hadn't realized it until that day. Christ is my Savior, Father, Friend...whom i love with all of me.

...about *Born Again*....that is a another of the 1000 denominational differences - I do not believe baptism is a display or symbol - but rather a sacrament - a means of grace that is done by God and a miracle. My belief is that the outward show of faith is done later at confirmation and reaffirmed continually throughout life. Not a matter of salvation - just a difference..... thus born again and again and again continually...:) Continuing in faith happens when the parents continue to bring that child to God's house and/or teach the child God's Word (another means of grace) This way of understanding baptism leaves all the work up to God - so we cannot take any credit for ourselves for making this good decision (known as "Decision Theology" in some circles) I do not believe it because it gives too much credit to US, IMHO - only the Holy Spirit can bring us to faith because we ourselves are spiritually dead and unable to do so. This is my belief. We are NOT going to agree. 1Peter3:21 clears it up for me - comparing the waters of baptism with Noah being saved from death - stating clearly that baptism does save. But again - a baptist will not agree with me here and it does not matter. This is not a debate - just sharing differing beliefs.

Quote:

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Originally posted by sirrahbed
Originally posted by NoahsMommy
Baptism is desplay of one's faith in Jesus and God.
That is a denominational difference - I do not believe baptism is a display or symbol - but rather a sacrament - a means of grace that is done by God and a miracle. My belief is that the outward show of faith is done later at confirmation and reaffirmed continually throughout life. Not a matter of salvation - just a difference. . [/B]

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I didn't mean to make it sound only symbolic. Its a very, very spiritual thing. I was trying to convey that I personally believe, as so most churches I've attended, that it isn't a required act for salvation. Someone here asked if a baby wasn't baptised, would they got to hell. That's what I meant by it. :)

Tithing with time...I agree 100%!! :D

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I, as a child, asked Christ to come into my life an save me. However, for me personally, i don't believe that i actually became "born again", until i was older (early teens), and i was sitting in a conference in my school (Christian school), and a man teaching there one day, just said some things that clicked with me, and i felt that i had been calling myself a Christian all of those years, but not truely walking with the Lord. And no one, but myself and the Lord would ever have known...but i just felt like, now i am really gonna start living my life for Christ. And i truely became a born again Christian at that point in my life. You might ask what i mean by becoming "born again"...i had believed in God before, and read the bible, attended church, but i was lacking the personal, close relationship that I now have with Jesus...and i hadn't realized it until that day. Christ is my Savior, Father, Friend...whom i love with all of me.

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I love this paragraph. :) Its always very cool for me to see/read how other's come to their faith, regardless of what religion it is. Yours is very similar to how I came to be Christain as well. :)

Just want to clarify and hope I did not border on debate about the *born again* - have been in heated debates with others about this and some who have been born into a church, baptised as infants and have never really had such a *moment* can be made to feel they missed something when in truth - they have not...I am an adult convert and while I do not really believe a *born again* experience is necessary - I do believe such experiences DO happen and sometimes repeatedly. Even Martin Luther - staunch Reformist had such an experience in his "tower" but it was the result of reading God's Word and was a renewal of growth on his journey. I can recall a time when I had been going to church for several years, I did already believe because the holy Spirit allowed me to believe, but was doing an intensive Bible study on my own in the book of John and suddenly, something just *clicked* and head knowledge became more real in my heart. Was I saved before this? Yes. Had I grown in faith? Yes. Have I *arrived*? No. It is an ongoing process. Hence being born again and again and again....etc.

But again - many Christians that have always been part of a church are no less Christian just because they have no moment of salvation or decision in their memory to claim. They were "saved" 2000 years ago when Christ died on the cross.

These are my beliefs:D

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Originally posted by sirrahbed
Just want to clarify and hope I did not border on debate about the *born again* - have been in heated debates with others about this and some who have been born into a church, baptised as infants and have never really had such a *moment* can be made to feel they missed something when in truth - they have not...I am an adult convert and while I do not really believe a *born again* experience is necessary - I do believe such experiences DO happen and sometimes repeatedly. Even Martin Luther - staunch Reformist had such an experience in his "tower" but it was the result of reading God's Word and was a renewal of growth on his journey. I can recall a time when I had been going to church for several years, I did already believe because the holy Spirit allowed me to believe, but was doing an intensive Bible study on my own in the book of John and suddenly, something just *clicked* and head knowledge became more real in my heart. Was I saved before this? Yes. Had I grown in faith? Yes. Have I *arrived*? No. It is an ongoing process. Hence being born again and again and again....etc.

But again - many Christians that have always been part of a church are no less Christian just because they have no moment of salvation or decision in their memory to claim. They were "saved" 2000 years ago when Christ died on the cross.

These are my beliefs:D

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To me, it doesn't matter how you became saved...the fact that you are, is what matters. If you were rasied Christian, strayed from God and came back to Him in your older years, that is a blessing to know that the Lord never left you, and was waiting for you to come back to Him...and if you became saved as a 5 year old child and grew to love Him more and moe everyday, staying close with Him your whole life...that is a wonderful thing as well..,it would be a shame to think that someone would make a Christian feel that their experience becoming a Christian was "better" or more "moving" than another...just the fact that you are one is all that would seem to matter to me.

When i think of calling myself "born again", i think of the fact that i was born a sinner, and upon recieveing Christ as my Savior, i then become "born again" (made new) (although still a sinner). And i agree, that as you grow in your Christianity, you do continue to renew your faith (or become born again), and again with Christ.

Wow...I just want to say that I'm VERY happy with how this thread is turning out. I hope it keeps going!! I've thought of a few questions, but I'll save them for when I get back form work. :)

I agree WolfChan. :D

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Originally posted by popcornbird
How many sects are there in Christianity? I always knew there were several, but I didn't know they differ so much. :o

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About 6.02 x10^23. (Sorry chemist geek humor.) There are probably hundreds, and they all disagree on the tiniest of minutiae, missing the Rabbi Jesus' point.

I want to bump this back up since Kay pointed it out to me.

The Pagan religion is something I'm very interested in. Reading this has led me to the decision that it might be right for me. :)

I'd really like to read more about it, I think. :)

Felt like answering thought it'd be fun...
Do you perform magic? What kind if so? Does it work and can you tell us about something magical that happened? If you do magic - is it you or does a god help you? Is it good or white magic?
Yes, healing usually, yes it works all the time, spirits help me, mostly good as bad tends to backfire on me more than the usual person and I've learned to accept that I can't help myself through magic too much. Also I can scry which is to see images is a pool of water (as compared to a crystal ball type scrying).

Why is your wand a "she" ? Is this usual? Would a man have a wand that was a "he"? Wand? What wand? I suppose it'd be from a tree which is usually described as feminine.

What do you call a man witch in your religion? Gardnerian Pagan- same as everybody else. A warlock is a bad witch- males and females.

How are you different from Wiccan? That is the only "witch" I have heard of. I prefer not to use wiccan because too many teenagers go through a fad stage in which they pretend to be "wiccan".

Do you dress differently to identify yourself? Nope but I wear a pentacle for protection and strength.

Do you find that people are fearful of you? Are they curious? If fearful, is it better if you explain what you believe? More likely prejudice and rude to me and try to convert me. I try to educate them. Some are afraid of so called black magick.

Do you have a group to meet together with? If so, is it regular like a service most people would be familiar with - that is - a Saturday or Sunday weekly service? Yes but not very often.

Do you believe in the Judeo-Christian God at all? Yes very much so, just not as the only one and all-powerful.

Do you believe in evolution? No.

Where will you go when you die? Do you believe in a heaven? Summerlands or possibly reincarnation.

Are people basically good or bad in your religious belief? Good but they are taught to be bad by popular culture.

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Originally posted by PJ's Mom
I want to bump this back up since Kay pointed it out to me.

The Pagan religion is something I'm very interested in. Reading this has led me to the decision that it might be right for me. :)

I'd really like to read more about it, I think. :)

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Good for you! I am always glad to see people educating themselves!

"God wants spritual fruits, not religious nuts" ;) Don't ask me where I got that from, I just happen to believe very strongly in that philosophy.

This is such a great thread, I really wish I had seen it earlier. It was so interesting to read about different beliefs. I am Christian, went to a Baptist church when I was little, then an Alliance church for a while, now a Weslyan church. They are all very much alike. There's so much I could talk about, I don't even know where to begin. I don't believe that you have to go to church to be considered christian, it's not for everybody. I personally love going to church, I have friends there and learn so much. The most important thing about a church to me is the ride home...if you can't wait to get home, are tired, or anything like that, the service may not have been right for you (if I feel that way every week, like I did after a while at my last church, it may be time to look for a new church, or just pray on your own). If on the ride home you feel good, want to be a better person and help others, and are thinking about how much you learned, it was beneficial.

I think it's great that everyone has put in their opinions and not much debate going on. It's amazing how many different religions there are, and how lots of them actually come down to a lot of the same beliefs (not just in christianity)

What a surprise to see this thread at the top again...but a good one! :)

I'm not trying to start an argument about this, although PM me if you want to talk about it...I am just bringing it up as something I thought a lot of people might find interesting.

An interesting topic that a lot of pagans disagree on....using magick to help yourself. A lot of pagans feel that it is wrong to use magic to help yourself more than you *need* to, and that seems to be almost unanimous(sp?) among Wiccans (that i've met).

However, I feel that magick is just a tool, like any other, and I tend to use any tool at my disposal to better my life and those around me. Lately, I've been wishing for more spending money. I have plenty of money to pay rent and buy food, even to get something fun every now and again, but I really wanted a little extra.

Am I a bad person for asking the aid of my dieties in finding a source of extra money? I asked, and a major pet-sitting job that made me around $600 popped up. I am very grateful that Goddess responded to my request so strongly, and I don't feel that it was bad to ask as long as I give thanks, but I know a lot of people who would disagree.

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I just re-read this whole thread and I think it's wonderful. Thanks for bringing it back up PJ's Mom. :)