Chewy, I need elp on the most important decision ever

i feel really bad. i guess a new pup would be great. what are you looking into? well, no matter what it is, i wish you the best of luck with him/her.

ash, i can suggest a whole bunch of things rather than put chewy down but i'm sure you have tried them already. what is left? an agressive dog like that isn't safe. i am so sorry. just be proud of yourself for actually trying to help him. some people would euthanize there pets because of little agression problems. i don't know what else to say. just take care of yourself. ::hugs:: to you

*HUGS*

Do not feel as if you have failed. You have tried everything.

Kia and I send our love and support.

~Kimmy, Kia, and Andy

Ash,

I think I would also get another dog pretty soon so I know how you feel. It is definately not replacing the other dog.

Can I suggest finding one at a shelter? Maybe you will feel better knowing that possibly Chewy was supposed to go to Rainbow Bridge so you could save a sweet innocent soul who would otherwise have been put to death for no reason.

I am sorry you are faced with such a tough decision. I know you have done everything you can for Chewy, and that he has had a loving and caring family while he was with you.
I will stand behind you 100% whatever you do, I know it will be hard.
Next time you're up this way, I'll give you my address, and you can stop in and meet my 2 nutcases--they should cheer you up a little.
Good luck with this very tough situation, I hope something can be done.
PM me if you need to talk.

Let me second what Mike said. We will come and get him if you will allow us to.

Quote:

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Originally posted by mugsy
Let me second what Mike said. We will come and get him if you will allow us to.

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That is so incredible of you to do, you two are truly dog heroes.

By the way, if you go to get Chewy, I'm pretty close, you should come by and meet Kito and Abbey!!!!

I just saw this thread.

Ash, my heart breaks to hear about Chewy. You have always worked so hard to help him when something went wrong. I remember I made you that picture of Chewy a long time ago when he bit Teddy. I hope you don't get mad for whatever reason, but I want to post it again.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...9/fd2cdf5e.jpg
Anyway, that is a very brave decision you have made. We all know how much you love Chewy, and how many things you did for him. You have our support as well.

omg! :( I just saw this thread and i am, very, very, sorry. I know how hard this must be, but i stand behind your decision. **HUGS**:( :( Im crying so hard right now! *tissue box please*
I still cant beleive this. God bless you and chewy.
I think i would also get a knew dog soon. I wish you all the luck in the world.

take care,
Jess

Quote:

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Let me second what Mike said. We will come and get him if you will allow us to.

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Ash, I think you should consider this offer before you put Chewy to sleep. Then if things still don't work out, you know you really did EVERYTHING for him and I'm sure you could still be there if he still needs to be put down. Mike and Molly may have more resources to try to get him help. You never know Ash. And you'd know what happened to him in the future, good or bad. If they didn't have this offer on the table to you, I'd say put him down. But with this option, my opinion changes.

Mike and Molly - you are wonderful people. That sounds so inadequate, but I think it sums you up.

I agree with micki76!


If after trying this he does not get better the only thing left to do would be to euthanize him.


As far as me saying he should go to a farm, that was before I KNEW he had had ongoing problems for while. Some herding dogs like this breed can be great if giving a positive thing to focus on, which in case would be herding.


If he is truly agressive, than yes it's common sense to put him down. There would be no safe place for him.


While working at the training center there was a dog there who was VERY agressive. He would lunge at people for no reason. The trainers worked with him for several months and eventually he became avery loving friendly couch potatoe dog. :)


But some dogs can't be fixed and if he can't there is no reason to put your lives or other innocent peoples at risk.

But please let Mugsy help. If after that they seem he would be unfit as a pet etc. then euthanasia would be best. Either way I fully support your decision and this must be truly heartbreaking for you and your family. I am very sorry this is happening to both you and Chewy. :( My heart goes out to all of you.

Ash,
I respect your decision and know your heart must
be breaking. I just want to make sure, that you have rulled out
Chewy's behavior is not a medical problem?
IF not I would do a complete blood work on Chewy
etc. to make sure he does not have a medical problem
such as Thyroid.
If he has no medical problems, than you know
your dog better than anyone.

Ash, I'm so sorry you have to go through this.

Was the behaviorist that you have taken Chewy to, a Specialist in Dog Aggression? Being the owner and foster home for GSDs, a breed that can show aggression, I am familiar with what your concerns are. In my area, we have an aggression behaviorist. In fact, he is the one who evaluated my assigned (but declined) first foster, Pete, who almost removed my nose. He was only 8 months old. He is now in training to be a police K-9. Something was able to be done for him, if not, he would have been pts.

Good luck to you and Chewy.

As I have said before in this thread I don't want to give Chewy to Mike or Molly because if they got bit by your dog how would you feel? I can't even imagine the guilt I would have if Chewy grabed one of there none furry dogs by the neck and threw it around the room like he did to Teddy. They have to many dogs and Chewy would not be happy. He has to be the alfa dog and he can't with 20 other large dogs. Also, there is always that one last thing you can try and you can always hold on to that hope but we have to learn to let it go, Chewy is agresive and I think we jut need to accept that. I mean how can he be? Look at him over in the corner eating Bunny poo, so adorable, lol. I promise to make his last week a special one. We plan on going to the park TONS of times and he is going to be bloated on dog biscuits. He doesn't have to eat dry dog food this week only wet. he will get a new monkey to tear apart in 2 days and he will be loved till no end.

On the issue of another dog we have deced on a Doberman, now I know what you are thinking they are mean agressive dogs and you don't want me to go through that again. We will be getting an older one, from a rescue. There is someone named Ronnie around here who is planning on giving up there 11/2 year old Female Dobie and we plan on talking with her about her. We called some rescues and the lady is having knee surgery and has no Dobies. We are also planning on going to the SPCA to look and see if they have any. We do plan on doing a temperment test on the dogs we get and we wont be getting any younger then a year. We will be looking at the dogs extensivly before even considering getting it.

Ash

Quote:

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Originally posted by slleipnir
I think your last resort should be giving him to a home who can help him out of this habbit, someone who knows dog behavior and can care for him. I don't think you should put him down :[

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I agree!

ASH, has Chewy been evaluated by a DOG AGGRESSION SPECIALIST?

Quote:

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Originally posted by Sudilar
ASH, has Chewy been evaluated by a DOG AGGRESSION SPECIALIST?

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Ash, there is a huge difference between a behaviorist and a dog aggression specialist. It could mean Chewy's life or death. Try to find a specialist. Please, for Chewy's sake. He may need a strong handler. You may not be what he needs to control him.

Yes Sue, I totally agree. That's why I wanted to take him. I am perfectly willing to accept whatever Chewy wants to dish out. I'm just concerned that he's not seen the people necessary to fix his problem. We have had 3 dogs with major aggression problems and they have been worked out. I'm sorry Ash, but I cannot in good faith support your family's decision.

Ash, what could it hurt to send Chewy to Molly and Mike. They are familiar with aggression and if he can be controlled, they are the ones to do it. Why would you kill him if he has a place to go? If Molly feels that he is hopeless (after exhausting ALL avenues), then I'm sure she will do the right thing. Sure sounds better than immediate death. Sorry to sound harsh, but we are talking death and I've seen too much of it lately. If there is a chance, why not give it to him. Just my opinion, sorry.

Ash, Why not give them a chance with him? I'm starting to question this an awful lot. Someone with a wealth of experience and complete knowledge of his issues has offered to take him and work with him and you still say no. You'd rather put him down????You ask how would we feel if our dog bit them or their family member? Well, I'd feel bad if they didn't know the risks, but they do. I'd feel much worse putting Chester or Millie to sleep if I could possibly avoid it. They would, I'm sure have him supervised at all times until they either got a handle on him, or could predict any bad behavior before it happened. I will be VERY disappointed if you follow though on this decision without giving them, and him a chance. I know Chewy isn't the dog you hoped he'd be, but he still deserves a chance. He may be a totally differnet dog with them. Dogs can adapt and change their personality with different people.
An extremely confident and strong hand may be what he needs. You may also find out that he doesn't need to be the alpha, or maybe he would be the alpha in their pack.

I have been informed that we have had more than 3 dogs with aggression issues and after thinking about it that's right. Mike has dealt with each and every one of them. Trust me on this one, we have seen just about everything there is to see when it comes to behaviors. I am here in front of everyone on Pet Talk to say that I accept any and all liability to Chewy. I am even offering to drive out to PA and pick him up. He would be crated when we aren't home until he has been evaluated by us and the other poochies. I trust he won't be alpha, but, I think he'll try. He will learn quickly that the only true alphas in this society is Mike and me. Some how I would think that 20 dogs who already make up a pack would be slightly daunting for one medium size pooch.

Mugsy, you are such an angel and Mike, too.

Quote:

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Originally posted by micki76
he still deserves a chance. He may be a totally differnet dog with them. Dogs can adapt and change their personality with different people.
An extremely confident and strong hand may be what he needs.

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This is true. Some dogs need a strong hand. I have seen it. There are some dogs that even I would not be able to control, however, another person (such as my husband) would have no problem.

Give Chewy a chance.

Ash, I know you want the best for chewy. So I say this as to try to help him. Have you thought about giving him to the miltary or police for and working dog? They need dogs that have an independant streak and can be thinking of there self protection. Its a jobyou could be proud of him doing and you know they take very good care of them.Now is the time they are really training for homeland protection and such. Or how about you local police dept. do they have a k-9 unit ? I have had them help me with an aggeresive dog be fore . They have great techniques and want to help be for they get a call about bites or maulings. Give it a try for Chewys sake.

This is no offense to Molly and Mike whatsoever, I love them, but I see where Ash is coming from. I don't think I would send my possibly aggressive dog to someone I only knew from a message board because of several reasons. She knows her dog better and if she feels he would not fit into a home with several other dogs, we should respect that. I know Lolly would absolutely be miserable with any more than 2 other dogs in her home.

What I WOULD do however is what Sue said about an AGGRESSION SPECIALIST. If someone who specializes in aggression told me to put my dog down, I'd feel more at peace with the decision than if a regular trainer told me. I had thought that Ash did seek help from an aggression specialist but I can't remember. I have a migraine and I'm confused.

I did send Ash the names and numbers of a few trainers and specialists in my area (she lives about an hour from here)--I can't find their cards right now:rolleyes: , but I know she is going to call them. I'm going to call my vet tomorrow also, and see if she knows of anyone that I didn't already know of.

Another thing, I know we all will do everything we can for our dogs, and we love them all to death. There may not be an agression specialist in her area, and it may be far for her to travel, and a lot of money. I know that's not an excuse to everyone, but sometimes it is not an option for some people.
Ash, I'm not saying that isn't an option for you, I'm just saying--I don't really know what!!

Aly, I've already said it didn't matter. If he bites either one of us, I wouldn't tell anyone anyway, so what difference does it make? I just don't want the dog killed. I'm just frustrated that we've made the offer and it doesn't seem to matter.

Quote:

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Originally posted by mugsy
I'm just frustrated that we've made the offer and it doesn't seem to matter.

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I know. I don't understand.:confused: :confused: :confused:

Quote:

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Originally posted by lovemyshiba
There may not be an agression specialist in her area, and it may be far for her to travel, and a lot of money. I know that's not an excuse to everyone, but sometimes it is not an option for some people.

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Mike and Molly have even offered to go get Chewy.

Quote:

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Give him to a shelter, a rescue organization, a farm, another home, but do NOT kill him.

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I'm sorry, but this is an incredibly naive and dangerous thing to say. The absolutely worse thing a person with an aggressive dog can do is to dump the problem on someone else.

An aggressive dog will be the first to be euthanized at a shelter. Even Best Friends will not take dog-aggressive dogs. Shelters have a limited amount of space, time and funding. They must take the most adoptable dogs, and the rest are euthanized. If the dog needs to be euthanized, it should be done by its owners, in a loving, safe environment - not done at a frightening, loud shelter by strangers. People dumping their problem dogs at shelters is one of the reasons the euthansia rate is so high. It's wrong, and it's an incredible cop-out, and I'm so very glad to see Ash is mature and responsible enough not to be considering this very bad option.

It is my understanding that Chewy is not a purebred dog, and therefore a rescue organization if probably not going to take him. Most rescues (not all, but most) specialize in purebred dogs.

Giving an aggressive dog to a farm or another home is simply ridiculous. Chewy already has a good home, with lots of love and attention. The home is not the problem, the dog is. What difference does it make if it's a farm or not? A farmer is not going to want to be bitten by a dog any more than someone in a city is. And the first time the dog goes after livestock it's going to get a bullet in the head, I promise you.

My personal opinion is that Ash is fully aware of all the options that she has. Everyone has given her good advice and listed a lot of choices. However, we all need to keep in mind that Chewy is her dog, and she is the one who knows him best, loves him, and has to live with him and deal with his behavior and the consequences of that behavior. It is not up to us to judge or criticize her for the choice that she makes. We are not the ones walking miles in her shoes.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Aspen and Misty
As I have said before in this thread I don't want to give Chewy to Mike or Molly because if they got bit by your dog how would you feel? I can't even imagine the guilt I would have if Chewy grabed one of there none furry dogs by the neck and threw it around the room like he did to Teddy. They have to many dogs and Chewy would not be happy. He has to be the alfa dog and he can't with 20 other large dogs.
Ash

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poor teddy!:(
im so sorry:(

im also bringing this back up because everyone is still offering to take him, and im not sure if they saw this. i really ddont want any dogs to get hurt or put down, but i can understand why you are doing this.

But i can also understand why people dont want you too put him down. :(

is teddy ok?:(

poor chewy:(

I've seen it

Ash, it is YOUR decision, but I found 2 more specialists in the state, who may be able to help:
Cranberry Townshib:
Lap Wolf Dog Training--owner Heather Houlahan
[email protected]
742-772-7837

and in Port Matilda (10 minutes from here)
Bell Hollow Dog Training Center
[email protected]
814-692-7241

I know these both say they are training centers, but both said they will take aggressive dogs--it could be worth an email.

Ashley,

This is not the first time you've had to give up a dog is it?
Maybe you are not the trainer you think you are, maybe Chewy
would do better with different people & consistant training
methods. Give Mugsy & Mike a chance with him please.With so
many dogs having health problems that they fight to find a
cure for; to put a dog to death for behaviour problems that
could be corrected, seems pretty drastic.Show how much you
do love Chewy by giving him this chance. Just my opinion.

here's a quote from a behaviorist that I found online...

"If your dog is aggressive, and has bitten or you think he/she might bite, please see a trainer or behaviorist. A behaviorist is one who specializes in training beyond basic manners. Again, be very frank with this person. Many, many, most, ALMOST all dogs can be helped with proper training. The hardest part is actually training the humans."

Quote:

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Originally posted by lizbud
Ashley,
This is not the first time you've had to give up a dog is it?
Maybe you are not the trainer you think you are, maybe Chewy
would do better with different people & consistant training
methods. Give Mugsy & Mike a chance with him please.With so
many dogs having health problems that they fight to find a
cure for; to put a dog to death for behaviour problems that
could be corrected, seems pretty drastic.Show how much you
do love Chewy by giving him this chance. Just my opinion.

---

Nope I have never in my life givin up a dog thank you very much. And I have trained Chewy well, you don't know him and will everyone please stop attacking me god. Sorry I've been to busy to replay latly but I see I have turned out to be the most horrible person on the earth acording to ya'll. Yup thats right I'm a cold heartless bitch who kills dogs for no reson, thanx guys, really.

I'm going to make this large so you all can read it this time
I am calling a behaviorist tomrrow. I will see what they say!! Now that I hope ya'll have read that.

Thank you Emily I will add them to the list :D your so helpful. I don't expect you all to agree with me, and I knew you guys would do this which is fine, I know I would if I were in Ya'lls situation. Really, Some of ya'll just showin how much you love Chewy, and I want to thank you for it. I do take EXELLENT care of Chewy so stop saying I don't as if I'm correct some of you said I dont' take good care of him. I train Chewy EVERYDAY. I got rid of his old agressive problems and now he has new ones. No matter what he is going to be agressive. He will fidn somethign new to be agressive about. But as I said, I have not giving up on him and if there is hope I will take it.

Ash

ps: I think my trainer is crazy :eek: seriously though

Quote:

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Originally posted by Aspen and Misty


Nope I have never in my life givin up a dog thank you very much. And I have trained Chewy well, you don't know him and will everyone please stop attacking me god. Sorry I've been to busy to replay latly but I see I have turned out to be the most horrible person on the earth acording to ya'll. Yup thats right I'm a cold heartless bitch who kills dogs for no reson, thanx guys, really.

I'm going to make this large so you all can read it this time
I am calling a behaviorist tomrrow. I will see what they say!! Now that I hope ya'll have read that.


Ash

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I don't think anything of the sort!!!!!! I think you're giving up too easily on him. I know you've dob\ne everything YOU can do. All I'm saying is don't put him down before you give someone else a chance with him who wants a chance and has shown they can help dogs with this problem.

Ash, you have stated here that you definately are putting him to sleep. You talked about how you'd make his last week alive great. It just bothers me. I am SO glad that you're calling a behaviorist. No one thinks you're a bad person, we just can't undertand why you are so intent to do this????:confused:

Quote:

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Originally posted by Aspen and Misty
ps: I think my trainer is crazy :eek: seriously though

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Why would you say that? Did she say she could help Chewy? Because if she did she has a lot more experience with this sort of thing than any owner does. Good luck!:)


I do have to say though that I don't agree that you should get a dog "before" Chewy gets put down if he does. You should focus all your attention on him and making his last days as comfortable as possible, not stressing him more with brining in a new dog so he can see you give the other dog attnetion. That sounds really hurtful. :(

Quote:

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Originally posted by luckies4me
Why would you say that? Did she say she could help Chewy? Because if she did she has a lot more experience with this sort of thing than any owner does. Good luck!:)

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NO she wants me to go see teh worst vet in the area and talk to him about putting him on Kidney failer medcine, whic hmight help I mean I don't know, I'm not a trainer. I'm goign to call my vet and see what he thinks cause he is so smart adn I trust and value his opioin in this. She also said Chewy is dangerouse and should probly be locked in a room at all times because you never know when he is going to bit.

I dont' insist on him being put down, I just feel he is dangerouse, imagine if he did that to a little girl. It was horrible, I wish you could have seen it. Also, I'm afried I know what most trainers are going to say. Put a basket muzzle on him and he needs to wear expet when he is locked up in his crate. (What the Crazy trainer said and said her vet will say)

Also, I'm not giving him to Molly and Mike, if there is hope for him I will find him another home, but they have to many dogs for Chewy. I man don't get me wrong Molly and Mike are my hero for saving all those dogs, (and I think they need 20 more :p), but I don't think Chewy would be happy and I don't want him to live a life of misery.

Ash

Quote:

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Originally posted by Aspen and Misty


NO she wants me to go see teh worst vet in the area and talk to him about putting him on Kidney failer medcine, whic hmight help

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So she thinks he might have a physical problem? Could pain be causing his aggression?

Quote:

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Originally posted by micki76
I am SO glad that you're calling a behaviorist. No one thinks you're a bad person, we just can't undertand why you are so intent to do this????:confused:

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Thanx, I hope she says we can do something. I've been crying all day, its been a crappy day. I need to go through the list lovemyshiba sent me to see which ones are behaviorist and I plan on calling them all :D what can I say, I love my Chewy. So, dont' try to call me tomrrow the line will be busy...

Ash