Andy Rooney Totally Said It!!

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Originally Posted by jackie

Ah now you are just assuming that I am talking specifically about you or your spose. Or you are just assuming the average gun owner has had the training your hubby has had.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and I still believe that hand guns should not be privately owned. :)

Can you give your opinion on these comments?

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

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I will have to look up the following statistics to answer that :D

Domestic violence.... well if one spouse wants to kill another it will happen with or without a gun. Unfortunately a woman I used to know (I actually knew her daughter and heard about this tragedy) was brutally beaten by her husband with her own crutches. No guns won't stop murder. Accidents .... result of improper training. Suicides... again they would happen with our without guns. When someone is determined to kill themselves or someone else... lack of a gun will not stop them. My grandfather killed himself by locking himself in the car with a hose going from the exhaust into the car window. Unfortunately I never got to meet him. he had a gun but chose to do it this way. So again... guns can't be blamed for these happenings. determination is a powerful thing and not having a gun is not enough to squash determination.

I know alot of states require people to get training. Mine does....plus I get the added training from the military.

I just wanted to point out that saying that because anything can kill a person, guns are fine is a logical fallacy. Like Jackie said, guns are designed to kill things, cars, golf clubs, etc, are not. And, people may be the ones to pull the trigger, but they'd have a much harder time killing anything without a gun. What about all the unintentional injuries and casualties that occur- such as children getting into guns...is that just the "people" not the guns?

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Originally Posted by Pembroke_Corgi

I just wanted to point out that saying that because anything can kill a person, guns are fine is a logical fallacy. Like Jackie said, guns are designed to kill things, cars, golf clubs, etc, are not. And, people may be the ones to pull the trigger, but they'd have a much harder time killing anything without a gun. What about all the unintentional injuries and casualties that occur- such as children getting into guns...is that just the "people" not the guns?

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There are a few things designed to kill people also...knives...bows and arrows...Nuclear power....lol, I cant even imagine banning nuclear power...the state of virginia would loose all power.

Ugghhhh...I hate all this crap about guns! Guns dont kill people, people kill people! It is rediculous, cause all of us responsible gun owners suffer. Just cause you dont like guns, does not make them bad. I have been around guns all of my life, and so have my children. My boys are 7 and 11 eleven, they know about gun safety, but have yet to touch or fire a real gun. they wont until they are old enough and responsible enough. We are hunters, and target shooters, and both hubby and I have served our time in the Army, hubby 20 yrs and myself 10 years.

and even if guns were illegal, the crime rate wouldnt go down, because criminals import weapons from other countries. Also if people didnt have guns, they would just use something else.

LOL so we should ban guns so people have to WORK at killing others? As far as I know a stab wound CAN kill just as effectivly as a gun shot wound. A baseball bat to the head can kill just as effectively as a gun shot wound.

As for kids getting into guns. that is parents trying to shelter their kids from guns. curiousity killed the cat. Kids should be taught IMMEDIATELY about gun safety. I can't say I know of too many kids who were taught about gun safety and taught to respect guns that got into the gun cabinet and used it as a toy. so YES it is human error. If you hide it from them and teach them nothing about it how do you expect them to know they shouldn't play with it.... just because you tell them not to? HA. TEACH your children... don't ever let them use guns as a toy.... take away that vantage point immediately. a gun is NEVER a toy.... I don't care if it is plastic or not. A gun is a weapon and they should be taught to respect it. If you are up front and honest with them about guns they are far less likely to misuse it. We will teach our child gun safety from a very young age. People say that is irresponsible but I think parents who try to hide the truth from their kids are more irresponsible. Kids aren't stupid and you shouldn't try to shelter them. I would rather my child learn gun safety from his/her parents than from some punk on the street or some TV show.

Again..... guns don't kill people.... PEOPLE kill people.

but what about kids.... what about old people... what about.... what about. That is YOUR responsibility as a parent and/or as a gun owner. YOU need to learn gun safety... you need to teach gun safety.

The world is full of what if's. If you live your life wondering what if everytime you do something that must be stressful. what if I fall in the shower and hit my head.... that's not enough reason for me to stop showering. What if I go to the store and get hit by another driver? that's not enough reason for me to stop going outside. Life is full of what if's. But we shouldn't all be punished because SOME people are morons... because some people are irresponsible.

Again, if you ban guns you aren't hurting anyone but law abiding citizens. Gun crime will still happen. Criminals are criminals. Don't make excuses for them. they kill people.... the sickest murderers in history never used a gun. Sh1t happens. but I will not have people take away my right to defend myself because they are afraid and misinformed

tonight (2/25) he was talking about papers and files he has kept in his office that he never looks at ... a famous person with a pack-rat tendency ... lol

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Originally Posted by cassiesmom

tonight (2/25) he was talking about papers and files he has kept in his office that he never looks at ... a famous person with a pack-rat tendency ... lol

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LOL you haven't seen pack rat tendancy until you see my boss's parents house. There are literally alleyways between box upon box of junk. They have boxes filling the basement... boxes on the dining table. Boxes under the dining table... boxes AROUND the dining table. Boxes that line all the walkways in the house.... it's like a maze LOL

How many drive by stabbings have you ever heard of? How many children killed by a stray knife that came flying through the air?

I say again...let's give everyone a gun when they graduate from grade school...to satisfy those worried about training....give then a gun class!....

there...now we have a level playing field!

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Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary

How many drive by stabbings have you ever heard of?
How many children killed by a stray knife that came flying through the air?

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Or ...
"I didn't know the KNIFE was 'loaded' ... it just went off by itself." :rolleyes:

Guns take most of the work out of killing a fellow being. :(

You can't disarm the public, just because of a few idiots.
Because if you do...those very same idiots will find some more guns.
So.....why disarm the public ?????

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Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary

Why to defend myself of course!

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You wouldn't have to...they'd run a mile anyway !!!! :D

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Originally Posted by wombat2u2004

You wouldn't have to...they'd run a mile anyway !!!! :D

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I'm not sure I understand Wombat. Why would lip gloss cause someone to run a mile?

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Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary

How many drive by stabbings have you ever heard of? How many children killed by a stray knife that came flying through the air?

I say again...let's give everyone a gun when they graduate from grade school...to satisfy those worried about training....give then a gun class!....

there...now we have a level playing field!

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Do you think that disarming Citizens, that this is going to stop?? most weapons in driveby shootings, are illegal, and imported anyways! Taking guns away from everyone isnt going to solve any problems! and it is rediculous to think so!

Andy and I own hand guns. Best if everyone kept their distance from us.

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Originally Posted by critter crazy

Do you think that disarming Citizens, that this is going to stop?? most weapons in driveby shootings, are illegal, and imported anyways! Taking guns away from everyone isnt going to solve any problems! and it is rediculous to think so!

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But I am suggesting giving EVERYONE a gun...male, female, black, white, hispanic....everyone! Where do I suggest disarming citizens?

ps...is calling me rediculous ...or even ridiculous very nice? :D

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Originally Posted by jackie

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

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I am the infamous "Spark's Hubby"

- So the weapon used in a crime was stolen from a legal owner. How does this justify punishing the legal owner?

- It is sad that guns are used in domestic violence and that accidents happen etc... This is still not enough reason, to me at least, to let the government take away yet another one of our freedoms. Indeed the one freedom that can protect us from that very government that supposedly "serves" us. If you take away hand guns, you set precedent for further action. You really think the government would stop at just hand guns?

From what I read in this thread, there are going to be a great many victims here when the government fails to respond to the inevitable major, natiowide disaster. What are your plans for such an occurance?

Think about it, humans are a mere 9 meals away from barbaric acts becoming commonplace. Think about what happens when New Orleans happens on a national scale?

[QUOTE=jackie]OK, we have different opinions.

I still can not think of one single reason civilians need HAND guns. I don't think people hunt with pistols. :p

QUOTE]
Actually many handguns are used in hunting! Some areas allow them and some dont, but they are used.

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Originally Posted by Pembroke_Corgi

I just wanted to point out that saying that because anything can kill a person, guns are fine is a logical fallacy. Like Jackie said, guns are designed to kill things, cars, golf clubs, etc, are not. And, people may be the ones to pull the trigger, but they'd have a much harder time killing anything without a gun. What about all the unintentional injuries and casualties that occur- such as children getting into guns...is that just the "people" not the guns?

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Giving up freedoms in the name of "security". Doesn't the government already control to much of our lives?

I think you are naive and a victim to be....

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Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary

I say again...let's give everyone a gun when they graduate from grade school...to satisfy those worried about training....give then a gun class!....

there...now we have a level playing field!

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Fine by me, as long as I don't have to pay for those weapons or the ammunition.

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Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary

But I am suggesting giving EVERYONE a gun...male, female, black, white, hispanic....everyone! Where do I suggest disarming citizens?

ps...is calling me rediculous ...or even ridiculous very nice? :D

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Oh no... You are one of THOSE kind of liberals.

Sweet....

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Originally Posted by jackie

I can't think of one single reason why a civilian would need a hand gun...

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Neither can I! The more guns there are around, the more tend to be used - even with good education. Sad but true.

I'm glad that people are not alowed to have a gun in Denmark, except the ones you use for hunting. At the moment there are discusions about whether to allow "pepper" sprays here.

wow, pepper spray, that falls under the category of stupid.

So what's a girl gonna do when someone twice her weight attacks her...smack him with her purse? Pepper spray is one of the most effective, efficient ways of protecting yourself.

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Originally Posted by Puckstop31

Giving up freedoms in the name of "security". Doesn't the government already control to much of our lives?

I think you are naive and a victim to be....

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Wow, it is so interesting to me how, when presented with an opposing viewpoint, you will go to such lengths to disagree. Everyone is "up in arms" about someone disagreeing with handguns, which in this country WE ARE ALLOWED TO DO, ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, and you suggest that I will one day be victim of violence. That is lovely, so eloquently spoken by a pro-gun advocate. Up until now I have been civil, and have taken the time to think out my responses. Well I quit trying to use reason, it's obviously ineffective.

I thought guns were harmless, why should I be a victim? Or are you threatening me?

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Originally Posted by Puckstop31

Fine by me, as long as I don't have to pay for those weapons or the ammunition.

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The government will use the money that would otherwise be spent on...oh adequate medical care for everyone and Aid to Dependent Children.....you know...all those silly programs....

Heck...with a national debt of $9 trillion ...what's a little more?

I will happily keep my gun holstered for now. Since I have a permit to carry concealed, I will just keep it with me.

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Originally Posted by Ceph

wow, pepper spray, that falls under the category of stupid.

So what's a girl gonna do when someone twice her weight attacks her...smack him with her purse? Pepper spray is one of the most effective, efficient ways of protecting yourself.

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Call the police and hope they get there in time LOL. Tell the perp to hold on a minute while I dial 911. I'm sure they will let you :rolleyes: people who rely on others to save them are only setting themselves up for failure. the only one that can protect you is YOU.

I've said it once and I will say it again....Taking away a legal owners right to own a handgun or pepper spray or whatever else does nothing but hurt the legal owners. gun crime will still happen.

LOL Look at Canada. it basically takes an act of GOD to get a gun yet gun crime is only on a the rise. Hmmmm a lot of good banning hand guns have done. Except NOW the victims can't protect themselves. Like the guy that shot up a strip club next to a day care center (YES I don't understand why the two would be anywhere near each other but they are) Stray bullets collected.... low and behold... the weapon USED to fire those bullets is not registered and was obtained illegally. He wasn't caught.... not a week later the same man (suspected) shot up another club. he still has not been apprehended. How did gun control help prevent this from happening? OH that's right.....it DIDN'T!!!

More and more often in Toronto we are hearing of drive by shootings, armed robberies, shootings at night clubs. and only a fraction of these shootings have led to an arrest ONLY because there was a witness the identified the shooter well enough that the police were able to find them. and guess what.... these thugs weapons are not registered and were obtained illegally. I see gun control really works LOL

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Originally Posted by Pembroke_Corgi

Wow, it is so interesting to me how, when presented with an opposing viewpoint, you will go to such lengths to disagree. Everyone is "up in arms" about someone disagreeing with handguns, which in this country WE ARE ALLOWED TO DO, ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, and you suggest that I will one day be victim of violence. That is lovely, so eloquently spoken by a pro-gun advocate. Up until now I have been civil, and have taken the time to think out my responses. Well I quit trying to use reason, it's obviously ineffective.

I thought guns were harmless, why should I be a victim? Or are you threatening me?

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LOL...

Such an emotional responce, I wonder what that means? ;) If you think these were "great lengths" to disagree with you... I say what I mean and I mean what I say. You might disagree with me but you will always know what I mean. If you cannot handle that, tough.

You will be a victim because you seem to be the type that would rely on others to keep you safe. If not, what are your plans to protect yourself and those you love if/when civil disorder happens, even if only for a short time.

Banning JUST handguns, I believe, would not end there. Our "government" takes a mile when you give them an inch.

Threatening you?? PUH-LEASE. Get over yourself, honey. Keep off my property and don't try to harm me or my family and you ain't got a thing to worry about.

C, wee unedukated hiks dunna leyek ween u beeg talkin sity peeple cum neer our stuf.

Now THAT is going to great lengths to mess with ya. :)

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Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary

The government will use the money that would otherwise be spent on...oh adequate medical care for everyone and Aid to Dependent Children.....you know...all those silly programs....

Heck...with a national debt of $9 trillion ...what's a little more?

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OK by me... Better to teach a person to fish than to give them one.

I am all for better health coverage for all. But the answer is NOT anything the government can/will do. Take all the money flushed down the can in Medicare/Medicade and give it to all the great, PRIVATE, organizations who really make things happen with it.

We are promised the ability to pursue happiness, not the happiness itself. Also, I do not believe healthcare to be a RIGHT. If it is, lets see some of our wonderful politicians offer up a Constitutional Amendment to make it so.

I know, insert your "where is your compassion" line. I am open to any answer, as long as it does not involve government.

I agree with most of those, except a few. One of them was this one:

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I believe that if you are selling me a milkshake, a pack of cigarettes, a newspaper or a hotel room, you must do it in English! As a matter of fact, if you want to be an American citizen, you should have to speak English!

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To me, that sounds a little arrogant...

From what I gathered, there are four - and probably more - different languages spoken in the United States (English and Spanish being two of the most common). So English is not the only one spoken. I believe it is best that everyone would be able to speak English, but they don't.

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Originally Posted by Husky15

I agree with most of those, except a few. One of them was this one:

To me, that sounds a little arrogant...

From what I gathered, there are four - and probably more - different languages spoken in the United States (English and Spanish being two of the most common). So English is not the only one spoken. I believe it is best that everyone would be able to speak English, but they don't.

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However English is our native language.................When in rome do as the romans do.

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Originally Posted by Husky15

I agree with most of those, except a few. One of them was this one:

To me, that sounds a little arrogant...

From what I gathered, there are four - and probably more - different languages spoken in the United States (English and Spanish being two of the most common). So English is not the only one spoken. I believe it is best that everyone would be able to speak English, but they don't.

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but warning signs, road signs etc etc are printed in English... therefore you SHOULD at least have an understanding of the language IMO

I am one who definitely thinks, that you should be able to read and speak english. I am not saying perfectly, but should definitely have a good understanding!

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Originally Posted by critter crazy

I am one who definitely thinks, that you should be able to read and speak english. I am not saying perfectly, but should definitely have a good understanding!

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I knew a couple who moved to Ontario from Colombia. they only spoke Spanish but upon arrival in Canada they bought as many books, tapes and whatever they could about learning the english language. They watched as much tv as they could so they could listen to the language even when not out with people. they would ONLY speak english to each other at home and were determined to learn the language because everyone around them spoke english and it just didn't make sense for them to not be able to understand anyone around them or not be understood. their english is still very broken but I just thought it was so amazing that they wanted to learn so badly. they did not speak a lick of English upon arrival but now they have a basic understanding of the language and all self taught.

After seeing their determination I wonder why anyone would refuse to learn the language spoken around them. If they could do it all self taught what is stopping others?

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Originally Posted by sparks19

I knew a couple who moved to Ontario from Colombia. they only spoke Spanish but upon arrival in Canada they bought as many books, tapes and whatever they could about learning the english language. They watched as much tv as they could so they could listen to the language even when not out with people. they would ONLY speak english to each other at home and were determined to learn the language because everyone around them spoke english and it just didn't make sense for them to not be able to understand anyone around them or not be understood. their english is still very broken but I just thought it was so amazing that they wanted to learn so badly. they did not speak a lick of English upon arrival but now they have a basic understanding of the language and all self taught.

After seeing their determination I wonder why anyone would refuse to learn the language spoken around them. If they could do it all self taught what is stopping others?

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Exactly! I grew up in a Huge Mexican family, and neighborhood, but every one knew and spoke english, if they didnt they were at least trying to learn. If I moved to a different country, i sure as heck would try to learn the laguage! I spent some Time in Honduras, with the Army, and Boy did my spanish come in handy.

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Originally Posted by Puckstop31

You will be a victim because you seem to be the type that would rely on others to keep you safe. If not, what are your plans to protect yourself and those you love if/when civil disorder happens, even if only for a short time.

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My plan is to stay away from guns, and keep away from "unedukated hiks!" ;)

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Originally Posted by Pembroke_Corgi

My plan is to stay away from guns, and keep away from "unedukated hiks!" ;)

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unedukated hiks aren't the ones you should be worried about ;) tis' the people who get fed up with them and begin civil disorder. I said it earlier.... the second amendment is the right to keep and bare arms (not the sleeveless kind) to protect ourselves against a tyrranous government... how far away from that do you really see us being?

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Originally Posted by sparks19

unedukated hiks aren't the ones you should be worried about ;) tis' the people who get fed up with them and begin civil disorder. I said it earlier.... the second amendment is the right to keep and bare arms (not the sleeveless kind) to protect ourselves against a tyrranous government... how far away from that do you really see us being?

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Wow, a radical Canadian. Didn't know they existed :eek:

We live near a gun club so I hear them every day. People here like to hunt, even youngsters. There are many many people with legal firearms here, and very few accidents or intentional killings (although they do happen once in a while) What I worry about are things like assault rifles illegally making their way into our streets & neighborhoods. Those weapons have no purpose other than to be used to kill human beings. Resources should be directed at confiscating illegal weapons such as these. Of course, we're talking about a legal system that demands little old grandmas be searched at airports just to be sure the terrorists are getting a fair shake. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by cyber-sibes

We live near a gun club so I hear them every day. People here like to hunt, even youngsters. There are many many people with legal firearms here, and very few accidents or intentional killings (although they do happen once in a while) What I worry about are things like assault rifles illegally making their way into our streets & neighborhoods. Those weapons have no purpose other than to be used to kill human beings. Resources should be directed at confiscating illegal weapons such as these. Of course, we're talking about a legal system that demands little old grandmas be searched at airports just to be sure the terrorists are getting a fair shake. :rolleyes:

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Very well said.