President's Photo Op

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Originally posted by mugsy
I agree Logan that it's been a long time since we've had a president that supported our military (which is pretty sad being that he is the Commander in Chief).... Both Bush and Clinton had/have strengths and weaknesses, and they seem to be totally different. Too bad we can't take the strengths of both and make one president because we'd probably get a good one. Personally, I wish McCain had won the Republican nomination and not Bush, because I think he would have done a better job.

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dear molly, eisenhower, kennedy, johnson(a very short time) nixon, ford, carter, reagan, g.h. bush all had military service backgrounds, that stretch of presidents goes back slightly more then 50 years. most presidents have had military supportive policies. the battle planners of the last iraq war, the weapons, the weapons systems that were so good at delivering a bomb to a specific site, those didn't spring into being after january 2001, when mr bush took the oath of office, those women and men were trained/training and honing their skills during mr clintons' tenure. mr clinton should get some credit for that.
i agree with you in wishing that senator mccain had won the republication nomination, i too, think he'd do a better job. the current foriegn policy choices leave me uneasy.

Mugsy,

Quote: " but then I don't think that ANY politician is NOT corrupt somehow."

I hate generalizations, b/c they are most often incorrect. A member of my family is an elected official in Indiana & has been
for 26 years. He is the most honest man I know. He has been
re elected to office by his constituants because he is known to
be an honorable man who works hard to make life better for
all Indiana residents. To say that ALL politicians are cut from the
same cloth does a disservice to honest, principaled people who
enter public service.

As for the photo op of the Prez., that's all that it was, a photo
op. & no it did not make me feel all warm and fuzzy.I wish he
would have attended some of the funerals of the soldiers who
didn't make it back to their families.

Joyce, I know that most presidents have been involved in the military, but, it has been awhile since the military has had the support they have now.

Liz, I meant no malice, but, I do think that when politicians reach the national level they have some varying degrees of corruption. I truly don't believe that local and even state politicians are necessarily corrupt. I went back and reread my post and I did make it sound that I thought all politicians are corrupt...sorry.

Mugsy,

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I know that Clinton refused to even return the Marine's salute as he got off Air Force One or the Presidential helicopter, which I found disgusting.

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This is an urban myth that has been written about many, many times. It is simply FALSE. (Usually the story is that the marines refused to salute Clinton --- also false and an insult to the marines!)

This is on all the myth-buster sites.

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Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
Mugsy,



This is an urban myth that has been written about many, many times. It is simply FALSE. (Usually the story is that the marines refused to salute Clinton --- also false and an insult to the marines!)

This is on all the myth-buster sites.

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when clinton became president he asked another politico
what he should do to be a 'good president' ...the politico gave him a bit of advice........LEARN TO SALUTE.

that's where the story started......

Quote:

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Originally posted by mugsy
I know that Clinton refused to even return the Marine's salute as he got off Air Force One or the Presidential helicopter, which I found disgusting.

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NOT TRUE.
This is an urban legend. I know E's secretary already posted that fact, but here is a link to check the story out if you're interested:
http://urbanlegends.about.com/librar.../aa031901a.htm

i don't understand why everyone is so taken the cost of GW's trip to the Lincoln.....

aside from the 'extra' TLC that the sailors had to give to the ship-
extra spit shining- and the on deck festivities.....the cost is practically nothing.....the ship was coming back to port...it has to be in 'ship shape' .....Vikings (the jet he used) ALWAYS ARE LANDING on deck to deliver passengers and mail..

since that is one of my favorite aircraft
the only thing that bugs me about the whole trip is I HAVE ALWAYS wanted a trip on one of those bad boys.....catapult
take off and hook landing...that's what bugged me the most
:p :) :cool: :D :eek:

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[i]Originally posted by RICHARD [.....the ship was coming back to port...it has to be in 'ship shape' .....Vikings (the jet he used) ALWAYS ARE LANDING on deck to deliver passengers and mail..since that is one of my favorite aircraft. the only thing that bugs me about the whole trip is I HAVE ALWAYS wanted a trip on one of those bad boys.....catapult take off and hook landing...that's what bugged me the most
:p :) :cool: :D :eek: [/B]

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dear richard, i have always been fascinated by those ships and aircraft. thank god that there are american women and men to do that job. i have always wanted to ask any of the pilots or flight crews, "ARE YOU NUTS?!?" what in the sam hill makes you for one milisecond think that landing a small fast moving multimillion dollar aircraft on a ship bobbing up and down in the ocean on a landing area the size of a football field is a good thing? and thank you very much for being so crazy, but are you nuts? and who makes the steel in that hook and cable?::p

I think, for me, I was alarmed that he would be so willing to spend millions on his photo op whilst he was taking billions away from the forces' paychecks and healthcare. Especially from a man who skipped out on National Guard service during 'Nam. Pretty crappy if you ask me...:(

But I guess as long as you put on a good show, people won't care.

Actually Richard, I have always been a bit concerned about you, but this pretty much seals it.

And as for Clinton not saluting....I watched him many times exit aircrafts and he did not acknowledge the Marine's salute, but, I didn't see him all the time, so I can't speak for that.

http://www.snopes.com/military/graphics/salute.jpg

Hmmmmm....

AND, from a marine:

If the question is "Did the Marines who greeted the President willfully show disrespect by failing to execute a "facing" movement after the salute?" the answer is no.
Proper protocol is for the Marine to snap a salute to the President. The President may or may not return the salute at his discretion. If the President returns the salute, the Marine immediately "cuts" or "posts" by bringing his arm sharply down to his side from the salute and remaining at a position of attention. If the President does not return the salute, the Marine will wait until the President passes him, then he will cut and remain at a position of attention. This is the protocol when greeting a senior officer, including the President.

With the new Presidency comes a changing of the Presidential Detail. The new command of the Presidential Detail may have chosen to add a facing movement to the protocol. This is at the complete discretion of the command. A Marine does not have the luxury of choosing whether or not he follows proper protocol. He is given an order and he follows it to the letter. If the order does not include a facing movement, the facing movement will not occur. If the order includes a facing movent, the facing movement occurs. It is that simple. Whether or not this movement becomes a standard part of protocol remains to be seen.

Marines do not act as individuals, we act as a team. Marines follow procedure and protocol. The Marines you saw followed their orders. That is a Marine.

Mugsy,

Glad you clarified that thought for me, I think. :p
Do you really believe that all national level politicians have
"varying levels of corruption", while state or local politicians
are "not necessarily" corrupt ? LOL. Hope you don't teach any
Government classes.:D

Soledad,

Quote: "But I guess as long as you put on a good show, people won't care."

Oh, I think a lot of people care & took notice of the photo op
"grandstanding" & just mentally filed it away for 2004. Did you
read Sen. Robert Byrd's (of all people) comments on the event?
He spoke very well I thought. Just my opinion.

Actually Liz I do teach government, however, I keep my personal opinions out of it and keep to "just the facts ma'am.";) I've just gotten cynical in my old age I guess! lol

I work with politicians all day. They are NOT all corrupt. They are pretty much normal people who have to make unpopular decisions and are always in a damned if you do, damned if you don't sort of position. Extremely long hours, moderate pay...all in all pretty thankless.

But it is easy to get cynical. I don't think corruption is as big of a problem as complancency. That happens a lot.

I hope you're right, Lizbud. I don't see why a national guard flunkie should get praise for spending millions of tax payer bucks in order to act out a Top Gun fantasy.

Because the ship was in sight of land (and that didn't go with the photo op) they moved the ship around so that the land would not show in any photos of the president.

My husband, who unlike me is apolitical, asked what he was doing in that outfit. When I was in NYC this week people were talking about it and singing "Macho Man." It was soooooo very masculine! The helmet, the straps around his legs looking as if he had on a codpiece.....