Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf_Q
Thanks Amy! I am still interested in it, and will of course look into both if this method stops working. :D
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf_Q
Thanks Amy! I am still interested in it, and will of course look into both if this method stops working. :D
I asked the trainer I go to about these collars cause I was thinking about using it for training Clover. I asked what she thought, cause I didn't know much about it. I thought I'd post what she said, just as something to think about cause I never really thought about it this way. I wasn't planning to use it to stop barking but other problems.
"I don’t like them much at all, although sometimes if it’s a family being evicted due to barking problems, or taking the dog to the shelter, I’ll sometimes recommend giving one a shot if it is in dire circumstances and it will keep the dog and family in its home. But I don’t really associate them as being useful for anything other than barking. They don’t cause pain, in the way that a shock collar does, but they DO cause a dog to be uncomfortable by spraying a burst of citronella oil into the dog’s face, nose, and sometimes eyes. Many people think they are less aversive than shock collars, because they don’t use electricity, but what a lot of folks don’t consider is how important a dog’s nose is to their world, and how dogs understand scent. Knowing about how much better a dog’s sense of smell is than ours, and how important it is, it may even be more aversive (it doesn’t have to be painful to be aversive!) than a momentary shock because of how long the oil sticks to the nasal passages, hair, etc.
The secondary problem that they come with is the same with the shock collars – once you start using it, if it is effective, you’ll probably be reliant upon it for life, because dogs become very knowledgable about when the collar is on versus off. Most dogs who need to use these collars cannot be weaned off of them, and once you do, the behaviours come back quite quickly. This is because the dog has learned by context, and the behaviour depends on the presence of the collar.
That being said, of course dogs who are trained using food rewards will always need random rewards for good behaviour throughout its life (as any behaviour will only persist as long as it is either reinforced once in a while, or punished for lack of compliance). The learning component is no different. But personally, I would much rather use rewards for good behaviour, over the life of the dog, than punishments for unwanted behaviour, for the life of the dog. I suppose you just need to know what you would rather do, and ask yourself if there’s a way to use rewards to get to the same behaviour that the citronella collar would be used for. "
I think they can work for some dogs and I think they are more humane than the shock collars. Although some dogs may not be phased by it. We had a dog at the shelter we used a cintronella collar on to get him to calm down with barking. It did not phase him when it sprayed him. Some dogs are just going to bark and nothing will phase them. I am glad the spray bottle is working with him, better than paying $70 for a cintronella collar that may not work. :)
Sowa,
That's exactly why I was so reluctant to use one. To me it's more of a reliance rather than an actual solution to the problem. I wouldn't keep it on him all the time anyway, so I could see it not working well in that respect.
Krista, yeah I am glad this way worked to! I already have to buy hiking gear for him. $70 is ALOT for something that may not work!
I actually took him for a shorter neighborhood walk today and everytime a car came I sat him down and said "NO!". I forgot the waterbottle of course, but I am working on one thing right now. It actually worked pretty well and he wasn't lunging.:D
Just in case anyone was interested in an update -
WOW there is so much improvement! I took him out on a four hour hike to a new park. He of course barked at first but the first time you say no to him he stops! He still gets sprayed from time-to-time but I have been bringing this on every walk (including neighborhood walks & hikes) and he's just behaving so well now. He was incredible. He's a changed dog. Toward the middle of the hike, he'd just look at them and whine, but he didn't bark! I just had to say "NO" and he stopped. I am so proud. I will keep bringing it with me of course, but he's just so good now.
He still pulled some Mikey antics -
-tried to bring me a dead mouse/bat...thank you but no thank you Mikey :rolleyes:
-accidently peed on my friend. He was peeing on a post and missed, she was sitting right in front of him.
-Almost fell into the water a few times.
Also, some geese came over to us on one of our breaks (probably expecting food) and Mikey is so respectful of them. Of course the wuss may be a little scared but he doesn't bark at all..so I really don't need to worry about *bigger* wildlife. :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alysser
YES OF COURSE we are interested! So just using the water squirt bottle worked? WOO HOO!!!!
When you are comfortable, to maintain you need to start treating him with a high value yummy something or other the moment he stops. Just the whining is alright (at least, it would be fine to me, up to you on that) and so you move from negative to positive reinforcement!
Give that puppa a rub all over from me!
Excellent! Good to hear training and persistence on your part has worked so well. Keeping reinforcing, and you'll have a good dog for life!Quote:
Originally Posted by Alysser
Smart dog - geese will not only go on the offensive, but those beaks are powerful and can inflict real pain! Better safe than sore!Quote:
Originally Posted by Alysser
Wow that's awesome news! Way to go Alyssa and Mikey!! :)
Glad to hear he is improving so much! Great job with him :D