What am I not doing?

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Originally Posted by luvofallhorses

Um punishing a dog for growling will NOT make them aggressive in my experience.

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Punishing a dog for giving a warning signal, such as growling, will teach the dog to ditch the warning signal and bite instead.

My JRT Micki growls constantly. He'll growl and snuggle into your lap at the same time.


Sowa, all that talk about entering doors first, not sleeping on the bed, etc is all bologna in my book. Do what you can to build a relationship and trust with her and try not to make it so much as you being 'in charge' and dominant over her.

Nobody ever said anything about hitting the dog. ;) If you tell a dog not to growl, it's only showing it that warnings are pointless. This causes you to create a dog that bites without an obvious warning.

I'm not saying you should ignore the growling, but you need to address the problem and not the symptom. The dog is obviously uncomfortable about something and that issue should be addressed, not the dog telling you that it's uncomfortable.

Count me in with the ones who do not believe in punishing a growl. All you're going to do is create a dog who is fearful of expressing itself. When my dog growls (which is very rare, because I usually spot his behavior prior to growling and act accordingly), you know what I do? I back off! A growl is a symptom, not the underlying problem. You need to take a step back, think about what caused the growl, and then take a different approach. You need to work on changing her underlying emotions around food.

By punishing her, you are, at the moment, actively creating a negative association with people being near her while she is eating. This will create a dog that is defensive and timid while eating. I've seen it in plenty of dogs, including in my OWN dog, after I used force-based training methods to fix his mild food aggression (and, no, I didn't do it "wrong", I actually have good natural timing, which has come very handy in clicker training)

Here is an good excerpt from Sophia Yin's article on how to deal with resource guarding. This is method 1 -
"At every meal, while Fido's eating his plain dog food, stand a safe distance away and toss a steady stream (10-30) of bite-sized treats that he loves. Then, when he's finished and has nothing left to guard, move closer and toss more treats to him or into his bowl. Note that you'll have to cut back on his regular food so that he gets his normal daily caloric alottment of food. After a few meals using this method, move a bit closer each day, always staying outside Fido's defensive range. If Fido tenses up or even growls, then you've moved too close, too quickly, so watch his body language closely. The key is that he stays relaxed at all times around the bowl and learns to expect even better treats from you. If this method takes you any more than a week, or Fido looks tense, or you're in any doubt about your ability to safely read Fido's mood, then you should go to method 2."

I also suggest "trading" the food bowl for a high value treat, and feeding by hand.

I also need to add this. Sowa, it seems as though you are very concerned with your dog's behavior. That's very good! But what's worrying me is that you appear to also be concerned about constantly making sure you are the "boss."

Please, do yourself a favor and don't think that way. I did the same thing for many years of my dog's life. I was a rabid Dog Whisperer fan and was constantly correcting my dog. Our lives were not happy because I was always so concerned about whether or not I was the "dominant" one. I read a great book by ethologist and dog behavior specialist Dr. Patricia McConell called The Other End of The Leash and it really changed my mindset. I stopped worrying and just starting enjoying him. He's much happier and so am I. This does NOT mean he does not have boundaries and does whatever he pleases. He doesn't, but I rarely have to redirect him anymore because I'm always making it clear what I want him to do, not what I don't want him to do.

Instead of looking for reasons to say NO, look for reasons to say YES! That's the fundamental idea that has totally changed the way I relate to ALL the animals I work with, whether it be dogs, cats, horses or birds.

I'm only saying this because I wish somebody would've told me this earlier. I wish somebody would have recommended books like The Other End of The Leash and The Culture Clash. I don't know if I would've listened, but I hope I would have.

Sowa, I really hope you can enjoy your dog as a puppy as much as possible. It's such a precious time. :)

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Originally Posted by k9krazee

Nobody ever said anything about hitting the dog. ;) If you tell a dog not to growl, it's only showing it that warnings are pointless. This causes you to create a dog that bites without an obvious warning.

I'm not saying you should ignore the growling, but you need to address the problem and not the symptom. The dog is obviously uncomfortable about something and that issue should be addressed, not the dog telling you that it's uncomfortable.

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I am not sure exactly what you're addressing in this comment. If you tell a dog not to growl (unacceptable behavior) it is not going to drive them to bite! Get real. I TOTALLY do not agree with you! You can't read a dog's mind. How can you determine why the dog is "obviously uncomfortable"...... My dog has growled at me - when she was young and guess what, she has NEVER bitten me or anyone else. She was told NO when she growled.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I agree with k9krazee and K9soul. Worry less about "asserting dominance" and focus more about building trust between you and your dog :)

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Originally Posted by sasvermont

I am not sure exactly what you're addressing in this comment. If you tell a dog not to growl (unacceptable behavior) it is not going to drive them to bite! Get real. I TOTALLY do not agree with you! You can't read a dog's mind. How can you determine why the dog is "obviously uncomfortable"...... My dog has growled at me - when she was young and guess what, she has NEVER bitten me or anyone else. She was told NO when she growled.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

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Three rolly eyes, I win! :D

Growling is unacceptable behavior to whom? Growling is the dog's way of letting you know that they feel threatened, uncomfortable, possessive, defensive, whatever. I don't have to read the dog's mind to know that that.

Let's say a dog has a bone and it growls at you because it doesn't want you to take the bone. You tell the dog not to growl. He STILL feels uneasy that you're going to take the bone away. You stopped the growling, but you didn't stop the way he feels in the situation. I'm not saying that it will "drive the dog to bite", but he's not left with many other options to let you know how he's feeling. Some dogs may submit to the correction and you won't have any problems, some may feel like they have to use physical means to get the point across. All dogs are different and all situations are different.

I'm not advocating letting the dog get away with growling, just that you should look into the cause of the growling. In the bone situation I'd play trade games until the dog felt comfortable giving up his bone, thus eliminating the growling without correcting the dog for doing it. I want to teach the dog not to feel possessive or uneasy that I'll take it away.

Or in Clover's situation I'd probably cut back on sticking my hands into her food bowl. Too much of a good thing can be bad. Maybe instead I'd hand feed her or use her meal times as training times. I'm a huge advocate of hand feeding your dog anyway, I think it's a nice bonding thing.

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Originally Posted by IRescue452

I don't think there's any particular move you're making that's totally wrong. Hand feeding or putting your hand in the bowl is great for teaching tolerance around the food bowl.

I hate to be mean, but I do think dogs pick up on personalities and with all the questions you've had, you seem very insecure. Not that this is unusual for a first time owner, especially if they've been exposed to extreme training methods like the dog whisperer. I don't believe you have a dominant personality to begin with. Dominance does not mean you are mean to the dog or some sort of punisher. It means you are confident and can lead naturally. Know what you want to do and do it, don't go into a situation with anxiety that it may not work. Its not really something that can be taught though, only developed perhaps with time and experience.

On another note, I think sleeping in the pen is a bunch of bologna. Yes, it great for a dog to be comfortable in the pen in case of emergency, but it does not make you any more of a leader. Let a puppy sleep on your lap and they will learn to be secure and totally relaxed around you. Make them sleep in a pen and they will be a "lone wolf" only secure enough to be sleeping deeply when they are alone, alert and awake when you let them out to be around you. Why would they have to be alert and awake when they are around you if they can trust you? Don't forget to play and have fun and don't worry that tug o war is going to make her aggressive. The bond you form with your dog will determine how well they will listen to you. Free-will following is always better than a dog who follows against their will.

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I'm not a first time owner. She is the second pup I've had, my first was 13 years ago so no I don't remember everything. I want to raise her right, I don't think there is anything wrong with asking a lot of questions. That doesn't make me insecure. I'm very firm with my dogs, but not mean. I also have a lot of fun with them. Just because the only things you hear from me are questions, doesn't mean I'm clueless. :p

My pup only sleeps in her pen when I'm out or over night because she is in a stage where she is into everything and I'm worried she'll eat something she's not suppose to. Anytime I'm around, she is allowed out with me. I have lots of bonding time with her. When she is old enough and house broken, she will no longer need a pen.

We have a lot of play time too. Maybe I mistook what you said, but it sorta felt to me you're saying I'm not letting her be a dog and have fun.

I just need to know I'm on the right track with her, as I said it's been a while since I've raised a pup. I worry about her, and I want her to have the happiest life possible.

As for the other comments...I guess everyone has their own way to deal with their dogs behavior. I have seen dogs get extremely food aggressive and was told this was a good way to show them they don't need to worry about it.

I never hit her, or hurt her. I simply say shhh! She'll stop and sit for a second and she can have it back. I don't do this everyday. Only every so often.

I sort of feel maybe I should back off with the questions. I'll just do as I feel is right for me. I've been doing a lot of research on training as well as take her to puppy classes. I just like to hear from other people their opinions.

I really won't accept growling though. It's not even about dominance or whatevr I just won't accept it. She won't get away with behavior I don't like. I don't see anything wrong with that.

I don't think anyone here is advocating ignoring or accepting growling. As k9krazee says it's better to focus on the root of the problem, however, which is building a trusting relationship with the dog so that growling just doesn't even come up. Making a training game with meal time, teaching "leave it", etc, are ways of doing this. It's a different approach than "I'm going to put my hand in your food and if you react wrong I will take it away." which doesn't address the underlying issue of trust and deepening your relationship, which would eliminate any possible anxiety or defensiveness she may feel about her food.

But do realize many people have many different views on dog behavior, dog training, dog problems, and that yes, you will get many conflicting views because of this. When it turns into rolling eyes emotes and people getting more personal it probably really does make you feel uneasy. I would just suggest to continue reading up on various viewpoints, maybe trying some of the books out there on dog behavior because even if you don't agree with everything an author says, you can still learn and gain a lot from it. I'm sure your pup will do just fine.

Sowa, your sound like a loving pupster parent. You seem to be doing a good job of giving loving instructions and direction to your little one! Clover looks like a happy pup for sure. You want a well behaved, safe, happy dog like we all do. Some of us have different approaches to training a dog and allowing it to blossom, if you will.

No one could love their dogs more than we do and all want to do the right thing. The problem comes up when we don't agree - and guess what? Each dog is so different, that there are many ways to get YOUR dog to behave. You have to do what works for you.

I really enjoy seeing your photos of Clover. She is such a pretty girl. They grow up so quickly, so enjoy her puppyhood while you can.

My pup is now 18 months old and is settled down. She is the love of my life. She is a good girl and loves her Mom, for sure. She is my shadow except when at the dog park! She loves her buddies too!

Keep up the good work. It will pay off in the end. Lots of positive reinforcement for good behavior. I, too, agree with saying NO and Shhhh.

I would never punish a dog for growling. This will just lead them to stop growling all together, which is a warning signal you want to be there. I would stop trying to be the 'dominant' one and start trying to be a team. You need to teach her she can trust you. (EDIT: I see you aren't worried about being the 'dominant' one. That's good :-D) She's uncomfortable with how close you are to her food because she thinks you're going to take it away. So in essence, taking the food away will just reinforce her behavior because you ARE taking it away. Instead, I would take a handful of kibble out of her bowl before you give it to her, sit next to her as close as she is comfortable, and casually toss a kibble in her bowl here and there. She will learn that you are the provider of good things, and when you are around, you give her things. If you ever do need to take her bowl away, it's best to trade it with something amazing, like a little bit of shredded boiled chicken, or something way higher in value than plain ol' kibble.

There are quit a few good books on resource guarding/fear issues.

This one is EXCELLENT

http://www.amazon.com/Mine-Practical.../dp/0970562942

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Originally Posted by MonicanHonda

I would never punish a dog for growling. This will just lead them to stop growling all together, which is a warning signal you want to be there. I would stop trying to be the 'dominant' one and start trying to be a team. You need to teach her she can trust you. (EDIT: I see you aren't worried about being the 'dominant' one. That's good :-D) She's uncomfortable with how close you are to her food because she thinks you're going to take it away. So in essence, taking the food away will just reinforce her behavior because you ARE taking it away. Instead, I would take a handful of kibble out of her bowl before you give it to her, sit next to her as close as she is comfortable, and casually toss a kibble in her bowl here and there. She will learn that you are the provider of good things, and when you are around, you give her things. If you ever do need to take her bowl away, it's best to trade it with something amazing, like a little bit of shredded boiled chicken, or something way higher in value than plain ol' kibble.

There are quit a few good books on resource guarding/fear issues.

This one is EXCELLENT

http://www.amazon.com/Mine-Practical.../dp/0970562942

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Thanks for the alternative. Maybe I'll try that.

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Originally Posted by MonicanHonda

I would never punish a dog for growling. This will just lead them to stop growling all together, which is a warning signal you want to be there.

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Totally agree. Dogs can't talk, so they growl to let you know something isn't right. It's up to us to figure out why they're growling and remedy the situation or reassure them if they're afraid of something.

Keep asking questions Sowa even though some may cause a difference of opinion, we can all always learn more.;) Oh and by the way, here at Pet Talk, the more questions you ask, the more pictures you have to post!:D:p

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Originally Posted by chocolatepuppy

Keep asking questions Sowa even though some may cause a difference of opinion, we can all always learn more.;)

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Yes, absolutely! :)

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Originally Posted by chocolatepuppy

Oh and by the way, here at Pet Talk, the more questions you ask, the more pictures you have to post!:D:p

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oh, and I definately agree with this statement.:D LOL