Think you could install a Puddy-size ice cube maker by the tub faucet? :D
Wow...Mary...I guess it IS darkest before the dawn...and remember the Beatles: "Here comes the sun" :love::)
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Think you could install a Puddy-size ice cube maker by the tub faucet? :D
Wow...Mary...I guess it IS darkest before the dawn...and remember the Beatles: "Here comes the sun" :love::)
WOW, such promissing reports! Way to go Puddy! :D
That's great news to read this morning. It's heartwarming to see you post in a positive way, and I can almost picture you looking somewhat relieved and optomistic. Hopefully Puddy will continue to improve - poor girl has been thru sooo much! As has Mom!!
I don't mean to sound disrespectful with what I'm about to say - but why hasn't your vet been able to see the whole picture of what's going on with Puddy?? You'd think with the tongue/mouth issue would have been a clue in regard to the B12 - and it appears to be working for her. Maybe he was too focused on one problem and completely missed another?
Whatever - I'm just glad someone found this info for you and that it appears to be helping. Still keeping fingers, toes, and poochie paws crossed in hopes that Puddy continues to improve!!
You're not being disrespectful. Believe me, this is something I intend to discuss w/him tomorrow. He's been on vacation all week. I've always been his biggest champion; he has always appeared to have such good instincts. To be fair, I don't know if it's the B vitamins or the Selegiline or the combination of both that has worked and I'm not willing to risk Puddy backsliding to find out by process of elimination. I'm inclined to think that it's the B vitamins, though. (It isn't just B12; it's all the B vitamins that I'm giving her because my other vet, the local one, said that she feels Puddy could need all of them.) Maybe my vet is burning out, too. When I first took Puddy to him a couple of years ago, she was screaming in pain. He said that he had never heard a cat scream like that. My regular vet had retired and the new owners of the clinic, there were 4 of them, looked at her x-rays and watched her for 3 days in their hospital and still couldn't come up w/a diagnosis. I finally said "Either you figure this out or I'm taking her out of here now", which is what I did. Dr. Lee had saved Yodie's life so I took Puddy to him and, as soon as he pulled her x-ray out of the envelope, he said "She has an inflamed colon, you know that, right?" I said "No, I don't know that. How is it that you can see that so readily and 4 other vets couldn't?" He said "I can't explain that but she needs surgery now". When he opened her up, he said she had peritonitis. Why those vets couldn't see that, I have no idea. So, I'm willing to cut Dr. Lee some slack but not much because if her lack of B12 could've been solved months ago, then she's been put through this misery needlessly.Quote:
Originally Posted by pomtzu
I'll post again later. I want to see how she does w/breakfast. She didn't touch any of her cat chow during the night but I baked a chicken breast for dinner and gave her some and she ate quite a bit of it, so maybe she just had enough to eat and didn't need the cat chow.
When I cleaned the boxes this morning, there was a pee clump and a poop. (I don't believe the things that get me excited now.) And this time I'm sure it was hers because there's no way Creamsicle could've gotten into her room.
She didn't eat the chilled Fancy Feast but I'm thinking that she just wasn't hungry because she had chicken for dinner last night and that filled her up. I'll try it again later. She kept the Selegiline down w/no problem this morning. Yesterday she threw it up just seconds after I gave it to her and I didn't have the heart to give her more later in the day, so we skipped a day. It just must taste awful even w/the chicken flavoring added. The way the pharmacist explained it to me is "The cherry Nyquil tastes better than regular Nyquil but it's still Nyquil". Makes sense. So I imagine that the Selegiline must taste pretty awful w/out flavoring.
Well, a friend is picking me up shortly; we're going to browse a flea market today. Sure hope Puddy will let me use the shower.
Well...start the shower with her in there! (JK)Quote:
Sure hope Puddy will let me use the shower.
Glad things continue to improve. Puddy will be feeling happier too!
Dr. Lee - maybe he IS burning out, simply because he has superior skills, and so many will seek him out over other vets (even in his practice). Bound to happen. Not blaming you at all - I am sure MANY have done that for very good reasons; but it may be costing him.
I hope he takes a week OFF...and not to go to a conference. You might jokingly ask him if he has been to HIS vet for a checkup lately. I am sure he will be happy to hear of Puddy's improvement. :)
It's good that you have another vet to check with - no one person can know or think of everything.
Have a good time at the market. :)
Wow, that's great that she used the litter box!! Sounds like things are indeed improving a bit! I'm also glad to hear that she ate the chicken!
Good luck for your talk with the vet tomorrow! ;)
Kirsten
Oh my gosh, what fabulous posts!! I'm so glad that your girl is improving in different ways. Who knows what it is but don't stop!! LOL How great to see that grinning smiley you posted.
In response to the post about your vet not finding this regarding Puddy's tongue, I just wanted to add that nowhere on the internet could I find this tongue/burning mouth syndrome in connection with cats, just people. But it does seem likely that if it is a symptom for people, it could certainly be one for cats too. And because so many of her other symptoms line up with a B deficiency, it makes sense. What I'm wondering though is why the levels of Vitamin B wouldn't show up on bloodwork if they were low. But in any case, from what I've read, it's safe to give and if the body doesn't need it, it can get rid of it. There is an issue with what is water soluable and what isn't and one site said that B12 is and another said it wasn't but your vet should be able to give you a clear answer. :)
It is so funny how little things can be so exciting but I too was cheering away in my den when I read about the drinking and the litterbox use and lack of howling. It is all such good news. And if I've been able to help, I'm so happy because you guys helped me a millions times more with Tiger and Jimmy etc.. That is the wonderful thing about PT. A place where we can share stuff and bounce ideas of each other and think about each other's pets during our day to day activities. It is neat and I don't know what I would have done without it for the past year, it helped so much.
p.s. I found some more stuff supporting the concept that what is first thought to be dementia may be a vitamin B deficiency instead. This again is from a site with regard to people but I think it's really interesting.
Since Puddy has anemia and was acting a bit demented (that sounds so mean-lol) it hopefully could mean that it may not be dementia but a side effect instead. I'm praying that this is the case.Quote:
CHRONIC VITAMIN B DEFICIENCY
Vitamin B deficiency can sneak up on you, because it doesn’t have to create serious health problems right away. In fact, medical researchers have discovered that very often there can be no detectable signs according to scientific instrumentation, that you are experiencing a deficiency. For example, “memory impairment due to vitamin B12 deficiency can precede blood symptoms of deficiency by years. Evidence that vitamin B12 deficiency accounts for some cognition deficits in older people comes from a study that revealed abnormal short-term memory in more than two-thirds of clients with pernicious anemia…The researchers recommend that a diagnosis of senile dementia should not be made, even in the absence of anemia, until vitamin B12 status is determined biochemically.” (Hamilton, p. 476) This means that it is possible that certain mental disorders can be directly attributable to vitamin B complex deficiency, and it is easier to first start replenishing stores of vitamin B complex than to begin treating difficult mental illnesses with drugs, therapy or psychological counseling.
And the highlighted 'blue' part answers my question about the blood work I guess. :)
I guess Salmon is the only thing in that list that would be appealing to a cat. I can't remember if it is one of your cats or one of Candace's that doesn't like salmon.Quote:
Eat more vitamin B-containing foods — oats, barley, wheat bran, avocado, salmon, Brazil nuts and others.
The above quotes came from this site.Quote:
It took a while to create a vitamin B deficiency, so it takes a while to reverse the problem; with severe cases it can take a year or so, with milder cases it can take just a few days.
Yes, my son said "And why isn't your vet finding out all this stuff for you?" He said that I've spent entirely too much money to not have all the info I need from my vet. On the one hand, I can see his point. On the other hand, Dr. Lee is human like everyone else. He saw things in Puddy that other vets missed. Lara found info that he didn't find because he says "Well, the internet is good and it's bad". I can't really fault him, I guess, but I do intend to have a talk w/him tomorrow morning.Quote:
Originally Posted by Catty1
As for the shower, Puddy insisted on sitting on the edge of the tub while I showered. I was afraid she'd fall in because I like HOT showers and, after a minute or so, she jumped down and sat on the floor by the tub. But as soon as I was finished, she jumped back up. Now she's under her bed again. She ate another slice of Buddig turkey meat for breakfast, so maybe she just doesn't care much for Fancy Feast. I'll try it again tonight, though.
Mary, just a couple of quotes from Lara's post:
And from a quote she quoted :) :Quote:
In response to the post about your vet not finding this regarding Puddy's tongue, I just wanted to add that nowhere on the internet could I find this tongue/burning mouth syndrome in connection with cats, just people.
You found Sergeline through the net - used mostly for people, though use of it in dogs and cats is on the net also. But it sounds like this Vitamin B thing isn't even mentioned in cats on the net - so even if Dr Lee was a Google hound, he would have found nothing.Quote:
For example, “memory impairment due to vitamin B12 deficiency can precede blood symptoms of deficiency by years.
Just a couple of things to bear in mind when you talk to him.;)
When I Googled it, the very first link had to do w/cats and BMS but, admittedly, there wasn't much info. Apparently, a vet had written a newsletter about it, so even if it's rare, some vets do know about it. Dr. Lee is always taking classes, etc. so he should also keep up w/what's online. I don't intend to attack him; that isn't my style. I won't be confrontational. I just want him to be aware of what's out there on the net and that can be found by people astute enough to look for it. He's said to me on more than one occasion "But then, I'm old". He isn't old by any stretch. He's younger than I am. He's still my vet and he's a specialist and I'll always remember the time that he gave up precious weekend time w/his sons home from college to do emergency surgery on Puddy because I was so insistent that the other vet call him for an opinion. Rather than give his opinion, he came in and performed the surgery. Yes, Dr. Lee's the man. No worries.Quote:
Originally Posted by Catty1
OK. ;) But I still want to know if he has seen HIS vet for a good once-over! :D And when is the last time you took REAL time off, Young Man??? :p:D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catty1
Trust me, he takes plenty of vacation. His office mgr. told me that he and his family were in FL this week. He just took a week off not too long ago as well. He's also cut back on his hours. I don't know what I'll do if he retires. When my first vet retired, I cried buckets of tears because I had just gotten Creamsicle, my CH baby, and I was scared to death to have her spayed because she's also deaf. Well, she didn't come into heat until she was nearly 6 years old and by that time I had found Dr. Lee. My first vet is the most compassionate man I've ever met and he LOVES cats and does it ever show. When he came out of retirement, I felt all my dreams had been answered. I had Dr. Lee as a specialist and Dr. LeBeau for the every day stuff. But Dr. LeBeau retired again after only two years back in his practice. He's had a bad back w/multiple surgeries and I guess he just can't be on his feet for too long. So I cried again. But his associate, Dr. Butera, is the one who told me to give Puddy all the B vitamins and not just B12, and she gave me the syringe for free. She's very sweet and compassionate as well. So I'll be going to her more often, especially since she's only 6 minutes away and Dr. Lee is 45 minutes away w/the shortcut that I found. W/gas prices the way they are and w/a stressed out and sick kitty in the car, if I can cut my drive time down, I'll do it. But Dr. Lee knows Puddy and her history and he loves her, I can tell. His eyes crinkle up at the corners and you can't fake that. I love the guy. If he wasn't married........
I've been out of town since Thursday. The place we were staying didn't have internet service. Last night I finally took my laptop to the Krystal parking lot and logged on. Of course I could only read a few threads and one of them was this one about Puddy. I told my sister and she asked me why I would want to read about such a sad situation. I couldn't explain it. I just got home tonight and am so thrilled to read the latest developments! I hope things keep improving!
Thanx, Moesha. I know, even my son who loves me and all of my cats asked "How's Puddy or should I even ask?". A couple of my friends are surprised that I didn't give up long ago. I will NEVER give up. But there will come a time when I'll have to let her go. That's totally different. PT prayers and words of encouragement mean the world to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moesha
Although I don't post I check every day on Puddy and you and was so happy to read of the recent steps forward she is making, may it continue so. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...iles/Hugs2.gif
Prayers & positive thoughts continuing.
I just cannot believe the difference in Puddy. Ok, she doesn't want to socialize yet; understandable. She's been through a lot, especially this past week. Her quality of sleep has been awful, so she needs her rest. But she ate cat chow during the night, used her litterbox and drank water out of her bowl. She still insists that I keep the water bowl in the bathtub, so I'm not sure why that is but compared to how she was last week, I don't really care.
Dr. Lee did not call me this morning; I had to call him and when he got on the phone he asked "How's our patient?" and I started right in w/the debate about the vitamin B complex and B 12. His response surprised me. Before becoming a small animal vet, he was an equine vet and he said that B 12 was regularly administered to horses to make them run faster but that he was never a proponent of it. What that has to do w/Puddy and all her symptoms, I have no idea. So I told him of the immediate change in her behavior, appetite, sleep pattern, litterbox habits, etc. since the B complex injection into her bag of fluids and he said "Oh yes, we do that here" and I said "Why was this never mentioned as an option for Puddy?" and he said "I'm just not a proponent of it. You certainly can't hurt her but I've never known it to really help". I was floored. I said "The change in her is undeniable. I'll concede that perhaps the Selegiline is kicking in and maybe the combination of both is what triggered the improvement but I'm unwilling to stop the Selegiline to find out". He said "Well, I wouldn't advise that". Sigh.
Then I asked him about Burning Mouth Syndrome and he said "Mmm hmm...." I paused, waiting for him to say something but he didn't, so I took that as meaning he didn't know what I was talking about and it wasn't my intention to challenge or corner him. I truly wanted his opinion on it or case histories or something, anything but "Mmm hmmm". I told him that I originally called him months ago because Puddy's tongue had been hanging out of her mouth and it so concerned me and we thought at that time that it may have been due to her gingivitis. Another "Mmm hmm". However, since the B complex injection, she hardly sticks her tongue out at all now. When I told him that all this info was discovered on the internet, I got his standard reply about the internet being good and bad. Now, how is all this bad, I ask you???
We finished the conversation w/him saying "I'm for what works and if you feel that the B complex is working for her, then by all means, keep it up. There are those who feel that it's effective". I replied with "Well, I'm in that camp". He chuckled and said "Ok".
After I spoke to him, I called my local vet and told her of Puddy's improvement and she even sounded surprised but said "Oh! Good!" So I'll be picking up another syringe for her subQ's today. The thing that frustrates me about her office is that they only have one person on the desk at all times. It's difficult for her to book appts., take care of incoming patients, answer calls, do computer work, etc. w/out confusion. And they're always training new people, so they never know who I am. Sometimes I have to spell my name for them repeatedly; today I had to spell it 4 times and after all that, she asked "What is this about again?" I became impatient and said "Please, can you let me speak to someone who is familiar w/my case? This is important! I know I'm not Dr. B's only patient but this is very frustrating." She offered to have someone return my call but, historically, I get the call at the end of the day and this couldn't wait. I need those vitamins today and not after they close their office. Finally, Dr. B picked up the phone. They also only have 2 vet techs there at a time, which is also another problem. They've inherited a HUGE client base from Dr. LeBeau and they're overwhelmed. I understand it and I can be patient but if it's a matter of urgency, then I have to go to Dr. Lee instead. I don't want to go to him for routine things. I love Dr. B and she's nearby but unless and until that office starts humming, I'll have to continue w/Dr. Lee for all my vet needs. However, when it comes to surgery, Dr. Lee is the man. He has an anesthesiologist there at all times and so many vet techs and people working the front desk that I've lost count. To be fair, he has a large clinic w/5 vets on staff, so maybe my comparison of the two offices is somewhat skewed.
Anyhow, the most important issue is that Puddy has improved a lot and I'm feeling hopeful for the first time in weeks. I know that she won't be w/me forever but until the time comes that I must say 'goodbye', I want her to be as comfortable and happy as possible. If it wasn't for Lara and her research, Puddy probably wouldn't be here today. I was going to make that call if she hadn't improved. The way I see it, Lara's research and many prayers from my PT friends saved Puddy's life, if only for a little while. Life is good.
ETA: She ate her Fancy Feast this morning.
What great news to read that Puddy is still making strides in the right direction. :D
But how frustrating that Dr. Lee can't be more consistent. If he uses the B vitamins at his clinic, I wonder why he never gave you the option of giving it a try on Puddy??? :confused: He uses it but is not a proponent of it - doesn't make sense - unless I'm missing something! :confused:
All that counts right now is Puddy - and if it's working along with her other med - then keep it up. When she makes her way in to the sun room to catch some rays, it will all be worth it! :D
I'm w/ya on all of it but this sentence says it all, Ellie. And if she can throw in a hiss for good measure, then I'll know that my Puddy is back.Quote:
Originally Posted by pomtzu
That's great that Puddy keeps improving! :) What a great advice it was when Emeraldgreen mentioned the B12 deficiency!!
However, Dr. Lee 's reaction is a bit strange, but most doctors don't like it when their clients do some research on their own.
Anyway, it seems to help Puddy, and that's all that counts!
(Too bad that Dr. B.'s office sounds so unorganized, she seems to be much nicer!)
Kirsten
I can't say any more right now. I'm too sick w/grief.
Oh, how my heart goes out to you. I just feel that Puddy will always be close to you. She knew how hard you tried and how much love you have for her. She will stay close to fill your heart with love and try to ease your grief.
These times are like no other and I wish that I could say just the right thing to ease your pain.
I am so very sorry.
OMG Mary - I'm sitting here just sobbing. Nothing I can say will ease your pain, but please know that you and Puddy are in my prayers. :love:
Mary I know everyone is in shock. Know that we all are here for you and praying. I am so sorry.
I am so sorry, we try and try but some times there are other plans for our babies.
Oh god, Mary, I am so sorry to be reading this. I wish I knew what to say to make you feel better.
Sweet Puddy girl, rest now, and watch over your meowmy, know that she is in terrible shock and grief. Know that you are now well, and whole, and that all of us on Pet Talk will be thinking of you and your family tonight and wishing you all peace.
Godspeed to the Bridge, dear sweet girl.
((((HUGS))))) to you Mary.
I'm so sorry for your Loss Mary.
(hugs)
What???? :eek:
OMG, Mary, I'm really shocked!!!! :( :( :( Things just looked so good for her, now reading this was the last thing I expected!! :( :(
I'm really really sorry, it must hurt so much, especially after you just started to hope that there's a turn for the better.
I'm so very sorry about your loss!
(((HUGS)))
R.I.P. little Puddy, you have touched many hearts here. Now be young and whole at the Bridge again. :love:
Kirsten
Mary,
I am so very sorry for your loss. I have been following this thread for a very long time, and I was so shocked to see she crossed the bridge. Please know that you were the best mom any kitty could ever ask for and Puddy knew you loved her with all of your heart. This is the saddest thing I have heard in so long. I am so so so sorry. Please if you need to talk to someone, do not hesitate to send me a PM. I am sending you a great big HUG through the computer screen. Puddy will be missed a great deal. :love::(:love:
I am so very sorry. {{{{{Mary}}}}}
Dearest Mary, my heart goes out to you, just know puddy is now at peace and it was her time to go, i often read that sometimes they appear to become really better and then go, i have no idea why, you were a great meowmie,you gave her the best life possibly could, and i know you are grieving right now,but in time you will see that it was just Puddy's time.
A big giant gentle hug to you right now,i wish there was something i could say that would help to comfort you,but i know your'e heart is sad right now, just know we are all thinking of you at this very sad time in your life.:love::love:
I had to go to Dr. Lee's to pick up Puddy's Epogen syringes and Dr. Butera's to pick up her B vitamins, so I was going to go to Dr. Lee's first but something told me to do it the other way around. I went to Dr. B's and brought the B vitamins home and checked on Puddy and she was in her carrier curled up, looking cozy. When I touched her, she meowed but it was forced and I could tell that she was struggling to breathe. I didn't want to take her to Dr. B's because when I went into that office today, they were packed and there was the usual confusion and so I called Dr. Lee's office and said "Alert him that I'm on my way". Puddy never made a sound during the entire drive there. They took us right in as soon as we got there.
Dr. Lee came back into the room and said "I want to do a chest x-ray" and I gave my permission, of course. He came back a few minutes later and said "I gave her a shot to help her breathe more easily and to kill the pain. Her lungs are filled w/fluid. You have two options: I can drain her lungs or you can ease her pain." I said "Ease her pain?" and he said "Put her to sleep". I asked "If you drain her lungs..." and he interrupted me and said "I don't even know if she'll make it." I said "And if she does?" He said "There's no guarantee that it won't happen again right away". So I said "No. She's been through enough. Let's end this, Dr. Lee". Then I said "I need to be w/her and hold her while you do it" and he said "Ok". He brought her to me and I held her. She tried to stand up, she took one last breath as though she was trying to grab onto air; she let out a cry and then she got still. I said "I think she's gone, Dr. Lee". Apparently, the shot that he gave her took her; he didn't even have to start the IV.
He said "I'm sorry, Mary. Puddy was a fighter right up to the very last breath. She was amazing." I asked him how this could happen; she had been doing so well the last couple of days and I told him "You know I would've said something when I talked to you this morning if she had shown any signs of not being able to breathe". He said "Because she's been lying around so much, it was easy for the fluid to accumulate in her lungs. It happens to humans, too. It didn't just happen. It's obviously been accumulating and she just now showed signs of it". I asked if I killed her w/giving her too many subQ's and he said "Nooooo! It's because of your good care of her that she lived as long as she did. No, Mary, Puddy had one challenge after another. She just said 'That's it. I can't take any more'".
He showed me her x-rays and her lungs were completely filled w/fluid and she had fluid around her heart, too. He said that she gasped so hard for air and fought so hard for life that her intestines were filled w/air and he showed it to me on the x-ray. He said "She fought to the very last second. That was Puddy". He gave me a hug a couple of times and said "Please be careful driving home". I could tell that he just did not know what else to say.
So I came home and dug her grave before it got dark. By the time I was done I was pretty sore, even from last week's fall, so I thought I'd take a hot bath. Of course, as soon as I went upstairs, I saw the bowl of water in the tub and that got me started again. You'd think I'd run out of tears by now. I'll write her tribute later. I just can't do it right now. The sun is setting and the night has never been my friend anyhow. How will I sleep w/out listening for that 'tap tap tap' on the hardwood floor?
{{{{HUGS}}}}
What more can I say???
But I can cry with you, as hard as if she were my very own. She didn't want YOU to have to suffer the pain of this decision. She was quite a girl.
Puddy, try not to give the Big Vet in the sky too much CAT-itude. OK? :love:
Many people will be missing you, tonight. :(
I am so sorry to hear about Puddy. You really did everything you could for her and much more than many pet owners out there would have. You have no reason to think otherwise. My thoughts are with you.
So sorry to hear that Puddy had to leave your side.
When things are quiet, you will hear her 'tap tap tap' in your mind and know she's there. Until you meet again, One Fine Day.
Godspeed, Puddy.
I am so sorry! God bless you both.katslady
Oh, Mary. I am so sorry. You did so much for sweet Puddy. I am sitting here crying. Please know that Puddy loves you and one day you will hear the tap-tap-tap again; even if only in your dreams.
((Hugs)) to you.
You can read my tribute to Puddy as an ETA in my first post of the Cat Memorial thread. Thank you all again, my dear friends, for your wonderful words of encouragement, support and sympathy. I treasure all of you.
{{{hug!}}} :(
Puddy, next time you see your Meowmie staring at the night sky, rip it with your claw so a bit of Light gets through. It'll let her know you're back to your old self.
Love, Columbine
OMG. I'm so sorry. This is my first time on the computer today and I couldn't believe what I was reading. :( I'm going to post in Puddy's Memorial post right now. {{{{{hugs}}}}}:(:love: