I think Reggie may have Cushings disease...

A friend of mine (former co-worker) came in a few days ago to bring me some pictures she had of Nebo. She told me that she lost her dog, Pookie, last week. :( Pookie was a shelter dog, a black and tan coonhound, and just an all around wonderful dog. She was 11 years old. She told me that they found out she had Cushings disease caused by a tumor. She described the symptoms (increased thirst, hunger, and urination) and that sounds just like Reggie.

I've looked on the internet and several more things fit. He definitely has the "pot-bellied" appearance (but not as severe as some pics I've seen). His belly sags and he looks rather round but when you feel him he doesn't "feel" fat if that makes sense (caused by loss of muscle mass another symptom). He also has the bony skull-like appearance of the head, hind leg weakness, pigmented spots on the skin and lumps (I'm not sure if they are the kind they mentioned though the vet said his were nothing to worry about), and his hair and skin seem a bit thinner as well but not dramatically. It mentioned nervous system problems (his restlessness and shaking?) and behavior (constantly attacking Nebo?) too. I read that its more common in small, older dogs. Not everything fits though so I don't know for sure. He really does not have hair loss on his sides or any sort of skin sores, diabetes, pancreatitis, seeking out cool places to lay (in fact he usually seems like he's cold) or seizures and the vet said his urine was concentrated not diluted (diluted urine is a symptom).

My friend said (and what I've read seems to confirm this) that there is no cure for it. If it's caused by a tumor its not recommended to surgically remove it in an older dog (Reggie is over 13). She said that the pills for it cost $10 per pill (going to check on that) and they don't shrink the tumor they just may help with the symptoms. What I've read makes it sound like the treatments can have adverse affects as well and that it is a hard disease to diagnose. I don't know if my parents will pursue my speculation, I'm sure they will see if the medication from the vet they already have works first. I'm not sure they could afford the treatments either.

So sorry to hear that. My RB Buttons had cushings disease as well as diabetes and blindness but he still had a good quality life up until the week before we put him down. He lived for a few more years after he was diagnosed. His hair loss wasn't too bad until a few months before he died. He lost all the hair on his ears and then his coat started thinning much later on. If you look in my signature you can kind of see the hair thinning on his waist and the complete loss on his ears.

We had to give him prednisone every other day I think, but I don't remember too well. I hope Reggie can get the proper diagnosis. They can lead a pretty normal life once they get help. Good luck :)

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Originally Posted by wolf_Q

that it is a hard disease to diagnose.

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Actually it's fairly easy to diagnose. You'll need to leave your dog at the vets for a full day. They take a blodd sample then administer an injection of dexamethasone and they re-test the blood 8 hours later.

The dexamethasone should suppress cortisol levels in the blood stream of a healthy dog. Which does not happen in a dog with cushing's disease.

Once the dog is diagnosed you may then get an additional test, very similar to the first to determain if it is pituitary gland tumors or adrenal tumors.



I am not sure of the cost of the medication but I don't think that it's that expensive.

Have you taken Reggie to the vet for a diagnosis? Is he in pain or discomfort?

Some of the stuff I read on the internet was conflicting so maybe its not hard to diagnose...I do remember reading about that blood test but I thought it said it is not always accurate.

He was at the vet on monday (this was before I talked to my friend). My mom called the vet and talked to him yesterday and the vet didn't think Reggie had it at all so I'm probably just nuts. He gave us some medications for him to try so we're going to try that and see if it works first.

I can't read his mind but he does not act like he's in pain or discomfort he acts pretty normal (besides the peeing all over but that's been going on for a while now and he's been to the vet twice for it). He doesn't cry out in pain or anything. He's very mean with Nebo but he's been like that for a while as well it just seems worse lately.

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We had to give him prednisone every other day I think, but I don't remember too well.

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I was under the impression that prednisone can cause it? :confused:

It was late at night when I read about it so maybe I'm just completely confused. :o

I have to say that the symptoms you are describing seems like "old dog disease". The thinning of the fur, the small tumors on the skin, aggressiveness toward the other dog, frequent urination and shaking. Are the tumors pink and kind of "bubblish"? Those usually occur in older dogs and are benign. They can be removed by a groomer in some cases.
Frequent urination can come with old age and the predozone. Right now I would say it's a combo of BOTH. The hair thinning often occurs on short haired dogs as they age. Especially after the age of 12. Kind of like human's hair thin out too at that age. (84)
Cushings would have been diagnosed at a younger age if it was the disease. Atleast by the age of 10 the symptoms would have been prominent enough for the vet to test for it.
Please stop doing the "internet" research on every symptom. It's just going to make you "overreact" to each new symptom. Your already taking the dog to the vet who is a professional. Let them make the diagnoses.
Your dog is getting older. They may be losing some hearing or eyesight. Keep an eye on cataracts forming. The dog's reaction to the other dog may be a reflection of this. They have less of their normal senses and other dogs can sense this. Your dog is just trying to maintain it's dominance or place in the pack. Hence the aggressiveness. Just understand your dog is getting older and is going to go through changes.

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Originally Posted by wolf_Q

I was under the impression that prednisone can cause it? :confused:

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I'm not sure really. He was on 3 or 4 medications but I thought the prednisone was for cushings. I could be wrong, it was so long ago.

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Originally Posted by wolf_Q

I was under the impression that prednisone can cause it? :confused:

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Killian had drug induced Cushings. Because he had to take Pred for his autoimmune disease, he ended up with Cushings. It was a no win situation. He HAD to take Pred or the autoimmune symptoms would flare up. He still did well for quite a while, but ended up with the pot belly, hair loss, rear end weakness, etc.

BTW, Pred's side effect can be urinary frequency.

It is best to go to the vet with all those symptoms and get a good diagnosis. Good luck!!!

Here's a link that will explain Cushings:

Cushings

Not all symptoms have to be present, and the Dexamethasone, ACTH suppression tests should provide a diagnosis. If left untreated it will readily damage the kidneys.

Given the array of symptoms you are seeing which are consistent with Cushings you should get the dog tested. If your current Vet resists, then ask for a referral to a specialist in order to get a diagnosis.

Prolonged treatment with Prednisone (e.g. just a few months) can induce Iatrogenic Cushing's. Yet another reason not to over use Prednisone for simple things such as allergies. For things like autoimmune diseases it's used to help get things under control, before switching to a Chemo drug such as Cytoxin, or Methotrexate.

I think was upset over the death of my friends dog so I probably overreacted when reading about the disease. He has been to a vet, last monday, I did not ask about cushings then because I did not know about it. But as I said before my mom called and talked to the vet after that and the vet remembered Reggie and he did not think he had it.

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Are the tumors pink and kind of "bubblish"? Those usually occur in older dogs and are benign. They can be removed by a groomer in some cases.

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I know what you are talking about, Smokey had them all over and I am a groomer and so I see dogs with those all the time. Reggie has a few of those but other ones that are different as well as some larger fatty cysts. The vet looked at them and said they were nothing to worry about.

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The dog's reaction to the other dog may be a reflection of this. They have less of their normal senses and other dogs can sense this. Your dog is just trying to maintain it's dominance or place in the pack. Hence the aggressiveness. Just understand your dog is getting older and is going to go through changes.

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He does not react this way to our other dog but she's female and smaller and so probably not seen as a threat. Reggie has never liked Nebo but I swear its worse...or maybe it's just driving us more crazy, he always growled but now he's jumping and biting at Nebo if he even walks past. Nebo does not do anything to provoke this.

Just for the record he's not on prednisone and has not ever been on it to my knowledge.

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Cushings would have been diagnosed at a younger age if it was the disease. Atleast by the age of 10 the symptoms would have been prominent enough for the vet to test for it.

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He's over 13 and the symptoms did not seem prominant to the vet. When looking at pictures he looks nothing like the dogs with cushings either except for a bit of a sagging belly.

I called today to get an estimate on the tests the receptionist didn't know she's going to call back. Reggie is not my dog he is my parents dog. It is up to them to decide if they are going to do the test. I hope I am not judged on what they decide to do.

I'm sorry I'm really depressed right now and this thread is just making it worse. :(

I didn't want to scare or depress you on my post. Sorry. I just thought it might be better to accept the dog is OLDER than having a disease. :cool: I think with a "disease" or "condition" we can accept the issues we see in our dogs. However, when we know it is "old age" and just the "natural" course of a healthy life, it's harder to accept. :( A disease we can "cure", old age, we can't ignore! ;)
My gut feel is the dog is going through the "change". It's no longer the young youthful puppy it was. It now needs a little more time and effort to do things. It's not time to panic. It may be a time to discuss "plans". Put some energy in deciding how to handle the final decision and when it may be appropriate. If it is cushings, would you consider putting the dog down or do you want to pursue treatments at it's age? These are things you and your family need to think about. How do you want the dog to live out the rest of his life?