Job Opening at Camp Vermont

[sasvermont]

I am just about ready to throw in the towel.

Ti and Miley just had the worst fight to date. Shouldn't it be getting better? Does one have to die in order to win? What gives here. Miley is relentless and Ti is having at her as much as he can.....and I am at the end of my rope. I have been dividing the house in half and switching them around - allowing them to be with each other when I am around. All it takes is one to get near the other and whammo....a fight. Things get knocked over...broken, fur flies....no injuries quite yet.

I just don't know .... Where is Graemer when I need him?

Any advice? I don't want to give up. Should I keep dividing the house until June, until the kitten arrives. Should I return Ti to his original home? I like Ti and I like Miley.

Does this sound oh so familiar? I would surely hate to give up now.....but...................................

Help!

:confused: :mad: :o :confused:

[lailamara]

Yikes !! All I can say is Feliway, Feliway and more Feliway. Diffuse it in the air with that diffuser thingy....spray it on everything and rub them down with it. Miley is very stubborn about giving up her throne and Ti can only be Mr. Nice Guy for so long. DON'T GIVE UP !You've done this before , you can do it again.:eek:

[NoahsMommy]

Yes, get the Feliway spray and spray the heck out of your house. Have you tried Rescue Remedy? It'll calm them down.

Since Miley had cats in the house before, she will get used to it. Its just a battle of wills right now. Is Ti submissive to her at all?

[shais_mom]

I don't have any advice, just support. The feliway and rescue remedy sound like good things to try.
or maybe valium for mom?? :o

[Denyce]

Wow.

I am not sure I have anything good to advise. Which one is the aggresser? Is it the female? If it is I would make sure the incoming kitten is male.

I have four female cats. My mom who also shares the house with us has a male and female. My four females tolerate each other. I never have cute adorable pictures of them cleaning one another because that just isn't going to happen. We have a king sized bed and all four cats and my husband and I all manage to sleep on it relatively peacefully except for the claustraphobia I get periodically. But the cats will not touch each other for any reason what so ever. I have 2 of those Feliway diffusers in our half of the house. You notice I said our half.

My cat Deirdre will not under any circumstances tolerate my mom's female Tribble. Not for one second. As soon as Deirdre sees her she takes off like a heat seeking missle. No noise no warning no nothing but WHAM! Tribble is lucky to be a long haired cat because that is all that has ever saved her from being torn to shreds. We tried keeping them apart by sharing the main part of the house. One half of the day mom's cats would get the run of the house...the second half would be my cats turn...but then we had territorial marking. Deirdre would pee on my mom's furniture and Tribble would pee on mine. So we had a wall built. Right across the middle of the house which is a one story ranch. Now they don't have to share space or see one another. So far the peeing has quit for the most part.

I have a friend that has 9 cats and they all manage to get along..but then 8 of them are male. I have found that for the most part it seems to be the females that are more aggressive and territorial. Of course there are always exceptions to every rule.

I wish I could say to you to try this or that and everything will work out great. I can't. Some cats just can't tolerate others for any reason what so ever. My Deirdre will tolerate my other 3 but not Tribble. Just keep trying. And keep trying...but if you get to a point that the situation just won't work then you need to let go without guilt. At least in our situation it is my mom's cats....that is so much easier. I don't know what I would have done if when my husband moved in with his Kaliban if they wouldn't have gotten along. I don't know after having all of ours for years seperately who we could have given up. It would have been impossible and I thank the fates every day that it never happened.

Good luck and I will be sending all the good happy thoughts and prayes that I can your way.

Denyce

[Edwina's Secretary]

Oh please don't give up!

[Karen]

There were times I'm sure my mom thought my younger brother and I were gonna kill each other, but we grew out of it ...

Perhaps if one of them "wins" the next battle, detant will be established .... never dealt with this, but try the Rescue Remedy/Feliway ...

[sasvermont]

I feel as though I am in a ring and going back into the fight each night.....

I will stop and get some feliway...I bought resue remedy a while back so it must still be in my house somewhere. I have considered using Gabe's medication on the two of them.....in the ear.....hey, maybe I will do that.....well, that will be my last resort.

Right now I have the house in 1/2....and all is quiet. I can't live this way forever. I feel so helpless..... and I see/hear about so many people struggling to get cats to accept each other. This one is going in reverse which puzzles me.

Both cats are so sweet and trusting of me. At least with Gabe, I had a healthy fear of HIM biting me, but Ti, gee, he is so sweet and Miley is too. They would never go after ME.....but each other...well...there is fur on the floor in the living room. I think it is Ti's. Both cats have had their nails clipped.....

I will not give up. It just isn't working out as I had hoped....

I will try. Honestly. I am not a quitter. And I love both these kitties.....

I need my Grammy Crackers......

I will keep you guys posted.

I just finished watching a Public TV program about an adopted Vietnamese child/girl/woman and her mother....and I am all cried out now....

So off to bed. Tomorrow is a new cat day!:rolleyes:

P. S. Denyce, your story about your cats made me laugh! I needed that....thank you!

[Pam]

Sallyanne I am sorry your two are putting you through this. I can imagine how sad and frustrated you must be feeling right now. I think if any cat should have ever gotten Miley's fur up it should have been Gabe, but aaah there was gentle Graemer to act as mediator and peacemaker. I know you must miss him so much at times like these, remembering his sweet little personality. I do hope that the Feliway helps. It sounds like it is certainly well worth trying.

[AmberLee]

Weird thought, and it might be too extreme for you...

We took Cassy, Livvy, and Sassy in to the groomers when it looked like WWIII was breaking out in the furry set. It seemed to help -- all the fur kids smelled alike and they were all out of their usual territory. Things settled down nicely for that visit at least.

(This WAS the groomers visit where Livvy was declared Gatta Non Gratta and wasn't allowed back. :rolleyes: :o My widdle furry princess can fight like a trooper!)

[sasvermont]

I will stop at Petco for the Feliway.......and take a wiff of it myself! Maybe I should be the one taking meds! I will confess to having had a beer each night for the past few days....to try to relax a little. I haven't had a beer here since Gabe gained his wings.

Wish me luck! I guess it could be worse.

And what is with all this snow? Where is spring?

This morning I was having bad thoughts about what it would be like if these two current cats start fighting the June kitten. Oh my.
I need to think more positively!

;)

[Pam]

Originally posted by sasvermont
And what is with all this snow? Where is spring?

This morning I was having bad thoughts about what it would be like if these two current cats start fighting the June kitten. Oh my.
I need to think more positively!

;)

That little June kitten may be what saves the day (**picture in my mind of June kitty flying in with a cape singing "here I am to save the day!"**) Remember those old Mighty Mouse cartoons? he!he! Thinking back, Miley was OK when there were "3." This one-on-one thing with Ti may just be too much for her to handle. Also, wouldn't it be funny if she developed some maternal feelings for the little June kitty. I know there is a book out called "Think Like a Cat." I have read about it here on PT. Maybe it is worth a look see. Still hoping for someone to raise the flag of surrender at Camp Vermont!

Yes, the snow is not adding to anyone's happy thoughts of spring. Ours has pretty much melted already. I just hope that is the last of it! Thinking of you and the strife at Camp Vermont!

[Vio&Juni]

Sorry to hear about this. I hoped they will fight for a while and they will decide who's the boss and stop. I can't even imagine how it's going to be with Juni. There is a black stray kitten near my office and I would like to adopt him after a visit to the vet, but, considering how fierce she was with the visiting cat some months ago :confused: I don't know?!
Good luck! I know you will do your best.

[Barbara]

F+T is the first time I have 2 cats. And they also had a short period of flying fur before they became friends. And since then the fur flies once a week and there has also been some blood - a scratch on tigris head, a little bit in Filou's ear.

I notice that here at PT some kitties seem to come in a period of more stress after 2 weeks or so.

Outside many cats can share the same territory in a kind of time sharing system: this is my path in the morning and your's in the afternoon. If a new cat arrives, there will be some fight before they have developped a new sharing schedule. So even some back gardens can be the territory of quite a number of cats.

I never heard about a cat killing another cat (and especially not of a fixed cat killing another fixed cat) but I understand how you must feel.

How is their behavior after a fight? More peaceful for a certain time? Who attacks first?

I wish I could be more helpful
:) :) :)

[rosethecopycat]

I agree, thy the Feliway. I've got some on hand when my fosters arrive next week.

Then, I know it seems like forever, but keep them as far apart as possible til June.

Then try and bond the kitten to Ti. (since Miley seems to be more territorial and wants to be left alone) Do an isolation, a good long one, 10 to 14 days and introduce Kitten to Ti. When they come out as a bonded pair, Miley might not feel so threatened.

Any one else agree with this? I't just a theory, I'm no expert.

I'm going to have two separate males to integrate with my two boys in about 3 weeks.


Good luck, SAS, we'll be thinking about you.:)

I fell so sory for you, Sas; after all you went through with Graemer & Gabe...:(
I realise now how lucky I am with my 2 cats:) There NEVER was a fight at all; just a tiny bit of hissing, and five minutes later, they were grooming each other!!:) :)
I do not know about any medicine, but lots of us have, so I wish you all the luck you need with this!!

{{{hugs}}}

[ramanth]

As rough as it may feel.. don't give up!

There is still hope that it will all work out in the end. :)

[Logan]

SAS, you know ( think you do, anyway ), my Mimi has NEVER accepted Butter in any way, shape or form. I wish she would, but they have simply never been able to bond. It's been two years. And the best situation that could have happened, happened when we move to a two story house! I'm not suggesting that you find another house, but it has just worked out that Mimi has become the "upstairs" kitty and Butter is the "downstairs" kitty. They do cross paths, coming in and out of the door, and Butter is always respectful of Mimi, backing up to allow her to come and go as she pleases. Mimi = Miley, Butter = Ti (at least in the "who's alpha" way :o ). Butter never bites Mimi.....he saves that for me and Scott. LOL!!! So in many ways, you are lucky, at least they are both loving you. The worst injury to date (and the only one that I know of) was Mimi's claw causing an abcess on Butter's neck! And he doubles her in weight!!! :eek:

I don't know what to tell you, except to let them "fight it out". And in fact, the Rescue Remedy in their water bowls might help a lot, just to calm things down. If it doesn't help them, you drink some!! Then you won't worry so much!!! Once things warm up and you can let them out on the porch, maybe it will improve.

My thoughts and prayers are with you!

Logan

Originally posted by Logan
I don't know what to tell you, except to let them "fight it out".

I agree with Logan, here.
Maybe, after a good "supervised fight", they will respect each other better and decide who is the "alpha" cat!

Success Sas!!

[PayItForward]

As we are experiencing similar problems at the moment, our thoughts are with you.:(

Lets rise our glasses and drink rescue remedy(Or a nice dry wine :))

To our cats, may they be friends in the near future (But I'll settle for 'eventually not enemies'...Sigh)

[moosmom]

SAS,

I know EXACTLY what you're going through. Although the transition between Moo and Georgie has gone very smoothly, I'm still having a problem with Maya Linn. She is a real witch (with a "b"). Georgie went to get a drink out of the fountain and she ripped into him.

When Georgie first came home, I pumped Moo full of Rescue Remedy. It worked well. Since her little "outburst" (she's so loud!!) I started giving her Rescue Remedy too. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

You're doing the right thing by alternating them so they both have a little freedom. Keep doing what you're doing. I think it might take a while (these things don't happen overnight) but it'll be worth it. Hang in there and call me if you need me. :D

[NoahsMommy]

SAS....it feels like I'm reading all about how I felt when I was having my problems with sweet Oliver. :( Drink that beer...drink two! ;)

Try the Feliway...spray them during fights and the house every day.

If it doesn't work, I would totally put that cream on Miley's ear. Just for a while, while she gets used to him being around as a sibling, not a house guest.

If it makes you feel any better, Noel is having a really hard time with Micah being in the house. Go figure, he's just like Basie...but Noel isn't too fond of him either. :rolleyes:

[Vermontcat]

Sas, maybe you want to try some soft paws on just Miley or both cats so there is less fur flying.
Noah's Mommy has a lot of experience with introducing cats lately and uses soft paws.;)
I hope Miley and Ti start to get along better, otherwise maybe the June kitten will turn out to be a Peacemaker!

[jenluckenbach]

I am so sorry that you are having the battle of the wills. I can't even give any helpful insight because I have simply NEVER had a cat that couldn't adjust. But I say if YOU can hold out, then let them work it out, no matter how long it takes. Good luck.

[krazyaboutkatz]

Sallyanne, I'm so sorry to hear that Miley and Ti are still fighting. :( I sure hope that the rescue remedy or feliway will work. I'm sure that once you adopt the June kitten that things will settle down. Good luck. BTW Cirrus and Sunny are starting to bond more now. I've seen both of them licking each others heads. Cirrus is also becoming more affectionate towards me too. :)

[sasvermont]

Fortunately I have doors on every room except the living room and dinning room. So each day/night all you hear are door slamming shut!

Last night I sprayed the Feliway and both of the cats just looked at me like I was stupid. I then put some of the anti-anxiety cream on Ti's ear (Miley was sitting too high in the kitchen for me to reach her and wouldn't come down because you-know-who was sitting below, teasing her).....

Needless to say, the cream did not impact on Ti at all. I will try both of them tonight, when I first arrive home.

I really think Miley is now terrified of Ti, since he has been fighting back. She bit off more than she can chew. My hope is that the house of doors will change to the positive once the new kitty arrives in June. Maybe, by that time, this cat war will be history.

I had two beers last night. Let me see, if I keep up at this rate, I will weigh 300 lbs and be holding AA meetings here!

Thanks for all of the advice.

P. S. I did not find the Rescue Remedy here at home or at Petco, so I will look elsewhere today!

Gotta get these cats to settle down.....:D :rolleyes: :D

[jenluckenbach]

SAS, get rescue remedy at GNC if you have one nearby.

[Pam]

Thank you for the update SAS. Your sense of humor may be what gets you through this. I hope one of these remedies will help. Has Ti's posture toward Miley changed (does he initiate any of the fighting) or does he still only lash out when there are acts of 'unfriendliness' toward him?

[catlady1945]

Our second oldest, Ginger, despises our youngest, Krissy - still, after almost 8 years. For Krissy's sanity we keep her in the living room/dining room when we are out. Ginger likes to sleep a lot now so Krissy has more freedom when we are all around.

[Vio&Juni]

same question as Pam's - does Ti start any fight or just fights back?

[sasvermont]

The answer about which kitty is the aggressor...well, it switches off. Ti is curious and would love to have a roll around the floor...as in playing....and Miley's response to his curiousity is to lash out at Ti....then the war begins. Miley usually runs and Ti is in hot pursuit. Last night was an exception in that Miley jumped up on the top of a kitchen cabinet and would not let Ti up there......and she would not come down. So we had no fights last night because Miley stayed isolated out of fear.

Uneven at best: Miley weighs 6 pounds and Ti weighs 17. Still no blood, just fur flying. I guess someday soon I should just let them have at it with each other. A couple of times, after cornering each other under the sofa, one kitty had an accident - scared the poop right out of him/her. I think it was probably Miley.

Today I will find the Rescue Remedy. What do you do with it? Rub it on them?

Such problems.

SAS

:rolleyes:

[Barbara]

Filou 7 lb, Tigris 13 lb.
The same role models.
Tigris wants to play. Filou attacks him. If it gets more serious Tigris will always win. Filou also had times when he started to pee in the wrong places because Tigris wouldn't leave him alone.

I had already the feeling that maybe they are competing for your love as well. I had the same impression with my two too. So in the harder times (maybe 2-4 years ago) I did not interact when they fighted (I must admit Filou cried as if Tigris would eat him but I got the impression it was a typical little brother behavior to get Mommy to help) but just saw that after and apart from that Filou could retire where he wanted and to give him as much attention and love as possible when he was alone.

As I have said in another thread at the moment they are closer again and it is much less stress but they still have different times to ask for quality time: In the morning e.g., Filou joins me in the bathroom while Tigris downstairs reads the newspaper with his tummy while my husband reads Tigris:D

I send the best and positive thoughts. I love Miley so much for what she's been through and I think Ti is a nice and friendly boy in his cat soul and so I hope they'll work it out.:)

[Edwina's Secretary]

while Tigris downstairs reads the newspaper with his tummy while my husband reads Tigris

Your husband gets the same newspaper I do!!! :D ;)

Reminds me of the old joke of someone sitting on a newspaper on a subway. Another person comes along and says, "Are you reading that newspaper?" First person stands up, turns the page of the newspaper, sits back down and says, "Yes."

[jenluckenbach]

They have to ingest the rescue remedy. You can put it in the water or mix it with canned food/