View Full Version : So much for "freedom"

04-01-2003, 06:51 PM
The world press on the war
A secret U.S. plan to impose a new regime on Iraq calls for the creation of 23 ministries, each headed by an American.

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Compiled by Laura McClure

April 1, 2003 |

A disagreement has broken out at a senior level within the Bush administration over a new government that the US is secretly planning in Kuwait to rule Iraq in the immediate period after the overthrow of Saddam Hussein. Under the plan, the government will consist of 23 ministries, each headed by an American. Every ministry will also have four Iraqi advisers appointed by the Americans, the Guardian has learned.

The government will take over Iraq city by city. Areas declared "liberated" by General Tommy Franks will be transferred to the temporary government under the overall control of Jay Garner, the former US general appointed to head a military occupation of Iraq.

In anticipation of the Baghdad regime's fall, members of this interim government have begun arriving in Kuwait.

04-01-2003, 06:57 PM
If it's "secret" how do they know about it?

04-01-2003, 06:58 PM
Secret in that it's not being broadcasted from the government. It was leaked to the media.

04-01-2003, 07:04 PM
"The first casualty of war is the truth" - I'm not sure of the exact source of this quote, I believe I heard it on the TV Sci-Fi show, Babylon 5.

I'm not going to get worked up over all the hype and propaganda going on right now. If it hadn't been for the US occupation of Japan after WWII, my husband's parents wouldn't have met and he wouldn't be here.:eek:

04-01-2003, 07:13 PM
Freedom, YES! A female POW was just rescued! She is 19 yrs. old and was with the maintenance company that "lost it's way." :)

04-01-2003, 07:17 PM
I think I will reserve judgement until there's more proof. Leaks don't make a big impact on me either way.

04-01-2003, 07:21 PM
Sandra I think this young lady was formerly listed as MIA. The people whose vehicle took a wrong turn were the following according to info that I received right after that took place. The female POW was Shoshana Johnson according to this list. Either way, this is excellent news! I hope the rest will follow shortly!

Chief Warrant Officer 2, David S. Williams, 30, of Orlando, FL;

Chief Warrant Officer 2, Ronald D. Young, Jr., 26, of Lithia Spring, GA

Army Spc. Joseph Hudson, 23, of Alamogordo, N.M.;

Army Pfc. Patrick Miller, 23, of Park City, Kan.;

Army Spc. Shoshana Johnson, 30, of Fort Bliss, Texas;

Edgar Hernandez, 21, supply truck driver, of Mission, Texas, rank unknown;

Army Sgt. James Riley, 31, of Pennsauken, N.J.

04-01-2003, 07:28 PM
Here's the rest of the article:

Decisions on the government's composition appear to be entirely in US hands, particularly those of Paul Wolfowitz, the deputy secretary of defence. This has annoyed Gen Garner, who is officially in charge but who, according to sources close to the planning of the government, has had to accept the inclusion of a number of controversial Iraqis in advisory roles.

The most controversial of Mr Wolfowitz's proposed appointees is Ahmed Chalabi, the head of the opposition Iraqi National Congress, together with his close associates, including his nephew.

During his years in exile, Mr Chalabi has cultivated links with Congress to raise funds, and has become the Pentagon's darling among the Iraqi opposition. The defence secretary, Donald Rumsfeld, is one of his strongest supporters.

The state department and CIA, on the other hand, regard him with deep suspicion ...

Last week Colin Powell, the US secretary of state, told Congress that immediately after the fall of President Saddam's regime, the US military would take control of the Iraqi government.

His only concession was that this would be done with the "full understanding" of the international community and with "the UN presence in the form of a UN special coordinator".

By imposing Mr Chalabi and his clique on the official administration-in-waiting, Mr Wolfowitz seems to be trying to appease the INC leader, even at the risk of annoying Gen Garner and those in Washington who consider him unsuitable for a senior post.

04-01-2003, 07:32 PM
Michelle Malkin

Where Helen Thomasís heart lies

Shame, shame, shame on Helen Thomas.

The crusty ex-journalist-turned-White House heckler had only one thing on her mind when her favorite news stations, al Jazeera and Iraqi state TV, repeatedly broadcast those chilling pictures of scared American POWs and gleeful Iraqi soldiers hovering over dead American soldiers last weekend.

Thomas did not ask if the five Americans in captivity had been tortured or raped.

Thomas did not wonder whether the dead American soldiers had been wantonly executed in public by Saddam's thugs, who ambushed our men and women (yes, Helen, I said "our") in the city of Nasiriyah.

Thomas did not show the least bit of curiosity about the whereabouts of eight missing American soldiers caught in the attack.

And Thomas did not inquire about the well-being of any of the anguished families of these captured, missing, and murdered American soldiers.

No, the question on Hellfire Helen Thomas's mind was:

What about the poor detainees at Guantanamo Bay?

At a March 24 White House briefing, Thomas smugly broached the topic of the America POWs with White House press secretary Ari Fleisher in order to harp on her favorite subject (i.e., blaming America):

Thomas: In terms of the pictures, the administration is upset because it is a violation of the Geneva Accords, you say, and I guess it is.

Fleischer: That's correct.

Thomas: Are we following the Geneva Accords in Iraq and Guantanamo?

Fleischer: .[W]e have always treated people humanely, consistent with international agreements. In the case of the battle, the fight in Iraq, there's no question that is being done in accordance with the Geneva Conventions.

Thomas: But how about the detainees in Guantanamo? They have no rights under the Geneva Accords.

Fleischer: As I just indicated, we always treat them humanely.

I admire Fleischer's super-human restraint in the face of this disgusting display of moral equivalence masquerading as journalism. Thomas sees pictures of dead American soldiers being molested by cackling Iraqi assassins, she sees video of dazed and wounded young American soldiers in captivity, and all she can do is harangue the Bush administration for not giving Guantanamo Bay terror detainees enough "rights?"

Let there be no doubt about where Helen Thomas's heart lies.

Since nothing the White House could say would convince her that the Guantanamo detainees are being treating humanely, maybe the testimony of freed detainees themselves will. It won't make a difference to hardened America-haters, of course, but let the truth be known:

Last weekend, 18 Afghans were released from detention in Cuba after 16 months of questioning in U.S. custody. They flew home and were held briefly in a Kabul jail. The Boston Globe reports that "nearly all of the former detainees enthusiastically praised the conditions at Guantanamo and expressed little bitterness about losing a year of their lives in captivity, saying they were treated better there than in three days in squalid cells in Kabul. None complained of torture during questioning or coerced confessions."

Sirajuddin, 24, a Kandahar taxi driver, said: ''The conditions were even better than our homes. We were given three meals a day -- eggs in the morning and meat twice a day; facilities to wash, and if we didn't wash, they'd wash us; and there was even entertainment with video games.''
"There is no need to lie," Sayed Abasin, 21, told the Chicago Tribune. "I'm telling you the facts. They treated us very well." His record from Cuba shows he was seen 37 times by the Gitmo medical staff, for everything from knee pain to sinusitis.

The freed detainees said they were allowed to pray five times daily, exercise, and were given books written in Pashtu. Upon their release, as parting gifts, the Afghan men received new shirts, jeans, tennis shoes, and gym bags (to carry their Korans).

Now, human-rights crusaders, let's head back to Iraq.

The American POWs have already been subjected to intense public humiliation. They will be lucky if all they suffer is sinusitis. Military and intelligence officials report that some of the U.S. soldiers who raised their hands in surrender at Nasiriyah received only one parting gift: a bullet hole through the head.

Were our fellow Americans allowed to say their final prayers before their execution?

Helen? Helen?

04-01-2003, 07:37 PM
Why would you post this in this thread? Can you please stop changing the topic when you're stuck against a wall.

She has every right to ask the question and you can paint it any way you want to, but it's worth asking and it's worth knowing the answer. Too bad it pisses off the government.

Helen Thomas is a highly respected journalist who does not have some of the big corporate ties that the other journos do. She does her job and it pisses presidents off. She's an institution!! She's in her eighties and has worked in the White House for decades. She's not some hippy nut job.

04-01-2003, 07:40 PM
Richard it is probably a touch of Alzheimers. That lady has been reporting since Noah loaded up the Ark. She obviously forgets all of the history of "her" country. Time to retire Helen.

04-01-2003, 07:43 PM
I might also add that Michelle Malkin is hardly an objective source. She's a conservative writer who writes her opinions, and not facts. This is hardly journalism in the traditional sense.

04-01-2003, 07:44 PM
"Richard it is probably a touch of Alzheimers. That lady has been reporting since Noah loaded up the Ark. She obviously forgets all of the history of "her" country. Time to retire Helen."

Oh, okay. So since you disagree with her she's senile. Nice. I guess all the infirmed and unpatriotic can either be euthanised or sent to France.

You people need to get some real arguments. Debates are not about name calling.:rolleyes:

04-01-2003, 07:44 PM
You know that the contention of the protesters of Gitmo is that these guys have had no trial. I know of people in the U.S. who have been incarcerated longer than these people have without a trial, but no one races to their aid.

As for Helen, she's an old bag who has nothing better to do than to badger every administration. I remember her doing it to the Clinton administration also.

04-01-2003, 07:46 PM
Bravo, Richard!!!

04-01-2003, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by tatsxxx11
Bravo, Richard!!!

let's see,

free and dom were in the topic title.....

and since were are gonna take over iraq when we are done..

i thought maybe a feel good story in the midst of all of this
haranging on how we are gonna capture and 'enslave' all the iraqi's........

we could use these guys as political pawns to lull the populace into believing we are nice guys......

hello, hello, who are you??

(actually, AZ is not a laughing matter, it broke my heart to see my
dad so incapacitated by that disease, pretty insidious....but hey this thread is not about me and my probs....let's help the world)

and did you know that if a man stands w/his back against the wall he cannot bend over and touch the floor.......but a woman can!!!!!

check it out..

04-01-2003, 11:10 PM
   Soledad's initial post is the topic of this thread. Please try to stay on topic or start a thread of your own.


[Babylon 5: Pet Talk is the Babylon 1 of the pet world. May we never go to Zahadum.]

04-02-2003, 05:48 AM
Originally posted by RICHARD

(actually, AZ is not a laughing matter, it broke my heart to see my
dad so incapacitated by that disease, pretty insidious....

I'm sorry Richard. My condolences to you. :(

Paul - I hear you. We'll try to do better. :)

04-02-2003, 11:12 AM
Originally posted by Pam
I'm sorry Richard. My condolences to you. :(

:) thanks, he's in a better place now!