Politics and religion.

[Lady's Human]

:eek::eek::eek:You think Blago was trying to sell the occupant as well?:eek::eek::eek:

:p....

If Blago was convicted of selling the seat, that would imply the person holding the seat purchased it. It takes two to tango.

[Puckstop31]

Well.... It is going to be fun this summer watching everybody connected to Blago try to wiggle out of this.

I see a "made for TV" movie about him... On Oxygen. :P

[lizbud]

:p....

If Blago was convicted of selling the seat, that would imply the person holding the seat purchased it. It takes two to tango.


Wasn't he charged with "Attempting" to sell the seat? He got no takers
that we know of or that has been proven.

[Edwina's Secretary]

:p....

If Blago was convicted of selling the seat, that would imply the person holding the seat purchased it. It takes two to tango.

Indeed it would. If that had been what he was convicted of. But as you stated above (and Liz reiterates) "trying to sell the seat" is not the same as "selling the seat."

[lizbud]

I ran across this very interesting article in Rolling Stone about Michele
Bachmann. She sounds like a potent & also scary contender for POTUS.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/michele-bachmanns-holy-war-20110622

[lizbud]

Oh, this made my day to read this.:):) I seriously dislike this obnoxious
fool. Not one other Justice supported his failed logic & obvious bias in this case.

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/national/general/view.bg?articleid=1348889&srvc=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+bostonherald%2Fnews+(News+%26 +Opinion+-+BostonHerald.com)

[wombat2u2004]

Food for thought ??

In 1887 Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh, had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years prior:

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a
permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse over loose fiscal
policy, (which is) always followed by a dictatorship."

"The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:

>From bondage to spiritual faith;
From spiritual faith to great courage;
From courage to liberty;
From liberty to abundance;
From abundance to complacency;
From complacency to apathy;
From apathy to dependence;
From dependence back into bondage."

[Bonny]

Food for thought ??

In 1887 Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh, had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years prior:

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a
permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse over loose fiscal
policy, (which is) always followed by a dictatorship."

"The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:

>From bondage to spiritual faith;
From spiritual faith to great courage;
From courage to liberty;
From liberty to abundance;
From abundance to complacency;
From complacency to apathy;
From apathy to dependence;
From dependence back into bondage."

Was that the Romans by chance?????????????? They got lazy & fell from within. :(

[Edwina's Secretary]

Was that the Romans by chance?????????????? They got lazy & fell from within. :(

Athens is in Greece and a two second Google search would have shown the OP that the quote is gobbly-gook. Check here. (http://www.snopes.com/politics/ballot/athenian.asp)

[blue]

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage."

[wombat2u2004]

Was that the Romans by chance?????????????? They got lazy & fell from within. :(

No mate, it was Athens in Greece. They had their Golden Age the same as most other civilisations, but it eventually collapsed from within. The Romans lasted longer, but they eventually fell to.
But yes, the reasons for that are quite accurately written in my previous post. ;)

[wombat2u2004]

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage."

In a nutshell mate ;)
History has shown us this.

[blue]

In a nutshell mate ;)
History has shown us this.

Im sure a certain Know It All will have a Google search and a Snopes link to prove us wrong mate.

[Edwina's Secretary]

The good news is the United States is not a democracy (it is a republic for those who don't remember their Pledge of Allegiance) so we need not worry about the hoax quoted above.

There now maties...feel better?

Jewish rabbis stoning dogs, descriptions of the demise of democracies after 200 years....make believe garbage...what's next? Quotes from Nostradamus...:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Can't we do a little fact checking maties??

[blue]

Thanks for not letting us down ES.
Hey Wom.

Did either of us claim the USA was a Democracy? I just checked our previous posts and saw no mention of the USA being a democracy in any of them.

On the other hand the current POTUS does think we live in a democracy and that may give some credibility to our quotes above.

Have a good one mate.

[RICHARD]

I am not apathetic, I just don't care.

[Edwina's Secretary]

I am not apathetic, I just don't care.

For the first time in a long while, RICHARD, you and I are in complete agreement.

Utter rubbish.

[wombat2u2004]

Thanks for not letting us down ES.
Hey Wom.

Did either of us claim the USA was a Democracy? I just checked our previous posts and saw no mention of the USA being a democracy in any of them.

On the other hand the current POTUS does think we live in a democracy and that may give some credibility to our quotes above.

Have a good one mate.

Well blue old mate. Here's some facts.
The only country mentioned in my post was Greece. There was no mention at all about the USA or any other country for that matter. Perhaps our "Fly On The Wall" believes I am having a shot at the tiny little world she exists in.

Secondly, the post made no mention of republics, it was purely and simply a quote written about a democracy. Altho, if our fly on the wall knew anything else other than where Paul Revere bought his horse, then perhaps she would understand the truth in that post regarding rise and fall of nations.

Thirdly, no one knows WHO wrote that quote. Just because someone at Snopes says it wasn't Tytler means nothing to me. That's HIS opinion. My opinion is that Tytler did write it, and Tytler was VERY accurate. It's not the quote that was questioned by Snopes, it was who wrote the quote.

So if our fly on the wall believes Snopes, then so be it. But we will allow her to tell us WHO wrote the quote.... I mean....she knows everything...right ??? ;)

[blue]

She never lets us down.:cool:
And a certain know it all even took RICHARDs funnay posting out of context in usual poor form.

[wombat2u2004]

She never lets us down.:cool:
And a certain know it all even took RICHARDs funnay posting out of context in usual poor form.

Hee hee.....do you think it could be something simple tho ?? Like.....ummmm...bad education ??? :D:D
AND....did you notice blue......NO ROLLY EYES !!!! Truly amazing.

[Edwina's Secretary]

I am shocked...absolutely SHOCKED..a news organization belonging to Rupert Murdoch engaged in deplorable, disgusting behavior?!?!?!?

Murdoch (http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/news-world-phone-hacking-scotland-yard-investigates-links/story?id=14007604)

Now we know what he values in his news organizations...if it might cost him money - shut it down...if it only hurts or destroys people - keep it going...we all must have our priorities after all!

[blue]

if it only hurts or destroys people - keep it going...we all must have our priorities after all!

Like CNN, MSNBC, ABC, and the rest of the MSM outlets? Im sure you mean just like them.

There really isnt much of a difference anymore.

[wombat2u2004]

Bummer. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[blue]

Bummer. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Im actually shocked that she is shocked. I thought she was so much more informed, her post makes her seem like she has been living in a cave with a caveman and a cavecat.

[wombat2u2004]

Im actually shocked that she is shocked. I thought she was so much more informed, her post makes her seem like she has been living in a cave with a caveman and a cavecat.

Yeah.....we must welcome her to the world beyond her street. :p
Actually, I did read the article, and even tho I never got to the shocked stage, I did reach the flabbergasted stage. As for a reaction to the OP's shockedness....well no....I never felt a thing. :p
Did you know that Rupert is an Aussie ??? Perhaps that's why the OP was so shocked. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[blue]

Did you know that Rupert is an Aussie ??? Perhaps that's why the OP was so shocked. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Unlike our shocked friend I dont have a problem admitting that there is something I didnt know, and I didnt know Rupert was a Kangaroo humpe- Kangaroo wrangle- an Aussie who appreciates the love of Kangaroos.

[wombat2u2004]

Unlike our shocked friend I dont have a problem admitting that there is something I didnt know, and I didnt know Rupert was a Kangaroo humpe- Kangaroo wrangle- an Aussie who appreciates the love of Kangaroos.

Yup. No margarita's or egg rolls where Rupert comes from.
He's just an Aussie boy ;)

[lizbud]

I am shocked...absolutely SHOCKED..a news organization belonging to Rupert Murdoch engaged in deplorable, disgusting behavior?!?!?!?

Murdoch (http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/news-world-phone-hacking-scotland-yard-investigates-links/story?id=14007604)

Now we know what he values in his news organizations...if it might cost him money - shut it down...if it only hurts or destroys people - keep it going...we all must have our priorities after all!


When all of the advertisers pulled their ads, then & only then did he
get it. I hope he loses tons more money from all the lawsuits to come
from this.

[Karen]

Like CNN, MSNBC, ABC, and the rest of the MSM outlets? Im sure you mean just like them.

There really isnt much of a difference anymore.

Um, did you follow the story at all? Folks at the paper he is shutting down went far beyond the tactics of most of the normal muckraking media outlets. They not only hacked into people's phones, repeatedly, regardless of the consequences, they even did so in the case of a missing child, and deleted messages on her cell phone, making her poor parents - and the investigators - believe she was alive somewhere and accessing her phone, when instead she has been murdered already.

[cassiesmom]

Question. The NEA just met here in Chicago and announced that they're endorsing Obama for President in 2012. There are Republicans who are still entering the race, but the NEA has already endorsed Obama versus an unknown opponent. Are they saying that they believe Obama would be better than any possible Republican candidate? What if the Republicans identify someone who can out-Obama Obama? On the other hand it seems like labor unions go toward Democratic candidates in general. I'm not happy with everything Obama has done, but he's got problems everywhere he looks. The economy? Problems. Gang violence and drugs? Big problems. Iraq and Afghanistan and terrorism? Even bigger problems. Joblessness? Problems. Health care? Long-term problems as Medicare runs out of money and Boomers and Gen X'ers like me get older. But he's only a little more than halfway through his first term and big change takes time. I would not want to be President even for a minute, no way, no how.

[blue]

Um, did you follow the story at all? Folks at the paper he is shutting down went far beyond the tactics of most of the normal muckraking media outlets. They not only hacked into people's phones, repeatedly, regardless of the consequences, they even did so in the case of a missing child, and deleted messages on her cell phone, making her poor parents - and the investigators - believe she was alive somewhere and accessing her phone, when instead she has been murdered already.

Did we read the same story? Now stop bringing logic into this thread please.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Excuse me for being dumb, but can someone explain to me just what in the world the debt ceiling is? I'd never heard of it until this year.

How does raising it help us? Is it the amount we can borrow or the amount other countries will loan us or what? :confused:

[lizbud]

Excuse me for being dumb, but can someone explain to me just what in the world the debt ceiling is? I'd never heard of it until this year.

How does raising it help us? Is it the amount we can borrow or the amount other countries will loan us or what? :confused:



You are not dumb. I don't think many people outside of Washington DC know
or understand what the debt ceiling is (including me). :)

This explains it a bit.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/politics/jan-june11/debtceiling_05-16.html

It's the amount of money that the Government is allowed to borrow this
year or any year. The debt limit is set by Congress & can be raised by them.

[wombat2u2004]

Thanksgiving 2022

"Winston, come into the dining room, it's time to eat," Julia yelled to her husband. "In a minute, honey, it's a tie score," he answered. Actually Winston wasn't very interested in the traditional holiday football game between Detroit and Washington.

Ever since the government passed the Civility in Sports Statute of 2017, outlawing tackle football for its "unseemly violence" and the "bad example it sets for the rest of the world," Winston was far less of a football fan than he used to be. Two-hand touch wasn't nearly as exciting.

Yet it wasn't the game that Winston was uninterested in. It was more the thought of eating another Tofu Turkey. Even though it was the best type of Veggie Meat available after the government revised the American Anti-Obesity Act of 2018, adding fowl to the list of federally-forbidden foods, (which already included potatoes, cranberry sauce and mince-meat pie), it wasn't anything like real turkey. And ever since the government officially changed the name of "Thanksgiving Day" to "A National Day of Atonement" in 2020 to officially acknowledge the Pilgrims' historically brutal treatment of Native Americans, the holiday had lost a lot of its luster.

Eating in the dining room was also a bit daunting. The unearthly gleam of government-mandated fluorescent light bulbs made the Tofu Turkey look even weirder than it actually was, and the room was always cold. Ever since Congress passed the Power Conservation Act of 2016, mandating all thermostats-which were monitored and controlled by the electric company-be kept at 68 degrees, every room on the north side of the house was barely tolerable throughout the entire winter.

Still, it was good getting together with family; or at least most of the family. Winston missed his mother, who passed on in October, when she had used up her legal allotment of live-saving medical treatment. He had had many heated conversations with the Regional Health Consortium, spawned when the private insurance market finally went bankrupt, and everyone was forced into the government health care program. And though he demanded she be kept on her treatment, it was a futile effort. "The RHC's resources are limited," explained the government bureaucrat Winston spoke with on the phone. "Your mother received all the benefits to which she was entitled.
I'm sorry for your loss."

Ed couldn't make it either. He had forgotten to plug in his electric car last night, the only kind available after the Anti-Fossil Fuel Bill of 2021 outlawed the use of the combustion engines-for everyone but government officials. The fifty mile round trip was about ten miles too far, and Ed didn't want to spend a frosty night on the road somewhere between here and there.

Thankfully, Winston's brother, John, and his wife were flying in. Winston made sure that the dining room chairs had extra cushions for the occasion.
No one complained more than John about the pain of sitting down so soon after the government-mandated cavity searches at airports, which severely aggravated his hemorrhoids. Ever since a terrorist successfully smuggled a cavity bomb onto a jetliner, the TSA told Americans the added "inconvenience" was an "absolute necessity" in order to stay "one step ahead of the terrorists." Winston's own body had grown accustomed to such probing ever since the government expanded their scope to just about anywhere a crowd gathered, via Anti-Profiling Act of 2022. That law made it a crime to single out any group or individual for "unequal scrutiny," even when probable cause was involved. Thus, cavity searches at malls, train stations, bus depots, etc., etc., had become almost routine. Almost.

The Supreme Court is reviewing the statute, but most Americans expect a Court composed of six progressives and three conservatives to leave the law intact. "A living Constitution is extremely flexible," said the Court's eldest member, Elena Kagan. " Europe has had laws like this one for years."
We should learn from their example," she added.

Winston's thoughts turned to his own children. He got along fairly well with his 12-year-old daughter, Brittany, mostly because she ignored him. Winston had long ago surrendered to the idea that she could text anyone at any time, even during Atonement Dinner. Their only real confrontation had occurred when he limited her to 50,000 texts a month, explaining that was all he could afford. She whined for a week, but got over it.

His 16-year-old son, Jason, was another matter altogether. Perhaps it was the constant bombarding he got in public school that global warming, the bird flu, terrorism or any of a number of other calamities were "just around the corner," but Jason had developed a kind of nihilistic attitude that ranged between simmering surliness and outright hostility. It didn't help that Jason had reported his father to the police for smoking a cigarette in the house, an act made criminal by the Smoking Control Statute of 2018, which outlawed smoking anywhere within 500 feet of another human being.

Winston paid the $5,000 fine, which might have been considered excessive before the American dollar became virtually worthless as a result of QE13. The latest round of quantitative easing the federal government initiated was, once again, to "spur economic growth." This time they promised to push unemployment below its years-long rate of 18%, but Winston was not particularly hopeful.

Yet the family had a lot for which to be thankful, Winston thought, before remembering it was a Day of Atonement. At least he had his memories. He felt a twinge of sadness when he realized his children would never know what life was like in the Good Old Days, long before government promises to make life "fair for everyone" realized their full potential. Winston, like so many of his fellow Americans, never realized how much things could change when they didn't happen all at once, but little by little, so people could get used to them.

He wondered what might have happened if the public had stood up while there was still time, maybe back around 2011, when all the real nonsense began.
"Maybe we wouldn't be where we are today if we'd just said 'enough is enough' when we had the chance," he thought.

Maybe so, Winston. Maybe so.

[Bonny]

Thanksgiving 2022

"Winston, come into the dining room, it's time to eat," Julia yelled to her husband. "In a minute, honey, it's a tie score," he answered. Actually Winston wasn't very interested in the traditional holiday football game between Detroit and Washington.

Ever since the government passed the Civility in Sports Statute of 2017, outlawing tackle football for its "unseemly violence" and the "bad example it sets for the rest of the world," Winston was far less of a football fan than he used to be. Two-hand touch wasn't nearly as exciting.

Yet it wasn't the game that Winston was uninterested in. It was more the thought of eating another Tofu Turkey. Even though it was the best type of Veggie Meat available after the government revised the American Anti-Obesity Act of 2018, adding fowl to the list of federally-forbidden foods, (which already included potatoes, cranberry sauce and mince-meat pie), it wasn't anything like real turkey. And ever since the government officially changed the name of "Thanksgiving Day" to "A National Day of Atonement" in 2020 to officially acknowledge the Pilgrims' historically brutal treatment of Native Americans, the holiday had lost a lot of its luster.

Eating in the dining room was also a bit daunting. The unearthly gleam of government-mandated fluorescent light bulbs made the Tofu Turkey look even weirder than it actually was, and the room was always cold. Ever since Congress passed the Power Conservation Act of 2016, mandating all thermostats-which were monitored and controlled by the electric company-be kept at 68 degrees, every room on the north side of the house was barely tolerable throughout the entire winter.

Still, it was good getting together with family; or at least most of the family. Winston missed his mother, who passed on in October, when she had used up her legal allotment of live-saving medical treatment. He had had many heated conversations with the Regional Health Consortium, spawned when the private insurance market finally went bankrupt, and everyone was forced into the government health care program. And though he demanded she be kept on her treatment, it was a futile effort. "The RHC's resources are limited," explained the government bureaucrat Winston spoke with on the phone. "Your mother received all the benefits to which she was entitled.
I'm sorry for your loss."

Ed couldn't make it either. He had forgotten to plug in his electric car last night, the only kind available after the Anti-Fossil Fuel Bill of 2021 outlawed the use of the combustion engines-for everyone but government officials. The fifty mile round trip was about ten miles too far, and Ed didn't want to spend a frosty night on the road somewhere between here and there.

Thankfully, Winston's brother, John, and his wife were flying in. Winston made sure that the dining room chairs had extra cushions for the occasion.
No one complained more than John about the pain of sitting down so soon after the government-mandated cavity searches at airports, which severely aggravated his hemorrhoids. Ever since a terrorist successfully smuggled a cavity bomb onto a jetliner, the TSA told Americans the added "inconvenience" was an "absolute necessity" in order to stay "one step ahead of the terrorists." Winston's own body had grown accustomed to such probing ever since the government expanded their scope to just about anywhere a crowd gathered, via Anti-Profiling Act of 2022. That law made it a crime to single out any group or individual for "unequal scrutiny," even when probable cause was involved. Thus, cavity searches at malls, train stations, bus depots, etc., etc., had become almost routine. Almost.

The Supreme Court is reviewing the statute, but most Americans expect a Court composed of six progressives and three conservatives to leave the law intact. "A living Constitution is extremely flexible," said the Court's eldest member, Elena Kagan. " Europe has had laws like this one for years."
We should learn from their example," she added.

Winston's thoughts turned to his own children. He got along fairly well with his 12-year-old daughter, Brittany, mostly because she ignored him. Winston had long ago surrendered to the idea that she could text anyone at any time, even during Atonement Dinner. Their only real confrontation had occurred when he limited her to 50,000 texts a month, explaining that was all he could afford. She whined for a week, but got over it.

His 16-year-old son, Jason, was another matter altogether. Perhaps it was the constant bombarding he got in public school that global warming, the bird flu, terrorism or any of a number of other calamities were "just around the corner," but Jason had developed a kind of nihilistic attitude that ranged between simmering surliness and outright hostility. It didn't help that Jason had reported his father to the police for smoking a cigarette in the house, an act made criminal by the Smoking Control Statute of 2018, which outlawed smoking anywhere within 500 feet of another human being.

Winston paid the $5,000 fine, which might have been considered excessive before the American dollar became virtually worthless as a result of QE13. The latest round of quantitative easing the federal government initiated was, once again, to "spur economic growth." This time they promised to push unemployment below its years-long rate of 18%, but Winston was not particularly hopeful.

Yet the family had a lot for which to be thankful, Winston thought, before remembering it was a Day of Atonement. At least he had his memories. He felt a twinge of sadness when he realized his children would never know what life was like in the Good Old Days, long before government promises to make life "fair for everyone" realized their full potential. Winston, like so many of his fellow Americans, never realized how much things could change when they didn't happen all at once, but little by little, so people could get used to them.

He wondered what might have happened if the public had stood up while there was still time, maybe back around 2011, when all the real nonsense began.
"Maybe we wouldn't be where we are today if we'd just said 'enough is enough' when we had the chance," he thought.

Maybe so, Winston. Maybe so.

And All The Freedoms Were Slowly Snuffed Out. :(

[wombat2u2004]

And All The Freedoms Were Slowly Snuffed Out. :(

Don't be sad Bonny.
Look at it this way.....you'll still be able to eat your turkey, with a spoon.
No need for a knife and fork....that effectively halves the amount of cutlery you will need to wash after the dinner.....you'll have that going for ya ;)

[Bonny]

Around 2003 or 2004 my daughter in law graduated from St. Ambrose. There was a Polish man by the name of Lech Walesa that spoke to the graduates & crowd in general. He told all of us to hold onto our freedoms don't left them be taken away from us. So easily said but so hard to hold on to in reality.

[wombat2u2004]

Around 2003 or 2004 my daughter in law graduated from St. Ambrose. There was a Polish man by the name of Lech Walesa that spoke to the graduates & crowd in general. He told all of us to hold onto our freedoms don't left them be taken away from us. So easily said but so hard to hold on to in reality.

Lech Walesa is a very clever man, I've read some of his work on anti-socialism.
Too bad Lech isn't running your country. ;)

[Edwina's Secretary]

What an interesting fact! Union membership in the US - in private industry is about 6.9% and 36% in the public sector continuing a downward trend.

In Australia private sector union memberhsip is 14% and growing! Public sector - that is government employees - 46%. Wow.

Those maties are a far way down the road to socialism! Look sharp maties or you'll be swallowed up in carbon taxes and union members...:D:D

[blue]

What an interesting fact! Union membership in the US - in private industry is about 6.9% and 36% in the public sector continuing a downward trend.

In Australia private sector union memberhsip is 14% and growing! Public sector - that is government employees - 46%. Wow.

Those maties are a far way down the road to socialism! Look sharp maties or you'll be swallowed up in carbon taxes and union members...:D:D

That is interesting, any chance of a source link?

I have viewed Ausie society going the way of the Socialist for many many years.

[wombat2u2004]

That is interesting, any chance of a source link?

I have viewed Ausie society going the way of the Socialist for many many years.

Ho hum.....looks like we've been hit with FACTS again by THE ONE WHO KNOWS ALL. :D
You won't get source facts from that spoilt arrogant yankee.
blue....she ain't got a source....hee hee.

Now for some real facts.
Australia has one of the best health systems in the world. We probably have one of the lowest unemployment figures in the world. Unionism rears it's ugly head every time a Labor party gets voted in, but they won't last long, and the unions will fall back on their butts where they belong.
Australia doesn't have a shot economy, almost falling into third world status like some. The Australian dollar is way stronger than the US dollar. And, believe it or not, we here have more freedom of speech than you all in US do.

Good God, who is she calling "Maties".....I could'nt imagine any Australian in their right mind who would even consider "mateship" with that one....I think that term would be well beyond her. ;)

[Edwina's Secretary]

That is interesting, any chance of a source link?

I have viewed Ausie society going the way of the Socialist for many many years.

Sure blue...the numbers are from 2010 but, before the nay-sayers attack, labor statistics are not usually reported in "real time."

Australia (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/union-membership-on-rise/story-e6frg6nf-1225865737717)

DOL - US (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.nr0.htm)

Facts are facts...

[cassiesmom]

What an interesting fact! Union membership in the US - in private industry is about 6.9% and 36% in the public sector continuing a downward trend.




Why such a disparity between the public sector and private industry, I wonder?

[Edwina's Secretary]

Why such a disparity between the public sector and private industry, I wonder?

There are a couple reasons for the difference. Unions are attractive to employees who do not feel any control over their worklife - employees who work for large, impersonal employers where the decisions makers are far away from them. That rather defines most public sector jobs - postal service, firefighters, police, teachers, etc. Hospital are becoming fertile ground for union organizers - large organizations - decision makers far away.

Smaller employers are more able to know what is going on in the organization and put out fires. Smaller organization can simply respond faster to problems.

Wages are rarely the reason most union campaigns get started. And most campaigns begin when employees contact the union rather than the other way around. When I was working in labor relations I was involved in a few campaigns - and every time it was the same thing - favoritism - the boss.

For example, in San Diego County the average number of employee is 12. Most people in the US public sector work for small/medium sized employers where the perceived need for a union is less.

[phesina]

Now for some real facts.
Australia has one of the best health systems in the world.

Wom, how does the Australian health system work? I'd really like to know more about that. Thank you.
Pat

[Bonny]

There are a couple reasons for the difference. Unions are attractive to employees who do not feel any control over their worklife - employees who work for large, impersonal employers where the decisions makers are far away from them. That rather defines most public sector jobs - postal service, firefighters, police, teachers, etc. Hospital are becoming fertile ground for union organizers - large organizations - decision makers far away.

Smaller employers are more able to know what is going on in the organization and put out fires. Smaller organization can simply respond faster to problems.

Wages are rarely the reason most union campaigns get started. And most campaigns begin when employees contact the union rather than the other way around. When I was working in labor relations I was involved in a few campaigns - and every time it was the same thing - favoritism - the boss.

For example, in San Diego County the average number of employee is 12. Most people in the US public sector work for small/medium sized employers where the perceived need for a union is less.

You mention favoritism - the boss. What do you mean by that? Like ignoring someones seniority in the company, breaking company rules, as an example. The boss would be non-union working for the company as the employee would be union working for the company type of thing? Do the bosses get reprimanded by the company like firing or transferred someplace else? I know of a company three faults by the employee even if they are protected by the union & out the door they go.

[Edwina's Secretary]

You mention favoritism - the boss. What do you mean by that? Like ignoring someones seniority in the company, breaking company rules, as an example. The boss would be non-union working for the company as the employee would be union working for the company type of thing? Do the bosses get reprimanded by the company like firing or transferred someplace else? I know of a company three faults by the employee even if they are protected by the union & out the door they go.

The most common complaint leading employees to try and bring a union into the workplace is favoritism by the boss. Not being treated "fairly" by the boss. Some people always getting the dirty jobs - that sort of thing. This is before a union is elected so there is no non-union boss - union employees - yet. Yes, I have seen managers and supervisors who are disciplined - including termination - for not doing their job well. In the campaigns I have been involved in - the first thing is to make sure the supv/mgr understands his/her role. Often having a meeting with the supv/mgr present to ask employees what are the complaints and expecting the the supv/mgr to accept responsibility and talk through the issues.

Interesting to note, the National Labor Relations Board has ruled that you cannot fire the supv/mgr until after the vote. Or at least made it very dangerous to do so.

[wombat2u2004]

Hey ES, I'll be the one manning the soup kitchen soon, along with some coloured people I know.
You'd better stop being so crabby, or I won't give you a bread crust to have with your bowl of cabbage soup....heee heee

[wombat2u2004]

Ahhhhhhhhh....it's so nice to live in the lucky country. :D

[wombat2u2004]

Ohhhh.....look what I found..........

There seems to be a lot of debate around the water cooler and the dinner table as to which President is most responsible for the increase in the National Debt.
(Note: This debate also includes future paupers like ES)

In this article, I’d like to take a look at the growth in the National Debt by President using an unbiased approach. This analysis uses National Debt figures from the U.S. Treasury Department and the White House Office of Management and Budget.

To be sure, there is plenty of blame to go around for the uncontrolled growth in the National Debt. For this analysis, I’ve begun with Ronald Reagan’s first term and followed it through the first year of Barack Obama’s administration. No effort has been made to cast any particular President in a favorable or unfavorable light.

The numbers below do NOT reflect the actual National Debt. Instead, they reflect the amount of the INCREASE in the National Debt during each presidential term.

> Ronald Reagan’s First Term – $656 billion increase

> Ronald Reagan’s Second Term – $1.036 trillion increase

> George H.W. Bush’s Term – $1.587 trillion increase

> Bill Clinton’s First Term – $1.122 trillion increase

> Bill Clinton’s Second Term – $418 billion increase

> George W. Bush’s First Term – $1.885 trillion increase

> George W. Bush’s Second Term – $3.014 trillion increase

> Barack Obama’s First “Year” – $1.573 trillion increase

To summarize, the National Debt increased by huge amounts under each of these presidents. The largest increase for a complete term occured during George W. Bush’s second term. The largest increse during a single year occurred during Barack Obama’s first year.

Current Obama administration projections indicate that the National Debt will increase by approximately $6.5 trillion during President Obama’s first term. If that happens, then he will obviously overtake President Bush’s record increase in the National Debt.

It is clear that the National Debt has been growing uncontrollably in recent years, regardless of which political party has been in power. To reverse this trend, we need to hold our elected officials accountable and demand that they balance the budget and reduce the National Debt.

Wow ES.....yer really are living beyond your means.....eh ??? :D:D:D:D:D

[wombat2u2004]

Wom, how does the Australian health system work? I'd really like to know more about that. Thank you.
Pat

Here ya go............

In 1984 a comprehensive health care system, Medicare, was introduced. Medicare facilitates access by all eligible Australian residents to free or low-cost medical, optometric and public hospital care, while leaving them free to choose private health services.

Individuals’ financial contributions to the public health care system are based on their income and are made through a taxation levy known as the Medicare levy.

Australia’s public hospital system is jointly funded by the Australian Government and state and territory governments and is administered by state and territory health departments.

People admitted to public hospitals as public (Medicare) patients receive treatment by doctors and specialists nominated by the hospital. They are not charged for care and treatment or after-care by the treating doctor.

Private patients in public or private hospitals can choose the doctor who treats them. Medicare pays 75 per cent of the Medicare schedule fee for services and procedures provided by the treating doctor. For patients who have private health insurance, some or all of the outstanding balance may be covered. Private patients are charged for hospital accommodation and items such as theatre fees and medicine. These costs may also be covered by private health insurance but are not covered by Medicare.

Medicare Australia is the agency within the Department of Human Services responsible for processing and paying Medicare benefits for approved services. Medicare Australia also pays pharmaceutical benefits under the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, which subsidises an agreed list of prescription drugs.

For both medical and pharmaceutical services, safety net arrangements exist to make sure patients who need a high level of treatment or medication during a financial year do not incur significant out-of-pocket expenses. Out-of-pocket costs are the difference between the Medicare benefit and what the patient is actually charged.

The Australian Government also provides medical, pharmaceutical and hospital services for veterans, war widows and their eligible dependants under legislation administered by the Department of Veterans’ Affairs.

The Australian Government provides about two-thirds (67 per cent) of public sector expenditure on health, and state, territory and local governments provide the rest.

Note: I have what they call a "Gold Card" Pat. They are issued automatically to war veterans over 70 years of age, and to those like myself who have a war caused disability. The card is given to us regardless of assets. Joe Blow living on the street, or as rich as Rupert Murdoch.....meeting the age and disability criteria automatically gets you issued one. The benefit of the Gold Card ??? Everything is free. Doctors, Specialists, Hospitals, Treatment, Medicines, Dental, Physiotherapy, Optometrical....every single thing related to our health is free.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Apparently "Undefeated" has been defeated at the box office by a documentary about turtles! The weekend gross for Ms. Palin was just over $24,000 - down over 60% from the opening weekend..."Turtle: The Incredible Journey" was over $25,000. Turtle total gross is over 3 times Undefeated.

Defeated! (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/16/sarah-palin-documentary-premiere-empty-audience_n_900693.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000009&r ef=fb&src=sp)

Could it be her 15 minutes are over?

[Karen]

Could it be her 15 minutes are over?

Not quite - you posted about her!

[blue]

Apparently "Undefeated" has been defeated at the box office by a documentary about turtles! The weekend gross for Ms. Palin was just over $24,000 - down over 60% from the opening weekend..."Turtle: The Incredible Journey" was over $25,000. Turtle total gross is over 3 times Undefeated.

Defeated! (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/16/sarah-palin-documentary-premiere-empty-audience_n_900693.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000009&r ef=fb&src=sp)

Way to misrepresent the 2 movies, not surprised by you or the Huffington Post for doing so. Turtle: The Incredible Journey was released in 2009, Link (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0970521/).


Could it be her 15 minutes are over?

Karen beat me to it. As long as the Huffington Post and its readers like yourself are rabidly reporting and reading about her, her time in the limelight will continue.

[phesina]

Here ya go............

In 1984 a comprehensive health care system, Medicare, was introduced. Medicare facilitates access by all eligible Australian residents to free or low-cost medical, optometric and public hospital care, while leaving them free to choose private health services.

Individuals’ financial contributions to the public health care system are based on their income and are made through a taxation levy known as the Medicare levy.

Australia’s public hospital system is jointly funded by the Australian Government and state and territory governments and is administered by state and territory health departments.

People admitted to public hospitals as public (Medicare) patients receive treatment by doctors and specialists nominated by the hospital. They are not charged for care and treatment or after-care by the treating doctor.

Private patients in public or private hospitals can choose the doctor who treats them. Medicare pays 75 per cent of the Medicare schedule fee for services and procedures provided by the treating doctor. For patients who have private health insurance, some or all of the outstanding balance may be covered. Private patients are charged for hospital accommodation and items such as theatre fees and medicine. These costs may also be covered by private health insurance but are not covered by Medicare.

Medicare Australia is the agency within the Department of Human Services responsible for processing and paying Medicare benefits for approved services. Medicare Australia also pays pharmaceutical benefits under the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, which subsidises an agreed list of prescription drugs.

For both medical and pharmaceutical services, safety net arrangements exist to make sure patients who need a high level of treatment or medication during a financial year do not incur significant out-of-pocket expenses. Out-of-pocket costs are the difference between the Medicare benefit and what the patient is actually charged.

The Australian Government also provides medical, pharmaceutical and hospital services for veterans, war widows and their eligible dependants under legislation administered by the Department of Veterans’ Affairs.

The Australian Government provides about two-thirds (67 per cent) of public sector expenditure on health, and state, territory and local governments provide the rest.

Note: I have what they call a "Gold Card" Pat. They are issued automatically to war veterans over 70 years of age, and to those like myself who have a war caused disability. The card is given to us regardless of assets. Joe Blow living on the street, or as rich as Rupert Murdoch.....meeting the age and disability criteria automatically gets you issued one. The benefit of the Gold Card ??? Everything is free. Doctors, Specialists, Hospitals, Treatment, Medicines, Dental, Physiotherapy, Optometrical....every single thing related to our health is free.

Thank you, Wombat. I think this sounds fantastic. Are there down sides of this system for you Australians?

So WHY are conservatives in the U.S. so outraged about the idea of even attempting to introduce such a system here? Would any of you folks of the conservative stripe please enlighten me? Thank you.

[Lady's Human]

Ummm, possibly a little issue along the lines of a $14 trillion debt problem?

We can't pay for all the government services now. Let's fix that before we spend more money we don't have.

[wombat2u2004]

Thank you, Wombat. I think this sounds fantastic. Are there down sides of this system for you Australians?

So WHY are conservatives in the U.S. so outraged about the idea of even attempting to introduce such a system here? Would any of you folks of the conservative stripe please enlighten me? Thank you.

As for down sides, well no system is perfect, so we do get the hiccup now and again, but overall it works very well for everyone, and almost everyone is happy with it. Oh, you always get the people who don't agree with the system, but some people don't agree with anything....right??

As to why this system is so contentious in the US, then I'd have to agree with LH on that. We have a very strong economy here, and the government does keep the system going by injecting funds from revenues into it. So I suppose when your economy gets back on it's feet, then there will be less against and more FOR that kind of system.
I do hope you all get it there eventually...I think good health services should be available to all regardless of their situation money wise.

[wombat2u2004]

The Balloonist

A man in a hot air balloon realized he was lost. He reduced altitude and spotted a man below.
He descended a bit more and shouted, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised a friend I would meet him half an hour ago, but I don't know where I am."

The man below replied, "You are in a hot air balloon hovering approximately 30 feet above the ground. You are between 42 and 44 degrees north latitude and between 83 and 85 degrees west longitude."

"You must be a Republican," said the balloonist.
"I am," replied the man, "but how did you know?"

"Well," answered the balloonist, "everything you told me is technically correct, but I have no idea what to make of your information, and the fact is I am still lost."

The man below responded, "You must be a Democrat."
"I am," replied the balloonist, "how did you know?"

"Well," said the man, "you don't know where you are or where you are
going. You made a promise which you have no idea how to keep, and you expect me to solve your problem. The fact is you are exactly in the same position you were in before we met, but now, somehow, it's my fault."

[phesina]

As for down sides, well no system is perfect, so we do get the hiccup now and again, but overall it works very well for everyone, and almost everyone is happy with it. Oh, you always get the people who don't agree with the system, but some people don't agree with anything....right??

As to why this system is so contentious in the US, then I'd have to agree with LH on that. We have a very strong economy here, and the government does keep the system going by injecting funds from revenues into it. So I suppose when your economy gets back on it's feet, then there will be less against and more FOR that kind of system.
I do hope you all get it there eventually...I think good health services should be available to all regardless of their situation money wise.

Okay, right, the debt problem means it is not going to happen overnight here, to say the least.

But why do so many "conservatives" believe that national health care is EVIL, period.. not good to let happen ever. "SOCIALIZED MEDICINE!" "DEATH PANELS!" "The Government will decide who lives and who dies!" (rather than the insurance companies, as happens now).

And how did you Australians, Brits, Canadians, others with national health care systems get the resources together to start your systems?

[phesina]

The Balloonist

A man in a hot air balloon realized he was lost. He reduced altitude and spotted a man below.
He descended a bit more and shouted, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised a friend I would meet him half an hour ago, but I don't know where I am."

The man below replied, "You are in a hot air balloon hovering approximately 30 feet above the ground. You are between 42 and 44 degrees north latitude and between 83 and 85 degrees west longitude."

"You must be a Republican," said the balloonist.
"I am," replied the man, "but how did you know?"

"Well," answered the balloonist, "everything you told me is technically correct, but I have no idea what to make of your information, and the fact is I am still lost."

The man below responded, "You must be a Democrat."
"I am," replied the balloonist, "how did you know?"

"Well," said the man, "you don't know where you are or where you are
going. You made a promise which you have no idea how to keep, and you expect me to solve your problem. The fact is you are exactly in the same position you were in before we met, but now, somehow, it's my fault."

Hey Wom, do most Australians follow the American political scene as closely as you do, or do you make a special study of it all? And are American political goings-on in the news a lot in Australia?

I live right next door to Canada and listen to a Canadian radio station much of the time, so I have some idea of what's going on over there.. but I don't really follow the political scene all that closely, since it doesn't affect me directly and I have no say in it. (They do cover what's happening in the U.S. much more than American stations cover what's happening in Canada, too.)

[wombat2u2004]

Okay, right, the debt problem means it is not going to happen overnight here, to say the least.

But why do so many "conservatives" believe that national health care is EVIL, period.. not good to let happen ever. "SOCIALIZED MEDICINE!" "DEATH PANELS!" "The Government will decide who lives and who dies!" (rather than the insurance companies, as happens now).

And how did you Australians, Brits, Canadians, others with national health care systems get the resources together to start your systems?

We have a Medicare levy. The rate of the Medicare levy is 1.5% of taxable income. In some cases, you may be exempt from the medicare levy or eligible for a reduction based on family income.
Low income earners who make less than a certain amount are exempt.
High income earners pay a surcharge in addition to the 1.5% of their taxable income (this is so that the wealthy can't take advantage of the public system, they have a choice, pay the surcharge or get private health insurance.)

[wombat2u2004]

Hey Wom, do most Australians follow the American political scene as closely as you do, or do you make a special study of it all? And are American political goings-on in the news a lot in Australia?

I live right next door to Canada and listen to a Canadian radio station much of the time, so I have some idea of what's going on over there.. but I don't really follow the political scene all that closely, since it doesn't affect me directly and I have no say in it. (They do cover what's happening in the U.S. much more than American stations cover what's happening in Canada, too.)

Not really Pat. I think 99.9% of Australians would probably tell you that "Congress" means a beer and shrimp BBQ. And there's never much on the media here about American politics.
I email a lot of US artillery veterans who were with me in Nam, and when they are unhappy about something, I get bombarded with all kinds of political stuff from over there. :D
Plus I had a lot of brothers and sisters in law who were Americans (connected to my first wife, who is now ancient history), and they used to talk about their politics to me when they came here or I went there.
So, what I know, which isn't a great deal, came from those sources, and also from PT to......LH is a good source for politics.

[lizbud]

Sometimes it helps to look back at how we got into the current money
problems. Might help on who we trust to better get us out of the debt woes.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/07/29/republicans-on-the-debt-ceiling-screwing-over-america.html

[Lady's Human]

For those who are unfamiliar with Mr. Begala, keep in mind that he is a long serving Democratic campaign strategist and adviser.

The article is far from the truth. It makes good partisan rhetoric, but as a factual piece it fails miserably.

Wall street deregulation (which Begala states is the cause of the crisis) started in 1999 when Pres. Clinton signed the financial modernization act, which removed the walls between securities firms, insurers, and banks. Had Pres. Clinton vetoed it, the veto likely would have stood, as Congress was too tightly contested to override a Presidential veto.

Despite the constant cries stating that the tax cuts signed into law by Pres. Bush are the cause of the current fiscal crisis, Federal tax revenue rose steadily from 2002 to 2007. Prior to 2002, the economy was in a state of flux driven by the collapse of the the tech stock bubble with the equally economically disastrous 9/11 attack. In 2008 federal revenue fell as the housing bubble burst.

To pin the current debt crisis on one party is foolish. Both are to blame, and both are to blame equally.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Anyone who has worked in a business knows you cannot be successful by just cutting costs. You must also increase revenue. Anyone who has ever been responsible for a family budget knows the same thing. And you certainly cannot increase costs and cut revenue and not expect a disaster.

Starting two wars and cutting taxes at the same time was the most idiotic decision.

Whether partisan, bi-partisan or non-partisan it doesn't change that truth.

[Lady's Human]

ES, point being, revenue ROSE after the tax cuts.

[Puckstop31]

In 2008 federal revenue fell as the housing bubble burst.

IMO, this had a greater impact. Fannie/Freddie. Follow the money. You do not even have to take any pundit's word. Just do your own digging, its easy enough to find the truth.

Demolicans.... Republicrats. Different sides of the same coin.


To pin the current debt crisis on one party is foolish. Both are to blame, and both are to blame equally.

LH for the win! (And the note about tax rates go down, revenue increases. Again, not a 'partisan' thing, facts. Easy enough to find and prove on one's own.)

Just watch the idiots we send to DC fight over this.... And people STILL want to play 'partisan'. :rolleyes: As if one 'side' is better than the other. LOL


Question of the day. Why do certain people want to INcrease tax rates on the "rich"? We realize that its an INCOME tax, right? Where are the people screaming for a Capital Gains Tax increase if they want to sock it to the rich? The evil, super rich have little, if any, 'income' that gets taxed in the traditional way. This is something important to note as we allow them to engage us in class warfare.

[Puckstop31]

Anyone who has worked in a business knows you cannot be successful by just cutting costs. You must also increase revenue. Anyone who has ever been responsible for a family budget knows the same thing. And you certainly cannot increase costs and cut revenue and not expect a disaster.

Starting two wars and cutting taxes at the same time was the most idiotic decision.Whether partisan, bi-partisan or non-partisan it doesn't change that truth.

I agree, 100%.

So, the new guy (and for the first couple years, 'his' Congress) ADDS more 'wars' and goes all in on the spending. Woot.

Again... Two sides of the same coin.

[Lady's Human]

I do believe you've laid a curse on North America
A curse that we now here rehearse in Philadelphia
A second flood, a simple famine
Plagues of locusts everywhere
Or a cataclysmic earthquake
I'd accept with some despair
But, no, you sent us Congress.
Good God, sir, was that fair?

I say it with humility in Philadelphia
We're your responsibility in Philadephia
If you don't want to see us hanging
From some far-off British hill
If you don't want the voice of independency
Forever still
Then God, sir, get thee to it
For Congress never will

You see, we piddle, twiddle, and resolve
Not one damn thing do we solve
Piddle, twiddle, and resolve
Nothing's ever solved in
Foul, fetid, fuming, foggy, filthy
Philadephia!

They may sit here for years and years in Philadelphia.
These indecisive grenadiers of Philadelphia.
They can't agree on what is right and wrong
Or what is good or bad; I'm convinced
The only purpose this Congress ever had
Was to gather here specifically
To drive John Adams mad!

You see, we piddle, twiddle, and resolve
Not one damn thing do we solve
Piddle, twiddle, and resolve
Nothing's ever solved in
Foul, fetid, fuming, foggy, filthy
Philadephia!
Congress:


((Words & Music by Sherman Edwards) - 1776 )


And in over 200 years the only things that has changed is the location and the names. :p

[momoffuzzyfaces]

If they don't send my disability check on time, I'm sending the White house a bill for 50% interest for each day it's late. I'm sure they won't pay it but each day it's late is a day I'll be without food or the ability to pay my bills which will cause me to pay interest. :rolleyes:

I just can't believe this is such a mess. God help us everyone!!! :love:

[Edwina's Secretary]

If they don't send my disability check on time, I'm sending the White house a bill for 50% interest for each day it's late. I'm sure they won't pay it but each day it's late is a day I'll be without food or the ability to pay my bills which will cause me to pay interest. :rolleyes:

I just can't believe this is such a mess. God help us everyone!!! :love:

MOFF - you need to send your bill to the House of Representatives. Or better yet - directly to the Tea Partiers. The ones who think, instead of Medicare - you should be given a voucher to shop for your medical insurance. Make those choices such - capitated or not? As my 87 year old mother says - on a good day she can shop for groceries - how can she be expected to understand and make all the decisions in selecting insurance? I am sure there are scam artist - in addition to the Tea Partiers - just waiting for that! Think of how they can fleece the elderly!

I was one of those who had my taxes reduced by the Bush Cuts. I remember looking at my paycheck and thinking - this will not make one iota of difference in my life. We already had two cars, a motorcycle, a house, two cats and lots of toys. What were we to buy to "create jobs"? (And to save time for the flying monkeys - no I did not give it back. That is more difficult than you think.)

Thankfully we saved it - knowing that those "raining days" would not be far behind such ridiculous fiscal actions as reducing revenue and increasing expenses.

[lizbud]

Money talks.

http://factcheck.org/2011/07/fiscal-factcheck/

[wombat2u2004]

What about a GST ???? That might get ya all back on ya feet.

[RICHARD]

I think that they should just fast track the first thing that comes across the politicos desks and we can read it later on.

Kinda like the healthcare initiative.

Let's just Git R Done and we can worry about all the problems later on.

;)

[Grace]

Oh my, miracles do happen -


Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, D-Ariz., returned to Congress tonight for the first time since being shot in the head in January, casting a vote on the compromise debt ceiling bill.

She entered the chamber to loud, sustained applause and a standing ovation by her House colleagues, who huddled around her to give hugs, kisses and handshakes.

Vice President Joe Biden, with a big smile on his face, walked to the House floor and said, "I came to see Gabby, that's why I'm here."

Her spokesman C.J. Karamargin told Tucson Weekly: “The vote taking place today is the single most important vote taken this year by the House of Representatives. The congresswoman insisted on participating,” she said.

“Congresswoman Giffords has been following this debate closely over the past two weeks. Like the vast majority of Americans, she is extremely disappointed at Washington’s inability to confront the debt ceiling issue in a timely and thoughtful manner.”

[Grace]

In the Religion category - couldn't happen to a nicer guy - NOT


Polygamist leader Warren Jeffs, who heads a breakaway Mormon sect, was found guilty on Thursday of child sexual assault for his so-called "spiritual marriages" to two underage girls.

A west Texas jury convicted the 55-year-old Jeffs of child sexual assault and aggravated child sexual assault over his relationships with the girls, ages 12 and 14, at his sect's Texas ranch. He faces up to 119 years in prison.

source (http://news.yahoo.com/jurors-begin-deliberating-abuse-trial-polygamist-leader-191310720.html)

[lizbud]

In the Religion category - couldn't happen to a nicer guy - NOT



source (http://news.yahoo.com/jurors-begin-deliberating-abuse-trial-polygamist-leader-191310720.html)


That man is just a pervert who uses religion as a cover for his own
evil actions.Claming a direct pipeline to God & fear, he's duped a lot of
people. I hope he rots in prison.

[pomtzu]

That man is just a pervert who uses religion as a cover for his own
evil actions.Claming a direct pipeline to God & fear, he's duped a lot of
people. I hope he rots in prison.

This guy is a disgusting low-life piece of scum. Seeing the pics of him and his 12 yr old "bride", just turned my stomach. Hell is too good for the likes of him! :mad:

[wombat2u2004]

I think a minute or two of high voltage electricity would be cheaper than feeding the Bast*** for 119 years ??? ;)

[Grace]

I think a minute or two of high voltage electricity would be cheaper than feeding the Bast*** for 119 years ??? ;)


Considering the trial is in Texas, that sentence would not be outside the realm of possibility.

[lizbud]

A refreshing point of view.

http://www.theindychannel.com/money/28866266/detail.html

[Lady's Human]

That's all well and good, but Buffet would be relatively immune from those taxes. He makes relatively little in "income", only $100,000 per year, which doesn't even put him in the top bracket.

You could raise income taxes to 50% and it wouldn't affect him one bit.

If Buffet thinks his taxes are too low, why doesn't he write a check to the IRS?

[Puckstop31]

I think Mr. Buffet is missing the point....

There is plenty of liquidity out there. The big evil bankers are sitting on a lot of cash, most of it from the "stimulus". The question that should be asked, in relation to job creation is WHY are companies not willing to spend that cash on hiring new employees. Or perhaps ask why the banks are they not willing to loan that money to companies to spend? What happens when those trillions of dolllars actually get put into circulation, when there is already a lack of faith in the value of the dollar?

Taxing all the millionaries at 100% would barely put a dent in the debt, which, IMO, is what they are afraid of.

[lizbud]

That's all well and good, but Buffet would be relatively immune from those taxes. He makes relatively little in "income", only $100,000 per year, which doesn't even put him in the top bracket.

You could raise income taxes to 50% and it wouldn't affect him one bit.

If Buffet thinks his taxes are too low, why doesn't he write a check to the IRS?

Quote: "The philanthropist said that his 2010 federal tax bill, including income and payroll taxes, was $6,938,744.


"That sounds like a lot of money," wrote the Omaha, Neb.-based billionaire. "But what I paid was only 17.4% of my taxable income - and that's actually a lower percentage than was paid by any of the other 20 people in our office."

He added that some investment managers were taxed only 15% on billions of dollars in income. He compared that to the middle class, with its income tax bracket of up to 25%."

[Puckstop31]

Liz, do you know the difference between an income tax and a capital gains tax? Do you know why the difference is significant? Do you even care?

[Bonny]

Liz, do you know the difference between an income tax and a capital gains tax? Do you know why the difference is significant? Do you even care?

I care! Please explain in laymens language so a person can understand what you are saying.

[Lady's Human]

To put it in a nutshell, the reason CEOs take $1 salaries and other stunts is because their salaries affect their capital gains tax rate.

If your ordinary income tax (prior to capital gains and other income) is 10%, (as in you took a $1 salary for running Apple) your short term cap gains rate would be 10%, and your long term cap gains tax would be 0%.

It's rather disingenuous for Mr. Buffet to pay the taxes he does, in part based on his "meager" $100,000 salary, which is structured to take advantage of a loophole in the tax code, and then claim he isn't paying enough in taxes.

Again, if he doesn't think he pays enough in taxes, write a check to D.C..

It's all P.R. stunts, and people are taking the bait, hook, line and sinker.

[RICHARD]

I wonder if the U.S. can recoup some of the 1.1 M we paid for the new Obama bus by renting it out to Buffett, Gates or some of the other bigwig millionaires.

[Puckstop31]

I care! Please explain in laymens language so a person can understand what you are saying.

Just to add a little to what LH said....


Income tax = What working stiffs understand. :) A tax paid on money you earn in the traditional way, generally a salary paid by an employer to an employee.

Capital Gains tax = You buy something (stocks, buildings, companies, etc....) and sell it for a profit. You invested capital and made a gain on that investment by selling it for a higher price than you paid.

[Bonny]

Just to add a little to what LH said....


Income tax = What working stiffs understand. :) A tax paid on money you earn in the traditional way, generally a salary paid by an employer to an employee.

Capital Gains tax = You buy something (stocks, buildings, companies, etc....) and sell it for a profit. You invested capital and made a gain on that investment by selling it for a higher price than you paid.

But then isn't your gain taxed? Isn't that also considered income?

[Bonny]

I wonder if the U.S. can recoup some of the 1.1 M we paid for the new Obama bus by renting it out to Buffett, Gates or some of the other bigwig millionaires.

I have seen THOSE buses up close. There are two of them. They closed our road & came through yesterday & stopped up the road at the neighbors. They are fancy buses believe me. I also had to pull over at Pizza Hut while they came through today & really saw them up close. Really fancy! One is black & the other is Red shiny & new. :cool:

[Lady's Human]

Capital gains are taxed, but the capital gains tax rate is determined in large part by your non-capital gains income tax rate.

Depending on your "regular" income tax bracket, you could wind up paying 0% on those long term shares of Apple stock you got as compensation in lieu of salary last year, as you have to hold stock shares for one year to get the much lower "long term" capital gains rate.

[Grace]

I wonder if the U.S. can recoup some of the 1.1 M we paid for the new Obama bus by renting it out to Buffett, Gates or some of the other bigwig millionaires.

Richard, the new bus belongs to the Secret Service. When the Republicans get their nominee figured out s/he will also have the use of one exactly the same.

[Karen]

I wonder if the U.S. can recoup some of the 1.1 M we paid for the new Obama bus by renting it out to Buffett, Gates or some of the other bigwig millionaires.

I read an article that explained that before now, they would spend lots of money reoutfitting busses each month to be bullet-proof, etc. For once, this seems like a smart investment, a purpose-built vehicle, rather than slapping armor on something else. It would be cooler if it had solar panels on the top to help power it, though!

[Lady's Human]

I read an article that explained that before now, they would spend lots of money reoutfitting busses each month to be bullet-proof, etc. For once, this seems like a smart investment, a purpose-built vehicle, rather than slapping armor on something else. It would be cooler if it had solar panels on the top to help power it, though!

Even with the surface area of the bus, the solar panels might be useful to power the interior accassories, but would do bubkus to help power the monsters.

Would have been a nice tech demonstrator for the BAE commercial hybrid drive systems they're using on the buses around here, though.

[Bonny]

Richard, the new bus belongs to the Secret Service. When the Republicans get their nominee figured out s/he will also have the use of one exactly the same.

We the tax payers still paid for them. :D

[RICHARD]

Richard, the new bus belongs to the Secret Service. When the Republicans get their nominee figured out s/he will also have the use of one exactly the same.

I have disdain for all politicians.

Not just the ones 'driving the bus'.

And if the Secret Service own the bus, why are they letting ANYONE use it? At the least they should let regular people use it.

Didn't FEMA let people borrow trailers, once?

:confused::(

[Grace]

We the tax payers still paid for them. :D

That's true. I was disputing Richard's phrase - new Obama bus. It's a bus for use by anyone with more clout than you or I have. Current President, future President, candidates for President.

[Bonny]

Aren't the buses being used just like the rock stars etc., use them to get around in when they go from place to place for their concerts. Instead we have politicians using them to meet the people & tell them truths & lies.

President Obama flew into Minneapolis & hopped on the bus. Now where the buses came from a person doesn't know. I hope they didn't drive the darn things all the way from Washington D.C. to Minnesota.

There was a lot of security work done to make this trip possible both on land & in the air. Last night we got to hear jets flying over protecting the air space overheard & talk about noise pollution. :eek:

[RICHARD]

That's true. I was disputing Richard's phrase - new Obama bus. It's a bus for use by anyone with more clout than you or I have. Current President, future President, candidates for President.

LOL,

They didn't go to Trader Vic's Miracle Cars in Pacoima to buy it.


I don't have clout, if I did I'd go get some antibiotics.

That stuff will kill you.

---------------------

The sign at Trader Vic's lot (It's on San Fernando Road in Pacoima, Ca) says
Trader Vic's Miracle Cars - If it's a good car, it's a miracle!

[RICHARD]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44160917?ocid=ansmsnbc11

President Barack Obama is traveling the Midwest on a new $1.1 million bus purchased by the Secret Service, an impenetrable-looking conveyance the size of a cross-country Greyhound, painted all in black, with dark tinted windows and flashing red and blue lights.

Secret Service spokesman Ed Donovan emphasized that the bus wasn't purchased solely for the president and would be used for other dignitaries in the future. He said the agency has not previously had buses in its fleet and was overdue to get some since it's had to protect politicians traveling by bus for decades.

All the AHs that can afford their own ticket are going to roll on my dime?:rolleyes::eek::(

Why didn't they just buy the tanker that Max Max drove in the MMII?

[wombat2u2004]

Why didn't they just buy the tanker that Max Max drove in the MMII?

That's still bogged down in pig crap at Thunderdome.

[Bonny]

That's still bogged down in pig crap at Thunderdome.

ROFL! It will take a miracle from trader Vic to get it out.

[wombat2u2004]

LOL,

I don't have clout, if I did I'd go get some antibiotics.

I think I had that once. It started off as a purple rash.
I should have listened to my mum, she told me not associate with those sort of girls. :D

[Lady's Human]

http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/18/news/economy/bachmann_gas_prices/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2

Would someone please buy Rep. Bachmann a clue?

[lizbud]

http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/18/news/economy/bachmann_gas_prices/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2

Would someone please buy Rep. Bachmann a clue?


LOL I read that article this morning. I see that they confirmed the "drill
baby drill" mantra made no sense and wouldn't solve the gas problem either.

BTW, did you read this on the Money page? If yes,what did you think?

http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2011/08/18/how-washington-is-destroying-the-economy/?iid=Popular

[Lady's Human]

Somewhere, the center has got to take the reins from the fanatics on both sides.

I disagree with one major point of the article, however, They give Standard and Poor's a pass on the bond rating downgrade, when S+P is as much a part of the political soup that's causing this mess as anyone else.

The entitlement issues needs to be dealt with, and the tax code as it exists needs to be scrapped. Completely. Clean sheet rewrite. Either a flat tax with a hard basic deduction raised annually by the CPI (as in anything under $30K isn't touched, adjusted for inflation) or a national sales tax.

[lizbud]

Somewhere, the center has got to take the reins from the fanatics on both sides.

I disagree with one major point of the article, however, They give Standard and Poor's a pass on the bond rating downgrade, when S+P is as much a part of the political soup that's causing this mess as anyone else.

The entitlement issues needs to be dealt with, and the tax code as it exists needs to be scrapped. Completely. Clean sheet rewrite. Either a flat tax with a hard basic deduction raised annually by the CPI (as in anything under $30K isn't touched, adjusted for inflation) or a national sales tax.


All big ideas & good ideas. I only hope the Congress can find the will to
do what is truly best for the American people. ALL the people, not just
a few corporations. (they are now considered people too);)

[Puckstop31]

Somewhere, the center has got to take the reins from the fanatics on both sides.

"Squish", like grape. :)


I disagree with one major point of the article, however, They give Standard and Poor's a pass on the bond rating downgrade, when S+P is as much a part of the political soup that's causing this mess as anyone else.

Sure.

Still, there has to be SOMETHING in there about borrowing 40% of every dollar spent.... With ZERO serious talk about actually changing our spending habits.


The entitlement issues needs to be dealt with, and the tax code as it exists needs to be scrapped. Completely. Clean sheet rewrite. Either a flat tax with a hard basic deduction raised annually by the CPI (as in anything under $30K isn't touched, adjusted for inflation) or a national sales tax.


Good luck there hoss. What politician is going to vote to repeal the 16th Amendment? You have to do that if you want a flat/sales tax. If you don't, we end up like Canada. Taxes on the money that was taxed already.

But I don't blame the politicians. I blame a lazy and ignorant electorate. Who actually has read and understands the Constitution anymore? Who has read the Federalist papers?

/rant

[Lady's Human]

For a national sales tax/VAT you'd have to amend the 16th, but I don't see a flat tax being a problem constitutionally.

[Grace]

http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/18/news/economy/bachmann_gas_prices/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2

Would someone please buy Rep. Bachmann a clue?

$2/gal gas - not in our lifetimes.

http://cartalk.com/blogs/jim-motavalli/?p=1116

[wombat2u2004]

http://img1.imagehousing.com/14/324c6d3283bc3e10ba606f2e6ea3f604.jpg (http://www.imagehousing.com/image/829542)

[Karen]

Um, somebody's sure got a warped view of our current President ...

No one ever said Universal Health Care - even those proponents of it - was gonna be free!

Never mind all the other stuff ...

[Bonny]

http://img1.imagehousing.com/14/324c6d3283bc3e10ba606f2e6ea3f604.jpg (http://www.imagehousing.com/image/829542)

That cartoon says a lot. Here in the heartland it is time for a change because people are feeling :( with the present situation.

[Lady's Human]

If you're upset with the way things are going, vote 'em out. Not the President, but Congress.

Over 80% of congressional reps are reelected. Change isn't going to happen with the same gang of fools in charge.

[Bonny]

President Obama can't lead period. He has tried lets give someone else a chance to take the reins.

It is a do nothing bunch of idiots in Congress we need to clean house there too. Get rid of the whole lot & start over. :rolleyes:

[lizbud]

It is a do nothing bunch of idiots in Congress we need to clean house there too. Get rid of the whole lot & start over. :rolleyes:


You're right. It's hard to lead when all you have to work with is a" bunch
of idiots" who are determined to see the current President fail.

[mrspunkysmom]

You're right. It's hard to lead when all you have to work with is a" bunch of idiots" who are determined to see the current President fail.

Amen!

[Lady's Human]

Pres. Reagan had to work with a much more divided house (The closest division was a 50 seat deficit) and still accomplished much of his agenda.

Agree with his policies or not, the amount a true leader can accomplish is staggering, even if Congress is against them.

[lizbud]

Pres. Reagan had to work with a much more divided house (The closest division was a 50 seat deficit) and still accomplished much of his agenda.

Agree with his policies or not, the amount a true leader can accomplish is staggering, even if Congress is against them.


Reagan never met the wing nuts of the Tea Party. He never was asked
to show his birth certificate. He was never questioned about his love for
America. Obama ,as the first African American President had to face blatent
prejudice never before experienced by a major political candidate.

[Puckstop31]

Reagan never met the wing nuts of the Tea Party. He never was asked
to show his birth certificate. He was never questioned about his love for
America. Obama ,as the first African American President had to face blatent
prejudice never before experienced by a major political candidate.

Thank you for proving how utterly ignorant and, a factor that is worse IMO, dogmatic you really are. And you accuse those who hold a different opinion of the exact same thing....


Lets put it in language you might understand Liz. Barack Obama's domestic/economic policy is the same as George Bush... on steroids. No? Please elaborate on the differences.

EDIT - Hint <Be sure to consider which party controlled Congress at the time certain variables were put into play. It would be neat to see if you understand how that matters.>

[Lady's Human]

Every President has to deal with name calling and opposition from both the fringes of their own party and the entire opposition party.

Pres. Reagan was derided as senile, a lightweight, an Actor with no background, ad nauseum. He still accomplished much of the agenda he ran on despite his detractors and taking office during a massive recession.

Pres. Clinton was derided as a hick from Arkansas, his presidency was rife with scandal, and he still accomplished much (love it or hate it) on the legislative side.

The first President Bush never got out of the shadow of Reagan, and was an appeaser, never showed a backbone on domestic policy, and didn't communicate well.(read my lips.......)

The second President Bush ran as a conservative initially, had a strong foreign policy (love it or hate it, you knew where he stood) but domestically he tried to be everything to everyone, from No Child Left Behind to the medicare prescription drug benefit disaster. We will pay dearly for both of those.

When Presidents LEAD, they do well. When they appease or go to childish bullying, they do poorly.

[blue]

Obama ,as the first African American President had to face blatent prejudice never before experienced by a major political candidate.

If you mean people voted for him because he is half African American, you would be correct.

[wombat2u2004]

IN MY BRIEF RESEARCH INTO THIS SUBJECT . I AM HAPPY TOO SHARE MY FINDINGS. I DO THIS AS A PUBLIC SERVICE.
THANK YOU.

Now we know the complete story!


The English language has some wonderfully collective nouns for the various groups of animals.

We are all familiar with a Herd of cows, a Flock of chickens, a School of fish and a Gaggle of geese.

However, less widely known is a Pride of lions, a Murder of crows (as well as their cousins the rooks and ravens), an Exaltation of doves and, presumably because they look so wise, a Parliament of owls.

Now consider a group of Baboons. They are the loudest, most dangerous, most obnoxious, most viciously aggressive and least intelligent of all primates.
And what is the proper collective noun for a group of baboons?

Believe it or not ....... a Congress! :D

[Lady's Human]

Don't insult baboons. At least they have a purpose to their....displays.

[Karen]

If you mean people voted for him because he is half African American, you would be correct.

I am sure there are also people who didn't vote for him for the same reason. Neither position makes much sense, but humans are not always as rational as they could be!

[blue]

Edit.


I am sure there are also people who didn't vote for him for the same reason. Neither position makes much sense, but humans are not always as rational as they could be!

That was the point Liz was trying to make.

If you voted for someone because of their race its just as raciest as if you voted against them because of their race.

[Bonny]

Darned if you do! Darned if you don"t!

[blue]

I remember seeing a poll that women voted for Clinton because he resembled Robert Redford.

But of course voting for someone because they are black is good, and voting against the same person is bad, is a perfectly rational argument.

[phesina]

Robert Redford? Never heard that one before! Oh, well.. could be..

And how about men who voted or would vote for Sarah Palin because they think she's good-looking, former beauty queen and all?

[blue]

Nobody voted for Sarah Palin for President.

[Karen]

Nobody voted for Sarah Palin for President.

No, but they voted for her for Governor in Alaska, and voted for her for Vice President ...

That is the glory and the pain of democracy - there's no need to tell anyone WHY you are voting for someone, so you can have reasons that are good, bad, ridiculous or sublime, and anything in between.

And by the way, anyone who voted for Bill Clinton because they thought he looked like Robert Redford needs their eyes examined. Yes, they are both Caucasian males with blue eyes, there the resemblance ends!

[wombat2u2004]

Hey, the same happens here.
Last election we had a rock singer, and a popular news reader who won seats.
Since then, nobody has heard a peep from the news reader, but the rock singer gave everyone in the country free ceiling installation, which backfired into his own face....haven't heard much from him since either.
Nobody should be voted in on popularity, but more so on policy. The sad fact is that a lot of people wouldn't know a good policy from a bad one, so rather than have someone who is experienced and knows what they are doing, the seat is usually filled by....
1) A Marlon Brando lookalike if the majority of voters have purple dyed hair.
2) BO, if a great deal of the voters depend on welfare because they don't like work, and the rest of his votes by those who feel sorry for the plight of BO's coloured folk because they feel sorry for them.
Not much to build a country on.

[RICHARD]

Hey, the same happens here.
Last election we had a rock singer, and a popular news reader who won seats.
Since then, nobody has heard a peep from the news reader, but the rock singer gave everyone in the country free ceiling installation, which backfired into his own face....haven't heard much from him since either..



Of course peter garret would want to insulate the ceilings....He's 7 feet tall!

Heat rises. ;)

[wombat2u2004]

Of course peter garret would want to insulate the ceilings....He's 7 feet tall!

Heat rises. ;)

Peter Garrett is a bloody idiot. He should be doing what he does best, entertaining drunk druggies at pubs.
He's like Al Gore. Thinks that everyone who has a BBQ in their backyard are destroying the planet. ;)

[Lady's Human]

Peter Garrett is a bloody idiot. He should be doing what he does best, entertaining drunk druggies at pubs.
He's like Al Gore. Thinks that everyone who has a BBQ in their backyard are destroying the planet. ;)

Only if they don't know how to grill! :p

[RICHARD]

http://us.mg5.mail.yahoo.com/ya/download?mid=1%5f5551%5fAIxYimIAAFKiTjxWWwFNYF3fzZ w&pid=2.2&fid=Inbox

[mrspunkysmom]

http://us.mg5.mail.yahoo.com/ya/download?mid=1%5f5551%5fAIxYimIAAFKiTjxWWwFNYF3fzZ w&pid=2.2&fid=Inbox

Don't see a picture. The URL shows up in the quote text but not in the message.

[wombat2u2004]

Don't see a picture. The URL shows up in the quote text but not in the message.

You need glasses.
I can see the pic perfectly clearly.
It's a little box with a red X in it. :D

[wombat2u2004]

DIVORCE AGREEMENT

THIS IS SO INCREDIBLY WELL PUT AND I CAN HARDLY BELIEVE IT'S BY A YOUNG PERSON, A STUDENT!!!
WHATEVER HE RUNS FOR, I'LL VOTE FOR HIM.
Yep....I'll be on his side of the fence. ;)

Dear Australian Laborites, leftists, social progressives, socialists, Marxists, Ms Gillard, et al:

We have stuck together since the late 1950's for the sake of the kids, but the whole of this latest election process has made me realise that I want a divorce. I know we tolerated each other for many years for the sake of future generations, but sadly, this relationship has clearly run its course.

Our two ideological sides of Australia cannot and will not ever agree on what is right for us all, so let's just end it on friendly terms. We can smile and chalk it up to irreconcilable differences and go our own way

Here is a model separation agreement:
Our two groups can equitably divide up the country by landmass each taking a similar portion. That will be the difficult part, but I am sure our two sides can come to a friendly agreement. After that, it should be relatively easy! Our respective representatives can effortlessly divide other assets since both sides have such distinct and disparate tastes.

We don't like redistributive taxes so you can keep them. You are welcome to the ACTU, the Fabian Society and every member of Emilys List. Since you hate guns and war, we'll take our firearms, the cops and the military. We'll take the nasty, smelly oil industry and you can go with wind, solar and biodiesel. You can keep the ABC left wingers (particularly Kerry O'Brien) and Bob Brown. You are, however, responsible for finding an electric vehicle big enough to move all of them.

We'll keep capitalism, greedy corporations, pharmaceutical companies, Woolworths and the Stock Exchange. You can have your beloved lifelong welfare dwellers, dole bludgers, homeless, homeboys, hippies, druggies and boat people. We'll keep the budgie smuggling, bike riding, volunteer firemen and lifesavers, greedy CEOs and rednecks. We'll keep the Bibles and the churches and give you SBS and the Greens.

You can make peace with Iran, Palestine and the Taliban and we'll retain the right to stand up and fight when threatened. You can have the greenies and war protesters. When our allies or our way of life are under assault, we'll help provide them security.

We'll keep our Judaeo-Christian values. You are welcome to Islam, Scientology, Humanism, political correctness and Penny Wong.. You can also have the U.N. But we will no longer be paying the bill..

We'll keep the 4WDs, utes and V8s. You can take every hybrid hatchback you can find.

We'll keep "Waltzing Matilda" and our National Anthem. I'm sure you'll be happy to keep in tune with Peter Garrett as he sings "Imagine", "I'd Like to Teach the World to Sing", "Kum Ba Ya", "We Are The World" and his recent big solo hit Beds and Batts are Burning.

We'll practice trickle down economics and you can continue to give trickle up poverty your best shot. Since it so often offends you, we'll keep our history, our name and our flag.

Would you agree to this? If so, please pass it along to other like-minded conservative Australians and if you do not agree, just hit delete. In the spirit of friendly parting, I'll bet you answer which one of us will need whose help in 15 years.

Sincerely,
John Wall
Australian Law Student

P.S. Also, please take Lindsey Tanner, Wayne Swan, Alan Griffin, John Faulkner, Kevin Rudd and Jenny Macklin with you.

P. S. S. And you won't have to press 1 for English when you call our country.

[phesina]

Thanks for that, Wom.. I see you have the same kinds of things going on in Australia as we have here.

[mrspunkysmom]

You need glasses.
I can see the pic perfectly clearly.
It's a little box with a red X in it. :D

Har :p

[mrspunkysmom]

Government reminds me of The Three Stooges. Wish we could bop their heads together. :D

[wombat2u2004]

Thanks for that, Wom.. I see you have the same kinds of things going on in Australia as we have here.

Well yeah. Every now and again the Idiot Party gets elected.
All of the usual backstabbing and "What kind of grass will we put a ban on mowing this year because trimming it is bad for the environment and is destroying the planet" discussions are the all that goes on in Parliament House.
But that's ok.....The South shall Rise Again. ;)

[wombat2u2004]

Government reminds me of The Three Stooges. Wish we could bop their heads together. :D

Awww give them a break Anne.
Being in the Government is proof that someone has already bashed them senseless.

[Lady's Human]

Government reminds me of The Three Stooges. Wish we could bop their heads together. :D

The Three Stooges were acting....in the case of Government it's incompetence, occasionally willful incompetence.

[wombat2u2004]

The Three Stooges were acting....in the case of Government it's incompetence, occasionally willful incompetence.

Hmmmmm. Interesting.
So what you are saying is that imbeciles actually DO exist ????

[lizbud]

Interesting Political Poll question. I wonder if Congress cares how we feel?

Quick vote

Should members of Congress get a pay cut as part of efforts to cut the federal deficit?


Yes 94% 329432
No 6% 20444

Total votes: 349876

This is not a scientific poll

[wombat2u2004]

Interesting Political Poll question. I wonder if Congress cares how we feel?

Quick vote

Should members of Congress get a pay cut as part of efforts to cut the federal deficit?


Yes 94% 329432
No 6% 20444

Total votes: 349876

This is not a scientific poll

No. I think we should double their pay.
And tomorrow, sack them.

[wombat2u2004]

Does anyone see a problem here ???
I do...but...maybe it's just me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=hxlcVAEj0sM&vq=large

[mrspunkysmom]

No, it's not just you. I didn't like the attacks on the Democrats, but it does show a lack of respect and lack of class on the part of the White House or Congressional staff that organized the medal ceremony.

There is too much politics in this country these days and not just with the politicians. Sometimes I really fear for my country.

[blue]

If that isnt the epitome of how our POTUS sees our soldiers, I dont know what is. Im to angry to post more but I reserve hte right to do so later.

[lizbud]

It surprises me that anyone would take this at face value. By this time -- more than a year later -- there is more than enough proof that the people on the front two rows were SSgt. Giunta's family, previous Medal of Honor recipients and Secretary of Defense Gates. Didn't you think there was something wrong when the youtube video didn't show anything from the actual ceremony?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RG-XAJiho5c&feature=related

[Grace]

Does anyone see a problem here ???
I do...but...maybe it's just me.


Perhaps you need a new pair of glasses, wom. FYI, all the recent MOH ceremonies have been live on TV here in the States - for anyone interested to view.

I've seen them all, live and in HD. Very impressive with the other MOH recipients, and family members, present.

[Bonny]

I saw the whole ceremony & felt that the focus was strictly on SSgt. Giunta & what he had done. He was very modest about the whole thing & would of rather saw his friends alive then receiving the medal. Pulling his friend out of there was for good reason as you saw on the U Tube the taliban mutilate their captures. SSgt. Giunta's buddies were also on camera, along with his family. The camera panned everyone involved.

[wombat2u2004]

Perhaps you need a new pair of glasses, wom. FYI, all the recent MOH ceremonies have been live on TV here in the States - for anyone interested to view.

I've seen them all, live and in HD. Very impressive with the other MOH recipients, and family members, present.

No glasses needed.
I have the choice to believe whatever branch of the media.

[wombat2u2004]

Didn't you think there was something wrong when the youtube video didn't show anything from the actual ceremony?

Nope.

[blue]

Nope.

Good man.

For the rest of you, this is completely in line with Obama's beliefs and values. Praise the ruling class on the backs of our warriors and workers.

[Bonny]

Good man.

For the rest of you, this is completely in line with Obama's beliefs and values. Praise the ruling class on the backs of our warriors and workers.

What Values? I don't think there are any values left in D.C. The rich rule while the rest of us work our asses off to pay them for doing nothing & send our children off into harms way.

[wombat2u2004]

What Values? I don't think there are any values left in D.C.

Values ?? Naw....they just want the money.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Please explain to me how Congress can possibly justify another break? Here we are, on the verge of another gov shutdown because the bozos can't get a budget together. They were gone the entire month of August. Now they are on another break with the gov to shut down on the 31st.

What is it going to take to make them do their jobs? I don't understand how they can stand to look at themselves in the mirrors every day. Even if I had plenty to live on, I couldn't have peace with my self if I caused others undue hardships.

I think first thing on the budget should be to eliminate all of Congresses paid 'breaks', and no pay raises for them until they can prove they earned them. And only then after there is a balanced budget. sheesh:love:

[mrspunkysmom]

It surprises me that anyone would take this at face value. By this time -- more than a year later -- there is more than enough proof that the people on the front two rows were SSgt. Giunta's family, previous Medal of Honor recipients and Secretary of Defense Gates. Didn't you think there was something wrong when the youtube video didn't show anything from the actual ceremony?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RG-XAJiho5c&feature=related

Thanks for posting this.

[lizbud]

Thanks for posting this.



You're welcome.:) Always glad to spread truth & quash lies.

[lizbud]

Please explain to me how Congress can possibly justify another break? Here we are, on the verge of another gov shutdown because the bozos can't get a budget together. They were gone the entire month of August. Now they are on another break with the gov to shut down on the 31st.




I think it's a break for the Jewish Holiday Rosh Hashanah. Not a long
break. I read something last night that hinted at a solution to this.
Then the Gov budget would be ok till the middle of November.:rolleyes:

[momoffuzzyfaces]

I think it's a break for the Jewish Holiday Rosh Hashanah. Not a long
break. I read something last night that hinted at a solution to this.
Then the Gov budget would be ok till the middle of November.:rolleyes:

First time I ever heard of them celebrating Rosh Hashanah. It's not a government holiday that I know of. If they celebrate everyone's religious holidays, they will never get anything done. Wait, they don't get any thing done any way.
Party on congress. :love:

[blue]

You're welcome.:) Always glad to spread truth & quash lies.

Are you a member of Attack Watch? Fighting lies with more lies and smears? The video you posted did not in any way invalidate the claims made in the video Wom posted. I have never seen a POTUS look more disgusted during a MOD presentation, maybe he thought his time would be better spent campaigning.


I think it's a break for the Jewish Holiday Rosh Hashanah. Not a long
break. I read something last night that hinted at a solution to this.
Then the Gov budget would be ok till the middle of November.:rolleyes:

Any excuse to waste more of the citizens time and money.

[lizbud]

First time I ever heard of them celebrating Rosh Hashanah. It's not a government holiday that I know of. If they celebrate everyone's religious holidays, they will never get anything done. Wait, they don't get any thing done any way.
Party on congress. :love:


Hardee har har.:D

Well, they shutdown for Christmas too & not everyone is Christian. Who
knows what qualifies any more.

[wombat2u2004]

Are you a member of Attack Watch? Fighting lies with more lies and smears? The video you posted did not in any way invalidate the claims made in the video Wom posted. I have never seen a POTUS look more disgusted during a MOD presentation, maybe he thought his time would be better spent campaigning.

Hee hee......I'm pretty sure our armchair politician wouldn't know up from down, let alone truth from lies.
I found it exhilarating to post that original Youtube.....it sort of cuts through the thoughts of those who think like sheep. :D

[wombat2u2004]

Well, they shutdown for Christmas too & not everyone is Christian. Who
knows what qualifies any more.

I do. Maybe you should read a book.

[Puckstop31]

I do. Maybe you should read a book.

That would require effort.

Besides, what else matters than CNN and MSNBC? MSNBC was good enough to tell us the AP is "racist" for relating a speech as it was spoken. Who is the racist again?


But, in the end there is no need to bother with those who are not willing to do their own homework. They are the minority and frankly are not deserving of their birthright of liberty.

But we will bring them along anyway.

[RICHARD]

That would require effort.

Besides, what else matters than CNN and MSNBC? MSNBC was good enough to tell us the AP is "racist" for relating a speech as it was spoken. Who is the racist again?


MSNBC Is better than the Comedy Channel.

I try to watch everyone for a few minutes and have to laugh at the comments, the moderators and content.

What a bunch of rude clowns-they interrupt each other, talk so quickly that they do not make sense and generally play the same clips over and over again.

FOX is no better, but MSNBC is the best at smearing anyone they thing deserves it.

The twits on Morning Joe need lessons in etiquette, Chuck Todd needs to either do a political show or do a food channel show -WTF do I care about the 'soup of the day' in the cafeteria? Andrea Mitchell is a stuttering moron and I get tired of laughing at the rest of the 'moderators' on the channel.

Why is Rachel Madcow on the air? I love her commercials about the economy and little bits of why the U.S. sucks.

I stopped watching FOX for the same reasons....MSNBC is more entertaining because the THINK they are making a difference.

A lantrine @ a Boy Scout Jamboree makes more sense than most of the 'on air' news/political channels...

[Lady's Human]

At least the latrine has a purpose.... :p

[RICHARD]

At least the latrine has a purpose.... :p

Have you seen what a troop of BS's eat during a Jamboree.....:rolleyes::eek:

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Hardee har har.:D

Well, they shutdown for Christmas too & not everyone is Christian. Who
knows what qualifies any more.

At least they made Christmas a legal holiday so all federal employees get the day off, Christian or not. The only ones that got to celebrate Rosh Hashanah was Congress. :love:

[Bonny]

Have you seen what a troop of BS's eat during a Jamboree.....:rolleyes::eek:

Inquiring Minds Would Like to KNOW? :D

[wombat2u2004]

Inquiring Minds Would Like to KNOW? :D

I'm not telling. :p:p

[lizbud]

Attention......... Hell just froze over.:D

http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article/rr/9001/52441350/Top_Republican_praises_Obama_for_strike_on_cleric

[Puckstop31]

Attention......... Hell just froze over.:D

http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article/rr/9001/52441350/Top_Republican_praises_Obama_for_strike_on_cleric

Really digging for good news eh Liz? LOL

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-obama-wall-street-20110930,0,6677823.story

This one is nice....

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/09/29/van_jones_were_going_to_build_a_progressive_counte rbalance_to_tea_party.html


In relation to your OP....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/checkpoint-washington/post/aulaqi-gets-new-designation-in-death/2011/09/30/gIQAsbF69K_blog.html

Or, this one... The "jobs" bill. What is that old adage about the definition of stupidity again???? I wonder how Durbin will coddle or threaten his people to vote for this turd?

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/184713-durbin-says-democrats-dont-currently-have-the-votes-for-obama-jobs-bill



I could go on.....and on.....and on.....


I know, its Bush's fault. LOL

[lizbud]

Dude, so just how bored are you with the vacation that you must
keep track of the goings on at the DH???? LOL :D:D

[Puckstop31]

Dude, so just how bored are you with the vacation that you must
keep track of the goings on at the DH???? LOL :D:D

This internet thingy is pretty easy to keep up with. We had the time of our life, thanks for asking. Capitalism creates some pretty freaking AMAZING things.

"A man should never neglect his family for business."
Walt Disney


"All the adversity I've had in my life, all my troubles and obstacles, have strengthened me... You may not realize it when it happens, but a kick in the teeth may be the best thing in the world for you."
Walt Disney

(America is getting its kick in the teeth right now. FWIW, Barack Obama was good for America. He woke people up.)


"Disneyland is a work of love. We didn't go into Disneyland just with the idea of making money."
Walt Disney



Back to topic.... Nothing to add on the topic Liz? I'd distract, duck and dodge were I you as well.

[lizbud]

That boring huh. LOL:) pitiful dude, just pitiful.:p

gotta go now, my movie is on. Ta ta.

[Puckstop31]

That boring huh. LOL:) pitiful dude, just pitiful.:p

gotta go now, my movie is on. Ta ta.

LOL Coming from you, that is a fantastic compliment. Thanks.

Liz... I don't even have to spend 90 seconds responding to you, because you are the best dodge ball player EVER. LOL

[wombat2u2004]

Attention......... Hell just froze over.:D

http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article/rr/9001/52441350/Top_Republican_praises_Obama_for_strike_on_cleric

It did. His first + (and probably his last)

[RICHARD]

I got the best laugh yesterday when I heard that Hank Williams Jr got his song pulled from the Monday Night Football program.

He made a few comments about the prez....

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31751_162-20115065-10391697.html

Now, I don't agree with what he said, but he really does have the right to say what he wants.

No, it does not have anything to do with the 1st amendment and the government, any company can can you if they believe you are not acting in THEIR best interest.........

BUT, ESPN/DISNEY promote probably one of the most violent sports and possibly the highest percentage of alleged and proven criminals.

http://www.amazon.com/Pros-Cons-Criminals-Who-Play/dp/0446524034

Kinda funny when the 'company' says you can't say things that really show what an idiot you are, then promote a product where some of the performers are a smidge away from being full blown criminals/convicts.

So much for the family of values....;):rolleyes:

[smokey the elder]

Disney is the biggest bunch of hard*** beestards about protecting their trademarks/copyrights (or at least they were in the Eisner era). BUT...anything that's a pop culture icon like that can easily be co-opted into the public sector, so I guess I can't blame them.

They put on a great show, though.:) But the Hank Williams Jr. thing does seem a bit hypocritical IMO.

[RICHARD]

Disney is the biggest bunch of hard*** beestards about protecting their trademarks/copyrights (or at least they were in the Eisner era). BUT...anything that's a pop culture icon like that can easily be co-opted into the public sector, so I guess I can't blame them.

They put on a great show, though.:) But the Hank Williams Jr. thing does seem a bit hypocritical IMO.

There was a kindercare business that painted a mural on a wall and disney went all out to get them to cover them over...

http://www.snopes.com/disney/wdco/daycare.asp

That and there was a show on NPR where they spoke about Disney's use of interns to cut costs within the company.

At the millenium Disney spoke about putting all the old movies into 'retirement' and they sold DVDs that were the last chance for the public to own the original films.

Now it's blu-ray and 3-d special editions....:eek:

[lizbud]

Nothing better to do in the Florida Legislature?

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/29421617/detail.html?source=orlpn

[RICHARD]

Nothing better to do in the Florida Legislature?

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/29421617/detail.html?source=orlpn

It's a BIG problem in FLA.

I think it's time for the state to correct it's shortcomings.

[wombat2u2004]

It's a BIG problem in FLA.

I think it's time for the state to correct it's shortcomings.

I thought it was a TINY problem :p

[lizbud]

A Mayoral election fight is going on in Indianapolis right now. I can't
wait to be rid of all the TV ads for the candidates. They are relentless,
ads for & con 24/7. You can'r even take a walk without seeing signs
covering yards, telephone poles, etc. Both parties must be spending big
for all this coverage. Just a few more days till next tues, election day.:rolleyes:

[Grace]

There are some elections scheduled in Connecticut next week, also. Big problems there since 300,000 still without power. I read one comment - they were working to get power to the schools and polling places. Bet that last went over big with the citizens.

One good thing - no power, no TV ads, in many cases no phone calls, and the streets are such a mess the candidates can't go door-to-door.

[lizbud]

There are some elections scheduled in Connecticut next week, also. Big problems there since 300,000 still without power. I read one comment - they were working to get power to the schools and polling places. Bet that last went over big with the citizens.

One good thing - no power, no TV ads, in many cases no phone calls, and the streets are such a mess the candidates can't go door-to-door.


Is the weather that cold in Conn.? No chance for warmer weather to melt
the snow? Don't they import power line workers from other states to help?
Most ststes do in an emergency.


Hey, guess what? I got a call from EX-President Bill Clinton this morning
urging me to vote for our Dem canidate in the Mayoral race.:D It was just
a robo call, but still.........:)

[Grace]

Is the weather that cold in Conn.? No chance for warmer weather to melt
the snow? Don't they import power line workers from other states to help?
Most ststes do in an emergency.


Hey, guess what? I got a call from EX-President Bill Clinton this morning
urging me to vote for our Dem canidate in the Mayoral race.:D It was just
a robo call, but still.........:)

The snow is gone - the problem lies with the trees that fell under the weight of the snow, taking the power lines with them. As of this morning I read that there are still over 200,000 without power in Connecticut. I think they do have some out-of-state help.

Massachusetts has just under 40,000 still without power.

[lizbud]

Note to self: Don't miss the next debate if Rick Perry is in it.:D:D:D

[blue]

Note to self: Don't miss the next debate if Rick Perry is in it.:D:D:D

No kidding.

[RICHARD]

Why did the US govt have to get involved with the three idiots in Egypt that got tossed into the clink for allegedly throwing fire bombs at the police during a demonstration.

I saw an interview with one of the morons and his mom.

Right before he was arrested he was online posting messages that the protests in New York should be like the demos in Egypt....

Nice.

Stupid kids going abroad to study and then get arrested for participating in a demostration that they had no business being a part of.

--------------------------

I never feel sorry for any American, like the Iranian hikes, the jounrnalist captured in No Korea or these three that get tossed in jail for being somewhere the should not have been.

ugh.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

--------------------------

I never feel sorry for any American, like the Iranian hikes, the jounrnalist captured in No Korea or these three that get tossed in jail for being somewhere the should not have been.

ugh.

What can you expect when we have a government who stickes its noses into other peoples business? :love: When did we become the worlds mother?:love:

[Grace]

What can you expect when we have a government who stickes its noses into other peoples business? :love: When did we become the worlds mother?:love:

I love your response. Have been wondering the same thing :)

[Lady's Human]

What can you expect when we have a government who stickes its noses into other peoples business? :love: When did we become the worlds mother?:love:

We're not, we're the world's substitute gym teacher. If we were the mom, we could send the world to bed without dessert and they might actually listen once in a while.

[RICHARD]

We're not, we're the world's substitute gym teacher. If we were the mom, we could send the world to bed without dessert and they might actually listen once in a while.

Had I been 'naive' enough to get into a jam like that and the media came to her to get a story she would have said, "Quien lo mando?"

Translation?

"Who sent him (to the protest)?"

She would have them been bleeped because she would have had some choice words about me and my stupidity.

The mom of this kid was just as stupid as he is.

She made a comment about telling her kids something like, 'get out there and live life...'

------------------------------

Seems like the kid got punched and roughed up while he was in the Egyptian clink.


I hope he remembers his civil rights and asks for a Miranda the next time he gets picked up in a foreign country.

[lizbud]

I have a new respect for Ron Paul and Jon Huntsman for turning down
the invitation to attend the Donald's debate forum. :):)


http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/12/ron-paul-rejects-donald-trump-moderated-debate/

[RICHARD]

The Prez is going to have a press announcement about his role in getting rid of Kim Sung Il.

Thank goodness for American ingenuity....;)

[lizbud]

The Prez is going to have a press announcement about his role in getting rid of Kim Sung Il.

Thank goodness for American ingenuity....;)


No need for anybody to do anything. His gourmet diet did him in.

[lizbud]

28 Dec 2011 03:46 PM

Perryism Of The Day

“Every barrel of oil that comes out of those sands in Canada is a barrel of oil that we don’t have to buy from a foreign source,” - governor Rick Perry.

[Karen]

No need for anybody to do anything. His gourmet diet did him in.

His diabetes and drinking, as well as general disregard for his own health, did him in. Actions have consequences, even for a "beloved leader."

[phesina]

28 Dec 2011 03:46 PM

Perryism Of The Day

“Every barrel of oil that comes out of those sands in Canada is a barrel of oil that we don’t have to buy from a foreign source,” - governor Rick Perry.

I love it!

[Puckstop31]

28 Dec 2011 03:46 PM

Perryism Of The Day

“Every barrel of oil that comes out of those sands in Canada is a barrel of oil that we don’t have to buy from a foreign source,” - governor Rick Perry.

Liz....


Your party of choice is lucky to have you on their side. Yes, Rick Perry is a moron. Sorry, he ain't the guy who will destroy "President" Obama. Pick on the low hanging fruit, it rather suits you. LOL

Seriously... You want anyone with a brain cell to take you seriously and THIS is what you share? LOL

P.S. I can't wait for 2012. I can't wait to see how our Dear Leader runs his campaign. He has ZERO to run on. Lets hear how its all "the other guys" fault.

[Edwina's Secretary]

28 Dec 2011 03:46 PM

Perryism Of The Day

“Every barrel of oil that comes out of those sands in Canada is a barrel of oil that we don’t have to buy from a foreign source,” - governor Rick Perry.

:D:D:D Geography has never been their best subject!! (Nor history...but there is always math!)

[Bonny]

But Canada is like a foreign country today. You need a passport to enter into it. It use to be your driver license was enough.

As far as history goes do you all believe everything they taught you in school? I don't!

Just like you should not believe what comes out of the mouth of ANY politician. They all make promises they can't keep. It would be better if they promised nothing. The most important question I would have is can you balance your own check book?

The world is changing so fast my world map from National Geographic 2011 is already outdated. I have never heard of some of the countries that are now on the map.

Two to three times a day we keep getting poll calls. We will be glad when everyone packs up & moves on to the next state.

It is true when the president was here his speech consisted of putting the blame on everyone else. He has had plenty of time to take a hold of the reins.

[phesina]

But Canada is like a foreign country today. You need a passport to enter into it. It use to be your driver license was enough.


Canada IS a foreign country! :D

[Grace]

Canada IS a foreign country! :D

And always has been. That's what makes Perry's comment so stupid :D

Unless, of course, he might want to annex it into the United States. It wasn't that long ago he was talking about having Texas secede from the Union.

[caseysmom]

But Canada is like a foreign country today. You need a passport to enter into it. It use to be your driver license was enough.

As far as history goes do you all believe everything they taught you in school? I don't!

Just like you should not believe what comes out of the mouth of ANY politician. They all make promises they can't keep. It would be better if they promised nothing. The most important question I would have is can you balance your own check book?

The world is changing so fast my world map from National Geographic 2011 is already outdated. I have never heard of some of the countries that are now on the map.

Two to three times a day we keep getting poll calls. We will be glad when everyone packs up & moves on to the next state.

It is true when the president was here his speech consisted of putting the blame on everyone else. He has had plenty of time to take a hold of the reins.

Do you honestly think Canada is part of the US?

[RICHARD]

I went to Canada on Spring Break.

I visited that monument to the equator.

And I loved the penguins.

[Bonny]

Do you honestly think Canada is part of the US?

No, but we do share the continent of North America. :D

When I was grew up in Minnesota they were considered our good neighbors to the North. I don't think they would want any part of our screwed up democratic republic.

[caseysmom]

No, but we do share the continent of North America. :D

When I was grew up in Minnesota they were considered our good neighbors to the North. I don't think they would want any part of our screwed up democratic republic.

Okay so then it is a foreign country not just "like" a foreign country and always has been, I must be missing something.

[Bonny]

Okay so then it is a foreign country not just "like" a foreign country and always has been, I must be missing something.

Don't you have to have a passport to get into a foreign country? Passport is the key word here for me.

We never had to have a passport to drive into Canada & the same went for the Canadians when they would come down here. All you had to do is show your driver license.

If you are talking about the money exchange then that is a different story. Then I guess you would have to call them a foreign country?

[Karen]

Okay so then it is a foreign country not just "like" a foreign country and always has been, I must be missing something.

What she meant, I am sure, is that border crossing is more involved and difficult than it used to be, making it more obvious you are crossing into a whole 'nother country.

I am sure there are back rounds still where you can slip across without knowing it, but those aren't on maps!

[caseysmom]

What she meant, I am sure, is that border crossing is more involved and difficult than it used to be, making it more obvious you are crossing into a whole 'nother country.

I am sure there are back rounds still where you can slip across without knowing it, but those aren't on maps!

Well Canada is a foreign country to the U.S. no matter how you look at it.

[RICHARD]

I just looked at a map and if I take an eraser and rub out the 'border', that means we own Canada.

[Bonny]

Well Canada is a foreign country to the U.S. no matter how you look at it.

As far as Minnesotans look at it they are our good neighbors to the North & always will be. Not foreign to us. :D

Karen, They have a huge swath of land cut along the borders between Canada & the U.S. Only the wild critters can run or swim back & forth across the border. :D

I remember entry was your driver license, are you carrying any fire arms & ammo, how long will you be staying here? If they were suspicious of anything they would have you get out of your vehicle & proceed to pretty much take things apart looking for guns, drugs, etc., coming & going.

[Grace]

What she meant, I am sure, is that border crossing is more involved and difficult than it used to be, making it more obvious you are crossing into a whole 'nother country.

I am sure there are back rounds still where you can slip across without knowing it, but those aren't on maps!

There's a library in a small town in Derby, Vermont. You go in the front door from the Vermont - and you are in Quebec when checking out books.


DERBY LINE, VT -- The world-famous Haskell Free Library and Opera House on Caswell Avenue here is probably the only cultural institution on this planet with a split personality. That's because the U.S./Canadian border slices right through the Kenneth Baldwin International Reading Room.

You enter the lovely turn-of-the-century building in Vermont, but you check out the books -- your choice of English or French -- in Quebec. And, the librarian who assists you may be either a citizen of the United States or Canada, or both and, probably bilingual.

In this part of Vermont, many residents of Quebec's border communities were born in Newport, thus also qualifying for U.S. citizenship. When the 400-seat Opera House reopens later this year following extensive safety and handicapped-accessibility renovations, patrons of the performing arts will again sit in the United States and applaud performances upon a Canadian stage.
The building and its facilities are governed by a seven-member board of trustees -- four Americans and three Canadians -- who serve without pay. The library lives up to the "free" part in its name: there are no membership fees, and no loan charges are made for book, tapes, or videos. All art exhibits, discussion groups, and other library programs are also free. However, you must usually pay to attend Opera House performances.

[phesina]

Border crossing between Canada and the U.S. tightened up after 9/11.. at least for crossing into the U.S. from Canada (I don't know if Canada has also tightened up on letting us in there). It was just too easy for anyone to cross over before.

Here's information on this topic from Transport Canada: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZfbTlYpKYo :D

I have an "enhanced" driver's license which supposedly (I haven't tried it out yet) enables me to cross the border without a passport. There are a few other documents available that will also authorize Americans to do that.

[phesina]

There's a library in a small town in Derby, Vermont. You go in the front door from the Vermont - and you are in Quebec when checking out books.

Oh, that's really neat! I'd love to see that some day. Have you been there, Gretchen?

I read about something similar recently, maybe in the New York Times, that said there is a lake or river between Washington State and British Columbia with an island in the middle of it. Half the island is in the U.S. and half in Canada, and on the island you can wander from one country to the other and back without passing through any checkpoints. However, to GET to or from the island you have to go through the customs check at whichever side you're coming from or going to.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Mexico, with which we also share the North American continent, did not always require passport (or the new passport cards.) A drivers license, voter's i.d., or birth certificate was sufficient to cross the border until recently.

But it is a foreign country!

[Lady's Human]

Mexico, with which we also share the North American continent, did not alwaysd require passport (or the new passport cards.) A drivers license, voter's i.d., or birth certificate was sufficient to cross the border until recently.

But it is a foriegn country!

Of course it's a foreign country, they don't speak American there! Canada, however, is clearly mostly not foreign, as with the exception of Quebec, they speak American.

Okay, hoser?

[RICHARD]

Of course it's a foreign country, they don't speak American there! Canada, however, is clearly mostly not foreign, as with the exception of Quebec, they speak American.

Okay, hoser?




Take off! To the Great White North!
Take off! It's a beauty way to go.
Take off! To the Great White North!

http://www.musictory.com/music/Bob+%5Band%5D+Doug+Mckenzie/Take+Off

[Edwina's Secretary]

Of course it's a foreign country, they don't speak American there! Canada, however, is clearly mostly not foreign, as with the exception of Quebec, they speak American.

Okay, hoser?

What??? They speak "Mericin" there??? I don't think so...eh?

You callin' me a hoser? That anythin' like a Canuck?

[blue]

What??? They speak "Mericin" there??? I don't think so...eh?

You callin' me a hoser? That anythin' like a Canuck?


They dont speak the Queens English either toots. Besides you dont have to worry about getting kidnapped by Canadian Drug Lords when visiting America's Tuque, the way you have to worry about getting kidnapped by Messican Drug Lords when visiting America's Jock Strap.

Arent you a FIB anyway? Hoser.

[lizbud]

Less Government?

and I thought Repubs wanted less government intrusion in everyday life.

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/30105045/detail.html

[Grace]

And then there is the State of Virginia -


The Republican Party of Virginia will require all citizens of the state voting in the Republican primary on March 6, 2012 to sign a loyalty oath before being permitted to cast their votes.
Put plainly, anyone who shows up at the polling place must sign a form wherein he or she swears to support the Republican candidate who wins the nomination. Refusal to sign the pledge results in revocation of the right to vote in the Republican primary election.

source (http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/10380-va-primary-gop-requires-qloyalty-oathq-to-support-whoever-is-nominated)



I have a son in Virginia. He said he will not vote in the primary if this is in effect.

[Karen]

And then there is the State of Virginia -



source (http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/10380-va-primary-gop-requires-qloyalty-oathq-to-support-whoever-is-nominated)



I have a son in Virginia. He said he will not vote in the primary if this is in effect.

That seems completely unConstitutional! I cannot believe that could be at all binding, considering one of the principles of American Democracy is the secret ballot - duh!

[momoffuzzyfaces]

And yet a little thing like asking for a photo ID when one resisters to vote is being tossed out by some courts in the US!!! :rolleyes:

[Edwina's Secretary]

And then there is the State of Virginia -



source (http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/10380-va-primary-gop-requires-qloyalty-oathq-to-support-whoever-is-nominated)



I have a son in Virginia. He said he will not vote in the primary if this is in effect.

What is the punishment if you sign the "loyalty pledge" and then do not support the winner? Do they pull out all your fingernails, make you wear a scarlet letter?

Of course, they are the party of liberty and freedom...:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Lady's Human]

Congratulations to the entire field of the Republican primaries.

You couldn't have self-destructed more completely had it been planned.

5 candidates who rail against judicial activism and overreach sue to get on the ballot in VA.

Mitt, you're a used car salesman in a nice suit.

Ron Paul.....well........frankly, your foreign policy concepts scare the hell out of me.

I'll say it again.....

We need an additional choice on every ballot: None of the above.

If none of the above wins, then the pool gets flushed and you start over.

[phesina]

Congratulations to the entire field of the Republican primaries.

You couldn't have self-destructed more completely had it been planned.

5 candidates who rail against judicial activism and overreach sue to get on the ballot in VA.

Mitt, you're a used car salesman in a nice suit.

Ron Paul.....well........frankly, your foreign policy concepts scare the hell out of me.

I'll say it again.....

We need an additional choice on every ballot: None of the above.

If none of the above wins, then the pool gets flushed and you start over.

Now that sounds like a good idea to me.

Happy New Year!

[Lady's Human]

Okay, I dated myself somewhat tonight on another forum....

Someone started a thread asking how you prep quail.....

My answer?

Give him spelling lessons and don't let him stray from the teleprompter.

My answer went over most of their heads....then I realized I was dealing mainly with 20 somethings.

[Karen]

Hee hee! Yes, I have to check my cultural references from time to time, to fit the age of the audience!

Now, do we really really really have to listen to politics on the radio ad nauseum from now until November? Really? I could seriously do without constant dissection of the minutiae of the campaigns, and movements in the polls by one or two points, I really could!

[Bonny]

Hee hee! Yes, I have to check my cultural references from time to time, to fit the age of the audience!

Now, do we really really really have to listen to politics on the radio ad nauseum from now until November? Really? I could seriously do without constant dissection of the minutiae of the campaigns, and movements in the polls by one or two points, I really could!

We've had enough nausea here with poll phone calls & the primary. At least 8 phone calls a day. It is worse then tell a marketers. I feel for the people in NH because they are headed your way. If you have a land phone be prepared for the insanity. :mad:

[Edwina's Secretary]

Okay, I dated myself somewhat tonight on another forum....

Someone started a thread asking how you prep quail.....

My answer?

Give him spelling lessons and don't let him stray from the teleprompter.

My answer went over most of their heads....then I realized I was dealing mainly with 20 somethings.

Very droll and better than your "hoser."

(I looked it up and...I rarely drink beer and gave up on ice hockey when it stopped being a sport and became an excuse for grown men to brawl...:p)

[lizbud]

Speaking of Quail, I met someone recently who was with him as he
prepared to give a speech. An aide handed him a copy of highlighted
points of the talk & Quail held the paper 2 inches from his face to be
able to read it. He's blind as a bat, but is to vain for glasses.:)

His poor eyesight explains a lot. Not everything, but a lot.:)

[Grace]

So I'm reading an article on Politico, and come across this -


With a clear opportunity to win the gold medal of American politics — knocking off an incumbent president — Republicans produced a field of dwarves.


I love it - wish I were clever enough to write like that :D

[lizbud]

So not a ooops, McCain was right the first time.:) Is this what is called
a freudian slip? :D

http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_t2#/video/politics/2012/01/06/sot-mccain-romney-obama-flub.cnn

[RICHARD]

Props to Barack for playing politics and rescue missions at the same time.

[cassiesmom]

"America is back" -- Pres. Obama

Really? Sure doesn't feel like it to me. I've seen my property value almost double and then return to exactly where it was when I bought it. Everything costs more, gasoline, milk, my health insurance. And I'm getting less. I'm paying the same price for ice cream and getting 1 1/2 quarts instead of half a gallon. Lots of people are still unemployed. Lots of people can't get the health care they need. America will be back when people are working and the economy is robust again.

Also -- I don't think it is right that in an election year the current President uses the State of the Union address as a campaign speech. That is not the purpose of the address.

Thanks for letting me rant!

[pomtzu]

Agreed - 100+%

[Karen]

If you look back in recent history, every sitting President who was up for reelection used the State of the Union for that purpose. This is nothing new.

[lizbud]

If you look back in recent history, every sitting President who was up for reelection used the State of the Union for that purpose. This is nothing new.



Yes,..........." it was ever thus" besides I'm a glass half full sort of person, or I try to be.:) We already know the bad stuff
I want to hear about the future, perferably the good stuff.

[kuhio98]

"America is back" -- Pres. Obama

Really? Sure doesn't feel like it to me. I've seen my property value almost double and then return to exactly where it was when I bought it. Everything costs more, gasoline, milk, my health insurance. And I'm getting less. I'm paying the same price for ice cream and getting 1 1/2 quarts instead of half a gallon. Lots of people are still unemployed. Lots of people can't get the health care they need. America will be back when people are working and the economy is robust again.

Also -- I don't think it is right that in an election year the current President uses the State of the Union address as a campaign speech. That is not the purpose of the address.

Thanks for letting me rant!

100% agree also. The current administration doesn't get it. They have no plan -- except to recycle ideas that have failed before. All my Hope for Change has disappeared. My faith is gone also.

It occured to me during the last election -- Is this the best we've got? I couldn't get excited about any of the candidates last time, and I'm feeling the same way these days.

[Karen]

I merged the State of the Union thread into this one, as of course, it's all Politics!

[Randi]

OK, I admit I don't know much about US politics, but my impression of B. Obama is very positive - the American people who live here also seem to prefer him. :) It seems a lot of you don't like him. Do you think another president would have done better? In the light of the financial crisis (which is not B. Obama's fault, and that is an entirely different discussion), I think the outcome could have been far worse. At least B. Obama is trying to do something for the less wealthy people and he withdrew the troops from Iraq.

Can you imagine what would have happened if any of these other ignorant candidates had made it into politics! I think you got a good deal with B. Obama. :) If only we were so lucky here! :p