Terri Schiavo - so sad :(

[Luvin Labs]

This is being discussed on several other boards I frequent, I found a post from someone that I wholeheartedly agree with so I've shamelessly c/p this to here:

The parents have successfully made this guy out to look horrible, and have done a very good job at a smear campaign.. I do find it disturbing to watch interviews with the mother where she's asked if she knew Terri's wishes, and she says, "No". (CNN Larry King Live Interview, 9/24/2004) She said she just wanted to take care of her for the rest of her life. Realistically, Terri would outlive her mother, but what happens if her mother's health fails or if she passes away?

Next, her husband is actually an Emergency Medicine Nurse with a hospital in the area..

With all these stories of abuse, and that Michael gave Doctors money to say his wife is in a persistent vegetative state, etc are all BS.. This case has been through all of the courts MULTIPLE times over the past 10 years, and only a small percentage sided with the family. The family, grasping for straws, got a nurse to testify in the trial in 96 that she was a nurse for Terri and that she was alert and trying to communicate, etc. And that's what the family takes as THE TRUTH, however, her testimony was thrown out because she didn't come forward at the first trial, and only came forward after being let go from the hospice facility.

Now, trying to look at this from the family's side, I can understand a bit. Here's a family that I believe genuinely loves their daughter, and they see her smile once in a while, and blink and once in a while follow a shiny object with her eyes, sort of. So, they translate this into someone being behind those eyes, their daughter and they think that she will get better with therapy that they say isn't being done. They have doctors across the country sending them letters saying that she can talk but she just needs some help. However, independent doctors that have actually met with her and done work with her have said quite the opposite. In the early 90's Michael had taken her out to California to do an experimental surgery that had helped a small amount with people in less severe situations, it was inserting a stimulus in the brain. Most people wore for 3 months with some results, she wore it for 1 year with no results whatsoever.

Also, you should check out the brain scans that they had done in the mid 90's of her brain. Basically, the entire half of the rear has all deteriorated because of her lack of oxygen as well as spinal fluid eating away at it. However, she still isn't considered brain dead, just not cognizant.

her doctors, both hired by her husband and also court ordered independent doctors have said that she is in a persistent vegetative state, AKA, hopeless, and her guardian, her husband, has said that her wish is to not be on these machines that keep her alive

she was Bulimic (sp?), but as you may know for women it's a very secretive thing, even the closest people to them don't know it's going on... Even her friends said that she seemed to be eating fine, and seemed to actually eat quite a bit before the injury. Also, this has been to court MANY times, and this notion has been thrown out every time as there is no evidence and you can not hold someone to what you think they might have done by whatever prejudices you have for the situation.

If Terri really didn't want to be kept alive by any machines at all, then her family has kept her alive for 15 YEARS against her wishes. I wouldn't want video of me plastered all over every TV station showing my family having to hold my head up and me sort of glaring at a balloon and flashing lights not able to move and in a clenched position. For me, it's a quality of life issue, if I know that I wouldn't come out of it, and would be bed ridden forever, and am not actively talking and need machines to help me live, I wouldn't want to be kept alive.

Now,

Michael also said that HE WOULD NOT GAIN ANYTHING from her death at all. That has been her family saying that. Her family offered him $700k to relinquish guardianship and divorce her 2 years ago, he declined.. He has offered that if/when she passes to have them do a full audit of everything if they choose to prove to them that he is not going to get any money out of this at all.. The family is trying to make him out to be this bad guy that just wants to kill his wife to get insurance money and/or settlement money..

Interviews were done for both sides on Larry King... For Michael his Lawyer sat there with document after document and case after case of proof, her family sat there just talking about what they feel and not having anything to back it up at all, their lawyer sat there rather quietly..

The parents need to learn to let go.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

If inmates on death row were denied food and water it would be considered "cruel and unusual punishment".
Seems to me, it should be considered the same for Terri, or any human.
There has to be a better way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just because doctors don't THINK a person in this condition feels anything by being starved, doesn't make it right. They don't really know! They've not been through it themselves.

As for the parents needing to learn to let go, that's easier said than done if it's your child or kin that you love with all your heart.

[Samantha Puppy]

Originally posted by Luvin Labs

Michael also said that HE WOULD NOT GAIN ANYTHING from her death at all.

Then why not just divorce her? Principle? That's just spiting her family. The way I see it, he's moved on to greener pastures. He has a girlfriend and two illegitimate children. (Don't even get me started on the whole "'Til death do us part" thing.) If he stands to gain nothing, divorce would be a very simple way out.

I find it repulsive she is being allowed to starve to death. Animals in government facilities (animal shelters, etc.) aren't permitted to starve to death, but we will let a fellow human being suffer that fate? I don't think so.

This truly does show how very important a living will is, if nothing else. This whole debacle has made me sit down with my husband and parents and share my wishes with them so, God forbid, if anything like this were ever to happen to me they'd at least know what my wishes were.

[Logan]

Simply said, it seems to me that if there is any doubt, then they should ere on the side of life, and there appears to be much doubt.

Samantha Puppy, I agree with you whole heartedly on everything you said.

[Luvin Labs]

Originally posted by Samantha Puppy
Then why not just divorce her?

Because he wants to see her wishes carried out. And obviously the courts (fifteen years of dealing with courts, evidence and reports) have decided in her and her husbands favor.

HOW do you know she is suffering with the feeding tube removed? We dunno. You dunno. I dunno.

the deterioration of Terri's brain left her without thoughts or feelings, that the damage is irreversible, and that Terri's life-like appearance is merely the result of brain stem activity -- basically involuntary reflexes we all have.

An independent doctor hired by the court reached the same conclusions.

From this quote, I really don't think we are 'killing her' since there are no thoughts or feelings... i.e. she isn't feeling anything because that part of her brain is not there.

Here's another site about this case:

http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/infopage.html

[momoffuzzyfaces]

If I were her parents, I'd be in her room with water and an eye dropper just to see if I could get some water down her. They don't know that she can't swallow.

Choking to death would be no worse than starving to death.

No they don't know for sure she's suffering without the feeding tube but THEY DON'T KNOW SHE ISN'T either!

[Luvin Labs]

Originally posted by momoffuzzyfaces
They don't know that she can't swallow.

Actually, they've known for YEARS that she cannot swallow.

http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/trialctorder0300.pdf

Page two, first full paragraph.

Can't c/p since its adobe.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Originally posted by Luvin Labs
Actually, they've known for YEARS that she cannot swallow.

http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/trialctorder0300.pdf

Page two, first full paragraph.

Can't c/p since its adobe.

Well, no wonder everyone is so confused. The doctors don't even agree.

One of the ones treating her said on Fox this morning that they have not done a test on her to see if she could swallow for years.

I'd still give it a go. At this point there's not much to lose and who knows?

[Luvin Labs]

True, it can't hurt just to try it again, who knows maybe she actually can now...

won't hurt just to try, I mean if it means proving she can or cannot, then it'll be current info/tests and hopefully help close this case

[joycenalex]

i have a living will, i've had it for many years. my biological family lives in another state, my family of choice lives here in ohio. i've worked in health care for 20 years, and i'm very very clear under no circumstances do i want a feeding tube inserted, if there is no meaningful chance of recovery. my primary physician has a copy of the directives, and i've looked her right in the face,every year since i had the living will done and reiterated, no tubes, dnr for me. my coworkers know dnr, no tubes. the doctors i work with, one that i love, a brilliant neuroradiologist, another a very very good radiologist know that i don't want tubes and want to be dnr. i've told as many people as i possibly can, do not tube me, i'm dnr. all of pet talk now knows, no tubes, dnr. may i never have to use it, amen. if i were found unconscious somewhere, the paramedics and er team would have to tube me, that is there job, to keep my human form alive, under all costs, but when i'm identified, by my telling so many people my wishes, those tubes can be legally removed.
this whole thing is sad beyond belief. i ache for her husband and her biological family. i am mightly pis#$d off at the politicans in florida and washington for having the shameless nerve to insert themselves into a private matter for their own political ends. how disgusting. this event is private and not at all the business of the florida legislature, floridia gov,. the us congress and the white house . terri is not a toy. this is wrong.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud

" O K, federal government, get out of my bed,

So you enjoy the company of Uncle Sam in YOUR bed every April 15th too????

To expand on this topic a bit more....

Starving a person to death is a fricking crime...

Now, as pet people on this site what do we do when we find our pets suffering or living a life that has no quality to it????


This is not an easy question to answer...we do have to take measures that will insure us a peaceful trip to the RB....


Yeah, it sucks to see all this politicos hamming it up for the voters and even sadder to see it as the topic 'du jour' in the media..

[Logan]

Richard, I rarely disagree with you, but I do this time.......I only refer to my earlier post regarding ering on the side of life, since there are so many questions. The whole thing makes me sad, and yes, I feel it is murder.........

[Edwina's Secretary]

And yet....many of the same politicians who are calling for the sanctity of life...and "we don't know for sure" are all for the death sentence. We don't know for sure about many who are on death row. How many how been found to be innocent of the crime for which they were convicted??? How many people have been put to death "incorrectly"??? Why are these politicians who are so concerned about life not INSISTING on a moritorium on the death penalty until we are sure??? Why is one life more valuable than another???

[chelsea]

I think it is a extremely selfish thing the parents are doing, let Terri have some peace from this Earth. She has no quality of life, put yourself in Terri's place, really just think about it and answer me this question... Would you want to spend 15 or more years like she has, would you really?? I know that I would NOT.

As for the government getting involved, it sickens me for several reasons. First and fore most if they really believed what they claimed about erring with the side of life then why didn't they get involved in the case in Texas??
http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/metropolitan/3084934

[Pam]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
And yet....many of the same politicians who are calling for the sanctity of life...and "we don't know for sure" are all for the death sentence. We don't know for sure about many who are on death row. How many how been found to be innocent of the crime for which they were convicted??? How many people have been put to death "incorrectly"??? Why are these politicians who are so concerned about life not INSISTING on a moritorium on the death penalty until we are sure??? Why is one life more valuable than another???

Sara, Alan Dershowitz was on GMA this morning and addressed this as it relates to both sides. He brought up your point but also said that many of those who are crying to do away with the death penalty are also first in line to end Terri's life. He said both sides have their agenda and that is the bottom line.

This poor woman was not convicted of a crime. She is not even remotely a criminal. She is an innocent person who is being allowed to starve to death. Though others have used this word barbaric I can't think of anything that so appropriately describes what is going on.