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[carole]

I just wanted to add I suffer from Social Phobia, have done all my life, when I was young I did not even want to go to partys, but drinking sure relaxed me and made it possible. I actually hide it very well, even to this day, I choose no longer to drink, so that I can socialise, I just DON'T want to do that anymore.

As a young child, we used to go for a sunday drive and then My parents would say now go in the shop and get an ice cream, my sister and I would argue about who was going to get it, she probably just could not be bothered, but for me it was painful to even do that, I hated just going in front of everyone and asking for it, I would have rather done without the ice cream.

It has been the most difficult thing in my life, as there is very little understanding, I believe it is something you are born with, my mother is exactly the same if not worse.

I have tried all my life to socialise, to please other people, and it has been traumatic for me, now I just won't put myself through this ordeal anymore. I loathe parties and get togethers, and yes part of it does come down to a low self esteem.

karen I have to respectfully disagree with you, i donot believe there is any medication that magically will make this disappear, and I for one would not take it, I just don't feel I should have to take something so that I can enjoy a party, it is something you learn to live with ,even though it is hard and there is very little understanding or empathy from anyone,(they think you are strange or stand-offish the only time it really pains me, is for my partner, who has taken years to deal with it, and finally has, but he wants to take me to xmas parties etc, and now has become a bit of a recluse like me, that does not make me happy.

[leslie flenner]

I don't think anyone was trying to say there is a magical medication regarding social phobias. I am on an anti-depressent and it doesn't make me more inclined to join in those kind of activities (I avoid them). But it makes me less likely to go into a severe depression as sirrahbed talked about before. That's all.
As I grew up, social events were there but i don't remember really enjoying them. I felt shy, stupid, ugly- you name it. Even though I wasn't stupid or ugly. And to this day (I'm in my 40's) I am extrememly uncomfortable in social gatherings. There were/are no family gatherings for me- so that's probably why I'm not acclimated- there was never a "family" per say. It's been a problem with my relationships all my life. I don't want to go to the holiday dinners, weddings etc (total ick and panic).
I don't want to be alone all my life- but that is where things are headed. You are sad that your husband has "become a recluse". Is he sad about that? If not, well I don't know what to say! I was going to say be glad but that is not the right solution as one can't just switch emotions like a switch and it is so much more complicated than what you are saying here...

[sirrahbed]

I also do not believe anyone should feel odd or like they have to go on medication because of a social anxiety. That is, unless it is something extreme and debilitating. That is the fine line I talked about before. Being shy and withdrawn (now known as *social anxiety* and I hate all those labels!) CAN be part of who we are and that should not be something with a label. BUT there are times when it IS a disorder. Gets complicated doesn't it?? Another reason I am glad to see more people talking about this stuff!!

Sometimes I enjoy getting out with people, but I tend to be withdrawn most of the time. I think it is normal for my personality. I have never been a social butterfly. When I was in my major episodes, however, I carried it to a terrible extreme. I would not even leave my room. The few times I did go to a store, I left my cart and ran to the car. I tried church and ran out to hide. So, I have to keep watch for these warning signs. Now, even when I am FINE, I am slightly withdrawn. It is ME and it is OK. No pill will make me different That said - other people have a phobia so debilitating and extreme that they cannot function normally without some medical help and it is wonderful that a bit of chemical change enamble them to live their lives again! Sometimes, it mat only take a few months or years to get back to normal, others may need to medicate always. NO BIG DEAL.

I like to use famous peole as examples. THE have the same fears phobias and disorders as everyone else - to all degrees. Some over come with medication and help. Try entering 'famous people mental illness' into google and you may be surprised!

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Hello again to Leslie and Cubby and also to others who have responded so kindly to my thread. I am back, I have been out of town for a mini-vacation at my sister-in-law's house in Clarksville, TN. She just got her new swimming pool in and I went swimming for the first time in about two years! My husband and I played like children and we really had a blast. Of course we had a kind friend to come in and feed water and chat with the critters each day. It was so good to get away and enjoy ourselves with out the worries and usual woes. We played cards until about one in the morning. We watched several movies that are fairly new and even had a strawberry daiquiri one night while we were away. My son, Blake, age 14 had fun with our 16 year old nephew, John. They had lots of fun too. Leslie, you were right about the Zoloft not being right to treat bipolar disorder, I know that anti-depressants tend to cause the manic part of this illness more profound. I just have had experiences with psychiatrists when they put me on bad drugs and I became very suicidal, I am terriified of the meds that may help me attain a balance, so I try to make the best of the Zoloft and my family doctor. Cubby, thank you for sharing your story, I surely felt your fustrations, the overwhelmed feeling that I know you felt with so much responsibility at such a young and tender age, and the lonliness that you felt though you were surrounded by people whom you loved and who were dependent on you for their very life. I am glad you talked about it and got it off your chest-I had my own struggles at that age also, but I never had all of those heavy responsibilities you did when you were so young. I had to cry when I read your story. You are a very strong woman, and you should be proeud of all you were to your family. I am in deep hopes that you have found some comfort and happiness, and that you are now being taken care of to some extent. May God Bless you, and also the rest of you, my friends at PT.

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Hello, thanks for the encouragement and letting me know it is okay to feel the way I have been feeling. I will go and look up the famous people you spoke of, that is very interesting. I guess I have a pretty shy nature, but I am also in- tuned to when I am isolating. When friends call and I screen their calls. I will keep my phone on only because my children may need me and I want them to bee able to reach me, or my parents or other relatives may need me in case of a serious illness or something. But, then I tend to ignore calls from dear friends, that coould very well get sick too. When I answer calls from relatives that I worry may have an emergency and find they have just called to check on me or just want to chat, I make up excuses. I lock the doors, avoid phone calls that I know deep inside I should take. I close my blinds and curtins and don't go anywhere for days or even a week and only go out when I absolutely have to. I feel I am being very selfish, which that part is not me. I have always placed friends and family before myself. But anyway, I am okay at the moment and thought of you guys at PT while I was away the last few days and thought, "Wouldn't they be proud of me now?" I was out and being my normal old self, laughing and smiling and talking so much that I am sure they were wondering when I was going to hush. lol It was all really therapuetic for me. Thanks a bunch to you all!

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Hi carole. Though I have bipolar disorder and that may be quite different, the social part, about wanting to avoid it at all costs, even if it meant doing without something you would really like to have, sounds very familiar to me as, I have had bouts with this too. Thanks so much for sharing with us so sincerely. I appreciate the input of you all. It looks as if I have became very rich in friends, right here at PT. God bless you. I pray that you are having an easier time as time goes on and you have had to deal with this painful problem for so long. I wish you the best of everything.

[moosmom]

I am grateful for Paxil. As I said before, it saved my life.

My Dad, who I believe I inherited my depression from, never got help for his depression. Instead, he chose to drink, 24/7. He became a recluse toward the end of his life, always telling me how much he loved my Mom and my stepmother, and was just waiting to "cruise on outta here". His choice of treatment caused him to lose out on his only grandchild's life. But, that was HIS choice.

My choice was therapy and medication. I never regret nor do I justify my choice to ignorant people who try to reason with me that the drugs I take are bad, and that I should try going "cold turkey". Believe me, I've tried. It almost cost me my life.

Until those people (no one on PT) have walked a mile in my shoes, they should keep their thoughts to themselves.

Debbie,

I feel my face redden when they tell me to stand back because some of my meds are class 3-controled and come from the vault - "uh could you shout that a little louder please - some people on the other side of the room didn't hear"

I was ROFLMAO!!! Not at you. It reminded me of the time I went to the drugstore to buy "personal care" items and the clerk at the counter announced it over the PA system!!!

[carole]

Anathiona, thanks for our kind words of understanding and support that mean't alot to me.

Yes Medication sure can help in certain situations, but if it is just Social Phobia you are suffering from, I personally don't believe so, hey I only need a couple of drinks and I then become very social lol, but I will no longer do that to myself.

I often wish to be like others, when they get an invite, they are thrilled and really looking forward to the event, me I dread it, loose sleep over it, trying to find ways to get out of it, and feel sick to the stomach, even my own Niece"s wedding was like this big ordeal to me, but the best thing that happened was it turned out to be the best social event I have ever been to, I really enjoyed myself and did not feel bad at all, for the first time ever in my life., but yes I stay away from things like it was the dreaded plague, because that is how it feels to me.

I suppose if there was indeed a magic pill with no side effects, I would be tempted to take it, but that is highly unlikely.

One always feels enormous amount of guilt, letting friends and family down, especially my partner, who now does not go rather than go alone without me, this is what i was trying to say Leslie, and you are right it is very complicated, and in the past it caused many problems in my relationship, because he just did not get it, he thought I just picked and chose what I wanted to go to, it has taken years, but he now is very understanding, he has gotten used to it I suppose and accepted the way I am, and that I really cannot help it.

Despite this , yes I do have friends, and good ones at that, I have always chosen to have only a few, not a lot, but they generally tend to be good loyal ones, I have explained to them how I am, and they seem to be ok with it, and just like me anyhow, but like I said they are GOOD FRIENDS.

Anyway enough about me, I DON'T want to turn this into being about ME, just wanted people to have a better understanding of what Social Phobia is like and the impact it has on our lives and our loved ones,. that is what is really important to me, and this thread has given me the opportunity, to express this to each and everyone of you, I am grateful for being able to do this in such a public way, its like everything else educating people, is the only way to better understanding.

So thanks for bearing with me on this subject so close to my heart., it was not my intention to hi-jack this thread or change the subject in anyway, but I saw this as the perfect thread to help people to understand me and others like me,hopefully it will give people something to think about, who knows you may know someone who sounds just like this and often thought they were snobbish or whatever and now you will have some empathy for them, heres hoping.

PS one thing I must add PLEASE NEVER put all people with Social Phobia in the same category, we are all different, what bothers one , may not another, and every situation is different. THANKS.

[leslie flenner]

You reminded me of a sad fact in my life. I was in a relationship for 10 years. Every year I was invited to my partner's family events: Thanksgiving, Christmas, birthdays, etc. I never once went. In hindsight, I guess I regret it. But never having had a family myself really (just me and mom), I have always felt wierd about these things. I (unrealistically) feel like one might feel eating alone in a resteraunt or going to a movie alone, ie, everyone is probably whispering, "why would she be out alone, she must not have any friends". At other's family gatherings, I imagined that they "KNEW" I was uncomfortable, awkward, gangly, wallflower, a girl with no friends or family (even though I have plenty of friends)- i image others looking at me like someone who might not- it's a very strange and unrealistic perspective but it operated my direction all my life.

[carole]

I sure understand what you are saying there Leslie, its amazing what we conjure up in our minds.

I forced myself to attend social gatherings with my husbands family, it was very difficult, because they were real party type people and if I were very honest, we were like miles apart, very different in many ways, things have changed, its a very long story, but my husband ended up dis-owning all his family(nothing to do with me) and even though I feel sadness for him, there was a huge relief for me, no more social events, that I felt extremely uncomfortable with., its funny how things have a way of working themselves out.

[leslie flenner]

My mind plays tricks on me all the time when I am alone! (I have left stores because the lines are long and I feel a sweat coming on- I figure i better leave because I MIGHT have a panic attack- rather than just relax and think about something else!) Or, lots of times in the past (not for a couple of years now) I would get partway to work and then over several minutes convince myself that i didn't unplug the coffee pot- simply because I couldn't remember if I did or not. Well, Now I use a melita coffee pot!! Fixed that problem but sometimes, if i leave the house too fast, I will worry about what I didn't do that could cause a fire. It's totally insane but nevertheless there. I recently had to join co-workers for a dinner out. I spent the entire time working on a newspaper crossword puzzle while everyone else drank and got silly. It was ok- I was in a compatition with another co-worker to finish the puzzle first- (which I did!) No one minded so it was a very ok evening!

[sirrahbed]

I have been thinking about this social anxiety/phobia part of the discussion and realize there are so many degrees of it and that I probably have more of it than I would *like* to have at times. Like anathiona and Carole, I seldom go anywhere and there are times when I can go for days or weeks not answering the phone or door, drawing my curtains, etc. My hubby may want to go out, but either goes somewhere alone (to church, the grocery store, watches a video instead of going to a movie) because I choose to remain at home - and I sometimes feel very badly that his life has adapted to mine in these ways. If I think about it too much, I can become very depressed about it and feel like I am not worth very much! But, we try to strike a balance. But much of this is pressure I put on myself and feel from society's expectations of what "normal" is. Perhaps my life IS normal for ME, at least at this time.

BTW, anathiona - I AM very proud of you for getting out with your hubby and son - getting away from the house, playing like a child and for hearing of your laughter!! That is wonderful that you were able to d this and that you enjoyed it!! It sounds as if it made you feel good and so it was a victory

leslie - just read what you posted as I was writing this and so I can add a bit more because I relate to what you have written also. I am awkward in large groups and family gatherings with my husband. I feel self-conscious and as if I am a bug under a microscope. My original family never had "family" things either. Most of the time, I can *act* normally, but inside I am terrified and very ill at ease and always have been. Even when I am FINE, I feel this way - my counselor tells me that most people do! that we all wear masks...I wonder??? When I was working at my last job - I was assistant to the director of a non-profit agency and had a good bit of responsibility and I definitely wore a mask that I put on every day along with my work clothes and make-up. My co-workers *saw* me as so cool, smart and efficient. My boss trusted me with his trustees and to stand in for him at agency meetings. I acted confident! When I left work each day - walking to the car...driving home...I felt the mask crack..and I usually cried. I only held the job for less than two years and my boss was very bewildered when I decided to leave! Before that I taught school and worked as an RN, but never very long for the same reasons - no confidence!! I was happiest at home with my children and now with my kitties. Maybe I am socially inept or maybe I am naturally shy - I really wonder? There was a time when I had a circle of close friends and a life that seemed normal - I was fun and funny, laughed a lot. I still like to laugh!! Those friends betrayed me badly, though! Maybe the PTSD is finally gaining the best of me?? I never really understood what it was within me until some events several years ago revived very old wounds and I was re-victimized in a terrible, horrible way.

I am going on too long - did not want this thread to be about *me* either. Hope it continues to be one of sharing and encouragement that shows many of us that we are really not so different from one another, and there are many ways to cope with what life brings to us.

[carole]

I think a lot of us with this problem are great actresses, and indeed could win a grammy for our efforts, it suprises people when I share with them how I really am.

One of my fav things to do is going to the movies, you ask why? because you are in the dark, I feel totally relaxed, I am good on the telephone as well, it is all about the non-face to face stuff.

I love shopping and that is my real social event, my hubby often asks did I see anyone i know, and I say NO and thats the way I like it, I like to be amongst the crowd, anonymous.

Sirrahbed I can relate to the closing of the curtains, not answering the telephone, but that is usually just on a down day, and let us face it we all have them, but i like to close off from the world and its day to day pressures sometimes, and it helps too.

The strange thing is sometimes I am really better off in a large crowd, other times I feel better in a smaller crowd with people I know, it all depends on how I am feeling at the time, and for others this part of it , is hard to understand, even for me, and probably why hubby thought i just picked and chose my events to attend, but I didn't it all depended on how my coping mechanisms were working at the time.

PS I never knew there was such a thing as a shy American lol, just joking.

[leslie flenner]

This will not be all about you by your telling what happened a few years ago that triggered the original events in your mind (or did I misunderstand?). It is about everyone who has had to deal with trauma and for many, didn't even know they were dealing with trauma until something happened that triggered a response! You don't have to share if you aren't up to it but I'll bet anything that a bunch of pters went through same or similar traumas- remember, the laws were not in the 50's and 60's as they are today- by any means. And in fact- the first case of child abuse (I'm not saying this is your trauma) that put it in the books as a real illegal thing to do- did not happen till 65- and even then the family was considered to be in the right so to speak.. I believe the book is called "On Bear Mountain" (or Lake- I used to own it- it boggled my mind!

[sirrahbed]

I don't really think the facts are that important - but rather how I and others are responding and dealing with the outcome but I will share the *nutshell* version. I come from a strict military family and grew up in a state of constant fear in a home I can only recall as being a battlefield/warzone because I have so few memories of it - mostly conveniently forgotten I suppose. At an age I do not recall, but it was very young - perhaps 3-4, I was sexually assaulted/abused by someone in a uniform, a professional I believe - while I was hospitalized. I was often hospitalized. My parents either did not believe me, did not understand what I tried to tell them, or were fearful of rocking the boat, etc. Life in the military was strict in the 50's.

As an adult I went for counseling to my pastor for an unknown nagging depression and anxiety. After a 12 year close counseling relationship in which I trusted and looked to him as a father, he sexually assaulted/exploited/abused me. Another abuse by a professional - thus reliving the same betrayal of trust I had hidden away for so many years and now - the ptsd. It happened in 1999 and I was an adult! I buried the secret of the abuse for over a year but I disintegrated. Unless it has hit home, it is hard to understand how it can happen but it does. It did to me. I am like one of the statistics you hear about in the news with the Catholic Church and so many others. Some say those people are lying or exagerating - I can say we are finally finding the bravery to find our voice that has been stunned and shamed into silence.

Things like 9/11, the war against terrorism, the daily news - these things are very triggering for anyone with ptsd - as well as depression and I would imagine a variety of illnesses. It is so very scary to not feel safe, to feel that fear rising - for a real reason of course but exagerated greatly from the ptsd and the symptoms caused by the disorder. Too many days of sleeplessness and withdrawal that might be normal in one situation - could possibly lead to another major depressive episode (MDE) and so I am vigilant and watchful!

But, I also have a life! This weekend, I watched all three Lord of the Rings movies I had never done this before because I thought they were silly but I have suddenly become a fan. I studied up all the characters and now have Middle Earth on my desktop I enjoyed watching the kitties lounging on the patio, took pictures and posted to Cat General and spent hours admiring the other kitties there and posting - I am addicted and *know* most of the regulars and their kitties like my own!! Yesterday I went to a senior's home to work on her computer and give her a few lessons. Hubby and I do "consulting" for seniors only and for donations only. He does the hardware and I do the software and teaching. This job I was paid with an old set of dishes Maybe a boring weird life by another's standards but it is mine! I wrote numerous e-mails and posts to Internet friends - mostly PT people I have never met but whom I certainly consider genuine friends! One I am concerned about in the mid-east and another who has other worries. I love to encourage where I am able! I am also politically motivated and write numerous letters about things I am concerned about and badger my lawmakers about laws I want changed.

See? I am a REGULAR person. .