Very low RBC count - feedback anyone please?

[TopCat3]

Hello folks
I hope you're all going along well and your kitties too.
It's been a while since I've been on here. I've had a lot happening in my life and taking care of Cleo is pretty full on too. I do duck in from time to time to see the daily pets and read but don't have much time to post. However I wanted to ask for some input if I may please.

Cleo, my renal-impaired cat, was off colour and off her food last weekend. Took her to vet and had bloods checked. PCV very low and vet suggested injections of erythropoetin as her kidneys are evidently no longer producing this hormone to promote RBC formation from bone marrow.

Apparently according to what I have read, an iron supplement should also be given as a building block of the RBCs (haemoglobin formation). Vet said he would try to search one out, hasn't got back to me yet. Another article I read said that iron supplements could easily create toxic reaction in cats. No-one I have spoken to (pet supplies, various vets) seems to know what iron supplement is available for cats.

I have yet to speak to the other vet in the practice who had her own cat on this hormone supplement for low RBC count to see what she did. She's not in until Wednesday though.

Cleo seems a good deal better and is eating more, however I'm still a bit worried. Does anyone have any personal experience or information they can share, please, about the need for the iron or any available supplement?(Bearing in mind I'm in Australia)

Thanks
TopCat3

[jenluckenbach]

YUP!! BraveHeart, a foster cat with renal failure, had a VERY low RBC count. He got Epogen/Procrit injections (2 brand names for a medicine that stimulates the making of red blood cells) and Pet-Tinic orally (a vitamin liquid with iron and other good things )

It took some time, but his red count is now back in the normal range.


The Epogen/Procrit was prescribed by the vet and supplied by a regular pharmacy. The Pet-Tinic was also supplied by the vet (not sure if you can get int over the counter)

Best of luck with Cleo.

[critters]

You might want to join http://www.vetpetpartners.org/ ; I know at least one parent has experience with this, and probably some of the vets, too. Good luck!

[kb2yjx]

TopCat3!!! How good to see you on the threads again!!!! I am so sorry to hear about Cleo's blood count. Norton was anemic. He is taking PET-TABS with iron(a liquid). His last CBC the RBC's were back in the normal range!!!HUGS and good luck with Cleo!

[kimlovescats]

I do believe the Pet-Tinic is available over the counter. If not, I KNOW that you can order it online ... here is one place http://www.healthypets.com/pet1ozbypfiz.html. It is basically the same thing as Poly-vi-sol w/iron that you give infants.

[Medusa]

I have nothing to share here except encouragement and prayers that Cleo will get back on track. Good to see you back.

[Jessika]

K so I have to say that six weeks ago I would not have understood a single thing in your original post... but you just helped me realize in my clin lab class... I'm actually learning something! I can not believe that I just read that and understood everything, even the processes behind what's happening and why it happens...

I'm very sorry for your kitty though and I have no experience with this except we have practicals tomorrow over PCV and TP and have to calculate the MCH, MCV, MCHC, etc

I will have you in my thoughts and pray that she will recover

EDIT: Yes, excess iron is toxic for cats, so I would hold off on that until you get more information. If you would like, I can talk to my Clin Lab instructor tomorrow and ask her about iron supplements for cats, she should be familiar with it. Though from my understanding the erythropoetin injections should be the most helpful since that's what stimulates RBC creation, not necessarily iron (which only supports hemoglobin). But iron shouldn't hurt in addition. Regardless if you would like I'll talk to my instructor tomorrow to ask her opinion, can't hurt right? She is a DVM.

[krazyaboutkatz]

I'm so sorry to hear about Cleo. I don't have any experience with this but I'd like to say that she'll remain in my thoughts and prayers. I hope she'll feel better soon.

[TopCat3]

Thank you so mych everyone from the bottom of my heart for all your kind replies and caring good wishes.
Jessica yes please see what your instructor says. It is my understanding that the injections are to stimulate the bone marrow to produce the RBC, but the iron is needed as a building block, a vital "ingredient" in the RBCs. A bit like asking a bricklayer to build you a wall but not giving him any bricks, only the cement, I guess! Good luck with your practical!

I will Google Pet-tinic and see if it's available in Australia.

Meanwhile the lady vet at the practice we attend will be back Wednesday and one of the vet nurses is going to ask her what she did for her own cat's iron requirements when he was having the injections.

Jen thank you for sharing Braveheart's story. This has cheered up Cleo and me a lot, and given us hope.

Sandra thanks for the email, and the offer, I'll respond after I've spoken to the vet on Wednesday.

Medusa and everyone else - thanks for your good wishes and the welcome back message.

I was retrenched from my job a couple of months ago and been very busy job-hunting now I am busy learning new job, taking care of Cleo, and recovering from - would you believe - pneumonia - so I don't have a lot of time to come online and chat.

I'll keep you posted on this one though.

Wishing everyone well,
TC, Cleo & Colette

[kb2yjx]

TopCat3!! I will wait to hear from you!!!

[Jessika]

Thank you so mych everyone from the bottom of my heart for all your kind replies and caring good wishes.
Jessica yes please see what your instructor says. It is my understanding that the injections are to stimulate the bone marrow to produce the RBC, but the iron is needed as a building block, a vital "ingredient" in the RBCs. A bit like asking a bricklayer to build you a wall but not giving him any bricks, only the cement, I guess! Good luck with your practical!

Well that's the thing -- iron is vital yes, but without erythropoietin you can't make RBCS, period, so the iron wouldn't do anything. Iron is only useful in hemoglobin creation, not in the actual creation of RBCs themselves. Hemoglobin is produced later, after the cell is already created. So therefore it would help yes but erythropoietin is THE building block of RBCs because without it you can not have an RBC and if that is what you are lacking, iron may help, but erythropoietin is vital.

I do sincerely apologize I was not able to even get a word in with my instructor today; in both classes I have with her we had practicals and to be honest she wasn't even in the room for either class except for a brief overview and then she was out of the classroom with groups of students doing their practicals. This could go on all week and I have a final with her in one class tomorrow so I will try my best!! Sorry

EDIT: To reiterate, iron is also a vital nutrient for RBCs but it is not involved in the initial creation of them, I hope that makes more sense

[TopCat3]

Thanks Jessica. Yes, I did know that, my question was the other way round, sorry if I wasn't clear. That's to say, Cleo is actually on erythropoetin already, I wanted to know how necessary the iron supplement was/how much to give/what type to give, given that she's on this hormone. A couple of the vets said it might not be necessary. She is having a good home diet with some liver every few days - I'm going to get her some chicken hearts they're a good source of iron too. She doesn't like raw beef etc She also has a vitamin supplement which contains iron called Nutrigel, you squeeze it out of the tube, it's a paste, I mix it with her fibre and water and syringe it down her. I've stepped up the dose. I will talk to the vet with the cat that was on erythropoetin when she's back tomorrow and see what she advises.

I hope your final prac goes well!