My kitty just diagnosed w/ CRF - need advice & prayers

[Ladybug70]

So we got some mixed news yesterday from the vet. Blood results show that his creatinine and BUN are still WAY too high... but the numbers have stabilized and the creatinine has actually dropped ever so slightly (creatinine went from 11.4 to 9.7, BUN is still 156 - ouch!). Not the best news but Blackie is still showing signs of increased energy and an interest in eating. He's loving the baby food. I also got him some kitten milk that he seems to like and some alaskan salmon fancy feast "appetizers" (LOL)... but they are juicy and moist and he makes an attempt to eat a small portion (or at least lick up all the gravy). I just try to put something under his nose every 2 hours. The best news of all is that he hasn't vomited since Thursday morning!

We took him in to the vet yesterday for another fluid treatment (5th day in a row) and the doctor commented that Blackie looked like he felt a bit better. Since he won't get any fluids over the weekend, we're watching him carefully and still encouraging eating/drinking. We've let him out on our patio and he's loving it... even tried to escape over our patio wall (I don't blame him after all he's been through this week). We also got out the laser toy for some mild playing and he really perked up! Just trying to keep him stimulated and happy.

Please keep kitty prayers going over the weekend as he won't get sub-Qs until Monday. So far so good.

Thanks again for all your comments, suggestions and well wishes!

Purrs,
Lisa

[Medusa]

Do you think you're now in a place where you can give Blackie the subQ treatments yourself? His creatinine is still very high and the fluids might make a difference. After my Puddy had a treatment, she always perked up and when she was at her worst, I was aggressive w/the treatments and administered them sometimes twice a day. Whatever you decide, I'm glad that Blackie is showing signs of improvement no matter what his levels are. Keep it up, buddy!

[kb2yjx]

Paws and hands folded in prayer that your boy continues to EAT and have a good weekend!! I attached a photo of Miss BooBoo Kitty getting her sub q fluids with her private duty nurse, Nicholas, watching. Boo went to the Bridge at the age of 16 in 2004 and Nicholas in 2007, Boo was the first of my 9 kidney cats. She was a patient and kind teacher. I can never thank her enough!! Sandra

[Ladybug70]

What an adorable picture of Boo with Nicholas!

Mary, the thought of doing the sub-Qs myself really scares me. I've been reading a lot online about how it's done. It seems daunting and time-consuming, but I'm also reassured that it gets easier to administer. If Blackie can only remain stabilized through daily sub-Qs, I'm concerned about whether that treatment will be sustainable for us (time and money wise). Last week was the exception and I was able to take some time off each day from work. Otherwise, both my fiancee and I work full-time and can't be home during the day to check on Blackie to make sure he's eating or give additional sub-Qs. I really want to be willing to do anything (that Blackie will allow) to keep him going. Trying to take it one day a time for now... the "what ifs" scare me right now.

[kb2yjx]

Please be reassured that giving the fluids at home by yourself is not as bad as you may think!!! I taught my husband how to do it! Also, it will save you $$. You can give the fluids in the anytime during waking hours. As far as time goes, I can run 100cc's in under five minutes or less, since it is given sub q(under the skin), you do not have to worry about blowing a vein, and if the cat gets fussy, that is a good thing. I warm the IV bag in warm water so it will be not a shock when it goes into the cat, have the cat on a soft cushion, and have nice soothing music on, they all seem to have liked Bach or Mozart....Once you get Balckie stable, things will be OK. I have had to give fluids every other day, daily, or like now with Tina Peepers, only three times a week....things will work out....hang in there. Please, if you have the time, go to Tanya's CRF site, I think cfr.org. Excellent advice is there....

[Ladybug70]

Hi,

For those of you have performed sub-Qs, can you give me an idea of how much it costs you on a monthly basis to do it at home (fluids, supplies, shipping, etc). Assuming sub-Qs 3x/week (200cc)? 5x/week? Daily? I'm trying to compare it to what the vet charges.

Also, did you buy directly from the vet or via medical supply company? Also, how did you handle disposing of medical waste (needles)? Thanks for your help.

By the way, Blackie is still hanging in there. Not great , but not bad either. Mild appetite, no more vomiting, and a little more energy. Still not his normal self (may never be). We're just taking it a day at a time. We're trying 3 sub-Qs this week with a blood test on Friday. Will meet next Monday with vet to review results and discuss next steps/options for long-term care. Keep those kitty prayers coming!

Purrs,
Lisa

[Medusa]

Hi,

For those of you have performed sub-Qs, can you give me an idea of how much it costs you on a monthly basis to do it at home (fluids, supplies, shipping, etc). Assuming sub-Qs 3x/week (200cc)? 5x/week? Daily? I'm trying to compare it to what the vet charges.

Also, did you buy directly from the vet or via medical supply company? Also, how did you handle disposing of medical waste (needles)? Thanks for your help.

By the way, Blackie is still hanging in there. Not great , but not bad either. Mild appetite, no more vomiting, and a little more energy. Still not his normal self (may never be). We're just taking it a day at a time. We're trying 3 sub-Qs this week with a blood test on Friday. Will meet next Monday with vet to review results and discuss next steps/options for long-term care. Keep those kitty prayers coming!

Purrs,
Lisa

I pay $10 a bag and they give me a bunch of heavy gauge #18 needles for $1 (b/c the treatment goes fast, usually in 5 min. or less; a lighter gauge needle might take up to half an hour for the treatment.) The lines are $2 each. Compare that to $10 for the treatment itself; I wasn't charged for the office visit, and you can see the savings. The vet I go to now charges $12 a bag and he's expensive so I know that if I had them give the treatments, I'd be charged for the treatment, the supplies and the office visit, too.

Puddy was getting 150 cc. a day so a bag lasted approximately a week. I also injected the B vitamins into the port in the bag but my vet gave it to me at no charge, so I don't know what that cost would be. In the beginning, Puddy was getting 2 treatments a day, though; then it came down to one a day, then twice a week, then once a week and she was even off the treatments for a while.

As for disposal, I kept a separate bag just for the discarded items. The needles are recapped so there's no danger of sticking anyone.

There are a few here on PT who buy their supplies online b/c it's less expensive but my local vet is less than 10 minutes away so I just go there. Hope this helps.

Glad to hear that Blackie is doing a little better. Keep it up!

[kb2yjx]

I just received an order of 12 1000 cc bags of Lactated Ringers solution, 6 IV lines. The cost(for the East coast delivery)was $65 and change. I am ahead on needles. I use Terumo needles 18 gauge 1 inch. Please try the Brico site for the rated to your area!!! They have all the prices for the IV bags, IV lines, needles, sharp boxes...etc....I will get the site for you!!

[kb2yjx]

www.bricomedicalsupplies.com Then go to the CRF section.....

[Ladybug70]

Thanks so much, Mary and Sandra. How often do you go through the IV lines? Sandra, you mentioned you ordered 6... how long does that last you? Just trying to figure out what the monthly cost would be for fluid (200 ccs 3-4x/week), needles, IV lines, etc. Thanks again.

My vet charges $20 fluid and $30 to administer it. I'm usually spending almost $60 per visit. To maintain 3x/week with occasional vet exams would be $800/month. Not doable!

Another question... with you administering the fluids at home, how often do you visit the vet for check-ups and blood tests to check kidney function?

Thanks... so sorry for the questions... just trying to get all information before I sit down with the vet in a few days.

Purrs,
Lisa

P.S. Blackie has been doing great in the last 24 hours. Lots of energy, eating KIBBLE (yes, kibble!), and being very affectionate...including his trademarked "murring" - term I use for his "musical purring"....kind of a cross between a sing-songy meow and purring. Truly music to my ears.

[Medusa]

Thanks so much, Mary and Sandra. How often do you go through the IV lines? Sandra, you mentioned you ordered 6... how long does that last you? Just trying to figure out what the monthly cost would be for fluid (200 ccs 3-4x/week), needles, IV lines, etc. Thanks again.

My vet charges $20 fluid and $30 to administer it. I'm usually spending almost $60 per visit. To maintain 3x/week with occasional vet exams would be $800/month. Not doable!

Another question... with you administering the fluids at home, how often do you visit the vet for check-ups and blood tests to check kidney function?

Thanks... so sorry for the questions... just trying to get all information before I sit down with the vet in a few days.

Purrs,
Lisa

P.S. Blackie has been doing great in the last 24 hours. Lots of energy, eating KIBBLE (yes, kibble!), and being very affectionate...including his trademarked "murring" - term I use for his "musical purring"....kind of a cross between a sing-songy meow and purring. Truly music to my ears.

Don't reuse the lines; one line per bag. Don't reuse the needles either, not just for sanitary reasons but also b/c it dulls the needles and will cause Blackie unnecessary pain. A fresh needle for each treatment, a fresh line for each bag.

As for vet visits, I leave that up to my vet. I could tell when Puddy needed to go in b/c her subQ's weren't perking her up. Usually after a treatment, she felt much better and was actually peppy at times. When she wasn't, I was on the phone to my vet.

You're spending a lot of money right now but that will decrease significantly once you start administering the subQ's yourself. Your vet or a vet tech will show you how. I'll say in advance that you'll more than likely screw it up the first couple of times. I sure did. My vet is 45 min. away but my local vet is less than 10 min. away and I called him crying b/c I not only couldn't get the needle in right, I poked myself in the thumb so hard that it turned blue. LOL He said 'Come in right now and I'll take my time w/you to show you how". Maybe I shouldn't have told you this but I just want you to know that it rarely goes smoothly right away. You'll be nervous but once you get over the initial nervousness, Blackie will relax and so will you and it will become second nature to you.

So glad to read that dear Blackie is doing better. Now that's the kind of report I like to hear! Never worry about asking questions. That's what this site is all about. I've learned so much on here that I'm amazed.

[Ladybug70]

Thanks for the honest feedback, Mary. I know it won't be easy to do sub-Qs at first (and I'm a stress case to begin with - LOL).

So, I think I understand with the equipment/supplies: assuming I administer 200cc every other day, I'd probably go through one 1000cc bag, one IV line and 5 needles every 1 1/2 weeks... or 3 bags, 3 IV lines and 15 needles per month. Or double that if I have to go to daily injections.

I'll definitely price compare between purchasing through the vet vs Brico site (but looks like Brico is really reasonable - ~$100-$200/month w/ shipping!).

[kb2yjx]

I agree with Mary with the use of the needles!!! I keep the IV line for a month. I think you will find Brico very reasonable evne for the West Coast!! And Hugh is a very nice guy, please feel free to use my name as the one who gave your their info: Sandra, Flemington NJ. There are about 100 needles per box, which costs about $6.00+ change. As far as the vet goes, I watch the cat carefully, note eating, output, and behavior. If there is a significant change, I will call the vet...OR if the cat is going in for a vet visit(q six months) then bloodwork gets done. Please do not get stressed, you will see that once you get a handle on things, you will be a pro!!!

[Momto4FemaleFelines]

LadyBug70, I hope your kitty will do well even with the CRF.

I think there is a Yahoo support group for CRF kitties. I have an on-line friend who helped her cat, who was 15 when diagnosed with CRF, live 3 decent quality years despite the diagnosis. She used special diet and meds, then started SubQ fluids for the last year or so.

[Ladybug70]

Hi all-

Just wanted to give an updated on our sweet Blackie. It's now been 3 weeks since he was diagnosed with CRF. We've been doing aggressive fluid therapy at the vet clinic but tapered back to 3x/week last week and this week.

We had another blood test this past Monday and since Blackie's overall behavior/symptoms have greatly improved over past 2 weeks, we were hopeful for better numbers. Unfortunately, the results are worse. His BUN, creatinine, potassium and phosphorus numbers are alarmingly high. So it's really amazing to see Blackie doing so well considering the numbers! He is alert, eating, washing himself, playing, cuddling, etc. and no vomiting in 2 weeks!

Given Blackie's strong will to fight the odds, our vet is recommending we ignore the blood results going forward and just continue with sub-Qs until Blackie tells us otherwise. The vet feels sub-Qs 2-3x/week should keep him stable for now. The vet is very supportive of us doing the sub-Qs on our own.

So, we are now taking the step to now learn how to do sub-Qs ourselves. The vet and his wonderful staff gave me my first lesson with Blackie at the clinic yesterday. I watched carefully... fortunately, Blackie seems to be an excellent patient and just sits quietly (with his head tucked into my stomach). Even the staff commented at how good he always is. Tomorrow, my fiancee will join me and we'll get another sub-Q lesson. This time I'll be handling the needle with the vet's supervision.

Wish me luck!

Thanks for everyone's support and encouragement. I'm sure I'll need more of it once we start doing this at home... but just trying to take it a day at a time and not get too stressed about it.

Purrs,
Lisa