Cat pee problem? Read this... A.K.A. My cats have issues..*UPDATE*

[Catlady711]

Ok some of you may remember my Previous Thread about finding cat pee in the bathtub and by the sinks, and I finally had caught Cami in the act and we got a urinalysis done and put her on antibiotics. I gave her the Amoxitabs for the full 10 days with very little fuss from her, her last pill was given Thursday.

The saga continues!!!

So Saturday I find cat pee on my stovetop!!!! I just cannot have cats peeing all over my house. Not only is it a bad smell and ruins stuff, but I rent and stuff like this is EXACTLY why landlords hate tenants with pets.

New stragedy!!! Get urine samples from ALL 7 cats and see if I have more than one cat with a problem or if we didn't get Cami's problem totally cleared up.

Multi-cat households pay attention if you have innapropriate peeing going on!!

So yesterday afternoon I lock up ALL 7 cats in the cpu room with me, with a bowl of water and no sandbox. I watch and wait carefully for any signs someone might have to go. Then I take them to the sandbox I put in the bathtub just for this purpose. If they go, I stick a paper cup under them and catch the pee.

I managed to get samples from the trio (Sassy, Sabrina, Josh). Yay. I would have gotten Jack also but he apparently 'tucks' his thing under him farther and I missed. Hey 3 out of 7 ain't bad for 2 hours of time.

Last night I lock up the remaning ones I need samples from same as before. Didn't get the first sample until 9 pm and the last one at midnight. Missed Jack AGAIN, this time he peed more to the side. *sigh*

Anyways here's the results of the urinalysis...

Sassy - Showed signs of infection and some normal amount of crystals. Has to take Amoxitabs for 10 days.

Sabrina - Showed signs of infection and some normal amount of crystals. Has to take Amoxitabs for 10 days.

Josh - No outright infection but VERY HIGH Ph balance and some normal amount of crystals.

Bear - No outright infection but HIGH Ph balance and some normal amount of crystals.

Pooky - No outright infection but VERY HIGH Ph balance and some normal amount of crystals.

Cami - Still showing mild infection, lots of small crystals, and WAY too much protein in her urine.

So as it stands I'm giving the Amoxitabs to Sassy and Sabrina. We are trying a different antibiotic (Zeniquin) with Cami.

They are going to order some stuff (sorry can't remember the name they said) that is supposed to be a urine acidifier for either some or all of the cats. Possibly some future lab work on Cami to decide if her kidneys are having a hard time.

Out of 6 cats I have 3 with infections, and 3 with Ph balance problems. And NONE of them actually showed any signs of having an infection, other than I thought Bear peed 'funny' which I'm told may just be his way of peeing. Obviously we don't know for sure on Jack yet till I can get a sample from him. Seems kinda weird the females show infections and the males show high Ph. I asked if food could be causing this or the fact I boil my water before putting it in the water jug which is fairly recent. Vet seems to think that's not the problem but isn't sure at this point what the problem is.

I just wanted to give a head's up to the multi-cat households that are having problems with cats peeing outside the boxes.

It might be worth the effort, mess and inconvienence to have all your cats have a urinalysis done to see if you have the same problem I've been having.

Before this the only problem I had was Jack pooping outside the litterbox when he's constipated, but he has Megacolon so he does have a bona fide medical issue and it's easy to clean up. Only recently has the peeing around the house been an issue.

Thought I would let you know all that. I'll keep you posted to updates, meds, and when I get a sample from Jack.

[Emeraldgreen]

You could ask your vet if they have a product called NOSORB, it is little tiny pebble like things. They come in a sterile cup and you pour it into a clean litterbox with no litter, just the NOSORB and then separate Jack so he is the only one with access to it. And then when he does finally pee, pour the NOSORB and the pee back into the cup it came in and bring it back to the vet. I think it's under 10.00.

p.s. I just noticed that you are a vet assistant so you're probably laughing right now since you know all about NOSORB! LOL

[krazyaboutkatz]

Wow! When I was having some issues, I was lucky in that I knew it was only 2 of my cats so I just brought them in to the vets. My vet sticks a needle into their bladder to get urine so I don't have to go through the experience of collecting urine samples. I would also think that diet would play a big role in the high PH and the crystal problem. I hope that the meds will help everyone. Good luck and please continue to keep us updated.

[carole]

Did the vet suggest putting them on a special diet, it sounds like all of them good do with it,my Lexie has struvite stones and is on royal canin so,so far working well, just worth a mention i thought.

[Catlady711]

First answering questions/comments, then the update....

You could ask your vet if they have a product called NOSORB, it is little tiny pebble like things. They come in a sterile cup and you pour it into a clean litterbox with no litter, just the NOSORB and then separate Jack so he is the only one with access to it. And then when he does finally pee, pour the NOSORB and the pee back into the cup it came in and bring it back to the vet. I think it's under 10.00.

p.s. I just noticed that you are a vet assistant so you're probably laughing right now since you know all about NOSORB! LOL

Not laughing so much as at least smiling. lol Yes we have some of that at work. I just hate to have to use it when I know I can get the samples from them without changing litter, plus it's cheaper this way. I just need better aim and timing occasionally. ROFL

Wow! When I was having some issues, I was lucky in that I knew it was only 2 of my cats so I just brought them in to the vets. My vet sticks a needle into their bladder to get urine so I don't have to go through the experience of collecting urine samples. I would also think that diet would play a big role in the high PH and the crystal problem. I hope that the meds will help everyone. Good luck and please continue to keep us updated.

I hate having to take any of the cats in to work with me because regardless of who goes, Josh gets his little butt in an uproar and has to be confined separately for about 2 days, and sometimes Sabrina too. It's not the taking them in that's a problem but the aftermath. Several of my cats also get VERY upset just being at the vets even if we don't do much; Jack has a 'MUZZLE' lable on his file, and Sabrina and Josh have 'CAUTION' on their files. When I bring any of my cats in (including when we had Dusty who would growl but not do anything else) no one else in the building will handle my cats. Everyone backs up, puts their hands up, shakes their heads, and says 'they're your cats...YOU hold them!". ROFL Most of them aren't THAT bad, but then again they're my cats so I'm not as afraid of them as I would of say a client's cat that I don't know.

I'm kinda suspecting either food or water as the problem but I have to talk with the vet more about it. I think the new meds are coming in on Friday and I'll know more then.

Did the vet suggest putting them on a special diet, it sounds like all of them good do with it,my Lexie has struvite stones and is on royal canin so,so far working well, just worth a mention i thought.

The vet hasn't said anything about a special diet for this problem yet. They are already on Royal Canin dry and Purina Pro Plan for the little dab of wet food they get each morning. The Royal Canin is techinically a 'prescription' diet because you can only get the version I use from a vet. It's the 'neutered cat formula'. I'm using the mature version for Jack and the adult for everyone else. The 'neutered cat formula' is supposed to have less calories and better nutrition for neutered pets. Plus any prescription/specialty foods I can get are cheaper for me as I can pay wholesale cost on them and it helps when we need a minimum order on a special food for a client but only need one bag, I add my order on and we make the minimum order.

Anyways now the UPDATE....

I FINALLY got a sample from Jack yesterday afternoon. I tried a different cup that was wider and shorter. I shoved it way under him until I felt it get warm so I knew he was peeing in it. (the things we don't do for our pets ). He's so darn furry down there and puts his butt down so low he's not the easiest one to 'catch'. lol

Anyways the RESULTS......

Jack is the only one in the house without an infection, crystals or high Ph problems. YAY 1 out of 7! lol I was hoping the poor thing would test out ok because he's already got problems with the megacolon thing and constipation, he doesn't need any more problems.

So if the food is the problem, that would sort of make sense because Jack eats mainly the Mature food, although he sneaks quite a bit of the adult food from the other cats bowls. It's easy to have happen when you have 2 all white, medium haired cats and you look up to see a white cat in the right bowl, until you realize that it's the wrong white cat in the wrong bowl! lol

I still have to kinda agree at the same time with the vet that it shouldn't be food because there isn't alot of difference between the ingredients other than calories and protien which is normal for a mature food. Still working on that mystery. I'm still suspecting the water because I never boiled and filtered my water until a couple months ago because it started tasting/smelling so bad I couldn't even bring a glass of it up to my face. I figure it it isn't good enough for me to drink, I'm not letting my pets drink it.

I did go buy new filters for the pet fountains in case that was an issue. The ones in there weren't really old and I rinse them out when I clean the filter, but then again I'm using that crappy faucet water to rinse them out with. Hmmm, maybe my water company should pay my vet bills? It does seem odd to me that the females have the infections, and the males (except Jack) have the high Ph. hmmmm

I'm fortunate though that I get very good discounts on the cats medical care and the convienence of just bringing in samples or cats without needing an appointment most of the time. Praise the Lord for perks!

Anyways so that's the updates so far. Once I talk to the vet on Friday I'll probably know a bit more on the meds and I'll discuss more with him about probable causes for 6 out of 7 cats having a similar issue.

[Catty1]

As far as the pH...how about cranberry capsules, about .50g of powder per cat mixed in wet food?

My vet says it can't be used long-term...not sure why.


Oscar LOVED it mixed in with plain unflavoured yogurt! He LOVES that yogurt!

Glad you got your gang all figured out!

I'm sure you know a food change can alleviate crystals. Just one thing my vet told me recently - that Hill's Dental has had recent studies done on it, and it works really well for urinary tract health! Might wanna check into it...hopefully everyone can eat it.

[Catlady711]

So far the vet had said that everyone but Cami had a normal amount of crystals (she had very tiny ones but more than normal amount). Jack is the only one that basically had NO crystals, which I guess is kinda unusual.

I'll talk more with their vet on Fri. and keep everyone posted.

[Emeraldgreen]

Glad to hear that Jack finally provided you with a sample!
Ah yes,... the muzzle. My cat Stinky once had one strapped on by the vet when she went 'crazy' during a visit a few years back. It looked like a tiny Hannibal Lector mask. Yikes! LOL
It stressed her out so much that since then I just do everything possible under the sun to avoid taking her in if I can because I hate to put her through that. (and the vet and me for that matter!) Thankfully the muzzle was only brought out once but it certainly was a memorable experience.

[Freedom]

If you can frame your water questions, give a call to your town or city's water dept. and speak with a manager / supervisor. They are water experts and may be able to give some guidance.

I called them when I was having trouble adjusting the Ph and chlorine levels in my aquarium. I learned that they have to use different additives and supplement at different times of year to meet potable water guidelines. Once he gave the me time frames -- which are approximate -- I was better able to control my tank.

Questions which may help you include --

is the water from my tap TODAY high Ph, balanced or low?
does my boiling it change the level?
is there something I can do to change the level? (if what comes from the tap is not balanced)

If you give it some thought, you may get a few more questions.

Just DON'T start off telling him this is due to cat urine levels. I was advised by someone on a fish forum not to tell them I was calling about a tank. They will get all defensive, "I don't know a THING about cats, never owned one." or something like that.

In the course of the conversation, you can mention it is a feline health issue which you are trying to correct on multiple levels, but don't get into specifics. You want them to talk about THEIR area of expertise, not listen to yours.

Maybe this will give some ideas.

[Catlady711]

If you can frame your water questions, give a call to your town or city's water dept. and speak with a manager / supervisor. They are water experts and may be able to give some guidance.

I called them when I was having trouble adjusting the Ph and chlorine levels in my aquarium. I learned that they have to use different additives and supplement at different times of year to meet potable water guidelines. Once he gave the me time frames -- which are approximate -- I was better able to control my tank.

Questions which may help you include --

is the water from my tap TODAY high Ph, balanced or low?
does my boiling it change the level?
is there something I can do to change the level? (if what comes from the tap is not balanced)

If you give it some thought, you may get a few more questions.

Just DON'T start off telling him this is due to cat urine levels. I was advised by someone on a fish forum not to tell them I was calling about a tank. They will get all defensive, "I don't know a THING about cats, never owned one." or something like that.

In the course of the conversation, you can mention it is a feline health issue which you are trying to correct on multiple levels, but don't get into specifics. You want them to talk about THEIR area of expertise, not listen to yours.

Maybe this will give some ideas.

Thank you for the tips. Is there an inexpensive kit or something so I can test my water, both before and after boiling? I don't know what the normal Ph of the stuff is, never did.

[Catlady711]

Just did some looking online about the specifics on the food I feed my kitties.

This is straight from the company's website...

The diet has been specifically designed to help address the major risk factors that affect young neutered male and female cats: struvite urolithiasis and weight gain associated with neutering.

Increases urine volume to simultaneously reduce the saturation of urine with calcium oxalate and struvite, helping to prevent the two major types of urolithiasis

Recommended for:

Neutered male and female cats from operation to 7 years of age
To help prevent struvite and calcium oxalate urolithiasis
To help reduce the risk of obesity associated with neutering
Multi-cat households from operation to 7 years of age

Ok so NOW I know why the vet said it probably wasn't the food. He didn't explain why he didn't think it was the food but he already knows which food I'm feeding. I'm already feeding something to help prevent urinary problems and stones. Somehow I didn't remember seeing that part when I did the research before giving this food. Apparently I have to remember I'm not the one with the veterinary degree, he is. lol

[carole]

It is good that they are already on Royal Canin, yes mine is prescription only available from the vet too, but especially for cats with urinary problems, so if they had to change to that, it would not be too much of a problem as they are already used to the taste, took a while for my lexie to adapt to it, but she is sweet now.Good luck.

Ok i had not read your post before i typed this,i find it odd your vet would not strongly recommend that you put them on special food for the problem,or have i mis-read your post, first thing my vet did was change to the royal canin SO ,it has to be that kind not just the royal canin food,which is specifically for that problem, well struvite crystals anyhow, and i think there is one for the other type of stones as well.

[motstyle]

I tried Nosorb but my cat was reluctant to pee on it, my vet gave me some sort of water repelling sand called Kit4cat which worked like a wonder.

You could ask your vet if they have a product called NOSORB, it is little tiny pebble like things. They come in a sterile cup and you pour it into a clean litterbox with no litter, just the NOSORB and then separate Jack so he is the only one with access to it. And then when he does finally pee, pour the NOSORB and the pee back into the cup it came in and bring it back to the vet. I think it's under 10.00.

p.s. I just noticed that you are a vet assistant so you're probably laughing right now since you know all about NOSORB! LOL

[Marigold2]

OMG you poor thing. I have had my share of cat pee as well. Bladder infection, bladder stones, diabetes, overactive thyroid, behavioral problems, the list just goes on and on.
I am so sorry.