Advice....

[manda99]

Hi there.

I brought Smokey into the house last week. He and Pork Chop fight NONSTOP.

P.C. is going to be a year old on 4/20 and Smokey is just over 7 weeks. They are both male pitbulls, P.C. isn't fixed; Smokey will be soon.

Sometimes they just play and it's fine but then they get crazy and P.C. will try to drag Smokey around by his ears. P.C. bit the hell outta S. the other night when S got too close to P.C. and his new bone.

I realize P.C. is still a pup himself so it's probably way hard. And it doesn't make it easier that my roommate (Pork Chop's owner) is rarely home -- and he doesn't really listen to anyone anyway. (I asked if my roommate would be down for taking P.C. to some sort of classes, I will do so w/ Smokey, but she wasn't interested.)

I was off work & home all last week to get Smokey used to his new home, and to get P.C. accustomed to S. But like I said, my roommate is hardly ever here so it's me basically trying to watch, pay attention to and disipline a dog that's not mine & then also do those things for my new puppy (who of course, I want to protect!)

That being said - Smokey is no angel, he loves to munch on Pork Chop...
It's just when they both get going that it's scary.

OK - SO - what to do? I'm trying to make sure P.C. gets extra love but it's hard when he's always stealing the baby's toys and treats.
When things get too rowdy I usually put Pork Chop outside and Smokey in a "nuetral area" with something to chew on. It works for a bit, but when P.C comes back in, if they both haven't settled down - they start at it again.

Wow, that was a lot... I just am frustrated cuz one minute they'll be hanging out playing with no issues and then they'll start playing a little hands on... and then they get rough. Do I just let 'em duke it out, so to speak?



ALSO - This is so annoying!!!! I spent the entire week at home and getting Smokey used to going poddy outside... and he did REALLY good!! But now, today for some reason, even if I take him out, watch him pee & poo, praise and then bring him back in... 20 minutes later he'll do a lil' squat and leak a little wizz out. If I take him outside he doesn't go anymore. Think it could be just a change for today since I went back to work and wasn't taking him out every 2 hrs?

I tell ya, work places really need to understand a puppy is just like a baby and we need 6 weeks off! Yeah right. :)

Ok, well, this was long and I'm a little tired so I hope it make some kind of sense.

Thanks in advance for anything... (did i even ask anything? i forget. ha)

[Dixieland Dancer]

Manda99, I received a few red flag warning signals from your post. First was TWO MALE PITBULLS (the larger intact and approching his maturity). And Second, It doesn't sound like Pork Chop was ever properly SOCIALIZED as a puppy. :( This is very critical in developing proper skills to associate with other dogs.

You are doing the right thing with Smokey by enrolling him in class. The sooner the better. The first 16 weeks of a puppies life are the most critical in SOCIALIZATION. They learn more during this period than any other.

Since P.C. doesn't seem to have these skills and his owner shows no interest in working on training (or even being with her dog much from the sounds of it) I don't see any hope of him improving his Social skills unless you are willing to work with him. He sounds like he is a bit too aggressive with a 7 week old puppy to me and needs work immediately.

Personally, if it were me, I would get Smokey out of there and find a new roommate or place to live. I see problems with this older dog happening if he is not getting training or the attention he needs. Especially since he is a Pitbull. Pitbulls can be very loving and friendly (look at KayAnn's Simba who is part Pitbull) if they are SOCIALIZED and trained and shown loving affection. However, they can also be nasty and very aggressive without the correct attention. It sounds more like the latter to me.

Be patient with the house training with Smokey. Puppies do not have full control of their bladders until they are 12 weeks old. Are you crate training? Smokey and P.C. are not together when you are at work are they?

Rough play is a given with two dogs (especially when one is a pup) but it sounds like sometimes this gets pretty out of control. As Smokey gets older, P.C. may feel the need to defend his territory more. He should be neutered too!

You especially need to keep Smokey away from P.C. when he is eating and / or chewing a bone. He is probably very food aggressive already. If he is already stealing his toys and things when Smokey is only 7 weeks old, what will it be like when he is getting older and learning to stand up for his things.

I see one of two things happening in this situation.

1. Smokey will become very submissive to P.C. and will let him have anything he wants.
2. Smokey will not stand for P.C. being so pushy and dominant and a all out war will occur and at that point, I can not predict what will happen. This will probably not happen until Smokey starts to come into his maturity though.

I would be very cautious where P.C. is concerned. PERIOD!

[manda99]

yeah, i pretty much figured that's what i'd hear...

P.C. was brought up around a female pitbull (who moved out a few months ago) and they did the same stuff at first but after a little while it was fine. but he wasn't socialized with other dogs... I took him out with other dogs a few times , kept him on a leash , and after he got over being superexcited, things were okay. Just sniffs and kisses.

Smokey is being crate trained. He is in his crate while I'm at work (going home at lunch) and P.C. stays in the back yard.

Oddly enough, P.C. isn't agressive over actual dog food. Just his bones & some toys (unless they are both playing with something and keep stealing from each other & playing chase) They both wander freely between their bowls, even though I try to stop that, and sometimes they eat out of the same bowl , at the same time - no problem. (of course, P.C. is gonna go to adult doggie food next week so we might have an issue then)

Last night I spent about 2 hours just playing with P.C. and cuddling with him ... Then we all (Smokey, P.C. and me) took a little nap together, them snuggling close. P.C. even leaving and coming back to see Smokey all up on me... No problems.

I may have over stated the fighting they do as I was just frustrated at that point. Also, I watched them for a while from the other room and learned that a lot of the squeals and barks were total play; they weren't even next to each other.

I think I am going to talk to my roommate again about getting P.C. into some class... Maybe I'll see if I can do it if she doesn't want to (she also has heath issues and has to work 2 jobs right now).

ANYWAY - thanks for your reply.
I really appreciate it.

[aly]

I got a little nervous too when you mentioned it was 2 intact males. It is really good that you are getting Smokey neutered. Your roomate doesn't want to neuter Pork Chop?

I agree with Candy, this could either get better, or so much worse, but you're not going to know for a little while. The good thing is that its a roommate's dog and not a husband or family member's dog who could potentially live with you forever.

Be sure that Pork Chop doesn't have to share ANY of his stuff (bed, toys, food, etc) so he doesn't think he's being replaced. Also, never let them alone unsupervised. I know you're not doing that but it may be tempting to start doing that. I wouldn't do it until at least 2 months after the problems stop. You never know what they might find to fight over and I would give it plenty of time with you supervising to explore all opportunities.

If Smokey is on the dominant side, you're going to have some problems. Classes are a good idea. I could give you more advice but I'd sort of have to see the dogs together. I don't want to tell you something and be wrong because its a different situation than I think. I really hope you and your roommate and the dogs can get this worked out.

Good luck!

[manda99]

they are not being left alone together unsupervised . no way .
i'm all anal and protective here, that's why the crate was a MUST. i remembered when we first got P.C. how he and Hurley would fight... but at that time my roommate wasn't working and was home all day to watch them.

Anyway, I'm sure we will work it out...

I feel like I'm giving P.C. a bad name here... he's really such a baby, momma's boy, sweetheart!! He loves ALL people (I've NEVER seen him show any kind of agression towards anyone... and there's constantly strange cable guys and handy men around the house) and his little girlfriend, Lady - a pit - from across the street. I really think if I can get P.C. into some sort of training it'll be a lot easier to deal with.

I'm a first time dog owner so I'm probably being a little crazy here.

P.C. has his own toys, Smokey has his own, too. The taking of treats and toys is more like - if they both get a rawhide chew , P.C. gets done first and then tries to take the baby's.
Since the first incident when Smokey tried to take P.C.'s bone and P.C. bit his nose... Smokey hasn't gone back to try to take his edible toys. So that's good at least. I don't know... It's weird, there's somethings that are OK to share by them... But the bone is a NO-NO.

So, keep the replies coming... I'm learning and getting ideas everyday from this place. It's great!!

xoxo
manda99

[mugsy]

We have 15 dogs and 1 is a full male pit and we have a male Husky/Pit mix and a female Boxer/Pit mix and they are fine. Now I'm not going to tell you it's always roses because it's not. We have scuffles and only one major blow up and Smokey (our full male pit) was a bait dog for fighters. He was just neutered. One thing that you HAVE to do is establish that YOU are the alpha. We do feed Smokey in his crate, but that's only because he's aggressive due to the fact that he was starved. We always introduce our dogs on leashes first and the first show of aggression we jerk back on the leash and give a firm NO. I have to say that the bad reputation that Pits have is grossly over rated. They are the sweetest things around as long as they are treated well. They are no different than any other dog...it is all in how they are raised and unfortunately Pits are one of the main dogs of choice for fighting, so therefore they are branded as being bad dogs. You have to be a little more careful because of the way their jaws are set up, but other than that they aren't any different than any other dog. If I were you, I would insist to your roommate that Pork Chop be neutered...it makes a HUGE difference and it's also healthier for the dog....there is a far smaller chance of them getting certain kinds of cancer. Please don't give up and might I suggest that you see a professional trainer or at least talk to one to get some pointers. Please feel free to ask anything you want on here too.

[manda99]

might I suggest that you see a professional trainer or at least talk to one to get some pointers


You must have read my mind... right as you were probably typing that I was talking to a co-worker and we said I should do that same thing. :D


Thanks once again!

[Dixieland Dancer]

As you can tell, it is very difficult to fully understand a situation without seeing it first hand. Perhaps everything will be ok and what you precieved to be major issue is really nothing other than puppy play.

I am not sure now if P.C. sounds like a big teddy bear or if he shows some dominance that needs addressed. The only way to address dominance is to have the owner be the dominant role in the pups life.

Perhaps you need to give this some time to work it's self out. If you notice any bloodshed then you have major issues. Play fighting can sometimes take on the appearance of being worse than it really is. If there is no blood shed then you need to let them work it out between themselves.

With Smokey being only 7 weeks old, it may be way to early to tell what the future holds. And I wouldn't get to upset over the potty thing yet. Just be consistent with him. He will catch on.

[manda99]

Yes, I'm not upset about the potty thing...
I think I just over reacted ... Geez. Imagine how I'll be with a human baby! :rolleyes: WHATEVER MOM!!

Anyway, my roommate said they have been playing nice all day... I guess it just takes some getting used to.

Thanks everyone for your support. I feel much better about things today!

manda99

[manda99]

and now, lets see if i can post Smokey and Pork Chop (i'm sure i've done it before...) SHOOT. I dont know how to make them pictures on here!

Smokey is the white one
Pork Chop is the gray one --- Smokey is P.C.'s baby. I don't know why he came out white. All the others are gray or brindle. (last picture is some of them)


http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/2d9a401b/bc/Doggies/102_0255_IMG.jpg?bc4OLD9ATng0Skm3
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/2d9a401b/bc/Puppies/Curtain.++Yum..jpg?bc4OLD9AfrOIebTG
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/2d9a401b/bc/Puppies/MVC-025S.jpg?bc4OLD9AT2MUFrac

[Dixieland Dancer]

They are precious! Thanks for showing us the pictures!!!