Why Won't Bush Speak To Her?

[lizbud]

Cindy Sheehan, a mother of a slain soldier has been in the
news since she tried to meet with George Bush while he's on
vacation (for the month of August) in Texas. This might have
taken 20-30 minutes tops to meet with this lady & convey his
personal condolences & the thanks of the nation for her son's
devotion to his country.

Why will he not meet with her?

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/08/07/mom.protest/

[caseysmom]

You would think he would talk to her so she didn't get this much coverage, its making him look worse.

[dukedogsmom]

Originally posted by caseysmom
You would think he would talk to her so she didn't get this much coverage, its making him look worse.
Yeah and that's hard to do.

[caseysmom]

;)

[kittycats_delight]

Not to dis on your president but he is just a moron. I guess he figured any press is good press whether he comes off bad or good. He probably does care how he comes across to the public considering he is in his second term and cannot run again.

[catland]

Why? maybe because its not an election year?:rolleyes:

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Maybe I'm seeing things differently here, but I don't see why he should talk to her. He spoke with her when her son first died - like he supposedly does to all the families that loose a son or daughter in the war.

Now she is using "strong-arm" tactics to get what she wants from him. What makes her and her efforts any different than the terrorists who kidnap a diplomat and threaten to kill him until we do something that they want? Does her "cause" justify the means - not in my book.

She has every right to protest, and that she is doing. We all know Bush isn't the brightest bulb in the lamp so his tactics may be backfiring as it would have been so much easier to just see her, let her speak her piece and then be done with her, but I do not believe he should bend to her will. If he bends to hers, why not to everyone Tom Dick and Harry who have some ax to grind with the government? Who knows, maybe somebody will threaten to light themselves on fire if he doesn't talk to them about lowering gas prices....

Ok, blast away. I'm well aware that my opinion is in the minority.

Oh, and just to clarify, if any of you remember from any of my previous posts to political threads, I am the furthest thing from a Bush lover there is. I would like to know who she voted for in the last election. :rolleyes:

[lvpets2002]

All I have to say is Thank You Tubby & Peanuts Mom of I could not have said it better myself & well Put..

[Pam]

Originally posted by lvpets2002
All I have to say is Thank You Tubby & Peanuts Mom of I could not have said it better myself & well Put..

Ditto. She brings up some good points. It would set a precedent and would ultimately lead to special meetings with the families of every soldier who has been slain. I grieve for all of these moms and dads. I don't know how I would handle such a devastating thing as the death of a son/daughter. It is beyond gut-wrenching. I do know that I would not want to be drawing attention to myself though and would choose to do my grieving privately and draw upon the Lord to give me strength and help me through. Out of respect for the families of the others who have died I would not put on such a display as it implies that their sacrifice was in vain. That only adds to their pain and is something I could never do. JMHO

[jesse_3]

Not to dis on your president but he is just a moron. I guess he figured any press is good press whether he comes off bad or good. He probably does care how he comes across to the public considering he is in his second term and cannot run again.

Umm, dis our president, GO AHEAD!!! I am also one of the many people who dislike Bush with a great passion!

Steph and Jes

[DJFyrewolf36]

I understand why this woman would be upset. To a lot of people, the war in Iraq is just a continuation of the Bush grudge match that started with Bush Sr. The president hasn't, at least in my opinion, given a good explination as to why people are still dying when the main problem (Hussain (sp?)) has been captured. So far, the only thing we've gotten is a bunch of buzzwords and empty promisies.

T & P, Pam, I agree with you too. The president doesn't have the time realistically to sit down and have a discussion with every affected family. He DOES however have the time to make a presentation to every American to explain what exactly our goals in Iraq are. I think more people would be supportive of our efforts if they knew what exactly those efforts were

[caseysmom]

Sorry but I can in no way equate what she is doing with that of a terrorist threatening to cut someones head off. She is not threatening violence of any kind. I think its time somebody took a stand and made him answer some tough questions.

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Originally posted by DJFyrewolf36
I think more people would be supportive of our efforts if they knew what exactly those efforts were

I agree that more people would be supportive, but are you kidding, even he doesn't know what exactly those efforts are! Remember, this is Bush we're talking about. ;) :p

I, personally, don't need to hear anymore from him, I've heard enough. The reasons we're there in the first place are irrelevant at this point. Whether it's right or wrong, the fact is that we went in and overthrew their government, so it is up to us to make sure they can stand on their own before we leave. We took it upon ourselves to make their country right, so we need to do that. In my opinion, if we left right now, started pulling our troops out tomorrow, all those that have already died would have died in vain. They gave their lives for a cause and that cause was to help better Iraqi lives, we need to stay there until that end is achieved. The good people of Iraq are working hard to turn their country into a democracy, which will supposedly improve their lives, and I feel they are making great strides, but they aren't ready to stand on their own yet. It's our fault that that innocent Iraqis are being killed just for getting on a bus and going to work, and that, in my mind, is justification enough for us being there.

And frankly, I'm rather sick and tired of hearing Bush's whiney voice, so no thanks, I don't need any more explanations out of him. I'd be happy if he'd just shut up and crawl in a hole for the rest of his term. :rolleyes:

Oh, and I forgot to say...thanks for the support guys, I thought I was the only one that had this opinion. The news channels all seem to be supportive of her, so I really thought I was alone in this opinion. :)

I also have to add (now you've got me all riled up about Bush...and I'm supposed to be working! ;) ), I think it is majorly wrong of him to go on "vacation" while we have young men dieing for his cause! He's the one that started all this and he sends our young innocent young people to fight his war - and then he goes on vacation! The gaul! :mad:

[Corinna]

Yes he did meet wiith her but not as with the others he had her and family to geather alone . None of the others families got that treatment. She and her hubby (soon to be ex becouse of her stunts) agreed and were thankful to President Bush for his time. She now is being handled by the Michel Moore bunch. and shes looking like a comeplete fool and idiot.

[lizbud]

Originally posted by Corinna
Yes he did meet wiith her but not as with the others he had her and family to geather alone . None of the others families got that treatment. She and her hubby (soon to be ex becouse of her stunts) agreed and were thankful to President Bush for his time. She now is being handled by the Michel Moore bunch. and shes looking like a comeplete fool and idiot.


Not so, in my opinion. She's nobody's fool. From all I've read
she listened to Bush speak along with a group of other moms & relatives of slain soldiers about 4 mos after her son was killed.

There's a huge difference in listening to a prepared speech vs
looking someone right in the eye & asking what purpose was
served by her boy's death in Iraq. Just what exactly is our mission
there all about? I for one would love to hear his answer.

[RICHARD]

I MAY have some facts wrong but here goes....

Her son died in '03.

A very courageous man, I believe he was a chaplain and he reenlisted to return to Iraq.


BECAUSE HE BELIEVED IN THE CAUSE.


Soon after he was killed, Mommie Dearest flipped out (who wouldn't?) left her husband with three kids to raise.

Her litttle stunt is being backed by who else? Mikey Moore and some Dem dot org group.

Apparently her son was the only one killed in Iraq and she got a few minutes with the president. Sad.....


I am really tired of the media turning people into MEDIA WHORES.

They really after the women who have lost their loved ones..

Sharon Rocha, The Dame Holloway, Denise Brown and now this woman...

Michael Moore gave the Farenheit 9/11 mom her fifteen minutes and where is she now?

Gracing the bargain shelves of the local video stores. And Moore never gave a Cat's Arse about her after....

To this day I never heard anything about any donations to any families who suffered a loss.....A HOLE.


----------------------------


If she wants time with the president, I'd be more than happy to buy her a watch with GWB's pic on the face...


----------------------------------


But to try to make amends to everyone here....

I do feel for this woman....her son went off to war....

I guess there is more guilt involved when you sign your daughter's trip slip for so she can experience a little debauchery in Aruba......



Where is Jennifer Wilbanks when we need her??

Koo KOO Ka Choo, our nation turns it's lonely eyes to you!!:rolleyes:

[Pam]

Originally posted by RICHARD


I am really tired of the media turning people into MEDIA WHORES.


Sad but true. I wonder what her son would think of all of this mess.

I am not minimizing her pain, but the fact of the matter is that her son was an enlisted soldier. He knew the risks and chose his path. Please, I am in no way even slightly suggesting that he deserved his fate. My hubby was in the Air Force during Viet Nam. He knew the risks and enlisted. My brother was in the Air Force during the Korean War. He knew the risks and enlisted. I have cousins who are career Navy men. When you enlist in the military, no matter who the President is or the condition of the world at the time of your enlistment, you have to know that this is dangerous business. You have stepped out and pledged to serve and made that commitment.

This is different than what was happening during Viet Nam where kids just out of high school were being drafted and swept into the Army, sent to a foreign land and killed even before the ink was dry on their diplomas. Yes war is horrific....NO DOUBT ABOUT IT! But I do believe that when you enlist you have weighed the costs and gone ahead accepting what may come. That said, my heart aches for this woman. I just wish she could do her grieving in a way that would be more honorable to his memory. JMHO again.

[RICHARD]

This is sad..

Apparently Ms Sheehan and her band of merry protestors are putting up crosses, in a memorial type setting, with the names of other soldiers that died during this war.

There are reports that some of their parents have made to trip to TX to remove those crosses from thise "memorial".


Why not use the pictures of the coffins, that the press was fighting to have released, coming back into Dover..

Wouldn't that make more of an impact?
:confused:

[Edwina's Secretary]

I, for one, hope he never does meet with her! If he mets with her, that would be that. But, as he, again, takes the coward's route, she is able to continue to ask the question others are thinking but are afraid to ask.

We have a puppy dog media that fails to ask Bush the hard questions about Iraq (or much of anything else!) and a far right power group that shouts "Unpatriotic" at anyone who dares to question. (I saw some of the Fox Network on my loooonnngg airline flight this week. Their favorite slur....at anyone who disagreed...."unpatriotic!")

So she has people behind her? Can you say "Karl Rove"...."Dick Cheney"?

Now...what is a media whore? Is that someone who uses the media to advance a position? Like say..... outing a intelligence worker for personal/political reasons?

And she and her husband broke up....well there's a reason she should shut up! She changed her opinion....unacceptable!

My only quibble with her is that the news that came out this week....... the government announced that it is doubtful that we will be able to achieve most of the objectives we had established in Iraq...... got lost in the liberal press.

I wonder if the media whore who released that did it in "The Dog Days of Summer" for a reason??

And I agree Richard, the coffins of the sacrifical young men and women would be powerful.....unfortunately, Bush's handlers won't let them be seen in the media. That isn't censorship is it?

[Samantha Puppy]

Originally posted by Tubby & Peanut's Mom
Maybe I'm seeing things differently here, but I don't see why he should talk to her. He spoke with her when her son first died - like he supposedly does to all the families that loose a son or daughter in the war. BINGO!!!!

She had her turn and was pleased with her meeting with him until she got a bug up her @$$ and started getting in with all these fanatical far left-wing nut groups.

[Edwina's Secretary]

If people who oppose the Iraq War are "Fanatical far left-wing nuts" does that make people who support the war Fanatical far right-wing nuts"?????????

Just curious...:D :D :D

[caseysmom]

I wish we could not have the name calling when we don't have the same view as you we are not left wing nuts geez grow up.

[Samantha Puppy]

Excuse me, did I say any of YOU were fanatical left-wing nuts? No. The groups that Sheehan is now associated with are.

And yes, there are fanatical far right-wing nut job groups out there that support the war. I was not calling anyone here names, so I'd appreciate it if people didn't try to sensor a rather benign post to begin with.

Thanks.

[beeniesmom]

Originally posted by catland
Why? maybe because its not an election year?:rolleyes:

true! why should he care anyway....
why should he care about anything...

[lizbud]

Originally posted by RICHARD

I MAY have some facts wrong but here goes....




It is that kind of thinking (or non thinking) that got us all into
this mess. It' almost sounds like something George might have
said himself.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Sorry SP....but there is nothing benign about the phrase ....Fanatical left-wing nut....

Rather inflamatory in fact.

And I don't knowabout anyone sensoring anything but if you mean censoring....that means not allowing something to be printed or spoken about.

You are entitled to your opinion. I fail to see censorship. Criticism...yes....censorship (or sensorship), no.

[Samantha Puppy]

I see it differently. The only way my comment could be taken in an inflamatory nature is if I called someone here a fanatic far left wing nut, which I did not. I'm saving that label for the groups with which this woman is now associated. It would also be inflamatory if I said the only fanatics were those opposed to this war, but I did not, and stated that there are, in fact, groups just as fanatic on the opposite end of the spectrum who do support the war.

At any rate, I'm not singling out left-wing nuts as the only ones of their kind. That is just who this woman is associating herself with now. If she were on the complete opposite end of the deal and supported the war and was demanding to see President Bush, I'd say she'd fallen in with fanatic far right-wingers.

My claim of a 'benign' comment came from me not attacking anyone here - not attacking anyone really. I didn't say that the fanatical left wing nuts were all evil and should go to Hell. I merely put a label on a group of people who seem to be as fanatical in their cause as say, PETA is for animal rights.

[DJFyrewolf36]

T & P...I agree with you yet again. I just think that perhaps if our intentions were clear from the OUTSET that we wouldn't be having this discussion now. IMO it wasn't Americas place to tear down the Iraqi government but now that we are imbeded, we owe it to the people whose lives we've disrupted to at least attempt to fix the problem and to help them rebuild.

This situation is very different from Vietnam. People are voulenteering service knowing full well they could be injured or killed. At least they aren't pulling kids from high school and throwing them to the wolves.

This woman's son voulenteered so obviously he must have supported the cause or he wouldn't have gone. I'd hate to think that we have men and women voulenteering to fight for something they don't support. At first I was sympathetic, but now it seems as if she is just gunning for 15 minutes of fame instead of actually trying to get something usefull done.

Another extreme political tactic...and we arent even close to an election year!

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Saw a bumper sticker yesterday

One learned man is harder on the devil than a thousand ignorant worshippers.

Seems to be an Islamic saying as when I did a google search, it came up with a bunch of islamic sites, but it is so true in so many aspects of society - not just the religious aspect.

At the risk of someone tracking my internet usage, I clicked on one of the sites that came up when I googled this. Seems this Muhammed guy is/was pretty smart. ;)

Islam: On Education
Had'ith

An hour's contemplation is better than a year's adoration...To spend more time in learning is better than spending more time in praying; the support of religion is abstinence. It is better to teach knowledge one hour in the night than to pray the whole night...One learned man is harder on the devil than a thousand ignorant worshippers...To listen to the words of the learned, and to instill into others the lessons of science, is better than religious exercises...The ink of the scholar is more holy than the blood of the martyr...The acquisition of knowledge is a duty incumbent on every Muslim, male and female...Who are the learned? They who practice what they know.

Muhammad

Ok, this seems to be more religious based than I wanted this post to be, but the "left wing fanatics" comment got me thinking about fanatics in general, and this seemed appropriate. oh, oh, better watch what I say or I'll be labeled as a terrorist pretty soon, so back to work for me now. ;)

[DJFyrewolf36]

Wise words.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Now I get it! If I call groups who support the war in Iraq..."Fanatical far right-wing nuts" that is not inflamatory nor insulting to anyone here who might hold those same views.

I am also curious as to which groups you know her to be associated with that you would characterize as "fanatical far left-wing nuts?"

In case I want a membership.....:D :D :D

[popcornbird]

Debbie....those 'sayings' you posted are some of the sayings of Prophet Muhammad. Just so you know. ;) Truly words of wisdom to live by.

[Lady's Human]

For starters, the President has already spoken to the woman one on one in the white house shortly after her son was killed. After the meeting she initially spoke highly of the President.

Some time after, her story changed. She decided that she was completely against the President, and has made no statement why she has changed her mind completely on the issue. I frankly don't buy the "I was grieving and in shock at the time, now I'm just grieving and have recovered from the shock" line. I know people who have been killed and wounded in Iraq, and still haven't changed my core beliefs on the issue.

Should he speak with her again? Yes, please show her to be the media whore she truly is. In an interview with Kieth Oberman (MSNBC), she stated that she didn't want the President to speak with her at this point becase it would defuse the issue.

Somehow in all this, the media has forgotten that SPC Sheehan has other family members who are highly incensed at the path she has chosen. The media has ignored the fact that the current "spontaneous protest" is anything but spontaneous, but was set up with assistance from Moveon.org and other groups.

As far as criticising the President for being on vacation for a month, name any office besides POTUS that "being on vacation" means doing everything you would normally do at the office, but just doing it from your home instead of from the office. All his staff and communications gear go with him wherever he goes. There is no "vacation" from being Commander in Chief, just the same things to deal with in a different venue.

[lbaker]

I had a loose- wing nut once and the whole contraption fell down upon me. Learned that day to keep my nuts tight and my mind open.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Originally posted by Lady's Human
As far as criticising the President for being on vacation for a month, name any office besides POTUS that "being on vacation" means doing everything you would normally do at the office, but just doing it from your home instead of from the office. All his staff and communications gear go with him wherever he goes. There is no "vacation" from being Commander in Chief, just the same things to deal with in a different venue.

Well...just about any corporate CEO, and many executives I have kown for starters. Only they don't have quite as many people to carry their bags.... and it is five weeks....

[Lady's Human]

ES, no one is criticizing the Corp execs for doing it, and they have less to worry about. Besides, a Corp exec can turn out the comms for a day, the POTUS cannot.

[Samantha Puppy]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
[B]Now I get it! If I call groups who support the war in Iraq..."Fanatical far right-wing nuts" that is not inflamatory nor insulting to anyone here who might hold those same views.[/i]I know you're being sarcastic but yes. Why? Because no one here is a fanatic - or at least, has not made it known. I happen to LIKE President Bush and support the war. I, however, do not agree with the fanatical approach to anything - left- or right-wing.

Let me put this on a different scale. It's no secret that we're all animal lovers here. We all want to see animals treated kindly and animal cruelty and suffering end, right? Just because we want the same end result as PETA [claims they want], does that make us just as fanatical? Not in my eyes. There are differences in opposition and support. I'm talking of the nutjobs here - EITHER SIDE. The PETA people of the war effort.


I am also curious as to which groups you know her to be associated with that you would characterize as "fanatical far left-wing nuts?"I don't remember the names offhand, so give me a day or two to research it and find the sources I got this information from. Basically, they were the American left-wing version of the crazy religious groups over in Northern Ireland, like the IRL (I think that's one of them). I will either come back to this thread, or if it's dead by then, PM you.

[Pam]

I just heard on the news that she is leaving her *post* because she has found out her mother has suffered a stroke and has gone to be with her. It will be interesting to see if the crowds disperse. I doubt it. They have an agenda and it is not standing beside her and supporting her in her grief. :rolleyes:

[Edwina's Secretary]

I don't remember the names offhand, so give me a day or two to research it and find the sources I got this information from. Basically, they were the American left-wing version of the crazy religious groups over in Northern Ireland, like the IRL (I think that's one of them). I will either come back to this thread, or if it's dead by then, PM you.

I assume you are referring to the IRA (Irish Republican Army.) I'm not sure religious would be an adjective to describe the IRA. Generally speaking, religious and left-wing don't go together real well. The IRA's cause is independence from England. Don't know if that makes them religious or left-wing.....

[Lady's Human]

ES, My examples of fanatical nutjobs on both sides.....

Left wing nujobs:


Earth liberation Front (their actions don't even make sense......supporting the environment by torching vehicles, homes etc. and thus releasing toxic pollutants into the environment is pro environment?)

Animal liberation front: releasing animals into the wild to die....that's pro animal?

ACLU....They'll fight any case involving the First amendment, but won't touch ANY second amendment case. We're for civil rights, but we'll pick and choose the parts of the constitution we support.

Right wing nutjobs:

Pat Buchanan's America first party.........Pat buchanan , enough said.

the KKK, Church of the Creator, White Knights, and other racist right wing twits. David Duke, Nuff said

[Samantha Puppy]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary


I assume you are referring to the IRA (Irish Republican Army.) I'm not sure religious would be an adjective to describe the IRA. Generally speaking, religious and left-wing don't go together real well. The IRA's cause is independence from England. Don't know if that makes them religious or left-wing..... [/B] <banging head on desk> I never said that their interests were the same... I was trying to draw a parallel between the fanatical approaches they use to try and get their [DIFFERENT] points across.

[caseysmom]

Samantha's puppy...I understood what you meant, sorry I misunderstood or took it the wrong way before.

I agree that we need to finish what we started, to me though I can't imagine anyone being "for" a war, there is death involved. I realize when people say that they probably mean that they are "for" a solution and war is the only viable one in their opinion.

Please don't bang your head against the wall..you need to relax and enjoy yourself so your little guy grows up healthy.

[Prairie Purrs]

My, my. So many people are all upset because a mother wants an explanation of why her son died.

Given that the rationalizations given by Bush & Co. have shifted several times since Cindy Sheehan's meeting with Bush in the aftermath of her son's death (9/11! No, WMD! No, freedom for the Iraqis!), I think she deserves to know what the real story is.

As do we all.

Who are the people standing with Cindy? Many of them are military families and veterans who don't think we should have started this war. I've thought about going myself, but couldn't pull it off financially.

And as for any comparison between a peaceful protest and terrorism, well, by that standard Gandhi was a terrorist. That's some pretty shaky logic.

Go ahead and call me names if you want to. I'll keep standing with Cindy--I want some answers.

[Edwina's Secretary]

LH...you never know....the ACLU may be just the group to help you get your New York State driver's license.....:D ;) :D

[Lady's Human]

ES, no, there is going to be a bill introduced in the next session of the legislature to deal with the issue. By then I will have gotten a new SS card and it will be a moot point for me. Besides, the ACLU wouldn't touch my case with a 10 foot pole.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud
It is that kind of thinking (or non thinking) that got us all into
this mess. It' almost sounds like something George might have
said himself.

Sometimes it's kinda nice to find out that I am wrong about things.

It grounds me and I am not stuck up in the rarified air with the people who think they do know everything.

ES,

I do agree that the pics of the servicemen's coffins are a matter of public record. Each casket contains the remains of a young man or woman who went to do a job for their country and people that they never met before they went to Iraq.

To see Moore and the LWNJs use those pictures as a propaganda tool shows the disrespect they have for those people who protect their, yours and my write to speak about this subject.


And I am still waiting for the oil that all their spilled blood was supposed to bring to America.

Another lie from the left.

-----------------------------------------------

For the record, Who called who, what??


:confused:


---------------------------------------------

Basically the whole name calling thing somes from broadcasters who do not have one bit of respect for anyone.

You respect the person, then try to have a conversation about why the think the way they do. You respect their opinions and maybe you challenge them.


When hear people calling GWB an idiot (again, I am no HUGE GWB FAN) it just reinforces the idea that their will be no intelligent conversations after that point.

It comes down to respecting the office and the laws of the land.

Listen to Air America and the namecalling on that "station".

Liar, Jerk, Dummy, Idiot, Ass....

What a great ideal to align with.

Lose an election and you have every right to speak out against the winner.

Lose your cool, composure and start the namecalling - you forfeit the right to be taken seriously.

-----------------------------------

Again, everyone makes a big stink about hillbilly armor.

Bush wants to put billions into getting better equipment.

People complaing about the spending, forgetting that better equipment will keep our soldiers from being killed...

But "we support the troops but not the war".....Get a grip...

Support the troops and pay a few extra bucks to keep them safe.

War protestors use dead bodies to further their cause-
What a crappy way to honor them.....

War isn't pretty-we have fought them all across the planet - that is what keeps our tongues wagging with no fear of being told to shut up.

Support the troops, but respect them and the job they do,
Respect their remains. Respect their families.
Respect the fact that they may have had some questions about their mission in Iraq.

And while you are at it, have a little respect for the next guy, the place you live, the rules that you live by and the people running the whole show...

You don't have to agree with them......they will show their true colors soon enough, just treat them with a little respect....and leave the namecalling to the children....when they have or lose control of a situation they'll always toss out a few barbs...

------------------------

I respect Sheehan's right to protest, But I reserve the right to shake my head, and call her a media whore....poor woman, just another pawn in a game..

We will soon forget who she is, just like we forgot the woman in the 9/11 shockmentary..Maybe someone will put a nice epitah on her headstone.


"Here lies a woman who was used and then tossed aside to make a president look like a chump......What was her name again???"







:(

[lady_zana]

Listen to Air America and the namecalling on that "station".

Liar, Jerk, Dummy, Idiot, Ass....

What a great ideal to align with.

Sounds like Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reilly to me.......

[lady_zana]

Originally posted by Lady's Human
ES, My examples of fanatical nutjobs on both sides.....

Left wing nujobs:


ACLU....They'll fight any case involving the First amendment, but won't touch ANY second amendment case. We're for civil rights, but we'll pick and choose the parts of the constitution we support.



Hey, I support the ACLU but I'm not a left-wing nutjob....
wait a minute....
I am left-wing....
and if you ask any of my friends, they would for sure tell you I was a nutjob.....
(sorry, nevermind:D )

[Edwina's Secretary]

Originally posted by RICHARD

For the record, Who called who, what??


:confused:


---------------------------------------------
Lose your cool, composure and start the namecalling - you forfeit the right to be taken seriously.

-----------------------------------
And while you are at it, have a little respect for the next guy,
You don't have to agree with them..........and leave the namecalling to the children....when they have or lose control of a situation they'll always toss out a few barbs...

------------------------

But I reserve the right to shake my head, and call her a media whore



:(


I thought you were leaving the name calling to the children????

hmmmm..... Although I still don't understand what a media whore is? Would that nice young woman, Jessica....I can't remember her last name.....the one who enlisted to get a college education....who was injuried in a vehicle accident in Iraq, treated medically in a local hospital and released to American soldiers....on the cover of every magazine going....tv movie, parades.....would she be one? And can men be media whores or only women?

[RICHARD]

Stupid me....I always thought a media whore was more a verb than a noun....I'll explain it when I get home tonight...


I am still stunned. In the shower this morning I found out that I have the ability to be BOTH a LEFT AND RIGHT wing NUT JOB...

Poor Lance Armstrong....Stuck in the middle.:(

[katienoonan]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
I thought you were leaving the name calling to the children????

hmmmm..... Although I still don't understand what a media whore is? Would that nice young woman, Jessica....I can't remember her last name.....the one who enlisted to get a college education....who was injuried in a vehicle accident in Iraq, treated medically in a local hospital and released to American soldiers....on the cover of every magazine going....tv movie, parades.....would she be one? And can men be media whores or only women?

I believe you are talking about Jessica Lynch.

[DJFyrewolf36]

Originally posted by Pam
I just heard on the news that she is leaving her *post* because she has found out her mother has suffered a stroke and has gone to be with her. It will be interesting to see if the crowds disperse. I doubt it. They have an agenda and it is not standing beside her and supporting her in her grief. :rolleyes:

Sad but I'm sure true. This whole situation has just turned into another political game

[lizbud]

Originally posted by DJFyrewolf36
Sad but I'm sure true. This whole situation has just turned into another political game


There are many, many people who think the Iraq invasion on
trumped up reasons is nothing but a political game on a giant
scale. So very sad for our troops who look to our current leaders
for clear direction and purpose.

I believe Bush chose not to meet with Mrs Sheehan is that he's
much to busy still defending a failed policy.He's going out on the
road again because he has to try to drum up some support.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=1054425

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud
He's going out on the road again because he has to try to drum up some support.



I wonder if Tommy Lee would drum for GWB, he ain't doing nothing these days.

Pam,

No wonder Sheehan's mom blew a gasket....

You woulda thought she taught her kids better....:rolleyes:

[G.P.girl]

*cough*cough* COWARD *cough*cough*

[RICHARD]

*cough*cough* Woman who needs to do something more constructive with her time, something better than to shill for Micheal Moore-who is using her, then will discard her like all the other people he uses.... *cough*cough*

[DJFyrewolf36]

Thank you for posting that Jadapit! People need to realize what is important and quit bickering and moaning about what isnt

[Edwina's Secretary]

This is exactly the kind of blatant, mawkish, emotional manipulation this administration has been using to justify this war!

A few facts..... Suicide bombers are not ripped from their mothers' breast. They volunteer often with the full knowledge and consent of the family. Suicide bombing has been used in Israel by Palestinians for years and years ...male and female..... where are the tears for those mothers? Why weren't the marines sent in there?

And of course....that all important question....if these suicide bombers are Pakistani and Afganistan....why are we in Iraq????? The US military repeatly has stated that, until recently, most suicide bombers were from OUTSIDE Iraq.

Why it is okay for a US soldier to volunteer to die for his country, for what he believes in, but not a Arab? Did you read the interview with a guy who is in training to be a suicide bomber (TIme or Newsweek....can't remember.) He is PROUD to do it.

We have heard how Sheehan feels about her son's death, but have you heard the sentiment of those Arab mothers, or is it an assumption?

I keep hearing that freedom of speech is one of the reason we are at war....but then turn around and hear...."you are wrong if you use your freedom of speech to state a position contrary to ours!"

So now we are in Iraq so mothers there won't be beheaded.

And I thought it was because of WMD....or 9/11....or getting rid of Saddam.

And by the way.....is anyone REALLY expected to believe that Iraq is the most male dominated society in the world????????

So Cindy Sheehan should not disagree with her husband, but Iraqi women should....what arrogance!

Yes...let's focus on what is really important....our sons and daughters and their safe return from this war.

[lizbud]

The Human Factor

--------------------
Considering the human factor
--------------------

What I really want to know is whether that pain of loss in wartime ever
really goes away

Charles M. Madigan

August 23, 2005

Sometimes you get yourself in a mood that just won't let you go, and my
mood about Cindy Sheehan and what has flowed from her decision to
protest the death of her son by camping out at President Bush's ranch in
Crawford, Texas, is becoming one of those things.

A little over two years ago, I went to Bedford, Va., to talk to some
women and men who had lost friends on D-Day. Bedford had 35 young men in
the first wave of soldiers to push onto the beach, all National
Guardsmen, and 19 of them were killed in very short order. More died later.

What I really wanted to know was whether that pain of loss in wartime
ever really goes away.

Before the Iraq war death notices started coming in, I wanted to remind
people that each loss is an individual loss, that it breaks hearts
forever, one at a time.

It is so much more than a number.

The little town sits in the shadow of the Blue Ridge Mountains, a place
where your eye falls kindly on everything from the 19th Century
architecture to the forests along the range.

It seemed the kind of place just invented for storytelling.

Many people in the South have a gift for measured speaking that makes
it easy to take notes or listen for nuance, for suggestion, for that
taste of cadence.

It makes you think, "Well, this lovely woman could just as well be
singing," or, "You could dance to the way that man talks."

I chased around town looking for the right women.

Elizabeth worked at the drugstore in the telegraph booth on D-Day, and
she got the first word of Bedford's loss some time later when she
turned her machine on in the morning and the messages from the Department of
War to the families of dead soldiers started printing out.

Imagine that, sitting there in your little booth and seeing the names
of fellows that you maybe had dated, maybe had kissed under a
streetlight one hot summer night, maybe danced with, or kissed goodbye when the
troop train pulled out of Bedford so long ago.

"The secretary of war regrets ..."

It's a lot of heartbreak for a little town.

It must have been awful to be there in the weeks after D-Day and find
out about those deaths. Even all these years later, some of the women
still grew teary when they talked about their dead boyfriends, how this
one had a chest wound and had drowned on the beach when the tide came in
and washed his stretcher away.

"You just don't get over that," one of them told me.

The elderly woman who headed the draft board at the time recalled the
farmer who came bursting into the draft office with his loaded shotgun,
ready to kill everyone. Two of his sons had been sent off to war, and
one wasn't coming back. He was talked out of it.

How many times did those kinds of things play out? How noble did it all
seem a decade or so later, when the flags stopped waving and what you
were left with was an overwhelming loneliness for someone you will never
see again on this Earth?

That is why I am taking this opportunity to quietly curse Cindy
Sheehan's critics in word and thought far too inappropriate to be published in
a newspaper.

Sheehan made the choice to protest by plunking herself down in Crawford
and demanding to see Bush so she could ask him exactly why her son,
Casey, 24, was killed in an ambush in Baghdad's Sadr City in April 2004.

The reporters descended on her the way buzzards float down to pick at
roadkill. Supporters eager to voice their concerns about the war, toss
some rhetoric at Bush and maybe get some time on TV showed up too.

Sheehan has now become one of those unfortunate media creatures, which
diminishes her message and her impact.

She has complicated matters with her own comments about the president
as terrorist and her thoughts about Zionist conspiracies.

Those remarks have opened the door to White House apologists of many
stripes, who stepped in to criticize her quite aggressively, just as they
seem to mysteriously step in to criticize anyone with unkind words or
difficult questions for the president. Fine, that's how they play the
game.

Anyhow, Sheehan became a certified, confusing, big-time media event.

Let me say this, Cindy Sheehan, so you can use it later.

I am sorry you lost your son. There will be this empty space around you
for the rest of your life.

I know a place you can go down in the Blue Ridge where all the sweet
women will weep with you and share their memories later, perhaps when you
need them the most.

----------

Charles M. Madigan, the Tribune's Perspective editor, is also author of
The Rambling Gleaner at chicagotribune.com/gleaner.

[Jadapit]

I'm honestly sorry if I offened any of you by posting that. I feel bad about it.:( Popcorn you made a LOT of good points in your post. I will delete that post if you want me to, let me know and i will.

*edit*
I'm going to go ahead and delete it.

[Lady's Human]

A few facts..... Suicide bombers are not ripped from their mothers' breast. They volunteer often with the full knowledge and consent of the family.

ES, yes, they do volunteer, but they have often been taught that suicide bombing is a great way to martyrdom from the time they are old enough to comprehend. I forget whether it was Time or Newsweek, but one of the news mags had a picture of an infant "member" of Hamas wearing a fake bomb vest. Hamas confirmed that the image was real and not created b ythe magazine in the article.


Why weren't the marines sent in there?

They were, and over 200 of them came home in body bags, courtesy of the suicide bombers.






And of course....that all important question....if these suicide bombers are Pakistani and Afganistan....why are we in Iraq????? The US military repeatly has stated that, until recently, most suicide bombers were from OUTSIDE Iraq.

Most suicide bombers were from outside Iraq. However, the loveable little teddy bear, Saddam Hussein, was funding the terrorists. There were publicity shots of him handing $25,000 checks to the families of suicide bombers prior to the war.


Did you read the interview with a guy who is in training to be a suicide bomber (TIme or Newsweek....can't remember.) He is PROUD to do it.

Again, in many cases they've been "programmed" to be suicide bombers from infancy. Hard not to be proud to fulfill your programmed task.



The most important thing for the United States to do right now in Iraq is to stay the course and rebuild what was torn down, only rebuild it in a far better manner than the shambles of a government that was there prior to the invasion.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Curious LH..... did you actually read the article to which I was responding????

The US lost 200 soldiers in Israel? When was that?

But I know what you mean about bending young minds.... I see little boys around here dressed in military fatigues and playing with toy (I hope) guns all the time!

[Lady's Human]

The US lost 200 Marines to Hamas and Hezbollah in 1983 in the bombing of the marine barracks in beirut. Hamas and Hezbollah are are the most active of the terrorist organizations in the region. The marines were in Lebanon as peacekeepers, Lebanon is their home turf for most of the terrorist attacks on Israel, they didn't want US marines in their playground. They were not IN Israel, but what happened was because of their presence in the area.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary


But I know what you mean about bending young minds.... I see little boys around here dressed in military fatigues and playing with toy (I hope) guns all the time!

And I see young girls playing with Barbies all the time..

They grow up to be be terrorists themselves....

You see it on the license plate frames all the time.

I want to be Baribie, THAT biatch has everything.
-----------------------------

Randi Rhodes, that cornerstone of free speech was on her show telling the audience not to join the service.....specifically OCS....she told them to go to business school and make tons of money....then she blasted Rumsfeld and Cheney for using the was to make money.



:rolleyes:

[RICHARD]

Kids in the Middle East are not torn from the breast....they are sent to madrassas and taught to hate.

What would a mom think about that?

THere was a report I heard about Casey Sheehan's mom.
Casey's uncle put out a note saying that Casey joined the service to get away from his mother.

What would a mom think about that?

Now we have some mother that uses the body of her son to promote a political cause.

What would a mom think about that?

A woman who is using the death of someone else's son to
promote her cause.

What would a mom think abou that?


The answer to her question, How did my son die?

Is simple as it is gross.

He was killed my a piece of metal, an explosion or ????

If she is asking, WHY DID MY SON DIE..

That's harder to answer.

Belief? Duty? A job? Service? War?

I think that Ms Sheehan would be better served to ask OBL or Saddam. It was their answers that got this thing rolling...

(Sorry Scott Beamer.....)

I think Sheehan is the same kinda person that watches a loved one smoke themselves into oblivion and then proceeds to sue the cigarette makers because they cannot lay the blame at their own doorstep.

At the Marine Corps graduations in Camp Pendleton the families of the soldiers are told that thier sons and daughters do not belong to them anymore....they belong to the government.

Shehann lost her son three times.

The first time when he left her home
the second time to the government
and the third time in a land far away

The fourth time she lost was when she decided not to
let him rest in peace and honor his service to his country.

Hmmmmm,
Losing is a bitter taste.

Some people go on to win.....others wallow in sorrow and loss.

The fourth time's the charm.







:(