News Flash! [Archive]

shutterbug0303

04-16-2005, 05:49 PM

Accord - I don't want to damper your good day...but you do need to know some stuff about parvo

I definitely don't have all the info on this horrid disease, but it is a quick killer, as you are aware. What you may not realize it is EXTREMELY contagious to the other puppies...especially the younger one!!! Although Anastasia was outside, even if you went outside to feed her and were in contact with her, the virus was transferred onto you and then brought into the house. EVERYTHING she was in contact with needs to be disinfected with a Clorox solution. We almost lost our dobie to parvo when she was a baby....we spent thousands of dollars keeping her alive and making sure our other dobie at home did not get the disease (even though he had the vaccination for it...)

Please keep a close eye on the babies and watch for ANY signs of sickness. If you see a hint of anything, get on the phone with an ER vet ASAP if you want to keep them alive. This is not an easy thing to cure, nor is it an easy thing to get rid of after it has been around your home. Take all three of the pups to the vet on Monday and definitely get them their shots. You're right that something is better than nothing. But be sure to tell the vet that you just lost a pup to parvo when you go. They may want to do some testing

Best of luck with the new baby and your existing pups! Take good care of them...they are cuties!

senorita02

04-16-2005, 10:52 PM

I agree with shutterbug , i would not consider the other pups out of the clear quite yet. This disease is contagious, no matter the pups inside or outside pups, the disease can still spread and get them too. :(

Accord

04-17-2005, 03:02 AM

but the only thing that sucks is money... these puppies were actually given to us for free cause my nephew's mom didn't want them at her house. And he was going to jail at that time. so it pretty much put a hand full on us. and we barely have money to make it...

I will keep my eyes open for any hints. They are eating fine, drinking and playfull, boy the sleep too much! but they will manage through. We kep them busy at all times. Since Haylee Hunny has joined our Famliy shes been keepin them busy.

LorraineO

04-17-2005, 05:10 AM

Originally posted by Accord
but the only thing that sucks is money... these puppies were actually given to us for free cause my nephew's mom didn't want them at her house. And he was going to jail at that time. so it pretty much put a hand full on us. and we barely have money to make it...

Well sorry if this sounds rude,, but you shouldnt have taken those puppies if you cant obviously afford them... perhaps you should start looking for new homes for them after you find out if they are Parvo free?

MsMini

04-17-2005, 08:53 AM

Parvo has a 10 day incubation period so if this just happened you are not out of the woods yet.Even if you get them a shot today, they won't build an immunity to it that fast. Good luck with that.

Accord

04-17-2005, 01:17 PM

It may sound a little rude, yes. But if i didn't accept it, then everyone would say "oh you didn't accept it, that means they die or gets killed" mean stuff like that. And 2 of them are already sold, so Im still getting monthly rent from that. And the mommy owner will be paying for their shots and not me. I am paying for Moo-Moo, Bailey and Hunny Bear's shot tmw if I get my first paycheck today. which I hope.

Everything is cleaned with bleach. I dont feed Anya since J5's mom doesn't NOT want me to be responsible for her cause she doesn't trust me in some ways. j5 always goes to wash his hands no matter what. the puppie's bed is in the kitchen and its cleaned out with bleach every day. They have little sponge baths every 4 days.

They go for walks with me at the park every 2 days.. If im not busy with work.

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by Accord

They go for walks with me at the park every 2 days.. If im not busy with work.
Another very dangerous situation. Parvo is EXTREMELY contagious. If you go to the park where other dogs have been, the pups may very well get it. Parvo is so contagious that you can drive somewhere an infected dog has been and carry the virus on your car tires. A pup should not be let out until it is atleast 4 months old (vets recommend 5 months).

Unfortunatly, the virus will remain in the area it now is in for atleast 6 months, alot of times the virus will remain for years. It can not be washed away with disinfectant. Clorox bleach is the best, but there is no guarantee. Which means that it is still in your yard, on your clothes, your shoes, etc, and will remain there for months or possibly years. If you drove Anastasia to the vet in your car, it is in your car. I would not be surprised if the puppies have it. You need to start a plan right away to make sure that the puppies recover. If they areinfected, they only have a 50-50 chance for survival, so a plan is best. The symptoms will not show for 7-10 days after they come in contact, so hopefully there is time. If I were you, I would get the puppies to another home fast, incase they haven't been infected.

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 02:46 PM

Here is a website about parvo... http://www.animalclinic.com/parvo.htm

Unlike most other viruses, CPV is stable in the environment and is resistant to the effects of heat, detergents, and alcohol.

Due to its stability, the virus is easily transmitted via the hair or feet of infected dogs, contaminated shoes, clothes, and other objects. Direct contact between dogs is not required to spread the virus.

Dogs that become infected with the virus and show clinical signs will usually become ill within 7-10 days of the initial infection.

Young puppies less than five months of age are often the most severely affected and the most difficult to treat.

The best method of protecting your dog against CPV infection is proper vaccination.

As it says, pups under 5 months are the most difficult to treat. If you don't have enough money to care for these pups, find someone else to take them, because the treatment for three pups can take you into the thousands of dollars. Parvo virus can not be killed once the dog has it, so it's important that the pups are placed in a safer environment.

Accord

04-17-2005, 04:29 PM

Thank you for all those links and information, but the pups are not going anywhere. I have 2 of them sold, and I can't let the buyers down. They should hopefully get their shots tmw. I have the buyers helping me get the shots. So all I can do is wait.

It feels like everyone here wants me to get rid of them. So it kinda hurts a little. And confusing too.

If the puppies arent allowed to go outside till they are 4 months old, then they would be late using the bathroom and being house broken. Cause thats what happened to Anya. She was VERY late in house broken. The orginal owner kept the mom and the pups in the house in a small closet. EW its gross. Anya was 10 weeks old and we tried and tried. But the way she was raised, she just poop in the guest room, living room (thank god not Tazsie's room)

So we kept her outside. Since we knew it was best. So Im assuming that the puppies mom, Sheba (not anya's mom) had parvo-yes she was treated, possible carried for it. So I dont know.

Let just wait and see what happens, if they survive and they are safe in the house, then let it be. If they get it, and we tried. Thats our loss-again. So all I can say and do is to have faith.

MsMini

04-17-2005, 04:58 PM

Why don't the buyers have their pups now? Are they waiting until they are a certain age?
I hate to say it but Anya caught Parvo from where she was living or another dog. She wouldn't have carried it for 5 months. She would have been dead a long time ago.
There is a chance that the pups will be ok , but you have to know , they are very supceptible to it right now. And if they get it, what about their future owners?
I sure hope for the best with those cute puppies.

luckies4me

04-17-2005, 07:25 PM

WOW! :eek:

I cannot believe you are keeping the puppies in an unsafe situation like this. Why wasn't Anya vaccinated in the first place? How long did you try to housebreak her? Sometimes it can take a few months. You don't just throw them outside. :rolleyes: It's obvious you cannot care for these puppies so please do the right thing and find them a better home, and if they are sold please make sure to let the new owners know that they were exposed to the parvo virus.

luckies4me

04-17-2005, 07:39 PM

It sucks that she was only 5 months old, if she was a live now, she would have her first litter. But she didn't. She passed away so soon that it broke our hearts even more.

She was already pregnant at 5 months old? :confused:

Also, you said you didn't have money to take her to the vet, so how are you certain she did in fact have parvo without testing and being seen by a vet?

luckies4me

04-17-2005, 07:42 PM

http://www.petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?threadid=29244

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 07:45 PM

The link won't work for me.

luckies4me

04-17-2005, 07:46 PM

Odd. :confused:

Accord

04-17-2005, 10:06 PM

OK first, let me clear something up for ya'll ok?
I kept them safe. Which would u rather have me do? Have the puppies be killed in a dog pound? Or have them live with me? I did because I loved them and 2 of them were sold and maybe this will clear up something about the buyers waitin, They live out of state, where? California. And If I wanted to send them out there, it cost 30 bucks for Health Certificate then add the air fare, how much is that? plus other transportation. My friends whom are the buyers will find a way. 1 of the puppies will be going in may, and my best friend is moving here so her puppy stays here.

I was told that Anya HAD her shots. BUT is that proven? NO. This dog that my husband had was not mine. I did what ever I could to care for it. Anya was NOT my idea. Johnny's mother felt so bad for her son that she decided to get him a dog. We had a lab that disappeard 10 months ago. this is Johnny's dog that died. I have nothing to do with it because his MOM does not want me too. I didn't care what mom said, I did the best I could.

Why are all of you barking up my tree like I dont know nothing.

I got the shots happy now?

How am I certain that she had parvo? Because I used to work at a vet office. I went to classes for it. I got kicked out because I was deaf and I was "supposely" doing my work wrong. I do research here and there. And I have friends that have dogs here in town so they would tell me. MOST say that dogs can pass. But I didn't think they would. So its hard to believe. So obviously Anya didnt. AFTER i was told that she DID had her vaccinations. But no. I was lucky enough to have the buyers pay for the shots for their puppies. And Im gettin my first pay check tmw so I can get my own.

And no Anya was NOT pregnant. Visualize this: A puppy... not sick, you love it so much, and boom out of the blues she gets sick w/ parvo or any other deadly viruses/disease. And she's what? 5 months old, shes never experienced having puppies, you wont experince the excitment that you want, the yelling of "Oh my god! she has 4 oh no another one! theres more! its boy! its a girl! aww shes so cute, shes colorful" you know what I mean? You wont experince that is your first litter from your own dog? *EXCLUDING other member's famliy dog or relatives* You know what I mean?

Do you understand that now?

And stop barking up my tree. OK? Im doing EVERY way I can. You guys are not here to see it. I see it in my own eyes. I am trying. IF I see another thread like this, I will do the same thing back. Would that hurt your feelings? yea? But is it going to confince you to get rid of them or to try to save them? Money is silly. Its greedy, everything has a price to be paid.

So let me do my own thing ok?

They will get their shots TOMORROW. I got the money, I know how to do it and where to get it. So dont hassel me on trying to get rid of them.

be nice ya'll I haven't done anything wrong. I did my part, I tried. Im doing something to stop it from getting worse. Isn't this not good enough for ya'll? Are we going to have a cat fight on here? I hope not.
Accord

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 10:21 PM

Originally posted by Accord
I got the shots happy now?
How am I certain that she had parvo? Because I used to work at a vet office.
The shots will not help if the puppies already have the disease.

Parvo can't be determined unless the dog had tests done. Even with tests done, sometimes you'll get a false negative. It's not easy to detect just by looking at it, even though death is one big tip-off. If you worked in a vet's office you should know this. It could have bee a myriad of other conditions.

And no Anya was NOT pregnant. Visualize this: A puppy... not sick, you love it so much, and boom out of the blues she gets sick w/ parvo or any other deadly viruses/disease. And she's what? 5 months old, shes never experienced having puppies, you wont experince the excitment that you want, the yelling of "Oh my god! she has 4 oh no another one! theres more! its boy! its a girl! aww shes so cute, shes colorful" you know what I mean? You wont experince that is your first litter from your own dog? *EXCLUDING other member's famliy dog or relatives* You know what I mean?
No, I don't know what you mean...You wanted to breed your mutt? She wasn't even house-trained is was probably unstable from her former abusive situation...I don't know what you mean because I am not a backyard breeder...and would NEVER want to be! :eek:

They will get their shots TOMORROW.
I thought you just said they got them? :confused: I'm so confused..

By the way..without a full vet check, and assurance of their health...they won't be able to board the plane..

Accord

04-17-2005, 10:39 PM

I dont see any problems with them right now.

And I did want to breed Anya when she is 1 yr old or older. Not 5 months, hell no. Back yard breeder? ha... Maybe it shouldn't be your conern should it? Maybe you can't understand me because my launguage is lousy due to being deaf. Maybe try to add some words for yourself and see the concept.

Right (about the health certificate) So why should we spend this amount of money on the vet check, shots, if sick more, then transport it?

These buyers are deaf buyers. And I did them a favor. So Let it be. They know they've been warned. So Im doing my part.

I have the shots on ordered and will be ready tomorrow morning, I ordered them online and this place is pretty flexable. So I will get them in the morning.

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 10:49 PM

Originally posted by Accord

And I did want to breed Anya when she is 1 yr old or older. Not 5 months, hell no. Back yard breeder? ha... Maybe it shouldn't be your conern should it? Maybe you can't understand me because my launguage is lousy due to being deaf. Maybe try to add some words for yourself and see the concept.

A dog shouldn't be bred until atleast 2 years of age. Yes, backyard breeding IS my concern -- it's the concern of everyone who is involved in animal rescue or just loves animals. It's a very serious thing that is killing our dogs and I know everyone here can back me up on that. I never once stated that I don't understand you because you are deaf; Infact I never said that I didn't understand you at all. It sounds like you want to put me on a guilt trip so that I'll apologize. Do YOU understand what I'm saying? Backyard breeding isn't something to be reckoned with..It's a terrible thing. I commend the reputable breeders that take the time to fix the screw-ups that backyard breeders and puppy mills have made.

luckies4me

04-17-2005, 10:51 PM

Originally posted by Accord
I dont see any problems with them right now.

And I did want to breed Anya when she is 1 yr old or older. Not 5 months, hell no. Back yard breeder? ha... Maybe it shouldn't be your conern should it? Maybe you can't understand me because my launguage is lousy due to being deaf. Maybe try to add some words for yourself and see the concept.

Right (about the health certificate) So why should we spend this amount of money on the vet check, shots, if sick more, then transport it?

These buyers are deaf buyers. And I did them a favor. So Let it be. They know they've been warned. So Im doing my part.

I have the shots on ordered and will be ready tomorrow morning, I ordered them online and this place is pretty flexable. So I will get them in the morning.

Yes that would most definitely classify you as a backyard breeder. NO mixed breed dog should be bred, and even most purebred dogs shouldn't be bred and when they are it should be someone who wants to better the breed as a whole. You cannot put a dog through labor just for the sake of having puppies born. That is completely selfish, especially knowing how many dogs and cats in this world are euthanized each day when they cannot find homes.

Why should you spend the money to make sure they healthy? Because they are YOUR responsibility. If you CANNOT care for an animal do not keep it. Find it a suitable home.

Having worked as a Vet nurse for 8 years I am startled by your point of view when it comes to Parvo.

bckrazy

04-17-2005, 10:54 PM

Originally posted by Accord

And no Anya was NOT pregnant. Visualize this: A puppy... not sick, you love it so much, and boom out of the blues she gets sick w/ parvo or any other deadly viruses/disease. And she's what? 5 months old, shes never experienced having puppies, you wont experince the excitment that you want, the yelling of "Oh my god! she has 4 oh no another one! theres more! its boy! its a girl! aww shes so cute, shes colorful" you know what I mean? You wont experince that is your first litter from your own dog? *EXCLUDING other member's famliy dog or relatives* You know what I mean?

Do you understand that now?

No, I don't understand. That makes me sick. You get an abused unwanted dog and you want to breed her??? You don't even take the time to crate train her, throw her in your backyard, and are sad when she DIES because YOU didn't get to breed her? I cannot believe you worked in a Vets office or have been educated about responsible pet ownership. To bring puppies into that unsafe environment is horrible as it is. I HOPE you plan on spaying/neutering those puppies before they're adopted - most cities spay and neuter pit bulls for free. Do you know why so many puppies are killed, unwanted, and abandoned like yours were threatened to be?? Because of people like you.

I don't want to be mean, but this is what I would say to anyone with your beliefs. Please, please find a safe environment for your three puppies.

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 10:56 PM

Btw...If you can't afford vet care for the puppies, there is NO WAY you can afford to breed a dog. Atleast if you do it properly. Doing it properly costs thousands of dollars. But considering your choice of female to breed...it wouldn't have been done properly anyways. Even still, you need hundreds of dollars of backup money incase somethign goes wrong.

bckrazy

04-17-2005, 11:02 PM

Originally posted by Accord

Right (about the health certificate) So why should we spend this amount of money on the vet check, shots, if sick more, then transport it?

Because you SHOULD care about these dogs. If you care about them, love them, and want them to have good lives you will get their shots and get them checked by a professional vet. I seriously could not imagine you being a vet tech. . if that isn't obvious to you. I also assume that if you would've bred Anya, the puppies would be born in the backyard then? what a nice environment for vulnerable, helpless puppies!

Honestly, I would never judge you because you are deaf. I treat you as I would treat any other human being with the mindset that breeding and breeding mixed breeds and pet dogs for no reason is perfectly fine and acceptable. You seriously contradict yourself, on one end you try to be some heretic, like you have saved those poor Pittie pups from being turned into a shelter and killed. . and yet you think its great for everyone to breed their pet dogs? WHY are puppies dying in shelters? There are too many puppies in this country, thats why so many are dying, theyre dying because of senseless BYBs. Please, volunteer one day at a shelter and you will completely re-think breeding your "backyard" dog.

PJ's Mom

04-17-2005, 11:04 PM

Originally posted by luckies4me
Having worked as a Vet nurse for 8 years I am startled by your point of view when it comes to Parvo.

I'm not a vet nurse, and I'm startled. :eek:

Accord, no one is ganging up on you. You should listen to these ladies, they know what they're talking about. :)

dukedogsmom

04-17-2005, 11:18 PM

I can ignore this no longer. Add me to the list of concerned people. Even when pure bred dogs are bred, the RESPONSIBLE breeder does a huge amount of research on the two dogs that are to be bred to see if it would improve the breed.
Backyard Breeder
1. Motive for breeding: "fun", "good for kids", "to make money". Does not screen buyers and seldom refuses to sell, even if buyer is unsuitable.
Reputable breeder
1. Dedication to producing quality dogs is serious avocation. Has so much invested in dogs that he struggles to break even, not make a profit. Will sell pups only to approved buyers.
Taken from this link: http://www.jlhweb.net/Boxermap/reputablebreeder.html
Take a look at that chart.

Accord

04-17-2005, 11:22 PM

Hello, this is Johnny, and I was reading the forums on here. Since Accord is busy playing with the puppies.

I have come to an understanding that she feels that you guys are sort of jumping on her. Let me explain this to you guys.

Those puppies that we have were not our puppies. My nephew DH had a brindle pitbull with AKC. His family lets her out when Sheba wants to go out. So it all happens with a one night stand to 2 different dogs. So that would be backyard breeding would it? So theres a 2 standard mix of these puppies. Rott, and austrilliann shepard. He moved here and Sheba had her puppies in the guest room. DH offered 2 of them to us, one for for Accord's birthday and one was for to pay off rent. DH had to go to jail so he asked us kindly to take over NINE puppies. But he decided to take 3 of them instead. So we had 6 puppies left. Accord sold them in a heart beat so that they were paid and given away. Her friends live in california. So they are earning every money they can to get them there. Her friend is moving here in June so she's payin 10 bucks a month for dog food just specifically her dog.

I checked some of the other forums and I dont see anything that looks wrong.. but I do wnat to add, that we are blaming our nephew for not taking care of Anya. Accord's mom was in the hospital out of town, and I (honestly) dont like going up there becuase of problems. So I was being a loving husband and decided to go and be there for her and her mom. And we were gone for a month. So appearatly DH has not taken care of her. Just fed her and let be in the back yard. He complains she poops every where. He even had a roommate move in who isn't responsible for his own actions.

Plus Iam mad at my mom for lying to my wife that Anya had her shots. So theres no way Im going to accept another dog from my mom for as long as I know.

I think Accord was overwhelmed with blames and cussing and every body ganging on her. So I think she didn't mean to exclude the story about DH. So I figure I did. Cause I am on her side.

Dont judge her for who she is. She did her part while I was at work. And I just lost a job, plus Anya and overwhelmed, So Accord is 2nd in hand to try to help. So please be appericated that she did are part. And

And why are you guys trying to blame my wife? Im the one who is responsible for that dog, Anya. She isn't.

I hope you guys be nice to her after this. Dont jump on her.
Johnny 5

wolfsoul

04-17-2005, 11:26 PM

We weren't calling anyone a BYB for breeding the puppies -- it was the fact that Anya would have been bred had she lived long enough.

dukedogsmom

04-17-2005, 11:26 PM

Do your nephew a favor and take Sheba to the vet or SPCA and get her spayed.

bckrazy

04-17-2005, 11:28 PM

hm. I'm really confused?

Most of the reason anyone was angry, is because those puppies lives are in danger. Parvo is highly contagious, very costly to treat, and usually kills young puppies. And they are not vaccinated, which is the responsibility of any dog owner. Secondly, she said that SHE did intend to breed your backyard, mixed breed dog, which we are ALL against. Most of us volunteer at shelters and watch hundreds of thousands of dogs being put to sleep because they are mixed breed, unwanted, bred for "fun", etc. NO ONE cussed at her, thats not what we're about. I think we are all concerned for the health of those puppies, and we don't look lightly on breeding for "fun" or breeding "just because". . :rolleyes:

Accord

04-17-2005, 11:45 PM

This is Johnny again, sorry.

I do agree, I think DH should get Sheba spayed or to have more responsiblity for what she does and what his family should do when she goes outside to do her business (bathroom).

We will get them checked hopefully this coming up week. Just to be sure, before Accord gives them their shots.

Ill call around and see if we can get a cheap check up for the puppies. If you know any that are good and trustable business, please list them as well. Accord gets paid everyday cash and could get them checked. One step at a time. Accord can bill the owners who wants the puppy for vet checks. But thats between her and her friends. Im trying to help as well.

Im thankful Accord has a job, whew.

I think Accord has been feeling down lately and I wish I knew a littel better why. I know shes a good mom to those puppies, Ive seen it. She cleans their area well every day. We are trying not to take them outside yet till we can get some good chemicals to kill the ground bacteria, I think its called Ryce. Or if you guys know anything that can kill it about 90% or up? Or a good percentage? Let Accord know and she will keep me updated.

I wouldn't say she intend to breed them in the back yard. We did want to breed her with another dog that is the same as Anya. But Sheba is only 1 year and 4 months old and had 9 pups. So some do get prego at the wrong time. So animals can't be blamed for that. But we have to deal with it right?

I better give the computer back before Accord thinks I fall in love with this forum. Im not on here often cause I dont know what to look for or to enjoy searching. So happy typing and please try to help Accord if you can. She loves Anya as much as I do. Be there for her, since shes trying
J5

LorraineO

04-18-2005, 05:41 AM

Originally posted by Accord
It may sound a little rude, yes. But if i didn't accept it, then everyone would say "oh you didn't accept it, that means they die or gets killed" mean stuff like that. And 2 of them are already sold, so Im still getting monthly rent from that. And the mommy owner will be paying for their shots and not me. I am paying for Moo-Moo, Bailey and Hunny Bear's shot tmw if I get my first paycheck today. which I hope.

again,, I might remind you due in part ,, one has already died because you couldnt afford to take him to the ER Vet,,, you said that yourself,,,, so again,, you should be geting those pups to a place where they can get the proper medical attention and ALLL shots that are needed WHEN needed.

Jadapit

04-18-2005, 08:30 AM

Accord,
I did some research and the Roice-Hurst Humane Society in Clifton will give your dogs their shots for $10.00. Also, they help out with spaying and nutering. Here is a link to them with there phone number. Maybe you could call and talk to them.
http://www.roicehursthumanesociety.com/Spay,%20neuter%20and%20vaccination%20clinics.htm (http://)

I also have another link I would like you to take a look at. Its Pit Bull Sad Reality. I should warn you that a lot of the pictures on there are very graphic. But it does show you how so many people in this world treat the pit bulls. The site has a lot of great info on it. It might make you guys stop and think about bringing more pits into the world. There are so many that are unwanted in shelters that need homes. Why bring more into the world when so many need adopted from the shelters!?! As, you probably know the pit bulls are having a tough time so many people hate them and want them gone. We as pit bull owners have to change that and give them the good name that they so deserve. Please help to do that for the pit's sake. Your puppies are adorable and they deserve the best in life and it's up to you to give that to them.

Here is the link to the pit site.

http://www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/sadreality.html

Jadapit

04-18-2005, 08:35 AM

Me again, for some reason the link to the humane society wont work. Let me try it again.http://www.roicehursthumanesociety.com/Spay,%20neuter%20and%20vaccination%20clinics.htm

I hope it works this time. If it doesnt I will give you their phone #.
Let me know if you want it.

Dixieland Dancer

04-18-2005, 10:00 AM

From a reputable breeder standpoint.....Please spay or neuter these puppies ASAP. Breeding dogs takes a lot of research to make sure genetic disorders, temperment and overall breed standards are met. Health clearances are mandatory. If you can not provide any of this, then you should NOT breed and yes....I would consider you a backyard breeder in it strictly for the money!! :mad:

Unfortunately, your Anya died of a very serious disease. However at 5 months she should of had the proper shots to prevent this deadly disease from killing her. If you can't afford to get the dogs shots, you can't afford to breed them.

I have a very close friend who is also a reputable breeder. She spent a lot of money making sure everything was done correctly. Unfortunately, her female died after an emergency C-section was done to deliver the pups when complications arose. She was now faced with 9 pups without a mom to feed them. The time and money she was faced with to help those pups survive was staggering. While this is not normal, it is a possiblity. Any reputable breeder doesn't consider the cost though. They consider the well being of the pups. Again, please spay or neuter these pups ASAP as I do not feel from your posts that you are capable of providing the expense to make sure the breeding is done correctly let alone the fact that these pups are not pure bred to start with!

Bigyummydog

04-18-2005, 01:20 PM

hi, i'm barbra...i'm sure everyone wasn't trying to be mean...just trying desperately to get a very important point across...:) i've learned these people(myself included) are very passionate about their beloved pets, and about others....their reactions are for your benefit....most of these people are very well informed...i've learned sooo much from them...i too am worried about your little pitties...so many pit bulls are abused just because they are pit bulls...and don't give up PET TALK it really is an informative site and sooo much fun...;)

LKPike

04-18-2005, 02:13 PM

:rolleyes: I knew this would turn this way from Accord's very first posts. Even though these are her first times posting here.

But I can't help to say, I wonder how many people who "ganged up" on me, when I mentioned breeding Jillian someday, would be willing to apologize today. I was new too when that whole fight started, no one really knew me and I was called a byb, people from another board followed me onto this board just to continue the fight in my "They called me a byb!" post when I refused to respond to such immaturity on their board. However I decided to stay here because I know what I am, and what I am not. It was my decision to include all of you in our struggles with Jillian's epilepsy the day we found out, how close I was to a breakdown while watching my beautiful puppy flopping around on the floor. I'm sure most of you have read about the money we spent on emergency vets, 2 regular vets, hospital stays, her spay, complications from her spay, etc. So I was just wondering how many who were calling me a quote, "hopeless pathetic byb" and "Gawd help those puppies" at first, would apologize for that after actually getting to know me?

I'm in no way supporting Accord, in my opinion this IS an actual byb situation.

Sorry for thread stealing :p, but this brought up 'memories'.

finn's mom

04-18-2005, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by LKPike
:rolleyes: However I decided to stay here because I know what I am, and what I am not........So I was just wondering how many who were calling me a quote, "hopeless pathetic byb" and "Gawd help those puppies" at first, would apologize for that after actually getting to know me?

Well, I'm glad you stuck around, and, I hope that Accord does as well. Because no one is going to learn anything about anything if they're run off. As long as people are willing to educate and not get so emotionally involved as to come across as ugly, Accord could actually benefit from this site. I hope the puppies are safe. That's all I really want to say. :)

Accord

04-18-2005, 03:08 PM

Originally posted by Dixieland Dancer
From a reputable breeder standpoint.....Please spay or neuter these puppies ASAP. Breeding dogs takes a lot of research to make sure genetic disorders, temperment and overall breed standards are met. Health clearances are mandatory. If you can not provide any of this, then you should NOT breed and yes....I would consider you a backyard breeder in it strictly for the money!! :mad:

Unfortunately, your Anya died of a very serious disease. However at 5 months she should of had the proper shots to prevent this deadly disease from killing her. If you can't afford to get the dogs shots, you can't afford to breed them.

I have a very close friend who is also a reputable breeder. She spent a lot of money making sure everything was done correctly. Unfortunately, her female died after an emergency C-section was done to deliver the pups when complications arose. She was now faced with 9 pups without a mom to feed them. The time and money she was faced with to help those pups survive was staggering. While this is not normal, it is a possiblity. Any reputable breeder doesn't consider the cost though. They consider the well being of the pups. Again, please spay or neuter these pups ASAP as I do not feel from your posts that you are capable of providing the expense to make sure the breeding is done correctly let alone the fact that these pups are not pure bred to start with!

Excuse me? I wasnt the one who was responsible for the shots for Anya. Why dont you blame the owner that BREEd her in her damn back yard? huh? Anya is not a purebred. Trust me.

Fine for your information I wont breed my pits then. happy?

If you guys want to gang up on me. Fine Ill bail. Cause I will not accept this bs on me. THIS IS JOHNNY'S DOG THAT DIED SO DONT JUMP THE HELL ON ME! DONT PUT ME AS A VICTIM OF SOMETHING I DID NOT DO. JOHNNY WAS THE ONE WHO SUFFERED WORSE THEN I DID. NONE OF YOU ARE SATISFIED WITH WHAT I HAVE TO SAY. IF I DID MY BEST TO TAKE CARE OF HER, PLUS 6 PUPPIES AND A DAUGHTER. WHILE JOHNNY IS WORKING. CMON NOW!
WHY ARE YOU JUDGING ME? I PROVIDED THEM A ROOF OVER THIEIR HEAD, I PROVIDED THEM LOVE, I DID THE BEST I COULD. AND LET IT BE.

IF THEY GET PREGNANT ON THEIR OWN AND WE DONT KNOW, YOU CAN'T BLAME ME FOR THAT BECAUSE I DONT HEAR WHATS GOING ON AROUND MY HOUSE CAUSE I CAN'T HEAR. MOST OF THESE PUPPIES ARE MY HUSBANDS. I HAVE 1 GIRL PUPPY. SO WHATS THE DIFFERENCE? I HAVE A FRIEND WHO HAS 3 PITBULLS AND BOTH ARE BROTHER AND SISTER. SHE BREEDS THEM CAREFULLY AND SELLS THEM TO THE RIGHT PROPER HOME, AND THE RIGHT PERSON WHO KNOWS HOW TO SHOW THEM LOVE. JUST LIKE I DID. I HAVE 5 PITBULLS IN THE HOUSE. AND THEY ARE LOVED, AND HAS THEIR SHOTS. NOW THE ONES THAT ARE SOLD IS NOT MY DECISSION TO SPAY THEM OR NOT. IF THE BUYER WANTS THEM SPAYED, THATS FINE. THEY PAY FOR IT. IF THEY DONT. THEN DONT HARRASS ME FOR IT. CAUSE I AM NOT GOING TO DISAGREE. ONCE ITS BROUGHT, IS "AS IS" THE BUYER CAN DO WHAT THEY WANT. MOST PEOPLE WILL SEE THEM FOR HIGH PRICES. AND I WONT BECAUSE IM NICER THEN THAT.

Now no more drama. Let them go. I dont need some mean people jumping on me because Im new here.

The puppies had their vet checked today and I GOT LUCKY. How? There is a place called Banfield and they do free exames and I ask them if they could bill me monthly for the check ups. And they said it was fine. So they did the test results and I got a call from them saying that all puppies are FINE. But they are redoing the test to be sure. So Now you can't do anything.
If they passed the parvo virus test by negative, then they are all good. So obviously they did. and im glad, so now they have their first shots. Im happy. So should you guys.

Im sorry for the yellin but I dont like to be critized because Im different from others and I take it MORE seriously then others do. Becuase most people will discrimiate deaf people, and I have suffered from that. So Im gettin serious on this. So dont say the wrong word or you will get jumped back just like this. I dont like to be called anything. Please dont push your limits.

Im still new, and I dont need this after Anya has passed away. Dont make me suffer more.

I was being lied to by the backyard breeder of Anya. So why dont you guys jump on her for it? I shouldn't be blamed for it. Johnny's mom was the one that got her for 250 bucks as a PUREBREED... Then later mom's friend that worked at the bank took her puppy to the vet and said it WAS NOT A PUREBREED! And had no vaccine as proven on the computer. So why dont you guys call someone else a backyard breeder of Anya? I didn't do anything. So hell no shes not going to be bred cause I have changed my mind... and f*ck no the pitbulls are not getting bred.

Bye

caseysmom

04-18-2005, 03:27 PM

Oh good lord because your deaf you won't take responsibility for your dogs breeding? I think we have all heard enough, is this a joke?

LKPike

04-18-2005, 03:27 PM

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: aaaand you accussed these nice people that *are* Pet Talk, of cursing and swearing at... YOU? mmmhhmmm.....

luckies4me

04-18-2005, 03:36 PM

Heh, don't really know what to say. So as long as the puppies are sold and you get the money you could care less what their new owners do to them? VERY responsible. ;)

bckrazy

04-18-2005, 03:38 PM

I feel so bad for all of the dogs involved :( SO bad

Dixieland Dancer

04-18-2005, 03:38 PM

Originally posted by Accord
IF THEY GET PREGNANT ON THEIR OWN AND WE DONT KNOW, YOU CAN'T BLAME ME FOR THAT BECAUSE I DONT HEAR WHATS GOING ON AROUND MY HOUSE CAUSE I CAN'T HEAR.

First, let me apologize for coming on harsh. I was reacting to the point that you said you were going to breed your girl when she turned a year old.

Second, your quote above is cause for disagreement because if they are neutered or spayed, they can not get pregnant. Being a responsible pet owner means you should do all you can to prevent "accidents" from happening. Females should be fixed before their first heat cycle which can occur as early as 6 months although it is more common to happen around 7 to 9 months. Males should be neutered no later than 6 months. If you take these precautions, you will not have to worry about not being able to see or hear what is going on.

I am glad you made the decision not to breed. I hope you stay around Pet Talk long enough to realize everyone here is not ganging up on you but trying to educate you to the problems of dog over population and too many furry friends being abused or uthinized in shelters because of lack of responsible pet ownership. You are showing a very responsible side by making the decision to spay and neuter the pups or to ensure whoever gets them does.

finn's mom

04-18-2005, 03:39 PM

Goodness. :(

PJ's Mom

04-18-2005, 03:39 PM

Wow.

Daisy and Delilah

04-18-2005, 03:53 PM

Sorry to post to this thread and maybe it's none of my business but I can't help it.
Accord: First of all, no one here is trying to penalize you for being deaf. You keep bringing this up as a reason why everyone is responding to you the way that they are. After I read and re-read this thread over and over, I have concluded that you're missing the point of the entire matter. Please slow down and re-read what you have written. Your description of what has and is happening tells a certain story. Go back and carefully read what you have already said. Please understand that the people here at Pet Talk are the cream of the crop of responsible pet owners. They only have the welfare of your dogs at heart. Can you not see this? No one is blaming you for anything. Everyone is merely suggesting that you might want to make some better choices in the future. We all love animals and only want the best for them. What could be wrong with this concept? Now you've gotten yourself angry and upset but you still don't seem to know why. You've done the right thing by getting the puppies checked out so please calm down and use this forum for the help that it can provide. Terry

wolfsoul

04-18-2005, 04:06 PM

I wasn't calling you a BYB for breeding the pitbulls, and I never said you had bred Anya. I called you one because you wanted to breed her even though she's a mutt with a bad background, she isn't health certified, pedigreed, titled, etc. I think that's whaty most people were thinking, though it seems they may have gotten confused due to all of the dogs involved. I'm glad to hear that the puppies aren't sick -- it probably wasn't parvo that took Anya then. That's a good thing because parvo has the tendency to follow you around. I am not jumping on you ebcause you are new here -- if anyone came on here and said that they had wanted to breed their dog, I would be angry and feel a need to explain why, even thought the dog is no longer alive. One reason because a BYB doesn't usually just do it once, nor do they get the idea of doing it and it just goes away. Unless they are properly educated they might continue wanting to breed.

Please, if you want to breed dogs, do it properly...Breed purebred dogs that come from reputable breeders. They should be health certified for whatever problems might be in the breed (Pennhipp, OFA, OVC, CERF, BAER, etc). They should have pedigrees so you know what lines might compliment another and how closely related the male and female are. They should be involved in some activity (herding, agility, conformation, schutzhund, etc). And many MANY other things that define reputable breeding. Of course due to your money problems, you couldn't do this for a really long time, because breeding is very expensive. So please, if you ever get another unaltered dog, do not breed it. There's alot of heartache involved when you don't do it properly --- Or, as Dixieland Dancer already explained -- sometimes when you DO do it properly.

I am not trying to gang up on you or be mean. I'm only concerned about the amount of dogs dying everyday because of people who think it's great to let their dog have a litter when they have no idea.

I also think the puppies should be spayed. It doesn't matter if you can't hear (though that confuses me, as you already said in another post that you can hear with a hearing aid), it is YOUR responsibility. Everyone has some sort of disability -- they are still responsible for what goes on around them. If you choose not to alter the pups then they should be seperated at all times. Keep diapers on them atleast. If you can't afford proper dog care then you can't afford to get blood stains out of your carpet and urine stains off of everything the male marks.

If you go to your SPCA and show them proof of your yearly income, they will spay and neuter them for free. I'm sure you can afford free.

dukedogsmom

04-18-2005, 04:15 PM

You can't use being deaf as an excuse for everything. You can be deaf and still be responsible. That includes spaying or neutering your dogs. As for the rudeness and cursing, the only one guilty of that is you.

jackie

04-18-2005, 04:21 PM

I would like to post something now, but I think I would probably regret it later.

Please get your pups taken care of, and recognize the people on this board are trying to help, not criticize you.

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 04:56 PM

these puppies were actually given to us for free

You have to realize nothing in life is free and of course they will be lots of money....and my first puppy when I was 5 lucy died of parvo:( . Just take really good care of them please and no if they already have parvo the shot won't help them... This is all I am going to say. :)

Accord

04-18-2005, 04:58 PM

Fine.. I just keep this to myself.

I have decided that Im not going to breed them because its going to be too much money. And that after just starting this job, hopefully will pay off the 500 buck vet bill for the check up that they had this morning. So Im thankful that they accepted a monthly payment of 100 a month.

Also the money is not going to me. Its going to my nephew cause he wants the money and it "was" his dog's puppies. So basically Im getting the money to book it into his jail for food and letters etc. So it doesn't give me a choice to keep the money. Unless I have a good reason. So now I have friends (who brought them) and they are helping with the food and shots. Im being fair to them by getting it checked up for them.

I did send them an IM and asked if they wanted their puppies spayed, and both requested no cause its too mean to do that. thats how they felt. So all I can say is I accept their request and I can't go further then what they ask.

Im not guilty for my swearing cause thats how mad I am right now.

But labeling someone BYB is insulting. As I have read in most of the post. So for ya'll sakes, I wont breed them. Period, no more comments on that BYB nonesense.

I can hear with a hearing aide, but you can't take a shower with it, cause its not waterproof, and you can't sleep with it at night cause it fall sout of your hear. And if you have a ear ache, it hurts to wear it. So hopefully that clears up the confusion.

So the 1st puppy is going home in May. Im driving up to Utah and have it delievered by car from a friend. The 2nd one that is sold will be here till the owner moves here in June. (She paid for the dog food and shots) If they decide to change their mind to spay them, they will send me a request and I will get that done for them.

their test came back and its negative for parvo and other deadly diseases. The vet says they will have their first Rabie shot when they are 6 months old. Which is in August. So I wrote that to the owners by snail mail. So they will get that by thursday hopefully.

All of the puppies (5 of them, the oldest one is 4 months old) have passed the test. (the good way) They are active, eating, sleeping, playing and having stinky poops (yuck)

Also jadepit, I saw the website and it makes me puke. There is no way those pits will end up like that. I love them so much that they wont suffer like that. Eeeh its nasty. ::shivers::

Ive had my own dog for 6 yrs and the one before that was 1 yr and half. the first one was my sister's christmas dog. and my dad didn't know what to do ( I was 14 at the time and volunteeering at Brickyard) Maddy had a heat stroke and I was trying to put cold water under her chin and kept her in a cool place. Dad said we are going out to eat. (this was in Moab, UT) and I tried to save her. and my dad just didn't want to take her to the vet.. So she died in my dad's truck. And I never forgave him for that, even now, I still dont.

about 2 to 3 yrs later, my sister got another puppy for christmas from a different boyfriend. and we took care of her again, and shes doing great. shes healthy. I haven't seen her for a while, so I dont know what the updates are for her now.

I hope we can move on from this.
Accord

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 04:59 PM

Originally posted by jackie

Please get your pups taken care of, and recognize the people on this board are trying to help, not criticize you.

I agree 100% :)

MsMini

04-18-2005, 05:20 PM

"I HAVE A FRIEND WHO HAS 3 PITBULLS AND BOTH ARE BROTHER AND SISTER. SHE BREEDS THEM CAREFULLY AND SELLS THEM TO THE RIGHT PROPER HOME, AND THE RIGHT PERSON WHO KNOWS HOW TO SHOW THEM LOVE. "

Am I reading this right???????

luckies4me

04-18-2005, 05:32 PM

Originally posted by MsMini
"I HAVE A FRIEND WHO HAS 3 PITBULLS AND BOTH ARE BROTHER AND SISTER. SHE BREEDS THEM CAREFULLY AND SELLS THEM TO THE RIGHT PROPER HOME, AND THE RIGHT PERSON WHO KNOWS HOW TO SHOW THEM LOVE. "

Am I reading this right???????

I was wondering the same thing earlier. I was also wonderfing WHY these people who are taking the puppies think spaying their puppy is "mean"? Spaying a dog helps reduce the chance of ovarian and uterine cancer, helps reduce the dogs urge to roam (run away from home) to look for a mate, etc. etc. It's a very simple procedure that is done every day and helps curb the pet overpopulation problem.

MsMini

04-18-2005, 05:35 PM

I agree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How do you do that quote thing??? LOL

shutterbug0303

04-18-2005, 05:50 PM

MsMini...there is a "quote" button on the right side of the post you want to quote.... ;)

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 05:51 PM

Oh my :(

CagneyDog

04-18-2005, 06:12 PM

Originally posted by Accord
[B]Fine.. I just keep this to myself.

I have decided that Im not going to breed them because its going to be too much money. And that after just starting this job, hopefully will pay off the 500 buck vet bill for the check up that they had this morning. So Im thankful that they accepted a monthly payment of 100 a month.

I am glad you decided not to breed them however I am still very disgusted by this whole story.

You shouldn't be breeding her period. You are not breeding her to better the breed, and that alone, proves that you are not a responsible breeder. You don't deserve to own the dogs, I can't believe the only reason you didn't breed her was because it would cost to much money. Thats sick.

Originally posted by Accord
[B]Also the money is not going to me. Its going to my nephew cause he wants the money and it "was" his dog's puppies. So basically Im getting the money to book it into his jail for food and letters etc. So it doesn't give me a choice to keep the money. Unless I have a good reason. So now I have friends (who brought them) and they are helping with the food and shots. Im being fair to them by getting it checked up for them.

You are all in it for the money. Thats disgusting. People like you don't deserve to own such wonderful animals.

Originally posted by Accord
[B]But labeling someone BYB is insulting. As I have read in most of the post. So for ya'll sakes, I wont breed them. Period, no more comments on that BYB nonesense.

When they called you a BYB they weren't labeliing you. It was the truth.

I

jackie

04-18-2005, 06:14 PM

But labeling someone BYB is insulting. As I have read in most of the post. So for ya'll sakes, I wont breed them. Period, no more comments on that BYB nonesense.
BYB stand for Back Yard Breeder.
It seems like you think thats some sort of curse word. It is just a term for people who breed and sell dogs for a profit. This is was you were saying you wanted to do. This is why people were calling you a BYB.
BYB'ers are a serious problem, and are one of the reason why MILLIONS of animals are put to sleep in shelters around the world every year.

I did send them an IM and asked if they wanted their puppies spayed, and both requested no cause its too mean to do that. thats how they felt. So all I can say is I accept their request and I can't go further then what they ask
It is not mean or cruel to spay/neuter you dogs and animal. READ ME (http://www.petrescue.com/spay-neuter.htm)

One more thing that is bothering me about this thread is that you keep pulling out the pity card.
NO ONE on this board is saying anything about you being deaf.
YOU are the only one bringing it up, and seem to be using it as a "get out of jail free" card...

IF THEY GET PREGNANT ON THEIR OWN AND WE DONT KNOW, YOU CAN'T BLAME ME FOR THAT BECAUSE I DONT HEAR WHATS GOING ON AROUND MY HOUSE CAUSE I CAN'T HEAR.

You are responsible for your own actions and for the welfare of those puppies, regardless of your hearing disability. If you cannot handle the stress and strain of owning dogs, maybe you should think twice about owning even one dog.
This is not an attack, please don't feel like it is. Once again, please take care of those pups

wolfsoul

04-18-2005, 06:22 PM

Originally posted by jackie
It is just a term for people who breed and sell dogs for a profit.
Not just for profit..I know more people that do it for "the fun." It's the fun of seeing what your dog's puppies will look like. Then other times it's to let your children see the miracle of birth. Some people think it's healthier for their female to have a litter before she is spayed. Some people want a puppy just like their dog. Some people just keep their dogs unaltered and don't care if they breed.

The friend who breeds siblings...that's just wrong...:eek: I don't disagree with line-breeding, but I completely disagree with inbreeding.

jackie

04-18-2005, 06:28 PM

ty for the correction Wolfsoul. :)

I think one thing that everyone here can agree on, is that there are enough unwanted and homeless dogs in this world.
BYB'ing is totally unnecessary...

Accord, please
READ ME (http://www.nopuppymillscanada.ca/back_yard_breeders.htm)

Accord

04-18-2005, 07:10 PM

Im removing myself off the board... So till you guys stop hypotizing me that Im a "backyard breeder" I AM NOT. Period.

Stop trying to think your above me. If my friends dont want it. Accept it. If they dont want it, let them decide. They dont want to worry about it right now. Ok? STop trying to repeat the phrase over and over.

I dont want the money duh. I gave it all to my nephew in jaiil. Since its his puppy and he wants me to sell it for him. Thats fine. So your loss not mine. I have a job, Please! 16.00 an hour? I just started it today. So hush. zip. nada.

The puppies will not be spayed or neutered. IF the owners request it, then let them request it. Dont make me think ya'll are right. In some ways you maybe right. But if this is what the buyers want. Accept it. Let them make their own mistakes ok? If they backyard breeds them, thats their problem not mine. I am ONLY BABYSITTING them till they are able to go.

Back off. I know you guys are trying to help me. But dont push it too much. I can't make the buyers disagree with me and fight and fight and then I have to give the money back from my nephew. Or with my own working money. No way.

If you were working for your boss, and he ask you to do something for him, would you argue back and disagree? And then you lose your job right.
So the situation is pretty much the same. The buyers are my "boss" and I am helping/working for them. And if I dont do waht Im told or to respect what they want, I lose my friends, I lose the trust I have in them. And they would send the puppy back, or sell it to someone else. And I would have to pay it back. So does that show the picture.

So Im going back to work and I will be back later. And I expect to see some positive stuff on here. and not arguable issues. You might not be reading all that there is. but Im not going to bred them, and Im not going to spay/neuture them. I can't do anything about it. Ok?

Good bye Im going back to work.
This is typed from a Sidekick II
Accord

MsMini

04-18-2005, 07:26 PM

How many dogs are there anyway???

Daisy and Delilah

04-18-2005, 07:27 PM

Good question Ms. Mini! The whole thing is pretty confusing isn't it?

Terry, Daisy, and Delilah

MsMini

04-18-2005, 07:34 PM

I still can't figure it all out...:(

IRescue452

04-18-2005, 07:46 PM

Your buyers are not the boss, the seller is. Make sure you inform them of all the consequences of not spaying; cancer, roaming male dogs, being in heat as a whole. You obviously don't have a puppy contract. I agree with all of the people on this board. I think you are confusing the meaning of backyard breeder. It has nothing to do with the dogs actually being in your back yard, and everything to do with the reasoning for breeding and the poor caretaking methods. By the way, it wasn't until like the third page that we found out you were deaf, and they were yelling at you long before then, no discrimination there. I also do kind of hold you responsible for the death of the other dog, did you just sit there and watch it get sicker and sicker without doing anything?!

LorraineO

04-18-2005, 08:12 PM

My GAWD girl.... you use your impairment as an excuse,, that initself is inexcuseable,,,

you cant afford treatment and so a pup dies needlessly??

youre breeding siblings?????

You say you got them shots in one post,, then in the next breath,, you say your GETTING them the next day?

You claim to remove yourself from the board and in the same post,, warn us to not post anything negative and demand to see something good when you get back later??

If I lived near you,, I would report you!

Suki Wingy

04-18-2005, 08:29 PM

I saw you are removing yourself from here, but if you see this, accord, PLEASE please PLEASE read this all!!!!!
http://www.furryfriendsfoundation.com/Information/TheLastWalk.htm
It is not your fault, and no one is blaming you, you are just misinformed. Here are some quotes from this article.
"'I look at the list, and some nights it's 20 dogs, 15 cats. My God, that's too many. That's the sad part. But where would they go?"'

"26,000 of them dogs and cats, are impounded. Of the 30,000, about 3,000 are adopted out and 3,500 are taken in by other shelters and rescue facilities, if they have room. Perhaps 5,000 more are reclaimed by their owners. The rest? You do the math. "People have to understand we don't have a choice," says Melanie Sobel, director of program services at Animal Care and Control. "This is an open-door shelter, we're open 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. People just don't realize the magnitude."'

And here they are talking about euthenizing dogs, just in one shelter, one of about 4 or 5 for this area.

The smallest could be 10, but they average 25," she says. "It could go as high as 35. I don't think I've ever gone more than 40. And I don't think I've ever seen a day of zero. Not with the number of impoundments we do. That'd mean every dog we impounded was perfect for adoption. And that just doesn't happen."

I really hope you choose to stay around here and learn and continue to let the wonderful members of pet talk educate you. We all understand that these quotes are the reality of this country, and that it is by all means not pretty. Please do your part to eventually stop it.

~~Eva.:)

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 08:35 PM

Ugh this whole story makes me sick :(

click me (http://www.justonelitter.com)

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 08:43 PM

Originally posted by LorraineO
My GAWD girl.... you use your impairment as an excuse,, that initself is inexcuseable,,,

you cant afford treatment and so a pup dies needlessly??

youre breeding siblings?????

You say you got them shots in one post,, then in the next breath,, you say your GETTING them the next day?

You claim to remove yourself from the board and in the same post,, warn us to not post anything negative and demand to see something good when you get back later??

If I lived near you,, I would report you!

So would I. EVeryone learns from mistakes and I REALLY hope you learn from your mistake(s)!!! I certainly would report you if I lived near you.

MsMini

04-18-2005, 08:46 PM

What do ya do? This seems to be a common attitude unfortunately.The more you try to educate, the more they get defensive.

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 08:48 PM

Originally posted by MsMini
What do ya do? This seems to be a common attitude unfortunately.The more you try to educate, the more they get defensive.

:confused:

Daisy and Delilah

04-18-2005, 08:49 PM

What makes me the sickest about it is that no matter how much good help and advice she has been given, she is only getting angrier by the minute. Are these dogs any better off than they were to begin with? I'm really not sure. Accord: You tell everyone to stop acting like they're above you. You're the one that is acting like you're above everybody. Why are you so defensive? I think you're the one that started all the negativity so be careful of what you're accusing others of doing. These are just helpful suggestions, questions, and concerns. Something is very clear to me and many others obviously, you are seriously confused. I believe there are many more issues in your life that are causing this reaction from you. You have contradicted yourself so many times it's hard to believe. Do you understand the purpose of this board? Am I right in saying(among other things)that yesterday you were broke so bad you could barely get by and today you're working and making $16 an hour. What you've been saying is, for the most part, making very little sense. Are you aware of this? Anyway.......congrats on your job and I truly hope everything works out for you. God Bless your beautiful dogs. What can you buy in jail? Terry(D & D's Mom)

MsMini

04-18-2005, 08:51 PM

I just hope the pups make it and get to new homes and there won't be any more pups there to get sick...:(

Daisy and Delilah

04-18-2005, 08:51 PM

AMEN MsMini!!!!!!:D

luvofallhorses

04-18-2005, 08:54 PM

Originally posted by MsMini
I just hope the pups make it and get to new homes and there won't be any more pups there to get sick...:(

me too sorry I misread your last post :o amen to that sister!

Cincy'sMom

04-18-2005, 08:55 PM

All I can say is WOW :(

MsMini

04-18-2005, 09:02 PM

After reading this all over again , it just makes me sad.

bckrazy

04-18-2005, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by Accord

Also jadepit, I saw the website and it makes me puke. There is no way those pits will end up like that. I love them so much that they wont suffer like that. Eeeh its nasty. ::shivers::

It makes me cry, it makes everyone cry, and it happens in literally every big city in the U.S., daily. How do you know your pups won't turn out that way (I am callign them your pups because they are YOUR responsibility now, whether you're "babysitting" them or not, you can choose a good home for them in you want to)? What about THEIR puppies (which they inevitably WILL produce since their owners are ignorant and will not spay them)?! Have you given the new owners adoption contracts? Will you take these dogs back in 1-10 years if the new owners don't want them anymore? If you don't, they could EASILY end up in horrible hands and being used as bait dogs or fighting dogs, or breeding for the rest of their lives. Again, the SPCA will spay/neuter those Pit puppies for FREE! If I were you, no, I would not allow some one to adopt any dog if they believed altering a dog is "mean". Whats really mean is allowing your unspayed dog to be impregnated, giving birth twice a year for the rest of her life. It is really mean to give those puppies to people who don't know a thing about dogs, and who will probably lose interest and abandon the dogs later on. It has happened many, many times before. You SAY they won't end up that way, but obviously you have NO way of knowing that.

I don't think you realize the HUGEness of this. Those two females can (and probably will :() produce HUNDREDS of puppies in their lifetime! Pittie puppies are unfortunately a dime a dozen in shelters because of all of the irresponsible abusive neglectful exploitative people who tend to breed these dogs, and you can be sure that most of them will be PTS. It's a vicious cycle, and YOU can prevent that right now! It IS up to you, you can turn down those people who supposedly didn't want the pups to be spayed, and you can find responsible, wonderful owners for the pups who know something about dogs. I don't know if you realize that these puppies aren't property or merchandise, they have feelings, souls, and lives too.

Accord

04-19-2005, 01:00 AM

*Been withdrawn* Ok. Im going to let this go.

I have been jobless for 4 yrs and still trying to get a job, and luckly I got the job yesturday and went through the basic steps. And now starting tmw full time from 8am to 8pm. Possibly 7 days a week depending on what happens.

I may have one friend that has the puppy brought.. might spay her.. She is re considering since she still feels it may hurt them since they are young.. But she is also thinking that its wise because of responsiblity. So shes talking with her boyfriend to see what he says. Since hes the one that put the money down on it.

Whatever happens it happens. If you guys think the puppies are in grave danger, why dont I send you some pictures of them and you guys can see what you think. Their tummy is full of food. Their pen is cleaned every day before I go to bed. They are running around and having a good time for 2 hrs. Since my husband works and I work. Im up at 6am, get them out, clean it in 10 minutues, feed them. Since I have no idea how bad parvo can be outside... *REMEMBER they had their shots and passed the parvo and other disease test* so what do you guys think? So when can they go outside and be potty trained?

Then I get ready, have breakfast, get my daughter ready. Give them a huge bowl of water for during the day, extra dog food is given before I leave. Take my daughter to the baby sitter's and then Im off to work till 8 at night. So whats wrong now?

Well IM going to bed. Im tired... I hurt, I work with BIG cats-courgars, 6 of them. Half of the day and then the other half is humans.

NOW this is where it gets interesting, thers a cougar at this property Im working at, his name is Ozzy, and hes a 1 yr old cougar who has brain damage from too much athusia (to put them to sleep for surgery procedure) and the vet declawed him too short. By Colorado Law, you have to have a permit and have one huge-wild animal for one year before you can get more and go on. For that one year period, there has to be no reports of troublism, livestock kills etc. And the permit passed. so now there are 6 cougars. But Im workin with the one that has brain damage. Im excited.

Good night.

anna_66

04-19-2005, 08:53 AM

Originally posted by Accord
And I expect to see some positive stuff on here. and not arguable issues.
I'm one to rarely get into something like this but PLEASE!
YOU expect to see some positive stuff on here? After the way you 've treated everyone...I highly doubt it.
You've treated everyone with no respect when all they've tried to do is to better educate you. You've cursed, blamed and yelled at everyone.

Orginally posted by Accord
IF THE BUYER WANTS THEM SPAYED, THATS FINE. THEY PAY FOR IT. IF THEY DONT. THEN DONT HARRASS ME FOR IT. CAUSE I AM NOT GOING TO DISAGREE. ONCE ITS BROUGHT, IS "AS IS" THE BUYER CAN DO WHAT THEY WANT.

Now no more drama. Let them go. I dont need some mean people jumping on me because Im new here.
So, the puppies are things:rolleyes: That's so sad:(
And btw, no one jumped on you because you were new or because of your hearing problem.
You say the puppies are all fine and have been tested. Not really sure if I believe that but I hope it's true and they all live a long healthy life.

If this upset you, well I'd say I'm sorry but I'm not. This is a public forum and I have the right to speak my mind just like you did.

Anna

PJ's Mom

04-19-2005, 09:20 AM

Originally posted by LorraineO
If I lived near you,, I would report you!

Yep. Me too. :( What a sad situation for those puppies. :(

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 12:25 PM

Hello Im Dusty, and I was reading this post, and wow its quick with drawing attention. I was reading everything from Accord and you ladies. And I most of agree with everything you ladies are saying.
Yes the ladies are trying to help Accord understand what BYB means. And yes I do understand that of course. And I see you ladies aren't showing quite enough encouragements for Accord. I dont see anything positive in there, saying that she did her job by getting the puppies checked and getting their first shots.
So Accord Congrandulations for getting their check ups and their shots. Thats good news. And Im glad they have a negative respnose to the viruses. So thats excellent news.
Also ladies, I dont think that was polite to say that you would say "If I live close to you, I will report you" naughty ladies, thats not nice to say. Say something that would be a little better then that. I think Accord is probably reading this but won't reply. Try to encourage her. I see why she's defensive is because you ladies are some what scaring her and sort of puting her down after all she was able to do. Please try not to put her down for those mistakes she made, I make mistakes too, and Im sure you girls do too. No one is perfect. I think you girls maybe have overwhelmed her with anxiety and pressure with her and the puppies. You girls should be thankful that she took them, feed them, love them, get their shots on time. I know Accord from another forum but I can't say it. She has told me some about it, and She told me that the mommy of those puppies abandoned them and she worked hard to save them. One of them almost died and she saved it. So please make her feel better. She feels insecured cause she doesn't have a lot of friends. So please try to have a gentle heart and help her and encourage her ok? I also think you ladies MIGHT be reading between the lines. Please dont think Im taking her side, Im not taking the ladies' side as well. Im just pointing out what you laidies have proven, and what Accord has tried to do. So Im not taking both sides. But did you read her recent post? That she is not going to breed the puppies? Did you ladies read that her dog didn't die in her hands for something she tried to save with the skills she have? Do you ladies know that it was not her fault that she thought that her puppy had her first shots? <dont blame her for not knowing it-she thought she knew, but felt the seller was full of shit> (Forgive me for my bad language, ::Tells myself bad boy:: Accord felt she knew that her puppy had the shots. But please dont try to blame her for not knowing that her puppy had no update shots. Sometimes the seller would lie just to get rid of them quicker. Again, remember, they thought their puppy had their first shot before they were claimed. Please try to understand that ok? So Im pretty sure Accord is fighting with her mom to get papers and information on her puppy's health.
Accord, Im pretty sure you rather hear this from a guy, right? I know the ladies aren't trying to be mean or to jump on you, you know that they are trying to help, but yes I agree how you feel that if they were being a little uptense about the "If I live close to you I will report you" I think they were trying to scare you. So dont worry. I know you can take care of them. Dont give up. Since you are working and helping your friends out. Encouraging THEM to hopefully spay/neuter their puppies. I have a good feeling that you wont breed your puppies... Mmm.. I wonder if you have another one for sale? Ill help pay to spay/neuter it for you. To relieve some stress. I hope you have one! I really want a boy. Its a guy thing. Sorry. :D Do you know what shots they have up to date? When is their next shot due? How much?
Ok girls are we going to be able to take care of this? Are we going to be a team to help Accord and encourage her? Are we going to stop blaming each other? Are we going to help Accord pull this through? Are we a team?
Ladies, encourage Accord to help get through the day.
Accord, please accept their encouragement and do what you can do to achieve this Puppy Goal. Everyone can do it, I know you can. Be strong. Be yourself and make it happen. Hope to see you on the Forum that we talked from.
Take care of those sweet rascals for me. If you have one for sale, let me know and I can buy it, help get it neutered/spayed, and their next shots. Im here for you since you are a sweet girl. And you done everything you could. Be positive and strong. Let the ladies give you advice, dont turn them down, open up to them please? Let them be a friend to you, like you are with me.
Love you Accord

Dusty

PS: Have Faith OK?

LKPike

04-19-2005, 12:29 PM

ok, am I the only one thinking *someone* is making multiple screen names???? maybe I'm just overly annoyed right now, but this is what I'm thinking now...

caseysmom

04-19-2005, 12:29 PM

Just FYI...most women don't appreciate being called girls....you are coming off as being a mcp...jmho.

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 12:37 PM

Of course not!
Are you guys getting upset?
What is MCP and JMHO? :confused:
Well what do you want me to call you? I was being respectful. Should I being calling you guys Ma'ams? The American way?:confused:

I tried to help both of ladies and Accord. So If you want me to leave, I will be happy to.

caseysmom

04-19-2005, 12:39 PM

I don't think its necessary to differentiate anybody being male or female...why do you feel its necessary?

finn's mom

04-19-2005, 12:41 PM

Originally posted by LuckyIrish
Of course not!
Are you guys getting upset?
What is MCP and JMHO? :confused:
Well what do you want me to call you? I was being respectful. Should I being calling you guys Ma'ams? The American way?:confused:

I tried to help both of ladies and Accord. So If you want me to leave, I will be happy to.

I won't say anything about the rest of yours or anyone else's posts except to say that the "girls" comment didn't offend me. I took at is a "come on, girls" like you would say to friends. I actually thought you were a woman just from your post. And, again, I'm not saying anything about the rest of the posts in this thread at all, but, I will tell you that I'm guessing mcp means male chauvenistic pig (although I've never seen it abbreviated) and JMHO means just in my humble opinion. A lot of people that chat online frequently use a lot of those things (like LOL, ROFL, JMO, etc), they're called acronyms and they're popular online. But, anyway, that's what they mean by that.

luckies4me

04-19-2005, 12:41 PM

:confused: :confused: :confused:

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 12:48 PM

:: checks down south :: I know Im a guy, thanks for noticing Finn's Mom :D

Well most women have very strong powerful words, casey's mom. And I think Accord felt it was to strong for her. So I thought I join and read, learn and understand and help everyone out. I didn't want all of you sweet ladies to feel she has turned against you ladies. I'll admit this, girls are smarter.
And I was thinking that from a man's perspective was to help clear the fog up and be extra helpful. Shockly theres about nearly 100 replies on here. And I thought maybe I can be helpful to you ladies and her, Accord. So we all can be happy. I was just helping :: gives puppy eyes of innonce ::

caseysmom

04-19-2005, 12:50 PM

:rolleyes:

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 12:54 PM

Do you want me to leave you ladies alone? Do you want me to leave and never come back? You dont love me? :: wah! :: :(

finn's mom

04-19-2005, 12:54 PM

Originally posted by LuckyIrish
:: checks down south :: I know Im a guy, thanks for noticing Finn's Mom :D

Ok. Sure. :D

K9soul

04-19-2005, 12:58 PM

I agree with LuckyIrish's sentiments in his post, that encouragement for even small steps in the right direction will do the most to help both people and pups involved. I have ALWAYS felt that positive reinforcement goes much further to help in the long run than negative. I do think there are very good, informative posts here that Accord can learn from. I also do think Accord has been overly defensive with some people who are genuinely trying to be kind and helpful in sharing their knowledge. I do agree that Accord should be applauded for the steps she has taken so far to make things better, and for deciding not to breed and that spaying and neutering is best.

I don't think LuckyIrish was trying to offend or demean anyone. I think he is merely encouraging the advisors and the advisee to calmly work together to get these pups in the best situation possible for them. I do realize strong emotions are involved for the welfare of these pups, but if you react from pure anger you will probably end up hurting them, and possibly future pups, more than helping, because an offended and defensive person is not someone very open to learning new ideas. If you just merely get angry, and run her off the board, how does that help the pups?

By "you" I mean no one, and everyone. In other words, I do not mean these words specifically for any one person, but something for every one of us here, including me, to consider.

In closing, Accord I truly do applaud and appreciate the steps you have taken to make sure your pups are getting the best care possible. I realize you are limited in income and resources, and would simply advise you to keep the things many posters here have been saying in mind, and try to get those pups into the best possible situation you can. I do hope you are able to convince the new owners to spay/neuter. I hope you can understand our fears here for them, that is why we feel so strongly about them being fixed. Thank you for considering our words Accord. Truly my best wishes go out to you.

Accord

04-19-2005, 01:03 PM

Wow! That's a lot of post.

Guys? I'm sorry that I was being a little defensive. I read the posts and I re thought abt what I did and how I have treated you guys. I'm sorry for cussing and blaming. I do feel upset and trying my best.

I'm glad Dusty joined and help us out. I hope he's not chasing ya'll (teasing and being funny).

Thank you Dusty for helping me out. And I re thought everything I did. I feel a little better. Just hoping the pet talk memebers will forgive me and help me.

Thank you
Accord

wolfsoul

04-19-2005, 01:09 PM

I don't see how LuckyIrish did anything wrong.

I think this needs to end right now. I see alot of places it's gone too far. I think the educational part of it started to get a little bit nasty...Everyone is acting out in what they feel is best and that's easy to understand, as I come from the majority's point of view. But enough is enough, and if no one has changed anyone's mind so far, it isn't going to do any good to beat the dead horse. It's dead, let's just let it go. Accord did the right thing by getting the puppy's shots...and the rest everyone can just grin and bear because no one is going to shift. If we want to preach about BYBing and whatnot, why don't we start a new thread? This thread has gone off-topic and frankly it is getting old...I hope someone agrees with me because I'm just tired of the arguing.

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 01:11 PM

Thank you K9Soul

Girls? Should we help Accord? Lets get her some resources! I checked online to see if there was an SPCA in her town, and there isn't, but in Denver, which is a long drive for Accord. I was reading in another post and I dont remember what it was, but something about a Hochie K something Humane Society.(if spelled right, please dont think its bad. Im lousy with remembering things and spelling things. Sorry) I can call them for her and find out the prices and stuff like that.
Trust me, Accord is a sweet girl. She loves those puppies and she would love to have you guys help her. Right Accord?
Accord, I know you are on, I see you on the bottom of the screen where everyone is in and how many people are on. Your friends are here and they will help you every step of the way, please be thankful for them. They will be there for you as I will be there, too.

pitc9

04-19-2005, 01:15 PM

No one here wanted to attack you or upset you, it's just that we all wanted to make sure you realized that no matter who's puppy it was before... and who was supposed to get the puppy's it's shots... the fact is that once the puppy is in your care, YOU are 100% responsible for it's health and well being. NEVER take anything for granted, always be cautious.

As far as the people buying the puppies and not wanting to get them spayed because it will hurt them. That is NOT acceptable nor is it responsible of you. If you want(ed) to do the right thing, you would have them neutered/spayed before they left your home. No two ways around it.

We all care about animals so much, that it's easy for us to see the errors of others ways, and sometimes its the first time those people realize what they are doing is wrong.
We want to help you learn to be more of a responsible pet owner, the world needs more!!!

Jadapit

04-19-2005, 01:22 PM

Accord,
Here is the info. Call them, I know they will be able to give you a lot of info and help you out.

Humane Society Roice Hurst
970-434-7337
3320 D1/2 Rd
Clifton, Colorado 81520

Humane Society of W Colorado
303-243-8823
326 Main St
Grand Junction, Colorado 81501

Accord

04-19-2005, 01:23 PM

LOL hochie? Dusty! I think you were talking abt the Roice-Hurst Humane Society, JadaPit mentioned that in General Post. How can u call them? Your in Utah. Well here's the number just in case, 970-434-7337.

I need to get back to work.

Thank you guys for helping, encuraging and trying to deal with me.

Love to you all
Accord

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 01:52 PM

Thats My Girl! Ok, Im going to call them right now. And I'll the information on here for you so you can check it out later when ever you get off work.
Calling . . . Ringing 1 . . . 2 . . . (yay got an answer) Collecting information and writing it down Hang on Girls :-D
Ok heres the information. They do spay/neuter puppies, BUT they have to be 3 months old. The prices PER puppy by weight is about $55.00 The lady asked me if they had their shots, and told her yes. And told her that Accord has proof, and she says its perfect. So Accord, on June 6th, the puppies are ready to have themself spayed/neutered. They also said they can give Rabies shots the same time which is 10 bucks each.
Save money! Plus thats a lot of money. Talk to the buys ok? Let me add up the price all together, a rough estimate.
:: Adding ::
Total Rough Estimate is: $195.00

(Your puppy, Bailey, your friend's puppy, and other friend's puppy)
Accord left an email and told me that the boy puppy is for sale. Any one want it?! Moo-moo is his name. Male, white with black cow spots on it, and here's the cool part, He has a little black heart on the left hand side of his side. Let me attach the picture from my computer. Done. Ill have Accord attach more pictures of him if you guys want him.
I am going to have some lunch. Thank god today is my day off. So Im havin fun :D

Dixieland Dancer

04-19-2005, 02:32 PM

Originally posted by LKPike
ok, am I the only one thinking *someone* is making multiple screen names???? maybe I'm just overly annoyed right now, but this is what I'm thinking now...

I was thinking the exact same thing! The writing and talk sound very similar. :confused: First it was Johnny 5 (how original) and now it's Dusty (why that wonderful name?). Personally, this thread has caused enough grief on Pet Talk. Perhaps if we all ignore it, it will stop. We obviously have said enough to convince her and now she has to make the choice, which she said she did.

PJ's Mom

04-19-2005, 02:41 PM

Originally posted by Dixieland Dancer
I was thinking the exact same thing! The writing and talk sound very similar. :confused: First it was Johnny 5 (how original) and now it's Dusty (why that wonderful name?). Personally, this thread has caused enough grief on Pet Talk. Perhaps if we all ignore it, it will stop. We obviously have said enough to convince her and now she has to make the choice, which she said she did.

Well said. I had exactly the same thought.

dukedogsmom

04-19-2005, 02:42 PM

What they said :D

Daisy and Delilah

04-19-2005, 02:48 PM

:confused: :confused: :rolleyes: :( :eek: :confused:

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 07:26 PM

Johnny 5 is Accord's husband. Does he have a user name on here too?

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 07:29 PM

Plus common sense, how would you ladies think that Accord have the screen names on at the same time if Im on? Ladies, you saw her and me on at the same time. So how would that be different? I dont understand? :confused: :confused: :confused:

LuckyIrish

04-19-2005, 07:44 PM

Hey, I have know Accord for a long time. She and I are classmates from JR high school through now-as our friendship is still attached. So I have learned from her and been trying to be at her level when she talks. Sometimes big terminology can get her confused. Think about it, deaf people are behing in language right? They go to a special school and doesn't teach them the right stuff. Sometimes the special school will teach the same thing over and over. Ask Accord . What will you learn? The same thing? So I have developed a bad habit of closely talking like her. She taught me sign language and Im kind of rusty at it since I haven't seen her when she was last in Utah.
Do you guys want the truth? She was my ex girlfriend in high school. From the day school started, and then we had some problems, broke up and moved on. We kept our friendship at the best.
"We obviously have said enough to convince her and now she has to make the choice, which she said she did."-Dixieland Dancer

See? With a little extra help from a long time friend, is the best thing because a friend can be a back up, if something goes wrong, or thers a mistunderstanding, or arguements, bam they are right there.
Sorry I did take a long time to answer. I had some company over and wanted to hang out and play some video games.