fallujah iraq, march 31, 2004

[joycenalex]

i made the mistake of looking at ONE photograph on the msnbc website. words are so limited to express my feelings. those poor american families who know it was blackwater security employees. what should be done by the provisional authority and the american military, and why are the humvees such easy targets?

[Logan]

Joyce, I know the whole thing is so heartbreaking. I can't imagine how the families feel, when we feel so badly. :( I hope it can and will end soon.

[2kitties]

I'm having a hard time keeping my emotions rational about it. It's war and we have to understand these things happen in wars. But also I can't dismiss the inhumanity of it and my feeling that these people are nothing but barbarians.
Right now my heart says we just go in there and level the place. But my mind knows that isn't right. But right now, it's a good darn thing I'm not President because Shock and Awe would be nothing more than a silly little fireworks show. We're bigger than them, stronger than them, and armed with enough firepower to take them off the globe. The only reason they have the stones to do this stuff is because they know we won't use it. Hiroshima seems like Eden to me right now.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by joycenalex
what should be done by the provisional authority and the american military, and why are the humvees such easy targets?

They news alluded to the fact that there may be a coalition sweep in the area soon, Apparently Fallujah even gave Hussein problems-he was a little wary of sending his own forces into the area.

Humvees......

Apparently they were moving without an American military escort. Most of the civilian workers move about with armed escorts.

On it's own, a Hummer has armor that will defeat machine gun fire...they were hit with a rocket propelled grenade (RPG). It's a grenade with a motor on the back end. It's range is about 1500 feet on a still target, moving targets cut the range to around 800 feet.

It's a Soviet made weapon that is used primarily against armored vehicles. It can be used by just one person and is pretty available in Iraq, Hussein had TONS of ordnance that still is sitting around.

A good security team will change routes, times they leave an area or what they are driving in order to keep potential attackers off guard.

Either they became complacent or were in the wrong place...
--------------------------

The worst part about the whole incident is watching the kids and teenagers dancing around like fools......It's part of their culture and their outlook on the world...

You can only blame their governments and clerics for the people acting out in that way. It's brainwashing at it's best...

------------------

Although I like the Shock and Awe idea you have to look at the stupidity and ignorance of the terrorist governments in the Middle East. Heaven forbid if we start to use some of the tricks used against us....

It's like sending kids to blow up buses, but when you send a GD helicopter to blow up some creep in a wheelchair the people 'homicide bombing' have a cow and complain, then they use the excuse that a guy with a bomb on his back is the only way to fight back.

How can you argue with people who believe that Saddam was better than having the Coalition in charge?






:eek:

[gini]

All of this war has been difficult for me. Everytime I hear about another American soldier being killed, I think of those men or women of Pet Talk families that are there. However, the recent events are so shocking that it went to my very core.

What are we doing over there? Yes, some of these people are barbarians - who take such glee and joy in suffering and torture.

How can we rebuild a country for people who have such a narrow vision and hatred and killing are their way of life?

[Edwina's Secretary]

The question to me is WHY are we there????? No WMD, no ties to Al-Queda. The only explanation left was to "free the Iraqi people from the horror of Saddam." It doesn't seem to me they are terribly grateful nor unhappy with horror and killing and torture.

Every day in the local newspaper they run a bio on the soldiers killed. I think of the fatherless children.

[ramanth]

I feel the same way Sara. Why are we even there?!

The local MSU paper ran a picture of those poor souls hanging on the bridge with the mob below...... so horrible. :( :( :(

[trayi52]

What really struck me as heartbreaking there was children there, smiling like it was just the best thing ever. These children already know how to hate Americans. I don't know, I think if the people in Fallujah think that it is an American graveyard, then I do believe I would be noncaring about the people there. I really think we should level Falujah, and then pull out troops out. They hate us so bad, let them take care of themselves.

The children are being taught to hate, what kind of monster wants to put that kind of feeling inside a child? Hate is an awful thing to teach your children.

Willie

[RICHARD]

"It is from numberless diverse acts of courage and belief that human history is shaped each time a man stands up for an ideal or acts to improve the lot of others or strikes out against injustice he sends forth a tiny ripple of hope, and crossing each other from a million different centers of energy and daring those ripples build a current that can sweep down the mightiest wall of oppression and resistance."
Robert F. Kennedy, South Africa, 1966

-------------------

I firmly believe that for every AH that we saw dancing around those corpses there are at least 100 people who find the acts of their neighbors, against the coalition, a disgusting representation of who the people of Iraq are.

--------------------

If you have ever noticed, it's the morons, lawbreakers and the scum that get the headlines in the paper. If the people of Iraq are against us you'd see this happening day in a day out.


600 men and women are 600 too many.

But I see that the American public have no resolve, no patience, no will and no vision. We started and we will finish. Every battle is experience we will take into the next war...and we will kick ass where ever that may be.

And if you'd like to take your aggression out on someone, go back to Russia, France and all the other countries who withheld their support when we went in. Then remember cries of "FOUL" when they were not allowed to take part in the rebuilding.

But don't forget 3,000 people who were minding their own business a few years back when their world stopped.
I pray there never will be a day when the radio or television
gets the 'breaking news' thing going and gives us the details that make us sick to our stomachs once again...

Funny,

Burned bodies on a bridge in Iraq just don't have the same impact as people jumping to their deaths after an airplane crashes into their place of business....we say that it's terrible what happened "over there", yet we shake in our boots, cry and freak out when we taste what the rest of the world has gone thru for years....

Me? Proactive all the way.....

Sweep the walkway, that way no dirt gets in your house.

GB1 stopped the show before we got Saddam, that would have shown that we were sincere about whopping ass, no matter who what or where....instead we stopped short and gave everyone the impression that we don't finish what we start...


Let's get it right this time.

[Logan]

I firmly believe that for every AH that we saw dancing around those corpses there are at least 100 people who find the acts of their neighbors, against the coalition, a disgusting representation of who the people of Iraq are.

Amen, Richard. I totally agree.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by popcornbird
Then I think of the Iraqi children and babies, that have been killed in the bombings, and my heart aches for them too, and I somewhat understand why they hate us. I know that if I lost a family member because of another nation's bombing, whether it was accidental or not, I know, I *would* develop a hate for whoever did that.

There hasn't been a coalition bomb dropped in quite a while now.

I think you mean the innocent bystanders that are killed in bombings/attacks against the citizens and police officials who are merely there to try and find a better way to improve their country.

I find those violent acts repugnant-

The fact that these people believe in the future of Iraq-and are willing to serve their country and cities by serving as an underpaid, under equipped police force is a sign that there is hope in Iraq.

It's the mullahs and the other religious monsters
that see no hope-only jihad and infitada...

Listen to the joker that took over for Hamas.
He's still spewing his hatered for Israel, Zion and us, the Great Satan. And Mr. Hawadi (or whatever his name is) sending out tapes imploring that the masses rise up against the West-all in the name of religion.

The voices of Muslim clerics taking a stand against violence of ANY KIND AND AGAINST ANYONE
haven't exactly rung across the land.

If they aren't willing to lead their people with wisdom, intelligence and a thirst for peace they only have themselves to blame when the other shoe falls.

Hate the bomb dropper, but forget the homicidal
maniac that digs a mass grave to bury his victims.
The bomb dropper does it from thousands of feet in the air, The Maniac comes to your front door and is a little more discriminating.

I like the unknown.

[lizbud]

"600 men and women are 600 too many.

But I see that the American public have no resolve, no patience, no will and no vision. We started and we will finish. Every battle is experience we will take into the next war...and we will kick ass where ever that may be."



How easy this crap slips off the tongues of the old, big
bellied men who send the stronger young men & women to die for some strange reasons never shared openly. :(

Big talk by small shriveled old minds.:(

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud


How easy this crap slips off the tongues of the old, big
bellied men who send the stronger young men & women to die for some strange reasons never shared openly. :(

Big talk by small shriveled old minds.:(

Any how easy is it for the younger slim gen Xer's to lap up all the crap that the old pot bellied sell outs from the VietNam war protesters era feed them. Brush your teeth, it keeps the taste from overwhelming you.



OHHHHHH, UP the establishment!!
Those protestors are the same ones raping big industry at the moment...
effin sellouts.

Chickie babe,

Is that what bothered you about my rant???

That we have no will or resolve?
Is that what stuck the nerve.....Didn't mean to point our someone's worst fears.


Go talk to your parents about WWII and the Korean War...the see if you can look in your dawn for the
facts about VN.. Don't tell me about being old because the oldsters are the ones that fed you the pablum that you regurgitate on your shirt front.

What has been your part in the war effort??

A rotator cuff tear from holding up sign?
Laryngitis from chanting some 60's era slogans?

Hey Hey, ho ho, George Bush has got to go???

For christ's sake, get something more contemporary. Maybe put it to rap music.

I didn't send "young men" to the Gulf.....as a matter of fact I'd be the first one out there, carrying the spear, if they took old pot bellied
men that talk cheap and have shriveled minds...

Just don't measure the size of my cojones, sweetheart, Or as Gomer Pyle U.S.M.C. would say,
"surprise, surprise!"


You are a young kid, where are you in the grand scheme of protecting the homeland???

I was never a big GWB fan, as a matter of fact I cannot stand him, But when it's time to stand up and make sure I support the slim, in shape, men and women that I finance to go to other countries to die for me, I will be GD sure they know that I respect them, support their mission and will do anything to give them the best equipment, cost be damned....


And I refuse to protest their mission and if I had and was confronted with the prospect of being unpatriotic or unamerican because of my views, I would not back track and use some excuse like, "I support the troops but I don't support the war"

Talk to a soldier - they are focused, well trained and eager to show their meddle....

Come to think of it,
Your anti-war stand would keep a big fat slob like me out of a war.....Make up your mind.


Kiss the next pair of combat boots you see on the street. Walk up to a serviceperson shake their hand and tell them that they did a good job.

I do and I have no problem admitting it.

Small talk by wordly, well informed people who will cower in fear the next time Mr. Terrorist comes to your neighborhood.

"Why did this happen? Why weren't we prepared?
Why can't our government protect us?"

It's a small world, after all.



-----------------------------

PCB,

Ignore what I say.....I don't understand it myself.

P.s. Jesus ain't coming back- That was my dad's name-and he passed away.

[Edwina's Secretary]

So it is all about "whopping ass." Once again...manly men whopping ass.

The last war we won...WWII ...we didn't start. We were attacked. It was a just war. We did not "win" in Korea, we did not "win" in Viet Nam. Rest assured that my WWII era parents are just as opposed as I am to this excursion.

Soldiers deserve respect...and I give it to them. I've heard no one quarrel with that. Where or when Richard do you perceive ANYONE disrespecting them??? That is a copout.

It is not about the men and women doing the fighting...it is about those sending them to do it. It is about the reason they are being sacrificed.

You use personal attacks and clever word play to put down those who have different opinions than you.

How about answering the question...why are we there?? To whop ass, to show the size of our cojones?

I don't know if you have dandilions in California. But if you destroy the top of the weed, it comes back, and often it comes back stronger. To remove weeds you must take out the root. Our leaders talk about "freedom haters" and continue to destroy the leaves, and the roots grow and grow stonger.

Is arrogance, pomposity, self-righteousness the way to get rid of the roots? Military might?

Would that make YOU love and admire a country. a society, a culture, a way of life?

[IttyBittyKitty]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
So it is all about "whopping ass." Once again...manly men whopping ass.

The last war we won...WWII ...we didn't start. We were attacked. It was a just war. We did not "win" in Korea, we did not "win" in Viet Nam. Rest assured that my WWII era parents are just as opposed as I am to this excursion.

Soldiers deserve respect...and I give it to them. I've heard no one quarrel with that. Where or when Richard do you perceive ANYONE disrespecting them??? That is a copout.

It is not about the men and women doing the fighting...it is about those sending them to do it. It is about the reason they are being sacrificed.

You use personal attacks and clever word play to put down those who have different opinions than you.

How about answering the question...why are we there?? To whop ass, to show the size of our cojones?

I don't know if you have dandilions in California. But if you destroy the top of the weed, it comes back, and often it comes back stronger. To remove weeds you must take out the root. Our leaders talk about "freedom haters" and continue to destroy the leaves, and the roots grow and grow stonger.

Is arrogance, pomposity, self-righteousness the way to get rid of the roots? Military might?

Would that make YOU love and admire a country. a society, a culture, a way of life?

Well said. I saw what happened on the news and I was disgusted. These were people that were there to HELP the Iraqis. It didn't help that they then showed the Law and Order episode where a young woman was slain because of an honor killing, then her mother was slain for defending her. It just made me feel sick, that people take the gentle, Islamic beliefs and twist them into something horrible and depraved.

And yes, I would like to question WHY we were there in the first place, but now that we are, we can't just walk away and leave Iraq to rot. We must finish what we started - for the good of the Iraqi people (and not all of them are violent, sadistic monsters either)

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary


You use personal attacks and clever word play to put down those who have different opinions than you.



Buy a thesaurus and you can play too!

Ah, personal attack????

Fat bellied old man????

And to correct everyone, "WE" are not there.

It's our fathers, mothers, sisters and brothers....it's kinda stupid to make that a collective statement when WE are sitting on our ever spreading rear ends here in America.......(big belly for me!!)


The part that makes ME laugh is the anonimity that
surfaces in the numbers game.....

600 dead and no one can name one or remember their story.....

Scott Helvetson...Google that.

It is Macho Ass Kicking...that is what war is.
It's not playing with dolls or tea parties. It's not a horticulture lesson either..

We are trying to get to the roots of the DANDELION. Your answer is to let the top dry off and blow the seedlings off....ever get one of those effers in your eye?


Here are some more of MY heroes. Pat Tillman and Kara Hultgren, Kimberly Hampton. Ordinary people... People that we forget until we need some ass kicked.

Don't dishonor people that serve our rear ends by just quoting a number from a newspaper or ticker on Fox News......remember a name, a face-remember what they did, how they died and why they went....

Our government sends these people out and they do the job that some of us find disgusting and distasteful.

Remember the macho BS when you need something heavy picked up or some other 'manly' thing done.
Yep women are equal, but then the poop hits the rotating, oscillating air displacement machine you'll want someone to take care of the mess.

And when it gets really tough you'll ask someone in a uniform to do it for you.

Again, talk to someone in a uniform and you'll get this answer- It's my job and it's what I train to do.


Cry me a river, drop your dinghy in and paddle like mad, And the next time Mr. Terrorist comes to America ask him in for a bite to eat and bottled water.


Yeah, it is about cojone size....

You have to have some really big ones to kill, burn and drag a body around a dirt street. The team with the biggest hammer wins the game....

Our armed forces have the biggest hammer and we are playing...


If war is not the answer, what's the Question, Einstein???


And let me apologize now for my clever word play-
It wouldn't garner a response if it was 'dullard' word play.


Does this make me a Pot Bellied Macho Pig??

I think so!:D

--------------------------

And by the way, the reason we went there was for OIL.....that's why the prices are over the roof..

[Logan]

Funny how I can disagree with Richard (about the Oil) and agree with him at the same time. I even explained to a Pet Talker, yesterday, that I agreed with Richard, and she was very surprised!

Yes, I support President Bush. No, I am not happy when more of our soldiers are killed, plus the innocent civilians who are over ther trying to make things better. This is a horrible place we have put ourselves into, but one can only hope and pray that things will improve in time. These people did not make their political decisions overnight. It will take some time to help them see some reality. I just hope that in time, it will come. I hope and I pray. I do think that we hear the "bad" things more than we hear the positive things. There are positive reports from that region that will hopefully overcome the other in time.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Logan
Funny how I can disagree with Richard (about the Oil) and agree with him at the same time. I even explained to a Pet Talker, yesterday, that I agreed with Richard, and she was very surprised!



Just don't invite me over for dinner.....;)

-------------------------

Let's put this into real life terms.

Four people work in an office, two guys and two women.

The two guys can't stand each other, and finally their dislike comes to a head in the parking lot.
They do the Macho Ass whoopping thing, later on they go to the bar sit down and have a drink.
They become best friends and that's that.

The two women will circle each other, snipe, sabatoge and never quite let go of the animosity.

Proof? the girl in grade school who ___________
to you. ;) Women seem to hold grudges, Men?

We kick each other's ass and laugh about it later on. We bear the scars and bruises of our fights proudly and we remember the reason why, the fight and not to make the same mistake again.

It is about cojones and taking a kick in the area every once in a while. And, as I said once before, when the pain subsides and you stop throwing up, you get your hands from your groin, lever yourself up and wail on the guy that put you
on the floor.

Otherwise, prepare to take another low blow.
---------------------------------

I will apologize for tweaking people and rubbing them the wrong way, I can't apologize for feeling the way I do..

For the Record

Scott Helvetson was a Special Forces soldier, who participated in a "reality combat" program, Combat Missions. I was a huge fan of that show and I recognized his name the second I heard it.

Pat Tillman was a pro football player who TURNED DOWN a lucrative contract with the Phoenix Cardinals to become an Army Ranger,
His brother Kevin, turned down a pro baseball contract to enlist with Pat.

Kara Hultgren was killed in 94, trying to land her
F-14 on an aircraft carrier. She was one of the first women to land a fighter on a carrier.

Kim Hampton was the FIRST woman to die from enemy fire, flying for the 82nd Airborne, on Jan 02 near
Fallujah.

My heroes.

Ordinary men and women, doing extraordinary jobs.

Remembering them is the least I can do.

[Logan]

Richard, as I have always told you, if you say something that offends me, I will let you know, privately. So far, you have done nothing of the sort. In the reverse, you have made me think just a little bit more and that's a good thing!!!!! :)

[Edwina's Secretary]

My mother, who is as prone to meaningless generalities based on gender as Richard is, says men have selective hearing. That is, men hear "dinner's ready" but they don't hear "the potatoes need peeling!" (of course, peeling potatoes isn't nearly as macho as killing people!) Here's an example of "selective reading."

I said...



Every day in the local newspaper they run a bio on the soldiers killed. I think of the fatherless children.


Response

600 dead and no one can name one or remember their story.....


Women seem to hold grudges, Men?

Let's see the conflict in the former Yugoslavia...a grudge held from a war that took place in 1500 something. Iraq....any grudge in GW's actions there? Even WWII...and Hitler's grudge over the treaty ending WWI! It is harder to think of a global conflict NOT started as a result of a grudge. So maybe she pulls a pigtail or flirts with the other woman's man....she doesn't blow up a country.

And by the way...I see nothing ordinary in a person who can fly a plane in combat, lead troops on a march through the desert wearing 100 lbs. of gear. I believe these to be extraordinary skills.

Speaking of that....ever see the 60 Minutes piece on Kara Hultgren who was killed in 94, trying to land her
F-14 on an aircraft carrier? Her brothers-in-arms trashed her. "Women shouldn't be doing that. She was strictly an affirmative action hire, etc." I give her respect for trying something I find extraordinary.



We are trying to get to the roots of the DANDELION. Your answer is to let the top dry off and blow the seedlings off....ever get one of those effers in your eye?

Sorry about misspelling "dandelion." That must have prevented you from understanding my point. My answer is to find the root of the hatred and get rid of it and killing a bunch of people doesn't strike me as the most effective way to do that. It hasn't been terribly effective in the Israel/Palestine case!

And yet with all the rhetoric and fancy word play, there is still that pesking little question....WHY are we there?

[lizbud]

Edwina's Secretary,


:) A voice of reason is bound to get drowned out in a sea
of pompous boasting and prideful ignorance. Some men are
just born jerks, there's no saving them with logic. It's wasted
on fools. Score one for you here.:)

p.s. Just tell him you don't hold a grudge either.:D

[RICHARD]

Killing has nothing to do with macho.

We are in Iraq because some nitwit refused to let us in to check for chem weps....we went in there because we thought there were terrorists in Iraq.

In your world it would have been better to let that SOB stay in power.......too bad you didn't get your wish...

Go back and read about the Olympic Training center and the torture chambers there......

Wait a second, It's o.k. for Saddam's kids to run around and punk people but when it Americans being dragged down the street its a different story??


"some world views are spacious and some are merely spaced.."

Wow,
Be a little more generous with your humanity.

Why are we there? We may have been lied to, but to discount the mission at this point is really stupid...we are there, maybe not for the reasons we were told, for the reason that some despot tyrannt wouldn't deal with us and to kick his ass....

Don't be like most Americans and bury your head about the problems that the people of Iraq had with that jerk...


LOLOLOL,

Yeah, sticking with your 'pig tail pulling' it never changes. Sometimes you have to roll up you sleeves and end the story right there. Not chase each other border to border plucking hairs out of your head..

Flirting with another woman's man....lololol,
are you gender generalizing??? shame on you!!!!




LOL,

You didn't seem to be able to pull a name out of the air.....just the mention that there was some soy print on paper..

Kara Hultgren was given the opportunity to fly Tomcats...
So? a bunch of macho a-holes who were scared that she was give a chance to compete, Instead of keeping their mouths shut they had to trash a gal who was not there to defend herself.....no I don't watch 60 minutes....I am too old for cartoons and that mean old SOB, Andy Rooney.....i cannot stand the way he cries, JUST LIKE A WOMAN.



I understood the dandelion reference (get that thesaurus, I'm telling you!)

Find the root of hatered and then what??

Stand there and watch it???

They way to do it is to take a shovel or some weed killer and either pull the sucker out or kill it with chemicals....


That way the other 'weeds' get the message and leave our yard alone.....

Or better yet, Let's sit down and have a real neat Terrorist Summit. We'll invite all the scumbags our there to meet someplace with a conference room and a pool. We'll spend a weekend, trading ideas and talking about their hate towards us..

I am sure they will understand and never homicide bomb again!

I mean, it's a great idea!! Let's sit everyone around a big table and they can tell us we are infidels and non believers, we are Satan and Israel is Satan too!!!

We'll explain Democracy to them and tell them that their Iron Grip on the people will disappear as soon as people learn that they can VOTE for the people they want to represent then. We'll show them how to educate those folks and teach them no to follow a religion and the pleas for children to hate America and grow up to
vaporize themselves on a bus someplace in Israel....


By God,

I apologize for being so stupid and not realizing that you had the answer to all the woes and ills in our situation...



And before I forget........you mentioned that we were attacked in world war II...

Geez, what happened on 9/11 was probably a mistake......

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud
Edwina's Secretary,


:) A voice of reason is bound to get drowned out in a sea
of pompous boasting and prideful ignorance. Some men are
just born jerks, there's no saving them with logic. It's wasted
on fools. Score one for you here.:)

p.s. Just tell him you don't hold a grudge either.:D


who's keeping score?

Get off the bench and play. Don't depend on the first stringers to get you a win without you contributing to the game.

[mugsy]

I hesitate to post here because my feelings are so strong regarding this horrific event. I do NOT believe that the average Iraqi holds evil in their hearts and contrary to what the press wants us to believe, many of them truly are glad we came over there and ousted such an evil man (and I use that term loosely).

Why are we there? We now need to finish what was started so we don't abandon the Iraqi people when they need help estabilishing SOME sort of something.

Was it a good idea in the first place? 20/20 hindsight may say no, but, in the long run who knows. I supported it in the beginning, now, I'm not so sure, however, we're there...are we supposed to abandon them when they need help? We shall see if we do as we said we would and leave in June. As for no WMDs...I still believe that they WERE there, but, because we spent so many months wavering as to whether or not to go in, they moved them to other countries like Syria...no one knows except the people involved and perhaps the intel community.

As for what the original intent of this thread was.....

SOMETHING needs to be done. I do not advocate violence very often (just ask my students!), but, this is beyond the "turn the other cheek" stance. I know what my heart says, but, I need to get over the incredible anger a little bit to think a little clearer and make a rational decision.

I mourn for EVERY family who has lost loved ones in this war, conflict, whatever word you choose to describe it....American, British, Iraqi.......war is inheritantly evil.


Now...to digress again....Richard, you are so right....men fight it out and then are over it. Women hold grudges (yours truly included) and never let go. I always say, I will break up a boys fight, but, when girls fight....FORGET IT....let them fight to the death....they have no code of honor....it's no holds barred! Btw...before I get raked for that....I am making a HUGE generalizatoin....I realize that.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Sorry Richard....it is no fun debating with you because all you do is get vicious and illogical. For example...this response


And before I forget........you mentioned that we were attacked in world war II...

Geez, what happened on 9/11 was probably a mistake...... would work if we had attacked say Korea in response to Pearl Harbor.

I'll leave you to your ass kicking, cojones measuring, whopping, hammering and killing.

[Pam]

Mugsy I agree 1,000% with every word in your post. I have been reading this thread and feeling inadequate to express my opinions. You have done a superb job; much better than I could have ever hoped to, or would have even attempted to, do! ;) :cool:

[mugsy]

Originally posted by Pam
Mugsy I agree 1,000% with every word in your post. I have been reading this thread and feeling inadequate to express my opinions. You have done a superb job; much better than I could have ever hoped to, or would have even attempted to, do! ;) :cool:

Pam, you should be scared....you agreed with me on another thread too!!! hehehe ;)

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary


I'll leave you to your ass kicking, cojones measuring, whopping, hammering and killing.

But will you respect me in the morning???

But, you forgot war mongering, hateful, myopic and charming!!





------------------------------

What WMDs???

http://www.phrusa.org/research/chemical_weapons/chemiraqgas2.html

-----------------------------


When you find a weed in the yard you have to kill it to get rid of it. You may damage some grass or other plants in the process....

When you play at or below the level of you opponent in a game where life and death is the grand prize it behooves you to call upon the Marquis of Queensberry for a ruling.

I look at the war as kinda our 9/11 'gift' to Osama and Saddam.....we were just nice about it.
We gave them a little hint and dressed our guys in shirts the same color so everyone knows who our players are.

They just bent the rules for their team.

[IttyBittyKitty]

For those of us in the "coalition of the willing," we need to step back and examine the situation as it stands. I was never in support of the action in Iraq, yet I disagree with the Opposition's pre-election promise to "bring the troops home for Christmas."

Why? Well, we all think we know why the US and other "willing" countries committed their troops to battle. Many of us felt as though everyone was misled, and whether or not this is the case needs to be addressed separately. What remains is a country that we have invaded, and decimated to some extent. We have removed their previous governing structures entirely, and we cannot, and should not, walk away until we assist in the re-building of the Iraqi nation. We may not be able to remove the "roots of evil" that have planted themselves there, but walking away and leaving the nation in shambles will NOT set a good example to the Iraqis about traditional democratic beliefs.

What those Iraqi men did was disgusting, but I commend the US (and Australian) government's decision to stick to their original resolve, and not "abandon" ship when the going got too tough. We all know the cliche ... you made your bed, now you must lie in it.