Sweet Annie needs a favor

[jenluckenbach]

Well, Jenny and I have done most of our homework for Annie's move to England, with the help of Sasvermont's breeder friend. Looks like Annie is going to be one darned expensive little Kitty :eek:
Jenny wanted so hard to not ask for charity, but like most humans, everyone could use a little help once in a while.
We know that not everyone can help and there is no shame in that. But if you would be willing to contribute, please contact PayItForward or myself.
Thank you in advance.
P.S.
Moral support is needed too, so don't feel left out if you can't support monetarily.

[Cataholic]

Jen,
how much is it going to cost? Some people might want to know that....
Johanna

[aly]

Is Annie a special needs cat? Just curious as to why she's going overseas. I apologize that I haven't kept up with things lately. Life has been crazy and I've had less time to browse PT :(

[jenluckenbach]

Originally posted by Cataholic
Jen,
how much is it going to cost? Some people might want to know that....
Johanna

Well, I hope Steve does not see this :eek: :o

Description / Cost
Adoption Fee $ 50.00
Shipping $ 530.00
Carrier (If we use yours - cheers Jen) $ 0.00 -
Vet Visit (Rabies. Microchip etc.) $ 125.00
Vet Visit (Blood Test) $ 150.00 **
Vet Visit (De-worm and de-ticking) $ 80.00 **
USDA fees (USA) $ 100.00
USDA fees (England) $ 100.00
USA Total = $1,135.00
English Total = £627

** estimated, will get more accurate amounts SOON.

[Killearn Kitties]

Yep, looks about right. A girl I used to work with took her cats to Australia with her when she was going back home and they cost around £600 each. That was about seven year ago.

It's not cheap!

[PayItForward]

Originally posted by Killearn Kitties
Yep, looks about right. A girl I used to work with took her cats to Australia with her when she was going back home and they cost around £600 each. That was about seven year ago.

It's not cheap!
I already had priced it at £460 / $830 but I didn't know about a couple of extra stuff, until we spoke to the breeder.

[jenluckenbach]

I have 2 pledges already (plus my own ;) ) :D

[jenluckenbach]

Originally posted by aly
Is Annie a special needs cat? Just curious as to why she's going overseas. I apologize that I haven't kept up with things lately. Life has been crazy and I've had less time to browse PT :(
Sweet Annie's adoption (http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45613)
Continued (http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45664)
The vet visit (http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45695)

[aly]

I browsed through most of the messages on those threads. I do have one question. Doesn't the shelter (or rescue) who you're fostering her for cover some of those medical costs (like the worming, rabies, etc)? Or none at all? It would at least put the price down a little if they did.

Good luck in your trip, Annie!

[jenluckenbach]

They do ALL her necessary vetting, but if she were to stay here she would not be due for any of those things yet (she is up to date, it is the government that wants these things done) so it is not fair to ask them to foot the bill, is it?

[kitten645]

to the UK and it will be a bloody fortune....I'm going over in August and will gladly stop over and collect the baby if it will be cheaper. LMK.
Claudia

[aly]

Originally posted by jenluckenbach
They do ALL her necessary vetting, but if she were to stay here she would not be due for any of those things yet (she is up to date, it is the government that wants these things done) so it is not fair to ask them to foot the bill, is it?

Ahh, gotcha :)

Too bad no one's flying there - that would greatly reduce the shipping cost.

[jenluckenbach]

To be honest, cats (animals) going into England MUST arrive as cargo, so even if someone was flying with them it would not be a different procedure. And Annie can't leave until October or later due to the quarrentine.

[Sirrahsim]

yes, Moosmom,
I think that PIF's references are pretty clean:D If I'm not mistaken, I believe that she IS the adoptive mother, correct? I'm sure that she won't leave Jen hanging:)

... guess you saw that she was the Mom

[moosmom]

*slinks away into corner of room, shaking head in embarassment*

After putting 2 and 2 together, a light went off in my head. DUH!!!That's why I deleted it immediately.

Sorry about that!

Congratulations PIF on your new addition!!

[moosmom]

I DO have one question though. Wouldn't it be less expensive to adopt a cat over in England??

I'm sure that PIF has impeccable references and all. But like I said in my deleted post, I'm SURE there are many cats over there who are unwanted in desperate need of furrrrever homes. And I'm also sure that Jen could find a great home for Sweet Annie where she is.

Just my humble opinion, not meaning to piss anyone off.

[jenluckenbach]

I, of course, managed to miss the deleted post, so it is hard to follow a line of thinking, But Jenny and I have been talking a LOT about Annie, and this is what they want. I will not speak for her but Annie won't find a home with just anyone. She is a very shy and scared cat. She needs very experienced and patient cat people, and those types are few and far between. While it is true that Annie might well find her own family closer to home, it is not likely to be in the near future, especially with kitten season coming and all those adorable FRIENDLY babies to choose from. So far, no one has been interested, and she's been available for adoprion for 8 months now. As soon as they hear that she will hide from them, that she doesn't like to be picked up and that she may never be a lap cat, they go look at the next cat. With SO VERY many homeless cats, people tend to adopt the "easier" ones.
If you don't want to help, that is perfectly fine, but don't bring down an otherwise joyous occasion for those who are happy for both the new parents and the little orphan who finally has a REAL home to go to.

[Prairie Purrs]

As I understand it, Jen hasn't been able to place Annie because the sweet shy girl doesn't do well at adoption fairs. And PIF (who has endured more than her share of heartbreak helping homeless cats in England) seems to have fallen in love with her.

So what the heck! Let's get them together! :D

[Logan]

Jen, will no amount of pleading help to reduce those horribly high vet bills for the blood work and worming? Seems to be very, very steep!!

I'm so happy for all of you, especially Annie, who will land her "American" self in a very wonderful home in another country. :) It's really sort of neat when you think about it!! :)
I just hate the thought of her being "cargo" instead of under the seat of the plane in her little carrier.

Logan

[moosmom]

If you don't want to help, that is perfectly fine, but don't bring down an otherwise joyous occasion for those who are happy for both the new parents and the little orphan who finally has a REAL home to go to.

Jen,

Here are both my posts:


I DO have one question though. Wouldn't it be less expensive to adopt a cat over in England??

I'm sure that PIF has impeccable references and all. But like I said in my deleted post, I'm SURE there are many cats over there who are unwanted in desperate need of furrrrever homes. And I'm also sure that Jen could find a great home for Sweet Annie where she is.

Just my humble opinion, not meaning to piss anyone off.

*slinks away into corner of room, shaking head in embarassment*

After putting 2 and 2 together, a light went off in my head. DUH!!!That's why I deleted it immediately.

Sorry about that!

Congratulations PIF on your new addition!!




I am in no way trying to bring down anything and I resent you implying I am.

I simply asked a question. I'm VERY happy that Sweet Annie has found a furrrever home and I am also grateful to Jenny and Steve for wanting to adopt her.

So LIGHTEN UP WILL YA???

[catnapper]

I can offer pictures of the sweet Annie!:D :D :D :D

I am so very happy that you are so excited to be getting her! She is a sweet girl and should blossom in your care.

I expected the cost to be around there. But seriously, nothing good in life is free, is it? And if you consider you get what you pay for, then you are getting something very VERY special.

[slick]

Oh my gosh if I were Annie I'd be purrrring with delight not only at the prospect of a furrever home, but also the chance to travel.

Jen I wish I could help financially, but I'm still paying off my Christmas debts. I'm so sorry. :(

Again, congratulations Annie on your new home. It won't be long sweetie, be patient. :)

[aly]

I did find some airlines that allow pets to fly on the cabin and not as cargo. KLM is one of them - http://www.klm.com/uk_en/

[Sirrahsim]

yeah, here is the little info that I found at that KLM site:


Dogs and cats traveling to the UK

This is possible with KLM Cargo without putting your dog or cat into quarantine in the UK, provided that your pet meets the Pet Travel Scheme (PETS) requirements.
For more information go to www.klmcargo.com Products & Services, Fit - Animal Care, Fit Pets.

[wolf_Q]

Wow, that much money could go a LONG way to spay/neuter and find homes for countless other animals. I'm sure Annie could find a home closer.

Just stating my opinion, I know Annie deserves a great home and I'm sure you'll get her just that.

[Kfamr]

I hope you don't see this as "bringing this down", because that's not what I intend on doing..but I really have to ask...

You say she's a very scared and shy cat -- wouldn't a plane ride to people she's never met before almost traumatize her?

I think it would probably be much better, for Annie atleast, if she were to find a home closer, with maybe a family that she can be introduced to and warmed up to.


Whatever you do, I hope Annie end up happy wherever she is!

[Nomilynn]

Perhaps people will hate me for saying this, and if that’s the case, that’s fine. But I can’t keep reading this thread without saying SOMETHING.

I really feel like shipping Annie to the UK, considering her social problems, is very disheartening. I don’t see at ALL how this is in Annie’s best interest. There are LOTS of people on PT, within the continental US, who would be willing to help place Annie as a “difficult” adopt. This is a LONG and traumatic flight. Why does Annie need to be flown ALL the way to the UK? She’s not going to understand this.. all she will know is she’s being put on a plane – ALONE – and basically abandoned. She won’t even be reunited with people she knows!

Also, if this is what is REALLY wanted, why other people being asked to pay for it? Jenny – I think it’s wonderful that you want to give Annie a home. I sincerely wish the world was filled with people willing to go to any length to help an animal in need. However, it is a LOT of money that does not NEED to be spent like this. When people donated for Bassett, I cried many happy tears many nights in a row, but I NEVER asked. If I hadn’t had the help, I would just be in an extra $3000 worth of debt right now. Jen, you started that thread for me and I was very grateful. It saved Bassett’s life. But, this is not a life or death situation. Annie doesn’t HAVE to be sent away, especially if she’s happy living where she already is.

My guess is that this post will make me a hated member, and probably get the thread deleted. But, I can’t say nothing. I hope that this side of the coin has been genuinely considered before Annie is whisked away and has to endure such an upsetting journey
:(

[shais_mom]

I don't think anyone is trying to bring down a 'joyous' occasion. I think that Pay It Forward and Pays For it will be a wonderful owners to any lucky Cat. But I also in my heart feel that the trip overseas would do more harm then good to Sweet Annie.
And those of us that are questioning it are not trying to bring down a joyous occasion but we have the cat's best interests at heart too and I am sorry if you don't think or believe that.

[Sirrahsim]

I've kept from throwing in my opinion, mostly because of my own situation. I also think that shipping Annie to the UK may not be the best thing for her... but seeing as I will probably be subjecting Boomer to an even longer flight when I leave Japan to go back stateside, I'm not really in a position to talk. Nevertheless, if you two have definately decided that you are going to get Annie shipped over than congratulations. I hope Annie makes a wonderful addition to your home and eventually comes out of her shell

[aly]

Originally posted by Sirrahsim
... but seeing as I will probably be subjecting Boomer to an even longer flight when I leave Japan to go back stateside, I'm not really in a position to talk.

I think you are doing the right thing with Boomer. It is a different situation and he is already your cat. You will make his trip and adjustment to his new home much better since he feels comfortable with you.

[Nomilynn]

Originally posted by aly
I think you are doing the right thing with Boomer. It is a different situation and he is already your cat. You will make his trip and adjustment to his new home much better since he feels comfortable with you.

I totally agree. There have been several PTers who have taken their own pet with them when they've had to move overseas.

[popcornbird]

Jen, I think it is wonderful that you are willing to do so much to ensure sweet Annie gets a wonderful home. No doubt, PIF's family would make wonderful parents for her and I truely believe she would be happy with them.

That being said, I would like to say something. You know that I very much consider you a friend and respect you, so please don't take anything I say in a negative way. I am only saying this out of concern.

$1,135 is no doubt, a lot of money. I can definitely understand a person spending that much, or even more, to take their pet with them when moving overseas. I'm not *sure* though, if I feel the same about spending to send an animal to a *new* home, overseas though. I know there are many cats in England that are in need of a loving home and would love to move into the care of PIF's family. I also know, that there are MANY people, here in the US, who *would* be willing to take Annie in, and provide her with the best of love and care. Because of that, I don't know how I feel about spending all that money when it isn't completely neccessary. Putting the money issue aside, I also worry about Annie and the long journey, that she would be making alone. I do think it is worth having an animal travel when one has to move with its family, but I don't know if its worth making an animal go through all that to get it to a new home overseas. This is my concern, and know that I say it with respect, while acknowledging that you have the best of intentions in mind, and are trying to do the best you can for Annie. I know that, so please don't mind anything that I said.

I wish the best for you, for PIF, and especially for Annie, and pray that whatever you do turns out to be the best in her interest, as well as in the interest of her future family. I will be following Annie's updates, and praying that the journey is easy on her, and that everything goes smoothly. My questions are just out of concern, and I would love to hear and understand your reasons for this, as I am positive you must have good and well thoughtout reasons to do this, that perhaps we don't understand because we don't know as much as you do.

[PayItForward]

.....arguments but I can guess what I have missed.

Yes, It would be best for Annie to stay forever with Jen in America but she deserves a forever home.

Second best to find a local home but if she couldn't find one as a cute kitten, she is going to struggle as a difficult young adult.

If anyone suddenly appears at Jen's with a good home for Annie in the next months, I have already said it would be best for Annie to stay in America, rather than stress her out with travelling.

But do you realise someone at the rescue wants to return her to a barn life as they think she is unadoptable *shudder*

I even wrote a new write up for Annie, to help her find a home but even being cat of the month has not help Annie.

Here are the writeups I did for Jen's special fosters.
http://www.piftails.com/main/OneByOne.html

When Jen posted the first thread suggesting we adopt Annie and asked for money support. I emailed her saying if we decided to adopt Annie the cost would be our responsibility to ship Annie over and Jen altered the thread.

We have/will have $830 for Annie's journey, it was only when the cost was $300 more than I had budgeted for that I was worried, I was moved by the fact so many people said they wanted to help, that I allowed this thread to be created.

I am so thankful that SAS's Breeder friend give us the correct additional costs, as I thought I had researched all the costs before we even decided to adopt Annie.

I am more negative than Jen, I actually expected the mixed reaction. Why transport a cat so far, it was and is our responsibility ? We have no right to ask for help with the additional unbudgeted for cost.

I will leave this post up today to allow any replies to my post to be posted and then ask Karen to lock it so it will drop off the lists.

But please keep up with Annie's journey, she might be a month or two late due to the addition $300 we'll need to save but she'll will get here and I'll be posting a million photos. :D

PIF

PS. If you have a friend who will be suitable to love Sweet Annie in PA, USA let Jen know, I would miss her but I have to think about Annie first :D

[jenluckenbach]

Jenny,
I am sorry I even opened my BIG mouth :(:(:(:(:(:(
The only thing I can say is DON'T you all think we KNOW! ? ! ?Everything you argued about has been covered in conversation.

[Ally Cat's Mommy]

Jen and Jenny,

I trust the two of you to make whatever decision is in the best interests of Annie.

I, for one, am excited that Annie has found a home, even if it is expensive to get her there.

There are strong points on both sides of the argument.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I am sure that some PT'ers will make a donation, whilst others will view it as a waste of money.

As with all donations, and even moral support, this is a personal decision.

[Logan]

I'm a bit surprised at you guys. Jen and Jenny didn't ask for an opinion, they gave people an opportunity to send them a private message if they felt inclined to donate towards the $300 needed to get Annie "home". One thing I know for certain, if Jen, an experienced rescuer, feels this is in Annie's best interest, then I'm not going to question it. Jenny and Jen, I wish you both the best of luck making this happen, and I hope Annie will be very happy in "Merry Ole England"!!! :D

[catnapper]

I don't understand what the big hub-bub is. The trip is long and will startle her... but its one trip and will be over when she's in her new home. Why startle her twenty times over by bringing her to adoption events to be on display and then packed back up into a carrier for the return trip? One big trip will save her many anxiety ridden little trips.

As for the money? Don't people pay half that much for a full-bred cat... some might even pay more depending on the breed. The thousand dollar cost should not be an issue for something that will bring joy to their lives for another 20 years. The only cost that is outrageous in people's minds is the traveling one.... since the others are all shots and proceedures she'd likely have anyway.

As for Annie being scared in a new country, she'll be fine Its a mazing what a little love and patience can do to.

Should Jenny be deprived of a wonderful new pet that she's fallen in love with just because the cost is high and the trip is long? Jen has known Annie for 8 months. Jen would not risk sending her overseas is Annie wouldn't be able to handle it. Come on, use common sense... Jen's as loving and commited to cats as anyone on this board; do you honestly think that she'd put a cat purposely in a situation that would traumatize her forever?

I think what they are doing is wonderful. I've met Annie and I think she'll flourish in her new home in England.

[aly]

People are not being unreasonable or rude. Opinions were expressed in very friendly ways and very valid points were raised. I appreciate PIF taking the time to explain the situation and wish it was explained like that from the get-go.

I have to admit that I was a bit taken aback by the plea for money for this though. I think a group of people should have been pm'd and asked for help. But the public soliciting did make me uneasy in this situation. When PT cats are sick and really need the money, are people going to be less likely to contribute because they have been donating to less necessary things on this board? I don't want to see it get to that point. I constantly have fosters that have vast medical needs that I can't even afford. I work it out though and wouldn't ever ask the kind people on here to give me money. I really think those donations should be saved for emergencies.

I am also a very experienced rescuer/foster mom/shelter worker and I know there are many people willing to take in cats like Annie. I've fostered ferals and semi-ferals before and was able to place them with wonderful people like PayItForward (but they were local). Its really all in the approach you take.

Just because people have differing opinions, it does not automatically mean they are attacking you. Being able to take constructive criticism makes you a better, stronger person.

With all that said, I think once Annie gets to PIF and is over that long flight, I will be very happy. I know she will have a wonderful home there.

[Nomilynn]

Originally posted by Logan
I'm a bit surprised at you guys. Jen and Jenny didn't ask for an opinion, they gave people an opportunity to send them a private message if they felt inclined to donate towards the $300 needed to get Annie "home".

Jen also asked for moral support, and PT being the kind of place it is, when we have a concern for an animal those issues WILL be brought up.

I only posted my opinions because I'm concerned for Annie's well-being. If you don't choose to see/believe that then you are missing the point.



Jenny - thank you for your post. It is very clear to me that you are thinking of the many sides of the issue, and thank you for clearing up some confusion. I hope that whatever does happen, that Annie and you are more than thrilled with the situation :)

[moosmom]

My main concern was Sweet Annie and the long ride to the UK. So why, after all these posts voicing the same concerns, was I made out to look like the bad guy here???

[Logan]

Moral support

Naomi, I'm not trying to fight with anyone, so please don't misunderstand what I said. But to me, "moral support" means support, and in this case, I took it that Jen was wanting to make anyone who couldn't/wouldn't contribute feel ok about that. At the time your girl was so sick, I couldn't offer anything but prayers and "moral support", but I did do that, and frequently. My prayer list is "knee deep" at all times. I don't always agree with or understand people's decisions either, but I'm learning to try and be supportive, regardless.

Best intentions, I promise. :)

[Prairie Purrs]

From my experience with "scaredy cats," I doubt that a trip in a cargo hold without people around would be horribly traumatizing for Annie. Riding with the passengers--all those people!--would probably be harder for her. And if the adoption agency has been considering returning her to barn-cat status, this may be Annie's only chance.

If Jen was passing the hat at the office to get a birthday gift for our friend Jenny, I doubt anyone would be offended or question whether it was necessary. And helping out in this instance isn't going to make me less likely to help someone else out, to whatever extent I'm able to do so. Friends help friends in whatever way they can--sometimes money, sometimes prayers and positive energy.

[shais_mom]

First off, Jenny (PIF) your post was beautifully written. And I thank you for not thinking that those of us that have concerns, have it out for you or Annie or Jen L b/c that is truly not the case.
I do applaud you for willing to take on sweet Annie and the expenses, I wish I could have afforded to rescue a dog from NY after the WTC attack, but I couldn't. There is no shame in that either. I do not agree with outside cats, so I don't understand how someone that is in rescue is wanting to make a cat a Barn outside cat. :( In reference to

But do you realise someone at the rescue wants to return her to a barn life as they think she is unadoptable *shudder*
that statement. If they want to do that then why rescue the kitty at all? :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:
Once again, PIF thank you for understanding that we don't have it in for you and that our concern is also Annie's well being.

[PayItForward]

Originally posted by shais_mom
First off, Jenny (PIF) your post was beautifully written. And I thank you for not thinking that those of us that have concerns, have it out for you or Annie or Jen L b/c that is truly not the case.
I understand everyone concerns as I share some of them and I have previously thought about everything that was raised.

I wanted to thank everyone for their opinions , whether I agree or not. What I was impressed with was the universal concern with Annie's well being. That is why Pet Talk is a very special place.

The happy news, due to one very large donation, I think we'll get Annie here very soon. A special heart felt to that special lady you know who you are :D

I think everyone has had time to state an opinion, so as I mentioned in my earlier post I am going to ask Karen to lock this thread.

Thankyou PIF