i need vet advise...dixie dancer!!!!

[delidog]

this started last fri. a.m. 11/09/01...my delilah woke up dead lame ...both front legs.....the only thing different we had done the night before was have a tug-o-war with her star toy before bed.....so i was concerned about her shoulders and neck...i gave her 2 tylenol a day...1 a.m.,1p.m. until sunday,i only gave 1 at 6:00 a.m. so vet could get a true picture of the laameness....i took her at 9:15 a.m. this morning....he did flex tests on both front....she winced on the left...she is still very lame....he said it is accute arthritis....she is a dal./ hound mix...5 1/2 years 70 lbs....that didn't bother me as much as it is similar to a navicular bursa in horses....they all react differently....what bothers me is two things...even with an appointment....he did not have time to x-ray her today...this would be my first avenue after understanding there is no infection or topical injury...he said bring her back next week...and that she would have to be left all day as she was to be anestethised!!!!! for 2 front leg x-rays?!?!?!?!??! i did horses for 17 years...i x-rayed all kinds of joints....i never put them under.....can you advise....have you heard of this????he said he can't get dogs to sit still for this x-ray....front wrists!!! or ankles....whatever you refer to them as....i am so unnerved by this man and i have been going to him exclusively since i got delilah from the pound...can you offer any advise?!?!?!?!? :confused: :eek: :mad:

[zippy-kat]

WOW! I think I'd seek a second opinion!

Sure hope the pup gets better, quickly!!

[Logan]

Delidog......I always heard that you should NEVER, NEVER give Tylenol to a dog!!!! The Tylenol contains acetominiphen which is deadly to our dogs. Did she have any adverse reaction to it? Buffered aspirin is the preferred pain reliever for them, but I would only do that with the vet's permission.

As for the vet needed to anesthetize her for the xray, I think that is pretty standard procedure. Everyone I know of who has had to have their dog's front or back legs, or hips xrayed, has said that they do it while they are asleep. I think there might be a lot of wasted film and time if the animal is alert and wiggling.

Good luck. Hope your baby will be better soon. :)

Logan

[ November 12, 2001: Message edited by: Logan ]

[zippy-kat]

I don't know if it's the same thing, but when our cat had her hips/backlegs x-rayed, they didn't put her under. :confused:

[sammi]

I have also always heard NOT to give tylenol or advil to dogs. I Have used asprin 1/2 tab for small dog and 1 whole one for med-lg dog. When ever we have needed x-rays on one of our dogs they have been put under to have them taken.

[ November 12, 2001: Message edited by: sammi ]

[delidog]

thanks guys!!! you are great people...let me say...the first morning she hurt i gave her 1/2 aspirin...generic...when i called the vet around 9:00 a.m. THEY told me to give her nothing but tylenol....i have heard the same thing about tylenol...i figured that i was giving so few...4 total that she'd be o.k.....she did not have any reaction...he gave me rimadyl...75 mg. to give her twice a day for pain....then he said to get glucosamine and put her on for 4 to 6 weeks...so i gave her those yesterday and last night...she is a little less stiff this morning....so you guys think its' o.k. to put her under for x-rays???? she is not figedty...she is a very quiet dog...( the houndie in her)i guess i will ask one more time if i can hold her...otherwise i guess i will let him proceed...we need to see if it is rhumatoid or osteo-arthritis.....thanks for all your thoughts and caring!!!! the deli dog :) ;)

[Dixieland Dancer]

Delidog, I am sorry to hear your precious pooch has a problem. :( When they hurt it makes us feel so helpless. How old is Delilah? I guess you won't be playing tug with her in the future. This does put a lot of strain on the front paws.

I always make sure I have Rimadyl on hand for my dogs just in case. It is in our doggie first aid kit. I was also told not to give dogs acetominiphine. It is very toxic to them. If your vet told you to I don't understand why? Was it because you didn't have anything else on hand?

About the X-rays. Most vets prefer the dog to be sleeping for a couple different reasons. First it prevents the dogs from being able to bite. Second they can position the dogs limbs any way they need to in order to get a good quality X-ray. Even though my Dixie is a very gentle and compliant dog, they still needed to put her out when I had her hips X-rayed for certification for breeding purposes. This was just to insure the most accurate picture. It is hard to tell a dog to lie still and don't move. The amount of anesthisia they use is not nearly as much as they use to use and the dog is not even groggy when they wake up.

Keep us posted on the results. Give Delilah a hug for me! I hope she is feeling better soon! :)

[Phred]

Hi, Deli ~

Sorry to hear about the sore :( front end! Here's some things to read about Tylenol...

Drs. Foster & Smith: "Some human medications such as Tylenol can be toxic, and even lethal to pets." See their site at: "Over-the-counter medications" (http://www.peteducation.com:80/article.cfm?cls=0&cat=1767&articleid=1031).

VetMedCenter.com: "What is acetaminophen toxicosis? Acetaminophen such as (Tylenol) toxicosis is an acute poisoning of cats and dogs resulting from overdose with (or accidental exposure to) pain killers containing acetaminophen. This active ingredient is found in many over-the-counter drugs, particularly in cold, flu, and sinus medications. Cats are generally at greater risk than dogs.

"What causes acetaminophen toxicosis?
Acetaminophen is not a recommended medication for dogs and cats. However, intentionally giving it to an animal, or accidental access and consumption happens sometimes. Cats lack the enzyme to metabolize (process) acetaminophen, so its accumulation in the blood and liver are damaging (toxic). Dogs can also be poisoned by moderate dosages of acetaminophen." See this site at: :VetMedCenter.com. (http://www.vetmedcenter.com/consumer/display.asp?dt=v&id=8832)

My previous Husky/Shepherd, Shadow (Rainbow :( Bridge), broke a back toe on a Friday night. Our Vet arranged for me to get into a larger Clinic with an X-ray on Saturday morning, without an appointment. Their Vet examined her and said he would X-ray the foot first, as he suspected a dislocated or possibly broken :eek: toe. Could I accompany her? Nope! X-ray siute was too small and it "wasn't legal" to be in the room. She hobbled off with a Tech and was returned within 10 minutes, biscuit crumbs dribbling out of her mouth. I never asked how or if she was restrained, but she certainly wasn't drugged for the procedure. The crystal clear X-ray was developed in minutes and showed the obviously fractured outside toe.

After a paw-wrap, we were instructed to keep it dry and wrapped for several weeks, giving
plain ASPRIN ONLY - not Tylenol - if she seemed to be in pain. She was off the asprin after a week. By the third week she couldn't remember which paw she was supposed to be favoring :rolleyes:. When someone would offer sympathetic comments, Shadow would quickly begin a little dance number - frantically trying to lift the correct injured limb.

As for getting Deli X-rayed; you're into "next week" now. Have you been granted an appointment yet? If they plan to do a complete study of her entire front end, they might need to sedate her.

Good luck to you and poor Deli!

[3-greys-and-a-mutt]

Last year, when Pup had her back legs and hips x-rayed, she was put under using anesthetia. She was a wriggly little puppy, and never would have stayed still long enough to take an x-ray. Also, the fact that she was sound asleep allowed the vet to stretch her legs out to get a better picture of the entire length of the extended leg.

She was found to have hip dysplasia and the start of arthritis in her hips, and sometimes she needs pain relief. We were told to ONLY give baby aspirin to her, up to two a day, for arthritis relief. She is twenty pounds. When Boo (about 65 pounds) had a bad reaction to a shot and was in pain, we were told to give her 2 regular, plain, aspirin once a day.

[tatsxxx11]

My Star had to have xrays done recently, and she too was sedated with valium and ketamine. Unless the dog is EXTREMELY cooperative and will lay completely still, I have found this to be the common procedure. Limbs may need to be manipulated and positioned, and this facilitates that, while at the same time reducing stress to the dog and reducing the need for repeated exposures. The dog is not given a general anesthesia with intubation (breathing tube) and is considered to be a very light level of anesthesia, as may be given during dental work, and considerd very safe. Please keep us updated! You both will be in my thoughts and prayers. :)

[ November 14, 2001: Message edited by: tatsxxx11 ]

[jackiesdaisy1935]

Delidog, I don't have any advice, just wanted to say I hope Delilah is doing better and hope all goes well. Hugs and kisses from us.
Jackie

[Sudilar]

Prayers are coming Delilah's way!

[Daisy's Mom]

I hope everything works out fine for my one of my favorite houndie girls! Big kisses to her, and I pray that it's nothing serious. Keep us posted!

[AdoreMyDogs]

I was really upset to read that the DeliDog is in pain :( I know it's hard for you to see her like that because you love her, but it's hard on us too, because we love her too. I hope you find out what the problem is and the fix is easy. I would not worry too much about the x-rays...they often have to fully extend the leg and joint and if she is having pain in that area, it might be painful for her. The anestisia they have nowadays is so safe anyway, and they may just mildly sedate her, just to keep the edge off her pain and so they can maneuver those legs so they get the best radiographs.

Good luck :( Kisses to Delilah.

[delidog]

you guys are sssooo wonderful!!! i guess what i didn't do is ask the right questions of my vet..i.e.what type of anestesia is he going to use???will she be completely out or is it a local???...just to update...the deli is doing great!!! mon.,she had 2 rimadyl...still limping,tues. 1 rinadyl...better,wed.puppyhood!!!! bounding around like a 70lb. baby!!!! no medication(my vet said only give meds for pain) i guess also, i was feeling ssooo guilty because i thought i caused this because we were playing tug-o-war...we aren't going to do that anymore.....also, i did not understand why one day she was fine and the next day she was dead lame...wouldn't you see signs of athritis coming on????? she is 5 1/2 years old....that is quite young...and of course having both front legs go at the same time scared me...anyway...she is fine this morning and ahsn't had any meds for almost 2 days now....i thank you all for your kind words,advise and prayers....maybe i'll wait and see if this happens again... :) :D

[shais_mom]

I am sorry I am getting here late. But I missed this topic, don't have much time to check the other topics.
I am an xray tech at a people hospital and I can only imagine that for some dogs and for some positioning that they do need to be anesthized. I am only speaking from experience when I took Kylie to work to xray her leg. I wish I could have given her something to knock her out. I would have gotten a much better image. When Jodi and I took Bailey (her new kitty) to xray her leg it was the front, and she was in such pain and was just a baby at the time that holding her was a breeze.
Keep in mind, I don't work at an animal hospital(would love to tho) so I am not familiar with the goings on, just giving my professional opinion. Now in some instances like CAT scans or MRIs the animal obviousley has to be knocked out. There is no other way.
Come to think of it, it would easier to xray some of my patients knocked out!
Especially the little wiggle worms!!I love kids, I love my nephews so much, but I don't like to xray kids!! Its so traumatic for them. But its for their best interest. Good luck!! Keep us posted.

[delidog]

thanks shais mom....i guess i am just overreacting to the anesthesia part...but the deli is doing better...i just have to decide when i want to get her x-rayed now....and put my personal fears aside......thanks for your support and kind words....the deli dog ;) :)

[joycenalex]

dear delidog, rimadyl can be very helpful, but some dogs will have horrible reactions to it. did your vet suggest liver chemistry blood work to make sure delilahs' liver can tolerate the rimadyl?
BTW shais_mom i too am an xray tech south of you in columbus and on occasion i have wished that a patient could be mildly sedated too. i was knocked down by a patient once, luckily tho' none have tried to bite me. :D

[Sudilar]

Liver functions should be checked regularly when on Rimadyl. Please check into that. Good luck.

Sue and Killian

[delidog]

no my vet said nothing about liver functions and rimadyl... i think that i should be in the market for a new vet...as he was also the one who told me to give her tylenol....specificly....i only gave her 4 rimadyl over 3 days....but he mentioned no side effects at all....sshheesh!!!! i am very frustrated with this man.... :( :confused: the deli dog....p.s. the good news is she is sound as a dollar now....i think that she pulled her flexor tendons when playing....but this is why i am holding off until i find a better vet

[ktreva52]

Well, I have no problem with the concept of anesthetising the dog for the x-rays -- Shiloh had to be when they x-rayed for bladder stones, but I would find another vet! I can't believe he suggested Tylenol and then didn't suggest liver-function checks for the rhimadyl (is that how it's spelled?). Did he draw any blood for baseline numbers before you started the med?

No, 5 1/2 isn't too young for arthritis, unfortunately. Depending on the activity level of the dog, the breed, the weight factor (don't tell Smoke I said anything about that), etc., arthritis can show up even earlier. I hope you find a GOOD vet soon that will take extra good care of Delilah and will keep up with the side effects of her medications. Is this vet an older fellow? Sometimes, the older vets/doctors get so hidebound in what they learned umpteen years ago.....

Prayers and crossed paws for you both.

[delidog]

ktreve52 you are right...and i should know better...no he did not run any blood at all...he just did flexion tests....and the prescribed rimadyl....and prescribed tylenol over the phone...i could kick myself for being so gullable...its' like me going to the doc....you think that because they have a degree that they do the right thing....this vet graduated from the university of pennsylvania....which in my experience has a very strong vet program...i have been to their large animal facility many times...oh well...the past is the past....i will find a new vet for my deli dog!!!! thanks for all the advise,kind words and prayers