What's w/all the neutering???

[Carlotta]

:confused: Stray cats are a good thing. They keep rats away and other unwanted critters. I know I'm gonna get alot of posts about "over-population" and "the vets say so" and "it's kind to spay" and "it helps prevent unwanted litters" so don't waste your time. I've reserched everything there is on cats and all I get is reasons for spaying. Can' people be happy w/the way God made them? I mean, I'm not against it but that it's beginning to get hard to find kittens in the paper does not prove overpopulation. I've seldomly seen a stray but everytime I do they always look happy and I leave food out for them. They can hunt and take care of themselves so there's nothing wrong w/being a stray. You also get a wonderful feeling when you feed them.

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

You know everybody, I wouldn't even respond to this post since it seems this person is what they call a "troll". Just trying to stir up controversy so don't give them the satisfaction of knowing that their post worked.

Some people really need to get a life! :rolleyes:

[K & L]

Sorry, don't agree with you. Big problem is there aren't enough people to feed and care for them. They get diseases, do not get a healthy regular diet, and bring kittens into the same environment.

[Carlotta]

:mad: They can hunt! Just because their "domesticated" doesn't mean that they can't hunt! They can feed themselves just as well as any wild cat but since most people do feed strays they are very well fed. You never see a stray cat that's skin and bones.

[kitten645]

ditto t&p mom...

[lbaker]

ditto T&PMom. mums the word here

[lbaker]

kitten645, we posted the same thing at the same time - great minds etc etc

[Carlotta]

what duz that mean. I'm a kitten in this place!;)

[HayleyRosie]

Originally posted by Tubby & Peanut's Mom
You know everybody, I wouldn't even respond to this post since it seems this person is what they call a "troll". Just trying to stir up controversy so don't give them the satisfaction of knowing that their post worked.

Some people really need to get a life! :rolleyes:

Ditto!

[PayItForward]

Ditto T&P Mum !

[Nomilynn]

You are right Debbie. I also won't vote on the poll, since the answers are skewed and none of them fit for my opinion.

[Logan]

Carlotta, I don't know who you are, but if you wanted to stir up a controversy, you probably succeeded, except that these ladies won't bite! I voted....my cats stay indoors when I want them to. They go outdoors when I let them.

One of the reasons I was interested in your post is that you live in the same city I do. Do you know how many strays are euthanized every single year in Greenville, SC?? A LOT!!!! I think the statistic is that about 1/4 or 1/5 of the cats and dogs that are at the human society are adopted. The others are euthanized. That's enough statistically for me to know that in our area, we need to do a better job of encouraging spay and neuter. In fact, one of those "strays" that you never see lives in my house and has been here for over two years.

Logan

[zippy-kat]

Originally posted by Carlotta
it's beginning to get hard to find kittens in the paper

I'll proudly disply status as a lemming and follow up with a huge DITTO to T&P, Lbaker, Nomilynn, Logan, & all the rest.

I just wanted to comment that, people who don't care enough to spay and neuter probably don't care enough to run an ad in the paper.

[ramanth]

Ditto T&P

[slick]

Well, Carlotta, even though I refuse to comment on this debate and agree with T & P, you are a newcomer and as with all newcomers I have to say welcome to Pet Talk.

However it's a shame that your first post has to be one that can stir up all kinds of emotions......and hurt feelings. I wouldn't be pushing this subject too far if I were you.

[catland]

Yes, welcome to Pettalk. Do you have pets? If so, tell us about them - that's the best way to get to know us. We're really nice people and if we had any friends, they would agree with us.

Funny story - regarding Sidney's (my 6 year old cat from the shelter) first visit to the vet after he was neutered. He was very skittish and scared and the vet tech looked at him and said "that's ok, we can only neuter you once"

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Originally posted by catland
He was very skittish and scared and the vet tech looked at him and said "that's ok, we can only neuter you once"

:D :D

[aly]

Originally posted by Tubby & Peanut's Mom
You know everybody, I wouldn't even respond to this post since it seems this person is what they call a "troll". Just trying to stir up controversy so don't give them the satisfaction of knowing that their post worked.

Some people really need to get a life! :rolleyes:

Just thought it should be repeated.

Hard to keep my mouth shut on this one but I will :mad: :mad:

[lynnestankard]

Ditto everyone!!

Lynne

[catland]

Another funny spay/neuter story. Some of you might have already heard this one - so bear with me.

I brought in Jan to be spayed, along with her sons, Joxer and Quincy, to be neutered. Because the boys were now weaned, she had lost her maternal instinct and wanted nothing to do with them. I brought her in a little cat carrier and the two brothers in together in a bigger cat carrier.

So now they are in a room and the vet wants to give them the once over before I leave and they get their operations. Jan was very scared. She got looked over, was pronounced to be in perfect health, and set down. Now the vet opened the carrier for the two boys. Jan scurried into their carrier and maneuvered herself to the back of the carrier behind her sons. She was sacrificing her boys to save herself.

It was like she was saying to me and the vet "go ahead - take them, I can always make more"


(HUMOR - the best weapon against Trolling:D )

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Originally posted by catland
It was like she was saying to me and the vet "go ahead - take them, I can always make more"


Another great story. :D :D :D

The only funny neutering story I have is that when I first got Tubby, his first mom thought he was a girl - called him Bitsy. Well, I never bothered to check on things so I called to make an appt to get "Bitsy" spayed. Everything went fine until the vet lifted his/her tail and said "Well, I'll have a tough time of spaying her," and my heart starts fluttering, thinking what's wrong with my kitty?!!?! and the vet continues..."because she's a he!" and he shifted Tubby's butt into my view with tail up. Well, we both got a good laugh out of it, and I learned to never take anyone's word for it on the sex of a young kitten. ;) :D

[Desert Arabian]

Do you have pets?
According to this person's profile she/he claims to have two cats: one not spayed, unsure of the other.

I am not even going to comment on the topic of this thread!! I just got back from the doctors office for a physical, I think I need to go back because my blood pressure just shot up.

I am so disgusted it's not even funny. Talk about getting on people's bad sides real quick!

[boscibo]

I have made gender mistakes with two kittens. Kelsey was a fluff ball, and I though he was a she. RIP, sweet Kels.

When I first got Hanna, I thought she was a he. I don't know what is so hard about it for me, I have a book with pictures and everything!

[catland]

Originally posted by Tubby & Peanut's Mom
Another great story. :D :D :D

Everything went fine until the vet lifted his/her tail and said "Well, I'll have a tough time of spaying her," and my heart starts fluttering, thinking what's wrong with my kitty?!!?! and the vet continues..."because she's a he!" and he shifted Tubby's butt into my view with tail up. :D

:D lol:D

[Carlotta]

Ok, first off. I do care about my animals. I have 2 females. One is Carlotta-a calico(email me at [email protected] for piccys)and she is pregnant and very happy too! Then there's this other cat that I rescued from a person who didn't want her and gave her a great home here. I'm not sure if she's spayed and she may be extremely elderly. She's seems to be doing ok adn gets along w/Carlotta fine. Her name's Gypsy. I let them in and out whenever they want so they may experience freedom. Carlotta is an extreme hunter and since she is pregnant she eats the prey she craves. My kitties are extremely well fed. Kibble all the time and fish, wet catfood, and table scraps are commonly offered. I'm not ignorant and I have researched many cat sites. I know what you people think and from experience greatly disagree w/it. You can hate me. I really don't care. My cats are my friends so I don't need people.

[Pam]

No comment. Carlotta I think it may be time to move on to another forum.

[Carlotta]

"those strays I never see" usually happen to be peoples outdoor kitties w/out collars. Carlotta wears a collar to prevent this and Gypsy isn't the kind of cat that would wander or any1 would want to steal. I'm not saying there aren't strays because I have seen some but they are always happy. I think the pound is cruel because they should give away the cats or set them free. Not kill them. I've also seen 2 beautiful kittens in the local petsmart grow up in a cage. Yes, a small cage barely big enough to hold them. They've been there since they were like 6wks and now they are full grown cats. I'm not lying and they may still be there. Last time I've been was a few mo. ago. How's spending your entire life in a cage for humanity?

[Carlotta]

how do you insert a pic of your kitty?

[Pam]

Carlotta it sounds to me like you are very young - at least you post like you are young. Would you like to spend you life in a cage or be killed because no one wanted you and there was no money to feed or take care of you? Your attitude is either childish or ignorant. Think about it, if you are really sincere.

[Carlotta]

If every pet is going to cost money then no1's going to want them. If they would try giving them away free w/out all the nonsense they came w/then they might find homes. Cat's don't even require homes. Strays are perfectly happy and when I was a little kid I would talk to some outside of my church. I would feed them too but they always looked happy and I could feel their happiness. There may have been strays several generations ago but a true stray(not sum1's pet)is truly rare nowadays.
I am young. I don't care. It's better than being old.

[kitten645]

Friends like you, who needs enemies?

[Carlotta]

Originally posted by kitten645
Friends like you, who needs enemies?
No1 said you were my friend.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by catland
vet tech looked at him and said "that's ok, we can only neuter you once"


that's why god gave the male cats TWO......oh, forget it....

[Carlotta]

:( I was hoping to find some nic ppl to chat w/on here that really like animals. Unfortunately none of you seem to be the kind that wants to make cats have happy lives. It's not my fault that the unhumane society has to cage and kill alot of their animals. They could just set them free.

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Tell me "Carlotta" does this look like the face of an unhappy cat?
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid47/p5dc1482bdd07e04268220d3f5646e7b9/fcc6532c.jpg

[Carlotta]

It obviously doesn't have much else to do but sleep.

[kimlovescats]

Seems not long ago, I suggested an AGE MINIMUM requirment to post on PT????:rolleyes:

[Carlotta]

:confused: What??? So you think every1 here has to be old like you. I suppose your brain rots away as you age!

[slick]

Originally posted by RICHARD
that's why god gave the male cats TWO......oh, forget it....

Hey now Richard, remember what Karen said...

Be good

[Pam]

Carlotta you should come and visit the dumpster behind my office some day. There are lots and lots of kitties there who only hope to find a scrap to eat from what is thrown out at the restaurant which is also in our shopping center. They are skinny and afraid of people. How is that living a good life? If they were trapped they would go to a shelter and ultimately be put to sleep. Is either a good life? I think not. Some day you will realize. We are not mean here. We just love animals and don't wish to see any of them suffer. Some day you will understand I guess.

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Originally posted by Carlotta
It obviously doesn't have much else to do but sleep.

That wasn't the question "Carlotta." Doesn't matter how much he has to do, the question was does he look unhappy? I can assure you he's not, and he's been neutered for probably more years than you've been alive. :D :D :rolleyes:

Also, I feel sorry for you. If you came here to meet people who love animals, you certainly came to the right place. However, your very first post did nothing but alienate everyone, which shows me that you haven't the first clue how to make friends, and probably don't have too many in real life - which is really sad. You seem to have a lot of misplaced and pent up anger. My suggestion would be to get some counseling.

If you can stop with all the negativity, there are many people here who would love to help educate you as to why neutering is so necessary. However, keep up like you've been and your future will surely be a sorry one. :(

[Carlotta]

You realize cats crave to be outside for a reason(don't tell me "my kitty is sooo happy being an indoor kitty" cause I'm not gonna believe it). How would you like to be stuck indoors. Catnip mice aren't all that exciting and being w/a friend is much more fun if you are able to run around w/them. You know all of those "crazy" cats people talk about? Well, I've only experienced "craziness w/my indoor cats. My outdoor kitties haven't had a crazy moment. I know what being indoors and declawing them does. Early altering of pets causes the "spay pouch" and the clogged urinary tract for males. I do think that if you have a male it is best to have him neutered to prevent him from becoming a wild animal. It needs to be done in time but not to early to be effective and healthy for them. How's that for ignorant?

[Uabassoon]

My outdoor kitties haven't had a crazy moment. I know what being indoors and declawing them does

Don't assume that everyone who has an indoor cat declaws them. I have two indoor cats and neither one of them is declawed.

[zippy-kat]

Originally posted by Carlotta
How's that for ignorant?

If the shoe fits...:rolleyes:

[Carlotta]

Man! How many times do I have to say this? Just because I'm not old doesn't mean I'm ignorant. I've been to all the catfood and cat and spay and neuter and humane society sites there are! I know what all of you nutters think because I've even talked to some of you in real life and on the phone and which all where mean. I know all the lies the sites post "healthier, happier pet if neutered" and "more companionable". I will agree that males are nicer if altered at the right time and most tom cats refuse to come to people(except my Carlotta's boyfriend). I also read that cat's don't need one litter of kittens b4 spayed. It wouldn't be such a common question if having one litter was so much healthier.
Anyway, I do have friends and they aren't all crazy like you. I think it's stupid that you must recommend counciling for someone you don't even know. My best friends however are my cats. I would send you a picture if you would email me asking for one because it is quite a treat to lay your eyes one her.
This is the most negative illusional chatroom I've ever been too. I don't think I'll be coming back unless in a few generations-yes, when I'm old-your precious vets decide the trend is to not spay and neuter and keep indoors and all that nonsense. Posting will be quite useless now if it's agaist me. I don't care to listen to old freaks that don't exist.

[Carlotta]

I never said that indoor kitties are all declawed. I've had one declawed and several others had claws but kept inside. All went crazy.

[zippy-kat]

Originally posted by kimlovescats
Seems not long ago, I suggested an AGE MINIMUM requirment to post on PT????:rolleyes:

There is one...and it's either 12 or 13. I don't remember which but it's in the rules & regs.

[Carlotta]

You all believe whatever a vet tells you. Their just out there to make money. They wouldn't declaw if they really loved animals. I know that most people think declawing is evil and that's one thing I can actually agree w/you in. I wish it were illegal.

[Carlotta]

I'm 15 so even though I'm not an old lady then I'm still old enough(oh, here you go going to bring the min. up)

[Desert Arabian]

Originally posted by Carlotta
:( I was hoping to find some nic ppl to chat w/on here that really like animals. Unfortunately none of you seem to be the kind that wants to make cats have happy lives. It's not my fault that the unhumane society has to cage and kill alot of their animals. They could just set them free.

EXCUSE ME!?!?!?!?! Is my vision going bad/taking this the wrong way...but did you just imply that I do not give my cats a happy life. I being one of the "none of you's".

My cats have an extremely happy life. And I don't have to worry about them getting hit by cars, getting in horrible fights, killed by coyotes and dogs, getting infested with ticks, fleas, worms, mites, etc.

As far as setting them free...I think you need to be set free, and have to build your house out of sticks, kill your food, bathe in a river, defend yourself against items bigger than you, groom all of the insects off of you, give birth out in the woods with no help...once you have done that, you will want to bring every stray cat into your house.

If you did all your research on cats, you would know that not all animal shelters kill, and in most humane societies they aren't in the tiny cramped cages 24/7. Many shelthers have playrooms for the cats, with cat furniture, toys, other cats, etc.

If I am indeed reading your post wrong (which I doubt), sorry, please disreguard the above.

[Uabassoon]

I never said that indoor kitties are all declawed. I've had one declawed and several others had claws but kept inside. All went crazy.

Maybe you didn't give them enough mental stimulation. My indoor cats certainly aren't crazy.

And I thought you were done posting here?

[kimlovescats]

Maybe 20 would be better???

[Carlotta]

Oh, shut up. {Karen edited} cats. Tah-tah.....

[Uabassoon]

I didn't know that 22 was considered old.

[zippy-kat]

Originally posted by kimlovescats
Maybe 20 would be better???

Nah, we have too many GOOD inbetweeners (those that fall inbetween 13 - 20). Now, IQ I could go with...

[boscibo]

Children are also happier running around free, into the streets and highways, but we don't let them now, do we?

Some people feel differently than you do about this issue, and many of the folks here actually work with rescues and at shelters and see first hand the truly sad and horrible things that can happen to strays. Have you? Or are you just sitting in your own rosy world, thinking everything must be free and wild to be happy? But the reality is, being stray is not an ideal situation for any cat. They die, they die horribly, and they die often.

[boscibo]

Originally posted by Carlotta
Oh, shut up. You old ladies really need help(and if your a guy then your a gay one). You all say what the next one say. I'll be letting myself out ...

Don't let the door hit your a$$ on the way out...

[Cheshirekatt]

Originally posted by Carlotta
"those strays I never see" usually happen to be peoples outdoor kitties w/out collars.

The "strays" I usually see are dead on the side of the road.

The last stray I adopted was about 3 days away from starving to death. He had a broken mandible, seizure disorder and parasites that were slowly killing him. Gee, sounds like fun.....perhaps you'd like to give it a try?

[GoldenRetrLuver]

Carlotta, i HAVE to disagree with you. Spaying and neutering helps keep the cat population under control. My cats are ONLY INDOORS and have a very happy life thank you very much! And i think your the one who needs help if you havent got the sence to spay or neuter your cats or put us down for speaking our minds about the situation. And vets are wonderful people and only want the best intrest for the animal, and are not in it for the money! And if you still dont get it after all these replies, then i dont think theres much more we can do....:rolleyes:

BTW, the "old lady" comment was very immature, maybe think about it before you say it next time eh?

[Desert Arabian]

Originally posted by boscibo
Don't let the door hit your a$$ on the way out...

And don't let my foot get up there too far.

[IttyBittyKitty]

[HEAVY SARCASM] Carlotta, you are obviously know EVERYTHING there is to know about cats. You must have put a LOT of research into those theories of yours. [END /HEAVY SARCASM]

To echo the sentiment of Forrest Gump, that's all I have to say about that.


Originally posted by Carlotta
Ok, first off. I do care about my animals. I have 2 females. One is Carlotta-a calico(email me at [email protected] for piccys)and she is pregnant and very happy too!

I hope you find homes for each and every one of those kittens. :mad: :mad:

[BastetsMum]

First off:

1. Whiskas and Purina websites with flashy pictures on them and targeting people who are guillible enough NOT to read the labels on the cans of catfood DOES NOT offer good advice relating to anything to do with cats. They are out to sell. Also if you actually DID do your research you wouldn't have alienated everyone on this forum. Ditto to the *troll* comment.

2. If your calico gets into difficulty birthing are you going to let her die rather than see a vet who is *just out for money*?

3. Have you ever had a cat hit by a car? If you have what did you do?

Finally, I have seen and met smarter 8 year olds.

[IttyBittyKitty]

Originally posted by YellowLabLover
And don't let my foot get up there too far.

... Sums it up nicely!

[kitten645]

No1 said you were my friend.

You said you were your cats friend. Hence my comment on enemies. Seems you are quite outnumbered around here little girl. Perhaps you might find another sandbox to play in. You ARE ignorant. :rolleyes:

[aly]

Ok I am REALLY mad now and I have to say that you HAVE NOT done your research that you say you've done. My cat and fosters are 100% INDOOR ONLY and are happy as can be. I provide cat trees for them to climb on and have tons and tons of mind stimulating toys to keep their brains working. We also play laser which lets them hunt while they're indoors and safe.

Do NOT ever call the Humane Society the UNhumane Society. I take great offense to that because I work there. What would happen if we started giving cats away for free? For one, a lot of testing labs would just go to the shelter to get their victims to torture and do tests on. I think its better to be put to sleep peacefully than to be tortured and neglected to death. The price also covers the costs of SPAYING and NEUTERING which a lot of shelters REQUIRE, not all shelters do require it but most do.

To say that every single stray is happy .. well thats completely naive. I am sure there are happy strays, but I'd be willing to bet there are TONS more who are unhappy. You are judging only by what you see. The general public has blinders on when it comes to the overpopulation problem. If you don't see it, you probably won't realize it.

And you are so offended by the responses, but look at your posts and look at your poll. You are just asking for controversy, as most young people on the net do.

This is a courteous site full of friendly people who love their cats. Please stop being so confrontational and offensive. Thank you.

[GoldenRetrLuver]

Originally posted by aly
Ok I am REALLY mad now and I have to say that you HAVE NOT done your research that you say you've done. My cat and fosters are 100% INDOOR ONLY and are happy as can be. I provide cat trees for them to climb on and have tons and tons of mind stimulating toys to keep their brains working. We also play laser which lets them hunt while they're indoors and safe.

Do NOT ever call the Humane Society the UNhumane Society. I take great offense to that because I work there. What would happen if we started giving cats away for free? For one, a lot of testing labs would just go to the shelter to get their victims to torture and do tests on. I think its better to be put to sleep peacefully than to be tortured and neglected to death. The price also covers the costs of SPAYING and NEUTERING which a lot of shelters REQUIRE, not all shelters do require it but most do.

To say that every single stray is happy .. well thats completely naive. I am sure there are happy strays, but I'd be willing to bet there are TONS more who are unhappy. You are judging only by what you see. The general public has blinders on when it comes to the overpopulation problem. If you don't see it, you probably won't realize it.

And you are so offended by the responses, but look at your posts and look at your poll. You are just asking for controversy, as most young people on the net do.

This is a courteous site full of friendly people who love their cats. Please stop being so confrontational and offensive. Thank you.

Well said.:)

[bluekat]

OMG, I didn't know that keeping cats indoors could make them have a boring life!!!!:eek: :rolleyes: yeah right......
Well, my Blueberry is strictly indoors, and he seems pretty happy to me. He actually is kind of afraid of going outside, so he's fine like this.
I wish there are no stray cats out there, they have a very short life. I sometimes see cats dead on the streets, how do we prevent that? By keeping them indoors and spaying or neutering. If you just let them have unwanted litters, all that creates are more cats, with the many chances of being killed.

[bluekat]

Oh yeah, forgot to add. If I were a cat, I'd rather be living in a nice home with loving owners instead of out on the streets constantly hunting for food, and only being able to live a few short years.

[K & L]

It's quite obvious this person doesn't think or feel the way we do. I would say it's not worth the argument!

[Cheshirekatt]

Originally posted by K & L
It's quite obvious this person doesn't think or feel the way we do. I would say it's not worth the argument!

My thoughts exactly.

[Nomilynn]

My guess is this idiot doens't really have pets, is sitting at home with a bunch of his/hers (like it matters) 15yr old friends, and thought, "hey wouldn't it be fun to get a bunch a people REALLY pi**ed off?"

Ignore it, and it won't be fun for whoever this is anymore.

Oh and by the way, after reading a unintelligable post like this, I have to say that to all the people who actually ARE involved in rescue that you have even MORE of my respect and admiration, because even though I don't really believe that "Carlotta" is a real pet owner etc, I do know that there are a LOT of dumb people out there who don't know their facts. Kudos to all of you who do such great work :)

[Cinder & Smoke]

I don't *think* the Pet Talkers are really going to "change" her mind...

And we're all gettin pretty worked up trying...

Let's just STOP & DROP the discussion and let the whole thing pass.

If we just STOP responding here - the thread WILL fade into a distant memory...

;)

/s/ Phred

[popcornbird]

First of all, this isn't a chat room. Its a discussion board and you need to know how to post on it (in a well manner). You are free to post your opinion, but the way you started it was rude and imposing.

2nd, to the others suggesting a change in age limit :eek:, 20 would be a very unfair limit. I'm years under 20 and I don't see any reason why any of the MANY very cherished young members on this board should be banned. Some of you make it like all kids are dumb and immature or whatever, and that is really wrong and hurtful. You all grew up from kids/teens, and this is a family site, not an all adults one. 13 is a fine limit set by the moderators of this site. There are dumb old people in this world as well. Age means nothing, and if someone young comes and starts blabbering like this, that is NO reason that all of us youngsters should get banned. Many of the young ones are great contributers to this site and far more mature than many older than them. Ok, end of this age rant. :o


Originally posted by boscibo
Children are also happier running around free, into the streets and highways, but we don't let them now, do we?


Very well said. Although opinions of spaying neutering differ greatly in the general public, I think it is absolutely stupid to say that every indoor cat is an unhappy animal. My friends have several cats that are indoor, but allowed outdoors, however, despite the pet doors for outdoor access provided by their mommy, they only go out like once a month for less than an hour and come back. If they were SO unhappy indoors, they would be running out all day, but they are perfectly happy inside and choose to stay indoors. Children love to go outside. They love to run around and play, putting anything they find in their mouths, and wandering off anywhere. A child would be perfectly happy to jump in a river and have some fun, and explore a forest. Such a child would have the freedom of his/her dreams. Would you allow a 3 year old to wander out and have all the freedom he/she wants no matter how dangerous it might be? I don't think so. Its the same with animals. Animals, and domesticated ones in particular, don't know how to handle the outside world and can easily get themselves into trouble. A outdoor cat may catch a diseased rat, and be so happy about it, but later get sick and die because it ate something it shouldn't have and didn't know any better. I have seen children throwing rocks at outdoor animals, and I would NEVER want to risk that with a loved pet. Animals can get lost, can get run over by a car, there are SO many possibilities of danger for an outdoor cat that a loving pet owner would never risk. Cats outside hunt because that's how they get food to eat. Indoor cats have fresh clean food available at all times. Outdoor cats play with moving bugs. Indoor cats play with moving toys, which they probably cannot tell the difference. Outdoor cats sleep in mud. Indoor cats sleep in beds. Outdoor cats avoid humans. Indoor cats LOVE humans. Indoor cats are NOT sad. Maybe the ones you know are crazy because they haven't been raised properly. Children who aren't raised properly are crazy also.

As for neutering, I understand why people do it, but personally I don't think its right to remove a part of an animal's body, mainly because God did not make animals to be altered. I truely understand why you all do it, but I just don't know. I don't think God would like us changing His creations by changing the way God made them. I don't have a cat and honestly don't know if I would spay/neuter my cat if I did. I don't like the idea of removing parts of an animal's body unless its for medical reasons (an illness, etc). Its just how I feel, I'm not condemning anyone. You do what you feel is best, and I don't know if I would do it if I had a cat. I would obviously do more research on the subject before getting a cat so I could make my decision. Many of my friends have non-altered cats that are strictly indoor and don't add to the population, and they have never had behavioral problems with them. They are females though. I know males spray. Please note that if I ever have an unaltered cat, it will be STRICTLY indoors, however, I would prefer to get an already altered cat from a shelter so that, if neccessary, I wouldn't have to get it done.

[boscibo]

popcornbird - you sound like you're a bright, well rounded young person, and an asset to Pet Talk.

About the neutering. I really don't like to argue or even discuss religious topics on public Internet forums, but -

Yes, animals are God's creations, and he made them a certain way. But if you think like that, think about this. We came into the world naked, without any clothes. That must be the way God intended us to be, right? Yet you will find very few (if any) humans that go around naked all the time. Sometimes we (as thinking beings) have to bend the rules a little. In the case of pet overpopulation and the whole neutering/spaying debate, I think it is justified.

There simply isn't enough homes for them all. We need to take care of animals on this earth, and if there was any other way to keep overpopulation under control (even a little bit) we would do it differently.

I personally think it is cruel to keep an animal like a cat or dog intact if you are keeping it for a pet. The un-neutered animal will have urges that it cannot satisfy. It can't understand why it can't breed to relieve these feelings, and that can be very frustrating and even painful for the animal. Like an itch you can't scratch, only 1000 times worse.

[wolf_Q]

Originally posted by boscibo
Don't let the door hit your a$$ on the way out...

No, no, please let it hit you....HARD! :D

Bye bye!! *waves*

p.s. I'm not an "old lady" either! :rolleyes:

[popcornbird]

Originally posted by boscibo
popcornbird - you sound like you're a bright, well rounded young person, and an asset to Pet Talk.

About the neutering. I really don't like to argue or even discuss religious topics on public Internet forums, but -

Yes, animals are God's creations, and he made them a certain way. But if you think like that, think about this. We came into the world naked, without any clothes. That must be the way God intended us to be, right? Yet you will find very few (if any) humans that go around naked all the time. Sometimes we (as thinking beings) have to bend the rules a little. In the case of pet overpopulation and the whole neutering/spaying debate, I think it is justified.

There simply isn't enough homes for them all. We need to take care of animals on this earth, and if there was any other way to keep overpopulation under control (even a little bit) we would do it differently.

I personally think it is cruel to keep an animal like a cat or dog intact if you are keeping it for a pet. The un-neutered animal will have urges that it cannot satisfy. It can't understand why it can't breed to relieve these feelings, and that can be very frustrating and even painful for the animal. Like an itch you can't scratch, only 1000 times worse.

Well, I don't think its comparable to clothes because clothes aren't a part of your body. A collar is more comparable to clothes. :) I actually don't know much on this subject, but if I ever decide to get a cat, I will definitely do a LOT of research on it before making my decision. I just don't know enough to say. It sounds scary to me, but I've never experienced a pet going through it, and I know you all do it for the best. I just can't see myself doing that to an animal. :o As I said, I would prefer to get an already altered kitty, because that way it would be fixed, and I wouldn't be the one that had to do it. :) I had never known that spaying/neutering even existed several years ago :o, but then again, I was young and didn't know a lot in this world. I don't know if having an unaltered pet is cruelty, because no one alters birds and other small animals, and they have desires too. Its just too risky for some animals. The overpopulation is defintely a problem, and if this is the only way to solve it, its much better than having so many animals die.

[aly]

There's also other reasons for spay/neuter other than the overpopulation problem.. another big reason is it reduces the risk of cancer, therefore making a happier and healthier pet. It can also prevent behavior problems such as fighting with other dogs (if 2 intact males are around a female, watch out).

[Denyce]

Finally someone mentioned the cancer aspect to spaying. Besides how miserable female cats are who are in season and do not have access to a male. The only way to bring them out of season is manually. Personally I find that rather offensive.

I have spent many years on discussion boards and chat rooms. In fact I met my husband in a chat room on August 28 1997. Best thing I ever did...:D . However...I have also seen many many such as "Carlotta" They are attention getters. They rarely have anything of real relevance or importance or even interest to add to any discussion. Most of the time they are not even what they "say" they are. One evening I was in a chat room, an adult one, and there was a person in there who had opened up 4 browsers and was having a "personal" chat with himself as a man and a woman...while he was also in as two other "people" and trying to cause havoc amoung the other chatters. The saddest thing is he was a moderator of the site and accidently screwed up and booted someone under one of his alternate names. Carlotta is the same sort...and if she isn't than she is a very young, very stupid and very ignorant know it all teenager who has had little real education in this world. With her inability to learn or listen she won't have a very happy life. So I feel more sorry for her than angry.

I don't mind intelligent, thoughtful young people on here. There are some I have to say I pretty much discount. But there are others who I enjoy reading their posts and I hope they go far in their lives. :D

I have to say this however, I cannot stand the "shortcuts" young people often use in posting. In all honesty I skip over and start discounting anyone's post that includes things such as "u", "r" and ppl. To me that is just laziness and if you do not have the respect to actually type out the correct word then why should I be interested in what you have to say. Ok...my rant. :o

Denyce

[marysmerrycats]

what duz that mean. I'm a kitten in this place!

kitten, go fend for yourself. :mad:

[ramanth]

Okay guys... I think he/she has left so lets have everyone move on. :) Remember, we promised Karen we'd be good. :)

*HUGS*

[marysmerrycats]

this little brat is not worth our time, to argue with her... its obvious.. school is out and she needs someone to bother... maybe a good day care or summer school would work for her, and less time unsupervised. 15 should be old enough, but obviously not in her case.
those cats with the wonderful outdoor life, hmm wonder what happens to them when they attack each other and get seriously hurt, maybe the vets that only care about money can help them.