Canadians and the War

[Tanya&Fritz]

I would love to know how Americans (and everyone else) feel about Canada not supporting the States. I am not exactly proud to be a Candian right now with the Prime Minister we have. Also, some of the rude comments from our members of parliament. Let me know. Do you think it will affect free trade and our relationship in general? I really hope not...

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Tanya&Fritz
I would love to know how Americans (and everyone else) feel about Canada not supporting the States. I am not exactly proud to be a Candian right now with the Prime Minister we have. Also, some of the rude comments from our members of parliament. Let me know. Do you think it will affect free trade and our relationship in general? I really hope not...

no, no worries.

keep sending Labatt's and we'll survive.
;)

[Tanya&Fritz]

Compared to your beer, you'd only need about 2 Labatt's :D :D :D

[lovemyshiba]

I don't really know that much, only that Canada is not supporting our president or our troops overseas. Personally, it doesn't affect me to the point where I don't want to ever go to Canada or talk to a Canadian again, but it may to some people. I'm sure every Canadian citizen doesn't agree with what the pariament is doing or saying, just as every American citizen doesn't agree with what our President says and does.


lol Richard!!! What about Molson??

[jackiesdaisy1935]

I have a lot of Canadian friends and they don't always agree with their government , and they are very supportive of what our military men and women are doing. I don't see any problem at all.
Jackie, Perry and Miss Daisy

[mugsy]

Is it the French influence that's causing it?? Personally, I don't judge a country by its citizens....I look at the government. I love Canadian people...they are so awesome!

[RICHARD]

actually i do have a beef with canada....




can you please take pamela lee back??

now that's scary......

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lovemyshiba

lol Richard!!! What about Molson??

thank you....i stand corrected...



unless i drink too much, then i lean against the wall...

[Tanya&Fritz]

Originally posted by RICHARD
actually i do have a beef with canada....




can you please take pamela lee back??

now that's scary......

NO WAY! You can have her! You can keep Celine Dion too :D

[primabella]

:D LOL :D

I feel ashamed sometimes too. As long as the Americans don't think we all think the same way, I feel okay. Plus, I support the troops..:D

[Tanya&Fritz]

I definitely support the troops. Like you, I just hope all Americans don't think we're similar to our Prime Minister :o But I do have to admit that I have a tendency to talk out of the side of my mouth and nobody can understand me. Oh, hold on, that involves Labatt's again :D :D :D

[Paul]

   I am sure it has and will have some effects. But it will not effect trade. Given the current situation, we will still enjoy good relations.

   I watched some of the coverage of parliament via C-SPAN. However, I think the only surprise is how little mention of Canada there is in the news coverage here.

      Paul

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Tanya&Fritz
NO WAY! You can have her! You can keep Celine Dion too :D

eeeeeeeeeewwwwwwwwww,
you mean she's not a national treasure????

lolololol

[lovemyshiba]

I forgot all about Celine Dion--keep her!!!!!!!

[mugsy]

I'll make a deal with you Canadians....you take Pamela Lee and Celione Dion and we'll keep Shania Twain!! I LIKE her music!! lol I know I know she lives in Switzerland! heheehe

I'm with Paul, I don't think it will affect our trade relations.

[cali]

I personanally am EXTREMLY proud to be canadian and very glad we are not suppoting the war, I certainly dont, and never will:) but I have lot sof friends in the US nothing against any of you but I for one will NEVER support the war:p

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by cali
I personanally am EXTREMLY proud to be canadian and very glad we are not suppoting the war, I certainly dont, and never will:) but I have lot sof friends in the US nothing against any of you but I for one will NEVER support the war:p

alrighty...now take back lee and dion.....please?!?!?!

and what's the deal with canadian football-why are the endzones 20 yards long??????????

[RockyRoad]

I'll keep silent on this 'supporting war' thing...;)

I'm proud of our Canadian neighbors! I have met many Canadian friends on here, and you are all as friendly as can be! My teacher is Canadian as well, and he's really nice! :D

[mugsy]

I'm not sure that it really matters anymore if we support the war or not since we are already in it. At this point, I look forward to the day that Iraq is no longer under the thumb of Saddam and has in place its own democratic government. It also doesn't matter if most of the world is behind us or not, we're there now. Just a thought.

I think everyone needs to stand behind what they believe in though.

Richard, I don't think they're biting on the return of Pamela and Celione....what a bummer! lol

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by mugsy


Richard, I don't think they're biting on the return of Pamela and Celione....what a bummer! lol



probably figgered it they ignore it, we'll forget.....i don't think so..

[oodlesofpoodles]

Whether we agree or not agree with war, it doesnt matter now as we are there. But the main reason that we are there goes back to 9/11. It wasnt just ameicans killed, there people from countries all over the world working at the World Trade Centers. But the one thing that I don't understand is when another country is in trouble who do they call upon. and who goes and helps out. Then when we need help and call upon the very same countries that we have helped out. Where are they. nowhere to be found. But thats all water under the bridge. The main thing is whether we agree or not is to keep all those over there doing their job to protect our nation and our freedom in our hearts and prayers. They didn't chose to go. they went because its their job. And I can see why Canada doesnt want Pam back. I dont think any country would want her. :D

[ScantyNebula]

I think that its kinda bizarre that Cretien didn't send Canadian troops to support the US .. but I agree that if the UN gives no thumbs up, then why should we fight in a war? US has enough power to tackle Iraq on their own ...even if they did have Canadian troops it wouldn't make much of a difference.

[Tanya&Fritz]

Originally posted by mugsy
Richard, I don't think they're biting on the return of Pamela and Celione....what a bummer! lol

OK, we'll make you a deal. We'll take Celine Dion back as long as we get Alanis Morissette back too. As for Pamela, sorry, there's just no convincing me :D :D :D

[sammi]

Originally posted by popcornbird
I believe the whole world helped the US after 9-11 and everyone was there for her. It is different this time, because people see no legal reason to go for war.

What do you consider being "legal"???

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Tanya&Fritz
OK, we'll make you a deal. We'll take Celine Dion back as long as we get Alanis Morissette back too. As for Pamela, sorry, there's just no convincing me :D :D :D

PLEASE?????
we'll keep peter jennings and alex trebeck!!!!

;)

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by sammi
What do you consider being "legal"???

stuffing people into wood chippers, feet first to hear them scream, head first so they don't.

using people as human shields

taking Iraqi olympians that lose a game , drag them on their backs until their skin bleeds, drag them over sand to embed the grains in those wounds and lastly making them submerge themselves in human waste, to infect those wounds.

raping women, taking pics and sending them to their families.

that's what's 'legal' in Iraq under saddam and his sons.
it's simply amazing how people, who stand for the rights of
people at any other time, can be so uninformed about the atrocities that have been perpetrated on a country like Iraq.

they'll gladly take up a cause against their country for trying to help those people and in the same breath damn the poor
citizens in Iraq to live in the shadow of evil.

no, our war is not legal, it's justified.

[Tanya&Fritz]

Originally posted by popcornbird
You can go to h*** for stating all those lies Richard. :rolleyes::mad: What a LIAR!

Popcornbird, you know I've supported you in the past, but I truly believe that these are not lies. There is just too much proof about some of the stuff that Saddam has done. He had one meeting with all of his generals and the next meeting he had with them there were 4 missing. Where do you think they went? He had them shot because they didn't agree with his strategies. He had his own brother-in-law killed :( Saddam is a very sick man and he needs to be stopped.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by popcornbird
You can go to h*** for stating all those lies Richard. :rolleyes::mad: What a LIAR!

And sammi, I said PEOPLE do not consider it legal, if you can't understand that plain simple sentence. You already know why people do not approve of this war. I don't want to argue. I don't come to this dog house forum much, so I'm not going to argue about something I'm going to miss anyways by not coming to this forum. I stick around the pet/general area.


sweetie,

i'm going to hell anyway.

i don't need your stamp on my passport.

as far as the olympians, check out the sports illustrated site (SI.com) and read the story, check out some of the other news
outlets and stories from people who have fled the regime.
i always figured that you may show some kind of maturity and not resort to calling people liars, but hey i'm wrong for supporting
the war, so i'm probably wrong about maturity too.

take flight little bird, the cage door is open.

[RICHARD]

FROM THE AMNESTY INTL. SITE

Political detainees in Iraq are subjected to the most brutal forms of torture. The bodies of many of those executed had evident signs of torture, including the gouging out of the eyes, when returned to their families. The most common methods of physical torture include electric shocks to various parts of the body, pulling out of fingernails, long periods of suspension by the limbs, beating with cables, falaqa (beating on the soles of the feet), cigarette burns on various parts of the body, and piercing of hands with an electric drill. Psychological torture includes threats of bringing in a female relative of the detainee, especially the wife or the mother, and raping her in front of the detainee, threats of arresting and harming other members of the family, mock executions and being kept in solitary confinement for long periods of time.

N.(20), a Kurdish businessman from Baghdad, married with children, was arrested in December 1996 outside his house by plainclothes security men. Initially his family did not know about his whereabouts and started going from one police station to another enquiring about him. Then through friends they found out that he was being held in the headquarters of the General Security Directorate in Baghdad. The family was not allowed to visit him. Eleven months later in November 1997 the family were told by the authorities that he had been executed and that they should go and collect his body. His body reportedly bore evident signs of torture. His eyes were gauged out and were filled with paper, and his right wrist and left leg were broken. The family was not given any reason for his arrest and subsequent execution. However, they suspected that he was executed because of his friendship with a retired army general who had links with the Iraqi opposition outside the country and who was arrested just before N.'s arrest and was also executed.

Soon after the attempted assassination of 'Uday Saddam Hussain in December 1996 and the mass arrests that ensued, Salah Mahdi, a 35-year-old traffic warden in al-Mansur married with three children, was arrested. He was accused of neglect because he did not notice the car the assailants used. He was held in the Special Security building and was severely tortured. He died reportedly as a result of torture in around June 1997. His family were told that he had died but the body was never returned to them for burial despite their repeated requests and to date his burial place reportedly remains unknown to the family.

[mugsy]

Popcornbird, you need to take a trip on the reality train hon, there is nothing that Richard stated that is a lie. It has all been reported and confirmed. The people in plastic shredders is all reported by a female Iraqi refugee.

[Nomilynn]

I don't really understand how you can think that is a lie when there are tapes of trapped American soldiers on the news?? :confused: :confused:

[sammi]

Popcornbird, What Richard said is reported facts - as sad as it may be, it is not lies. You are a young girl and I don't expect you to feel like some of us do. Many of us have heard these horror stories over and over. You may not have had anyone in your family fight in war either I don't know.

I understood your sentence. I just asked what you meant by legal/not legal (when you say the people). Whatever...................

[RICHARD]

i quoted sammi when she asked 'what is legal?'

i answered our 'war is not legal, it's justified'

i find that humor and torture are mutually exclusive.

i do not joke about the plight of people who are unable to
enjoy the basic right to live.

bascially, i did not address you because it's very tiring to
argue a moot point.



Richard replied with what he did, and I took that as him applying it to me (as my reasoning). THAT is what I said was a lie, because those reasons are NOT the reasons I don't support the war. Now do you understand what I meant?

yes, you just said that you are against the war, but torture
is not one of those reasons. so i can safely assume that the violation of Iraqi human rights does not figure in your stance against the war? let me know if i misquoted you.

[Soledad]

I also have to wonder why our democracy-loving nation installed such a ruthless dictator in the first place. :rolleyes:

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by popcornbird
I believe the problem could have been solved politically or in another way, that is why I'm not with the war. I KNOW Saddam is an evil wicked creature that needs to be thrown, and I KNOW that the Iraqis are denied their basic rights because of him. If given the chance, I'm sure the Iraqis would've overthrown him themselves, so I believe it was better if the US helped them to do that, instead of going in and doing the war, taking both the lives of Americans AND Iraqis. Also, since the UN did not approve going to war, and since they didn't find any weapons, The legitimacy for going to war was not proven. Just my humble opinion.


got it, but you have to understand that any US involvement would be construed by the other arab countries as an interference to Iraq's gov't.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Soledad
I also have to wonder why our democracy-loving nation installed such a ruthless dictator in the first place. :rolleyes:


boy howdy,



you mean we actually supported saddam during the iran/iraq
war!!!!!!! why, why i am shocked!!!


you should let the newspapers and media know about this...
stop the presses!!

[Soledad]

You truly are a jedi master of debate. Way to shoot that point down!

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Soledad
You truly are a jedi master of debate. Way to shoot that point down!


jedi master?????? no way grasshopper.

when you can 'get the stone from my palm you are ready to go....anywhere-but here'.... the blind guy to david carradine..


my point is - o.k. we supported saddam years ago and now we are on the way to escort him off the planet.. and then?????

come up with some facts and some sins we have committed that
are recent.....not the same old arguement from yesterday..

i told my self i'd never answer your posts again, but being a pro war kinda guy- i love to divide and conquer....

last chance to argue a point........

just do it!

[Soledad]

"i told my self i'd never answer your posts again"

Funny, I told myself the same thing. I think I will actually try doing that again. I suggest you do the same. It will make things easier for the both of us.

I just can't understand why my thoughts on this are of such interest to you.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Soledad
"i told my self i'd never answer your posts again"

Funny, I told myself the same thing. I think I will actually try doing that again. I suggest you do the same. It will make things easier for the both of us.

I just can't understand why my thoughts on this are of such interest to you.

aw hell, i may as well admit it.....

i like winning arguements!!!!!! it's that funny, silly feeling i get in my gut when the clock runs out and i am ahead on points. i want to open a bottle of gatorade and dump it on my head..

suggest as you may, darling, but i heard some demonstrators talk about some amendment right to free speech and i just wondered.....

the reason your thoughts inspire me is i like to have a round with you is to see how fast you fold...


whoa, 'another one bites the dust' just jumped into the CD player....my theme song....


toodles, dolly!

stay in touch and toss out those dated history books.......

XO

[RICHARD]

what part of no don't you understand?

[mugsy]

I don't think (and I could be wrong *gasp* I'm admitting I might be wrong...NO! It's my evil twin) that we put Saddam in power, but supported him during the Iran/Iraq war (not that I think this was a brilliant move) because, at the time, he was the lesser of two evils (now THAT'S a scary thought).


He is just so evil that he seems to be the Anti Christ. I just can't understand how these kinds of people are allowed to exist. His type (thank God there aren't that many) are why I love my dogs so much.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by mugsy
I don't think (and I could be wrong *gasp* I'm admitting I might be wrong...NO! It's my evil twin) that we put Saddam in power, but supported him during the Iran/Iraq war (not that I think this was a brilliant move) because, at the time, he was the lesser of two evils (now THAT'S a scary thought).


He is just so evil that he seems to be the Anti Christ. I just can't understand how these kinds of people are allowed to exist. His type (thank God there aren't that many) are why I love my dogs so much.


so what.....i'm EVIL and STUPID.....:p

[mugsy]

Now did I say that??? hehehe I never mentioned your name, unless of course you changed it to Saddam, but, I really do prefer Richard...it suits you so much better! :p Yes, I know I'm bad! You must send me evil ideas too, I'm running out and my students think I'm losing my touch (except of course when I turn into the Gum Nazi, as I was deemed today in my 6th period class)

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by mugsy
(except of course when I turn into the Gum Nazi, as I was deemed today in my 6th period class)

that's it, no more gum for you
.....Frau Gum Nazi, 6th period class



a tyrant i can live with.

[RICHARD]

going back to the original thread....

does the US have to invade Canada for you to take Celine back???

[Nomilynn]

Richard, she lives in Florida now (I think??) can't we just give her to the gators? ;)

[mugsy]

yeah that's it....gators....no one at fault that way! lol

[Crikit]

Actually she lives in Vegas now...doing all those shows for all that money. Now that's an idea, the Canadian government should see if Celine, and aw heck why not Shania as well...see if they would be willing to help fund the millitary. After all with all the money that Celine apparently is going to be making she can afford it.

Oh and no, you do not have to invade Canada to make us take Celine back, you just have to promise to let a Canadian team win the stanley cup ;)

And the CFL field is wider and longer because we prefer a passing game to a running game...not that anyone really cares about that point.

[kingrattus]

u americans can try to invade us canadians, but we'll just kick ur butts again :p & this time we'll give u Rita McNeal (sp)

[Cincy'sMom]

Originally posted by Crikit

And the CFL field is wider and longer because we prefer a passing game to a running game...not that anyone really cares about that point.

Being a huge football fan, I thought it was intereting...



Canda has been invaded...accidently! When my husband's cousin was in the military and stationed in North Dakota, he and another guy were out on patrol, cruising around. Suddenly they noticed the road signs were now in metric (kilometers instead of miles), and they realized, in a military vechicle, had crossed the border. They high-tailed it back to the US, before anyone relized they had "invaded"

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Cincy'sMom
Being a huge football fan, I thought it was intereting...



Canda has been invaded...accidently! When my husband's cousin was in the military and stationed in North Dakota, he and another guy were out on patrol, cruising around. Suddenly they noticed the road signs were now in metric (kilometers instead of miles), and they realized, in a military vechicle, had crossed the border. They high-tailed it back to the US, before anyone relized they had "invaded"

i love you all.....
from celine to football endzones to invading canada....
now this is a thread!!

[Tanya&Fritz]

Originally posted by Crikit
Oh and no, you do not have to invade Canada to make us take Celine back, you just have to promise to let a Canadian team win the stanley cup ;)

Go Sens Go!!!

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Tanya&Fritz
Go Sens Go!!!


what's with everyone being upset at gretzky???

[kingrattus]

:p

[Soledad]

I have no idea what your first sentence was about.

[emily_the_spoiled]

Hey Richard,

I was living in Edmonton when Gretzy was traded away. People aren't mad at him so much as the owner of the hockey team. Now for a little digression:
Peter Pocklington owned the Edmonton Oilers at the time and had been given millions of dollars in loans by the Alberta government to save his meat packing plant. He then defaulted on the loans (and wasn't very nice about it). In the mean time he made this big "to do" about Gretzy being a national treasure and he would never be traded away. Well low and behold there was enough money in the world to "make" Peter Puck (his nickname) trade Gretzy away. I guess maybe you had to be there...

[tatsxxx11]

Wayne Gretzky??? Who said Wayne Gretzky??? Who's mad at WG?? How can the same nation that gave the world Wayne Gretzky also create Celine Dion???:rolleyes: I heard that WG is being much maligned in Canada for his support of Pres. Bush...meantime, at the Edmenton Hockey game last week, while playing the Stars Spangled Banner, the Canadian crowd turned thier backs and boooed:(

[Tanya&Fritz]

Originally posted by tatsxxx11
meantime, at the Edmenton Hockey game last week, while playing the Stars Spangled Banner, the Canadian crowd turned their backs and boooed:(

I heard about that Sandra but I thought it was in Montreal. But I'll have you know that at the last game in Ottawa the Star Spangled Banner received a standing ovation.

[emily_the_spoiled]

I am not sure why they are upset with WG about the war. But it seems to becoming very very divisive within the country. With a large geographic split (with the West more likely to support the war).

I don't know how they could produce WG, Doug Flutey, Steve Martin, John Candy, and Martin Short but also give the world Celine Dion, Pamela Anderson, William Shatner, and Jim Carrey.

Actually I was told that it was a hockey game in Quebec where they did that. If that is the case I would right it off to them being French...

[tatsxxx11]

Ahhhhhhhh, you caught me!!!:o Just came back to fix that! Went to double check and found this article. I don't want our Canadian friends to be mad at us!!:( But Monteal....now THAT explains it!!;) Seriously, I defend anyone's right to protest the war. But booing our Natl. Anthem is not an act of protest against a specific event or issue. When a nation's flag/anthem is booed, it says to me, "we" reject all you stand for. I hope that's not the case. I can't speak on the ramifcations to free trade. But I know Canada's protest of the war does not in any way affect my very postive and warm feelings for my Canadian friends and neighbors!:) THANK YOU OTTAWA!!!:) And I've found a lot of the web today re: how Canadian's think our beer sucks...:D I'm not a beer drinker, but I hear for the most part, it does! That's why so many Americans drink imports!:rolleyes:


3/21/2003: Canadians Boo US Anthem

At a hockey game in Montreal, Canadians booed throughout the playing of the US national anthem.

The sellout crowd of 21,273 at Bell Centre was asked to "show your support and respect for two great nations" before the singing of the American and Canadian national anthems.

But a significant portion of the crowd booed throughout "The Star-Spangled Banner" in an apparent display of their displeasure with the U.S.-led war against Iraq. More than 200,000 people turned out for an anti-war demonstration in Montreal last Saturday.
And then the New York Islanders kicked the Montreal Canadiens’ asses. Hard.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by emily_the_spoiled
Hey Richard,

I was living in Edmonton when Gretzy was traded away. People aren't mad at him so much as the owner of the hockey team. Now for a little digression:
Peter Pocklington owned the Edmonton Oilers at the time and had been given millions of dollars in loans by the Alberta government to save his meat packing plant. He then defaulted on the loans (and wasn't very nice about it). In the mean time he made this big "to do" about Gretzy being a national treasure and he would never be traded away. Well low and behold there was enough money in the world to "make" Peter Puck (his nickname) trade Gretzy away. I guess maybe you had to be there...

thanks for the refresher.....

my comment was on his stance on the war..saw a blurb on the
telly and missed specifics....:)

[Crikit]

Ah yes, the reason people are mad at the "Great One" or at least some people are mad at him is because he stood up and said that he supports the war. Which is something that Don Cherry said as well, and you don't see people getting all up on his back about it. Anyhoo from what I saw in the paper and on the news some people in Edmonton went and did some stuff to his statue in protest.

As for the whole booing the anthem thing, from what I understand the people in Montreal did it a couple of times and then they were asked not to by a former player. While in Calgary, people have been cheering everytime that the anthem is played, which apparently brought tears to an american dignitaries eyes, and it's also something that the american players on the flames find moving.

[Tanya&Fritz]

Originally posted by tatsxxx11
But booing our Natl. Anthem is not an act of protest against a specific event or issue. When a nation's flag/anthem is booed, it says to me, "we" reject all you stand for. I hope that's not the case. :rolleyes:

Sandra, we have to remember that at another Montreal game they booed the Canadian National Anthem :eek: This is a VERY sensitive topic in Canada so I'll stop now so the thread doesn't go that way :D :D :D

[tatsxxx11]

Tanya, that's been done here as well. American athletes turning their backs of the flag, etc. So sad!:(

[Tanya&Fritz]

Sandra, since this thread seems to be about everything under sun :D , I wanted to let you know that a friend of mine lives in the suburbs of Boston and apparently it's not very far from Cape Cod at all. Wouldn't it be fun if I went down for a visit???

p.s. I will bring some Canadian beer with me. No point drinking watery beer :D :D :D

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Tanya&Fritz

p.s. I will bring some Canadian beer with me. No point drinking watery beer :D :D :D



THAT DID IT..............celine you are going home...