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View Full Version : Marlin saw the vet today. :( More info p3 #37



Freedom
04-17-2012, 04:04 PM
I put the visit off, as I couldn't find any solutions offered on line, and been through this once before with a family dog, nothing was available then either.

Marlin spins. He turns to the left, over and over and over, non stop. This morning, he'd been going almost 3 hours by the time our appointment came up (made that yesterday).

Vet said she's seen this before, mostly w/ small dogs, mostly w/ poodles. In 17 years, she never saw anyone so dedicated to his spinning as Marlin is. (He went non stop for half an hour in the exam room while we talked, after she examined him)

It is either a symptom of the dementia, or it is a brain tumor. No treatment for either, unfortunately, so she did not recommend spending the money for an MRI to see if it is a tumor. She could suggest some dementia meds she used in UK, not approved here but I could get them online via a Canadian pharmacy. Also she is going to look in to an OCD med. He is COMPELLED to spin, he will be lying down and give a little cry and hop up to spin: "I can't just lie here, I have to SPIN!" So I'd asked about an OCD med. She is going to research that. Either way it will be experimental, not an obvious fix.

She noted he does keep track of where I am as he spins - she had me move around the room to 3 different spots and stop. She said he is in no pain and really not aware of what he is doing. When he searches me out, you can see his eyes focus (I'd noticed this in the back yard, already).

This came on gradually over 5 weeks, first he'd spin a bit then be alright for several hours. Now, he either eats, sleeps or spins. He sometimes gets up in the night to spin. Exhausting to watch him!

He is unsteady on his feet and may get himself dizzy; after a time, he will tip and his rear end goes down. This only keeps him for seconds and he struggles to get up and resumes his spinning. The other problem we have is, in him getting up, he waves his legs about a bit. That sets Willy off, he rushes in for the kill - a bite to the neck. This started with Willy last summer, so I've been on watch for it. Willy has not actually bitten Marlin since last August. I have to keep a water bottle handy. And to help Marlin up, or hold him and cuddle him, I have to either put Willy outdoors, or one of them in the bedroom with the door closed. I discussed this with the vet as well. She has seen Willy go for Marlin, last year at one vet visit when I lifted Marlin off the exam table to put him on the floor. Marlin has never been one to stretch his legs down to meet the floor, no, instead he always has waved them around. I knew it would happen, and had the vet tech holding Willy's leash. It is a primal instinct, to put a pack member out if having a seizure, or if seriously injured, and so on.

Anyway, so she suggested I not leave the 2 of them with access to one another anymore when I have to go out. I need to start separating them before I leave the house. As there is no telling what Marlin will do, when, no clear prognosis as to what comes next in this decline.

Dad is not able to manage any of the dogs any longer, so it doesn't matter if I leave and he is home, that is the same as me not being here.

Marlin could stay this way for some months, or could get worse at any time. He eats fine, he is still Starvin' Marlin.

Oh, and I've been walking Marlin a few times a week. Slow to start, and slow moving but he is steady. She suggested I stop walking him; neighbors have commented to me that the dog does not want to walk. Unfortunately, she said someone could call Animal Control, and I'd have another big mess to cope with. I will perhaps take him up to the farm a few times, as he loves to potter about at the entrance where all the dogs leave their p-mail. In a way I'm glad about this, it was hard to poke along and go 1/4 mile in 45 minutes. On the other hand, I enjoyed seeing him find a smell and sniff, sniff, sniff! I do understand exactly what she is saying.

So, that is the update for Marlin. Sad, to watch him age like this.

pomtzu
04-17-2012, 04:26 PM
We're still sending prayers and good vibes to Marlin Darlin. :love:

chocolatepuppy
04-17-2012, 05:20 PM
Pawsitive thoughts and prayers headed Marlin's way.

Cataholic
04-17-2012, 06:23 PM
I am sorry to read this. I have heard of it before. I would try the medication for OCD or anxiety (though that might be similar), and hope for the best. Really, what else can you do?

Johanna

Asiel
04-17-2012, 06:37 PM
Freedom I am so sad to read about Marlin - it must be hard watching him go through the spinning. But it's comforting to know he isn't in pain and doesn't realize what is going on. I'm hoping that with some luck he might revert to more peaceful days. Keeping fingers crossed that things get better if possible.

beeniesmom
04-17-2012, 08:09 PM
I'm so sorry about Marlin. I hope the mess help. This must be so hard for you.

beeniesmom
04-17-2012, 08:10 PM
Meds not mess. Darn autocorrect.

Scooter's Mom
04-17-2012, 10:10 PM
I'm so sorry to read this update. Prayers and hugs for you and Marlin.

cassiesmom
04-17-2012, 11:32 PM
I'm so sorry to read this update. Prayers and hugs for you and Marlin.


I agree with all that has been said. I will keep praying.

SWHouston
04-18-2012, 12:00 AM
Freedom,

I know this sounds crazy, but...
Try putting a Patch over one Eye, and if that doesn't help, move it to the other Eye.
Maybe that'll slow or stop this...maybe.

krazyaboutkatz
04-18-2012, 01:05 AM
I'm so sorry to hear this.:( I hope that some kind of meds will be able to help him. Lots of prayers and positive thoughts are being sent his way.

ChrisH
04-18-2012, 04:17 AM
So sorry to read this, poor Marlin. I hope the meds do the trick or at least help. Prayers and good thoughts on the way.

Pinot's Mom
04-18-2012, 08:23 AM
Freedom,

I know this sounds crazy, but...
Try putting a Patch over one Eye, and if that doesn't help, move it to the other Eye.
Maybe that'll slow or stop this...maybe.

Prayers, certainly Sandie, but this actually makes sense!

Felicia's Mom
04-18-2012, 08:50 AM
I am sorry to read this about Marlin. Sending prayers and positive thoughts your way.

kaycountrygal
04-18-2012, 08:54 AM
I'm sorry to hear about Marlin's problem. I've never seen or heard of a dog spinning for long periods. Yes, I would try the meds; they might help... and I'd try covering one eye as poster suggested. Sorry.

Roxyluvsme13
04-18-2012, 10:26 AM
Poor sweet Marlin :(. Pawsitive thoughts and prayers being sent his way, and lots of love to him and the rest of the Bichon crew :love:

Lilith Cherry
04-18-2012, 11:39 AM
Lots of love and prayers for Darlin' Marlin! Hope the meds will help him.

Queen of Poop
04-18-2012, 12:37 PM
Sending a huge hug to you and also one for Marlin. Hoping either the meds or eye patch provide some measure of relief for you both. :love::love::love:

Alysser
04-18-2012, 01:48 PM
Oh no:( I am so sorry! A friend of mine, her dog had dementia, not to that extent though. Anyway I would try every option, and I know you will. I am hoping something works. Good vibes going out to you!!

IRescue452
04-18-2012, 02:16 PM
Did she check his liver? Spinning and crazy behavior are signs of a liver shunt (usually shunts are in young dogs) and or any problem where the liver stops processing toxins correctly. Hepatic encephalopathy is a brain disorder associated with dogs in liver failure and also can causing spinning. In fact, liver problems are the FIRST thing I think of when people say their dogs are spinning or staring into space, especially small breeds. If she didn't mention his liver you should call her and discuss it or get on the phone with another vet.

Freedom
04-18-2012, 05:11 PM
Thank you, for all the prayers, support, and suggestions.

The vet had suggested a thunder shirt or tight T shirt, so this afternoon I put his peacoat on him. That kept him calm for 3 hours!

We are going to start with Anipryl, generic name selegiline, a med that is approved in the US for ccd - canine cognitive disorder.

I also found this website, and plan to try several things on there:
http://pathwithpaws.com/blog/2010/02/01/dementia-and-anxiety-in-your-older-dog-what-to-do/

I had already started adding canned food to his kibble, at least half and half.

The eye patch is an interesting idea too, I'll give that a shot!

We didn't do any blood work this week. Marlin was diagnosed with ccd last July, after tons and tons of testing - blood work, urinalysis, and several other non invasive tests. I need to see about updating his blood work and checking liver function.

Again, thanks for all the ideas.

pomtzu
04-19-2012, 06:31 AM
Wow Sandie - that's amazing that putting on his peacoat settled him down. I've seen ads for the Thundershirt and always thought it was just a bunch of hokey, but I see that I'm wrong. I read that article that you linked, and I bookmarked it for future reference. Very interesting! Maybe with warmer weather on the way, you could get Marlin a kid size tee shirt, since the peacoat will probably be too warm.

Continuing with the prayers and good vibes for Marlin Darlin. Hoping some meds and new techniques make him more content. :love:

SWHouston
04-19-2012, 10:58 AM
On the Eye Patch...

Just fold a 4x4 up and use a Rubber Band to see if it works,
and if it does, then something more permanent/cute can be made.

Karen
04-19-2012, 11:45 AM
Wow Sandie - that's amazing that putting on his peacoat settled him down. I've seen ads for the Thundershirt and always thought it was just a bunch of hokey, but I see that I'm wrong. I read that article that you linked, and I bookmarked it for future reference.

Friends of mine have a Mini Schnauzer rescue pup, who apparently lived outside in Louisiana before his rescue and transport North. So he naturally came with thunderstorm anxiety. They got him a thunder shirt, and as Michael describes" "It makes him calm, but a bit puzzled, like 'I'm not freaking out, but I don't know why!" Far easier to deal with then destructive anxiety and the panic and trying to calm him back down afterwards!

Alysser
04-19-2012, 12:25 PM
Mikey has a thunder shirt. I can't give much of a review on it because we haven't had much storms here yet. But I've heard it really works. I've seen it on the news to and there's a bunch of dogs that it DID work for. I really hope that can help Marlin! If the pea coat worked something tighter may do the trick!

snakemama
04-19-2012, 12:57 PM
The Thunder Shirt is a great help for my 16 year old pup, I'm glad Marlin's pea coat helps him too!

IRescue452
04-19-2012, 01:43 PM
I've read nothing but bad reviews of the thundershirt. I want to try something with Naylee but I don't want to spend that much money if it doesn't work, especially since she needs an x-large shirt. I'm happy the peacoat works for Marlin though.

pomtzu
04-19-2012, 02:16 PM
I've read nothing but bad reviews of the thundershirt. I want to try something with Naylee but I don't want to spend that much money if it doesn't work, especially since she needs an x-large shirt. I'm happy the peacoat works for Marlin though.

Try a tight fitting tee shirt like was suggested in the link. That won't set you back more then a couple of bucks at the most, and if it doesn't work, then you haven't really lost much.

cassiesmom
04-19-2012, 10:26 PM
Lots of love and prayers for Darlin' Marlin! Hope the meds will help him.

That goes for me, too! Marlin, you and your mom have been on my mind and heart.

Freedom
04-20-2012, 11:45 AM
His meds did not arrive today, should be here in tomorrow's mail. Can't wait to get that started!
Wily's refill from the same pharmacy did arrive today, that's why I'm sure I'll see Marlin's med soon.

krazyaboutkatz
04-21-2012, 03:43 PM
Sandie, I sure hope that Marlin's meds will arrive soon and that they'll do the trick.:) You have a lot on your plate right now. Lots more prayers and positive thoughts are being sent your way. Please take care.:love:

Freedom
04-21-2012, 03:51 PM
Thanks, yes it arrived this morning via FedX and I gave him a dose.

Unfortunately Friday afternoon (before I knew about Sugar's results) he started vocalizing. That is the next step in his decline; it wasn't supposed to start for a month.

Varga
04-21-2012, 05:13 PM
So sorry about both your fluffs. Must be very hard with both Sugar and Marlin so gravely ill at the same time :(
All the best to you.

robinh
04-22-2012, 08:29 AM
Sandie, you have had a tough week. Give Marlin a hug for me. I will be praying for you and all the fuzzy butts!

Freedom
04-22-2012, 08:42 AM
Thank you.

cassiesmom
04-22-2012, 09:22 AM
Thanks, yes it arrived this morning via FedX and I gave him a dose.

Unfortunately Friday afternoon (before I knew about Sugar's results) he started vocalizing. That is the next step in his decline; it wasn't supposed to start for a month.

Oh, Darlin Marlin, I hope the selegiline will take effect very quickly and work well for you :love: I am sending many hugs and prayers.

Freedom
04-25-2012, 06:26 PM
No additional info really. Marlin is wearing a sweater 24/7. He is now on selegiline, for the doggie dementia. I've also added some things from that page I linked earlier: Rescue Remedy, Cod Liver Oil, Melatonin at bedtime, and a ginko mixture. We had seemingly good days with some improvement.

Then last night I took Willy to Agility class, I was out 2 hours. Go back and Marlin had been spinning most of the time, howling, whining and fussing, driving dad crazy. Poor Marlin kept it up till 10PM, nothing I did helped calm him. I tried holding him, he just started bucking to get down. He was almost shaking with nerves.

I have a call in my vet for more info and to ask about a mild sedative and what I am supposed to to when he is like that (it is awfully hard to ignore!) My vet has Wed off, the other vet in the practice didn't feel comfortable making any adjustments at this point, she hasn't seem him in over a year so long before this started.

Today we are back to him being better, and I don't have to go out this evening so perhaps he will do alright.

robinh
04-25-2012, 07:33 PM
This has been such a tough week for you, my heart breaks for you and the fur-kids. You continue to be in my prayers.

krazyaboutkatz
04-26-2012, 12:43 AM
I sure hope that your vet can prescribe or give you some more information about what to do to help keep Marlin calm. You continue to be in my thoughts and prayers. Please take care. (((HUGS)))