I have a problem...

[Pinot's Mom]

I have an issue which, in the grand scheme of life is very small, but ...

My friend and her 17 year old daughter (who is also my Goddaughter) are staying with us for a two and a half months. She and her husband are starting a new life in New Mexico, they bought a LARGE piece of land with no structures, her husband is out there getting things started before she moves out there. Simplified greatly; but enough background.

We have been friends for 30 years, as some of our group of friends have been. Regardless of our feelings toward this couple (which is great fondness; they are wonderful people), many of us stopped eating at their house, or really going there, because of their lack of hygiene. They just don't feel the same about cleanliness, especially in the kitchen, as the rest of us. The problem is now she is living here and she wants to help as much as possible. She wants to cook for us, but her habits are unsanitary and unhealthy. She doesn't wash her hands after ANYTHING, and doesn't clean things well at all.

My question is - do I say something to her now that we're directly affected? It really bothers me, but she's such a good friend, I just don't know. Any thoughts?

[Alysser]

Of course, being that it is your house and you are doing them a huge favor by letting them stay there, you need to say something. However, you don't need to be mean about it, and obviously you won't be, so there should be no reason that she be mad. Maybe say something like "well....at our place we do things differently". No need to worry about her getting angry...or she won't have a place to stay for 2 and a half months otherwise. ;)

[Freedom]

A 2.5 months house guest who WANTS to help?! THAT is amazing!

I like Alysser's suggestion, saying "We like things done a particular way . . . . " Do any of you have allergies, asthma? What about Pinot? Blame it on that if you like, that it is medically NECESSARY.

Or, get her doing other things like laundry, vacuuming, and such.

[Sowa]

Honestly, if someone had a problem with me I would rather them tell me. Depending on what it was, I may be upset or something at the time but I'd still want to know so I could fix it. Usually after I think about it I understand where the person is coming from. That's just me though.

[Asiel]

I think I would go along with Freedom -- steer your friend in another direction , like vacuuming, dusting, doing the bed linens and towels. I think it's easier than having to tell her straight out you don't want her help in the kitchen.. I don't think I could do it myself, I would be so afraid of offending and maybe losing a friend of 30 yrs.
Maybe she could even do some errands, whatever she does, impress on her what a help it is to you.

[Karen]

Just tell her plainly, "We have certain standards for health reasons. If you want, I can teach you more sanitary food preparation, and it'll serve you well for the rest of your life! Please don't take this the wrong way, I'm just guessing no one ever taught you any different, so here's your chance to learn, okay? Feel free to ask all the questions you want, and if I do something you don't understand, I'll be glad to explain it."

You can mention that, to give an excuse, at your age you need to be careful about things, as your immune system is not as strong as hers.

[kitten645]

I would just point her in a different direction and just say "I'm really picky about my food and I'd prefer to do this myself. Can you ...do laundry, buy groceries, clean the bathroom, etc" Maybe a list of chores for everyone? Boundries are always good.

[Taz_Zoee]

I would just point her in a different direction and just say "I'm really picky about my food and I'd prefer to do this myself. Can you ...do laundry, buy groceries, clean the bathroom, etc" Maybe a list of chores for everyone? Boundries are always good.

I like this approach. Or say you have a house rule that guests do not help in the kitchen. But she can help in other areas of the house. :)

[caseysmom]

Just say you love to cook but hating doing...well other things...you may want to mention that the first thing you do when going into the kitchen is wash your hands...

[Husky_mom]

the picky/allergy approach is what I´d do.. and well.. in reality.. I´m very picky..even when my mom cooks :P ..I got used to my own way and now back here sometimes I´d rather eat something else (not higyene related..lol.. more like pieces cut too big or too small.. haha)

[catnapper]

We've had similar conversations at work. I myself would want someone to tell me if I was doing something you felt unsanitary. You would just have to approach it in a non-judgmental way. I might be hurt at first, but if brought up without accusing me, I'd think about it and realize you were just being a friend who cares. (once my sister in law disbelieved the fact that I washed my hands in hte powder room and sent me back to rewash my hands where she could watch me before I could hold her baby... honestly I KNOW how to wash and dry my hands. She's just an obsessive, never happy, never satisfied prima donna. THAT incident insulted me and still does)

Many people were either brought up differently or have different ideas of cleanliness. I talked to some people who honestly feel as a society we're way too clean. They say we intake more dirt and debris than we ever are aware. She said there are super germs out there because of our obsession with cleanliness. People like that are never going to meet our standards and only make issues for everyone involved. In that case, I'd steer her to other chores and make up some excuse like how you look forward to kitchen work.

[sasvermont]

I am on the "re-direct" side. Send her off to do other things that would make life easier for you. I doubt your friend would ever change unless you prove to her that she is going to kill someone with her lack of skills. I personally like a clean kitchen and bathroom. The other rooms can become dusty etc. but not those two rooms. I bleach my dishes and stainless steel every couple of months and keep the stove top spotless. When I visit my two friends with glasstop stove, I freak out just looking at them. I would never say anything to them, because I know I am the one being silly about it. Oh, I am also a clean refrigerator freak too!

Just send that lady friend of yours to the yard to prune, or the store to shop, or the vacuum to clean..... Ask her nicely - no need to upset the living arrangements at this point. Now if she was there forever, I would say that you should address the problem up front - but not just for a couple of months.

Women like their own kitchens - and hands off to everyone else. I have a friend with the most beat up cookie sheets and I would love to give her new ones but she wouldn't use them..... I like new, clean ones.....but that is me....

Enjoy your friend for the time you have together. She will enjoy being there too, if you let her know what makes you happy...without insulting her already established standards, however low they might be....

Good luck. True friends are hard to come by.... and they may not be perfect!

[BitsyNaceyDog]

I'd probably try to set an example. Maybe ask for her help (rather than let her cook by herself) and then say something like "could you please wash the counter before we start, there could be some dust or cat hair on it" ... or "after you wash your hands, can you please wash and dice the tomato. I use a dab of soap on the tomato when I wash it. Thanks, it's a lot of fun having a good friend cooking beside me in my kitchen."

[Cat Daddy]

All good suggestions here. I would start by telling your guest that you and Coop have very sensitive stomachs and are very particular about how your food is prepared. Then explain how important it is to you that you wash your hands because of how easily bacteria is spread and give her an example, for instance an E-coli outbreak. Then explain that you could use her help much more with other chores instead. There, I think I've stolen everyone elses ideas now. Watcha think?

[Kirsten]

Hmmm, tough question, especially as she's a good friend and you don't want to hurt your feelings, but I think I would do it as others have already suggested. That doesn't sound too hurtful 'cause you're not blaming her for not being clean enough, but referring to your standards, which is a normal thing as it is your house.

I had a similar problem some years ago. 2004 after my first back surgery, a neighbor helped me at home with some things (while I was in hospital, and also later when I was at home after surgery). And there, I saw her cleaning the litter boxes, and then grabbing into a bag of jelly beans that an American friend had sent to me! Without washing her hands!! I have to admit, I was shocked and furious and told her she could have the entire bag now, because I would no longer eat any of those jelly beans. Then, I actually had to explain to her that litter boxes, the scoop, and the container with the used cat litter are contaminated with urine, poop, and probably all kinds of germs! Obviously, that thought didn't even occur to her before I told her because after that, she didn't want the jelly beans any more! lol Imagining that she probably had never washed her hands after cleaning the litter boxes, I started cleaning all the door handles and other things she might have touched when she was gone... :o

[pomtzu]

Since you've been friends for such a long time, she probably knows too much about you for you to be able to give her the allergies or sensitive stomach routine. And since you have a cleaning lady (I presume you still do), then cleaning would probably be out too, except for maybe straightening up a bit in between the regular visits by her. I rather like what KBlaix suggested - helping you with some of the cooking, but under your direction. Also running any errands and doing some of the laundry. Other than that, can't think of anything that would be of much help to you. Sorry.......:(

[Bonny]

Since you've been friends for such a long time, she probably knows too much about you for you to be able to give her the allergies or sensitive stomach routine. And since you have a cleaning lady (I presume you still do), then cleaning would probably be out too, except for maybe straightening up a bit in between the regular visits by her. I rather like what KBlaix suggested - helping you with some of the cooking, but under your direction. Also running any errands and doing some of the laundry. Other than that, can't think of anything that would be of much help to you. Sorry.......:(

Allergies can just pop out of no wheres sometime. ;)

[Pinot's Mom]

Since you've been friends for such a long time, she probably knows too much about you for you to be able to give her the allergies or sensitive stomach routine. And since you have a cleaning lady (I presume you still do), then cleaning would probably be out too, except for maybe straightening up a bit in between the regular visits by her. I rather like what KBlaix suggested - helping you with some of the cooking, but under your direction. Also running any errands and doing some of the laundry. Other than that, can't think of anything that would be of much help to you. Sorry.......:(

Yes, Ellie, I do still have a cleaning lady... Sasha (the friend) really wants to cook, and help, and she has such a great heart. I knew this issue going into the stay here, but had never witnessed it in my own kitchen. One of the first nights here, she wanted to cook chicken. The handling of the chicken and lack of hand/prep area washing was appalling. I don't know... I might just let this ride for a bit, though. We seem to be separating a lot of the cooking, so it might work out OK.

Thank you all for your words - just trying to keep things on an even keel.

[kitten645]

"I might just let this ride for a bit, though."

I'd be careful of this approach. If you are anything like me, your feelings will pent up until you blurt out "WTH are you doing? That's gross!" LOL! Just sayin.

[Pinot's Mom]

"I might just let this ride for a bit, though."

I'd be careful of this approach. If you are anything like me, your feelings will pent up until you blurt out "WTH are you doing? That's gross!" LOL! Just sayin.

I do that, too. The good thing right now is that schedules aren't meshing very often to eat together, so we don't get exposed so much to the food handling aspect. If I drop off PT after Dec. 23 (her last day of work), though, please send a health professional to my house - Ellie knows where I live! ;)

[cassiesmom]

Yes, Ellie, I do still have a cleaning lady... Sasha (the friend) really wants to cook, and help, and she has such a great heart. I knew this issue going into the stay here, but had never witnessed it in my own kitchen. One of the first nights here, she wanted to cook chicken. The handling of the chicken and lack of hand/prep area washing was appalling. I don't know... I might just let this ride for a bit, though. We seem to be separating a lot of the cooking, so it might work out OK.

Thank you all for your words - just trying to keep things on an even keel.


Put a liquid soap dispenser beside your kitchen sink and one in the bathroom. I'm with the people who say that if she sees you washing your hands and handling food properly, she's likely to pick up on your actions. A blunt statement has worked with me: "Elyse, you did wash your hands before you started slicing those peppers, right?" My sister is even more diligent about these things than I am. She has had us over for holidays in the past and I have found I am more attentive to hand washing and being careful with food safety in her company.

[pomtzu]

If I drop off PT after Dec. 23 (her last day of work), though, please send a health professional to my house - Ellie knows where I live! ;)

:D Should I notify the FDA to be on call too??? :D