200,000 Gallons A Day

[lizbud]

At least that much oil is fouling the ocean floor and fragile wetlands
all along the coast line. This is such a disaster, it is hard to fathom how
bad this really is and if we can ever recover completely.

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/gulf-mexico-oil-spill-bp-prepares-dome-leak/story?id=10567030

[Catty1]

BP is positioning the big dome at the moment...and they did manage to shut off one leak.

Local fishers are being paid $1500 a day to cram their boats with the oil-retaining floats and to put them out at sea.

Prayers going out...

[RICHARD]

At least that much oil is fouling the ocean floor and fragile wetlands
all along the coast line. This is such a disaster, it is hard to fathom how
bad this really is and if we can ever recover completely.

Do you remember Saddam and his 'retreat' during the Gulf War?

He blew up oil rigs/set them on fire.

They estimated that it would take years to put them out.

The US oil/fire teams put them out in months.

First they have to seal the leak.

Then, we have to worry about the coast line.

-----------

Here's a tidbit about how stupid we are.

The European offshore rigs HAVE TO HAVE A SECOND shut-off valve system as a back up to the main emergency shut off valves.

So, all the AHs that want to regulate OSD can't even think that far ahead?

Everyone is to blame for this one.

FN morons.

[RICHARD]

BP is positioning the big dome at the moment...and they did manage to shut off one leak.

Local fishers are being paid $1500 a day to cram their boats with the oil-retaining floats and to put them out at sea.

Prayers going out...

I am sorry, I mean no disrespect?


Isn't that like trusting the placement of a diagphram?:confused::(:eek::rolleyes:;)

[Marigold2]

This is so sad for the wildlife, the damage man does to this planet is beyond belief.:(

[Catty1]

Hey RICHARD - they gotta try...with the remote thingies lighting the way.

If it DOES work...wonderful. It's definitely worth a shot...

[RICHARD]

Hey RICHARD - they gotta try...with the remote thingies lighting the way.

If it DOES work...wonderful. It's definitely worth a shot...

Oh no,
I understand, but I was shocked to hear that the EU has stricter rules for OSD.

I would have thought all the Greenies would have demanded that for any OSD here in the states.

It makes me really question the 'depth' - pun intended - that the owners and protestors put into the process of allowing the drilling to go on!:eek:


When I hear stories like this one I always cheer for the little company that has some bizarre technology that will come to the rescue.

That is what we are as humans.

We stop, think, tinker, then solve.:D

[Lady's Human]

I suppose this would be a bad thread to quote James Watt?:p

[momcat]

This situation is frightening and not getting much better. My heart aches for the environmental impact and the danger to the wildlife. Last night on our local news there was a story saying that 21 years later, Alaska is still feeling the effects of the Exon-Valdez. On the film clips one can still see the oil in the sand and the risk to the animals. The "experts" are saying it could be months before all of this is contained.

[lizbud]

Local fishers are being paid $1500 a day to cram their boats with the oil-retaining floats and to put them out at sea.




BP didn't pay them out of the goodness of their hearts. They asked the
fishermen to sign legal waivers that, in effect, released the company of any
blame for the business losses the fishermen had.

They fishermen quickly wised up to this trick, and BP released them from
the waivers.

http://www.wdsu.com/news/23450572/detail.html

[Catherinedana]

The wild bird sanctuary where I volunteer is gearing up for the worst eventuality. If so, they will be busy beyond belief. It is a nightmare scenario and I just keep praying that it doesn't get as bad as it could possibly get.

We are right on the Gulf of Mexico and will get a huge influx of seabirds. This is also the middle of baby bird season so they are already overwhelmed.

:mad::mad: :(:(

[cassiesmom]

I heard on the afternoon news that hair salons are collecting hair clippings to be used in helping to clean up the spilled oil. It made sense when I thought about it - I wash my hair to make it less oily. Here's a link.
http://matteroftrust.org/

[kokopup]

Lady's Human

I suppose this would be a bad thread to quote James Watt?

There are others that would rank right there with him, Including RR & W.

[Laura's Babies]

The ripple effect of this mess will touch us all! Goods transported through the Gulf of Mexico, I think have already stopped. I doubt anything is coming in or out of the Mississippi River. The big oil refineries we have here will be cut off..no way to get the stuff in or out. You would not believe how much stuff is transported up and down that Mississippi River, headed to the gulf. A lot of what we push is coal that goes down the river to be shipped overseas... Prices are going to sky rocket, jobs are going to be lost.

If this leaking the oil into the gulf isn't stopped, we ALL are going to suffer. This new thing they are trying HAS to work or the impact of this in the gulf is going to throw things into a tail spin that will eventually effect us all in our every day life.

My great nephew just posted a beautiful video on facebook he made of Pensacola beach and I just got sick watching it, thinking of what could happen to those beautiful beaches because of this. :(

[lizbud]

Before the Big Spill

Oil companies have a history of ill-timed fights against safety improvements.
By Paul Sabin
Posted Friday, May 7, 2010, at 5:25 PM ET

The site of the recent Gulf oil spill In the last half-century, three major oil spills have significantly marked American politics—the 1969 Santa Barbara, Calif., spill, the 1989 Exxon Valdez spill, and now the 2010 spill in the Gulf.


They have a striking thing in common: Each occurred after the oil industry successfully resisted demands for safety improvements that would have greatly reduced the damage the spills caused. These technological fixes either were already standard or would later become so—and mandatory. By fighting them off in the short-term, the oil companies cost themselves huge amounts of money and the rest of us an environmental debacle.

Off the coast of Santa Barbara in the late 1960s, the Union Oil Company operated just beyond state waters, where the federal government makes the rules. Those federal rules were more lax about safety than California's. In particular, the oil companies successfully avoided state requirements to use extra protective casing to strengthen the well and prevent accidents. After the well blew out in 1969, approximately 100,000 barrels of oil spilled into the ocean, polluting the beaches and near shore waters.

Take two: In the late 1970s, the Carter Administration and environmental advocates called for double-hull oil tankers that would protect against spills by providing a second hull to absorb impacts and safeguard a ship's oil. The oil industry insisted that single-hull tankers were safe and headed off the double-hull mandate. After the single-hull Exxon Valdez tanker crashed in Prince William Sound and spilled 270,000 barrels of oil, a Coast Guard study suggested that a double-hull probably would have reduced the oil spilled by 60 percent. Congress passed legislation in 1990 requiring double-hulls in Prince William Sound by 2015, and more than 100 countries have pledged to ban the single-hull tankers by the same year. The Exxon single-hulls continue to chug along, though.


In the Gulf of Mexico, BP and its drilling contractor, Transocean Ltd., chose not to install a $500,000 remote-control shut-off switch that might have contained the recent spill from BP's well. Norway has required these switches since 1993. The U.S. Minerals Management Service considered a similar requirement several years ago, but the oil industry killed off the proposal. And so, but for $500,000, we probably have billions of dollars in liability and cleanup expenses in the Gulf, plus a long-term threat to the livelihoods and ecology of the region that we can't yet quantify.

Cutting corners to keep down costs is an age-old business strategy, from coal mines to sweatshops and the dumping of hazardous wastes. The history of these oil spills makes clear, however, that when it leads to a disaster, cost cutting becomes a bad corporate bet.

The Santa Barbara spill kicked off the environmental decade of the 1970s, spurring an otherwise indifferent Richard Nixon to champion the National Environmental Policy Act and creation of the Environmental Protection Agency. Any developer in the past 40 years who has struggled to complete an arduous environmental impact statement can partly credit Union Oil's resistance to additional well casing for NEPA's tough rules. The California spill also prompted a decades-long moratorium on new oil drilling off the coast of California.

The Valdez spill invigorated institutional investors and environmental activists to press companies to adopt the Ceres Principles, a new code of corporate environmental conduct. The accident also brought the passage of the Oil Pollution Act of 1990, which barred the Exxon Valdez ship and others involved in oil spills from operating in Prince William Sound.

So if you take a longer environmental view, has the industry's balking over safety improvements actually been a boon? It's not pretty, but birds dying coated in oil and fishermen lamenting their losses can change the political calculus. This recent spill is yielding a similar backlash against Big Oil. The spill has significantly undercut President Obama's proposed expansion of offshore drilling. Politicians from Florida to Virginia are lining up to oppose coastal oil development.

The problem is that offshore drilling is key to the White House's proposed grand bargain on energy and climate. On Friday, Lindsey Graham called for delaying the climate bill, in part because of the renewed opposition to drilling. If the already-tenuous deal unravels, then the Gulf oil spill will not just be an environmental disaster. It will also be a political one.

[cassiesmom]

I heard on the news tonight that they're going to try again to put the top part of the containment dome over the well, but it's still leaking a couple of hundred thousand gallons of oil into the Gulf of Mexico every day.

[lizbud]

It is strange to think that we are watching such a major disaster in
the making and nobody seems to know how to stop the destruction.

What will you tell your children when they ask one day why this happened?


http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/05/14/gulf.oil.spill/index.html?hpt=Sbin

[Karen]

It's so disheartening how little coverage this is getting in the network news, and it is still happening, a disaster in progress!

[Puckstop31]

Well, I think it is pretty clear they know HOW it happened. Sadly, so far, the containment efforts have failed.

BP has about 5,000 such wells around the world. 1 failure out of 5,000 is a pretty good ratio.


As for telling my daughter about this, should she ask some day... "Honey, 'doo doo occurs'. Through out history, man has strived to make their lives better. Cheap and abundant energy is reason number one we live the lifestyle we do. Sadly, sometimes things like this happen. That's life. When bad things happen, learn from it, fix it if possible and keep going."

[lizbud]

Sadly, sometimes things like this happen. That's life. When bad things happen, learn from it, fix it if possible and keep going."



There is risk involved in drilling the deepest well in the world, in one
of the most sensitive enviromental areas in this country. They were
allowed to gamble on everything turning out ok. It didn't and now we
get to see the companies involved scramble around for a fix for this.

A plan B wasn't in place before they drilled and, if some politicans hadn't
been in bed with big oil, we could have demanded they have a recovery
option in place.

p.s. " Honey, S*** happens" What kind of thing is that for an adult to tell a kid? Pitiful.

[Puckstop31]

There is risk involved in drilling the deepest well in the world, in one
of the most sensitive enviromental areas in this country. They were
allowed to gamble on everything turning out ok. It didn't and now we
get to see the companies involved scramble around for a fix for this.

There is risk invovled in most innovative things Liz. Should humanity stop trying to innovate just beause there is risk involved?

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Or, 'a ship is safe in harbor, but that is not what ships are for.'



A plan B wasn't in place before they drilled and, if some politicans hadn't been in bed with big oil, we could have demanded they have a
recovery
option in place.

Its my understanding there was a "plan B" in place. Sadly, it failed as well.

And who, pray tell, are these politicians you speak of?


p.s. " Honey, S*** happens" What kind of thing is that for an adult to tell a kid? Pitiful.

In classic Lizbud fashion, you fail to use an entire quote in context. Shocker.

Tell me... Is it wrong to teach a child the way the world really is? Also, recall your original question here included 'one day'. I would not explain it, that way, to my 2 year old. When she is 10 perhaps? Yes.

(ETA - Do you actually think I would use the exact words, "S*** Happens"? If you do... Wow, what did I ever do to you to make you think that? Disagree with you? No wonder you are so easily duped. LOL)

I am not going to shelter my child(ren) from the realities of the world. I will not rob her of future opportunites because I refused to teach her the truth. And the TRUTH is, bad things happen.

[Lady's Human]

It all depends on your point of view.

I look at this mess and I'm grateful it was just one platform, in deep water.

It gives engineers time to react and deal with things, and the next time something like this happens, we won't have the same issues as the engineers will use this as a learning experience.

OR........

We could stick our collective heads in the sand, go back to a subsistence farming level of tech, and never, ever drill for any oil ever again because we might have an accident.


Three Mile Island wasn't a disaster, it was a proof of concept, but the media turned it into a moratorium on nuclear power in the US. This CANNOT happen again.

[Puckstop31]

It all depends on your point of view.

I look at this mess and I'm grateful it was just one platform, in deep water.

It gives engineers time to react and deal with things, and the next time something like this happens, we won't have the same issues as the engineers will use this as a learning experience.

Exactly. Its why I said when bad things happen and they will, learn from it, fix it if you can and move forward. In Army speak... FIDO. :)


OR........

We could stick our collective heads in the sand, go back to a subsistence farming level of tech, and never, ever drill for any oil ever again because we might have an accident.


Three Mile Island wasn't a disaster, it was a proof of concept, but the media turned it into a moratorium on nuclear power in the US. This CANNOT happen again.

"Don't let a good crisis go to waste." No? ;) Classic 'progressive' BS. Back in the day, Woody Wilson's time... War was the catalyst they used to move their agenda forward. Now, it has to be a 'moral equivilant' of war.

FWIW, I live 15 miles from TMI. I have zero worry. My dad works in the nuclear power industry. There really is no safer and more efficient form of power. Too bad the media and the 'progressives' gave it such a bad rap.

[RICHARD]

I look at it like the post war fires in Iraq.

Everyone projected the wells would burn for years?

Then they sent in all the Houston based oil/fire fighters and put them out in months?

It's all a matter of tossing ideas at the problem.

We are, after all, the United States of Leading Edge Technology.;)

[lizbud]

Well, I think it is pretty clear they know HOW it happened. Sadly, so far, the containment efforts have failed.

BP has about 5,000 such wells around the world. 1 failure out of 5,000 is a pretty good ratio.





Did you know they have different requirements for oil drilling in other countries than the US does? No.., Didn't think so. Ever think that's why this has not happened elsewhere? No, didn't think so. You realy ought to read more on the topic.

[lizbud]

(CNN) -- Oil industry experts said there is no sure-fire way to stop the massive amount of oil gushing into the Gulf of Mexico.

If there were, BP wouldn't still be grasping for a solution.

"That's because pollution cleanup technology is primitive," said Robert Bea, a University of California-Berkeley professor who directs the university's Center for Catastrophic Risk Management. He worked for decades as a risk assessor to oil companies, including BP in the 1990s.

The science of cleaning up oil spills has remained largely the same since the 1989 Exxon Valdez disaster, said Bea, who worked on that 11-million-gallon spill in Prince William Sound that blackened 1,500 miles of Alaska's coastline.

"It boggles my mind what in the hell they're doing, because the industry has been around for years, and this kind of thing had to be anticipated," Bea said. "But that's just the way it is. It's sad."
Since an explosion on the Deepwater Horizon drilling rig April 20, BP has tried various techniques to stop the leak 5,000 feet underwater. The spill is sending 210,000 gallons of crude into the Gulf of Mexico each day, BP has said.

Video emerged Wednesday showing a giant leak on the floor of the Gulf shooting a huge plume of oil and gas into the water.

Shortly after the leak was discovered, BP tried using remote-controlled submarine devices to stop it. That didn't work.



Interactive: Responding to an oil spill In the past week, two other techniques were tried. The first was a huge containment dome that would have captured the oil so it could be siphoned off to a waiting tanker. But ice crystals formed when escaping gas mixed with water, thwarting that effort. Then, BP announced it was employing a similar, but smaller device called a "Top Hat." The 5-foot structure weighing nearly 2 tons reached the Gulf's floor on Wednesday, and crews are trying to position it over the leak. If that doesn't work, BP says it has yet another plan -- sending a "junk shot" -- loads of shredded rubber tires and golf balls, to clog the leak at the source.

Meanwhile, a Coast Guard effort to mitigate effects of the slick by using what a spokesman called a "historically proven technique" of burning the oil and sending the resulting smoke and soot out to sea proved less effective than was hoped. BP has been using using a chemical dispersant, Corexit, to try to break up the oil. The substance was synthesized by Exxon and has been the industry's go-to dispersant for years, Bea said.

It dilutes oil the way soap breaks up dirt on the body. However Corexit, whose makeup isn't disclosed by its manufacturer because of trade secrets, could be extremely toxic in large quantities, Bea said.

"We [in the oil industry] would always say, 'If you touch it, smell it, breathe it, eat it, you better see a doctor quick," he said. "That's a quick tip to me that my friends, the bluefin tuna, are going to be just as sensitive. The victims of this disaster will be aquatic life."

Corexit 9500 includes petroleum distillates, propylene glycol and a proprietary organic sulfonic salt and can cause eye or skin irritation with prolonged contact, according to its material data safety sheet. The document warns that "repeated or prolonged exposure may irritate the respiratory tract."

Read about dispersant chemical Corexit 9500

Ed Overton, a Louisiana State University environmental sciences professor, agrees with Bea that pollution cleanup technology is woefully behind the times.

"I don't think there is a very good system set up to evaluate those dispersants," said Overton, who heads NOAA's chemical hazard assessment team analyzing the toxicity of the oil in the Gulf.



"Testing has for years been not as sophisticated" within the oil industry as he and other environmental scientists would like, Overton said. A wave pool in Leonardo, New Jersey, is used to test the effectiveness of dispersants. The pool is 203 meters long by 20 meters wide by 3.4 meters deep, and is filled with 2.6 million gallons of saltwater.

"They can spray oil on the dispersants and measure how much gets into the water," Overton said. "But at best, that's still a fairly crude way to test the effectiveness of these chemicals because it's done under one set of wave conditions."

Steve Newman, the president and CEO of Transocean, the world's largest offshore drilling contractor and owner of the Deepwater Horizon rig, answered questions about the industry's cleanup technologies Wednesday during a House hearing on the spill.

Rep. Lois Capps pointed to a document provided by Transocean stating that floating booms used to clean up oil spills only contain about 15 percent of the oil, a rate that has not improved since a Union Oil spill in 1969 off Santa Barbara, California -- in Capps' Congressional district -- released about 200,000 gallons of crude over a 10-day period.

Capps asked oil executives why the technologies haven't improved if "the technologies have been perfected to get down there and [to get oil]. ...Why was there not equivalent technology developed to clean up after a spill, whether a small spill or a huge spill, at the very same time, using some of the profits that have been generated in each of the companies that you represent?"Lamar McKay, the president and chairman of BP America, answered: "I would just comment we're working very closely with all the government agencies, EPA, Coast Guard.

"[The] Coast Guard deals with spills all over our coastal areas, all over the country. We're using the best available technology at scale. This is the largest effort that's ever been put together, so we believe we are using the best technology."

Rep. Jan Schakowsky, D-Illinois, said, "But you never had any until it happened."

McKay answered: "Well, we've been drilling with the Coast Guard for years, since the..."

Schakowsky interrupted: "Did you develop technologies for dealing with this?"

McKay: "Not individual technologies for this, no."

Schakowsky: "I rest my case."

[Puckstop31]

Did you know they have different requirements for oil drilling in other countries than the US does? No.., Didn't think so. Ever think that's why this has not happened elsewhere? No, didn't think so. You realy ought to read more on the topic.


Hmmmmm....

http://www.oilrigdisasters.co.uk/


And by the way, YES to your questions. Didn't your mommy teach you to not ASSuME? :)


Liz... Accidents happen. Thats all I am trying to say. But, if you still feel the need to project your inadequacies at me, feel free to carry on. You asked a question, I answered it.

[Lady's Human]

1) What, praytell, are the good professor's experiences in oil platform technology and engineering? A professor of risk management is, in reality, a professor of statistics with a fancy title.

2) in many, many articles about this disaster, it is repeated time and time again that the blowoff valves have a lousy success rate.

3) Who holds extremely large amounts of oil company stock, yet is theoretically a grade a environmentalist? Enough stock in oil companies to have a say at a board meeting? Follow the money..........and it's not all Republicans. Does the name Al Gore ring a bell?

[kokopup]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=524_1273510578

[lizbud]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=524_1273510578



Thanks for the video. As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words.:(

[cassiesmom]

Couple of stupid questions...

Could they burn the oil off the surface of the water, or would the smoke be toxic?

Could they use anything to physically scoop it up out of the water? How can it be kept (if at all) from reaching the shore?

[Karen]

They have been doing some controlled burns when weather permits. The smoke is bad, but not as harmful as the oil reaching estuaries.

There are boom to try to keep it from reaching the coast, but the spill is so huge that everyone is going to have to be hyper vigilant. I think there may be some efforts to siphon or scoop up some of it from the surface as well. Most important, too, is stopping the flow!

[Catty1]

I also heard on radio today about oil-eating bacteria being present in the slick below the water.

A friend of mine works in such a place in Calgary - yes, there are bacteria that will transform oil into harmless stuff. Let's hope it spreads fast!

bacteria story: http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2010/04/can-microbes-save-the-gulf-beach.html

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2010/05/16/bp-gulf-oil-leak-tube.html

Tube diverts some leaking oil
Last Updated: Sunday, May 16, 2010 | 10:32 PM ET
CBC News

Engineers began to siphon oil leaking from a damaged well deep beneath the Gulf of Mexico to a vessel on the surface Sunday, but the company in charge of the operation said it's too early to know how much of the fuel is being recovered.

Oil leaking from a damaged undersea well could be seen earlier this month blending into a light sheen as it moved through the currents in the Gulf of Mexico. BP Plc said its engineers began to siphon the oil leaking from the well to a vessel on the surface Sunday.Oil leaking from a damaged undersea well could be seen earlier this month blending into a light sheen as it moved through the currents in the Gulf of Mexico. BP Plc said its engineers began to siphon the oil leaking from the well to a vessel on the surface Sunday. (Dave Martin/Associated Press)BP Plc said its Riser Insertion Tube Tool, or RITT, remained attached for about four hours after it was installed Saturday before it became dislodged. Workers then secured it in place again Sunday morning.

Kent Wells, BP's senior vice-president for exploration and production, told reporters the amount of fuel being drawn was gradually increasing, but it would take several days to measure.

He said the nitrogen, oil and gas being collected cannot be accurately measured until it is separated.

The tube was threaded inside a riser pipe where oil has been gushing for the past 24 days. Massive amounts began leaking two days after the rig Deepwater Horizon sank following an explosion and fire that killed 11 on April 20.

BP said engineers will spend the next seven to 10 days preparing to plug the leak. They want to pump in debris, or "junk shot," to clog the well's blowout preventer, before adding mud and cement.

Previous attempts to stop the leak by using a 90-tonne steel and concrete container failed after an ice-like slushy mixture clogged the opening in its roof.

However, BP said its smaller version of the box, dubbed the "top hat," is "ready to go if needed on the sea floor" to stop the leak, which has spilled millions of litres of oil into the Gulf, threatening sea life, commercial fishing and the coastal tourist industry from Louisiana to Florida.

The permanent solution of completing a relief well is still months away.

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2010/05/16/bp-gulf-oil-leak-tube.html#ixzz0o9utzahb

[lizbud]

Did anyone happen to see CBS 60 Minutes last night? They interviewed
one of the survivors of the oil rig explosion. It sounded like the experience
was like hell on earth.If you get a chance to see the interview, please do.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml

[RICHARD]

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL,

Two stupid presidents, with coastal land about to be affected by an oil slick, are talking about immigration reform and how 'racist' the AZ law is.

Hey Barack,

Apologize for oil leak and it's affect on the Gulf areas, then we can talk about immigration.

Morons.

[Edwina's Secretary]

What poppycock. "Doo doo happens."

At least 99% of accidents are preventable. Accidents happen because people make mistakes. They get complacent and take shortcuts or fail to pay attention. Or they get greedy and use shoddy materials to save a few bucks. There are many reasons people make mistake, but as any halfway competent businessperson will tell you ..."doo doo" isn't one of them.

The other one percent is caused by earthquakes, tornados and the like.

Anyone, including BP...(which by the way stand for British Petroleum :rolleyes:) who takes refuse in "doo doo happens" is someone who is willing to accept mediocrity but not responsibility. Beware.

[Puckstop31]

What poppycock. "Doo doo happens."

At least 99% of accidents are preventable. Accidents happen because people make mistakes. They get complacent and take shortcuts or fail to pay attention. Or they get greedy and use shoddy materials to save a few bucks. There are many reasons people make mistake, but as any halfway competent businessperson will tell you ..."doo doo" isn't one of them.

The other one percent is caused by earthquakes, tornados and the like.

Anyone, including BP...(which by the way stand for British Petroleum :rolleyes:) who takes refuse in "doo doo happens" is someone who is willing to accept mediocrity but not responsibility. Beware.

HEY! Welcome back!

Clearly you are taking the "doo doo occurs" comment WAY out of context. Good to see some things never change. LOL

The question was posed as to how we explain this to our children.... You know, how to explain something like this to a younger child. (Feel free to make baseless assumptions here too....)

While we are at it with the assumptions... Thanks for the (OK, I already knew it) insight into your worldview. Mankind CAN be perfected, we just need to regulate the 'stupid' people. Right?

[wombat2u2004]

While we are at it with the assumptions... Thanks for the (OK, I already knew it) insight into your worldview. Mankind CAN be perfected, we just need to regulate the 'stupid' people. Right?

LOLOLOL :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[cassiesmom]

I heard on the news yesterday that the head of BP described the effect of the oil spillage on the Louisiana environment as "minimal". From other stories I've heard and seen on the news, it sounds like it has already gotten worse than "minimal". And not only for the environment, but also for tourism and fishing as a commercial industry.

[lizbud]

I heard on the news yesterday that the head of BP described the effect of the oil spillage on the Louisiana environment as "minimal". From other stories I've heard and seen on the news, it sounds like it has already gotten worse than "minimal". And not only for the environment, but also for tourism and fishing as a commercial industry.


BP lies. They have lied from the beginning of this spill. They under reported the amount of the oil gushing out of the well, when they knew better.

It seems like they are more concerned with recovering oil for resale, then
stopping the oil from gushing into the gulf waters.

[blue]

BP shouldnt shoulder all of the blame. Link (http://blog.heritage.org/2010/05/17/morning-bell-did-the-federal-government-enable-the-gulf-oil-spill/).

[Edwina's Secretary]

BP lies.

Of course they lie. "Doo doo happens." Especially when profits are involved.

[RICHARD]

BP shouldnt shoulder all of the blame. Link (http://blog.heritage.org/2010/05/17/morning-bell-did-the-federal-government-enable-the-gulf-oil-spill/).

THAT SOB GWB is to blame.

Look what he did to the gulf before?

[blue]

THAT SOB GWB is to blame.

THe SOBs GWB, WJC, GHWB, and BHO.


Look what he did to the gulf before?

What did GWB do to the Gulf?

[Grace]

What about those people whose living is/was made from the Gulf - what is going to happen to them?

More Than Just an Oil Spill (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/22/opinion/22herbert.html)

[blue]

What about those people whose living is/was made from the Gulf - what is going to happen to them?

I can only hope BP isnt as big an AH company as Exxon. But hey this is the Hope and Change era.

[wombat2u2004]

THe SOBs GWB, WJC, GHWB, and BHO.

And R, BLUE, WOM :p

[blue]

And R, BLUE, WOM :p

Leave my dog out of this!

[wombat2u2004]

Leave my dog out of this!

Only if i can leave my pet Wombat out of it :p

[blue]

Only if i can leave my pet Wombat out of it :p

Seriously, my dog may be a dang left leaning hippy but there is no need to drag him into this.

[wombat2u2004]

Don't worry Blue....I wouldn't even think about it.

[cassiesmom]

I saw a report on the late news last night (Chris Sowers on Fox Chicago) of what might happen with storm season approaching and the mass of oil floating in the Gulf. The bad scenario is that it could be picked up and carried into the water supplies of nearby states, affecting even more water, wildlife, fish, plants, etc. The very bad scenario is that it could be scooped up in micro-droplets, carried along by a strong storm (like a tornado) and be rained back to earth. Yuck and double yuck. But the government is trying to figure out why this happened instead of trying to get it cleaned up.

[Grace]

Another piece by Bob Herbert. (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/25/opinion/25herbert.html)

[RICHARD]

Just saw a report on the news.


The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is doing a study on the EFFECT OF PLACING A BOOM IN THE WATER TO CATCH THE OIL.


They are trying to figure out the enviromental impact of it, the boom, not the oil.

[wombat2u2004]

Just saw a report on the news.


The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is doing a study on the EFFECT OF PLACING A BOOM IN THE WATER TO CATCH THE OIL.


They are trying to figure out the enviromental impact of it, the boom, not the oil.

Well, I think that the individual Army Engineers involved in that should first have their credentials checked. In light of the situation, I think we owe it to the marine life to ensure that at least these personel are qualified to carry out such a study. ;)

[lizbud]

Another piece by Bob Herbert. (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/25/opinion/25herbert.html)


Thanks Grace, good article.:) You know, sometimes you just have to
laugh, or go crazy. :( I think I'll go with the laugh for now.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/video/item/kimmel-oil-companies-at-senate-hearing-judge-judy

[cassiesmom]

Editorial from today's Chicago Tribune entitled "In Too Deep"

It has been more than a month since the Deepwater Horizon oil rig exploded in the Gulf of Mexico, uncapping a geyser of trouble. Anger and frustration over BP's futile efforts to stop this mushrooming spill is growing almost as fast as the slick itself. Thick reefs of oil are washing up on the coast of Louisiana.

Every day brings new and disturbing revelations about how BP, its partners, the U.S. government — everyone who had a role in preventing or stopping such an accident — failed.

BP is trying to shift blame for the explosion onto rig owner Transocean Ltd. And the White House is trying to duck charges that it was slow to respond.

Over the weekend, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar scrambled to the region and said there was "no question that BP is throwing everything at the problem to try to resolve it because this is an existential crisis for one of the world's largest companies." But then he added: "Do I have confidence that they know exactly what they are doing? No, not completely."

Who could?

Ten days ago, BP chief executive Tony Hayward admitted that the company could have done more to prepare for such an accident.

The company is scrambling for solutions that no one had even thought to devise before this disaster. BP is expected to try on Wednesday to stop the gusher with a "top kill" — pushing heavy drilling fluids into the wellhead as a seal. That would be "another first for this technology at these water depths and so, we cannot take its success for granted," Hayward said. No kidding.

Salazar said the federal government would "push BP out of the way" if the company isn't up to the job. But that sounds like empty bravado. A top Coast Guard official shrugged when asked Monday about Salazar's threat. He said the government doesn't have the expertise to do a better job.

So we're stuck with BP.

What the government can do is demand that BP give completely transparent answers to some questions. For instance: BP hasn't come clean on how much oil is gushing from that well. Its earlier estimates of 5,000 barrels a day are laughably low.

The company has sprayed 600,000 gallons of chemicals to disperse the oil so far. But it is resisting a U.S. Environmental Protection Agency demand to start spraying a less toxic chemical. That won't wash.

This much is clear: BP wasn't prepared. The government didn't make sure BP was prepared. And the government created a disincentive to operating safely. By law, BP's liability to fishermen, property owners and others hurt by the spill is capped at $75 million for all claims. BP has said it will ignore the cap and pay all appropriate claims. Congress is haggling over changing those limits.

Low liability caps encourage riskier drilling practices. They reduce the incentives for companies to spend more upfront to avoid accidents or make sure they have equipment on site to deal with them effectively.

After this, you can be sure that every company that drills in the gulf will look harder at the risks and rewards of deepwater drilling. They'll invest in better safety equipment to avoid spills, better methods to cap blowouts. They'll expect more effective government scrutiny. They'll be better prepared.

But they will drill for oil. You don't hear many people in the gulf — even those most affected by this disaster — say otherwise. Oil from offshore rigs accounts for about 30 percent of the nation's domestic oil production and is critical to the economy of gulf states. Every barrel produced here is a barrel that we don't have to import. The Obama administration recognized all that when it announced an expansion of offshore oil and gas development … three weeks before the explosion at Deepwater Horizon.

So keep the pressure on BP to seal the disastrous leak, of course. And let this lead to safer oil exploration, where companies know the cost of failure will fall squarely on them.

[Lady's Human]

And in a moment of levity:

http://neworleans.craigslist.org/mat/1758839193.html



FREE - 2 million barrels of OIL (Gulf of Mexico)
Date: 2010-05-25, 11:56AM CDT
Reply to: [email protected] [Errors when replying to ads?]

FREE TO PICK UP!

2 million barrels of crude oil. Mixed with seawater. You'll need to separate the seawater yourself.

Please pick up ASAP! THIS OFFER WON'T LAST LONG! CALL SOON!

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PostingID: 1758839193

[Catty1]

I totally do not know quite what that pic is...but it must be related...

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6430AR20100527

BP says 24 hours will tell if oil leak plug works

http://www.reuters.com/resources/r/?m=02&d=20100526&t=2&i=113430150&w=460&r=2010-05-26T201413Z_01_BTRE64P1K7X00_RTROPTP_0_OIL-RIG-LEAK

(Reuters) - BP Plc's chief executive said a difficult deep-sea operation to plug a gushing oil well was proceeding as planned on Wednesday and the next 24 hours will determine the energy giant's success in stanching the leak deep on the Gulf of Mexico floor.

U.S. | Green Business | Gulf Oil Spill

BP remained cautious about the outcome of the much anticipated "top kill" procedure, as did President Barack Obama, whose credibility stands to suffer if one of the country's worst environmental catastrophes does not end soon.

But the fact that the London-based energy giant was able to launch the complex maneuver around midday and keep it on track in the first hours was a welcome respite from a string of failures and setbacks in the 37 days since a rig blast triggered the disaster.

Undersea robots were helping to inject heavy fluids and ultimately cement pumped down about a mile to the sea-bed well, while BP chief executive Tony Hayward and U.S. Energy Secretary Steven Chu monitored operations together in Houston.

"The operation is proceeding as we planned it," Hayward said in a media briefing four hours after launching the top kill strategy.

"It will be another 24 hours before we know whether or not this has been successful," he added.

The embattled CEO stood by BP's 60-70 percent odds of success. But top kill, a routine procedure on the surface, has never been attempted at such depths, prompting one industry expert to predict less favorable odds.

"You have got some of the smartest guys in the business trying to figure this out, but it has never been done before," David Pursell, partner at Houston investment bank Tudor, Pickering, Holt & Co, told Reuters Insider.

"I think the odds have to be 50 percent or less," he added.

Obama said that if successful, BP's plan to cap the well should greatly reduce or eliminate the flow of hundreds of thousands of gallons (liters) of crude billowing into the Gulf.

If it fails, "there are other approaches that may be viable," he said on a trip to California.

Obama, who has told aides to "plug the damn hole," will head to Louisiana on Friday for the second time since the April 20 rig blast that killed 11 and unleashed the oil.

If the top kill fails, the next approach would be to install a containment device over the broken blowout preventer, a structure at the top of the well on the ocean floor, said BP chief operating officer Doug Suttles said at a briefing with the Coast Guard Wednesday.

It is still unclear how much oil is flowing from the well, but it is already shaping up to be the worst oil spill in U.S. history and a long-term threat to a rich ecosystem.

The disaster is also reshaping the U.S. oil industry. Obama is expected to announce on Thursday that he will continue to hold off issuing deep water drilling permits off the Gulf of Mexico, but allow permits to be issued for shallow water drilling, a government source told Reuters.

The oil's destruction of critical habitats continued to spread, with Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal saying that more than 100 miles of the state's 400-mile coastline were now affected.

PIVOTAL DAYS FOR OBAMA, BP

These days may be critical for BP and Obama.

BP's reputation and its big presence in the United States is at stake and investors, who have wiped $50 billion off BP's market value since the start of the spill, will watch closely to see whether the latest attempt to seal the well works.

BP shares seesawed in London trading on Wednesday, with investors boosting the share price about 2.6 percent at one point before it closed up 1.4 percent. BP's announcement that it had launched top kill came after London markets had closed.

If the effort fails, Obama may have no choice but to take charge of the response. He has so far deflected calls for the government to take a more direct role and said BP has legal responsibility for fixing the mess.

What he can do is unclear because the government does not have its own deepwater tools and technology and will have to rely on BP.

But even with Obama applying constant pressure on the company, polls show that nearly half of Americans are unhappy with how he has handled it. That sentiment could play into the November elections that are widely expected to erode his Democratic Party's control of the U.S. Congress.

Florida Democratic Senator Bill Nelson said if BP failed to plug the leak this week, Obama must seize personal control of the effort immediately.

"If this thing doesn't work then the president ought to turn this over to the military. It has the command structure to bring in all the civilian agencies," said Nelson.

LOST COASTLINE EXASPERATES LOCALS

BP has estimated that about 5,000 barrels (210,000 gallons/795,000 liters) have been leaking every day, although some scientists have given much higher numbers for the size of the leak -- up to 20 times more.

Residents of the Gulf region are particularly concerned about the impact of spreading oil on wildlife and area shorelines, home to a $6.5 billion seafood industry and lucrative fishing tourism.

Operation "top kill" was not putting them at ease.

"If I was a betting man I'd say the odds are better than last time, but I still don't think it is going to happen," a fishing guide who goes by the name of Captain Boola said at a marina at Venice, Louisiana.

He said he only fished with clients three days this month and had cancellations through to November.

Billy Nungesser, president of Plaquemines Parish, one of the worst affected Louisiana coastal districts so far, sharply criticized BP and the Coast Guard, saying they had no comprehensive plan to defend the coast from the oil.

"We will lose more coastline from this catastrophe than from all four hurricanes -- Katrina, Rita, Gustav and Ike," said Nungesser.

(Additional reporting by Kristin Hays in Houston, Ed Stoddard in Venice, Louisiana, Pascal Fletcher in Miami, Susan Heavey and Tom Doggett in Washington, Jeff Mason in Fremont, California; writing by Mary Milliken; editing by Philip Barbara)

[RICHARD]

BO and his advisers are mulling over a plan to let the oil leak go on until a suitable plan to stop it completely, is drawn up.


Until then, he has ordered tankers of vinegar and herbs to be dumped into the GoM.

Plans are to turn the Gulf into a giant bowl of salad dressing for the upcoming summer months....:rolleyes::mad::eek:.

----------

Catty,

Wasn't Captain Boola a Klingon in the Star Trek series?:eek:

[Catty1]

Oil stops gushing from Gulf of Mexico well

1 hour, 33 minutes ago

NEW ORLEANS, Louisiana (AFP) - BP has stopped the oil gushing out of a ruptured Gulf of Mexico well, US officials said Thursday, but cautioned it was still too early to declare victory in the five-week disaster.

"They've been able to stabilize the wellhead, they're pumping mud down it. They've stopped the hydrocarbons from coming up," said Coast Guard chief Thad Allen, who is coordinating the US government's battle against the oil spill.

He told local radio WWL First News that BP "had some success overnight" but cautioned the British energy giant was "in a period of kind of wait and see right now where they see how the well stabilizes."

"So everybody is cautiously optimistic, but there is no reason to declare victory yet. We need to watch it very, very carefully."

The news came after BP yesterday launched a maneuver dubbed a "top kill" in a bid to plug the leak which has been gushing oil into the Gulf since a April 20 explosion ripped through the Deepwater Horizon drilling platform.

After at least two failed attempts to cap the spill, BP has come under increasing pressure from the US administration and furious residents helplessly watching oil wash ashore, with 100 miles (160 kilometers) of Louisiana coastline now contaminated.

Full article here: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/100527/world/us_oil_pollution_environment

[pomtzu]

Let's hope that "cautious optimism" turns into a success story.

I heard on the news yesterday, that they are estimating 200 million gallons have have already spewed into the ocean. :(

[lizbud]

As I thought from the beginning, there was no plan B. Only a few wild
suggestions on how the company could ever regain control of the well
should there be an accident.

Article from Newsweek........

http://www.newsweek.com/2010/05/28/why-wasn-t-there-a-better-plan.html

[momoffuzzyfaces]

The Pres is there looking the situation over now. I can't help wondering if they will offer him a seafood lunch? :love:

[RICHARD]

The Pres is there looking the situation over now. I can't help wondering if they will offer him a seafood lunch? :love:

They stopped the leak so he could visit, They will start it again as soon as Air Force One leaves to take him home.:confused::eek::(

[lizbud]

Every day I think this couldn't get much worse, then it does.:(:(

It is impossible to believe any thing BP says again. There is no possible
way to stop the oil before August when they finish drilling the second well
which they say is needed to really seal the first well. I'll believe it when I
see it.:rolleyes:

http://www.wthr.com/Global/story.asp?S=12565028

[blue]

Didnt Obama take full responsibility for this disaster a few days ago?

[Grace]

Unlike George Bush who never took responsibility for anything.

[blue]

Unlike George Bush who never took responsibility for anything.

So this is ShrubCo's fault? Isnt that getting a bit tired about now?

At least Shrub didnt shirk his job to go play golf, basketball, or go on a date night in NY. He sure didnt go on vacation and leave it to the VP to handle things at Arlington during the Memorial Day ceremonies.

I dont blame you for your blind hatred of Bush, but get over it. At least Bush could take criticism without looking like a punk.

[Alysser]

Focusing on who's fault it is isn't going to fix the problem, just saying. ;)

[Grace]

So this is ShrubCo's fault? Isnt that getting a bit tired about now?

At least Shrub didnt shirk his job to go play golf, basketball, or go on a date night in NY. He sure didnt go on vacation and leave it to the VP to handle things at Arlington during the Memorial Day ceremonies.

I dont blame you for your blind hatred of Bush, but get over it. At least Bush could take criticism without looking like a punk.

Where did I say this problem was the fault of George Bush? Show me an exact example - please.

Blind hatred - you're way off base.

[blue]

Focusing on who's fault it is isn't going to fix the problem, just saying. ;)

I do agree with you however, just dont tell that to the media or the "Obama can do no wrong" public like the next quote.


Where did I say this problem was the fault of George Bush? Show me an exact example - please.

Blind hatred - you're way off base.

Blah blah blah. Off base? I dont think so, you brought up Bush not me.

[Grace]

Blah blah blah. Off base? I dont think so, you brought up Bush not me.

My question still stands - Where did I say this problem was the fault of George Bush? Show me an exact example - please.

Yes, I brought up Bush. So what? You can't answer my question, because you're ascribing things about me that are a lie.

[blue]

A bit defensive arent you? Get over it. Shrub is back home in Crawford and Obama is dropping the ball not just in DC, and the border, but all over the Gulf as well.

At least Shrub took the blame when he knew it was his to own, unlike your man Barry.

[Grace]

A bit defensive arent you? Get over it. Shrub is back home in Crawford and Obama is dropping the ball not just in DC, and the border, but all over the Gulf as well.

At least Shrub took the blame when he knew it was his to own, unlike your man Barry.

No, you are. You accuse me of something I did not say. I'm just setting the record straight. You're the one calling the former President of the United States Shrub. A bit disrespectful, don't you think? And, to set your mind at rest, I have never called Bush by that nickname. And that is not defensive - that is the truth.

[blue]

No, you are. You accuse me of something I did not say. I'm just setting the record straight. You're the one calling the former President of the United States Shrub. A bit disrespectful, don't you think? And, to set your mind at rest, I have never called Bush by that nickname. And that is not defensive - that is the truth.

Nice misdirection. At least Im consistent when I disrespect the president, I dont care what party they are from or even if I agree with the job they are doing.

Im not in the least defensive about Obongo dropping the ball in the Gulf, on the Border or going on vacation in Chicago when he should be at Arlington. In fact I think Obama AKA Barry should be in DC this weekend and not in Chicago with his buddies.

On the topic of this thread Obama AKA Barry should be bending over backwards to give BP every helping hand and advantage to plug this leak in the ocean rather then letting his lapdogs posture about pushing the people who know what they are doing and what is at stake out of the way.

I have to give credit to my hard left leaning brother for this, Shrub would have nuked this leak the day after the blowout, he wouldnt have pussyfooted around going to fundraisers.

[wombat2u2004]

SHRUBBERY !!!! I say. :D

[pomtzu]

Well whoever did what - or didn't do what - isn't the issue now. The fact remains, that the oil is still gushing, and the top fill idea is just another act of grasping at straws that didn't work. Back to the drawing board, guys! :mad:

[Puckstop31]

This truly is a big time disaster. Who is to 'blame'?

Ask this question.... Why are they drilling that far offshore and that deep when there are sources closer and more shallow? Or oil shale, or on land resources? Hmmmmm?

Or is it just BP being greedy? Because 'doo doo' occurs, ESPECIALLY when greed is involved. Because I know I would cut corners and be lax about the return I get on a multi-billion dollar investment.


And the best part... The fix is to just stop drilling. Glad this guy was not President during the Moon race.

I know... Being angry and pointing fingers is fun... And the easy way out. Eh?


-----------

We all want 'green' energy. It will take time. 'Doo doo' will occur during the R&D of those sources. Will movement forward on it stop? Will we even know?

Our way of life is utterly dependant on petroleum products. Why not get the EASY and domestic sources while we bring better sources online? Bashing BP does not help.

I mean, I can survive living in the 18th century, but I don't want to. How about you?

[RICHARD]

Stop and think about it.

If those stupid dinosaurs hadn't died in a group?

No oil and no drilling.

[wombat2u2004]

We could always tap the White House for methane. :p

[Catty1]

I was talking with a geologist friend of mine who has worked in the oil industry for some 30 years. He was detailing how BP was cutting corners before this blowout happened - BP was into profits, and my friend referred to them as "criminals", with a couple of choice adjectives in there.

JMO - the POTUS and his administration does not have the technology to begin to try and deal with this; BP does. It is my understanding that BP answers to the administration as cleanup continues. I know some people are upset that Mr. Obama did not get involved sooner - but I honestly don't see what he could have done onsite that could not be done in the Capitol - being BP's hardline boss in the aftermath of the blowout.

[Puckstop31]

I was talking with a geologist friend of mine who has worked in the oil industry for some 30 years. He was detailing how BP was cutting corners before this blowout happened - BP was into profits, and my friend referred to them as "criminals", with a couple of choice adjectives in there.

And if BP broke laws doing so, fry em.

What for profit company is NOT "into" profit? I am not saying that greed was not a factor in this mess however.

All of this does not answer the question as to why BP and others are doing these dangerous deep water drills... When resources are available at shallower depths and on land. If greed was the sole motivation, would they not access the resources that are cheaper to get at? I wonder why they won't or CAN'T?



JMO - the POTUS and his administration does not have the technology to begin to try and deal with this; BP does. It is my understanding that BP answers to the administration as cleanup continues. I know some people are upset that Mr. Obama did not get involved sooner - but I honestly don't see what he could have done onsite that could not be done in the Capitol - being BP's hardline boss in the aftermath of the blowout.

Agreed. The farther he stays from this, the better for everyone.

[RICHARD]

Just like the hearings and seeing a guy squatting on some beach, playing with tar balls?

I feel my government is doing the best they can, with the TOOLS they have to work with.

[lizbud]

Satellites track the oil spill.

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/05/28/4384563-watch-the-oil-spill-as-it-changes

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Now they are going to try and cut the pipe and cap it. Yea, that's a great idea! Make the hole bigger that you can't fit a cap on now. sheesh!!! :rolleyes:

Maybe when the oil get loose in the ocean and starts killing other marine life and gets to other countries, maybe by then they will fix it.

[pomtzu]

Now they are going to try and cut the pipe and cap it. Yea, that's a great idea! Make the hole bigger that you can't fit a cap on now. sheesh!!! :rolleyes:



Yup - and don't forget the big bucks that these brilliant engineers are getting as they try to find a solution.
All this, as people have lost their livelihood because of the money hungry oil company and their shortcuts, and ignoring the warning that a disaster was impending. They had days to shut the operation down before the explosion actually occurred, yet they chose not to. I wonder how they explain that to the families that lost loved ones in the explosion, the fishermen, restaurant owners, hotel and ocean resorts, whole towns losing tourism money because the beaches are closed, people in the cleanup crews getting deathly sick, and of course the damage to wildlife and the eco system, that will be affected for years and years and years to come........:mad:

[RICHARD]

What happened to the little kid with the finger and the dike?

With the internet they should be able to find him....:confused:

[Lady's Human]

I love this thread.

It's amazing how easy it is to play Monday morning quarterback.

Some things that truly disturb me about this?

Comments from administration officials that "They have their boot on the neck of BP".

Not a comment I want to hear from the government unless they are talking about a foreign adversary. Comments like that should NEVER be made when talking about citizens of the US.

Yep, engineer make too much money. So do accountants, lawyers, doctors, and any other professionals when they're in the spotlight for negative reasons. Want to bet it was an engineer screaming at a beancounter in the background warning them that the fertilizer was about to hit the rotary oscillator?


BTW, Nice touch, Pres. Obama. Truly impressive to skip the ceremonies at Arlington to run home for a quick vacation. The three hours in LA stress you out too much?

[Grace]

Satellites track the oil spill.

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/05/28/4384563-watch-the-oil-spill-as-it-changes

That is frightening.

[pomtzu]

Another thing that I find "amusing", under the circumstances, is how it has been said (by Pres. O, I believe), that BP will pay back every penny of the cost of cleanup. First of all, who figures up what that dollar figure is? Impossible to do I believe, since this will go on for years. And who really believes that BP will pay it??? They may very well be assessed the charges, but it's going to be John Q Public - you and me - that pays in the form of higher prices at the pump, and anywhere else that their petroleum products are used. BP may not come out of this smelling like a rose, but I doubt that they will suffer much in the end, when all is said and done. :(

[Lady's Human]

And all that will be accomplished by the popular cry to punish the oil companies will be precisely that: Prices will be raised to pay the fines, and then the same populists will be launching a congressional investigation into why prices are so high at the pump.....

Clean up the mess and move on.

Figure out why it happened, and prevent it from happening again.

You can punish a person, but you CANNOT punish a company..........as the costs of the punishment are passed on to everyone else.

[Kater]

If you want to *do something*....

Contact your elected Senators and Reps and let them know that they will be voted out of office if they don't ban off-shore drilling this session, and provide the funding to make environmental laws enforceable.


...assuming you share my politics and absolute horror at this mess. :( Just my $0.02.

[Lady's Human]

Banning offshore drilling?

And you're going to heat your home in Colorado how?

I'm with Puckstop......I could easily survive living a 19th century existence, but I'd prefer not to.

Banning Nukes after TMI got us some REALLY good results..........

[pomtzu]

Banning offshore drilling?



And why aren't the oil companies drilling in shallower water, instead of 5000' deep? It has been reported that there are known oil deposits in much shallower water, and an accident such as happened, would obviously be much easier to contain/repair. Of course, I don't know the first thing about oil drilling, but it seems that would make a whole heck of a lot more sense.




You can punish a person, but you CANNOT punish a company..........as the costs of the punishment are passed on to everyone else.

Exactly!!!



I also find it inappropriate that the Pres isn't in DC this weekend! :mad:

[RICHARD]

Banning offshore drilling?

And you're going to heat your home in Colorado how?

I'm with Puckstop......I could easily survive living a 19th century existence, but I'd prefer not to.

Banning Nukes after TMI got us some REALLY good results..........

You have a wood chopper!:mad:;):p

I was watching an interview with some kind of hotel owner.

He was all p.o.ed and talking about how the OCs need to pay him b/c the hotel was operating at a 40% decrease in occupancy.

I have been on vacation at the beach and never went near the water.

LOL, I wasn't about to carry a full cooler of beer and food to the beach then lug it back while I was all jacked up, tired, sunburnt and lugging a crotch full of sand in my shorts.

Be creative, discount the rooms, figure out how to make the Spring Break shenanigans family friendly and sell, sell, sell.

Should that greedy -- get an oil company settlement? he'll make money on it. He sure as ---- won't pay the people he layed off and will save on operating costs.

Just like government.

Lining up all the excuses to worry about now and never looking at the problem and how to make the best of a real hard time.

Child please!

[momoffuzzyfaces]

What happened to the little kid with the finger and the dike?

With the internet they should be able to find him....:confused:

Can't use the kid, he can't breathe under water!

Drilling off shore isn't the problem. Not having an emergency shut off valve is!! :love:

[RICHARD]

Can't use the kid, he can't breathe under water!

Drilling off shore isn't the problem. Not having an emergency shut off valve is!! :love:

In Europe all well have to be equipped with TWO valve, they are called Blow out Preventers.

IT's our own fault.

OSD can be a safe way to get oil out of the ground.

Now, everyone will use this as a deterrent to get our own oil.

It's either Drill or Cut Bait.

I sure as heck do not want to smell like fish all the time?:eek:;)

[cassiesmom]

I also find it inappropriate that the Pres isn't in DC this weekend! :mad:

He's in Chicago, although he went from here to Louisiana to assess the oil spill situation, and then came back. They were seen attending a barbecue at the neighbors' house. When they're home it causes even worse traffic tie-ups because they have to shut down one section of the expressway (which is already under construction) at a time to get him and the First Fam and the dog to and from the airport. It was reported in the Chicago Tribune that Michelle was working in their garden before they headed for the party.

I heard on the news today that the top kill hasn't worked, so it is likely that nothing further will be effective in containing the spill till at least August when they can drill a second well. :mad:

[blue]

SHRUBBERY !!!! I say. :D

http://pythonline.com/sites/pythonline.com/files/images/Knight_Who_Say_Ni_Figure.jpg

[blue]

I love this thread.

It's amazing how easy it is to play Monday morning quarterback.

Some things that truly disturb me about this?

Comments from administration officials that "They have their boot on the neck of BP".

Not a comment I want to hear from the government unless they are talking about a foreign adversary. Comments like that should NEVER be made when talking about citizens of the US.

Yep, engineer make too much money. So do accountants, lawyers, doctors, and any other professionals when they're in the spotlight for negative reasons. Want to bet it was an engineer screaming at a beancounter in the background warning them that the fertilizer was about to hit the rotary oscillator?


BTW, Nice touch, Pres. Obama. Truly impressive to skip the ceremonies at Arlington to run home for a quick vacation. The three hours in LA stress you out too much?

Never let a good crisis go to waste.

[wombat2u2004]

Mutant Fish Found at Site of Oil Rig Accident

http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/wombat2u2004/Jack-Black-Fish--30924.jpg

[pomtzu]

He's in Chicago, although he went from here to Louisiana to assess the oil spill situation, and then came back. They were seen attending a barbecue at the neighbors' house. When they're home it causes even worse traffic tie-ups because they have to shut down one section of the expressway (which is already under construction) at a time to get him and the First Fam and the dog to and from the airport. It was reported in the Chicago Tribune that Michelle was working in their garden before they headed for the party.

I heard on the news today that the top kill hasn't worked, so it is likely that nothing further will be effective in containing the spill till at least August when they can drill a second well. :mad:

I know that he's in Chicago. My point was that he should have been in DC to participate in some of the events going on there, or at least been there for a wreath laying ceremony. There are so many memorials in the DC area that honor the fallen, it's really a shame that our obviously healthy and vigorous president saw fit not to be there at any of them. :(

[pomtzu]

[QUOTE=RICHARD;2269113]

Be creative, discount the rooms, figure out how to make the Spring Break shenanigans family friendly and sell, sell, sell.

Lining up all the excuses to worry about now and never looking at the problem and how to make the best of a real hard time.

QUOTE]
************************************************** ************************************************** **************************************************

Discount the rooms - all well and good - but the folks who are looking for that beach vacation just aren't going to come, if there is no accessible beach to go to.

How about that restaurant owner that specializes in all those wonderful seafood dishes from the Gulf waters harvest. No seafood = no customers.

And the fisherman who make their living on their boats. If the waters are polluted then they can't very well take contaminated fish to market to sell, not to mention the eventual cleanup costs of their oil laden vessels.

How do you tell these folks to just deal with it? :confused:

[wombat2u2004]

http://pythonline.com/sites/pythonline.com/files/images/Knight_Who_Say_Ni_Figure.jpg

My thoughts EXACTLY !!!! :p

[wombat2u2004]

How do you tell these folks to just deal with it? :confused:

I betcha that's all that will happen. :rolleyes:

[pomtzu]

I betcha that's all that will happen. :rolleyes:

Unfortunately, you're probably right, if they get that much even. :(

I feel so bad for all that have been affected, all because of BP's greed and total disregard for the safety of their workers, and even less when it comes to the damage that they have done to this beautiful area of our country that will suffer for many years to come.

[wombat2u2004]

Unfortunately, you're probably right, if they get that much even. :(

I feel so bad for all that have been affected, all because of BP's greed and total disregard for the safety of their workers, and even less when it comes to the damage that they have done to this beautiful area of our country that will suffer for many years to come.

Well....they are up against a big corporation.
Can they get together and go a class action against BP ???

[momoffuzzyfaces]

I know that he's in Chicago. My point was that he should have been in DC to participate in some of the events going on there, or at least been there for a wreath laying ceremony. There are so many memorials in the DC area that honor the fallen, it's really a shame that our obviously healthy and vigorous president saw fit not to be there at any of them. :(

AND in the meantime, he has the leaders of Isriel and Pakastain chillin in DC waiting for him to come home so he can have a meeting with them tomorrow. :rolleyes:

[Lady's Human]

Well....they are up against a big corporation.
Can they get together and go a class action against BP ???

The only people who win in a class action are the lawyers.

The cost of goods goes up, the lawyers get rich, and everyone else gets screwed.

Stop with the litigation. Hell, why sue a company that so far is paying for their mistake willingly?

Again, the ONLY people who win in a class action are the lawyers.

[pomtzu]

Well....they are up against a big corporation.
Can they get together and go a class action against BP ???

I'm no lawyer, but I imagine they probably could, but BP's lawyers would have it all tied up in litigation for years. A snowball in Hell would stand a better chance than anyone collecting anything, I would think. Of course, BP could just add that into the higher prices at the pumps, too. :eek::mad: I'm sure there's already a bunch of biggies in a think tank, already trying to figure out how to minimize their expenses and losses, where they should be seeking out some brainiacs to come up with a surefire way to stop the leak.

[Bonny]

You would think even though it is a mile down they could run a huge long plastic pipe down to the leakage site & have pumps to pump the stuff up & out of the water. I don't think the little Dutch Boy can swim & hold his breath that long.

[lizbud]

Hurricane season starts tomorrow and that could really complicate
an already bad situation. All this misery to save a few bucks by BP.:rolleyes:


http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/37177833/ns/weather/

[pomtzu]

Hurricane season starts tomorrow and that could really complicate
an already bad situation. All this misery to save a few bucks by BP.:rolleyes:


http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/37177833/ns/weather/

Interesting article, but so many "if's"...............:(

[cassiesmom]

I know that he's in Chicago. My point was that he should have been in DC to participate in some of the events going on there, or at least been there for a wreath laying ceremony. There are so many memorials in the DC area that honor the fallen, it's really a shame that our obviously healthy and vigorous president saw fit not to be there at any of them. :(


It's poured down rain for most of the day, so they weren't even able to hold the memorial service this morning down at Lincoln Cemetery. The President returned to Chicago by helicopter (thank goodness - no traffic snarls if he goes up and over it) because the First Fam is scheduled to fly back to Washington this afternoon. On the noon news they said the service will still be held today if the weather breaks.

One more question about the oil. If they can sand bag river banks to keep water from overflowing, would it be possible to somehow sand bag the shores to keep the oil from getting up onto the beach? I saw on the news that they were trying to capture some of the birds and release them into oil-free water in Florida.

[lizbud]

Interesting article, but so many "if's"...............:(


This whole mess is a question of "ifs" Nothing like this has ever happened
before. Not an accident at this depth, with so much on the line for the
fisherman, for the animals, for the enviroment,etc,etc.

I wonder what BP was thinking during the risk-benefit analysis meeting
for this project. (if they even had one)

[lizbud]

It's poured down rain for most of the day, so they weren't even able to hold the memorial service this morning down at Lincoln Cemetery. The President returned to Chicago by helicopter (thank goodness - no traffic snarls if he goes up and over it) because the First Fam is scheduled to fly back to Washington this afternoon. On the noon news they said the service will still be held today if the weather breaks.

One more question about the oil. If they can sand bag river banks to keep water from overflowing, would it be possible to somehow sand bag the shores to keep the oil from getting up onto the beach? I saw on the news that they were trying to capture some of the birds and release them into oil-free water in Florida.


Indy got your weather this early evening. Lightening, t-storms & lots
of rain.:)

I think they are ready to try about anything to keep the oil away.

[RICHARD]

How do you tell these folks to just deal with it? :confused:

No, I don't ask them to deal with it.

I want them to rise above it.

Having been thru a few 'natural disasters" I know enogh not to depend on the city, state or government for aid?

After the 94 Earthquake I remember seeing - will use this term with a great amount of respect - wetbacks working their arses off, cleaning out homes and yards of earthquake rubble.

The ones that had no cars, piled the stuff out on the street. The ones with cars charged a fair fee to load up the rubble and take it to the dump.

The impotent knuckleheads left the piles of trash in front of their homes for the city to pick up. It was MONTHS before you could drive down a street and not see a pile of brick, drywall, wood and stuff that wasn't EQ damage on the streets.

The people who wanted to move on with life didn't wait for anyone to show up and help.

Most of the people who got FEMA money spent it on other things, not home repair..:eek::mad:

What I am suggesting is that people make the most of a situation.....

------------------

Let's put this into terms we all can appreciate?


During the winter I read stories of people who could not shovel a drive or walkway in front of their homes.

They had to wait for a neighbor or relative to shovel the snow.

Wait for your local government to come out.

What do they tell you?

They'll clear out the street and gutter- sidewalk and path to your house?

Pay more taxes!

Sometimes you get a bunch of kids, who have no fear of work, get together and start up a little neighborhood company.

I'll shovel the snow on your walkway, once a week for 10 dollars.

Those are the kids that end up with a 500 jillion dollar company.

----------------

If people deal with it? They are the folks you see on the news complaining about the assistance from the government.

You'll never hear about the people who do thins for themselves.

They don't have time to talk .

they are rebuilding their lives?

[Grace]

I agree with your premise, Richard, but cleaning up after a hurricane or earthquake is a tad bit different than capping a leaking oil well a mile under the sea.

And, yes, they can work at cleaning up the oil on the shoreline - but not if it keeps rolling on in.

[Catty1]

As opposed to class-action lawsuits, I hope there is one heck of an inquiry held - where the surviving rig workers can be called to testify honestly about what happened, and not have to worry about staying quiet to avoid retribution from the corporation.

[RICHARD]

I agree with your premise, Richard, but cleaning up after a hurricane or earthquake is a tad bit different than capping a leaking oil well a mile under the sea.

And, yes, they can work at cleaning up the oil on the shoreline - but not if it keeps rolling on in.

When the wetbacks show up, to clean up, because no one else wants to do it?

I hope no one complains about it.

Most American 20 somethings want to go to on-line school, get a diploma and get a 45-50 k jobs to start with.

They go to FLA. and all the gulf vacation spots and really do not have any desire to make sure that their kids they have get the same MTV Spring Break
experience they had.

America used to be all about rising up to a challenge?

NOw?

We are a bunch of ------- -------- that cower in the shadow of any adversity.

---------------------

I can see someone complaining about the ride in a Conestoga Wagon in the 19th century, the way that people who are grounded by a plume of volcanic gas do.

"Get the ---- out of my wagon, the next stagecoach should be by in a few days."


I understand and respect your opinions.

Do you remember all the idiots and morons who snuck back into NO after Katrina to check on their businesses?

They are ones who 'opened' a business under dire circumstances and helped the area get to a semblance of what used to be.

They didn't wait for Brownie and Bush.

So, I guess with hope and change on the docket, there is no need to panic?


I call BS on the whole govenment, Independent, Dem, Lib and Tea Party.

It's for the people and by the people!

The asshats in Washington D.C. can stuff themselves. When the Next Big Earthquake hits CA/Lost Angeles, do worry about me.

Worry about the idiots with 20 ounces of gold, stocks and bonds and an ATM card.

I'll be in the back yard making soup on my propane stove and sleeping in my tent with dirty cats.;):eek::D

[RICHARD]

As opposed to class-action lawsuits, I hope there is one heck of an inquiry held - where the surviving rig workers can be called to testify honestly about what happened, and not have to worry about staying quiet to avoid retribution from the corporation.

I love you doll, but............

A nice inquiry with bottled water, lunch breaks, stays in nice hotels with the young, nice smelling interns wearing lace camisoles and thong underwear sounds great.

Me? I think at this moment I'd prefer to have some smelly, overweight nasty arse pipefitter/diver/oceanographer/geologist standing over a map and diagram trying to fix things.

Some idiot office wienie, wearing 40 dollar underwear, 70 dollar shirts and 600 dollar suits only care that they dodge the bullet and keep their jobs.


I have BS on speed dial and not afraid to call the number....:eek::);)

[Lady's Human]

Congress is good at inquiries......

Acting on their inquiries, however, not so much......

[RICHARD]

Congress is good at inquiries......

Acting on their inquiries, however, not so much......

Acting, is that the same as make believe?:eek::mad::(

[RICHARD]

Again, the ONLY people who win in a class action are the lawyers.

I read that the 9/11 lawyers were trying to settle the case(s)....


A third or more of the money set aside for the workers was expected to go to their lawyers. Some plaintiffs had agreed at the start of the case to give as much as 40 percent of any judgment to cover fees and expenses. That might have meant $200 million or more going to attorneys.

http://www.smdailyjournal.com/article_preview.php?type=wnews&title=Judge%20orders%20renegotiation%20of%209/11%20settlement&id=127309&eddate=


These poor guys dug thru piles of bodies and trash at the site of the WTC and some SOB in an office is going to make money on their P&S?

I guess you have to be good at rifling the pockers of the sick and dying without them knowing?

Morons.

[wombat2u2004]

The only people who win in a class action are the lawyers.

The cost of goods goes up, the lawyers get rich, and everyone else gets screwed.

Stop with the litigation. Hell, why sue a company that so far is paying for their mistake willingly?

Again, the ONLY people who win in a class action are the lawyers.

Hmmmm....like giving strawberries to pigs....eh ???

[Lady's Human]

and for all the little piggies, life is getting worse.......

[wombat2u2004]

and for all the little piggies, life is getting worse.......

You think ????

[pomtzu]

I agree with your premise, Richard, but cleaning up after a hurricane or earthquake is a tad bit different than capping a leaking oil well a mile under the sea.

And, yes, they can work at cleaning up the oil on the shoreline - but not if it keeps rolling on in.

Thanks Gretchen - that's the point I was trying to make. Until they can "stop it and mop it", then the nightmare will not end for many, many people, no matter how innovative and resourceful they may be.

[RICHARD]

Let's save the money that's being spent at the moment and wait until it's finally over before we start to clean up.

:confused:

Instead of keeping the damage to a minimum, let's ride out the storm, see what the MAXIMUM damage is, then use our resources.

This is a mess that the OCs and the OUR government caused.

Greed and the ability to buy a few votes in D.C. made this happen.

The FWs who took the money are harumphing and making the proper sounds of disgust because they thought it was a good idea to go ahead and not demand a two BOV system on our off shore rigs.

-----------

I'm an AH because I advocate standing up and DOING something before someone will tell you to do it.

If people refuse to at least try and make a go of it?

They can move and let some other poor schmuk come in and work at it.

Isn't that what happened after Katrina?

That circumstance demanded people move, but, after the fact?

Who came back to rebuild?

The mindless and the people who refused to be displaced.

-----------------

Let's re-implement the "Debit Card Program" that GWB gave to the people who left New Orleans......

THat way we can give everyone some money and kill the CAN DO spirit that our country was built on.:(

[lizbud]

Pretty good article covering this oil spill.


The Oil Catastrophe


By Michael T. Klare

MAY 28, 2010 "The Nation" -

May 27, 2010 -- It's hard to grasp the magnitude of the ecological catastrophe unfolding in the Gulf of Mexico as a result of the Deepwater Horizon/BP oil spill. At this point no one is certain how much oil is pouring from the well into the surrounding ocean. BP, adopting an early government estimate, has claimed that it amounts to a mere 5,000 barrels a day, but some scientists say the amount is closer to 60,000 or 70,000 barrels. Taking the lesser of these estimates, that would translate into the equivalent of an Exxon Valdez spill every four days. Given that this has been going on for five weeks at the time of this writing, the gulf has by now absorbed nine such spill equivalents, with more to come. But picturing the 1989 Exxon Valdez spill—until now the largest in US waters—and multiplying by nine does not begin to convey the scale of the disaster.

For the first time in history, oil is pouring into the deep currents of a semi-enclosed sea, poisoning the water and depriving it of oxygen so that entire classes of marine species are at risk of annihilation. It is as if an underwater neutron bomb has struck the Gulf of Mexico, causing little apparent damage on the surface but destroying the living creatures below.

Who bears responsibility for this unmitigated catastrophe? What should be done in response?

Beginning with the first question, it is evident that a host of actors bear responsibility, from the drilling managers aboard the Deepwater Horizon rig to the BP officials who oversaw their work to the government regulators who awarded the corporations blanket waivers to ignore required environmental assessments. But, as in all matters that derive from broad strokes of policy, this disaster bears the imprint of the ultimate deciders: presidents George W. Bush and Barack Obama.

What can be determined from the information available is that the April 20 explosion occurred because BP managers were in a hurry to seal off the well so they could move the rig (which BP leased from Transocean for $500,000 per day) to another drilling location. To speed up the move, BP's managers evidently approved the risky exit procedure that led to the lethal explosion. At one level, then, responsibility can be laid at the feet of the managers involved in that decision as well as of Cameron International, the manufacturer of the rig's blowout preventer, which appears to have been defective. These managers operated in a corporate culture that favored productivity and profit over safety and environmental protection.

BP, which has boasted of its success in boosting oil production in the gulf, has a sordid history when it comes to safety. Last October it was fined $87 million by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration for failing to correct safety problems discovered after a 2005 explosion that killed fifteen workers at BP's Texas City refinery—the largest such fine ever levied by OSHA. Like other firms operating in the gulf, BP has also sought a blanket exemption from requirements that it conduct an environmental impact assessment for each new offshore well it drills.

But corporate officials and their parent companies did not operate in a political vacuum. BP and its subcontractors were able to drill in this location, some forty miles off the Louisiana shore, because the government, first under Bush and then under Obama, has been keen to increase production in the deep waters of the Gulf of Mexico. Ever since it became clear, in the 1990s, that oil output at Prudhoe Bay in northern Alaska was in irreversible decline and that no other onshore location in the continental United States could provide increased levels of petroleum, the government has sought to boost output from the deepwater gulf to moderate the nation's growing dependence on imported energy. To that end, the Bush administration proposed to open up new areas for drilling, including the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR) and the Outer Continental Shelf, and to facilitate the efforts of giant energy firms to exploit these resources.

Bush was never able to persuade Congress to approve drilling in ANWR. But he did succeed in expanding drilling in other areas, including the deepwater gulf. Bush's principal instrument in these endeavors was the Minerals Management Service (MMS), the branch of the Interior Department responsible for providing leases for offshore drilling as well as collecting the fees and royalties the companies paid for operating in federal waters.

Intended largely to promote offshore drilling, the MMS was also responsible for ensuring that all such operations complied with the National Environmental Policy Act, the Endangered Species Act and other environmental laws. Full adherence to these laws could have slowed the expansion of drilling or blocked it altogether—but the MMS provided the leases without making the companies, including BP, obtain required environmental permits. MMS officials routinely ignored warnings from the agency's own scientists and from those at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration that this sort of deepwater drilling posed a risk of massive oil spills with devastating consequences for protected marine species. Such preferential treatment for industry is hardly surprising, given the cozy—in some cases criminal—relationships that developed between senior MMS officials and their corporate counterparts.

Enter the Obama administration. Obama has been deeply critical of his predecessor's environmental policies and has promised to place fresh emphasis on developing alternative fuels—but he has shown little inclination to reverse the nation's growing reliance on offshore oil. As it did under Bush, the MMS has continued to award leases for offshore drilling in the gulf without requiring environmental scrutiny. In October the agency gave Shell Oil preliminary approval to drill in the Beaufort Sea, off Alaska's northern coast, despite warnings from scientists within and outside the agency that any spill in these far northern waters would have catastrophic environmental repercussions. Then on March 30—three weeks before the Deepwater Horizon disaster—Obama announced he would permit offshore drilling in additional areas of the gulf as well as in the Beaufort and Chukchi seas above Alaska and off the East Coast. Although Obama supposedly took this step in part to win support from Senate Republicans for the proposed climate-protection bill, it also reflects his belief, inherited from Bush, that the United States must produce more domestic oil to reduce its reliance on imports.

Since the gulf explosion, the administration has taken several halfhearted steps to slow the drive for increased deepwater drilling. It placed a moratorium on awarding new offshore leases, although the MMS reportedly has continued to give these away. It has also announced plans to break up the MMS into several independent agencies—with separate bodies responsible for awarding leases, collecting revenues and providing environmental oversight—in order to prevent a future conflict of interest. All these bodies, however, will remain within the Interior Department, and it is unclear if the White House really has the will to curb risky offshore drilling.

What can we learn from all this? It should be obvious that merely tightening safety and environmental procedures on offshore rigs will not be enough to prevent further environmental ruin. As long as the major energy firms continue to rest future profits on wells in ever-deeper waters—and government regulators collude with them in this—more catastrophes are inevitable. Clearly, it's policy that has to change, not its implementation.

To prevent more ecological disasters, President Obama has to acknowledge the fallacy of his offshore-drilling plan and place a moratorium on all drilling in the Arctic, the Atlantic and new areas of the Gulf of Mexico while the government and industry determine whether it will ever be safe to operate in these waters. As BP's inept response to the crisis shows, the giant firms lack the capacity to control leaks in deep offshore waters, and so any approval of new wells in the gulf must be contingent on developing safety and cleanup technologies equal to the task. In the meantime, every effort must be made to speed the introduction of alternative fuels that pose fewer threats to the natural environment.

[Catty1]

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/100603/world/us_oil_environment_pollution_pipe_2

BP successfully cuts leaking oil well pipe: official

Thu Jun 3, 11:45 AM

WASHINGTON (AFP) - BP has successfully cut an underwater wellpipe using hydraulic shears and will now work to place a containment cap over the leak, the senior US official overseeing the response said Thursday.

"For the first time in a couple of days I have some good news for you -- we just cut the riser pipe off the lower marine package," Coast Guard Admiral Thad Allen told reporters, calling the operation "a significant step forward."

So far, BP has met failure at every turn in its attempts to stem the flow of oil from the spewing well a mile down in the Gulf.

Some 20 million gallons of crude have gushed into the sea since April, after an explosion rocked the Deepwater Horizon rig, killing 11 workers and sending the platform sinking to the sea floor.

Shears were used to cut off the pipe at the top of the blow-out preventer stack after an attempt to saw off the riser with a precision diamond saw failed on Wednesday when the saw got stuck in the pipe.

"We don't have as clean a cut but we do have a cut now... The challenge now is to seat that containment cap over it," Allen said.

Once the containment cap is set and sealed, oil will be sucked up a riser pipe from the unit to a drillship on the surface.

Because the cut is irregular, a "very, very solid seal" will be placed around the containment cap to reduce the amount of oil that could leak out of the device once it is set up, Allen said.

"This is an irregular cut, so it will be a little more challenging to get the seal all around," said Allen.

The flow of oil from the pipe was expected to increase between the time the pipe was cut and the cap is placed over the leaking well head, but Allen had no immediate information on whether the flow had already increased.

[wombat2u2004]

I just checked this out on Snopes.
It's true. :p

[Catty1]

i just checked this out on snopes.
It's true.

rofl!!!:d

[Catty1]

BP oil spill update - cap placement success! wait and see if it worked [VIDEO]
June 03, 2010 10:17 PM EDT

Click on the link to see the video. Photo is attached...pretty awesome. I pray this will slow the leak enough that cleanup can get ahead of it soon.

http://news.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474978277222

BP oil leak in the Gulf of Mexico

Breaking news update about the BP oil spill. BP has just placed the cap over the cut that they made in the gushing oil well. So far, the effectiveness is not known. However, the procedure has been completed just minutes ago.

Unfortunately, the cut is ragged, so the cap will not fit as snuggly as BP had hoped. The video of the procedure showed dramatic footage of robots wrestling the cap into place of the jagged cut.

One reason the cut is so jagged is because the diamond saw got stuck, so BP had to use giant shears to make the cut, which could not make as clean of a cut as the saw would have been able to make.

There is no way to know how effective the cap and cut procedure was until the cap is completely fitted. Officials do believe that oil will continue to flow into the Gulf of Mexico. However, the hope is that the flow will be significantly reduced.

Also, BP has pledged to bring the Gulf Coast back to its original state. The hope to completely stop the oil flow is a relief well that will not be finished until August at the earliest.

So far, BP has received a $69 million bill from the Federal Government according to the White House. Obviously, this is the first of many bills the company will receive regarding this spill and cleanup effort.

I sure hope this is the break we’ve all been waiting for in this frustrating oil spill. Hopefully this cut-and-cap will end up significantly reducing the oil flow. BP will be in the area for years if not decades fulfilling their promise to completely restore the area. I’m even sure they can completely restore some things. Some of the delicate coast line may be forever lost.

The video below shows more about the cap and cut.

[wombat2u2004]

rofl!!!:d

What are you rofling about ??? You.....rofler you !!!! :p

[Catty1]

Like Rofl Harris? :D

[wombat2u2004]

Like Rofl Harris? :D

Rolf is a rofler !!!:p
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_D-LmRNdQiQ

[lizbud]

Wildlife feels the impact of oil spill.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36880053/ns/news-picture_stories/displaymode/1247/?beginSlide=1

[momoffuzzyfaces]

It's the innocent birds and animals and such that really breaks my heart. They found a dead dolphin today. The first of many I am afraid. :(

[3Catcondo]

I am really sad about this situation, seeing the pics of the herring and such smothered in the oil, either suffering or dead. I am praying daily that somehow quickly a resolution is found, so the wildlife and people of the affected areas can recover quickly. What a shame!:mad::(:o

[Marigold2]

Tis heartbreaking, we greedy evil humans have done this, we ruin this earth and the innocent creatures that live in and on it. I pray that this can somehow be fixed, this damage I fear will last for many many years and perhaps never be gone.

[kokopup]

The Oil spill hits the Alabama beaches today. I hate this because they are among some of the prettiest beaches in the world. I don't think the Gulf coast will ever be the same again. These are my stomping grounds that BP Desecrated.
http://media.al.com/mobile-press-register/photo/a-stick-in-the-goo-6ff7c6c45b9ba3a3.jpg

[Grace]

Bob Herbert's (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/05/opinion/05herbert.html) latest column. I had never heard of this disaster, until this article. Maybe because it doesn't impact the USA?

Whatever - the oil companies need to be held accountable.

[kokopup]

Grace

Bob Herbert's latest column. I had never heard of this disaster, until this article. Maybe because it doesn't impact the USA?

Whatever - the oil companies need to be held accountable.


The problem with Jonathan Abady, the New York lawyer, who is part of the legal team suing Chevron is they will get richer and the inhabitants of the rainforest may get pennies. Lawsuits of this type are conceived by greedy lawyers, feeding on the misery of people, who care only for their own interest.

[blue]

Lets not forget the greedy .GOV that was hoping to cash in on BP's mile deep well, the .GOV was so ready to cash in it overlooked its own regulations leading up to this crisis. The same .GOV that is going to try and cash in by suing BP. So yes BP and its shareholders, I hope Im one of them, are greedy, so is the .GOV, and both should be held accountable.

[RICHARD]

Lets not forget the greedy .GOV that was hoping to cash in on BP's mile deep well, the .GOV was so ready to cash in it overlooked its own regulations leading up to this crisis. The same .GOV that is going to try and cash in by suing BP. So yes BP and its shareholders, I hope Im one of them, are greedy, so is the .GOV, and both should be held accountable.

Yeah, Ride BP into the ground and let su taxpayers pick up the tab.
Morons.

[blue]

Yeah, Ride BP into the ground and let su (I'm pretty sure you meant "us" and not "su" I would have fixed that for you in the quote but the butthurt would have ensued from somebody and I would have joined the Band.) taxpayers pick up the tab.

BP has been good to and for AK. As an Alaskan when BP does good I do good. I dont really care enough to check my holdings to see if I have a stake in BP, but if their stock gets much lower Im gonna try and buy in.


Morons.

This is what most politicians are calling us right now.

[RICHARD]

BP has been good to and for AK. As an Alaskan when BP does good I do good. I dont really care enough to check my holdings to see if I have a stake in BP, but if their stock gets much lower Im gonna try and buy in.





When I am mad my fingers get possessed and they type out stuff I do not mean?

Koko,

This is not a commentary at you it's pointed at the people in the picture!

Why do people let kids poke around in that shiat?

Why not tell the kids to leave it alone? It's bad enough that it made it to shore. Now the kids are going to play with it and track it back into the rental or the Dodge Caravan the dad is still paying for.

IN the early 80s the Cali coast had tar balls wash up on the shore.

You stepped in them and the rest of your trip was spent scraping dead dinosaur off you sole.

-----------

In the Midwest, farmers have taken to charging people to come and spend time working a farm.

It's free work for the farmers and people, who would never get the chance, get to play cowboy for a few days.

People in Louisiana did a similar thing, touring tourists thru the damaged parishes.

Now what?

If I was there and owned a boat? I'd take out an ad in the paper and ask for people to - for a modest fee - to come out and help clean up area.

No need to be greedy, take a percentage to keep the boat afloat, to pay the crew and donate the rest to charity.

People are motivated when it comes to efforts like that.;)

[blue]

During the Exxon Valdez spill lots of fishermen made more money in days then they would have made for the whole fishing season. Tug captains made hundreds per sandwich getting lunch to the workers. Yes Exxon is still giving the same fishermen the shaft today as they did back then, and now they are breathing easy with BP in the spotlight.

I dont think BP is in the same lower class as Exxon is. Why do I think that? Because BP is still a major investor in oil development in AK and Exxon isnt. BP has allready spent millions, or is it billions on the capping and clean up? Cleaning up the mess they and our .GOV regulatory officers created. They are still dumping cash to stop the leak and clean it up while the .GOV is hosting musicians in the Whitehouse.

BP knows they EFed up and our own .GOV is trying to pass the buck. Or does the POTUS and the First Family need another break?

[blue]

Richard, Ive had a long, tiring, short week...

But are you trying to equate farms that offer you a discount for fruits or vegetables that you pick yourself, to kids picking up oil/tar balls off of the beaches in the Gulf? If thats the case the kids picking up the oil/tar balls are the clear winners. Its free oil.

[wombat2u2004]

Richard, Ive had a long, tiring, short week.

Take a little nap Blue.....you deserve it ;)

[blue]

Take a little nap Blue.....you deserve it ;)

I tried, the dogs and cat said no.

[RICHARD]

Richard, Ive had a long, tiring, short week...

But are you trying to equate farms that offer you a discount for fruits or vegetables that you pick yourself, to kids picking up oil/tar balls off of the beaches in the Gulf? If thats the case the kids picking up the oil/tar balls are the clear winners. Its free oil.

My peeve was about letting the kids PLAY in the oil.:D;)

Here's the rub.

You offer discount rooms for visitors and play up the "green/ecology" slant.

Get sponsor to donate gloves, bags and other materials. Hold little workshops and get people excited about particpating in the clean up.

Say a 30% discount on room rates in exchange for helping the cleanup?

Toss in a t-shirt and a free food/bbq for a few hours of work during their stay?

"I helped clean up the Gulf Oil Spill" on the shirt, along with the sponsors names on it?

Look at Dawn Dishwashing Liqiud, long before this happened they were selling bottles of the stuff with promises of donating one dollar to the oil spill victims (birds)

--------------------

Everyone is sitting around thinking about the negative effects on the area....

If I am the governor/senator of the affected areas, I come out and play up the fact that, altho this is a huge tragedy, the area's people are not giving up.

We always try to rise above out problems.


I have said this before....there are some places on the planet that would absolutely screw up the response to this disaster, either that or shrug their shoulder and say, 'Screw it"....

Sometimes we panic way too soon and never really appreciate or apply the "GIT ER DONE" attitude that got us here.:(

[wombat2u2004]

A stroke of genius

How to plug the oil leak in the Gulf ...............:p:p


http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/wombat2u2004/Plug.jpg

[Catty1]

http://imgsrv.gocomics.com/dim/?fh=cf7fbd3ac0c832e90a149bccd0f88237

[lizbud]

It really breaks my heart to see the damage to the birds. They show
them in tv news accounts & I feel like they should try to help them, not
just stand there and take pictures of their misery.:mad:



http://www.theindychannel.com/slideshow/slideshows/23801924/detail.html

[pomtzu]

It really breaks my heart to see the damage to the birds. They show
them in tv news accounts & I feel like they should try to help them, not
just stand there and take pictures of their misery.:mad:



http://www.theindychannel.com/slideshow/slideshows/23801924/detail.html

I heard on a news broadcast, that they are asking the public to NOT to try to help them, but to call in to the wildlife experts and they will come out and get them. Seems that the birds are already so stressed, that someone trying to help that doesn't know how to properly handle them, could just cause more stress, damage, and even death to these poor creatures.

It was heartbreaking to see those poor pelicans struggling to even move. Such as sad situation........:(

[Catty1]

Latest report says the BP riser is delivering about 10,000 barrels a day.

I looked up the equivalent in gallons, and it was 420,000.

Likely I missed something - but was the original output from the leak over 400,000 gallons?

[lizbud]

I heard on a news broadcast, that they are asking the public to NOT to try to help them, but to call in to the wildlife experts and they will come out and get them. Seems that the birds are already so stressed, that someone trying to help that doesn't know how to properly handle them, could just cause more stress, damage, and even death to these poor creatures.

It was heartbreaking to see those poor pelicans struggling to even move. Such as sad situation........:(


Death might be a blessing to the worst of them.:(

[pomtzu]

Death might be a blessing to the worst of them.:(

Absolutely! Unfortunately, there are already many of them that are just too far gone to be helped. :(

And now I heard something to the effect, that they expect the oil to keep leaking all the way thru Fall. All this is just too much to even imagine what the situation will be like by then. :mad:

[momoffuzzyfaces]

BP acts like they should get a reward because they put that cap thing on that has the vents and it's "helped some". What I want to know is WHY DON'T YOU SHUT THE DARN VENTS?!!!!!! :(

[Lady's Human]

(Just an assumption, I've heard some pretty outrageous figures for the pressure at the wellhead....)

Because with the pressures involved it would probably blow the cap off of the pipe, making things even worse, possibly leaving them with no way at all to capture the oil.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

(Just an assumption, I've heard some pretty outrageous figures for the pressure at the wellhead....)

Because with the pressures involved it would probably blow the cap off of the pipe, making things even worse, possibly leaving them with no way at all to capture the oil.

They may be going to make things worse all on their own. FOX News just reported that BP has decided to put a bigger cap on the thing to maybe close it further. BP is saying that it will have to take the old cap back off, which means more oil gushing again, then TRY and put a new cap on, if possible.
Lord have mercy! They are going to mess around until we have a volcano of oil going non stop. :(

[RICHARD]

People/tourists are taking the tarballs home as souveniers.

----------------

Here's a little tidbit about the location/depth of the wellhead.


If we weren't as uptight about the location of the wells and not forcing them to be placed so far offshore?

The costs involved to drill would not be a high and any efforts to shut off a spill would not be as complicated.


----------------

For those who remember the Union Carbide chemical spill in Bhopal, India that killed a bunch of people?

There was a trial held in India and the defendants were fined 2k and sentenced to 2 years in jail.

I love justice.:mad::rolleyes:

[momcat]

After almost 50 days, nothing seems to be getting any better. It's obvious that BP doesn't know what they're doing yet they continue to minimize the extent of this disaster. While BP plays trial and error, massive amounts of oil continue to leak into the Gulf and irreparably damage fragile ecosystems.

So many things have gone wrong. I have a hard time believing technology to at least partially resolve the situation doesn't exist. Technology has intruded into so much of our daily lives, why isn't it being used for something good for a change?

President Obama could have jumped on this right from the start. When this first started, why did he not call a meeting of engineers, oil company experts, environmental experts, and other scientists to accurately assess the full extent of the disaster and develop a plan to effectively deal with this?

So many residents along the Gulf Coast have lost their livelihoods along with their way of life, protective barrier islands are disappearing because plant life is destroyed, wildlife are dying. All this because BP chose greed over safety and corporate responsibility.

On a personal level, the worst part is the feeling of absolute helplessness. All I can offer to the fine folks along the Gulf Coast who have already lost so much are my prayers.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

One news report this morning said that it's mostly gas that's coming out of the hole now, not oil. So, that's supposed to be a good thing? :eek:

[RICHARD]

One news report this morning said that it's mostly gas that's coming out of the hole now, not oil. So, that's supposed to be a good thing? :eek:

Actually yes,

I have been in bed with a "gas leak" before.

When the 'oil' spills? That's a different story.:eek::rolleyes::o

[lizbud]

After almost 50 days, nothing seems to be getting any better. It's obvious that BP doesn't know what they're doing yet they continue to minimize the extent of this disaster. While BP plays trial and error, massive amounts of oil continue to leak into the Gulf and irreparably damage fragile ecosystems.

So many things have gone wrong. I have a hard time believing technology to at least partially resolve the situation doesn't exist. Technology has intruded into so much of our daily lives, why isn't it being used for something good for a change?

President Obama could have jumped on this right from the start. When this first started, why did he not call a meeting of engineers, oil company experts, environmental experts, and other scientists to accurately assess the full extent of the disaster and develop a plan to effectively deal with this?

So many residents along the Gulf Coast have lost their livelihoods along with their way of life, protective barrier islands are disappearing because plant life is destroyed, wildlife are dying. All this because BP chose greed over safety and corporate responsibility.

On a personal level, the worst part is the feeling of absolute helplessness. All I can offer to the fine folks along the Gulf Coast who have already lost so much are my prayers.


Excellent post. I agree with your assessment of the Gov response. I think
officials actually believed BP's PR BS.They believed the company had a fall
back plan to control the leak.

[lizbud]

One news report this morning said that it's mostly gas that's coming out of the hole now, not oil. So, that's supposed to be a good thing? :eek:


Here's a live video feed of the oil gushing out. The black stuff looks
like crude oil, not just natural gas.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/horizon-oil-spill.html

[RICHARD]

Excellent post. I agree with your assessment of the Gov response. I think
officials actually believed BP's PR BS.They believed the company had a fall
back plan to control the leak.

Here's a little tidbit for you all..

The Exxon Valdez accident was in an area that pretty screwed up to get to.

Cold oil don't move as quickly.

Plus, the currents will help dilute the oil faster.

I remember guys on the clips that were helping clean up by picking up rocks and cleaning them individually.


Not really good stuff to worry about in the first place, but more positive than having to do it in Alaskan weather/areas.

It's a bad situation, but doesn't anyone think positively anymore?

It's all common sense and I laugh, get angry and turn the channel when some IDIOT with more schooling that I have cannot look at the problem at hand and say something that doesn't call for the end of the world.

It's a messed up deal, but we will overcome it.

------------

Now? remember when someone starts b!tch!ng about OSD, tell them we can get cheaper oil if we move those platforms a tad closer to shore. That way, when it blows up, we don't lool like idiots in the media.

[lizbud]

Richard,

Do you really think the Exxon Valdez spill is over & done with? I saw a
tv news report that was comparing the two oil spills, and even now,after
21 years, the oil is still on the beaches & in the soil of Alaska. That place
has been changed, it will never be the same,ever. They went on the
beaches & dug with one hand, a few inches below the surface, and there it was.

It's nice to be optimistic, but better to be realistic about the results of
the oil spill & what can be expected to be a long, hard road forward.

[RICHARD]

Richard,

Do you really think the Exxon Valdez spill is over & done with?

Yes,

I said so in my post.

Oh, no...This is what I said....

The Exxon Valdez accident was in an area that pretty screwed up to get to.

Cold oil don't move as quickly.

Plus, the currents will help dilute the oil faster.

I remember guys on the clips that were helping clean up by picking up rocks and cleaning them individually.


Not really good stuff to worry about in the first place, but more positive than having to do it in Alaskan weather/areas.

Thanks.

[momcat]

Do you really think the Exxon Valdez spill is over & done with? I saw a
tv news report that was comparing the two oil spills, and even now,after
21 years, the oil is still on the beaches & in the soil of Alaska. That place
has been changed, it will never be the same,ever. They went on the
beaches & dug with one hand, a few inches below the surface, and there it was.

It's nice to be optimistic, but better to be realistic about the results of
the oil spill & what can be expected to be a long, hard road forward.

Hi Lizbud, Sounds like we both saw the same news report about the Exon Valdez. That area is still dealing with the aftermath of the spill. The amount of oil in those handsful of sand is really incredible and it doesn't look like it's going away anytime soon. My son just got back yesterday from China and he said the current leak in the Gulf is big news over there too. I'm not at all confident that we'll see Alaska and the Gulf completely recover in our lifetimes.

[RICHARD]

James Cameron was called for his suggestions on how to stop the leak.

He's going to make a 3-d movie and make money

Moron.

[lizbud]

Here is a young 11yr old girl from Islip, NY who is willing to help all she can.:)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37620887/ns/us_news-giving/

[momcat]

There was a newsclip today that says the UK is not happy about what they call "Britan Bashing" over the Gulf disaster. When the CEO of BP meets with President Obama later this week, he plans to make an offer: BP will hold back on their dividends if the US starts being nicer to them.

According to this clip, Britain really thinks we're making this out to be much worse than it actually is. Easy for them to say, they don't have to cope with the impact of so many job losses and envionmental devastation.

A British official actually said keeping BP a strong and successful company is in the best interest of Britain AND the United States!

[Catty1]

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/11/oil.disaster.suggestion.box/


Government opens suggestion box for ideas to deal with oil spill
From Larry Shaughnessy , CNN Pentagon Producer
June 11, 2010 7:52 p.m. EDT

New London, Connecticut (CNN) -- There's no shortage of oil leaking into the Gulf of Mexico and no shortage of ideas on how to deal with it.

BP, which owns the exploded rig causing the oil leak, has solicited ideas itself, via a phone number listed to submit alternative response technology, services, products or ideas for the oil spill. But after hearing complaints that BP was not responding to solicitations, the government decided to open its own suggestion box.

"There were complaints that come to us that replies hadn't been given back, that suggestions hadn't been responded to in a timely manner," said Capt. Matthew Sisson of the US Coast Guard. "In that sense its time for us to help out."

BP's Mark Proegler told CNN the company is working with the Coast Guard to sort through the ideas that are pouring in.

"We're receiving over 5,000 suggestions a day," Proegler said. BP assesses the ideas along with the Coast Guard and others.

Sisson's regular job is commander of the Coast Guard's Research and Development Center. On top of all his ordinary duties, he has a new number one priority: to oversee the Coast Guard's effort to gather and disseminate ideas about dealing with the oil spill. His office wants to hear from anybody with an idea. It can be an idea for stopping the leak, cleaning up the coastline or saving the oil-covered wildlife.

And they promise a response in less than a day.

For Sisson, it's more than just another duty in his long career in the U.S. Coast Guard.

"I consider New Orleans my home. The Gulf is the most wonderful place in the world to me and I have never seen it like this," Sisson told CNN.

That's why he is adament that there are no bad ideas. "Some idea is out there that someone hasn't seen yet that might be helpful to the cause."

He does admit he doesn't understand some of the ideas he's seen.

"We had a suggestion to use sonic-solar technology to use anti-matter," Sisson said.

So what is that?

"We are looking into it. I couldn't tell you myself," Sisson admits.

Still Sisson makes it clear, "There are no wacky ideas."

After the Coast Guard gets the idea, it figures out which agency might be the best able to analyze the idea to see if it can really help. For example, if someone has an idea for a chemical that can help make the oil harmless, the idea would be sent to the EPA, which overseas any such techniques. Or if someone has an plan for saving oil-covered birds, the idea might be forward to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

As of late this week, the Coast Guard has received more than 400 ideas, mostly through the website www.fbo.gov (https://www.fbo.gov/).

It expects to be fielding calls, emails and website submissions for weeks or months to come.

[Puckstop31]

A British official actually said keeping BP a strong and successful company is in the best interest of Britain AND the United States!

You have said a lot of silly things in this thread. I can't ignore this one.

Tell me... How is making BP die a good thing? The petroleum industry is one of very few that are actually growing and creating REAL jobs.

YES, BP made mistakes and they should pay for them.... Last I have seen, they are, on their own. You seem to have missed the fact that the oil companies are the only ones who have any idea what to do. Did you also miss that the first idea they had, one that works all over the world, is to burn the oil that makes it to the surface? It absolutley minimizes the impact on the shore. Of course, our "experts" in government denied them this. WTF to they know about cleaning up a oil spill? Other than, of course, SUE!!! INVESTIGATE.

The sophmoric, grade school "they were BAD... spank them" stuff is.... Amusing.

Did you ever wonder why BP and others drill in these risky spots when there are other sources much easier to get at?

/rant

[Lady's Human]

Hi Lizbud, Sounds like we both saw the same news report about the Exon Valdez. That area is still dealing with the aftermath of the spill. The amount of oil in those handsful of sand is really incredible and it doesn't look like it's going away anytime soon. My son just got back yesterday from China and he said the current leak in the Gulf is big news over there too. I'm not at all confident that we'll see Alaska and the Gulf completely recover in our lifetimes.

News in China commenting on an oil spill in the US?

Oh, the irony.

[blue]

Why did Barry's administration refuse help from the Dutch and their oil skimmers early on in this disaster? Why werent the artificial berms built to keep the oil from making landfall? Why did Barry wait so long to meet with BP? Why is Barry now trying to act like a tough guy with BP? Did he run out of fundraisers and golf games to attend?

Out of curiosity, when this leak is plugged is President KickA** going to plug all of the oil that naturally seeps into the Gulf?

[Lady's Human]

it takes TIME to write those scripts for the pocket 'prompter.

[IRescue452]

I've always wondered one thing? If we're sucking all this oil (and that from other companies) daily from the center of the earth, and its not being replaced, how are we changing the surface pressure of the earth by creating a giant air pocket underneath? Will the earth eventually cave in and become a giant sinkhole? Will we be able to empty a single cut-off oil pocket and then allow it to fill up with millions of gallons of water so as to replace the pressure in the pocket and to help with the problem of rising sea levels? What exactly is draining gazillions of gallons of oil from the center of the earth doing to us long-term?

[RICHARD]

I've always wondered one thing? If we're sucking all this oil (and that from other companies) daily from the center of the earth, and its not being replaced, how are we changing the surface pressure of the earth by creating a giant air pocket underneath? Will the earth eventually cave in and become a giant sinkhole? Will we be able to empty a single cut-off oil pocket and then allow it to fill up with millions of gallons of water so as to replace the pressure in the pocket and to help with the problem of rising sea levels? What exactly is draining gazillions of gallons of oil from the center of the earth doing to us long-term?

Some technques call for water to be pumped back into a well.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Some people want to nuke the well. Oh, great just what we need!! A bigger hole and the entire gulf radioactive!!! :eek:

[momcat]

[QUOTE=Puckstop31;2272425]You have said a lot of silly things in this thread. I can't ignore this one.

If you bother to read the entire post right from the beginning, you'll see that these are NOT my thoughts about BP or any other oil company. They are from a newsclip. This obviously proves if something is from the internet it just isn't true. In the future, know what was REALLY said before you say something stupid again. I resent being misquoted.

[Puckstop31]

If you bother to read the entire post right from the beginning, you'll see that these are NOT my thoughts about BP or any other oil company. They are from a newsclip. This obviously proves if something is from the internet it just isn't true. In the future, know what was REALLY said before you say something stupid again. I resent being misquoted.

OK.... So "A British official actually said keeping BP a strong and successful company is in the best interest of Britain AND the United States!"

The "actually", "AND" and the "!", were not YOUR commentary? I ask because the way the sentence is written makes it sound like the author thinks keeping the company solid is a bad idea.

That was the primary purpose of my post. If your post was a simple cut and paste from a news article, you should give credit. If it was your orginal commentary on the news clip... I in no way "misquoted" you.

[momcat]

The "actually", "AND" and the "!", were not YOUR commentary? I ask because the way the sentence is written makes it sound like the author thinks keeping the company solid is a bad idea.

No they were not!!!!! And yes, you did misquote me. As mentioned before, it was from that $*^!@&* internet.

[Puckstop31]

No they were not!!!!! And yes, you did misquote me. As mentioned before, it was from that $*^!@&* internet.

Alrighty then.

It read as if it was commentary from you. My apologies for the misunderstanding. You have just seemed to be very critical of BP in this thread. There is a lot of blame to go around.

Also, FWIW... I did not misquote you... I misunderstood your point. I did not edit what you said.

[RICHARD]

Two thoughts about the OS.

I saw some woman complaining about the cleanup crews and the story that they had some current and former criminals coming thru town.

She was paranoid and said that they had to watch each one.

Lady,

If you got some of the lazy effing kids (maybe your own) to go out and clean up a beach or two over the summer, this may not be a problem in your town,
ya fricking moron.

-------------

I took some oceanography classes and I have to laugh at some of the projections re the cleaning up of the shorelines.

There will be tarballs on the beach, and that is because of the wave action that will make the cleanup easiers. The areas that need to be looked at are the marshes and swamps.

[lizbud]

I've always wondered one thing? If we're sucking all this oil (and that from other companies) daily from the center of the earth, and its not being replaced, how are we changing the surface pressure of the earth by creating a giant air pocket underneath? Will the earth eventually cave in and become a giant sinkhole? Will we be able to empty a single cut-off oil pocket and then allow it to fill up with millions of gallons of water so as to replace the pressure in the pocket and to help with the problem of rising sea levels? What exactly is draining gazillions of gallons of oil from the center of the earth doing to us long-term?


I woud really like to hear an answer to your question. I have no idea what
would happen.:confused:

[Lady's Human]

Mass of the earth:5.9742 × 10^24 kilograms or 5974200000000000000000000 kg.

Mass of one barrel of oil:138.8 kg (avg) 276000000 Kg of oil have leaked so far, given an avg of 40K bbl/day


4.6198654213116400522245656322185 x10-17% (read, a really tiny, infinitesimal fraction) of the earth's mass is involved.

I wouldn't worry about it.

Not even close to the mass % you lose if you pop a zit.

[RICHARD]

Not even close to the mass % you lose if you pop a zit.

I had a cyst on my rear once........:D

[Lady's Human]

BTW, we're not pulling oil from the "center of the earth"

It's in the lithosphere, which is the top roughly 70 Km of the earth.

The Deepwater Horizon was drilling at a depth of 13 Km into the lithosphere.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_udSTgadqhFc/S-uAQp9p7jI/AAAAAAAABbg/hQCGgca2Se8/s1600/Deepwater+well+casing.jpg

The center of the earth would be another 6500 Km below that.

http://www.geologyrocks.co.uk/glossary/lithosphere

The Earth is BIG, guys.

[Louie and me]

I have been so horrified by the oil spill I can no longer watch the news reports especially the effect it is having on wild life.
Based on all the British bashing that has been going on, I did do some research and found some interesting information.
40% of BP is owned by Great Britain.
39% of BP is owned by America.
The remaining 21% is owned by other countries.
The rig is owned by Transocean, the failed blowout preventer was built by Cameron, the cement work was carried out by Haliburton (all US companies) and only 8 of the 126 people working on the Deepwater Horizon were BP employees.
So, can we stop the blame game including blaming your President Obama.
Clearly so far, nobody has any idea as to how to stop the spill and yet I would be shocked if, just like with Apollo 13, there aren't teams all over the world trying to come up with ideas and solutions to solve the problem. This is a terrible tragedy and we can only hope and pray that a solution will be found soon.
I only mentioned Apollo 13 because this was a dire situation and as a Canadian, I am proud to say a Canadian team significantly contributed to solutions to bring the crew home safely.

[RICHARD]

BTW, we're not pulling oil from the "center of the earth"

It's in the lithosphere, which is the top roughly 70 Km of the earth.

The Deepwater Horizon was drilling at a depth of 13 Km into the lithosphere.



The center of the earth would be another 6500 Km below that.

The Earth is BIG, guys.

According to 'some people' the world has ended, so why worry?:eek::o;):D



I am kidding, the OS news makes me ill too.....but what can we do, as the public at large to seal the well?

IF all the buttwipes - people that wanted the rigs pushed father off shore are to blame, the gov't. for not putting in stricter guidlines-altho every company does cut corners-and the common folks who really do not pay attention to the world around them.

The baby gets tossed out with the bathwater.

And all of us saw him in the tub before he went out the window.

http://www.caglecartoons.com/media/cartoons/51/2010/06/17/79785_600.jpg

[blue]

I have been so horrified by the oil spill I can no longer watch the news reports especially the effect it is having on wild life.
Based on all the British bashing that has been going on, I did do some research and found some interesting information.
40% of BP is owned by Great Britain.
39% of BP is owned by America.
The remaining 21% is owned by other countries.
The rig is owned by Transocean, the failed blowout preventer was built by Cameron, the cement work was carried out by Haliburton (all US companies) and only 8 of the 126 people working on the Deepwater Horizon were BP employees.
So, can we stop the blame game including blaming your President Obama.
Clearly so far, nobody has any idea as to how to stop the spill and yet I would be shocked if, just like with Apollo 13, there aren't teams all over the world trying to come up with ideas and solutions to solve the problem. This is a terrible tragedy and we can only hope and pray that a solution will be found soon.
I only mentioned Apollo 13 because this was a dire situation and as a Canadian, I am proud to say a Canadian team significantly contributed to solutions to bring the crew home safely.

Thank you!

I know its popular, even with my own family, to put the blame on soley on BP. But the facts show that isnt the case. The blame needs to be spread all around, from the Big O, or Barry as I like to call him, to his underlings in the .GOV, to the USA companies, and lets not forget the hippies and enviro Nazis that caused BP to start looking so deep for oil in the first place when there are plenty of oil reserves on land or in shallow water.

For those that dont want to lay blame for where BP was drilling, ok. I give you the Big O, or AKA Barry. Why werent sand berms built to block the oil from making landfall days from the start of this? Why werent legal exceptions made so Dutch oil skimmers could be brought in to help aliviate this disaster? Why did the state govs affected by this oil leak have to act on their own to skim the oil only to be shut down by the Fed and .GOV?

Now why did the Big O, aka Barry, use this disaster to push Cap and tax? Why let a crisis go to waste, especially when he can make it bigger.

Now Im ashamed to say I did not know the Canadians helped bring the Apollo 13 crew home. And for their help, I give them my heartfelt thanks.

This is normally where I would do a white post but since so many get their undies in a twist over that.

Im still going to make fun of Cananada as much as possible.

[lizbud]

There is only one Big O as far as I am concerned and that's Oscar
Robinson. http://www.nba.com/history/robertson_bio.html :)

[RICHARD]

There is only one Big O as far as I am concerned and that's Oscar
Robinson. http://www.nba.com/history/robertson_bio.html :)

A GF of mine..........aw forget it.;)

[lizbud]

A GF of mine..........aw forget it.;)


A GF of yours looked like the big O, could outshoot the big O, or are
you just rambling again??? :D

[blue]

There is only one Big O as far as I am concerned and that's Oscar)

If thats the only Big O you know....

To many jokes and none of them family friendly.

[RICHARD]

The BP guy was at yacht race and he's getting pummeled about it.

My prez was at the Nationals baseball game recently.

;)

[Lilith Cherry]

And today while the BP guy watched the Yacht race Obama played golf!!?

[Bonny]

What does the BP guy & BO care it is Fathers Day. :rolleyes: Let the oil plug up the Gulf it will be there tomorrow who cares?!?!?! :mad: While birds & fish die, people are now unemployed & the Gulf is one big pile of oil sludge. WHOOOPPPEEEE! For those who are unresponsible!:mad: A-- H----!:mad:

[Lady's Human]

What effects, praytell, would the presence of the CEO of BP and/or President Obama have on the situation in the Gulf?

None.

Instead of working to fix things, the people involved would be playing kiss *** with the brass.

[Bonny]

Lady's Human, I always thought you started at the top & worked your way down to the bottom? In this situration I don't thing either end makes any difference.

[Lady's Human]

I have to laugh at all the grandstanding in DC over this.

They grilled the CEO of the company about the well in question, and the media went nuts when the CEO didn't know the specifics involved with THAT well.

If they had the site engineer on the stand and he didn't know, there's a problem.

The CEO is probably an MBA or equivalent. Not an engineer, not a part of the drilling crew, he oversees the operations of BP on a global basis.

To make a military comparison, the Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff shouldn't be on the stand answering questions about the actions of a Lieutenant in charge of a platoon, and shouldn't be expected to know the details of what the Lieutenant was doing.

[Puckstop31]

I have to laugh at all the grandstanding in DC over this.

They grilled the CEO of the company about the well in question, and the media went nuts when the CEO didn't know the specifics involved with THAT well.

If they had the site engineer on the stand and he didn't know, there's a problem.

The CEO is probably an MBA or equivalent. Not an engineer, not a part of the drilling crew, he oversees the operations of BP on a global basis.

To make a military comparison, the Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff shouldn't be on the stand answering questions about the actions of a Lieutenant in charge of a platoon, and shouldn't be expected to know the details of what the Lieutenant was doing.

You can delegate authority but not responsibility. Something our political "leaders" would do well to remember.

So, yes, it speaks volumes to see CONgress grill him about not knowing the day to day details of how a rig runs. It just reinforces the fact that very, very few of those clowns have any idea what running a buisness is all about.


To add a military comparison... I had the 'joy' of giving a ride and tour to a 2 star general who spent his whole career in Quartermaster Corps (Supply, aka bean counter.) My very first words to him before he touched the tank. "Sir, do not touch ANYthing with out asking first. This thing is built to kill and it does not care who it kills. Also, the only thing soft in there is YOU." Ya shoulda seen to look I got. "How dare this Sergeant talk to me like that." LOL Not 20 seconds inside and he bumped his head, hard, on the Commanders sight extension. "See, I told ya so, Sir."

Big time leader who's job was to give us go juice and bullets. Does not mean he knew dookie about what happened after that. I didn't know the details of HOW the stuff got to us. I just know that it did.

[RICHARD]

Oil, Oil, Oil?
Oldie but goodie

http://spectator.org/archives/2006/01/11/oil-oil-oil

----------


Just heard over the weekend that Nancy Pelosi moved into her new offices, that will cost us 225,000 a year in rent. I was mad at first, then heard they were green office spaces.

That kinda sucks because she ain't gonna be in there for long.

Effing moron.

[Edwina's Secretary]

BP ignored direction from Haliburton about safety – must be Al Gore’s fault.

BP ignored the advice, complaints and concerns of its own employees about safety on the oil rig – President Obama’s fault of course!

A Congressperson from Texas who is DEEP in the pocket of the oil companies (is there any other kind of Texan???) apologized to a foreign company responsible for a hideous disaster causing major damage to this country. For what did he apologize? Because the government of the United States DARED to try and hold that foreign company accountable.

Earlier someone asked what we will tell future generation. Apparently we will tell them “doo-doo” happens especially when you get greedy, cut corners, ignore advice – especially from those who actually do the job.

And when that “doo-doo” gets really deep and really bad – blame someone else – someone you don’t like. All that matters is that your stockholders get their dividends, you don’t get too exhausted and the mess you made doesn’t dirty your yacht.

Lesson taught – whatever you do wrong – it is someone else’s fault! Just spin, spin, spin.

[RICHARD]

I love virgin olive oyl.


Popeye ruined if for me.


----------


Did you say something?

[Lady's Human]

Who's deep in the pockets of the oil companies?

For thirty years we've listened to politicians bleat about our dependence on foreign oil.

Nuclear power is a legit option.......but it was killed by trial lawyers and hollywood overreacting to an accident which wasn't a disaster, it was a proof of concept.

A plant had a catastrophic failure, and a bunch of people got the radiation equivalent of an extra dental X-ray.....if they were living a mile or less from the plant. Result? Panic, lawsuits and essentially the destruction of an industry which COULD have reduced our dependence on oil.

Inshore drilling? Nope, can't do it, too dangerous.

Offshore drilling? Nope can't do it, too dangerous.

Coal? Nope, can't do it, too dangerous and too much pollution, regardless of how the smokestack emissions are handled.

Hydro? Nope, can't do it, regardless of how fish friendly we can make the dams.

Wind? Nope, can't do it, it will ruin our view. (Doesn't work all the time anyway)

Solar is impractical, low energy density and messy to construct...........unless of course, we do it in space, which we can't do, because NASA is just a waste of money we could use to guarantee another dependent generation of voters. Social programs are far more important than something that could actually give people gainful employment and solve a problem.



There are many alternatives to oil currently available............but people need to decide whether we're going to actually DO something, or just listen to another generation of political idiots bleating about a problem no one wants to really solve, because they are ALL to busy getting money from one group or another, which, in the long run, keeps us dependent on oil and guarantees that no solution will be USED. Note, not FOUND, USED!

[RICHARD]

There are many alternatives to oil currently available............but people need to decide whether we're going to actually DO something, or just listen to another generation of political idiots bleating about a problem no one wants to really solve, because they are ALL to busy getting money from one group or another, which, in the long run, keeps us dependent on oil and guarantees that no solution will be USED. Note, not FOUND, USED!

You forgot geothermal......:confused::(;)

[Lady's Human]

I completely forgot geothermal.

Mea culpa.

I purposefully left out a few really freaky technologies which are possible, but not probable (MHD), or far too weather sensitive (Tidal, and a couple of really oddball thermal techs)

[RICHARD]

I completely forgot geothermal.

Mea culpa.


Just don't let it happen again....:D

[Puckstop31]

Who is blaming the President on a exclusive level?

Follow the money. You know, never let a crisis go to waste.


Obama authorizes a 2 billion dollar loan to Brazil's oil company, Petrobas. Petrobas is going to drill almost 1500 meters DEEPER than the Deepwater Horizon. (I thought the accident that happened was because it was to risky because it was too deep?) Better yet, who is Petrobas's largest shareholder? You guessed it... George Soros.

How much did ole' Georgy donate to Obama's campaign? Who is the real winner by just banning all offshore drilling? Hmmmmm....

From 2009... http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203863204574346610120524166.html


Never let a crisis go to waste indeed. "Look over here! Lets beat up the 'evil' Texans. Never mind what's going on over there...."

---

FWIW, BP indeed made mistakes. Seems to me they are paying for them. I wonder what will happen to the 'insiders' who also have a role in the blame trail?

Right... Some people are pathologically incapable of admitting a mistake. Bummer, because the best medicine is the kind that tastes bad.

---

It's fun watching the worst administration in US history** flail away. Fun and yet so very sad that it took what is going on to wake the people up.

**That's saying something, considering what we have recently endured.


---

Side note.... STILL with the out of context "doo doo" line? LOL I always wanted to be (in)famous.

[RICHARD]

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/05/ixtoc_oil_spill.php


It seems like deja vu all over again?

[momcat]

BP ignored direction from Haliburton about safety – must be Al Gore’s fault.

BP ignored the advice, complaints and concerns of its own employees about safety on the oil rig – President Obama’s fault of course!

A Congressperson from Texas who is DEEP in the pocket of the oil companies (is there any other kind of Texan???) apologized to a foreign company responsible for a hideous disaster causing major damage to this country. For what did he apologize? Because the government of the United States DARED to try and hold that foreign company accountable.

Earlier someone asked what we will tell future generation. Apparently we will tell them “doo-doo” happens especially when you get greedy, cut corners, ignore advice – especially from those who actually do the job.

And when that “doo-doo” gets really deep and really bad – blame someone else – someone you don’t like. All that matters is that your stockholders get their dividends, you don’t get too exhausted and the mess you made doesn’t dirty your yacht.

Lesson taught – whatever you do wrong – it is someone else’s fault! Just spin, spin, spin.

Great post! Sure, there is a lot of "blame" to go around but ultimately it falls on BP, they cut corners and ignored a crew member who reported a problem with a part that wasn't working properly. I saw an interview with 5 of the survivors from the rig explosion, they said there were 3 explosions in all. Earlier that day, 3 of them witnessed a heated discussion between a BP honcho and the drill master. The project was 5 weeks behind schedule and $26 million over budget. The BP honcho said there were to be changes in procedure and the drill master objected saying it was too dangerous. BP said it was not open for discussion, that was how it was to be done and stormed out. We know what happened as a result. And BP has the nerve to continue to minimize the extent of this disaster.

[Louie and me]

I agree with Edwina's Secretary's post for the most part except to remind everyone BP is not exclusively a "foreign" company, it is almost 50% owned by the US.

[blue]

Side note.... STILL with the out of context "doo doo" line? LOL I always wanted to be (in)famous.

It seems you have a fan.

__________________________________________________ ______________________

Why are so many people lining up to scapegoat BP? They arent the only ones who caused this mess. Everybody who hand a hand in this disaster that stood by and let it happen should be held accountable, and actually held accountable in a court of law not a Chicago style shakedown. Transocean, Haliburton, state and fed agencies who signed off on the permits and inspections, the MMS who gave the Deep Water Horizon a safety award all need to be called on the quarterdeck for this. The PotUS and Congress for not working around the Jones act to get the Dutch skimmers into the Gulf when they offered their assistance? Why are the feds hampering states efforts to contain the spill with skimmers and dredging up sand bars?

BP couldnt have dug up this amount of doo doo on their own.

[blue]

McCain doing what Barry wouldnt.


Friday U.S. Senator John McCain, R-AZ, introduced legislation for a total repeal of the 1920 maritime law, which mandates that all goods shipped between U.S. ports be transported in U.S.-built, U.S.-owned and U.S.-manned ships.

Hawaii Congress member Charles Djou, R, D-HI, in a letter June 23, joined GOP congress members from Florida and Texas in asking President Barack Obama for a Jones Act exemption in the Gulf of Mexico. Djou says the law is deterring foreign countries from bringing in highly trained workers and the latest technology to lend their expertise.

Linkhttp://www.franklincenterhq.org/1788/mccain-seeks-repeal-of-jones-act/.

Im torn on this one....

The Jones Act gave Barry an excuse to let this disaster get as bad as it has, never let a good crisis go to waste. I agree with Djou, exemptions should be made, but not a full blown repeal. But if the only way to get it done is a full blown repeal, lets have it.

[kokopup]

Hi all:
These pictures were taken by a friend, on his Turtle Walk this morning at the State Park beach. Trying to keep you all informed of the mess. Another friend has pictures of the beach in Pensacola with oil buried 6 inches before the surface. So very sad and depressing.



Not a pleasant morning for our Turtle Walk along the beach at Gulf State Park in Gulf Shores, AL.

Saw no turtle tracks nor turtles. Found much oil and a dead sea bird instead.

[lizbud]

Hi all:
These pictures were taken by a friend, on his Turtle Walk this morning at the State Park beach. Trying to keep you all informed of the mess. Another friend has pictures of the beach in Pensacola with oil buried 6 inches before the surface. So very sad and depressing.



Not a pleasant morning for our Turtle Walk along the beach at Gulf State Park in Gulf Shores, AL.

Saw no turtle tracks nor turtles. Found much oil and a dead sea bird instead.


Oh wow, those pictures are worst than any I've seen on TV.:(:( They can
clean all they want, but it will never be the same beautiful place it was.

[RICHARD]

I have been awaiting the Super Duper Giant Skimmer from Tawian.

I thought that it was as big as a whale.


No stupid, the name of the ship is A Whale.

I have to start reading my news. :rolleyes:;)

[lizbud]

I wish the stormy seas would calm down. I really hope this thing works (WHALE)
as well as they say it could. It would be a big help in cleaning the water.

This is birthing season for Dolphins, Sea Turtles, and many species of Water
Birds.:(


Mean while, it keeps on gushing......:(:(

http://www.cnn.com/video/flashLive/live.html?stream=stream3&hpt=T2

[momoffuzzyfaces]

I wish the stormy seas would calm down. I really hope this thing works (WHALE)
as well as they say it could. It would be a big help in cleaning the water.

This is birthing season for Dolphins, Sea Turtles, and many species of Water
Birds.:(


Mean while, it keeps on gushing......:(:(

http://www.cnn.com/video/flashLive/live.html?stream=stream3&hpt=T2

They've been taking some of the turtle eggs to NASA to see if they can save them. Not sure what they can do but sure hope they can do something. :love:

What is this day 78 now? Fix the darn thing already!!! :(

[kokopup]

lizbud

I wish the stormy seas would calm down. I really hope this thing works (WHALE)
as well as they say it could. It would be a big help in cleaning the water.


For the Whale to work it has to have oil floating on the water. They have used
so much dispersant on the spill it will be hard for the skimmer to do an effective job. The dispersant just makes the cleanup that much harder. The only thing it accomplishes is to hide the evidence from clear view.

[lizbud]

lizbud


For the Whale to work it has to have oil floating on the water. They have used
so much dispersant on the spill it will be hard for the skimmer to do an effective job. The dispersant just makes the cleanup that much harder. The only thing it accomplishes is to hide the evidence from clear view.


That's true. They are supposed to position the WHALE closer to the spill
itself, and siphon it directly into the ship.That should help some. I hope.

[lizbud]

They've been taking some of the turtle eggs to NASA to see if they can save them. Not sure what they can do but sure home they can do something. :love:

What is this day 78 now? Fix the darn thing already!!! :(


Yeah, I read about that. They say they don't know if it will work because
the hatchings will instinctly want to go back to their nesting area & the water there is deadly for them.What a mess we humans have made.:(

[kokopup]

All of the Gulf coast states are effected now. Once the Gulf stream picks up on the oil it will impact most every coastal state on the east coast, plus Nova Scotia ,Canada, then we can expect it to effect Norway and the British isles by this time next year. The recirculating currents from West Africa will bring it back again with one of the tropical waves next fall. This spill will change the world as we knew it. BP does not have enough money to withstand the economic fallout that this spill will bring.

[lizbud]

They got the oil stopped. :) It's only temporary
and they need to monitor the pressure readings for days yet, but it feels
like some progress has finally been made.:)

[RICHARD]

Now what?

[momoffuzzyfaces]

They got the oil stopped. :) It's only temporary
and they need to monitor the pressure readings for days yet, but it feels
like some progress has finally been made.:)

I sure pray that this stops it until the can seal it completly. If it only holds!!! :love:

[Laura's Babies]

Now what?

Now we sit and wait with a heart full of hope and PRAY HARD that the pressure stays where it should and this works until they can kill that thing permanently! Every day it was gushing, my heart sank lower and lower. I have done more praying since this thing started than I have ever done in all my life. My heart broke when I saw the beautiful beaches with oil on them, can't tell you how many times I have cried over this whole thing.

This could happen again anytime, anyplace, by any oil company and I just hope they have learned enough from this/or will learn from this and all the mistakes made so they can take action sooner to protect the shores, wild life and our earth.


kokopup wrote-All of the Gulf coast states are effected now. Once the Gulf stream picks up on the oil it will impact most every coastal state on the east coast, plus Nova Scotia ,Canada, then we can expect it to effect Norway and the British isles by this time next year. The recirculating currents from West Africa will bring it back again with one of the tropical waves next fall. This spill will change the world as we knew it. BP does not have enough money to withstand the economic fallout that this spill will bring.

I have said this almost since day 1. I have always said this will go global and while BP has always said they would take care of it financially and continue to run ads here on TV saying they will make it right for those who have lost their livelihoods, they are making it more and more difficult for people to file claims and are paying fewer of them and in lesser amounts $$ wise..

Those people down there make their living for the whole year in the few months they were able to work, there isn't any way they can give those people enough money to live as they did for the whole year. Many of them are going to end up loosing everything. Business everywhere are being effected since seafood is what their business depended on.

And that is just the gulf coast. These people are on TV crying saying they have NEVER had to get food stamps in their whole lives, now they have to get food stamps to eat. (that tells you how well BP is taking care of them! :rolleyes:) Once it is global the cost will just keep adding up.

Never forget that crude oil is abrasive and it has eaten away at that pipe all this time.. what that explosion did to the pipe, nobody knows... there are still so many things that can go haywire with this but this temporary stopping has given us hope... So lets not break open the Champagne yet.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

There was a report I think of the weather channel last night that even if the leak is stopped, it will take probably years to clean up. Instead of skimming the oil off then putting the dispersents on it, they did it the other way around. The dispersents caused millions of gallons of oil to sink to the bottom of the gulf where it can't be skimmed.

Mercy what a mess this entire thing is. Prayers for all who have lost their way of life and for all the creatures. :love:

[kokopup]

What they aren't saying is that the pressure is not going high enough. The pressure from that well was around 70,000 psi and they are seeing less than 7000 psi. That means the oil is going somewhere else and it is only a matter of time before it breaks out somewhere else. I pray that I am wrong about it showing up again but that pressure is being vented somewhere.

[Grace]

From the NY Times -


Officials Call Results of Well Test Encouraging
By HENRY FOUNTAIN

A day after BP closed off the flow of oil from its runaway well in the Gulf of Mexico, officials said the signs from a crucial test of the well’s condition were encouraging.

Pressure readings in the well rose significantly in the 24 hours after the valves were closed on a cap at the top of the well, an indication that the well was in good shape. But officials voiced caution, saying that they had expected that the pressure might rise even higher, and that the possibility of damage from the April 20 blowout could not yet be ruled out.

Another possibility, they said, is that the reservoir has been depleted by three months of gushing oil.

“This is generally good news,” Thad W. Allen, the retired Coast Guard admiral who is overseeing the spill response, said Friday afternoon, about 24 hours into what was expected to be at least a 48-hour test. “But we want to be careful not to do any harm or create a situation that could not be reversed.”

He said that so far the test results were ambiguous, and that the possibility remained that the well had been breached and that oil and gas were escaping into the surrounding rock and perhaps even into the gulf. But there were no visible signs of a leak.

The test, which ended — at least temporarily — what had been a three-month gusher, is intended to determine whether the well can withstand pressure from the sealing cap.

The procedure will continue in six-hour increments, Admiral Allen said, and new data will be reviewed by scientists and engineers from the government, BP and other companies. He said there would be “enhanced monitoring” of the seabed, including acoustic tests that could detect small amounts of methane bubbling into the water, which would be evidence of damage to the well.

At the White House earlier Friday, President Obama cautioned against concluding that the corner had been turned in the oil disaster, which began with the explosion and sinking of the Deepwater Horizon drill rig. He said it was still possible for there to be complications that “could be even more catastrophic” than the original leak.

Appearing in the Rose Garden before taking off for a short Maine vacation, Mr. Obama said all decisions about the fate of the well would be based on science, “not based on P.R., not based on politics.”

Kent Wells, a senior vice president of BP, said the company was watching the seafloor with cameras on robotic submersibles and using sonar and other equipment to look for leaks. So far, he said, “there is no evidence that the well doesn’t have integrity.”

When the test began, Admiral Allen said, pressures increased in a way that would be expected if the well was undamaged. But the level reached was lower than scientists had predicted if the well was intact. And pressures are now rising very slowly.

A breach could be one reason for the lower pressure readings, he said. But a more benign explanation would be that so much oil had spewed from the out-of-control well that the reservoir, 13,000 feet below the seabed, had been depleted.

“The pressure buildup we’re seeing is with modeling we did around reservoir depletion,” Mr. Wells said. “The longer we model these trends, the more we’ll convince ourselves that that’s the case.”

At some point — perhaps after 48 hours, as originally planned — a decision will be made about what to do with the well over the near term, until a relief well is finished that will permanently plug it. He said leaving the valves closed beyond the test remained a possibility.

But, Mr. Wells said, if the monitoring detects oil or gas coming up through the sea floor, engineers could reopen the well immediately.

“At least initially that would involve some venting of oil into the gulf,” he said. “We’re hopeful that’s not going to be the case.”

[Grace]

Oh dear, this doesn't sound promising -


Retired Coast Guard Adm. Thad W. Allen released a letter Sunday night that he had written to BP, noting a "detected seep a distance from the well and undetermined anomalies at the well head."


source (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/18/AR2010071800814.html?hpid=topnews)

[lizbud]

Oh dear, this doesn't sound promising -




source (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/18/AR2010071800814.html?hpid=topnews)


Yes & reports late today say the oil & gas are still "seeping". They will
watch for a spike in pressure before removing the cap.:eek:

[Grace]

Yes & reports late today say the oil & gas are still "seeping". They will
watch for a spike in pressure before removing the cap.:eek:

There was a great explanation of "seeping" by Chad Myers on CNN this afternoon. This seeping goes on all the time. He said some really large amount of oil seeps into the Gulf every year. There are tar balls out there - even when nothing is going on.

The problem now - this current seeping they have found - is it normal seeping or is it due to the well being capped?


CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: We've been talking here in the office all day long about this 40 million gallon normal leakage into the Gulf of Mexico. Is this true? Really, do 40 million gallons of oil naturally leak into the Gulf of Mexico every year without wells even being there, just in cracks in the surface, or is this just something that someone made up? Tell me the truth.

VAN NIEUWENHUISE (Don Van Nieuwenhuise, who is a professor of petroleum geoscience at the University of Houston.): Actually, I don't know what the actual number is, but that sounds about right. All over the Gulf of Mexico, you have formations that actually leak to the surface. And when we look for oil and gas, we're looking for situations. We call them trapping situations, where the oil that's being formed in the earth does not follow up faults or actually break through capping rocks itself and -- and leak to the surface.

A lot of oil that's formed naturally by the earth ends up escaping or leaking to the surface in the form of natural seeps. And yes, there are a lot of these all around the world.

[cassiesmom]

As loop current splits, South Florida catches a break
(source: SPTimes.com)

In the oil spill battle of man vs. nature, nature is pulling off a valiant feat.

The powerful Gulf of Mexico loop current, which seemed primed three months ago to thrust oil to the Florida Keys and beyond, suddenly changed course and helped protect much of Florida's cherished shorelines.

Now, with BP capping the leak, a growing number of scientists think the loop current will help spare South Florida and the east coast from large amounts of BP oil.

It's a bit of serendipity amid calamity.

"Things look excellent," said Frank Muller-Karger, a biological oceanographer at the University of South Florida. "They have not looked better in the last two months."

Pollution from the Deepwater Horizon site has blanketed Pensacola and parts of Louisiana and Alabama. Texas saw tar balls.

So far, most of Florida has caught a break.

Tampa Bay and the west coast have been spared because they are separated from the spill by the shallow, 150-mile-wide West Florida continental shelf. It would probably take days of tropical storm-force winds to push oil to the shoreline.

The Keys, which were supposed to get oil weeks ago, have seen nothing from the BP spill, researchers say. It's the same story along Florida's east coast.

In fact, a Coast Guard lab in Connecticut testing oil samples from the gulf and East Coast says it has found no matches with BP oil south of the Panhandle.

"People had good reason to worry," said Michelle Wood, a National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration oceanographer studying the loop current. "It seems we've kind of dodged a bullet on that so far."

The loop current, part of the Gulf Stream, begins in the narrow passage between Cuba and Mexico's Yucatan Peninsula, where it speeds north at 5 knots into the north central gulf.

The Earth's rotation and underwater features known as shelves ultimately turn the loop to the south, then east through the Florida Straits, where it joins the Gulf Stream and heads north up the coast.

Every nine months or so that changes because of numerous currents and the topography of the gulf floor.

The top of the horseshoe-shaped current is clipped off, becoming a spinning ring of water known as an eddy. The revised loop current then takes a more easterly course, traveling from the Yucatan through the Florida Straits, well south of the oil spill.

"It's just a natural cycle, and it goes back and forth," said Muller-Karger. "It's a completely cyclical thing."

This time, it happened in May.

The current's top part became a massive eddy spanning hundreds of miles. Scientists named it Franklin. The bottom part reshaped itself.

The threat of BP oil being swept to South Florida and beyond was lost.

"The gulf loop current is a living, breathing thing that takes on a life of its own and shapes things in a very fundamental way," said Doug Rader, chief oceans scientist at the Environmental Defense Fund.

Scientists are watching what comes next.

The loop current will eventually reshape itself. Will it be soon enough to move oil south?

"It's not only hard to predict, it's almost an art to forecast," said Muller-Karger.

For now, many scientists say the likelihood of large amounts of BP oil being carried to South Florida or the East Coast are diminishing with each passing day.

With the leak capped, the oil has time to dissipate, evaporate and break into tar balls. And when the loop current resumes its more northerly course, it doesn't necessarily mean an oil rush to South Florida.

"It's not an immediate rapid freight train that goes from the spill site to the Florida Keys, but rather a more complicated system of handoffs," Rader said.

As hurricane season begins in earnest, keeping oil offshore is up to the wind. And, of course, humans.

"There's no question that the capping of this well is what we all really wanted to see," said Muller-Karger. "From now on, it will all be a dilution process — if they continue to keep the thing capped."

[cassiesmom]

I heard on t he news today that tropical storm Bonnie, which could have been a huge problem for the fragile situation in the Gulf of Mexico, simmered down before it caused any major problems. Phew!