Arizona immigration law

[cassiesmom]

The new law in Arizona that authorizes police officers to stop suspected illegal immigrants for proof of citizenship is creating quite the buzz in Chicago. There was a demonstration for immigrant rights at the immigration and customs detention center.

I think that if the police are stopping a person for another valid reason, and they have a legitimate suspicion that the person might be in the country illegally, then (and only then) they have a right to ask for proof of citizenship. But for them to be able to ask anyone, at any time, arbitrarily, to show proof - I think that's going too far. Chicago has a lot of Eastern European immigrants as well as lots of Spanish speakers - if stopped by police, would the Eastern European people be handled differently because they "look American"? I'm thinking this will become a Pandora's box on immigration.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Well, if the US government had kept it's promise to do something about illegal immigration, Arizona wouldn't be doing this. Since the gov built part of the promised fence but not all of it, illegals are coming in through Arizona. A rancher was recently killed on his own property by some of them. Legal citizens should not be killed and terrorized on their own property by folks who shouldn't be here.

The US gov doesn't even enforce the laws it has passed.

I don't blame Arizona, I blame our federgal Government. :love:

The only time they can ask for papers is if they have a legitimate reason to ask. They aren't going to round them up like cattle and drive them back across the border. Sad fact, is something does need to be done.

Why should people who don't belong here have ANY rights of our country?
If they want to apply for citizenship, that's wonderful. I'm all for it. As long as they come legally!

If I stole someone's car and resold it, should I get off a jail sentence just because I contributed to the ecconomy by paying taxes with the money I earned from the sell of the car?

I still think we should just have invaded Mexico and made them part of the US instead of messing around overseas. ;) :love:

[lizbud]

The blame should be placed with the companies that hire illegals.
The companies can keep more money by paying them less & paying
no payroll taxes. It's win-win for the companies.

It's hard to blame people who want to work & make a living for their
famiies.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

I don't blame them but wouldn't it be better to work legally and not have to live in fear all the time? I sure think it would. Is it that hard to get a green card to work here? I don't know. I'm just asking. :love:

[Lady's Human]

So, exactly what does an illegal immigrant look or sound like?

The 14th amendment to the Constitution give the power to enforce immigration law to the federal government, not the states.

If you want to impeach you congressional delegation for failing to uphold their oaths of office (refusing to enforce the law of the land in relation to immigration) then do so.

Passing a patently unconstitutional law to try to fix something doesn't make it right.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

The 14th amendment to the Constitution give the power to enforce immigration law to the federal government, not the states.

If you want to impeach you congressional delegation for failing to uphold their oaths of office (refusing to enforce the law of the land in relation to immigration) then do so.

Passing a patently unconstitutional law to try to fix something doesn't make it right.

So, how does one go about impeaching the federal government? They are the ones not enforcing their own law to make it illegal for people to hire undocumented workers. :love:

[Karen]

It is difficult for an person from Mexico to get papers to work here legally, it costs money and takes time, often years. For unskilled workers, it is more difficult. Even skilled workers have to apply for a work visa and include information for an employer who has already hired them in the US. The employer has to do its part as well, and fill out certain forms.

[Lady's Human]

So, how does one go about impeaching the federal government? They are the ones not enforcing their own law to make it illegal for people to hire undocumented workers. :love:

It's already illegal for employers to hire illegal immigrants.

You can't impeach the entire federal government, but a congressman or two would be a good start.

Barring that, start a recall petition drive.

[Marigold2]

They are all over the place like flies, even here in upper Ohio they work in the nursery not far from where I live.
It's a disgrace to every hard working legal immigrent who came here and had to do all the paperwork and follow all the rules.
What is the problem with shooting them at the boarder with a tazer and then sending their illegal rear ends back to wench they came from?
Or sending them to jail? After all they did break the law!
And while we are at it lets revoke the anker baby crap already. If the baby is born here fine, it can stay but mom and dad, grandma and 15 cousins who don't speak English go home already. Baby can be adopted out.

[Lady's Human]

Again, what does an illegal immigrant look or sound like?

Have you checked with the nursery workers to see if they're illegal? Just because someone doesn't look "right" doesn't mean they're illegal.

If you're so certain they ARE illegals, why not call INS yourself?

[Marigold2]

I know because they come up every summer to work in the nursery which is one of the biggest in the state if not the country. They don't speak English and they leave right after that and this year I will be calling you can bet your sweet bippy.:mad: As to what they look like, they all look alike, dirty, covered in soil.

[Lady's Human]

As to what they look like, they all look alike, dirty, covered in soil.

That means damned near every farmer in upstate NY is an illegal immigrant?

[cassiesmom]

what does an illegal immigrant look or sound like?



This is what worries me about immigrants (whether legal or not) to Chicago. Employers are not supposed to hire illegals, but they do. I'm concerned that it is going to turn into an issue of Hispanic = illegal and white = legal around here, which is not necessarily true. Hispanic people can be here legally and many are. But I agree with MoFF that the federal government's inaction isn't helping.

[Lady's Human]

I've seen Irish illegals, Chinese illegals, legal hispanic immigrants of multiple extractions, etc.......

Again, what does an illegal immigrant look like?

The Federal government's inaction does not justify extra-constitutional measures, especially when there are Constitutional solutions.

[DJFyrewolf36]

I have a friend who is about the whitest person you could meet and he is technically here illigally. He was born in England and his grandfather kidnapped him and brought him to the US. By the time anything was done England didn't want to take him and the US didn't want to let him work. He is over 21 and has been dealing with paperwork processing since he turned 18.
The process isnt easy. Hes been in this country since the age of 4 and is finding things difficult even with family resources in both places. I can't immagine how hard it would be for a non-english speaking person with no family to help them and no money. I don't think rounding up illigals is the answer and I don't think making the process harder is the answer either. If they can prove their willingness to adopt our language, pass some tests in that regard and find a job then they should be allowed at least part time residency.
There is no way to visually spot an "illigal". They tried that in the late 1800s and it caused a lot of bloodshed and heartache. Id like to think civilization has advanced a bit since then.

[wombat2u2004]

So, exactly what does an illegal immigrant look like?

http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/wombat2u2004/Aussie.jpg

[kokopup]

Lady's Human

The 14th amendment to the Constitution give the power to enforce immigration law to the federal government, not the states.

If you want to impeach you congressional delegation for failing to uphold their oaths of office (refusing to enforce the law of the land in relation to immigration) then do so.

Passing a patently unconstitutional law to try to fix something doesn't make it right.

I do not have the insight of a Supreme Court but I do not see that AZ's law violates the 14th Amendment. The key words are "Citizen" and "Due Process of Law". The problems that are occurring all across the country isn't just having illegals working here, It is the Drug cartel causing mayhem. Many of the illegals are here for one reason, Drugs. I live near Birmingham and we are sitting right in the middle of their drug pipeline. We had 8 illegals killed Gangland style in a "Upscale" home because they had somehow crossed the Cartel. The Drug Cartel has brought war to the southeastern states. I see many more states taking the same action that AZ did. In this area "profiling' has turned up millions in Cartel drugs and money. The way I see it all is fair in the war against Drugs.

[Husky_mom]

so.. let´s say.. I go to the AZ.. I do not apply for "legalization".. work there somewhere... and I remain as illegal.. I do speak english.. I´m blonde.. green eyes.. and STILL ILLEGAL.. who´s gonna file against me just by my looks?.. do I look illegal?.. I´d say no by the ways they are treating this..

I think the law had a valid reason just poorly addressed... it may be a real hassle to get legal and work over there.. many employers surely underpay so it´s best for them to hire illegals... but can there be a solution to do things within law for both parties so it´s a win-win WITHIN law.. not around it..

I think if people want to work and have rights and benefits over there they
SHOULD do things properly.. but with so many obstacles it´s sometimes difficult.. and I´m not saying everything should be handed in silver plates..

Employers should be also punished by hiring illegals I think a bit more drastically..

and whatever the law is for NO-ONE should be categorized just by looks.. IMO that´s racist.. one can be the most decent hard working person and only because they are dirty or covered in soil or look like a mexican THAT should not be what stigmatizes them..

yes I´m aware there are TONS of immigrants... mexicans included.. as well as many hispanic and southamerican and european and asiatic places.. so Lady´s Human is right.. what does an illegal immigrant LOOK like?.. I´m not one to answer that..

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Maybe it they should make it easier to come to work here legally. Also, every person in the US, could tuck a copy of their birth certificate in their purse or wallet and all get checked every time they are even stopped for a speeding ticket. That would not be racial profiling at all.

We have 'emersion camp' offered for the grade school children here this summer. Not to teach English but to teach Spanish. Isn't that backwards? :confused: :love:

[Karen]

We have 'immersion camp' offered for the grade school children here this summer. Not to teach English but to teach Spanish. Isn't that backwards? :confused: :love:

Why not learn a second language? It is easier as a child than as an adult ... I think it would be fun, no matter the language choice!

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Why not learn a second language? It is easier as a child than as an adult ... I think it would be fun, no matter the language choice!

Fine but why not offer an 'emersion class' for English for those who need it? I'd think that would be more important. We are still an English speaking country mostly. :love:

[lvpets2002]

:p Wom thats a RedNeck Texan.. No no maybe its a Drunk Aussie..:D
http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/wombat2u2004/Aussie.jpg

[Lady's Human]

Lady's Human


I do not have the insight of a Supreme Court but I do not see that AZ's law violates the 14th Amendment. The key words are "Citizen" and "Due Process of Law".

The key part of the amendment is the last clause:

Section 5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

The Congress. No the states. The Congress.

As to the problems with illegals and drugs, Alabama and the rest of the south have no unique claim on that one. There are several pipelines, and some of them are in the north, too.

[Lady's Human]

Maybe it they should make it easier to come to work here legally. Also, every person in the US, could tuck a copy of their birth certificate in their purse or wallet and all get checked every time they are even stopped for a speeding ticket. That would not be racial profiling at all.

Ze Papers, please......


Yep, that'd work wonderfully. How about at the border control checkpoints between states?

Or maybe have an officer checking people as they came into town?

[lizbud]

They are all over the place like flies, even here in upper Ohio they work in the nursery not far from where I live.


And while we are at it lets revoke the anker baby crap already. If the baby is born here fine, it can stay but mom and dad, grandma and 15 cousins who don't speak English go home already. Baby can be adopted out.


This is pretty rough language, don't you think? Comparely people to flies,
and even saying a "anchor baby" should be separated from it's mother and
adopted out to strangers???

[caseysmom]

This is pretty rough language, don't you think? Comparely people to flies,
and even saying a "anchor baby" should be separated from it's mother and
adopted out to strangers???

Truly despicable as usual.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Ze Papers, please......


Yep, that'd work wonderfully. How about at the border control checkpoints between states?

Or maybe have an officer checking people as they came into town?

:rolleyes: They would only have to check them at times they would normally ask for your drivers license or ID, like being picked up for a dui, not flagging every car down or knocking on doors. :love:

[Lady's Human]

:rolleyes: They would only have to check them at times they would normally ask for your drivers license or ID, like being picked up for a dui, not flagging every car down or knocking on doors. :love:

If your driver's license isn't sufficient, there's a problem already.

[wombat2u2004]

:p Wom thats a RedNeck Texan.. No no maybe its a Drunk Aussie..:D

IT'S ME !!! Hee hee

[Marigold2]

They come here and try to have a child so they can stay. Is that right?
The amount of money that these people cost in Welfare, Medicaid is staggering. And we the tax payer foot the bill.
For decent, honest Americans who work and cannot get health insurance or cannot afford health insurance it is in part because so much money is being spent on illegal alians sapping all the money through Welfare and Medicaid, CareSource.
It is helping to crush our economy. Why are insurance rates so high, why are hospitals closing and laying people off? It is in part because all these people get free care. And they continue to have children in this country that we have to pay for probably as long as they live.
They don't speak English, don't care to learn, why should they we are writing everything in Spanish now.
They can't get a job, because they are illegal but they can get free health care.
Like I said shoot them at the boarder with a taser, put them in jail and revoke the anchor baby law.
Why are they having a baby in a foreign country without legal status and no job?? Because they get every thing for free.
That makes the US government pretty dumb. The long and short is they are breaking the law and should be punished.


This is pretty rough language, don't you think? Comparely people to flies,
and even saying a "anchor baby" should be separated from it's mother and
adopted out to strangers???

[Karen]

They come here and try to have a child so they can stay. Is that right?

How do you know that? What makes you assume that? You should not make such assumptions about people. As Lady's Human pointed out, being brown-skinned and dirty from working in the fields does not make you an illegal immigrant - many US born, native for many generations of farmers would fit that description. Farming is hard, physical labor, and involves being in the sun, and getting dirty.

I am not saying there are no illegal immigrants among the group you are talking about, but if you are so upset about it, why not call ICE?

[blue]

Has anybody posting in this thread actually read SB 1070?

[RICHARD]

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/4/2/129147037644754585.jpg

I konkur!:confused::eek::D

-----------

Homogenous?

Does that mean they can play soft ball?:eek::)

I live where anchor babies are par for the course.


Anchor babies are AMERICAN CITIZENS and are allowed the privileges of such.

--------------

Keep it up and I will personally go to the Taco Bell by your home and shut it down.

Earache my eye.

----------

Ask me about illegal aliens, not the guys that cut your lawn.

[caseysmom]

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/4/2/129147037644754585.jpg

I konkur!:confused::eek::D

lmao...you captured some of the above posts to a tee:D

[blue]

I see your sign and raise you a video.

Link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9ohsvJHkbY).

[RICHARD]

I came late to the thread...


Husky Mom.

Well said!

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The worst part about this law is that any cop can use the 'probable cause' reason to jack your arse, on the street.

-----------

I had to laugh at Gordon Brown getting punked for calling that woman a bigot.

She was a bigot.

----------

14th amendment.


"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and the State wherein they reside."

It's not a law, It's an amendment!;):eek::(

[blue]

I would very much like to shoot you

:confused:

[wombat2u2004]

:confused:

Was that a threat ????

[pomtzu]

Welcome back! I know you felt like I didn't have your back before but I have your back on this one.

I concure on this one........

Marigold - maybe you should boycott produce and chicken too. Afterall - "these people" are the ones who work the fields from sunup to sunset, harvesting all these crops that you so love to purchase, without giving a thought about how they get to the supermarket or the local produce stands. The next time you buy chicken, stop and think of how it got to the stores or restaurants too - by these people working in the chicken slaughter houses in deplorable conditions for long hours, so that Mr Perdue and others like him can sit back and count their "hard earned" :rolleyes: money. The immigrants do the dirty work that you, and people like you, refuse to do because it's "below you". You've made it quite clear here, (by implication), time and time again, that somehow your German heritage makes you superior. I believe Hitler was of the same mindset!!!

[Louie and me]

Talking about Hitler - I must confess that when I first heard about this bill my mind immediately went to the Jews in Nazi Germany with the Star of David sewn on their clothes. This bill is nowhere near that extreme but I do think it is pointing in a very scary direction.

[Marigold2]

I have no control over were our produce or our chicken comes from. I do not hire the workers. I don't have a problem with people from Mexico working here and living here, I have a problem with illegals regardless of where they come from. This is America it's a melting pot.
I believe that all people from foreign lands should go through the proper channels to become a citizen so it is fair for all, I have stated this many times.
They are breaking the law if they cross our boarders without the proper paperwork, I am not breaking any law.
As for concentration camp I do know something about that as my mother was there and she was the only one out of 11 children to live.


I concure on this one........

Marigold - maybe you should boycott produce and chicken too. Afterall - "these people" are the ones who work the fields from sunup to sunset, harvesting all these crops that you so love to purchase, without giving a thought about how they get to the supermarket or the local produce stands. The next time you buy chicken, stop and think of how it got to the stores or restaurants too - by these people working in the chicken slaughter houses in deplorable conditions for long hours, so that Mr Perdue and others like him can sit back and count their "hard earned" :rolleyes: money. The immigrants do the dirty work that you, and people like you, refuse to do because it's "below you". You've made it quite clear here, (by implication), time and time again, that somehow your German heritage makes you superior. I believe Hitler was of the same mindset!!!

[caseysmom]

I have no control over were our produce or our chicken comes from. I do not hire the workers. I don't have a problem with people from Mexico working here and living here, I have a problem with illegals regardless of where they come from. This is America it's a melting pot.
I believe that all people from foreign lands should go through the proper channels to become a citizen so it is fair for all, I have stated this many times.
They are breaking the law if they cross our boarders without the proper paperwork, I am not breaking any law.
As for concentration camp I do know something about that as my mother was there and she was the only one out of 11 children to live.

So when you see the illegals everywhere like "flies" (your word don't even enjoy writing it) how do you know they are illegal? What do they look like?

[Marigold2]

Births to Immigrants in America
1970 to 2002
July 2005
By Steven A. Camarota (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805.html#author)
Download the .pdf version (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805.pdf)
County and MSA Data (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805data.xls)
Analysis of birth records shows that in 2002 almost one in four births in the United States was to an
immigrant mother, legal and illegal, the highest level in American history. The enormous number and proportion of children from immigrant families may overwhelm the assimilation process, making it difficult to integrate these new second-generation Americans. At present, the U.S. government automatically gives American citizenship to all people born in the country, even the children of tourists and illegal aliens.1 (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805.html#1)

Among the study's findings:

* In 2002, 23 percent of all births in the United States were to immigrant mothers (legal or illegal), compared to 15 percent in 1990, 9 percent in 1980, and 6 percent in 1970.

* Even at the peak of the last great wave of immigration in 1910, births to immigrant mothers accounted for a slightly smaller share than today. After 1910 immigration was reduced, but current immigration continues at record levels, thus births to immigrants will continue to increase.

* Our best estimate is that 383,000 or 42 percent of births to immigrants are to illegal alien mothers. Births to illegals now account for nearly one out of every 10 births in the United States.

* The large number of births to illegals shows that the longer illegal immigration is allowed to persist, the harder the problem is to solve. Because as U.S. citizens these children can stay permanently, their citizenship can prevent a parent's deportation, and once adults they can sponsor their parents for permanent residence.

* The large number of children born to illegals also shows that a "temporary" worker program is unrealistic because it would result in hundreds of thousands of permanent additions to the U.S. population each year, exactly what such a program is supposed to avoid.

* Overall, immigrant mothers are much less educated than native mothers. In 2002, 39 percent of immigrant mothers lacked a high school education, compared to 17 percent of native mothers. And immigrants now account for 41 percent of births to mothers without a high school degree.

* The dramatic growth in births to immigrants has been accompanied by a decline in diversity. In 1970, the top country for immigrant births -- Mexico -- accounted for 24 percent of births to immigrants, by 2002 it was 45 percent.

* As a share of all births in the country, Mexican immigrants accounted for one in 10 births in 2002. No single foreign country has ever accounted for such a large share of births.


* In 2002, births to Hispanic immigrants accounted for 59 percent of all births to immigrant mothers. No single cultural/linguistic group has ever accounted for such a large share of births to immigrants.

* The states with the most dramatic increase in births to immigrants in the last decade are Georgia, North Carolina, Nevada, Nebraska, Arkansas, Arizona, Tennessee, Minnesota, Colorado, Delaware, Virginia, and Maryland

* Immigrants account for such a large percentage of births because they have somewhat higher fertility and are more likely to be in their reproductive years than natives. However, the difference with natives is not large enough to significantly affect the nation's overall age structure.

* Immigrants who have arrived in the last two decades plus all of their U.S.-born children have only reduced the average age in the United States from 37 to 36 years.

* Looking at the working age share (15 to 64) of the population also shows little effect from immigration. With or without post-1980 immigrants and their U.S.-born children, 66 percent of the population is of working age.

* While immigration has little effect on the nation's age structure, new immigrants (legal and illegal) plus births to immigrants add some 2.3 million people to the nation's population each year, making for a much larger overall population.
Introduction
It is difficult to imagine a government program that has a more profound impact on society than immigration. Large numbers of immigrants and their descendants cannot help but shape the destiny of the country in which they settle. (The terms "immigrant" and "foreign born" are used synonymously in this report.) Even after the original immigrant dies or returns home, his children and descendants will continue to exert a powerful influence on their new country's demographic, political, economic, and cultural life. Examining births to immigrants is therefore important, because it is a way of measuring the scale of immigration and its impact on American society. This is especially true because the U.S. government has chosen to award American citizenship to all persons born in the United States, including those born to temporary visitors or even illegal aliens. As citizens, it seems almost certain that the vast majority of these children will live in America.

Why Study Immigrant Births?
Public Expenditures on Children. All levels of government provide services to children. Therefore, it is necessary to understand the effect of immigration policy on the number of children being born in the United States in order to better anticipate spending on services, especially public schools. Children from immigrant families may also have needs that are different from those of children from native families. Given the large share of births to immigrants, how these children integrate into American society is critically important to the future of the country. Thus a better understanding of immigration's impact on births is necessary so that government may better meet the needs of these children.

Assimilating the Children of Immigrants. There are now more than 30 million immigrants living in the country. It is sometimes suggested that because immigrants are now so numerous it lowers their interaction with natives and reduces their need to integrate fully into American society. Advocates of high immigration often respond that immigrants account for a smaller share of the population today than during the peak of the last great wave of immigration, yet those immigrants integrated successfully. These advocates seem to be saying that the relative sizes of the immigrant and native population matter, but we have not reached the level of the last great wave, so there is little reason to worry.

Of course, given the enormous changes in the world, it is not clear that comparing current immigration with that of a century ago makes sense. Nor is it clear that the very peak level of immigration, which itself was unusual in American history, is the best point of comparison. Nonetheless, it is true that at the very peak of the last great wave in 1910, the foreign born were a larger share of the total population -- about 15 percent versus 12 percent today. However, examining births to immigrants is relevant to the assimilation debate because it is another way of measuring the scale of immigration and its impact on American society.

Although children born to immigrants are by definition natives, the number and share they represent of all births may have some bearing on how they assimilate. After all, if births to immigrants comprise a very large share of all births, then children from immigrant families may tend to interact primarily with each other, having little contact with the children of natives. As a result, foreign cultural norms, values, and even identities may be dominant among these children. Of course, the fact that a very large share of children may come from immigrant families does not necessarily prove that assimilation will be less complete, since assimilation is a multifaceted and complex process. But the issue of births to immigrants certainly is germane to the debate over the likely course of assimilation.

Research on the Second Generation. The changing share of immigrant births is important because it may help us to better understand how things are changing for the children of immigrants. Researchers often examine the assimilation of adults who had immigrant parents, referred to as second-generation Americans. But the environment in which such individuals grew up may have fundamentally changed. For example, an American born three decades age to immigrant parents was raised in a country where only about one out of 20 U.S.-born children had a foreign-born mother compared to one in four today. The situation for the children of Mexican immigrants is even more striking. In 1970, 54,000 children were born to Mexican immigrant mothers and they accounted for 1.5 percent of all births. In 2002, 408,000 children were born to Mexican immigrant mothers, accounting for 10.1 percent of all births. This change likely will have significant impact on the childhood experience for these children. A person born to immigrants 30 years ago may have grown up with relatively very little contact with other children whose mothers came from the same country. But given the enormous growth in numbers, a child born to an immigrant today may have a very different sense of identity. We at least need to be aware of how things have changed when thinking about the experiences of second-generation Americans.

Characteristics of Those Having Children. Another reason to examine births to immigrants is that it provides some insight into the environment that the children of immigrants are being born into. For example, data are available on the education level of each child's mother. Education is important because it is the single best indicator of income and overall socio-economic status. Parental education levels are also a good predictor of how much education the child will ultimately obtain. Thus, examining characteristics such as education provides important clues to the life prospects of these children, and how they may differ from those born to native mothers.


This article continues just google it.












How do you know that? What makes you assume that? You should not make such assumptions about people. As Lady's Human pointed out, being brown-skinned and dirty from working in the fields does not make you an illegal immigrant - many US born, native for many generations of farmers would fit that description. Farming is hard, physical labor, and involves being in the sun, and getting dirty.

I am not saying there are no illegal immigrants among the group you are talking about, but if you are so upset about it, why not call ICE?

[Asiel]

Mariglod I'm not from the U.S. but we have all nationalities here that you can think of. I'm sure we have the "illegals" as you call them , funny no matter what colour they are I have no clue if they are illegal or not. For some reason they all look like human beings, maybe my eyesight is very bad.

Don't you think some of your U.S, citizens abuse your system as well as any one else does because out here we have people born here who abuse our system worse than the "illegals" as you call them.

[RICHARD]

http://deemusic.homestead.com/files/speedygonzalestop.jpg



I have to shatter some myths about the 'Illegals'.


In downtown El Lay you could drive around McArthur park and see guys gesturing that they had 'documents' for sale.

You could get almost anything for I.D. purposes.

I worked with a clerk in the records room that sold birth certificates, complete with a real doctor's signature out of the office.

They way it worked was to get the doc to presign the forms, then the clerk would fill them in and make a copy of the form that was to be submitted to the hall of records. Give it to the mom and their kids are registered for school.

Any school system would take that copy as a declaration that the child was indeed born here in the U.S...

Because the U.S. system of record keeping is so disjointed-anyone can and will get somekind of paperwork to make them 'legal'. There's people that share identities and social security numbers.


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The US government HAS to put pressure on the Mex government to make their northern border as strong as the southern access to thier company.

The border between Central America and Mexico is way tougher to cross than you may think.


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THere has to be some fine tuning to this law -I am not comfortable with the local police departments having that much power. Most of the time illegals are part of the crime problem here-not because they are the criminals.
It's because they will not report a crime for fear of being found to be illegal and then being fearful of being deported.


So, some crimes just are not reported.

There a way too many pros and cons in this conversation and most of them, on either side, are way too close to the truth.

Instead of acting wacky and stupid with boycotts of Arizona, more thought needs to be put into the idea of immigration laws.


BTW,

The Prez was able to solve the health care reform?!?!?!?

I am sure he can work a miracle for Immi Laws and then have time for the Oil Slick in the Gulf...

Just wondering.:confused:;)

[blue]

The Prez was able to solve the health care reform?!?!?!?

He did? I see a bigger boondoggle the the 2 wars we are fighting right now.


I am sure he can work a miracle for Immi Laws and then have time for the Oil Slick in the Gulf...

ShrubCo at least did a fly over 2 days after Katrina. Barry waits 8 days to say, "we're working on it".

[Karen]

Barry waits 8 days to say, "we're working on it".

What do you expect him to do? 8 days ago, they had no idea the fail safes had not worked, never mind that the well would continue to pump without a working pump to extract oil ... the situation has been evolving each day.

[blue]

What do you expect him to do? 8 days ago, they had no idea the fail safes had not worked, never mind that the well would continue to pump without a working pump to extract oil ... the situation has been evolving each day.

They expected ShrubCo to avert hurricane Katerina. Never mind the fact that the .GOV cannot control the weather.

There must not be enough illegal immigrants in LA to warrant BO's attention.

[RICHARD]

There must not be enough illegal immigrants in LA to warrant BO's attention.

El Lay or LA?:confused:;)

--------

I was being facetious about the government intervention, every crisis is different, but the criticism should be even.:eek:;)

[Lady's Human]

Warren Zevon lives!

OT, but the DC answer to the oil slick?

Send Lawyers:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=xprnw.20100430.DC96773&show_article=1

Guns:

INTERIOR DEPARTMENT:
The department deployed SWAT teams from the Minerals Management Service to inspect 30 drilling rigs operating in the deepwater sections of the Gulf of Mexico. Inspections should be completed within the next week, according to an Interior Department spokeswoman.

Inspectors will check to see whether the rigs have conducted blow-out preventer tests and inspect related records, the spokeswoman said. The teams will also verify that emergency well control exercises are taking place. Inspectors will then inspect 47 deep-water production platforms in the gulf, a process that will take longer than rig inspections because of the complexities of the structures.


And DC is involved, so you know money isn't too far behind!

[RICHARD]

Warren Zevon lives!

OT, but the DC answer to the oil slick?

Send Lawyers:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=xprnw.20100430.DC96773&show_article=1

Guns:

INTERIOR DEPARTMENT:
The department deployed SWAT teams from the Minerals Management Service to inspect 30 drilling rigs operating in the deepwater sections of the Gulf of Mexico. Inspections should be completed within the next week, according to an Interior Department spokeswoman.

Inspectors will check to see whether the rigs have conducted blow-out preventer tests and inspect related records, the spokeswoman said. The teams will also verify that emergency well control exercises are taking place. Inspectors will then inspect 47 deep-water production platforms in the gulf, a process that will take longer than rig inspections because of the complexities of the structures.


And DC is involved, so you know money isn't too far behind!



Poor lawyers, do you know what crude does to wingtips?


SWAT?:confused::rolleyes:

I guess psychiatrists could be next??
:D

[Lady's Human]

What do you expect him to do? 8 days ago, they had no idea the fail safes had not worked, never mind that the well would continue to pump without a working pump to extract oil ... the situation has been evolving each day.

Wells don't need a pump to bleed oil in many cases. See any of the pics from the oil rush in PA. The term "gusher" didn't enter the lexicon without cause.

All I expect, frankly, at this point, is equal critique for equal performance. Pres. Bush was hammered for a lack of federal response mere hours after Katrina hit.........despite the fact that military disaster response guides dictate that local authorities are on their own for a minimum of 48-72 hours after a disaster. It takes time for the federal government to act, especially in a military context within CONUS.

[cassiesmom]

There was a big march for immigration reform in Chicago today. Chicago has a big labor union presence, so May Day gets recognized. I heard on the news that the state spends over $3 billion yearly for education, health care and incarceration of illegal residents. "What does an illegal immigrant look like?" is a big question. But $3 billion is a LOT of money. All I know for sure is that we can't keep doing what we have been doing, because it's not working. If I wanted to move to Canada I would have to obtain proper documentation as a resident and as a nurse. What's different about Mexicans coming here? But the President doesn't know if he'll "get to immigration" because of the ecological impact of the oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, restructuring financial regulation, and health care.

[caseysmom]

Births to Immigrants in America
1970 to 2002
July 2005
By Steven A. Camarota (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805.html#author)
Download the .pdf version (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805.pdf)
County and MSA Data (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805data.xls)
Analysis of birth records shows that in 2002 almost one in four births in the United States was to an
immigrant mother, legal and illegal, the highest level in American history. The enormous number and proportion of children from immigrant families may overwhelm the assimilation process, making it difficult to integrate these new second-generation Americans. At present, the U.S. government automatically gives American citizenship to all people born in the country, even the children of tourists and illegal aliens.1 (http://www.cis.org/articles/2005/back805.html#1)

Among the study's findings:

* In 2002, 23 percent of all births in the United States were to immigrant mothers (legal or illegal), compared to 15 percent in 1990, 9 percent in 1980, and 6 percent in 1970.

* Even at the peak of the last great wave of immigration in 1910, births to immigrant mothers accounted for a slightly smaller share than today. After 1910 immigration was reduced, but current immigration continues at record levels, thus births to immigrants will continue to increase.

* Our best estimate is that 383,000 or 42 percent of births to immigrants are to illegal alien mothers. Births to illegals now account for nearly one out of every 10 births in the United States.

* The large number of births to illegals shows that the longer illegal immigration is allowed to persist, the harder the problem is to solve. Because as U.S. citizens these children can stay permanently, their citizenship can prevent a parent's deportation, and once adults they can sponsor their parents for permanent residence.

* The large number of children born to illegals also shows that a "temporary" worker program is unrealistic because it would result in hundreds of thousands of permanent additions to the U.S. population each year, exactly what such a program is supposed to avoid.

* Overall, immigrant mothers are much less educated than native mothers. In 2002, 39 percent of immigrant mothers lacked a high school education, compared to 17 percent of native mothers. And immigrants now account for 41 percent of births to mothers without a high school degree.

* The dramatic growth in births to immigrants has been accompanied by a decline in diversity. In 1970, the top country for immigrant births -- Mexico -- accounted for 24 percent of births to immigrants, by 2002 it was 45 percent.

* As a share of all births in the country, Mexican immigrants accounted for one in 10 births in 2002. No single foreign country has ever accounted for such a large share of births.


* In 2002, births to Hispanic immigrants accounted for 59 percent of all births to immigrant mothers. No single cultural/linguistic group has ever accounted for such a large share of births to immigrants.

* The states with the most dramatic increase in births to immigrants in the last decade are Georgia, North Carolina, Nevada, Nebraska, Arkansas, Arizona, Tennessee, Minnesota, Colorado, Delaware, Virginia, and Maryland

* Immigrants account for such a large percentage of births because they have somewhat higher fertility and are more likely to be in their reproductive years than natives. However, the difference with natives is not large enough to significantly affect the nation's overall age structure.

* Immigrants who have arrived in the last two decades plus all of their U.S.-born children have only reduced the average age in the United States from 37 to 36 years.

* Looking at the working age share (15 to 64) of the population also shows little effect from immigration. With or without post-1980 immigrants and their U.S.-born children, 66 percent of the population is of working age.

* While immigration has little effect on the nation's age structure, new immigrants (legal and illegal) plus births to immigrants add some 2.3 million people to the nation's population each year, making for a much larger overall population.
Introduction
It is difficult to imagine a government program that has a more profound impact on society than immigration. Large numbers of immigrants and their descendants cannot help but shape the destiny of the country in which they settle. (The terms "immigrant" and "foreign born" are used synonymously in this report.) Even after the original immigrant dies or returns home, his children and descendants will continue to exert a powerful influence on their new country's demographic, political, economic, and cultural life. Examining births to immigrants is therefore important, because it is a way of measuring the scale of immigration and its impact on American society. This is especially true because the U.S. government has chosen to award American citizenship to all persons born in the United States, including those born to temporary visitors or even illegal aliens. As citizens, it seems almost certain that the vast majority of these children will live in America.

Why Study Immigrant Births?
Public Expenditures on Children. All levels of government provide services to children. Therefore, it is necessary to understand the effect of immigration policy on the number of children being born in the United States in order to better anticipate spending on services, especially public schools. Children from immigrant families may also have needs that are different from those of children from native families. Given the large share of births to immigrants, how these children integrate into American society is critically important to the future of the country. Thus a better understanding of immigration's impact on births is necessary so that government may better meet the needs of these children.

Assimilating the Children of Immigrants. There are now more than 30 million immigrants living in the country. It is sometimes suggested that because immigrants are now so numerous it lowers their interaction with natives and reduces their need to integrate fully into American society. Advocates of high immigration often respond that immigrants account for a smaller share of the population today than during the peak of the last great wave of immigration, yet those immigrants integrated successfully. These advocates seem to be saying that the relative sizes of the immigrant and native population matter, but we have not reached the level of the last great wave, so there is little reason to worry.

Of course, given the enormous changes in the world, it is not clear that comparing current immigration with that of a century ago makes sense. Nor is it clear that the very peak level of immigration, which itself was unusual in American history, is the best point of comparison. Nonetheless, it is true that at the very peak of the last great wave in 1910, the foreign born were a larger share of the total population -- about 15 percent versus 12 percent today. However, examining births to immigrants is relevant to the assimilation debate because it is another way of measuring the scale of immigration and its impact on American society.

Although children born to immigrants are by definition natives, the number and share they represent of all births may have some bearing on how they assimilate. After all, if births to immigrants comprise a very large share of all births, then children from immigrant families may tend to interact primarily with each other, having little contact with the children of natives. As a result, foreign cultural norms, values, and even identities may be dominant among these children. Of course, the fact that a very large share of children may come from immigrant families does not necessarily prove that assimilation will be less complete, since assimilation is a multifaceted and complex process. But the issue of births to immigrants certainly is germane to the debate over the likely course of assimilation.

Research on the Second Generation. The changing share of immigrant births is important because it may help us to better understand how things are changing for the children of immigrants. Researchers often examine the assimilation of adults who had immigrant parents, referred to as second-generation Americans. But the environment in which such individuals grew up may have fundamentally changed. For example, an American born three decades age to immigrant parents was raised in a country where only about one out of 20 U.S.-born children had a foreign-born mother compared to one in four today. The situation for the children of Mexican immigrants is even more striking. In 1970, 54,000 children were born to Mexican immigrant mothers and they accounted for 1.5 percent of all births. In 2002, 408,000 children were born to Mexican immigrant mothers, accounting for 10.1 percent of all births. This change likely will have significant impact on the childhood experience for these children. A person born to immigrants 30 years ago may have grown up with relatively very little contact with other children whose mothers came from the same country. But given the enormous growth in numbers, a child born to an immigrant today may have a very different sense of identity. We at least need to be aware of how things have changed when thinking about the experiences of second-generation Americans.

Characteristics of Those Having Children. Another reason to examine births to immigrants is that it provides some insight into the environment that the children of immigrants are being born into. For example, data are available on the education level of each child's mother. Education is important because it is the single best indicator of income and overall socio-economic status. Parental education levels are also a good predictor of how much education the child will ultimately obtain. Thus, examining characteristics such as education provides important clues to the life prospects of these children, and how they may differ from those born to native mothers.


This article continues just google it.


Just because somebody writes something, then publishes it on the web, does not mean that it is all true.

[blue]

I cant possibly be the only poster in this thread that has actually read the AZ law.

[Bonny]

I live near a town that had a cosier meat packing plant. There was a raid & they rounded up the immagrants mostly Mexicans. The Jews had hired illegal immagrants & besides under age children of the Mexican community were working at the plant. The Jewish man that was responsible for this is going to prison & I hope they throw the book at him. The immagrants have been sent back to Mexcio at our expense. There were problems with killings, lots of births, breaking the law, robbery, you name it, it happened. The Mexicans are hard working people they do jobs that no one else wants to do. Some of the legals are still here. The cosier meat packing plant has reopened under new management. If they have their green cards & are here legally I have no problem with it. But when they are here I hope they pay them a good wage so they can live the American dream & not drain the system. It is like slave labor other wise. I got into it with a Mexican lady at Wal Mart about a year ago. She purchased hot dogs that were suppose to be on sale & she had other hot dogs that weren't. She accused the clerk of cheating her & calling her a bad name. I was standing in line & watched it all go down. She got real loud with the clerk. I spoke up & told her if you don't like it here go back to where you came from! It really pissed me off! She left the clerk alone, left me alone, & headed for the service counter. This is the kind of stuff that turns you against people.:mad:

[Lady's Human]

I think you missed a couple races H. Schickelgruber, but it was a good try.

[cassiesmom]

I have a friend who used to be the evening kitchen manager at a restaurant. Every now and again the INS would come in and whisk away his employees who were not in the country legally. They would mostly have used someone else's Social Security number and/or card as proof of eligibility to work. Sometimes the restaurant would lose a third of the kitchen staff and have to finish the shift without them.

[RICHARD]

The one thing that jerks my chain is the morons who march and protest about the RULES.

While I do not advocate the random "Ze Papers, Please" rousting of citizens, there has to be something in place, a law?, that will at least try and deter the people who do come into the country illegally.

There are buttwipes in every group.

The key is to hate just one a day.

It makes life easier and you aren't overwhelmed with more irritation that you can handle?:confused::eek:;)

[cassiesmom]

Here's a piece from "60 Minutes" about an irrigation canal in California that is being used by Mexican citizens to enter the U.S. illegally. It's so unsafe to cross that it has resulted in numerous drowning deaths. Some people say that measures should be instituted to make the canal safer to cross; others say that isn't the point.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6453537n&tag=contentMain;contentBody

[wombat2u2004]

Here's a piece from "60 Minutes" about an irrigation canal in California that is being used by Mexican citizens to enter the U.S. illegally. It's so unsafe to cross that it has resulted in numerous drowning deaths. Some people say that measures should be instituted to make the canal safer to cross; others say that isn't the point.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6453537n&tag=contentMain;contentBody

Oh this is terrible.
There must be something that can be done, either by the Federal Govt. or State Govt's. I'm sure if a few of them got their heads together, they could figure out something that will work.
What ever happened to that fence thingy that Bush had going a couple of years ago ???

[pomtzu]

What ever happened to that fence thingy that Bush had going a couple of years ago ???

I don't think that a fence would deter anyone. I was thinking of something on the order of the Berlin Wall. :p

[lvpets2002]

:) Oh they would just figure out how to climb over or under.. :D
I don't think that a fence would deter anyone. I was thinking of something on the order of the Berlin Wall. :p

[Cataholic]

I live near a town that had a cosier meat packing plant. There was a raid & they rounded up the immagrants mostly Mexicans. The Jews had hired illegal immagrants & besides under age children of the Mexican community were working at the plant. The Jewish man that was responsible for this is going to prison & I hope they throw the book at him. The immagrants have been sent back to Mexcio at our expense. There were problems with killings, lots of births, breaking the law, robbery, you name it, it happened. The Mexicans are hard working people they do jobs that no one else wants to do. Some of the legals are still here. The cosier meat packing plant has reopened under new management. If they have their green cards & are here legally I have no problem with it. But when they are here I hope they pay them a good wage so they can live the American dream & not drain the system. It is like slave labor other wise. I got into it with a Mexican lady at Wal Mart about a year ago. She purchased hot dogs that were suppose to be on sale & she had other hot dogs that weren't. She accused the clerk of cheating her & calling her a bad name. I was standing in line & watched it all go down. She got real loud with the clerk. I spoke up & told her if you don't like it here go back to where you came from! It really pissed me off! She left the clerk alone, left me alone, & headed for the service counter. This is the kind of stuff that turns you against people.:mad:

I don't know you, and while I think I have seen your posts, I can't distinguish you from Adam. From this post alone, though, you sound nice and bigoty.

[caseysmom]

I don't know you, and while I think I have seen your posts, I can't distinguish you from Adam. From this post alone, though, you sound nice and bigoty.

Ya think???

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Oh this is terrible.
There must be something that can be done, either by the Federal Govt. or State Govt's. I'm sure if a few of them got their heads together, they could figure out something that will work.
What ever happened to that fence thingy that Bush had going a couple of years ago ???

It stopped when it got to Arizona which is why they are having lots more trouble with illegals now. :love:

[wombat2u2004]

:) Oh they would just figure out how to climb over or under.. :D

Yeah, but you could put signs up saying "Please do not climb or dig under fence" :cool:

[wombat2u2004]

Ya think???

;)

[Bonny]

Cataholic & Caseysmom, I live in the real world. DO YOU?

[Alysser]

Cataholic & Caseysmom, I live in the real world. DO YOU?

Yeah, they actually do. They realize that the thoughts like the ones expressed in your post are the reason why there's still war going on in the world. ;)

[caseysmom]

Yeah, they actually do. They realize that the thoughts like the ones expressed in your post are the reason why there's still war going on in the world. ;)


Thanks hon. Yes I do live in the real world where there are wierdos and good people in all races of people.

[Lady's Human]

Cataholic & Caseysmom, I live in the real world. DO YOU?

What you describe is your perception of reality. Reality may in fact be something completely different, especially when the veneer of racism is removed.

How do you know they are Mexicans? Just because they don't have white skin and speak with a hispanic accent doesn't make them Mexican.

[kokopup]

According to the 60 Minutes segment the reason there is an increase in drownings in the canal is because of the border fence. They are saying the fence is doing to good a job and now the canal is the only section available for crossing. I guess the fence needs to extend down the canal also.

[RICHARD]

What you describe is your perception of reality. Reality may in fact be something completely different, especially when the veneer of racism is removed.

How do you know they are Mexicans? Just because they don't have white skin and speak with a hispanic accent doesn't make them Mexican.

You have a whole southern hemisphere of them pesky Spanish speakers!;)


The Mex government is trying to keep the Central Ams from coming up and supplanting the locals - who lose jobs to undocumented workers from CentAm and the countries at the top of SouAm - sound familiar?

There is no simple answer to this problem.

The first thing that needs to happen is for people to ditch the racism/bigotry and work towards laws that are just and fair.

By the same token?

We have to tell the illegals that the free ride is over.

Being a 'guero' I get to see both sides of the arguement.

There are people here illegally that laugh at system that allows them free access to many of the programs that help them stay here in the States.

They really tick me off and I run into them often. Those are the people who do not appreciate MY country and should not be given the right to enjoy it.

--------

This is a tough issue and people have to chill out or toughen up.

There is a place stuck right in the middle that will take care of the whole situation.

It's up to everyone to take that first step forward.

[kokopup]

Lady's Human


How do you know they are Mexicans? Just because they don't have white skin and speak with a hispanic accent doesn't make them Mexican.

Mexico is just a conduit for illegals. A very large portion of the illegals that make it to the southeast are from Honduras, Nicaragua, El Salvador or Guatemala but all come through Mexico. I was able to speak with a large group that were doing construction next door, a few years back, and the entire construction group was from Guatemala. There have been several drownings at a State Park where I spend a lot of time. On any given Sunday the beaches at the park will have Hispanic's there in the thousands. All of the drownings were illegals and none were from Mexico. Central American's particularly those from Honduras and Nicaragua are easy to identify because they are very small people compared to those from Mexico.

[wombat2u2004]

How do you know they are Mexicans?

They wear sombreros ???

[RICHARD]

They wear sombreros ???

Just because you have a Barrier Reef and sharks guarding your borders doesn't mean you have be a smart arse...:D:eek::p;)

[wombat2u2004]

Just because you have a Barrier Reef and sharks guarding your borders doesn't mean you have be a smart arse...:D:eek::p;)

Yep.....we have to keep our sharks fed with prime illegal immigrants. :cool:

[Bonny]

Oh, By the way it is not only the Mexicans coming across the border but DRUGS. DRUGS for you, your children, parents, grandparents, aunties, & uncles, cousins, grandkids, mother in laws, father in laws, etc. It is Mexicans that were brought here illeagally by the Jews that ran the packing plant. It was Mexicans that were sent back to Mexico. Call them Hispancis if you want to be politcally correct.

[Lady's Human]

Drugs come into the US by many routes, what's your point?

And again, how do you know they were mexican?

Where do the Masons, Blacks and Illuminati come into your argument?

[Cataholic]

Cataholic & Caseysmom, I live in the real world. DO YOU?

My world is so real it is scary at times. I strive every day to lay aside the prejudices, the hate, the bigotry, the "isms". It is hard work, but it is worthwhile. I do not refer to people by their ethnic or religious ties, their body shapes, colours, disabilities, etc. They are people. They live and they die and do a whole lot of other stuff inbetween. Maybe some of it is bad, good or immaterial. My job is to police myself and my young son, and our ever growing populus of four legged companions. Frankly, I don't have time to do much else. I am not PC, I call a spade a spade, and I call you out on your bigotted post. Usually, bigotry is born of fear and ignorance. Perhaps you are different. As I said, I don't know you from Adam.

[lizbud]

I read where Arizona is getting rid of any teacher with an accent.:confused:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/answer-sheet/teachers/heavily-accented-teachers-remo.html

[Karen]

Racism is not allowed on Pet Talk, people, remember. One can discuss the issue of immigration without painting entire groups of people with a negative light.

[Bonny]

Lady's, Catholic, I don't know either of you. So that makes us even. We had the biggest raid in US history in our area & I was sharing the facts with all of you. Then you come along & call me a bigot The drugs come from this months National Geographic & was is now going on in Mexico. I was sharing that with you. This discussion is now closed.

Wombat, They don't wear somberos anymore. They are hot & heavy hats, the straw hats are in.;)

[Karen]

See the PM I sent you, please.

[Bonny]

Karen, I did!

[caseysmom]

Racism is not allowed on Pet Talk, people, remember. One can discuss the issue of immigration without painting entire groups of people with a negative light.

Thank you Karen, unfortunately racism is alive and well out in the real world:(

[Husky_mom]

They don't wear somberos anymore. They are hot & heavy hats, the straw hats are in.;)

and apparently you know me very well.. I´m MEXICAN.. and even if I weren´t I do not like your remarks.. and that´s all I am gonna say to you as I don´t have the necessity of being rude and I have much more respect for others..bye

[momoffuzzyfaces]

Yeah, but you could put signs up saying "Please do not climb or dig under fence" :cool:

Naw, that wouldn't work unless you could post it in every language known to man. Not all people know English after all. :love:

[Lady's Human]

Lady's, Catholic, I don't know either of you. So that makes us even. We had the biggest raid in US history in our area & I was sharing the facts with all of you. Then you come along & call me a bigot The drugs come from this months National Geographic & was is now going on in Mexico. I was sharing that with you. This discussion is now closed.


The religion of the people hiring your local illegals has absolutely nothing to do with the issues. It's a classic bigoted slam. Like Cataholic, I call a spade a spade, though I do temper my language most of the time in deference to the Mayor.

Drugs come in from many routes. Canada, Mexico, Providence, RI, any seaport with a decent sized container terminal will do, and there's still the ever popular drug mule route for the more expensive drugs. It isn't a Mexican problem, it's a national problem in the US, and a region wide issue as a whole.

[Bonny]

One more time. It is a religious issue. It was a Kosher Meat Packing Plant. I will tell you what they do to make the meat Kosher. It is part of their religion. They slit of the throat of the cattle & let them bleed out naturally. They say special prayers. But in the mean time they are hiring illegals, have Hispanic children working in the plant, dumping sewage into local streams, you name it they did it. They were dishonest & didn't obey the law & got caught.

[caseysmom]

I still don't understand what the religion had to do with it a business hiring illegals is a business hiring illegals. If it was some white guys making paper cups would you have said, some white guys making paper cups?

[Cataholic]

I still don't understand what the religion had to do with it a business hiring illegals is a business hiring illegals. If it was some white guys making paper cups would you have said, some white guys making paper cups?

Nope. It would be some white breads, or crackers, making paper cups. Those dern methodists!

[Lady's Human]

No, because that wouldn't bring the same special tinge to the issue that the plant owners being "jews" does.

Just because it's a Kosher slaughterhouse doesn't mean that the owners are Jewish.

The plant I worked for after I got out of the Army made Kosher products......and the owners were an Irish Catholic family.

(Oops, there I go, bringing the Catholics into this! :p)

[caseysmom]

One more time. It is a religious issue. It was a Kosher Meat Packing Plant. I will tell you what they do to make the meat Kosher. It is part of their religion. They slit of the throat of the cattle & let them bleed out naturally. They say special prayers. But in the mean time they are hiring illegals, have Hispanic children working in the plant, dumping sewage into local streams, you name it they did it. They were dishonest & didn't obey the law & got caught.

You seem to be offended by how Kosher meat is slaughtered, have you ever been to a good ole all american slaughterhouse?

[Cataholic]

No, because that wouldn't bring the same special tinge to the issue that the plant owners being "jews" does.

Just because it's a Kosher slaughterhouse doesn't mean that the owners are Jewish.

The plant I worked for after I got out of the Army made Kosher products......and the owners were an Irish Catholic family.

(Oops, there I go, bringing the Catholics into this! :p)

Those dern Catholics! LOL.

[phesina]

No, because that wouldn't bring the same special tinge to the issue that the plant owners being "jews" does.

Just because it's a Kosher slaughterhouse doesn't mean that the owners are Jewish.

The plant I worked for after I got out of the Army made Kosher products......and the owners were an Irish Catholic family.

(Oops, there I go, bringing the Catholics into this! :p)

... and those IRISH... we all know what THEY'RE like!

[lizbud]

... and those IRISH... we all know what THEY'RE like!


Hey now, don't go trashing the Irish or I'll be very upset.:D

[Bonny]

I would say the white guys making paper cups. Yes! How would I describe them Honkies, Kringos, Infidals. I am Catholic too. You could say those Germans, Irish, Canadians, French, Lutherans, Spanish. The Amish call us the English around here. I guess what gets me about the whole Jewish/Hispanic thing is one group of people taking advantage of another & to me treating them like slaves & getting by so many years with this. The churches around this area have taken up collections, to send to the Mexican/Hispanic families that were sent back to Mexico. We supported the families with food, & other needs while the illegal workers were sent off to jail. Gods Chosen People didn't left a hand through all this, it was left to the Christians. Not all Jewish Communities are like this but this one knew what they were doing to the Mexicans/Hispanics & it was wrong.

[caseysmom]

To quote a wise pettalker...."just put down the shovel"

[Bonny]

Caseysmom, Spoken By A True Californian

[RICHARD]

I am going to step back and laugh.

You all are worried about some brown people that have shown up in the country. For or against? I have no problem with either side, it's all opinion.


I would just like to ask you all to pay attention to the other "alien problem" we are having.


I COULD toss out a cheesy Star Wars/alien joke and I will.....


Does anyone remember the Sand People on Tattooine?:rolleyes:

-----------------------------

WE HAVE TO seal our border to the south.

One interesting thing that I noticed before and some people, smarter than I, have commented on?

Arabs and some Latinos look almost identical in their physical characteristics.

There is a concern that some middle eastern terrorists/idiots will try to sneak into Mexico and just walk across the border to get in, undetected.

Plug these words into your search engine-terrorists, mexico, sneak- the columns/stories are a few years old, but, who ever said these morons were impatient?

-------------------------


So, as it goes on Tattooine, it goes on the planet Earth. Why are people out in the desert so off the hook?:confused::rolleyes::mad:

I will allow you all to observe Cinco De Mayo tomorrow.

Huskymom,
Eres la mas chula, hermana.:);)



My favorite racist!

http://lowdownblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/mark-martin.jpg

[caseysmom]

Caseysmom, Spoken By A True Californian

I could say a lot of things that stereotype the midwest but I know many lovely people form there and besides they woudn't be true they would just be stereotypes which you are so fond of...put down your shovel while you are not too far in the hole.

[RICHARD]

Just want to remind everyone that there is nothing "Happy" about the Cinco De Mayo.

It's not Mexican Independence Day- It's the anny of the Battle of Puebla.

War is never 'happy'.:o

[Karen]

Just want to remind everyone that there is nothing "Happy" about the Cinco De Mayo.

It's not Mexican Independence Day- It's the anny of the Battle of Puebla.

War is never 'happy'.:o

Then why do retail establishments, especially "Mexican" restaurants, have big "celebrate Cinco de Mayo with us!" with balloons, and flowers and silly sombrero hats for the staff?

[Husky_mom]

never miss a chance to celebrate.. even if it´s for a not so happy reason..

we even have a "Taco Day".. yeah.. to celebrate.. tacos.. lol

[Cataholic]

never miss a chance to celebrate.. even if it´s for a not so happy reason..

we even have a "Taco Day".. yeah.. to celebrate.. tacos.. lol

Well, if it is okay with you, tonight, I toast you and Richard. However, it will not be a margarita...just white wine. :)

[RICHARD]

Cat and Husky,

You are correct, never pass up a chance to party!:D

Karen,

5 de 5, like St. Patty's Day, are those 'kinda' holidays?

It's kinda a celebration and a reason to go crazy.

I don't really care for the 'debauchery' of either.

Hey, go out and drink, have a good time, but don't get tossed in jail/kill a pedestrian/act stupid/burn the house down/beat your spouse....

I could be working at the moment, but the boss says "end of the day" at 1 o'clock and a cooler of beer shows up in the break room?

ME?

I want to work. Drinking beer at 1 p.m. and taking the chance of being pulled over as I stumble home, won't help me out?;):rolleyes:

As I get older I get more cynical in my outlook of life.

Every store owner dreams of a days like today. "Hey, I'll get a mariachi band and hand out sombreros and give out free tacos at the (used car) lot to bring in business!

That's just capitialism. I can handle that. It's just the inability of people-and the sponsors of sales/events tied to the date - to take a look at WHY they are partying.

Having to go to work on March 18th, hungover and trying to pass off the awkward 5 minutes that you spent with your co-worker in the parking lot is common place.

My only gripe is that people go nuts and use it as a reason to be irresponsible.;)

---------

Me?

I'll drink a Mexican beer, then an American beer tonight. I'll be safe at home and if I happen to have any kind of accident?

I only have myself to blame.:)


The Battle of Puebla is a Mexican military victory that should be celebrated.
We/They were always on the toe end of the boot when it came to wars.;)

If you see the mosaic/renderings of the battle, you will see and recognize the romantification of the event.

Brave young men, holding up standards in the face of enenmy gunfire!

There is a line about "history being written by the victors", and while not the "reality" version of the event, Who's gonna argue? ;)


--------

The BoP was a bunch of outnumbered Mexicans that kicked the larger and more organized French Army's fesses.

A win is a win?:rolleyes:;)


My only 'thing' is that people do not realize why they are drinking.

---------


One of the local TV stations will go to a Mex bar/restaurant and talk to a drunk blonde girl in a sombrero, who has on a half shirt, no bra and is alternating cerveza and shots of tequila while yelling, "Happeeee Shinco De Maaaayoooooooo!!!!"

The reporter will ask her, "Do you know the meaning of the CoC?"

She'll lean in to make sure the microphone will hear her and say to the talking head, "You have pretty eyes...."

Rock on!:D

[Marigold2]

When one reports facts is it bigotry? If five Russians break into a home and murder a family is it bigotry to say they are Russian? What if they were five Germans or five Irish or five Jews or blacks or French? It is not a made up story, one is not picking on a particular part of society one is simply reporting a fact. People are who they are and they did a certain deed good or bad.
If we say five Russians saved a boy from drowning is it any different to mention that they are Russian? Are we profiling here as well? Are we saying the rest of the worlds people can’t swim or would not jump in to save someone?
Reporting the facts good and bad from each part of the world and each type of people is important it connects us to each other and reminds us that certain people have different cultures, we might not agree or understand but regardless they are mostly proud of themselves and what it means to be thought of as Jewish, or Christian, or Mexican, Swiss, Dutch, Turkish.
Jewish people are perhaps the best educated in the world. So am I being a bigot against all other people saying they are not educated?
And what is with Dave Chappell? Oh my goodness gosh. Have you heard that man use the ni&&er word, over and over and over again he makes fun of blacks. Who is he, why he is a black man who is so funny he makes you pee in your pants from laughing. He makes fun of his fellow black men, we laugh because there is truth in what he says. The best jokes do have truth in them. Yet no one calls him a racist. He is a really funny man who uses the F word a lot. You have to have a really great sense of humor to watch him and an open mind. Black people love him, they laugh at themselves which is great, everyone should be able to laugh at themselves.
Same with George Lopez he makes some much fun of his own race. “Mexicans love golf you know, any time they can hit something white they love it.” That is really funny.
He makes me laugh. Good guy.
Oh and Caseysmom, you are on my ignore list. Life is good.
I wish everyone a happy holiday today, I am going to have a nice drink with hubby.


I don't know you, and while I think I have seen your posts, I can't distinguish you from Adam. From this post alone, though, you sound nice and bigoty.

[wombat2u2004]

Then why do retail establishments, especially "Mexican" restaurants, have big "celebrate Cinco de Mayo with us!" with balloons, and flowers and silly sombrero hats for the staff?

See !!! I was right. They DO all wear sombreros. :D

[Marigold2]

Wombat, your quote of the people downunder is bigoty. Shame on you for making fun of the people of Australia. Shame, shame, shame.

See !!! I was right. They DO all wear sombreros. :D

[wombat2u2004]

Wombat, your quote of the people downunder is bigoty. Shame on you for making fun of the people of Australia. Shame, shame, shame.

I'm sorry Monica. I didn't mean it. :D
But, I guess if being a bigot and a racist is necessary to protect ones culture.....then so be it. ;)

[caseysmom]

[Oh and Caseysmom, you are on my ignore list. Life is good]

Your breaking my heart....

[Bonny]

Caseysmom, You have broken my heart. I came on here thinking it was open to discussions & opinions. You & your friends shot me down. BANG! This is a free country, with freedom of speech. It doesn't seem to be that way here. Being negative & putting down someone just because they don't fit your line of thought is not a postive way to live life. I work with people from all over the world & have to be a good listener. I may not agree with what they say (you say) but I take it in & learn from it. My grammar may not fit your part of the world but it does not make me a bigot. :confused:

Wombat, & Marigold hang in there life is a ball & keep on dancing. :cool:

[Lady's Human]

Freedom of Speech is a requirement of the government, not private parties. The GOVERNMENT cannot censor your speech. Private parties are more than able to express their displeasure with what you say.

Try removing the plank from your eye. It makes it easier to see.

[Bonny]

Lady's Human, Your breaking my heart too. You need to be a less bias & a better listener. You walk the plank for that one.

[wombat2u2004]

Has anybody posting in this thread actually read SB 1070?

Yep....I have.
I can't see any reason why that Bill shouldn't be enacted. Nobody on this thread so far has come up with any solution to the problem. At least SOMETHING has been thought up by the State of Arizona....and I hope the Bill passes....I mean SOMETHING has to be done....right ???

And a couple of ladies come into this thread and voice their opinions about illegal immigration, and they are accused of racism, bigotry, comparing people to flies and heaps else. Funny that...eh ??? I've read all of the posts so far, and those two ladies seem to be the only ones here that can see a problem that is going to become worse and worse, and probably not end.

On top of all of this, you have a country that is steeped in unemployment, yet you have half a squillion illegals in the country working. You have a toppling social security and hospital system that is used and abused by illegals and your very own legals because they can't find work.
What is this ??? USA self destruct mode ???

Bonny and Marigold have both displayed to me so far that they have the country's wellbeing at heart.....the rest of you are knocking them down for that ????

Ok, I've had my say (and I'm not wearing my BS constitutional hat).

[caseysmom]

They are all over the place like flies, even here in upper Ohio they work in the nursery not far from where I live.
It's a disgrace to every hard working legal immigrent who came here and had to do all the paperwork and follow all the rules.
What is the problem with shooting them at the boarder with a tazer and then sending their illegal rear ends back to wench they came from?
Or sending them to jail? After all they did break the law!
And while we are at it lets revoke the anker baby crap already. If the baby is born here fine, it can stay but mom and dad, grandma and 15 cousins who don't speak English go home already. Baby can be adopted out.

Wom...marigold said flies...nobody is falsly accusing her of saying flies...look at the first sentence. If some don't find that imflammatory then I strongly disagree and that is my right. I could care less if some bigots want to put me on ignore I will fight for equality for all people.

[wombat2u2004]

Wom...marigold said flies...nobody is falsly accusing her of saying flies...look at the first sentence. If some don't find that imflammatory then I strongly disagree and that is my right. I could care less if some bigots want to put me on ignore I will fight for equality for all people.

It is an EXPRESSION that people use...."They are swarming around us like flies"..."They are dropping like flies"...."It's raining cats and dogs"
If you take offence at that (and of course it is your right), then you are
nit-picking.

[caseysmom]

Thats your opinion. That taken along with all of the other remarks makes a pretty ugly picture in my opinion.

[Bonny]

I guess this country USA is going to have to roll with the punches & yes things aren't good here. The economy of New Mexico, has anyone looked at that? I know churches are pitching in & have set up workshops not sweat shops so the people in Mexico & other countries in Central America can make a living. Tourism is out right now because of the dangers to anyone going down their & being kidnapped& held for ransom. Tourism is a big catch all & brings money in for sure & Central America is a unique & beautiful part of the world. During the winter we get a lot of our fruits & veggies from Guatemala. I guess they can pass the Bill & hopefully they can get things to workout. There are always so many conflicts nothing is simple anymore.

[kokopup]

Before we started having the major influx of illegals we had thousands of seasonal legal workers that came to work the various crops that are harvested in Central Alabama. These workers were on work Visa's and you had the same groups returning year after year. They had special programs in the churches for the Children of the workers. I do not know what impact the illegal workers may have had on these groups that were coming yearly legally. If I had to guess I would say it probably had a negative impact, though it is Just my guess. A big part of this regions economy is tied to Peaches and Strawberries
and I know that the workers are still needed , I'm just not sure that the illegal
influx has not displaces the one's coming legally.

[wombat2u2004]

Thats your opinion. That taken along with all of the other remarks makes a pretty ugly picture in my opinion.

That's ugly ???
I tell ya what's ugly...the drugs that are killing your kids....the illegals that take your jobs and whatever else they can get their hands on....the crime that these people bring with them.
Apathy is not to be applauded.....ACTION to solve these problems is.

[wombat2u2004]

I guess this country USA is going to have to roll with the punches & yes things aren't good here. The economy of New Mexico, has anyone looked at that? I know churches are pitching in & have set up workshops not sweat shops so the people in Mexico & other countries in Central America can make a living. Tourism is out right now because of the dangers to anyone going down their & being kidnapped& held for ransom. Tourism is a big catch all & brings money in for sure & Central America is a unique & beautiful part of the world. During the winter we get a lot of our fruits & veggies from Guatemala. I guess they can pass the Bill & hopefully they can get things to workout. There are always so many conflicts nothing is simple anymore.

Well yeah !!! It's all give and take....right ??? You all give...and they all take.
I guess all the "happy smiling people" and the "tree huggers" on this thread may one day finally open their eyes when the problem directly affects their way of life. ;)

[Bonny]

Wombat, I have a solution to the problem. All the lazy couch potato American kids that need exercise can get out there in the fresh air & pick the strawberries, peaches, apples, etc. They can even eat something good while they are working. I worked on my uncles truck farm for 5 summers picking strawberries & sweetcorn. I learned to work by God & am still a good worker to this day. We don't need immagrants we have a whole crop of kids that don't know what work is. Problem Solved!!! I'am now waiting for the happy smilling peoplem, tree huggers to attack me. Watch out I have my shovel & know how to use it.

[Pembroke_Corgi]

I think politicians love to get people riled up about all the "illegals" so they have scapegoats who have no rights or recourse. They're stealing jobs? :rolleyes: That is completely ridiculous. It's more like these people are being exploited by others by working for next to nothing because that's the only option available to them.

I think the "Lurn to talk American" mind-set is just thinly veiled racism.

[Bonny]

thinly veiled racism must of been when my grandparents came from Europe & had learn to speak English too.

[wombat2u2004]

Racism ??? So far no-one has ever defined that word other than it being exclusively a word that we in the western world are accused of.

[cassiesmom]

According to the 60 Minutes segment the reason there is an increase in drownings in the canal is because of the border fence. They are saying the fence is doing to good a job and now the canal is the only section available for crossing. I guess the fence needs to extend down the canal also.

I just watched the piece again. It's definitely a problem. Do they make it safer, knowing that people are going to try to cross, and they might drown? Or do they leave it as is, since making it safer might encourage even more people to try to cross, entering the U.S. illegally? My question is, if they can't extend the fencing, can they improve the supervision on the canal? Would it help to light it better and have people watching more closely who could rescue those who get into trouble while trying to cross?

[wombat2u2004]

Wombat, I have a solution to the problem. All the lazy couch potato American kids that need exercise can get out there in the fresh air & pick the strawberries, peaches, apples, etc. They can even eat something good while they are working.

Too late mate. Congress has just passed the 896th Amendment stating
"No son or daughter or hermaphrodite shall be required to harvest fruit if it is reasonable to assume that their time is better spent at McDonalds" :p

[caseysmom]

Racism could be defined as believing one race of people are not human, as in referring to them as flies.

[wombat2u2004]

I just watched the piece again. It's definitely a problem. Do they make it safer, knowing that people are going to try to cross, and they might drown? Or do they leave it as is, since making it safer might encourage even more people to try to cross, entering the U.S. illegally? My question is, if they can't extend the fencing, can they improve the supervision on the canal? Would it help to light it better and have people watching more closely who could rescue those who get into trouble while trying to cross?

I think they should be helped across. And as soon as get out of the water, they should be presented with a Mouseketeers Certificate (let's not forget the Mickey Mouse ears to).

[wombat2u2004]

Racism could be defined as believing one race of people are not human, as in referring to them as flies.

How about locusts then ??? :p

[Bonny]

Caseysmom, You just knocked my socks off & caused me to drop my shovel. I love your humor. :)

[caseysmom]

Caseysmom, You just knocked my socks off & caused me to drop my shovel. I love your humor. :)

You find racism to be funny?

[RICHARD]

All of you have to leave the U.S. before May 15th.

Everyone that is not a indige.

I am going to throw down in 3,2,1.....


----------

I am sure many of your have sections of immigrants that live in your hometown.

Here in SFV there are tons of people who come into the hood and wreck it.

I am not talking about JUST 'MEXICANS'.

I have seen MANY go to pot, not with just Mexican immies, but a whole host of nationalities.


North Hollywood is a Armenian fave, the Filipinos favor Panorana City, there is a huge Thai population in the fringe of Lost Angeles and you have the rest.

NOT ALL ARE meatheaded people out to ruin a great chance to live in a pretty good area of the country, but...

In recent years you pick up and read about a crime/criminal ring that was busted here and you can tell WHO the people ar by the crime.

The little Filipino punks are into car theft and gangs.
They steal imports to part out and sell.

Armenians have found a lucrative business in fleecing Medicare.
And the Armos are notorious for being heavy handed when dealing with each other. A few weeks ago one an Armo shot and killed 4 people in a restaurant.

The Koreans have opened up liquor stores in black neighborhoods and charge outrageous prices for items.

The local store changed ownership and I recently paid 1.00 for a 6 ounce box of choco milk, so much for keeping the black man down?:confused::rolleyes:

At around 6 p.m. every day you see the Mexican woman waiting for the buses that run along Sunset Blvd. They are traveling home after working in the Malibu/Beverly Hills/West Hollywood areas for the rich folks that live in the hills....


At the risk of offending some of you?


STOP WORRYING ABOUT HUMAN RIGHTS.

If you want to help out the poor people at risk of being deported for being here illegally? Let's get everyone here LEGALLY or begin to go thru the process of making them legal. THAT way we don't have to keep worrying about Juan Valdez sneaking his burro over the border, with good Columbian coffee.

Everyone has the RIGHT TO BE HUMAN and the responsibility to "Portarse Bien".

We have to get around the nudge, nudge, wink, wink attitude that we have toward people HERE ILLEGALLY.

Don't get me wrong.

I love my country and have had the spectacular privilege of seeing what is poverty just next door in Mexico.

Privilege?

Am I crazy?

Go find a 4-5 person family living in squalor, in a house made of cardboard and 2x4s.

Floor of mud, People peeing and crapping in a stream that serves as the bath, toilet and dump.

----------

I do know why people take the chance of drowning in an effing irrigation ditch or dehydrated and dying in the Southwest deserts after some AH takes their money with a promise of getting them to America with papers?

Here's a challenge?

Take a step over the line and put yourself in the shoes of those you have issue/compassion with.

Move into a one car garage for 6 months. Wash your clothes in a tub and hang them to dry on a makeshift clothesline, Go to the local agency and try to get beds for the kids because they sleep atop mats on concrete floors.

Here's a novel one?

Put an makeshift out house in the corner of the yard.

By 'allowing' people to live her illegally, we push them farther into the outskirts of what is decent and righteous for everyone.

-----------

"Hey, I can stay here living like an animal and no one will bug me!"

There is enough compassion on the planet for everyone, I dole mine out compassionately.

I have to.

I get tired of seeing some of "my people" being allowed to live like animals, because they are not forced to abide by some simple rules.


I do appreciate the people that have taken up for them.

I also do appreciate the people who hold the opposing opinion.

Don't sell any race short, But, do not allow us to come up short by not making 'us' follow the rules.

I have the ability to straddle this topic and am able to lift up a leg and taunt either side.

If we cut people's vocal cords and peeled the skin off each other?

We'd have to deal with each other as bloody, mutes with no way to look down our noses at each other.

I like the idea, Maybe we'd be forced to look at caring for each other and really paying attention to what we mean, not what we say.



Rock on....

[caseysmom]

Well said Richard.

[Bonny]

caseysmom, Yes, humans are like pesky flies, they annoy each other to no end. It is a part of our genetic make up & so is racism. It was, is, & always will be lets face it. We are more territorial then the cats, dogs, & pets that we own. Everyone is going to get hurt at one time or another but as individuals each one of us can make a difference in someones life to make it better.

[lizbud]

WE have the answer for those who feel threatened with deportation.
It's the Gringo Mask.

http://www.aolnews.com/weird-news/article/gringo-mask-lets-nervous-arizonans-whiten-up/19467712

[RICHARD]

WE have the answer for those who feel threatened with deportation.
It's the Gringo Mask.

http://www.aolnews.com/weird-news/article/gringo-mask-lets-nervous-arizonans-whiten-up/19467712


Just by looking at the story and seeing that this novelty started in FLA by "hispanics"?

I can probably deduce that it was a bunch of Cubans sitting around looking for a laugh or two.

I have to laugh every time I see the "latino/hispanic" labels come out.

I firmly believe in the "take responsibility for yourself" rule of life and am bothered at the 'paint brush' used to cover everyone from "latin" America.

Where the eff is Latin America? Haven't seen that on a map?:rolleyes:

------------------

There will be the group of people who will take the 'whitey' masks and blame them all on those "dirty messicans making fun of us!!";):p

I really do not care who calls me what, but, I find it a bit off-putting that some factions of the community act stupidly-The Cubans are a separate set of the 'latino' community.

I will not sugar coat the fact that within the Carribean/Mexican/SouAm groups there is racism/prejudice also. There are groups that cannot live with each other because of some slights, real and percieved, that they cannot forget or move on from.


One problem?
The Mexicans enforce their southern border because they do not want any of the CentAm groups moving up into the country.

Why?

They push the poor and impoverished Mexican locals north, to escape the economic stress put on that system by people who are poorer and do not respect the areas they live in.

-------


Before I go off on a tangent?

I laughed at the idea of wearing a mask to hide your looks.

But, to think that a group, who has no real dog in the fight regarding this topic, putting out a idea like that, irritates me.

---------


Here's another story that got my goat.

Some 'white' kids were sent home from school because they wore 'stars and stripes' clothing on CdM. The admin sent them home because they thought that the clothing had the potential to start a fight between the brown and white folks.

:rolleyes:

So what is the answer from the 'latino' kids?

They ditch school and march to protest the fact that these kids were wearing American Flag clothing.

It showed disrespect to them.

Eff them.
Please, I would have rounded them up, tasered them, and frog marched them back to school.

My father, a dyed in the wool Mexican, would have rolled his eyes and given his famous line......

"The cops here should do what the cops in Mexico did to the students who marched in the 60's, fire them up with machine guns....":eek:;)

My dad was a pacifist and probably saw him mad three times in my life?

But, he had no patience for A-holery against the country that he came to settle in. He did not suffer fools lightly and had NO patience for idiots.

--------------------------

Mom would often tease him by asking this question, "If the U.S. and Mexico went to war, who would you fight for?"

"The winning side.........the U.S.!" :D


-----------------------

Look,

There is a huge problem w/immigration, Some illegals really do not care about living here and being productive w/in the community, they only want to make money and send it home to the families they left behind.

Living 8-10-14 people in house with two bedrooms and a garage, isn't living.

The people here legally and the citizens of the U.S. that have issue with the laws, do have a point.

But, having everyone here legally and controlling who enters, stays and contributes is another matter.

Just the idea of having a law like the one in AZ will deter many people trying to cross into the U.S. at that point, but what does that do to CA and TX?

People will focus their efforts there.

------------

The Mexican media sensationalize the law-more than the U.S. media- and that is a good thing.

By and large, a great percentage of the illegal immigrants here in the U.S. are uneducated, poor and desperate.

They hear a story about the cars, homes, stores and they want to be here.

I don't blame them, I like it too.

We are not doing anyone any favors by not cracking down on the influx of people who refuse to follow the rules. We hurt them and hurt ourselves.

Rock on some more.

[momoffuzzyfaces]

---------


Here's another story that got my goat.

Some 'white' kids were sent home from school because they wore 'stars and stripes' clothing on CdM. The admin sent them home because they thought that the clothing had the potential to start a fight between the brown and white folks.

:rolleyes:

So what is the answer from the 'latino' kids?

They ditch school and march to protest the fact that these kids were wearing American Flag clothing.

It showed disrespect to them.

Eff them.
Please, I would have rounded them up, tasered them, and frog marched them back to school.

My father, a dyed in the wool Mexican, would have rolled his eyes and given his famous line......

"The cops here should do what the cops in Mexico did to the students who marched in the 60's, fire them up with machine guns....":eek:;)

My dad was a pacifist and probably saw him mad three times in my life?

But, he had no patience for A-holery against the country that he came to settle in. He did not suffer fools lightly and had NO patience for idiots.

--------------------------

Mom would often tease him by asking this question, "If the U.S. and Mexico went to war, who would you fight for?"

"The winning side.........the U.S.!" :D


-----------------------

Look,

There is a huge problem w/immigration, Some illegals really do not care about living here and being productive w/in the community, they only want to make money and send it home to the families they left behind.

Living 8-10-14 people in house with two bedrooms and a garage, isn't living.

The people here legally and the citizens of the U.S. that have issue with the laws, do have a point.

But, having everyone here legally and controlling who enters, stays and contributes is another matter.

Just the idea of having a law like the one in AZ will deter many people trying to cross into the U.S. at that point, but what does that do to CA and TX?

People will focus their efforts there.

------------

The Mexican media sensationalize the law-more than the U.S. media- and that is a good thing.

By and large, a great percentage of the illegal immigrants here in the U.S. are uneducated, poor and desperate.

They hear a story about the cars, homes, stores and they want to be here.

I don't blame them, I like it too.

We are not doing anyone any favors by not cracking down on the influx of people who refuse to follow the rules. We hurt them and hurt ourselves.

Rock on some more.

The thing that got the entire stars and striped shirts started was the vice principal of the school. From what I've heard no one had a problem until he stuck his nose out and told the boys to go home or turn their shirts inside out. He is of latino descent from what I've heard and felt disrespected. After he did that, then the students thought maybe they should be offended about the shirts too and started protesting and a way we go. :rolleyes:

[Bonny]

Richard, I looked up Mexico-US History & found a census. In the census it came up with Hispanic & Latin American of any race. They put the two together at 14.8 percent compared to 74 percent whites in the U.S. There must not be a Central America anymore? :eek:

[wombat2u2004]

Richards posts make a lot of sense, and I can see the fors and againsts about the whole situation.
But what about the Mexican Govt ??? What are they doing about the situation ???? They blocking THEIR south border against illegal immigrants and not caring about their own people entering the USA ????
And if there is so much poverty in Mexico, why isn't something done about that by Mexico itself ????

An interesting article from USAID.........
Mexico is a member of the North America Free Trade Agreement and shares a 2,000-mile border with the United States. Mexico, the 14th largest economy in the world, and second largest trading partner of the United States, had $11 billion in foreign direct investment, and received $23.9 billion in remittances in 2007. Mexico faces huge gaps between rich and poor, north and south, urban and rural. Over 40 percent of the country’s population live on less than $2 per day while close to 18 percent live on less than $1 per day.

Ok....so what do we see here ???? The rich not caring about the poor ???
I mean gee....even China sorted that one out years ago. They even made laws that governed how many children a family can have. I don't see such initiatives being implemented in Mexico.

And for those who keep pointing the "Racist" finger....forget the easy cop-outs.......discuss the PROBLEM !!!! It's illegal immigration we are discussing....not racism.

[Medusa]

And for those who keep pointing the "Racist" finger....forget the easy cop-outs.......discuss the PROBLEM !!!! It's illegal immigration we are discussing....not racism.

Thank you for that. Even though I haven't contributed to this particular discussion, this is primarily why. I've grown weary of the racism accusation.

[RICHARD]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37074501/

Oops!:eek:

One reason I do not feel comfortable having the PD check me for my papers?

I betcha the incident report kinda forgot to say anything about that.

[caseysmom]

You don't have to go further than the articles in the doghouse to know people suck.:mad:

[wombat2u2004]

You don't have to go further than the articles in the doghouse to know people suck.:mad:

Because they believe that illegal immigrants shouldn't be in your country ???
Nawwwww....they don't suck.

[Bonny]

We are talking about exploitation here too. The United States & Canada actually exploit Mexico & the Mexican people in there own country. They have moved businesses into Mexico & hire Mexican people to work in their businesses for low wages. There is a trial going on in my area 83 counts of exploitation. Mexican children working in a packing plant, 12 hours a day, using chemicals to clean the belts. :mad:

[caseysmom]

Because they believe that illegal immigrants shouldn't be in your country ???
Nawwwww....they don't suck.

Did you even read Richard's article which I was referring to?

[cassiesmom]

This was on the news today. I think the team, coaches and parents should have been allowed to decide whether they went, instead of the administration deciding they would not go. Highland Park is affluent, and Highwood is more middle-income.
------

Highland Park High School scraps team trip to Arizona

Reveling in its first conference championship in 26 years, the Highland Park High School girls varsity basketball team has been selling cookies for months to raise funds for a tournament in Arizona. But those hoop dreams were dashed when players learned they couldn't go because of that state's new crackdown on illegal immigrants.

Safety concerns partly fueled the decision, but the trip also "would not be aligned with our beliefs and values," said District 113 Assistant Superintendent Suzan Hebson. That explanation, though, smacks of political protest to parents upset by the decision.

The news, which was broken to the team Monday by coach Jolie Bechtel, comes as critics of Arizona's controversial law call on professional athletes and others to boycott the state.

Last month a New York congressman asked Major League Baseball to pull next year's All-Star Game from Phoenix, and protesters recently picketed Wrigley Field when the Arizona Diamondbacks played the Cubs.

But tossing a high school team into the heated debate has left parents and players baffled and angry.

"Why are we mixing politics and a basketball tournament?" said Michael Evans, whose daughter Lauren is a junior on the team. "It's outrageous that they're doing this under the guise of safety."

Lauren Evans said she thought the concern was probably that one of the players could get stopped and questioned.

"It shouldn't be a problem," she said. "I don't think it makes much sense. We shouldn't be a threat. We just want to play basketball."

District 113 Superintendent George Fornero declined comment, saying it "wasn't just my decision." He referred calls to Hebson.

Hebson said Arizona is off-limits because of uncertainty about how the new law will be enforced. Signed by Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer last month, it makes it a crime to be in the country illegally and requires police to check suspects for immigration paperwork.

Hebson said the turmoil is no place for students of Highland Park High School, which also draws from Highwood.

"We would want to ensure that all of our students had the opportunity to be included and be safe and be able to enjoy the experience," Hebson said of the tournament, which will be played in December. "We wouldn't necessarily be able to guarantee that."

Asked if there are undocumented players on the team, or if anyone associated with the team is in the country illegally, Hebson said she did not know.

Parents and players interviewed said they knew of no one who fits that description.

The high school's Web site boasts of a "relatively diverse" student population of 80 percent white, 15 percent Hispanic, 3 percent Asian and 2 percent African-American.

"Many of the parents feel that this should be resolved in the judicial court, not the basketball court," said Cynde Munzer, whose daughter, Lena, is a freshman on the team.

"I disagree personally with the Arizona legislation, but I also feel strongly about young women's rights," Munzer said. "They don't want to get involved in politics."

Subrina Collier, whose daughter Briana is a junior on the team, said even if someone were worried about presenting immigration papers in Arizona, it should be a personal decision to stay away. She called the administration decision a misplaced political statement.

The school district is looking for another tournament for the Giants, officials said.

The girls basketball team at Mundelein High School was in Scottsdale, Ariz., in December for the tournament hosted by Desert Mountain High School, said coach Brian Evans.

Evans called Desert Mountain High School "unbelievably hospitable" during his team's trip. Officials there declined comment about Highland Park's decision not to participate.

Meanwhile, other Chicago-area organizations continue to wrestle with their involvement in Arizona.

Local immigrants' rights activists delivered a letter Tuesday to the Chicago-based American Bar Association that urged the group to cancel a conference slated for this week in Arizona.

At Highland Park, basketball player Marguerite Biagi, a junior, said she disagrees with the law but still wants to visit Arizona.

"It's ultimately the state's decision, no matter what I think," she said. "Not playing basketball in Arizona is not going to change anything."

Cynthia Dizikes, Dan Simmons, Oscar Avila and Lisa Black contributed.

-- Jeff Long

[lizbud]

The Federal Goverment is not doing it's job. Border security is a Federal
responsibilty. As long as they are leaving the problem to the affected states,
they have to try to solve the issue for their state. It's not a good situation
for anyone involved.

[wombat2u2004]

Did you even read Richard's article which I was referring to?

Yep I did. But what has that to do with illegal immigration ???

[RICHARD]

The point I was trying to make is that even with a set of papers-If a cop/copette don't like you?

You are going to get your "homey" arse kicked anyway.

Now, not ALL cops are boneheads.

But, you are going to run into the few that will make you "work" for you innoncence.

As in all instances, we do not know what happened BEFORE the film starts...But, what kind of reaction is that?

The cops that are punks and morons are the chicken shiats who abuse the color of authority and have no qualms about admininstering a little street justice.

The worse part are the 'partners in crime/police' who will not report a clear case of abuse.

-------

The U.S. flag incident is BS.

IF that is that things are?

Forget everyone's flag and turn the schools in race-free zones.


And no more tacos or burritos in the cafeteria.


THAT will teach everyone.:eek::mad:;)

[wombat2u2004]

SHERIFF JOE IS AT IT AGAIN!

You all remember Sheriff Joe Arpaio of Arizona, who painted the jail cells pink and made the inmates wear pink prison garb. Well............

http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/wombat2u2004/SheriffJoe.jpg

Now he's in trouble with the ACLU again.
He painted all his buses and vehicles with a mural, that has a special hotline phone number painted on it, where you can call and report suspected illegal
aliens.
Immigrations and Customs Enforcement wasn't doing enough in his eyes, so he had 40 deputies trained specifically for enforcing immigration laws, started up his hotline, and bought 4 new buses just for hauling folks back to
the border.
He's kind of a 'Git-R Dun' kind of Sheriff.

Yup, he was re-elected last year with 83% of the vote.
AND HE KEEPS GETTING ELECTED OVER AND OVER.

I'd vote for ya to Joe ;)

[Marigold2]

I have read about Sheriff Joe for years. He is wonderful, smart, no nonsense type of guy. Knows how to get things done and how to save tax payers money.
He made the imates live in tent cities and when they complained about the heat he reminded them that our troops live in tents as well.

[wombat2u2004]

I have read about Sheriff Joe for years. He is wonderful, smart, no nonsense type of guy. Knows how to get things done and how to save tax payers money.
He made the imates live in tent cities and when they complained about the heat he reminded them that our troops live in tents as well.

And no taco's or grits. I guess he must be a racist. :p

[RICHARD]

And no taco's or grits. I guess he must be a racist. :p

Shame on you!!!;)

I dig the message, but the messenger is a bit of an idiot.;)

There's a bit of humility missing from that picture!:):D

Rock on.

[cassiesmom]

This was on the news today. I think the team, coaches and parents should have been allowed to decide whether they went, instead of the administration deciding they would not go.

Same story made the national news with Diane Sawyer today, so we'll see what happens now.

[wombat2u2004]

I dig the message, but the messenger is a bit of an idiot.;)

Sorry mate :o You'll have to blame my parents for that. It's just that I was dropped on my head at birth :p

[RICHARD]

Sorry mate :o You'll have to blame my parents for that. It's just that I was dropped on my head at birth :p

No, no, no.....
I didn't mean YOU! I meant the Good Sheriff and his Bus Message!


Running a jail/county PD is a huge deal. I agree that his some of his methods are not that inhumane........but, he seems to take a small amount of glee enforcing them.

You put a man into pink underwear for his sins? Great!

But you do not taunt him after. It's like making the winning score in a game, then taunting the losing team as they walk off the court/pitch/field.

Growing up, ma used to tell us that "Jail is for everyone!" Arpaio runs a low level lock up with 'entry level' criminals.

I don't know how -if he does- run a 'real' jail. The kind with meaner, nastier clientele..


Do a search on "Arpaio, Lawsuits" and read a few of the sites.

-----------

I do think his methods are innovative, but his madness is kinda disturbing.

[wombat2u2004]

[QUOTE=RICHARD;2263909]No, no, no.....
I didn't mean YOU! I meant the Good Sheriff and his Bus Message![QUOTE]

Yeah.....hee hee....I know. I'm only have'n ya on mate :p:p

[wombat2u2004]

I do think his methods are innovative, but his madness is kinda disturbing.

I think he's after fame and glory if ya ask me.

[RICHARD]

http://awkwardfamilyphotos.com/wp-content/uploads/cache/2009/07/katie-l_6d0449ca7a7cb16489384ed602f3cc03.jpg/570_0_resize.jpg



IS a Medicare/AARP card valid I.D. in Arizona?

[blue]

I think I see now why people think this law is racist, its a 2 part issue...

Part 1. If people are here illegally they must be Mexicans.

This is flat out not true but the news media, and the liberal political hacks want you to believe it.

Part 2. All laws are racist.

If you are pulled over for driving on the wrong side of the street with a pint of Guinness in your hand, its not because your here illegally, its because of the color of your skin.

[wombat2u2004]

They don't have any cards....I bet they are illegal immigrants... I can tell just by looking at them.
They are wearing sombreros....it's what gives them away every time. :p:p



http://awkwardfamilyphotos.com/wp-content/uploads/cache/2009/07/katie-l_6d0449ca7a7cb16489384ed602f3cc03.jpg/570_0_resize.jpg



IS a Medicare/AARP card valid I.D. in Arizona?

[wombat2u2004]

I think I see now why people think this law is racist, its a 2 part issue...

Part 1. If people are here illegally they must be Mexicans.

This is flat out not true but the news media, and the liberal political hacks want you to believe it.

Part 2. All laws are racist.

If you are pulled over for driving on the wrong side of the street with a pint of Guinness in your hand, its not because your here illegally, its because of the color of your skin.

Part 1. Why ?? For what reason would they single out Mexicans ???

Part 2. No, laws are not racist. Laws are put in place for all people, and apply to everyone whether one is blue, black, white or purple.
People who are pulled over because of the colour of their skin, is done so because most crimes are committed by coloured people.

[kokopup]

wom

People who are pulled over because of the colour of their skin, is done so because most crimes are committed by coloured people.

In the US you are not allowed to make statements like this because it is not "politically correct"(1) or you are a racist (2), or both. That is just how it is.

[wombat2u2004]

wom


In the US you are not allowed to make statements like this because it is not "politically correct"(1) or you are a racist (2), or both. That is just how it is.

I didn't make the statement in the US. I made it in Australia.
And if that statement hurt the feelings of the powers who be, then perhaps you should vote for someone who won't hide from the truth.

[kokopup]

I know it to be the truth also, but because of where I live I am not allowed to speak the truth without being called a racist.

[RICHARD]

If you are pulled over for driving on the wrong side of the street with a pint of Guinness in your hand, its not because your here illegally, its because of the color of your skin.

That sounds like an illegal (pale) Irishman to me.;)

-----------------

I do not want to start a 'border war' here, but-

One bothersome facet of the conversation, across the land is the idea that we do and will harbor lawbreakers living amongst us.

I have no qualms about people coming to the States and being part of the pretty good deal we have here.

I just am appalled by the idea that we turn a blind eye towards parts of the problem.


As I suggested before-regarding the nitwits in Guantanamo Bay-people's hearts bleed for the group that want to do harm to us.

So, if you really care about terrorists we have in locked up in jail?

Sponsor one and have them come live in your home. Seriously.

Show them your hospitality by letting them experience all the things they hate about us-they just might change their minds about how we live.

Sponsor an Illegal Alien.

Bring them into your home/garage and let them live off of your good nature and spoils.

Pay for their insurance, allow them to drive your cars with no license, insurance or knowledge of the laws.

Pay for their medical costs, welfare and give them food from your kitchen.

We already do-inviting them into our REAL homes will let you get a first hand experience with their plight.

No, I am not being mean. I just want to illustrate a point-we just make it worse for them and us by allowing this farce to go on.


-----------------

When you see a debate regarding this topic be very wary of who is on the panel.

There will always be the professor/teacher with the 'latin' last name that makes it sound like the U.S. government routinely tortures the illegals by uprooting them and sending them back to their countries. These are the morons who have worked THEIR way into positions by taking advantage of the rules and laws that allowed them to jump ahead in the "line/queue of life".
Their a-holery allows them to become activists for the cause and they gain a bloated and misplaced admiration from the people they defend.

The Mexican government officials refuse to enforce the US/Mex border because they do not want the people who have moved up thru the country to clog up their northern borders. They show up at the table with they sad eyes and say that they also suffer from the influx of illegals into their country.

It's way better to let them percolate up into the US, they become our problem.


And, while I admire the people who look at it more as a human rights issue?

It rankles my rear that it's solely looked at in that light. It's way more involved than uprooting people who are here in the states illegally.


------------------

I was watching a Nat Geo program about the AZ border.

The drug cartels and THEIR contributions to the problems are just bringing more problems to an already over taxed Border Patrol.

[lizbud]

Actually, anyone who isn't a Native American is an illegal immigrant.

[Marigold2]

OMG someone please call the fashion police.

[RICHARD]

Actually, anyone who isn't a Native American is an illegal immigrant.

Hence my asking you all to bug out of the U.S. by the 15th, yet you are all still here.;)


----------


I have to chime in here because I was thinking about a situation in my family that is going on at the moment-it also brings in the idea that calling people "insects" is wrong.


Part of my parent's estate includes a home they bought, paid for, and rented out.

After the 94 earthquake the renters moved out and I helped my dad renovate parts of the home by putting in drywall.

It's a small two bed/1 BR and had charm.

The next set of tenants moved in and began the destruction of the place.

When they moved out, they TOOK THE WATER HEATER and replaced it with a POS one they found.

The next set of tenants moved in and soon were joined by 6-7 people.

They moved and w.o telling my mom and turned the place over to another family.:eek:

During this time my AH brother began to pick up the rent and 'took over' maintaining the place. (I was the one who would go over and fix things because he is inept and cannot fix things to save his life.:rolleyes:) Thank god it's his problem now-there's more to the drama, but that is more family than immigrants.

He was raising the rent on the tenants until they got smart and began to call the city for things that went wrong with the place.

They are illegal aliens and use the laws here to protect them and make life harder for the legitimate folks in the community.

(When I went to collect the rent after my mother's death, the POS woman told me that I would not get it because I had to show a letter from an attorney..)


I fixed a sliding window at the back of the property, It was broken to put in an air conditioner. The drywall was smashed and holed all over the house, the house stinks of rancid grease and door jambs are written on and carved into.

All the windows were replaced in the summer of 08 and most are broken, again.

They built a shed next to the garage, wired it from the house and put a washer and dryer inside. They routed the gray water into the cesspool and flood the back yard repeatedly.

They have about 6 cars parked in the front yard of the house and have killed any vegetation in the area.

The house started as a nice little place and has turned into nothing more than a frame with open windows and holes in the walls.


All because my mom and brother would not take a stand against these people who act and live like animals because they are afraid of having the city come down on THEIR heads because of the conditions these morons cause for themselves.

There, I said it.

They act like insects/locusts/animal and devour/destroy everything in their path, yet refuse to respect the owners of the homes that they are allowed to live in.

So, while everyone deserves the right to live and prosper?

These morons scream about justice and human rights when they are the biggest problem in areas of our country.

They refuse to intergrate legally and when they show up illegally, they have no qualms about throwing our laws into out faces.

God bless em, they pretty much put it all on the line by getting here, but GDI,
they could show some respect for dirt that they live on.:mad:

[RICHARD]

I am seriously raging about the fantasy of Human Rights.

Having your HRs violated is living in Darfur with a screwed up government.

It's living on the hills of Rio de J and having your house disappear under a landslide.

It's betting stoned for being a woman in and Arab country..

IT's having limbs cut off as punsihment for crimes.


Seriously?

Just like the post about the burqa wearing beeyotch that gets a ticket then begins to complain about the laws of that land?

We bend over backwards-washing stations for cabbies in Chicago?- to make immigrants feel at home and we get, in return-slapped in the face while these people try and wear down our laws.


Trust me, soon we will have a 'made up' holiday, like Kwanzaa, just for the Arab population. all because we are violating their human rights for not giving them a paid holiday...


You guys can give them what they want.

I live in America.

[Bonny]

I haven't left the U.S. by May 15th because I don't have my papers in order to enter Mexico legally as yet. I hope you can give me some more time to get things together. No one wants to sponsor me?:( If I had a sponsor I could get out of here & move across the border legally. I need a sponsor that would treat me with respect. I will do an honest days work for an honest days pay. Anyone out there hiring? :)

[wombat2u2004]

I will do an honest days work for an honest days pay. Anyone out there hiring?

Me. I need a magic mushroom picker. :p:p

[wombat2u2004]

Well said Richard.
We extend the helping hand only to be bitten. And if we speak out against that, it's called racism.
The cretins who run our country's listen to people like Caseysmom who believe that the human rights for illegal immigrants are more important than the human rights of residents within her own country.
For want of a better label for illegal immigrants, lets just call them "Queue Jumpers", for that is exactly what they are.


I am seriously raging about the fantasy of Human Rights.

Having your HRs violated is living in Darfur with a screwed up government.

It's living on the hills of Rio de J and having your house disappear under a landslide.

It's betting stoned for being a woman in and Arab country..

IT's having limbs cut off as punsihment for crimes.


Seriously?

Just like the post about the burqa wearing beeyotch that gets a ticket then begins to complain about the laws of that land?

We bend over backwards-washing stations for cabbies in Chicago?- to make immigrants feel at home and we get, in return-slapped in the face while these people try and wear down our laws.


Trust me, soon we will have a 'made up' holiday, like Kwanzaa, just for the Arab population. all because we are violating their human rights for not giving them a paid holiday...


You guys can give them what they want.

I live in America.

[wombat2u2004]

I know it to be the truth also, but because of where I live I am not allowed to speak the truth without being called a racist.

Ahhhhhhh....well that sounds to me like you are all being taken for a ride.

[Marigold2]

Bottom line______________________

They are breaking our law.

Now they want us to change our language because they can't or want learn it.

They want equal rights when they are not suppose to even be here.

This is no different then outright stealing.

If you were waiting in a resturant with your family and friends and some illigels came in, wanted a table right now, free food to feed their poor hungrey family what would you do? Throw their sorry behinds out, or buy them a meal with your hard earned money?

That is really the question for all of us private and government, what should we do with free loaders that have no right to be here.

[RICHARD]

I have to edit my gripe about the 'made up' holidays...

I am also not a huge fan of "Puerto Rican Day" - Kiss me, I'm Puerto Rican!

Cinco de Mayo either....

At my old job we had a nice one day deal called "International Day".

The hospital arranged for caterers to bring in ethnic food and they turned the cafeteria into a buffet, some people would dress in their native garb, we had a nice meal and fun going from table to table checking out the vibe.

I am all for celebrating your roots, but think we have gone overboard with the idea.


I propose we an American Holiday to celebrate the U.S.

Let's call it Tax Year. It will start on April 16th and run until April 15th.

We can all work in unison to pay our taxes, so we can have an even better country!

The colors will be red, white, blue and green, the color of money.;)

No one will be left out and everyone will be included. We can tweak it to celebrate participating in the running of the country.......

On the April 15th we can party and celebrate the end of another year of hard work and unity.....:eek:;):D

[Bonny]

In school we were taught that the US was a melting pot where people from all over the world came here to live & have the freedoms they could not enjoy in their homelands. They actually had more freedom then we do now. :eek:

[Marigold2]

I am very proud of our melting pot status it is one of the things that makes this country so great.
However for it to be as fair as possible rules need to be followed so that one person or one nationalty does not have an unfair advantage over others.
People from all nations have a right to come here to have a better life they better darn well do it legally however.
And not just have a baby so that the baby is legal and they can stay, that really bothers me. A baby should be wanted for itself not for legal status.

In school we were taught that the US was a melting pot where people from all over the world came here to live & have the freedoms they could not enjoy in their homelands. They actually had more freedom then we do now. :eek:

[Bonny]

It has been two years now since the Fed's raided an area town & took 389 Hispanic people off to processes them. The workers that were illegal along with their families were sent back to Mexico. It turned out a third of the town was sent back to Mexico. They came here to work & were treated very badly by another group of people. There were legal workers too. They lost their jobs, didn't get paid because the plant closed. It was & is still a real mess. The old immigration laws have to be changed. The sponsors have to be held responsible. I don't know how long our country can hold up to all this? The Fed's can raid a little town but can't seem to take care of the border & illegals streaming in? There must be something wrong with our government? I know I am sick of the stinking lying politicans that are running this country.:mad:

[Lady's Human]

I know I am sick of the stinking lying politicans that are running this country.

Until people forget about how much money congressman/senator X brought back to their district and finally vote the bastards out, nothing is going to change.

A constant in the news is how upset people are with congress and politics in general........yet over 90% of the incumbents who run for re-election for their office win.

Can't have it both ways, people. Your guy is part of the problem too.

[Bonny]

Our guy has been there so long he has cob webs all over him.:)

[wombat2u2004]

Those pollies live in a different world than ours....I'm sure.

[Catty1]

http://punditkitchen.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/129179586601811050.jpg

I know, I know....we're talking about illegal immigrants. ;)

[Lady's Human]

RE the above pic.....they're immigrants also.

[Catty1]

I know, LH, Bering Strait and all.... :) When I saw the pic, it made me think of this thread.

Hmmm....makes me wonder if anthropologists have figured out WHO the first race on earth was, will all respect to the Adam and Eve story believers...


http://history-world.org/paleolithic1.htm (WARNING! My Anti-Virus detected and blocked a Rogue Spyware virus when I went to this page)


Evolution Of The Hominids

Who the ancestors of early humans were and when and where tools were first made are much debated questions in scholarly circles. According to the theory of evolution, a crucial development occurred when the ape family became differentiated into the tree-dwelling apes and the ground-dwelling types known as hominids ("pre-humans" or "protohumans"). The remains of Australopithecines ("Southern Apes"), the earliest known hominids, were first discovered in South Africa in 1924. Autralopithecus had an erect posture but an apelike brain.

Since World War II, and especially during the 1970s, our knowledge of the hominids and their relation to the genus Homo ("man") has been rapidly growing. The dominant present view is that Australopithecus was succeded by three species of the genus Homo: Homo habilis, Homo erectus, and Homo sapiens. (A genus contains one or more species. The genus name is capitalized and precedes the species name, which is not capitalized.)

Three major sites in East Africa have produced a remarkable collection of Australopithecine fossils. Between 1972 and 1977, an expedition led by C.D.

Johanson worked at Hadar in Ethiopia. The Hadar collection comprises at least thirty-five individuals, with one female skeleton - named Lucy after the Beatles' song "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" - nearly 40 percent complete and between 3.0 and 3.5 million years ago.

[RICHARD]

Hmmm....makes me wonder if anthropologists have figured out WHO the first race on earth was

Nascar, the Daytona 500?;)

[wombat2u2004]

Hmmm....makes me wonder if anthropologists have figured out WHO the first race on earth was, will all respect to the Adam and Eve story believers...


I have read books written by Donald Johanson, and I definately believe that this man is too hasty in his writings on paleoanthropology, I share the same opinions as do the Leakey's.......I'm a follower of their works to a word.

A little on the Leaky family.............

British / Kenyan archaeologist and anthropologist who became famous for his academic work centered on human origins. Louis Leakey, his wife Mary, and their second son Richard made the key discoveries that have shaped our understanding of the first men. Richard Leakey and his wife, Maeve, sustain a family legacy of research that is now, with the work of their daughter Louise, three generations deep.

"To me it's a question of being able to look backward and give the present a root... To give meaning to where we are today, we need to look at where we've have come from." (Richard Leakey, in National Geographic, February 1998)
Louis Leakey was born in Kabete, British East Africa, now Kenya, into a missionary family. At the age of twelve he found his first fossils, and knew that he wanted to be an archeologist. Leakey graduated from Cambridge, and set out to prove Darwin's theory that Africa was humankind's homeland. At that time it was believed that early man originated in somewhere Asia. Between the years 1926 and 1935 he led a series of expeditions in East Africa in search of man's fossil ancestors. He was interested in particular Olduvai Gorge, a 300-foot-deep, thirty-mile-long chasm not far from the Ngorongoro Crater. It was made famous by a German entomologist named Wilhelm Kattwinkel, who first discovered its value in 1911.

Leakey dug at Olduvai two decades without finding anything especially significant. His first marriage with Frieda Leakey ended in divorce in 1933, when he met and fell in love with 20-year-old Mary Douglas Nicol; they married in 1936. With Mary he collected early manmade tools, mostly made of basalt and quartzite, and fossilized bones of many extinct mammals. His first major discovery was the jaw of a pre human creature called Proconsul. In 1945 Leakey became the curator of the Coryndon Memorial Museum at Nairobi. In the late 1940s and early 1950s he also served as a spy for the British government and acted as a translator in court in 1952-53 during the trial of Jomo Kenyatta, the leader of the independence party. As a conservationist, Leakey was active in promoting game preserves in East Africa. His interests and writings were wide, including all aspects of African natural history, primate behaviour and the origins of man.

From the 1950s the Leakeys expeditions to Olduvai Gorge produced several important discoveries of early primate fossils, named Zinjanthropus (now called Australopithecus boisei), which Mary Leakey found in 1959 from the lowest and oldest excavation site. The discovery of "Zinj" made the Leakeys famous. Louis wrote an article for the National Geographic magazine and estimated that Zinjanthropus was 600,000 years old, in which he was wrong. Using a new method of dating, the carbon-14 technique, geophysicists from the University of California at Berkeley concluded that the site was 1.75 million years old. But the excavations brought to light a rich fossil fauna.

Among Leakey's academic protegees were Dian Fossey, who studied mountain gorillas, and Jane Goodall, who became famous for her studies of the behavior of chimpanzees. Leakey stayed long periods at the London home of Vanne Goodall, Jane Goodall's mother. When Louis began spending less and less time at Olduvai, and concentrated on raising funds and lecturing, the place became Mary's domain, where she spent most of the next 25 years. Personally and professionally Mary and Louis lived separate lives from the mid-1960s.

In 1978 Mary Leakey found a trail of clear ancient hominid footprints of two adults and a child - some 3.5 million years old - impressed and preserved in volcanic ash from a site in Tanzania called Laetoli. They belonged to a new hominid species, best represented by the 3.2 million-year-old Lucy skeleton, which was found at Hadar, Ethiopia, by Donald Johanson . "It is tempting to see them as a man, a woman and a child," Mary Leakey later wrote. The Lucy skeleton on the other hand arose a bitter debate. Mary and Richard Leakey criticized Donald Johanson for proclaiming a new species too hastily - the fossils could be a mix of several different species.

From 1961 to 1964 the Leakeys and their son Jonathan unearthed fossils of Homo habilis, "handy man", the oldest known primate with human characteristics and discovered in 1967 Kenyapithecus africanus. The Leakeys claimed that Homo habilis had walked upright. "Until then the idea that two hominids could occupy the same area at the same time had been unacceptable to most scientists," Mary Leakey wrote in Disclosing the Past (1984). Also evidence of human habitation in California, more than 50 000 years, old was found.

Louis Leakey died in London in 1972 at the age of 69. In the same year his son Richard Leakey, who directed National Museum of Kenya, reported the discovery of a 1.8 million-year old skull of modern humans from Koobi Fora. Three years later he discoverd the skull of Homo erectus, estimated at 1.6 million years old, and in 1984 he and another paleontologist discovered a virtually complete Homo erectus skeleton. In 1989 Richard Leakey abandoned fossil hunting for wildlife conservation. President Daniel Arap Moi appointed Leakey head of what is now the Kenya Wildlife Service. He signed in 1994 amid politically motivated accusations of mismanagement, only to be reinstated by Moi 4,5 years later. As a result of an airplane crash, Leakey lost both legs below the knees, but he has continued his scientific explorations. Mary Leakey died in Nairobi on December 9, 1996, at the age of 83.

[RICHARD]

I have read books written by Donald Johanson, and I definately believe that this man is too hasty in his writings on paleoanthropology, I share the same opinions as do the Leakey's.......I'm a follower of their works to a word.

A little on the Leaky family.............



A family of plumbers?;)


Do you think Lucy lies about her age? 3.2 million years old?

Women do, you know.:eek:;)

[Bonny]

I think we all orginally come from outer space & are related to the one eyed green eyed purple people eaters. :D

[RICHARD]

I think we all orginally come from outer space & are related to the one eyed green eyed purple people eaters. :D

You're from Venus, I'm from Mars!

------------

Lost Angeles was handed a nice letter from AZ saying, Seventh-letter You!

HAHAHAHAHA.

The El Lay city council passed a boycott of AZ- so AZ responded in kind.

I cannot type in what I think.....AZ threatened to pull the 25% of electricity they supply to California....

I love it.

Watch the politicians back pedal.

--------


And WTF is BO doing with the prez of MEXICO?

Apologizing?

And what is it with the State Dept. apologizing to CHINA for the AZ law.

Them godless commie morons violate human rights every minute of the day and WE ARE APOLOGIZING?

Hell hath frozen over, I feel it in my heart.:o:confused:

[Marigold2]

What a sight to see.......
I think we all orginally come from outer space & are related to the one eyed green eyed purple people eaters. :D

Wom I loved the info you posted, I remember reading about Lucy oh so many years ago, only a mirco-second but 30 years or so ago.
I was amazed and have always believed we came from apes or ape like people. One just has to look into their eyes and see the human in them. SCARY! And their hands.......
Evolution happens all around us everyday yet some people are afraid to grasp that theroy that we might have come from apes and instead believe we women came from the rib of man in a magic garden of Eden where everything is perfect, there is no sin, one does not age and all is created by a mystical being. I always found it to be a fairy tale, stanger then Alice in Wonderland.
And now for thousands of years humans kill each other in the name of the mystical God who speaks of love, forgiveness and understanding. Why does the killing, and judgement go on in the name of this mystical God? I do not know.

[blue]

And WTF is BO doing with the prez of MEXICO?

Apologizing? .:o:confused:

http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll199/jettscott/undoc.jpg

[wombat2u2004]

A family of plumbers?;)

Obviously related to LH :D
They reckon he knows all about leaky's in the garden....hee hee :p

[wombat2u2004]

http://punditkitchen.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/129179586601811050.jpg

OMG....someone has sold them rifles !!!
Disarm them immediately, and put them to work in the corn fields. :p
The hide of them rebelling against our taking of their lands....the hide of them :p

[wombat2u2004]

I think we all orginally come from outer space & are related to the one eyed green eyed purple people eaters. :D

Well those from the Mid-West do....yeah :p

[wombat2u2004]

What a sight to see.......

Wom I loved the info you posted, I remember reading about Lucy oh so many years ago, only a mirco-second but 30 years or so ago.
I was amazed and have always believed we came from apes or ape like people. One just has to look into their eyes and see the human in them. SCARY! And their hands.......
Evolution happens all around us everyday yet some people are afraid to grasp that theroy that we might have come from apes and instead believe we women came from the rib of man in a magic garden of Eden where everything is perfect, there is no sin, one does not age and all is created by a mystical being. I always found it to be a fairy tale, stanger then Alice in Wonderland.
And now for thousands of years humans kill each other in the name of the mystical God who speaks of love, forgiveness and understanding. Why does the killing, and judgement go on in the name of this mystical God? I do not know.

Hmmmmm....I guess most people have to believe in something, such as an afterlife. I suppose they just can't come to terms with the fact that when the light gets switched off...it's all over.

[RICHARD]

Here's a great example of why some police officers are not qualifed to qualify to uphold the law.

In typical fashion, they act like morons and when they get caught on tape/film?

They target the person doing the filming, beat the crap out of them and the city loses on the settlements awarded to the 'victims'.

I have heard of a few cases where IAs are awarded bucks and a get out of jail free card for the stupidity of a few idiots...

If there was no camera watching, they probably would have been a few arrests- "The perp aimed his bike at me and I feared for my life, so I knocked him to the ground and effected an arrest...."


Great, a few cyclists that irked an officer and made him take action.:rolleyes:;):eek:

[dab_20]

I think that people should come here legally and apply for citizenship. However, I do not blame some people for not coming here legally. It's damned near IMPOSSIBLE to come here legally anymore. Especially for hispanic people, who unfortunately, have a bad rep here in the US. If it's going to take 10+ years to get citizenship here, there is always going to be illegal immigrants. Period.

As for the Arizona law, I think it is unnecessary to ask random people off the street for their legal status... and it's mostly going to be based off racial discrimination. However, if they're doing something wrong or pulled over or something, then yes I think they can ask for status. We have to show our IDs when we're pulled over, they need to show theirs too.

I'm not that informed on this subject, but this is just my opinion. As I've got a boyfriend from South America that's waiting FOREVER to get any kind of status, it's very frustrating to me that it's so hard to get citizenship here, much less any kind of residency. They keep telling him "six more months... six more months..." It's pretty ridiculous. :rolleyes::(

[RICHARD]

I think that people should come here legally and apply for citizenship. However, I do not blame some people for not coming here legally. It's damned near IMPOSSIBLE to come here legally anymore. Especially for hispanic people, who unfortunately, have a bad rep here in the US. If it's going to take 10+ years to get citizenship here, there is always going to be illegal immigrants. Period.

My dad was a green card holder for 30+ years and he earned his citizenship when he was about 72 years old.

In 1984 Dan Blatnick won the first Olympic medal for the U.S. in freestyle wrestling in YEARS.

The next morning the media quoted Blatnick as saying, "Nothing is impossible, the impossible just takes longer".

I never thought my dad was a fatalist.
But, man, he was optomistic.;)

[blue]

Only reason my stepdad finally became a citizen was because he was tired of not having a say in the a**hats that kept getting voted into office and their a**hatterish antics.

[RICHARD]

Only reason my stepdad finally became a citizen was because he was tired of not having a say in the a**hats that kept getting voted into office and their a**hatterish antics.

LOLOL,

A**haterish?

Wasn't that the character that Johnny Depp played in the Alice in Wonderland movie?:eek:;)

After my dad became a citizen I chided him to register and go vote.

He said, "Pinches bandidos, que han echo por mi?"

"Dang bandits, what have they done for me?"

You know, he was on to something...;)