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phesina
01-14-2010, 07:52 PM
To our Canadian members and you folks in other countries with some form of national health care system:

Are there many people in your country who want to do away with the medical system you have there and adopt one like ours?

Here in the U.S. I hear all the pro and con arguments about other countries' public systems, but I would like to know what people in those countries think about their own health care systems and about what YOU hear of the American system.

This topic has come up in the "sarah palin" thread here in the Dog House, and I think it warrants its own discussion.

I look over the Dog House discussions/arguments/rants but rarely comment in any, because, do I need this headache?

Now I'm starting a thread in it? :confused: Am I nuts? :mad::mad: Do I need THIS headache? :eek::eek::eek:

But since this is a huge matter of concern in this country right now, I would like to get information and opinions from people who know first-hand the pros and cons of the various possibilities we're looking at here.

Thank you for your thoughtful responses.

Pat

Puckstop31
01-14-2010, 11:14 PM
10...9....8.... Waiting for my Canadian wife to comment on the Canadian health "care" system.

phesina
01-14-2010, 11:17 PM
Good, I want very much to hear what Sparks has to say!

Nomilynn
01-15-2010, 08:46 AM
If it weren't for the Canadian health care system, I would likely be be declaring bankruptcy and homeless, after being unemployed last year. I am a diabetic and I have several items that I have to buy on a monthly basis. However, they aren't expensive when compared to how much they cost in the USA (I have bought my medications in the states before when I went on a trip and I forgot something.. suprisingly a lot of insulins don't require a medical prescriptions). Also, I need to have blood work and see my doctor every three months, and I do not have to pay for any of it out of pocket. It's covered by my monthly premium of $54.

A couple of years ago I had to have surgery, and did not have to wait that long. From the time I was referred to surgery to the date of the procedure it was around 2 months. It was not an emergency. However, my friend went into the emergency room and had to have hernia surgery that evening, no wait, and not one penny out of pocket except for his prescription for pain after he left the hospital.

So if I had a choice, I would keep what I have.

Randi
01-15-2010, 09:06 AM
It sounds like we have a Health Security system in Denmark much like Nomilyn describes, and I would definately want it to stay that way - or only rich people could afford to stay healthy. :eek:

Going to hospital and doctors doesn't cost anything, but buying the medicine does. However, if it's prescription medicine, you pay less and less for it every time. After a year, you start over paying full price, but it will get cheaper for each purchase.

We do pay to go to the dentist. The Healthcare only pays very little of that bill.

There are private hospitals in Denmark too, and if the State hospitals can not fit you in within a certain amount of time, you go to a private, and the Health care will pay.

To have this, we all pay more taxes than most countries, but I much prefer that EVERYONE can get treated.

phesina
01-15-2010, 01:48 PM
Thank you, Randi and Nomilynn. Puck, I hope your wife will join in!

Catty1
01-15-2010, 02:25 PM
sparks' dad had a really bad time when he was in hosp - he was sent home way too soon because so many other people with H1N1 were filling up the beds.

I sure hope her dad is doing ok now. Anywhere there are baby boomers topping up the population - too few staff, too few resources. :(

Asiel
01-15-2010, 02:54 PM
Actually I think we have great healthcare in Canada. There is a shortage of doctors in some areas but everyone is taken by priority. A cancer patient would always come before a knee or hip replacement which is the way it should be IMO. But no one is ever turned away when needing a doctor and we don't ever see a bill, for office visits or hospital care, so how can we not be thankful for a system like that. Sure, it comes out of our taxes and people who don't pay taxes have the same benefits but I think everyone should have healthcare regardless of their status. Our taxes have to be paid anyway so this way we at least know our health won't be neglected. If someone is down on their luck and have no job they shouldn't be denied care either. After 65 the government takes over and covers all drug costs after the first $100 dollars and believe me when you are getting thousands of dollars worth of meds a year that's a bonus.
We get free eye coverage every 2 yrs, Or we can go more often but pay a percentage of the cost. Dental care we pay for unless we have a private plan.
I'm sure lots of things could stand improvement but what in life doesn't?

catmandu
01-15-2010, 04:19 PM
I heard a radio show where the European System had one advantage over ours.
In thier case the money followed the patient , in other words the doctors did not get paid until the procedure was done.
A problem here is that a lot of money goes to the Board of Directors , who make 6 figure salaries.
There are 35 million dollars of cuts coming to Hamilton Hopsitals, and I have a feeling that a bloated bureaucracy is responsible.

phesina
01-15-2010, 06:40 PM
sparks' dad had a really bad time when he was in hosp - he was sent home way too soon because so many other people with H1N1 were filling up the beds.

I sure hope her dad is doing ok now.

Oh, my God, that's awful. I hope he is doing all right now too.


Anywhere there are baby boomers topping up the population - too few staff, too few resources. :(

You nailed that one, all right. The source of many problems here and everywhere else.

sparks19
01-15-2010, 07:40 PM
I just saw this thread :)

Well many call it a FREE system but it is anything BUT. in Ontario you are taxed out the ying yang. It was 15% then harper put it down to 14%... is it down to 13% now? plus the ridiculous amount they take from your paycheck. and the taxes are super high but the system keeps facing more and more cutbacks. Doctors are leaving because they are overworked and aren't making the money. In london Ontario you cannot find a family physician. they aren't taking any new patients because as it is they are overloaded. The last I heard there was only one doctor taking patients in London and there is a reason she is the only one. she was my doctor for a while. She refused to give me a pregnancy test and told me it was impossible that I was pregnant because I was on birth control. I was extremely sick and lost that child. She has never ONCE correctly diagnosed me. and I know a few other people who had her as a doctor and they had the same issue. One woman was in her 50's and had severe hip pain and that doctor told her it was all in her head. After a spill down the steps directly related to her hip problem it was determined by another doctor that she needed surgery but she couldn't get it right away

My grandmother has been waiting for a hip replacement for quite a few years now... basically they are just trying to wait her out now.

like Catty said my step father recently had a HORRIBLE experience. After a year long sickness and his second surgery he had to go to a hospital an hour away for this surgery. after his surgery he sat in recovery for almost 8 hours because they didn't have a room for him. When recovery started filling up he literally had to stay in a bed in the HALLWAY because there was not a room for him. after a full day he finally got into a room only to be told the next morning that he had to leave because they needed the bed and he wasn't about to die basically. He was doing well for a while but had a relapse a few weeks ago. He called his doctor right away and got on some heavy duty antibiotics and seems to be doing better but he is still not cleared to go back to work.

a friend of mine was pregnant and was a week overdue. the doctor wanted to induce her told her to go home and wait for their call... after a day no call so she called the hospital. "sorry no room you will have to wait" another day goes by still no room and they checked surrounding hospitals and no room in any of those either. She finally asked what would happen if she did go into labor and they told her she would have to go to a town over a half an hour away and hope they had a bed for her. I am DEAD serious. After two more days a bed opened up and she finally got in luckily she didn't go into labor before that.

I have waited in ER over 12 hours before.

They don't have beds, nurses, doctors and they are just losing more and more because of cut backs.

Now every system has it's issues of course. but I just CANNOT in anyway see this working in the US. The US has single STATES with a higher population than all of Canada and Canada can't keep up with the demand. Now imagine 300+ million people all going in for every sniffle and cough or cut or bruise... and it will happen. People WILL start going for everything. I've seen it everytime I've had to set foot into a walk in clinic. There is just NOT enough supply for the demand that is surely going to follow

I mean the government here can't even reliably budget for snowplows to run... and I'm supposed to trust them to budget for our healthcare.

I don't know what the answer is. this system is seriously broken but so is the canadian system. I honestly feel that because it's "free" we (canadians) are more willing to sacrifice quality of care for quantity. We are willing to forgive less than stellar care because it's "prepaid".

but that is just my personal experiences

phesina
01-15-2010, 08:06 PM
Oh ... my .... God...

Thank you very much, sparks. I hope your stepfather will recover and be well enough to work again before long.

Puckstop31
01-16-2010, 05:48 AM
It sounds like we have a Health Security system in Denmark much like Nomilyn describes, and I would definately want it to stay that way - or only rich people could afford to stay healthy. :eek:

??? I am not rich. Yet I can "afford" (we provide ourselves and our staff a decent health care plan) to keep myself and my family healthy.




Going to hospital and doctors doesn't cost anything,

THIS is exactly why, though nobody in them here might admit it, why most "socialized" health plans fail and/or suck.

It DOES cost money. A lot of money actually. Just not YOUR money. The infamous "THEY" pays for you.

Whatever happened to personal responsibility?

Puckstop31
01-16-2010, 05:52 AM
sparks' dad had a really bad time when he was in hosp - he was sent home way too soon because so many other people with H1N1 were filling up the beds.

I sure hope her dad is doing ok now. Anywhere there are baby boomers topping up the population - too few staff, too few resources. :(

H1N1? Really? Can you prove that? If it were not for H1N1, he would have been fine?

I have not seen anywhere near the epidemic the media promised us.

As for staff... Its not much of a issue here. I hear nurses are in high demand though. The health care industry is one of the few that continue to grow.

I wonder why Canada has too few staff and too few resources???

Louie and me
01-16-2010, 07:22 AM
I really hesitated to get into this debate but being a Canadian originally from England I have experienced both national health care systems and cannot imagine what my life would have been like without them.
I recently had my annual physical that included blood tests, a mammogram and a bone density scan. My husband (a heart patient and type 2 diabetic) also had his physical with blood tests and is waiting for an appointment for a colonoscopy as a preventative test.
Since age 45 my husband has had quadruple bypass surgery, three angioplastis and replacement of both hips due to avascular necrosis. I have had surgery for melanoma followed by a sentinal lymph node biopsy. Dispite how it may sound, we are both active and in pretty good health.
I have heard of people who have experienced delays in treatment both in the UK and here in Canada but never for any condition requiring urgent care.
A friend from Missouri just had a defibrillator replaced and the cost was over $250,000US. Fortunately he had health insurance paid for my the Canadian company he used to work for. Now that is scary.

Grace
01-16-2010, 09:13 AM
After reading all the responses, it seems that no matter where one lives, no matter the health insurance/care available, there are both good and bad situations.


. . . . . I am a diabetic and I have several items that I have to buy on a monthly basis. However, they aren't expensive when compared to how much they cost in the USA . . . . . .


BIngo!! This is my main gripe about medical care/supplies in the US - especially for those of us on Medicare.

Medicare seems to think that a non-insulin dependent diabetic should get by testing only once a day - so they will only pay for one strip/day. Being pro-active, I think it important to know what different foods do to my blood glucose - so I test frequently. I can buy 200 strips from Canada (on-line) for $100. Here in the USA companies charge $100 for 100 strips - twice as much!

This being a pet board, I will include some info about pet meds. I use Revolution once a month - prevents ear mites, heart worm, round worm, etc. Buying on-line from a place in Australia (thank you Ellie), I save $20/month over the cost in this country. That's a savings of $240 each year.

pomtzu
01-16-2010, 09:57 AM
I have to agree with Gretchen (Grace) - there is good and bad in every system.

I too am on Medicare and a supplemental private insurance, and those combined cost me a little over $200 per month. With both of those, I have no out of pocket that I have to pay - ever! What Medicare doesn't pay, the supplemental picks up the balance. However I have no prescription coverage since it is quite expensive, and doesn't even cover full cost. For what few meds I take, it's a whole lot cheaper just to pay it on my own, and can get great prices thru Sam's or Canadian pharmacies. Even my brother who takes a pharmacy worth of meds, finds it cheaper thru Sam's or Canada than to carry prescription coverage here.

I cannot fathom having to wait months, or longer, for a non-emergency procedure. The longest I ever waited for a surgical procedure was a couple of weeks, and diagnostic tests such as an MRI or CT Scan, just a few days - blood tests no wait - just walk into the lab and it's done right away. Doctors are plentiful with no real wait for an appointment, and I can go to any doctor of my choice without any referral being necessary.

So even tho I believe that our system in the U.S. has many flaws and in need of fixing, I still prefer what I have over what some other countries have. This country needs to find a way to cover all of it's people that want to be covered. If you don't want insurance, then that's fine, but for those that desperately want and need it but can't afford it, there needs to be some kind of solution.

sparks19
01-16-2010, 12:20 PM
Yeah that's kind of my biggest gripe about that system. I guess because the money is being taken from us BEFORE we even get to see it and anytime we buy anything (that includes nessecity items) so everyone says it's "free" when it's not really free it's just being taken from you before you get to see it and it's still not enough because they keep making more and more cutbacks.

But beyond that... because it is seen as "free" people overlook the wait times for non life threatening things. So yeah if you are about to die without the surgery you get it right away but otherwise you need to just suffer and live your life in pain until they finally find an opening for you... or until you get to my grandmothers age and they just try to wait you out rather than waste their time giving her the hip replacement she needs so badly.

When my step dad went in for his second surgery... he couldn't get an actual date and time for the surgery. He had to just sit and wait for them to call if they had a cancellation. Luckily after just over a week he got a call one night telling him he had to be in for 7 am the next morning because they had a cancellation. then he was booted out about 30 hours later when he was SUPPOSED to stay for 5 days. if they hadn't had that cancellation who knows when he would have gotten in because they couldn't or wouldn't give him a date.

but like Grace said... there is definitely pros and cons to each system although the cons seems to be weighing down the pros for both systems. There's gotta be some middle ground.

cassiesmom
01-16-2010, 08:14 PM
One thing I would like to see change is the way services are paid for. (I work in a claims office) We received a claim for a service that is not covered under the insurance plan I work for. The patient had the service at a hospital in the PPO network, so the claims came in with the billed charges and the contracted rates. But the patient will not get to know the contracted rates - she will get a bill for the services at the billed charges, which are a LOT higher than the contracted rates. That stinks.

The other thing that is frustrating to no end is the cost of prescription drugs.

sparks19
01-16-2010, 08:25 PM
One thing I would like to see change is the way services are paid for. (I work in a claims office) We received a claim for a service that is not covered under the insurance plan I work for. The patient had the service at a hospital in the PPO network, so the claims came in with the billed charges and the contracted rates. But the patient will not get to know the contracted rates - she will get a bill for the services at the billed charges, which are a LOT higher than the contracted rates. That stinks.

The other thing that is frustrating to no end is the cost of prescription drugs.

This I agree with. the way the billing and rates and stuff go here is ridiculous. I know we did a TON of pricing and shopping around when I was pregnant and it AMAZES me the differences between what the customer sees and what insurance sees and not only that but the differences in price between a customer with insurance and a cash customer

there needs to be regulation in that area for sure

catmandu
01-17-2010, 02:43 PM
I heard a story that Chemo Therapy for cancer is outdated, that there are a lot better ways to fight cancer , but that there so much money invested in chemo therapy and chemo therapists that they cant afford to change over.
If you have the money there are cancer clinics that will use these homepathic cures which are easier on the patient , or try to find natural meds to fight this on the internet.

Cataholic
01-17-2010, 02:57 PM
One thing I would like to see change is the way services are paid for. (I work in a claims office) We received a claim for a service that is not covered under the insurance plan I work for. The patient had the service at a hospital in the PPO network, so the claims came in with the billed charges and the contracted rates. But the patient will not get to know the contracted rates - she will get a bill for the services at the billed charges, which are a LOT higher than the contracted rates. That stinks.



This happened to me. J had speech, covered at 20 visits a year, cause anyone knows that speech problems clear up on that 20th visit, duh!

Anyhow, I asked if I could continue the service, at the discounted rate, and was denied. Add that on top of the fact the insurer did not count the payments made for additional speech treatment as medical care going towards the significant deductible, and things stunk.

I think one of the largest lobbying groups in DC is the insurance industry. Too bad, as that will keep things the way they are for a long time now.

carole
01-17-2010, 03:07 PM
I can't even begin to understand the American Health system, but all I know is i prefer what we have here from what i do understand, no health system is perfect and our's is far from it either.

We have waiting lists like any other public system,and because of that i choose to have private medical insurance at least for surgery cover, i cannot really afford anything else.

We do have subsidised Doctors visits and ACC here which contributes to your care if you have an accident, that recently had an overhaul and we are now paying a lot more than we used to, i guess our government just cannot sustain it as is.

We have free dental care until you are 18, providing it is just standard care,not for wisdom teeth removal that sort of thing, and free blood tests still at this stage, i am wondering how long that will last though.

All in all i am happy with it as it is,but i guess it is because i have the security of knowing if i need surgery i can have it quickly due to taking out insurance, but i pay through the nose for that, and i will not be able to continue paying as i get older, as it will be too expensive and i will have to rely on the public system then.

At accident and emergency they try and get you out within 6hrs, which is far too long, we went there recently with my mother and were there for four hours, so that is not too good.

Killearn Kitties
01-20-2010, 11:57 AM
Are there many people in your country who want to do away with the medical system you have there and adopt one like ours?

Phesina, there must be people in Britain who would like to abolish the NHS and set up a US-style system, but I can honestly say I have never met one.

What do we hear about the American system? That it is possible your medical condition will go untreated if you do not have the money/insurance to pay for it. Frankly, this freaks us out. As a nation we tend not to believe that your right to healthcare should be dependant on your income.

pomtzu
01-20-2010, 12:14 PM
What do we hear about the American system? That it is possible your medical condition will go untreated if you do not have the money/insurance to pay for it. Frankly, this freaks us out. As a nation we tend not to believe that your right to healthcare should be dependant on your income.

And I think that this is the biggest flaw in the U.S. system.

However, I don't believe that there is a hospital ER that would ever refuse to treat a patient, just because he had no insurance. I may be wrong, but I believe it's law that someone be treated, regardless of insurance coverage, race, ability to speak English, and some others that I can't put my finger on right now. I know that all satellite offices and clinics of the local medical center have signs posted stating this.

carole
01-20-2010, 01:28 PM
I have to agree with Killearns Kitties, that is exactly what we hear over here as well, we have a pretty similar system to the British i think, and i want it to stay that way.

phesina
01-20-2010, 01:45 PM
And I think that this is the biggest flaw in the U.S. system.

However, I don't believe that there is a hospital ER that would ever refuse to treat a patient, just because he had no insurance. I may be wrong, but I believe it's law that someone be treated, regardless of insurance coverage, race, ability to speak English, and some others that I can't put my finger on right now. I know that all satellite offices and clinics of the local medical center have signs posted stating this.

That is true that a hospital emergency room must treat everyone who comes in. However, the result is that the ER has become the family doctor for people who don't have health insurance. You have a headache? Kid has the sniffles? Off to the hospital to sit and wait for several hours for someone to see you! This is a phenomenal waste of money and health care resources.

pomtzu
01-20-2010, 02:10 PM
That is true that a hospital emergency room must treat everyone who comes in. However, the result is that the ER has become the family doctor for people who don't have health insurance. You have a headache? Kid has the sniffles? Off to the hospital to sit and wait for several hours for someone to see you! This is a phenomenal waste of money and health care resources.

Exactly! And this is why the hospitals and doctors and clinics charge such outlandish prices - to make up for the freebies. I'm definitely not saying this is right, but it will continue to happen. And who takes the beating in the end??? - you and me - paying for it in the form of higher insurance premiums - or cost in general if we don't have insurance.

A couple of years ago I fractured my wrist and arrived at the ER around midnight. When I got checked in I asked the clerk about how long a wait I had, and she said there were patients in the waiting room that had been there for about 5 hours. I just kind of groaned with the thought of that wait, but she said they would take me right back. The ones that had been waiting were no emergencies - a headache, baby with diaper rash, and some other ridiculous "ailments". After my x-ray and my orthopedic surgeon saw me, he had to laugh and tell me that there were some people not too happy with me. It seems that the ones with nothing really wrong and were still waiting , made a complaint that I had been taken ahead of them. They have no insurance, use the ER as their primary care, have someone else footing their bill - and they complain???? What's wrong with that picture??

sparks19
01-20-2010, 02:58 PM
That is true that a hospital emergency room must treat everyone who comes in. However, the result is that the ER has become the family doctor for people who don't have health insurance. You have a headache? Kid has the sniffles? Off to the hospital to sit and wait for several hours for someone to see you! This is a phenomenal waste of money and health care resources.

but that isn't something that will stop with a different system. that's one of those things that is going to be that way no matter what. Doctor can't see you right away? off to the ER. Can't find a family doctor that is taking patients? of to the ER. After doctors hours? of to the ER.

I've waited TWELVE hours in the ER before :O

Killearn Kitties
01-20-2010, 03:11 PM
but that isn't something that will stop with a different system. that's one of those things that is going to be that way no matter what. Doctor can't see you right away? off to the ER. Can't find a family doctor that is taking patients? of to the ER. After doctors hours? of to the ER.

I've waited TWELVE hours in the ER before :O

I don't understand where you are coming from here. Why would anybody wait in an enormous queue in ER when they could go to their family doctor? I can certainly say that that does not happen here.

Grace
01-20-2010, 03:15 PM
I don't understand where you are coming from here. Why would anybody wait in an enormous queue in ER when they could go to their family doctor? I can certainly say that that does not happen here.

I'm guessing sparks did the ER waiting on a weekend or holiday when Family Docs are not available.

sparks19
01-20-2010, 03:39 PM
I don't understand where you are coming from here. Why would anybody wait in an enormous queue in ER when they could go to their family doctor? I can certainly say that that does not happen here.

because in London ontario you can't GET a family doctor. none of them are taking patients. Plus it was after hours anyway and I had huge white plotches on my throat that was affecting my breathing. Turned out I had mono and they couldn't do anything for me anyway.

Now I'm speaking specifically about london because thats where most of my experience lies. But unless you have had a family doctor for many years you can't get a new one. there aren't enough doctors for the demand and they have all stopped taking patients as theya re over loaded as it is. And if you DO have a family doctor you often can't get in same day or next day. you have to wait sometimes a week or more.

So... they go to the ER because what other option do they have?

here in Lancaster we have luckily not had to use the ER although we almost did once when Hannah had a high fever and vomitting but we got her fever down and didn't end up having to go but that was on a sunday night at like 7 pm. But I have called Hannah's doctor first thing in the morning when she's been sick and gotten an appt for a few hours later.

sparks19
01-20-2010, 03:41 PM
I'm guessing sparks did the ER waiting on a weekend or holiday when Family Docs are not available.

not that particular time but that is another issue. family doctors don't work around the clock and you don't always get sick on their schedule lol so people cram into the ER.

pomtzu
01-20-2010, 03:49 PM
not that particular time but that is another issue. family doctors don't work around the clock and you don't always get sick on their schedule lol so people cram into the ER.

I think that Grace and KK thought you waited 12 hours in a U.S. hospital - when it was a Canadian hospital.

Not everybody knows that you're an import!!! :D

Killearn Kitties
01-20-2010, 03:49 PM
Well the situation in London, Ontario sounds horrific. All I can say is that it is a million miles away from the situation here.

sparks19
01-20-2010, 03:52 PM
Well the situation in London, Ontario sounds horrific. All I can say is that it is a million miles away from the situation here.

yeah... the system pretty much sucks in London lol. it's actually not THAT bad in other places in Ontario and I don't know about other provinces but if there were a list I could find I would bet London would be at the bottom. and on top of that they CLOSED one of the hospitals there so that's one less hospital taking patients.

but my basic point was when you have a HUGE population I don't think there is much that can be done about the ER being full with people who probably dont' NEED to be there

sparks19
01-20-2010, 03:53 PM
I think that Grace and KK thought you waited 12 hours in a U.S. hospital - when it was a Canadian hospital.

Not everybody knows that you're an import!!! :D

LOL an import

yeah I've yet to actually experience an ER visit here... but as Hannah gets older I'm sure I will be old hat when it comes to that lol

Killearn Kitties
01-20-2010, 04:01 PM
but my basic point was when you have a HUGE population I don't think there is much that can be done about the ER being full with people who probably dont' NEED to be there

Yes I know I don't post in the Dog House, but I still know that this doesn't accord with your political view ... but there is something that can be done about the ER being full of people who don't need to be there ... give them access to a family doctor!!!

sparks19
01-20-2010, 04:07 PM
Yes I know I don't post in the Dog House, but I still know that this doesn't accord with your political view ... but there is something that can be done about the ER being full of people who don't need to be there ... give them access to a family doctor!!!

but if the family doctors aren't taking patients... what can you do? I mean here in the US they are because not everyone has one and with this population if it becomes "free" then they are going to become over run. there jsut aren't enough doctors for the demand and when everyone starts flocking to the doctors for every sniffle and sneeze and bruise they get full and overworked. this is what happened in London. People started going to the doctor for every little thing and they filled up... so they started walk in clinics... now because of the family doctor shortage the walk in clinics can be just as long a wait as the ER.

They can't work around the clock and can only handle so many patients. when the patient load gets to be too much they stop taking new ones. I know even some pediatricians here aren't taking new patients because they are filled.

and.. again... after hours if you need help where else can you go but to the ER.

Grace
01-20-2010, 04:33 PM
I think that Grace and KK thought you waited 12 hours in a U.S. hospital - when it was a Canadian hospital.

Not everybody knows that you're an import!!! :D

Actually, I thought she might be talking about an ER in this country. I do know she's an import, and a very talented one :)

I once spent 9 hours in an ER. Oh, I started getting treatment immediately for my trimalleolar ankle fracture, but it was so busy, and the Ortho guy kept having to run up to one of the patient units. Not a fun time.

pomtzu
01-20-2010, 04:45 PM
Actually, I thought she might be talking about an ER in this country. I do know she's an import, and a very talented one :)

I once spent 9 hours in an ER. Oh, I started getting treatment immediately for my trimalleolar ankle fracture, but it was so busy, and the Ortho guy kept having to run up to one of the patient units. Not a fun time.

Yes - she is - I have to agree with you about Sparks.

With my wrist fracture, they shot me up with a lot of pain meds, splinted it really good, and sent me home, to come back in the a.m. for surgery.

Killearn Kitties
01-20-2010, 04:57 PM
but if the family doctors aren't taking patients... what can you do? I mean here in the US they are because not everyone has one and with this population if it becomes "free" then they are going to become over run. there jsut aren't enough doctors for the demand and when everyone starts flocking to the doctors for every sniffle and sneeze and bruise they get full and overworked. this is what happened in London. People started going to the doctor for every little thing and they filled up... so they started walk in clinics... now because of the family doctor shortage the walk in clinics can be just as long a wait as the ER.

They can't work around the clock and can only handle so many patients. when the patient load gets to be too much they stop taking new ones. I know even some pediatricians here aren't taking new patients because they are filled.

and.. again... after hours if you need help where else can you go but to the ER.

Forgive me for being so thick, but I just don't get that. People here don't go to the doctor for every sniffle, sneeze and bruise, so why would they do that anywhere else?

Does the Canadian system really make no provision for out-of-hours consultation? The British system does.

sparks19
01-20-2010, 05:01 PM
Thank you both :o

Yeah I've been to the ER more times then I would like to remember lol.

At least the time I went when I waited 12 hours (6 were in the waiting room and other 6 were in a bed at least) they had a tv with a vcr and lots of disney movies so I watched Mary Poppins and two others lol.

When the doctor finally came in he made me lay down, looked at my throat, tapped on my stomach and said ... I think you have mono. drew some blood and sent me home. so the actual exam was less than 5 minutes lol and I was TICKED to find out it WAS mono and I basically had to suffer through it but at least he gave me some good anti inflammatories to help my throat just too bad I had to crush them up because my throat was so sore and swollen that I couldn't swallow them.

Mono is something I wouldn't wish on ANYONE.

The time I broke my leg... I don't really remember anything about that trip other than I did NOT want to go to the hospital because I was scared (I was 8) so I think I blocked o ut that whole experience in my mind lol.

Grace
01-20-2010, 05:05 PM
Mono is something I wouldn't wish on ANYONE.


I was 7 when I had Mono. It used to be called the Kissing Disease, but I wasn't that type at 7 ;)

sparks19
01-20-2010, 05:08 PM
Forgive me for being so thick, but I just don't get that. People here don't go to the doctor for every sniffle, sneeze and bruise, so why would they do that anywhere else?

Does the Canadian system really make no provision for out-of-hours consultation? The British system does.

I don't know WHY they do that... but they do. I've seen people taking their kids to the walk in clinic because they were sick but the kid spent the entire time running around the office. I've also known people who have skipped out of work and then gone to the doctors to try to get a note SAYING they were sick when they weren't and to get a note you have to see the doctor.

Oh yeah.. it really does happen. People go in for everything and anything and then get mad when someone who is REALLY sick gets taken in before them.

no there is no after hours consultation. if you are sick or injured after doctors hours... you go to the hospital... especially if you don't have a family physician.

I remember the doctor I had for a while (she was the only one taking patients in ALL of london and there was a reason she had openings...because she was the worst doctor I have ever encountered) she was closed on Mondays, open tuesdays, half day wednesday, full day thrusday and closed on Friday, saturday Sunday. because she had SO few in office hours it could take two WEEKS to get in to see her. One time I was going to have my yearly woman exam done and apparently they are only allowed to do a certain amount of PAP's in a month (don't get that but that's what I was told) so I couldn't get an appt with her for THAT particular thing for THREE months. so yeah... no after hours visits at ALL

sparks19
01-20-2010, 05:09 PM
I was 7 when I had Mono. It used to be called the Kissing Disease, but I wasn't that type at 7 ;)

HAHA yeah I was 16 I think when I had it... but if it's the kissing disease I would have had to have someone to kiss :O

sparks19
01-21-2010, 03:41 PM
I just wanted to share this since we were talking about long wait times at the ER vs just going to your family doctor.

I was just talking to a friend of mine back home and she's had a "boo boo" for a bit now and had an appt with her family doctor ... and waited two hours.

Over worked, understaffed.

carole
01-21-2010, 05:14 PM
Woah that is not on, i would never expect to wait more than 15mins if i had made an appointment with my doctor, unless there was an emergency or something, i would be changing my doctor for sure.

RICHARD
01-21-2010, 05:29 PM
Woah that is not on, i would never expect to wait more than 15mins if i had made an appointment with my doctor, unless there was an emergency or something, i would be changing my doctor for sure.

The HMO I worked for had a policy that a physician was scheduled 15-20 minutes PER PATIENT.

Just enough time to read the nurse's notes and have him say "hmm" and "exactly where does it hurt..";)


Henry Phord made it work assembling cars....:eek::o

sparks19
01-21-2010, 05:56 PM
Woah that is not on, i would never expect to wait more than 15mins if i had made an appointment with my doctor, unless there was an emergency or something, i would be changing my doctor for sure.



But she can't because there are no doctors taking on new patients so you kinda gotta keep what you got even if it's not ideal.

but yeah two hours is a long time to wait when you've made an appt. I know i've waited 45 mintues here one time with Hannah's back up doc but that's because he is VERY thorough :)

Marigold2
01-23-2010, 09:57 PM
Does anyone who lives out of the US want to trade their healthcare system for ours??? ANYONE???

Marigold2
01-23-2010, 10:11 PM
Working for two Dr's I know that sometimes we do get behind and people have to wait up to an hour.
1) Emergency. Eye Dr's get a ton of these, metal in the eye from factory workers, infection, something poked in eye, pencil, tree branch, fall on a fork or people in car accident, fallen down steps, punched in the face, glass in eye, animal ripped eye the list goes on and on. The ED sends them to us, they won't cut the metal out of the eye, our Dr does.
2) People arrive late, get lost, etc.
3) We work with a lot of elderly. They can not hear, can not see, don't understand the directions (they do drive to the app however). Explaining the surgery to them 2 then 3 then 4 times same questions over and over. What should have taken 10 minutes takes 27. They come in with walkers, take forever to refract or even to understand the directions on their drops.
We don't rush them. We understand that for some of these people we are the only ones they talk to all week maybe all month, they bring in pictures of their pets, grandchildren, they have no one, no one to even drive to the hospital for surgery. We have to plead with their family or neighbors to help. The hospital will not release them after surgery to a taxi and of course they cannnot drive. We are patient and kind and treat them with respect and it takes time. These are our WW11 veterans these are people who worked all their lives and now need surgery need help and we don't rush them. So yes you might have to wait but when you do see the Dr (who was voted one of the best in the country) he really listens to you, calms your fears, answers your questions and you are not rushed or made to feel like a number, so sit down, take a magazine and kindly wait your turn.
Woah that is not on, i would never expect to wait more than 15mins if i had made an appointment with my doctor, unless there was an emergency or something, i would be changing my doctor for sure.

carole
01-24-2010, 02:33 PM
I hear what you are saying Marigold, i too have worked in the health system, a private surgical hospital, and i sure know that some things are beyond control, and stuff just happens, however i have never had to wait longer than 15 mins to see a doctor if i have made an appointment, if you just walk casually in to the drop in doctor or ER you can expect 1 to 2 hour waits, and at the hospital up to six hours wait, still it is far too long, but yep stuff does happen,

In answer to your question , no sorry i would not swap my health system for your's. Thanks anyway lol.:)

Cataholic
01-24-2010, 04:30 PM
I am with Carole, I wouldn't wait more than 15 minutes for a doctor. Heck, the whole appointment isn't much longer than 10 minutes, LOL!

sparks19
01-24-2010, 04:55 PM
they won't cut the metal out of the eye

Ok off topic ....

But did reading this make anyone else's eyes water LOL

*shudder*

Medusa
01-24-2010, 09:26 PM
Regarding waiting for a dr. appt, I call ahead and ask how they're running, if they're behind or on time. If they say 'behind', I ask how far and if the answer is, say, 15 minutes, then I tell them that I'll be 15 minutes late. I will not sit in a dr's office and wait. I realize there are emergencies but aside from that, there's no reason to leave us sitting there. I used to do the same thing w/my old vet, too, but this one is on the ball and I've never had to wait. I started this practice when a dr. kept me waiting for a ridiculously long time only to find out that two other people in the lobby had the same appt. time. I sent him a bill for my time. He didn't pay it, of course, but he got the point. I didn't go back to him anyhow, though, but I felt good after sending that bill.

carole
01-25-2010, 01:46 PM
Good for you Mary,way to go girl.:):D

Louie and me
01-25-2010, 02:37 PM
I had a small lump removed ten days ago and it was sent for biopsy. This morning I received an email from my doctor with the results (nothing scary). he had emailed it at 10:15pm Sunday night! Now there's a dedicated doctor.

Killearn Kitties
01-25-2010, 04:33 PM
Sending you my best wishes Louie and Me. :) Hope everything is OK.

My father in law is in hospital just now and we have had lots of communication during the week and over the weekend letting us know what is going on. He cannot speak highly enough of the care he is receiving.

RICHARD
01-26-2010, 11:03 PM
I met my GF at the HMO we both worked at.

As I type this the phone rang and a computer voice is telling me that there is an important message for some National Elderly health plan..I swear to god.

We lived together for a while but, she never used my parent's home address for any kind of a mail drop.

She passed away in March of '02, while under their care.

----------------

I went out to check the mail today and there was a letter, sent in her name, but with my parent's address on it.

They wanted to know if she would like health coverage from the company. I cannot even think of how the got her name and linked it to this address.

LOLOLOLOL, it's a computer generated letter, so now that the hospitals have gone high tech, nothing is sacred.


I have railed before about how the computer systems are just another setback for patient care and record keeping.


These morons cannot even figure out people are dead and they want health care reform done on their terms.


I am not beyond words at the moment, I just can't use them.

What a bunch morons, we are doomed.:confused::o:rolleyes:

caseysmom
01-26-2010, 11:06 PM
Sorry you had to go through that Richard, that kind of stuff is unspeakable. A good friend of mine lost her husband 2 years ago and got a wedding invitation for their grandson's wedding, the bride to be's family sent the invitation to her and her husband...what idiots.

RICHARD
01-26-2010, 11:34 PM
Sorry you had to go through that Richard, that kind of stuff is unspeakable. A good friend of mine lost her husband 2 years ago and got a wedding invitation for their grandson's wedding, the bride to be's family sent the invitation to her and her husband...what idiots.


Check this out.

I swear this is true,

My dad and GF dies w/in 6 months of each other.

In the same batch of mail?

I got a letter and on the lower left hand corner of the envelope?

FREE Pre-paid Cremation!
Detail inside.

If it's prepaid, it should be free?:eek::rolleyes:

RICHARD
01-29-2010, 06:43 PM
Here's one to marinate on?

I called my sis and she was upset.

She went to the doctor's office and while she was talking to him she found out that there was a mix up with her medical records.

She has three different chart jackets-all three have to do with her treatment and two have info that together, would have kept the two doctors who are treating her from giving her two types of treatment that contraindicate each other...

Meaning?

Had she not investigated/or spoke to her primary physician-the two treatments together may have killer her.

Lovely.

I worked in a records room for years and that was a HUGE bug up my arse.

Don't take for granted that a physician/surgeon/hospital/HMO knows that you....

Got married.
Hyphenated your name.
Changed your name.
Got divorced
or have entered a witness protection program.

YOU are half of your 'medical team' and if you don't take care of YOUR end of the job?

I had taken the calls of STUPID PATIENTS that have been wed, changed their names, dropped their coverage under their old name, then gone on the spouse's coverage with their new names....All the while accusing me/hospital of losing their records.:rolleyes:

morons.

trayi52
01-29-2010, 08:34 PM
What about Medicare? Somebody seems to have forgotten the people on Medicare, meaning the people in Washington. They are not giving raises for the next two years, and medicine is sky high! My God, we are the poor, but I haven't even heard him talk about the poor, just the middle class, and the rich.(Obama, that is). Maybe I have missed that speech, if I have, sorry.

Willie

blue
02-02-2010, 07:52 PM
Wait a minute.


Danny Williams going to U.S. for heart surgery
Last Updated: Tuesday, February 2, 2010 | 7:21 AM NT Comments632Recommend246

CBC News
N.L. Premier Danny Williams is scheduled to have surgery this week. (CBC)

Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams is set to undergo heart surgery this week in the United States.

CBC News confirmed Monday that Williams, 60, left the province earlier in the day and will have surgery later in the week.

The premier's office provided few details, beyond confirming that he would have heart surgery and saying that it was not necessarily a routine procedure.

Deputy Premier Kathy Dunderdale is scheduled to hold a news conference Tuesday morning.

She's expected to provide more details about Williams's condition, as well as how the provincial government will function during his absence.

CBC reporter David Cochrane said Williams appeared to be in good health recently. He described the premier as "fairly active," playing pick-up hockey at least once a week when work permits.

Catty1
02-02-2010, 08:28 PM
Hi, blue - haven't seen you for a bit!

If Danny Williams needs a non-routine heart procedure, chances are the wait lists are too long in Newfoundland.

It has happened here in Alberta that the provincial health system has paid for a critical procedure to be done out-of-province, and also in the USA.

One's doctor has to apply, of course - you can't just jump the border and check in to the hospital.

But yeah, it does happen. Hopefully there will be more details in the days to come.

If you can pay for it - you can go to where the treatment is. I did that with my sleep test.

blue
02-02-2010, 11:02 PM
Hi, blue - haven't seen you for a bit!

I havent gone anywhere.


you can't just jump the border and check in to the hospital.

Sure you can, you said so yourself. :D


If you can pay for it - you can go to where the treatment is. I did that with my sleep test.

I need to get one of those sleep tests done myself.

RICHARD
02-09-2010, 09:53 AM
Hey,

We just killed one of our state reps with a bad surgery.

I would have thought they killed him by by hemorrhaging.

Nope, They nicked his bowel.

Truly tragic....

I'm betting on a resident surgeon to be involved.:(

wombat2u2004
02-14-2010, 09:04 AM
Hey,

We just killed one of our state reps with a bad surgery.

I would have thought they killed him by by hemorrhaging.

Nope, They nicked his bowel.

Truly tragic....

I'm betting on a resident surgeon to be involved.:(

Can they go that surgeon for medical negligence ????
Sometimes it's just so hard to prove, and when it does happen the medico's close ranks. That's what happens here.
I attended a funeral of one of my veteran welfare clients on Friday, we all know here what happened to him, he was wrongly diagnosed a couple of years ago by one of our doctors here, by the time he was properly diagnosed, the cancer had spread too far, and he was gone.

RICHARD
02-16-2010, 03:07 PM
Can they go that surgeon for medical negligence ????
Sometimes it's just so hard to prove, and when it does happen the medico's close ranks. That's what happens here.
I attended a funeral of one of my veteran welfare clients on Friday, we all know here what happened to him, he was wrongly diagnosed a couple of years ago by one of our doctors here, by the time he was properly diagnosed, the cancer had spread too far, and he was gone.


It depends.

If you join a Health Maintenance Orgranization, somemtimes you sign away your right to sue. All claims are handled by an ombudsman, who is supposed to be impartial. In your dreams.

About 6 months before I was fired from my job, a 35-40 year old man had his hepatic artery nicked and bled to death on the table, A simple gall bladder surgery, done by a resident, gone wrong.

Another thing that people do not realize is that some hosptial have 'incident reports' that are not part of a medical record, those are filled out and submitted to a Quality Assurance office/group and they bury those beause of the possible liabilites that may arise should the 'real story' get out.:eek:

wombat2u2004
02-17-2010, 04:32 AM
Ombudsman Office is the same here, they are toothless tigers.
As they say mate, doctors mistakes are buried.

RICHARD
04-03-2010, 06:08 PM
Here's a HUGE problem with the companies that make implant/med devices.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36158151/ns/business-the_new_york_times


The ortho surgeon mentions the DePuy and Zimmer hips.

Those hips have been failing since 2006. There was a rush of people having implants redone because of defects in the joints.

Also?

In the summer of '06 there was a rush of defibrillator surgeries because the mfg. recalled scads of them.

The hospital had to set up special rooms where the surgeons/cardiologists did nothing but replacement surgeries. The whole OR was sent into a panic and the reps from the company had to come in with replacement defibs and work all day to help change them out.

-----------------------

As the population ages, the use of artificial hips and knees is growing fast, providing a lucrative market for device manufacturers. Sales of artificial hips and knees in this country reached an estimated $6.7 billion last year, and the devices have one of the highest profit margins of any medical product. An artificial joint can cost $3,000 to $15,000.

------------------

It is impossible to know how many artificial hips and knees fail early because of design or manufacturing problems, because the United States, unlike some other countries, has no database to track such procedures. Also, implant companies and doctors say that such devices primarily fail because of issues unrelated to the product.

LOL, this has got to be the biggest lie on the planet.

Implants come with bar coded labels that are supposed to be attached to the operating room record and surgery procedure records. The are also serial numbered and the reps that sell them do keep track of lot and serial numbers.

Since most operating rooms track surgeries by computer? They just have to pull all hip and knee surgeries, then pull out the cases when a patient name is repeated.

And to top that off? Sugeries that are redone are coded as a "Revision" which means that it was done once and redone a second time.

---------------

This is one part of the Health Care Reform that should have been addresed BEFORE anything was voted on.

But, common sense isn't running rampant anywhere near the seat of power for the U.S. gov't.

Morons.

RICHARD
04-04-2010, 07:59 PM
http://www.aolnews.com/politics/article/rep-gerry-connolly-in-trouble-after-health-care-vote/19423395?icid=main|main|dl1|link5|http%3A%2F%2Fwww .aolnews.com%2Fpolitics%2Farticle%2Frep-gerry-connolly-in-trouble-after-health-care-vote%2F19423395

Susan Lydick, 51, is not one of them. She approached Connolly after the Rotary speech.

"I just have to thank you for your vote. It's going to make a big difference in my life," said Lydick, a Fairfax psychologist. Both of her daughters have mental health problems, and one of her biggest worries is how they will get health insurance on their own. Under the new law, insurance companies can't deny coverage to those with pre-existing conditions.


How do you think her kids got mental? Ya think?;)

wombat2u2004
04-05-2010, 01:44 AM
How do you think her kids got mental? Ya think?;)

They were dropped on their heads at birth ???? :p