What is in the HCR Bill.

[blue]

President Barack Obama says Americans wary of a government-run health care plan should look no further than Medicare.

Source (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090811/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_medicare).

I thought part of the mad rush for HCR was that medicare/caid were under funded? Either way, neither are very efficiant.

At a town hall meeting Obama used the USPS as an example of how well .gov works at running programs.


Meanwhile, at another point of today's town hall meeting, Obama was pushing back against the idea that the creation of a new government-run plan would drive private insurers out of business, and he said that UPS and FedEx were doing fine, but "it's the Post Office that's always having problems." Oops!

Source (http://spectator.org/blog/2009/08/11/obama-lies-on-single-payer-dis).

Obama's own Science Czar wrote that forced abortions and sterilizations should be used for population control, so is it really a stretch to think that .gov wouldnt have death pannels to keep HCR costs down? I for one dont think so.

If you think the Patriot Act was bad read on, both the bill and the analysis. If anybody has a link with analysis that is supportive of the HRC bill post it up, we all need to see both sides.

Link for full text of bill, http://edlabor.house.gov/documents/111/pdf/publications/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf.



The HC Monstrosity-All 1,018 Pages

Since Congress doesn’t want to read the Health Care Bill and Obama, ACORN, Unions, Lawyers, & Special Interest Groups don’t want you to know whats in this monstrosity, I decided to do it myself. I’ve taken all my tweets on the HC bill and put them into one single place for your enjoyment. Additionally here is the link to the full bill – Health Care Bill

Update: Folks, I’ve done this analysis and provided the fruit of my efforts here for free. I want all of you who read this to share it with as many people as possible. I’ve now come across sites that have advertising or services that generate income. No biggie, I love capitalism, but some have been using my work as their own. So I’m requiring that if any person or entity uses my work in any form then they must link to my blog and attribute my hard work to me. It’s still free but please give credit where credit is due.

Enjoy and remember – the President & Congress are YOUR servants, not the other way around.

PG 1018 States give up some of their State Sovereignty.


PG 1003 9-11 National Med Dev Reg ‘‘(iii) other postmarket device surveillance activities” U WILL b tracked.

PG 1001 The Govt will establish a National Medical Device Registry. Will u be tracked?


PG 994 School Based Health Clinic will be integrated into the school environment. Say GOVT Brainwash!

PG 993 Govt will establish school based health clinics. Ur kids wont have a chance.


PG 950- 980 BIG GOVT core pub health infrastruc. incl workforce capacity, lab systems; health info sys, etc

PG 942 Lines 22-25 More Govt? Offices of Surg. Gen. -Public Health Svc, MinorityHealth, Women’s Health


PG 936 Govt will develop “Healthy People & National Public Health Perform. Standards” Tell me what 2 eat?

PG 935 21-22 Govt will identify specific goals & obj 4 prevention & wellness activities. Control U

Pg 932 The Govt will estab Preventative & Wellness Trust fund- intial cost of $30,800,000,000-Billion


PG 915 SEC. 2251. Govt MANDATES Cultural & linguistic competency trng 4 HC professionals.

PG 913-914 Govt starts a HC affirmative action program thru guise of diversity scholarships.

PG 910 The Govt will develop, build & run Public Health Training Centers.


PG 901 The Public Health Workforce Corps WILL incl commissioned Regular & Reserve Officers. HC Draft? WTF!

PG 900 The Public Health Workforce Corps includes veterinarians

PG 898 The Public health workforce corps shall consist of civilian employees of the U.S. as Secretary deems.

PG 898 The Public health workforce corps shall consist of officers of Regular & Reserve Corps of Service.

PG 898 The Govt will establish a Public Health Workforce Corps. 2 ensure supply of public health prof.

PG 876-892 The govt takes over the education of our Med students and Drs

PG 865 to 876 The NHS Corps is a program where Drs. perform mandatory HC for 2yrs for part loan repayment

Pg 865 The Govt will MANDATE the establishment of a National Health Service Corps

Pg 859 Govt will establish a Public Health Fund at a cost of $88,800,000,000. Yes thats Billion.

PG 844-845 OMG! This Home Visitation Prog. includes Govt coming in2 ur house & telling u how 2 parent

Pg 838-840 Govt will design & implem. Home Visitation Prog 4 families w young kids & families expect kids.

PG 835 11-13 fees imposed by Govt for Trust Fund shall be treated as if they were taxes. No sh*t


PG 829-833 Govt will impose a fee on ALL private health ins. plans incl. self insured to pay for Trust Fund!


Pg 810 SEC. 1759. Billing Agents, clearinghouses, etc req. 2 register. Govt takes over private payment sys.


PG 801 Sec 1751 The Govt will decide which Health care conditions will be paid. Say RATION!


Pg 789-797 Govt will set, mandate drug prices, controlling which drugs brought 2 mrkt. Bye innovation


Pg 770 SEC 1714 Fed Govt mandates eligibility 4 State Family Planning Svcs. Say abortion & State Sovereign.


Pg 769 3-5 Nurse Home Visit Svcs – “increasing birth intervals btwn pregnancies.” Govt ABORTIONS any1?


Pg 769 11-14 Nurse Home Visit Svcs include-economic self-sufficiency, employ adv, school-readiness. WTF?!!


Pg 769 3-5 Nurse Home Visit Svcs – “increasing birth intervals btwn pregnancies.” Govt Abortions any1?


Pg 768 Sec 1713 Govt – Nurse Home Visitation Svcs (Hello union paybacks)

Pg 765 Sec 1711 Govt will require Preventative Services including vaccines. (Choice?)


Pg 757-762 Fed govt will shift burden of payments 2 Disproportionate Share Hospitals (DSH) 2 States. (Taxes)



PG 740-757 Govt sets guidelines 4 subsidizing the uninsured (Thats UR tax dollars peeps)


Pg 735 lines 16-25 For law enforce. purposes the Secretary-HHS will give Atty General access to ALL data.


PG 724 23-25 PG 725 1-5 The same Govt certifications will apply 2 medicaid & CHIP (ur kids)


PG 722 Sec 1639 Govt MANDATES Doctors must have face2face w patient 2 certify patient 4 Home Health Svcs.


PG 724 Lines 16-22 Govt reserves rt 2 apply face2face certification 4 patient to ANY other HC service.


PG 732 Sec 1639 Govt MANDATES Doctors must have face2face w patient 2 certify patient 4 Home Health Svcs.


Pg 719-720 Sec 1637 ANY Doctor who orders durable med equip or home med svcs MUST b enrolled in Medicare.


PG 711 Lines 8-14 The Secretary has broad powers to deny HC providers/suppliers admittance into HC Exchng.


Pg 686-700 Increased Funding 2 Fight Waste, Fraud, and Abuse. LMAO!! U mean the Govt w an $18 mil website?


Pg 676-686 Govt will regulate hospitals in EVERY aspect of residency programs, incl. teaching hospitals.


PG 660-671 Doctors in Residency – Govt will tell U where ur residency will b, thus where u’ll live.


Pg 654-659 Public Reporting on Health Care-Associated Infections – Looks okay.


Pg 635 to 653 Physicians Payments Sunshine Provision – Govt wants to shine sunlight on Docs but not Govt.

PG 633 14-25/ 634 1-9 The Secretary may issue non-endorsed “Qual Measures” 4 Physician Svcs & Dialysis Svcs.


PG 633 14-25/ 634 1-9 The Secretary may issue non-endorsed “Qual Measures” 4 Physician Svcs & Dialysis Svcs.


Pg 632 Lines 14-25 The Govt may implement any “Quality measure” of HC Services as they see fit.


Pg 630 9-24/631 1-9 Those Multi-stake holder groups incl. Unions & groups like ACORN deciding HC quality.


Pg 628 Sec 1443 Govt will give “Multi-Stake Holders” Pre-Rule Making input in2 Selection of “Quality” Measures


PG 624 “Quality” measures shall b designd to profile u including race, age, gender, place of residence, etc


PG 624 “Quality” measures shall b designd 2 assess outcomes & functional status of patients.


Pg 622 Lines 2-9 To pay 4 the Qual Standards Govt will xsfer $$ from 2 other Govt Trust Funds. More Taxes.


PG 621 Lines 20-25 Govt will define what Quality means in HC. Since when does Govt know about quality?


PG 524 18-22 Comparative Effectiveness Research Trust Fund set up. More taxes for ALL.


PG 518 Lines 21-25 The Commission will have input from HC consumer reps – Can u say unions & ACORN?


PG 506 Lines 19-21 The Center will recommend policies that would allow for public access of data.


Pg 504 Lines 6-10 The “Center” will collect data both pub & unpub (that means public & ur private info)

Pg 503 lines 21-25 Govt may secure data directly from any depart or agency of the US incl ur data.


Pg 503 Lines 13-19 Govt will build registries and data networks from YOUR electronic med records.


PG 502 Sec 1181 Ctr 4 Comparative Effectiveness Research Established. – Hello Big Brother – Literally.


Pg 494-498 Govt will cover Mental Health Svcs including defining, creating, rationing those svcs.



PG 489 Sec 1308 The Govt will cover Marriage & Family therapy. Which means they will insert Govt in2 ur marriage.


PG 476 19-20 Chapter 35/ title 44, (Privacy of pers records) shall not apply Home Med Svcs. ACORN ACCESS!


Pg 469 – Community Based Home Medical Services=Non profit orgs. Hello, ACORN Medical Svcs here!!?


Pg 464 Lines 17-22 Indep. Patient Ctr Home Med Svcs – Drs dont have 2 b at ur home just some1 directed by Dr.


Pg 460 Sec 1302 The Govt WILL provide medical svcs in ur home. Paging Nurse Pelosi !!


Pg 460 Sec 1302 – Knock Knock – It’s the Govt and I’m here w the Medical Home Program – YOUR home


PG 455 Lines 3-4 Govt exempts itself frm Chapter 35, Title 44 Paperwork Reduct & Citizens Privacy Prot. Act


PG 448 Lines 4-17 Govt will set performance targets 4 ALL Accountable Care Organizations incl. private.


PG 444 Lines 1-6 Gov’s Accountable Care Program will mandate svcs & infrastructure thru reward/penalty sys.


PG 443 Lines 7-24 Govt at taxpayers exp, test out an “Accountable Care Org” program (Gov doesnt have plan).

PG 438 Sec 1236 – The Govt will develop a patient decision making aid program that u & Dr. WILL use.


PG 434 Section 1234 Military Active, Reservists, Families – Once HC bill is passed ur premiums will go up.


PG 434 Section 1234 Military Active, Reservists, Families – If ur not enrolled in Tricare it is mandated


PG 432 Lines 18-21 The Govt will publish “quality measures” 4 individual’s end of life in Federal Register.


PG 430 Lines 11-15 The Govt will decide what level of treatment u will have at end of life.


Pg 429 Lines 13-25 – The govt will specify which Doctors can write an end of life order. Logan’s Run anyone?


PG 429 Lines 10-12 “adv. care consultation” may incl an ORDER 4 end of life plans. AN ORDER from


Pg 429 Lines 1-9 An “adv. care planning consult” will b used frequently as patients health deteriorates.


PG 427 Lines 15-24 Govt mandates program 4 orders 4 end of life. The Govt has a say in how ur life ends.


PG 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3 Govt provides apprvd list of end of life resources, guiding u in death.


Pg 425 Lines 17-19 Govt will instruct & consult regarding living wills, durable powers of atty. Mandatory!


PG 425 Lines 4-12 Govt mandates Advance Care Planning Consult. Think Senior Citizens end of life.


Pg 404 Lines 17-19 Govt doesnt know the cost of Language svcs but states that money is there.


PG 404 Lines 12-16 Govt exempts itself again from – Chap 35 of title 44, USC incl. privacy of Americans.


PG 401Sec 1221 Americans will fund Medicare Language & Translation Svcs Program. Can u say MORE taxes?


Pg 399 – If ur a subsidy eligible individ under Medicare part D and u dont enroll, the Govt will autoenroll u.


Pg 379 Sec 1191 Govt creates more bureaucracy – Telehealth Advisory Cmtte. Can u say HC by phone


Pg 355-369 Sec 1181 Govt disguises tax on Drug Cos as rebate 2 Govt 2 subsidize Drugs. We pay in the end.


Pg 354 Sec 1177 – Govt will RESTRICT enrollment of Special needs ppl! WTF. My sis has down syndrome!!


Pg 341 Lines 3-9 Govt has authority 2 disqual Medicare Adv Plans, HMOs, etc. Forcing peeps in2 Govt plan

Pg335 L 16-25 Pg 336-339 – Govt mandates estab. of outcome based measures. HC the way they want. Rationing.


Pg 328 Sec 1157 Govt study disguised. Its a HC workforce study mandated by law for unionization


pg 321 2-13 Hospitals have oppt to apply for exception BUT community input required. Can u say ACORN?!!


Pg 318-319 HC Bill – Govt is mandating how hospitals & physicians conduct business & investments. We’re nxt


Pg 317-318 lines 21-25,1-3 PROHIBITION on expansion- Govt is mandating hospitals cannot expand.


Pg 317 L 13-20 OMG!! PROHIBITION on ownership/investment. Govt tells Drs. what/how much they can own.


pg 313 L 9-14 Govt MANDATES Health Svcs providrs will state ownership, invest, & compensation arrangements.


Pg 304 L 17-19 Govt does NOT have 2 protect ur priv, share w any1, & is not resp http://www.twitlonger.com/show/c5bcfdae5fa79a650bbdab6be70918ac (expand)


Pg 306 L 3-6 The Govt can expand the scope & size of Post Acute Program Svcs anytime & as they see fit.


Pg 304 L 17-19 BIG ONE HERE: Expedited Data Collection – Chapter 35 o… Read More: http://www.twitlonger.com/show/c5bcfdae5fa79a650bbdab6be70918ac (expand)


PG 303 L 12-25 Post Acute Care Svcs Data – Govt will collect data including Pers. info as they see fit.


Pg 300 Line 1-18 The Govt will MANDATE Post Acute Care svcs(what), how Drs. get paid, etc.


Pg 298 Lines 9-11 Drs, treat a patient during initial admiss that results in a readmiss-Govt will penalize u.


Pg 287 Line 14-25 PROOF that Govt will ration HC by mandating waiting periods for readmission.


PG 276 Line 3-20 Oxgen Equip & Supply Cos -Govt MANDATES u will provide suppl NO MATTER where indiv. is.


PG 272 SEC. 1145. TREATMENT OF CERTAIN CANCER HOSPITALS – Cancer patients – welcome to rationing!


Pg 270 Sec 1144 Govt Mandates that all private ambulatory surgical centers submit cost data & other data


PG 268 Sec 1141 Fed Govt regulates rental & purchase of power driven wheelchairs.


PG 265 Sec 1131Govt mandates & controls productivity for private HC industries.


Pg 260 Sec 1125 HC Fed Govt will adjust Medicare Payment Localities 4 California based on Census. ACORN?


PG 253 Line 10-18 Govt sets value of Dr’s time, prof judg, etc. Literally value of humans. We’re nxt.


Pg 238-249 Sec 1121 Doctors-Govt mandates ur growth, costs, value, svcs, & income. Peeps-Welcm 2 rationing


Pg 239 Line 10-12 Medicare DSH payments will be increased. Can u say even higher taxes for all?


Pg 236 Line 22-25 PG 237 Line 1-3 National rate of uninsur defind by Census. Can u say ACORN corruption?


Pg 241 Line 6-8 HC Bill – Doctors, doesnt matter what specialty u have, you’ll all be paid the same.


Pg 239 Line 14-24 HC Bill Govt will reduce physician svcs 4 Medicaid. Seniors, low income, poor affected.


Pg 202-215 HC Bill is a GOVT rewrite of the tax code ensuring more taxes for EVERYONE, Everywhere.


PG 203 Line 14-15 HC – “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax” Yes, it says that.


PG 201 Lines 12-19 HC – Govt will ignore whatever costs they see fit 2 show savings. (Cookin the books)


PG 199 Lines 1-4 HC Bill Surtax rates on raised AGAIN on Americans in 2012.


pg 198 lines 4-6 HC Bill 5.4% ADDITIONAL TAX on peeps who have income of 1mil+. Redist Wealth


pg 198 lines 1-3 HC Bill 1.5% ADDITIONAL TAX on peeps who have income of 500k to 1mil. Redist Wealth.


Pg 195 HC Bill -officers & employees of HC Admin (GOVT) will have access 2 ALL Americans finan/pers recs.

Pg 170 Lines 1-3 HC Bill Any NONRESIDENT Alien is exempt from indiv. taxes. (Americans will pay)


Pg 167 Lines 18-23 ANY individual who doesnt have acceptable HC accrdng 2 Govt will be taxed 2.5% of inc.


Pg 151 Lines 1-3 HC Bill Aggregate Rules-tax on employers payroll not on pub opt. incl payroll of other biz.


pg 150 Lines 9-13 Biz w payroll btw 251k & 400k who doesnt prov. pub. opt pays 2-6% tax on all payroll.


Pg 149 Lines 16-24 ANY Emplyr w payroll 400k & above who does not prov. pub opt. pays 8% tax on all payroll.


Pg 146 Lines 22-25 Employers MUST pay 4 HC 4 part time employees AND their families.


Pg 145 Line 15-17 An Employer MUST auto enroll employees into pub opt plan. NO CHOICE.


Pg 130 Lines 10-23 HC Bill – FedGovt will subsidize State Medicaid= Even Higher State & Fed taxes 4 ALL.


PG 129 HC Bill – The public opt will be subsidized. Credits= Ur tax dollars. Redistribution of wealth.


pg 127 Lines 1-16 HC Bill – Doctors – The Govt will tell YOU what u can make.


pg 126 lines 10-15 HC Bill – The Govt can make up prices for anything at anytime for any reason.


pg 124 lines 24-25 HC No company can sue GOVT on price fixing. No “judicial review” against Govt Monop.


Pg 121 Sec 223 HC bill- PAYMENT RATES FOR ITEMS AND SERVICES. Can u say Govt price fixing & monopoly?


Pg 119 HC Bill Lines 1-3 establish geographically-adj prem. rates 4 pub opt. Can u say ACORN census?


Pg 111 Sec 208 The Federal Govt will usurp all State powers in State Based HC Exchng. Violation 10th Amend.


Pg 110 Lines 13-18 An excise tax on ALL goods from companies not offering Govt HC. ALL Americans pay.



PG 110 Lines 7-12 HC Bill Employment taxes on ALL employers NOT offering Govt HC. No choice.


PG 109 Sec 207 – Health Trust Fund. The Govt will raise taxes on EVERYONE 2 fund HC as they see fit.


PG 102 Lines 12-18 HC Bill – Medicaid Eligible Indiv. will b automat.enrolled in Medicaid. No choice


Pg 100 HC Bill Lines 15-19 The govt WILL be using ACORN and other comm. grps to promote & enroll.


PG 85 Line 7 HC Bill – Specs of Ben Levels 4 Plans. #AARP members – U Health care WILL b rationed.


Pg 98 HC Bill Line 8 – Americans u will be paying 4 others HC while paying 4 ur own.


Pg 95 HC Bill Lines 8-18 The Govt will use groups i.e., ACORN & Americorps 2 sign up indiv. for Govt HC plan.


PG 89 Lines 6-10 HC Bill – The FAR is not applicable. Govt can write contracts any way they want.


PG 85 Line 7 HC Bill – Specs for of Benefit Levels for Plans = The Govt will ration ur Healthcare!


PG 84 Sec 203 HC bill – Govt mandates ALL benefit pkgs 4 priv. HC plans in the Exchange.


Pg 72 Lines 8-14 Govt is creating an HC Exchange 2 bring priv HC plans under Govt control.


PG 65 Sec 164 is a payoff subsidized plan 4 retirees and their families in Unions & community orgs (ACORN).


Pg 64 lines 21-25, pg65 lines 1-5 which refers 2 this http://www.ssa.gov/OP_Home/ssact/title11/1179.htm (expand). It says the Govt does not


Pg 62 HC bill – Protection of Data, Govt shows they will have database of ur pers & financial info.


Pg 61 HC Bill lines 22-24 Congress has no clue what Elec. Med Records will cost. Asks for estimate.


Pg 59 HC Bill lines 21-24 Govt will have direct access 2 ur banks accts 4 elect. funds transfer!


Pg 58HC Bill – Govt will have real-time access 2 individs finances & a National ID Healthcard will b issued!


PG 50 Section 152 in HC bill – HC will be provided 2 ALL non US citizens, illegal or otherwise.


Pg 42 of HC Bill – The Health Choices Commissioner will choose UR HC Benefits 4 you. U have no choice!


Pg 29 lines 4-16 in the HC bill – YOUR HEALTHCARE IS RATIONED!!!


Pg 37 Sec 132 of HC Bill – The Govt will be reviewing grievances about themselves and will decide on appeals for rejected claims.


Pg 30 Sec 123 of HC bill – THERE WILL BE A GOVT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benes u get.

PG 24 Sec 116 of HC bill Govt effectively sets prices for ALL private health plans. WTF!!!!


Pg 22 of the HC Bill MANDATES the Govt will audit books of ALL EMPLOYERS that self insure!! WTF!!

Source (http://blog.flecksoflife.com/2009/07/19/the-hc-monstrosity/).

[Lady's Human]

And what's one of the reasons UPS and Fed-ex are doing so well (actually, they aren't but that's another story)?

The USPS delivers their packages in areas that they find it unprofitable to do so.

[Karen]

Um, blue, there is no single HCR bill. There are several proposals, the media keeps referring to it as the HCR bill, but as far as I can tell, there's no one thing.

My folks always taught me to learn all you can and trust no single source.

[blue]

And what's one of the reasons UPS and Fed-ex are doing so well (actually, they aren't but that's another story)?

Care to show that Fed Ex And UPS arent doing well?


The USPS delivers their packages in areas that they find it unprofitable to do so.

USPS is talking about closing branches, reducing services, and postage rates are still rising, I wouldnt call that a success by .gov.

[Lady's Human]

Blue, very simply, unless you work in, around, or for the USPS and are aware of the morass of federal laws mandating what we do, it's impossible to explain, which is a major part of the problem.

Add to it the fact that management is promoted strictly from within, and you have damned few competent craft employees who will go into management because of all the garbage from above.

Hell, we have senior management in the USPS who can't even get the answers to simple questions correct, for instance, are Postal Employees Federal Employees or not.

When the execs running the show can't even answer that correctly, there's a problem.

We're in the communications business, but we can't even explain to the general public how the system works.

Take the contracts for the USPS away from Fed-Ex and UPS and see where their balance sheets settle. Your package prices would be a touch higher than they are now.

[blue]

Um, blue, there is no single HCR bill. There are several proposals, the media keeps referring to it as the HCR bill, but as far as I can tell, there's no one thing.

My folks always taught me to learn all you can and trust no single source.


I posted the HCR bill thats being floated and it is from a .gov website.

http://edlabor.house.gov/documents/111/pdf/publications/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf


Feel free to post the other HCR bills being floated, and any analysis of them.

If PBS.com is proposing a HCR bill does that negate the one posted by .gov? How about a HCR bill proposed by the Huffington Post? No it doesnt, because .gov is the ones writing the bill.

At least the Patriot Act focused on non Americans, this bill focuses on Americans and American businesses.

So Karen if you have link/s to other HCR bills in the house or senate post them because those are the only 2 sources for bills.

[blue]

Blue, very simply, unless you work in, around, or for the USPS and are aware of the morass of federal laws mandating what we do, it's impossible to explain, which is a major part of the problem.

Add to it the fact that management is promoted strictly from within, and you have damned few competent craft employees who will go into management because of all the garbage from above.

Hell, we have senior management in the USPS who can't even get the answers to simple questions correct, for instance, are Postal Employees Federal Employees or not.

When the execs running the show can't even answer that correctly, there's a problem.

We're in the communications business, but we can't even explain to the general public how the system works.

Take the contracts for the USPS away from Fed-Ex and UPS and see where their balance sheets settle. Your package prices would be a touch higher than they are now.

If USPS cant answer even simple questions to their own employees, do we want the same type of bureaucracy applied to our health care?

[Lady's Human]

As far as the Postal Service being a Government success or failure, it's neither.

The USPS in it's current incarnation is a Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac type entity.

It is a private entity, operating under federal law, using federal employees which cannot make a profit, but isn't supposed to show a loss, either.

[blue]

As far as the Postal Service being a Government success or failure, it's neither.

The USPS in it's current incarnation is a Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac type entity.

It is a private entity, operating under federal law, using federal employees which cannot make a profit, but isn't supposed to show a loss, either.

Obama made the comparison not me. Either way Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac failed under gov mandates. The USPS is propped up by federal funds/mandates as far as I can tell.

If you allready have health insurance fine, have it. I just dont want whats in the HCR bill forced on me.

[Lady's Human]

The USPS is propped up by federal funds?

Where?

[lizbud]

I posted the HCR bill thats being floated and it is from a .gov website.

http://edlabor.house.gov/documents/111/pdf/publications/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf


Feel free to post the other HCR bills being floated, and any analysis of them.

If PBS.com is proposing a HCR bill does that negate the one posted by .gov? How about a HCR bill proposed by the Huffington Post? No it doesnt, because .gov is the ones writing the bill.

At least the Patriot Act focused on non Americans, this bill focuses on Americans and American businesses.

So Karen if you have link/s to other HCR bills in the house or senate post them because those are the only 2 sources for bills.



What you have posted is not a House Bill.It doesn't even have a Bill #
attached. It's a bare bones skeleton of a proposed , but not yet submitted
for consideration.

I'd like to know who wrote the "explanations" for each of the proposed
sections of the "bill".

[blue]

The USPS is propped up by federal funds?

Where?

By blocking Fed Ex and UPS from doing the same job as USPS. If all you want to do is defend USPS maybe we should start another thread.


What you have posted is not a House Bill.It doesn't even have a Bill #
attached. It's a bare bones skeleton of a proposed , but not yet submitted
for consideration.

I'd like to know who wrote the "explanations" for each of the proposed
sections of the "bill".


HR 3200. (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text) Over 1000 pages is not a bare bones skeleton.

If you had clicked the link you would have found out who wrote the analysis of HR 3200.

[Lady's Human]

There is no monolithic proposal.

Nothing has been brought to the House floor for vote, and the proposals haven't even cleared the committees completely. The House and Senate haven't passed any legislation, and if they do, the bills go to conference committee for reconciliation. Until that happens, there is no monolithic "Health Care Reform" bill.

As to the USPS, you're the one who included it in the thread.

Attack an agency without facts, and it's going to be answered with facts.

Fed Ex and UPS deliver in a year what the USPS delivers in a day. There's just no comparison, especially when they (Fed Ex and UPS) have the luxury of dumping parcels they don't want to deliver or can't deliver on time into the USPS mailstream.

We have to deliver to every address 6 days a week, even if it's a lone farmhouse 2 miles from anywhere. They don't.

[blue]

There is no monolithic proposal.

Nothing has been brought to the House floor for vote, and the proposals haven't even cleared the committees completely. The House and Senate haven't passed any legislation, and if they do, the bills go to conference committee for reconciliation. Until that happens, there is no monolithic "Health Care Reform" bill.

HR 3200, I allready linked it. Why is Barry pushing for a vote if there is nothing to vote on? HR 3200. Why all the THMs on HCR if there isnt anything to have a meeting on? Why are representatives saying they cant comment because they havent read the 1018 pages of proposed legislation in HR 3200?


As to the USPS, you're the one who included it in the thread.

I quoted Obama, email him about Fed Ex Vs USPS. If you want to continue start a new thread. This thread is about HCR, mainly HR 3200, not USPS Vs Fed Ex/UPS.

[Lady's Human]

Again, funny, I didn't know you were a moderator. Last time I checked, those positions were spoken for.

You used the quote, you thought it appropriate, YOU made it part of the thread. Not I.

[blue]

Again, funny, I didn't know you were a moderator. Last time I checked, those positions were spoken for.


You used the quote, you thought it appropriate, YOU made it part of the thread. Not I.

So you are arm chair moderating to prove a point?

FWIW Obama thought it was worth mentioning that USPS was having problems, email him. I only quoted him.

If you are in such a snit about the USPS being dissed by the POTUS start your own thread. I quoted Obama in reference to the HCR bill, not a USPS Vs Fed Ex/UPS bill. Why is this such a big deal to you?

Why arent you rallying for medicaid/care? I also thought it appropriate to quote the POTUS on that too, why arent you focusing on that aspect?

If I were a tinfoil hat wearer, Ild be wondering what is in HR 3200 that you
are trying to draw attention away from.

ETA: In hind sight, please dont answer any of my questions as it would only further highjack this thread. I have no idea why your undies are in a bunch over the POTUS comment about the USPS, but if you could keep your comments contained to the topic at hand I would greatly appreciate it. If you have any question of the actual topic, its HCR and HR 3200.

[Lady's Human]

In reference to the above.........


:D:D:D

Of course, when confronted with facts, run away, just as you accuse others of doing.

Pot.....the kettle is calling.

[lizbud]

There is no monolithic proposal.

Nothing has been brought to the House floor for vote, and the proposals haven't even cleared the committees completely. The House and Senate haven't passed any legislation, and if they do, the bills go to conference committee for reconciliation. Until that happens, there is no monolithic "Health Care Reform" bill.





Thanks LH. You explained it well.:) Actually you explained the USPS
system vs Fed Ex ,UPS systems too.

[Catty1]

Another quote from the POTUS on HCR:

http://www.canadaeast.com/front/article/756004

(excerpt from article)


On a separate issue, Obama cracked a joke in Canada's direction.

He warned that Canada would continue to serve as a whipping boy in the highly charged U.S. debate over the future of health care, which has seen town hall meetings erupt into scuffles this summer.

Warnings about the danger of adopting "Canadian-style socialized medicine" are a ubiquitous refrain among critics of Obama's intended reforms.

"I suspect that you Canadians will continue to get dragged in by those who oppose reform - even though I've said nothing about Canadian health-care reform," Obama said.

"I don't find Canadians particularly scary, but I guess some of the opponents of reform think they make a good bogeyman."

Obama wants to extend health coverage to all Americans and allow for greater public-sector involvement alongside the current network of privately run insurance companies.

He said Americans are spending too much money on health care, with results that are too poor, and that too many families are being bankrupted by health bills because they don't have coverage.

But he quickly added that Canada's model - the single-payer public system - bears little relationship to the system he wants to create.

Obama repeated his frequent refrain that the U.S. health system evolved as a privately run entity over the decades, and there's no reason to move it in a radically different direction now.

But his legion of conservative critics argue that Obama's plan will ultimately kill the private insurance industry, increase government spending, and result in higher taxes. Just like Canada.

Harper steered clear of the debate.

When asked whether there were any elements of the Canadian system worth emulating, he merely replied: "Canadians support their own health-care system. As for the rest of this question my only answer is that this is an American debate, and the responsibility of the provinces."

Harper's obvious reluctance to sing the praises of Canada's medicare system stood in stark contrast to NDP Leader Jack Layton, who spent two days in Washington last June talking up Canadian health care with White House officials and members of Congress.

[blue]

In reference to the above.........


:D:D:D

Of course, when confronted with facts, run away, just as you accuse others of doing.

Pot.....the kettle is calling.

Hi Pot, this is Kettle, your black, go lay down. All you want to do in this thread is USPS USPS USPS. You havent given any facts!

You seem to have a problem that the POTUS dissed the USPS and that I quoted him on it, why? Yes I was mistaken when I posted that USPS is federaly funded, but at the same time FE and UPS cannot directly compete with USPS. You also pointed out all the problems the USPS has via federal laws. Ill ask you again do we want that type of bureaucracy in charge of our Health Care? THis time I await your answer, after all this thread is about health care reform not YOU and the USPS USPS USPS.

HR 3200, direct link to the Library of Congress for Bills and Resolutions, http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:H.R.3200:

What do you have that shows that HR 3200 is not being considerred by the Congressional Branch? Again I await your answer.


Thanks LH. You explained it well.:) Actually you explained the USPS
system vs Fed Ex ,UPS systems too.

Where did he do that? UPS and Fed Ex cannot by Federal law directly compete with USPS.

[Lady's Human]

Actually, I did give facts directly related to ANY congressional legislation.

Again, in case you missed it, nothing has passed through the committees and been brought to the house floor for a vote.

Nothing.

Nada.

Zip.

Zero.

There are hundreds of bills pending before congress, most of which no one will ever hear of. Why? They have been submitted as bills, and have numbers, but the status is "in committee"

After that rather lengthy process, despite what Speaker Pelosi would liek to have happen, the bill is brought to the full house for a vote.

Guess what? It still isn't law yet.

The Senate gets it's chance, and amendments are offered, changes made, and debated..........and it can be fillibustered and killed on the senate floor, in which case it goes back to square one.

After the House and Senate have voted on bills, the bills got to a joint Senate House committee for reconciliation, as no bill of this type is ever identical in both houses.

Then......it goes back to the House and Senate to be voted on in its complete form.

IF it ever gets out of the Senate I might be concerned, but I don't see that happening, as both chambers have other rather more pressing bills on their plates, such as the budget.

The status of the bill, as reported on Thomas, is ordered to be amended......

It's a long way from being law.

[blue]

Actually, I did give facts directly related to ANY congressional legislation.

Again, in case you missed it, nothing has passed through the committees and been brought to the house floor for a vote.

Nothing.

Nada.

Zip.

Zero.

There are hundreds of bills pending before congress, most of which no one will ever hear of. Why? They have been submitted as bills, and have numbers, but the status is "in committee"

After that rather lengthy process, despite what Speaker Pelosi would liek to have happen, the bill is brought to the full house for a vote.

Guess what? It still isn't law yet.

The Senate gets it's chance, and amendments are offered, changes made, and debated..........and it can be fillibustered and killed on the senate floor, in which case it goes back to square one.

After the House and Senate have voted on bills, the bills got to a joint Senate House committee for reconciliation, as no bill of this type is ever identical in both houses.

Then......it goes back to the House and Senate to be voted on in its complete form.

IF it ever gets out of the Senate I might be concerned, but I don't see that happening, as both chambers have other rather more pressing bills on their plates, such as the budget.

The status of the bill, as reported on Thomas, is ordered to be amended......

It's a long way from being law.

Great googly moogly! You havent provided any facts.

Nothing.

Nada.

Zip.

Zero.


Obama wanted this voted on this month, I wouldnt call that a long way from becoming law. How long did it take for the Patriot Act to become law?



You only care if HR 3200 comes up for a vote?!! You dont care what is in it during the debates or what is talked about on the floor, or in THMs? You dont care that the POTUS is pushing this for a vote? You only care if it might be voted on?

I havent missed anything, and guess what? I dont want HR 3200 anywhere near getting into law.

You may not care about whats in it but I do.

I dont want it to get to get voted on!!! I dont want it even to come close to being voted on! I care whats in it! I dont have health insurance but Ill bet you do. In the future I want to be able chose my HI, not have it dictated by .GOV to me or my employer.

You may be willing to take that chance, but Im not.

Im sorry the POTUS dissed the USPS, take it up with him.

You want to be glib about this? Fine thats your business.

[Lady's Human]

I'll be damned.......

A reasoned description of the legislative process and where the bill(s) currently stand in the process isn't factual?

Huh. Whodathunkit?

The President's demands that it be voted into law ASAP are probably what killed the bill as it currently stands.

Speaking of providing facts, since when are someone's tweets about a bill, largely opinion, facts?

[blue]

I'll be damned.......

A reasoned description of the legislative process and where the bill(s) currently stand in the process isn't factual?

Huh. Whodathunkit?

The President's demands that it be voted into law ASAP are probably what killed the bill as it currently stands.

Speaking of providing facts, since when are someone's tweets about a bill, largely opinion, facts?

Sweet Zombie Jesus!!

You havent provided any facts reguarding HR 3200. You think HR 3200 is a myth at best as far as I can tell.


What in Jebus's name are you talking about with...


tweets about a bill

WTF is a tweet?!

[Lady's Human]

Mea Culpa......


It's a blog post about the bill.......Far, far more informative than a bunch of tweets, which is what it appears to be.

Stating where HR 3200 stands in the legslative process isn't providing factual information?

I guess it all depends on what your definition of fact is............ :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


BTW, my last response even mentioning the USPS is on the first page.....several posts ago.

Keep up with the thread, come on, man!

[blue]

It's a blog post about the bill.......Far, far more informative than a bunch of tweets, which is what it appears to be.

Until the MSM reports on this, Ill settle for a blog. Unfortunately, as far as I can tell, the MSM is fronting for the current addministration.

And WTF is a tweet?


Stating where HR 3200 stands in the legslative process isn't providing factual information?

I guess it all depends on what your definition of fact is............ :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

You stated nothing about HR 3200.



BTW, my last response even mentioning the USPS is on the first page.....several posts ago.

Keep up with the thread, come on, man!

Allmost every post you have had in this thread is deffending the USPS.

ETA: Does anybody think our healthcare system should be subject to the same bureaucracy the USPS is subject to?

[Karen]

A "tweet" is s micro-blog post from Twitter, 140 characters or less.

[lizbud]

You stated nothing about HR 3200.




Allmost every post you have had in this thread is deffending the USPS.

ETA: Does anybody think our healthcare system should be subject to the same bureaucracy the USPS is subject to?


There is no provision in the PROPOSED bill that says you have to sign
up for HC. You can keep your same Doc & private provider if you prefer.

Didn't you ever take a Goverment course in high school?

[blue]

A "tweet" is s micro-blog post from Twitter, 140 characters or less.

Thank you, Ive never been to twitter. I can barely tolerate facebook.


There is no provision in the PROPOSED bill that says you have to sign
up for HC. You can keep your same Doc & private provider if you prefer.

Didn't you ever take a Goverment course in high school?

That was one class I got exceptionaly good grades in.

So now its actually a bill? I thought you said it wasnt? Oh wait you did.


What you have posted is not a House Bill.It doesn't even have a Bill #
attached. It's a bare bones skeleton of a proposed , but not yet submitted
for consideration.

When according to


H. R. 3200


To provide affordable, quality health care for all Americans and reduce the growth in health care spending, and for other purposes.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

July 14, 2009

Mr. DINGELL (for himself, Mr. RANGEL, Mr. WAXMAN, Mr. GEORGE MILLER of California, Mr. STARK, Mr. PALLONE, and Mr. ANDREWS) introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on Energy and Commerce, and in addition to the Committees on Ways and Means, Education and Labor, Oversight and Government Reform, and the Budget, for a period to be subsequently determined by the Speaker, in each case for consideration of such provisions as fall within the jurisdiction of the committee concerned

It is a bill, with a # attached to it, and introduced by representatives.


Under this PROPOSED BILL, I would be fined for not having a HI plan. And if you lose, or change your plan you have to take a .gov plan not a private plan, its in the bill.

If you had done well in a Government course in HS, you would know that all bills are PROPOSED untill they are voted on, they dont become LAW otherwise.



LH and Karen, if there is no HCR bill or act in the Congressional branch, why are the representatives having Town Hall Meeeting about HR 3200? Why did the POTUS have a THM about HR 3200? Why over the last couple of months has the POTUS pushing to have it voted on before the fall break? If there is no bill before the COTUS why is it in the MSM so much?

[lizbud]

http://www.tdbimg.com/files/2009/08/14/img-mg---week-in-cartoons-815---1_110040296944.jpg

[blue]

I didn't think you would be so childish Liz.

[lizbud]

I didn't think you would be so childish Liz.



You're just Jealous.:rolleyes:

[RICHARD]

http://www.tdbimg.com/files/2009/08/14/img-mg---week-in-cartoons-815---1_110040296944.jpg

Hmm, no cloven hoofs or forked tail.

----------------

He'd granting the 'power' to 'kill' grandma his minions.

He's more a Charles Manson than a monster.

Charles Manson didn't kill grandma, he let the idiots following him do it!:eek::confused::o

[blue]

You're just Jealous.:rolleyes:

Only if you have more legos then me.

[blue]

It seems ObamaCorp might consider dropping the public funding in the HRC bill.


President Barack Obama and his top aides are signaling that they’re prepared to drop a government insurance option from a final health-reform deal if that’s what’s needed to strike a compromise on Obama’s top legislative priority.

Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20090816/pl_politico/26158).

The problem is all of the intrusive bits would remain in the bill.

Obama might even be willing to be a one term President to get HRC passed, when I find a good link on this Ill post it. Until I find a link take it as a interweb rumor as I am.