Trick or treat

[Marigold2]

TRICK OR TREAT :p:p:p:p
Here is what I did...............
My friends and neighbors are Republicians. He is a retired Dr. his wife a sweet, dear friend. Every time I go there he tries to change my mind on whom to vote for. He of course thinks McCain is the way to go. The Dems are all fools, the Rep are all Gods.
He has a McCain sign on his lawn.
Two doors down another couple have two Obama signs.
See where this is going? LOL Oh yea. :D:D:D
The Dr now has two Obama signs on his lawn and the other couple has his McCain sign. :eek::eek:
I wish I could see his face in the morning when he gets his paper.
TRICK OR TREAT MAN.................

[Lady's Human]

And how is this any different from signs being vandalized?

Sorry, I fail to see the humor. I don't, and will never have, campaign signs in my yard, but I'd be pissed.

[Marigold2]

1) These two retired couples will meet and perhaps become friends.;)
2) No one was hurt.:)
3) Nothing was destroyed, just moved two lawns down.:)
4) You need a sense of humor to appreciate this. It is after all Halloween, trick or treat.:cool::cool:
5) A bit of harmless adult fun with cloths on, no drugs or firearms were used.:D:D
6) No pets were used.:love:
7) It's damn funny. :p
8) I needed to take a walk
9) It was dark and no one saw me
10) Best reason of all, it pi$$ed you off.

[blue]

10) Best reason of all, it pi$$ed you off.

Are you 12?

[Marigold2]

LOL no I am 49 and full of harmless fun, adventure, daring and bull.
I am a free soul who enjoys a practical joke or two.
Believe me my friends give it to me all the time. I can either laugh or lose one of the most precious God given gifts. A sense of humor and the obsurd.

[sparks19]

Technically... that's against the law. it is theft. A lot of people purchase those signs. so it may have been harmless fun... but never the less it WAS illegal of you to do so.

So... it may be funny to you but hope you don't get caught and hope if you do that they aren't too mad.

Sadly enough.. at my husbands work a child approx 6 years old and his friend came onto their property and took their sign... the boss caught them (he didn't call the cops or anything) but this CHILD proceeded to tell him to "F off... McCain is an F'ing A hole and to go F himself" Sad isn't it?

[Karen]

Technically... that's against the law. it is theft. A lot of people purchase those signs. so it may have been harmless fun... but never the less it WAS illegal of you to do so.

So... it may be funny to you but hope you don't get caught and hope if you do that they aren't too mad.

Sadly enough.. at my husbands work a child approx 6 years old and his friend came onto their property and took their sign... the boss caught them (he didn't call the cops or anything) but this CHILD proceeded to tell him to "F off... McCain is an F'ing A hole and to go F himself" Sad isn't it?

I would have escorted the child home, and spoken to his parents. Because you know he's not just inventing that opinion - or language - on his own!

[caseysmom]

I would have escorted the child home, and spoken to his parents. Because you know he's not just inventing that opinion - or language - on his own!

I would be afraid to he probably learned it at home!

I thought about doing that to my sister and brother in law they have 2 mccain palin signs, I was going to borrow them and replace them with 4 obama signs and my daughter the wise one in the family talked me out of it she said they would get mad and it turns out they said they would have gotten pissed:D I do enjoy the prank every now and then!

[sparks19]

I would have escorted the child home, and spoken to his parents. Because you know he's not just inventing that opinion - or language - on his own!

THAT'S what I said. He started to chase after the kids but he decided that it might not be a good idea. when Brian told me about it I said flat out that I would follow those kids home and tell their parents that if they came on my property again i would call the police and THEY would pay the price for it. Nothing ticks me off more than young kids who display THAT kind of disrespect. and I figured it must come from home... that kind of talk... so simply telling them what happened probably wouldn't be enough. SAD

[Karen]

I know it probably came from his home, but his parents need to learn that its their responsibility, and the kid was doing something illegal, as well as being disrespectful.

[Marigold2]

Well the Dr called me..........He was putting his garbage out and of course noticed the signs.
Asked if I had any idea who had done this......:mad::mad:
I started to act shocked, said "NO" but I was laughing too hard. :D :D He told me I was in trouble. Called his wife and said, "Do you know what your crazy friend did?" No No she had no idea. She is so mad at me. Why, because she didn't think of it first. The Dr is now mad at us both. :rolleyes:
Now I am scared :eek::eek::eek: he is going to get me back.
I will probably have a couple of tombstones on my lawn by Friday. Perhaps even a giant billboard pronouning my insanity. Hey it's Trick or Treat I told him. Revenge will be his he said. :eek::eek:

[caseysmom]

Along those lines those signs seem kind of wierd to me. I guess I think politics is your own business like religion I don't need to preach on my lawn and don't need others to do it either I think its just wierd.

If I put an obama sign on my lawn and my neighbor had a mccain sign it would be uncomfortable to me.

[blue]

At least you arent stealing roadside crosses, thats a story for another day though.

Respect your neighbor.

[NoahsMommy]

If someone put an "Obama" sign, sticker, ANYTHING anywhere NEAR me, I'd burn it. Our country is in SERIOUS trouble if he's elected. I don't normally get involved in politics, other than keeping myself informed of the issues at hand so I can make an educated opinion, and vote, if applicable.

I ALWAYS have very correct "gut feelings" and there is something seriously scaring me about the possibility of him becoming President. Just look at the people he chooses to surround himself with - I wont name names, but if you watch ANY news, or radio, you'll know what I mean.

While I tend to steer more towards a Republican view, I also fit in within the middle a lot as well. I care about people, but think everyone needs to put in efforts and do their part in life. I don't have a McCain (or anyone) sign on our house/yard or a sticker on my car (WHY would someone do that to their paint job??? SERIOUSLY STUPID!!! If/when your "guy" doesn't win, you look so dumb!!!)

All this to say, NO ONE had better put anything 'Obama' anywhere near me, especially if they wanted it back!!! ;) I would honestly be mad if I was your neighbor. Its one thing to talk politics if that is your relationship with him, but its another to disrespect his property. I get the idea of the joke and see where you're coming from comicly, but when someone is that strong in their beliefs, its not such a good idea to mess with them. You know??

[Lady's Human]

10) Best reason of all, it pi$$ed you off.


Yeay.

I'd expect that type of "humor" from a 10 year old.

'nuff said.

[Pam]

I have stayed away from threads in the Dog House that are political but read this one because I thought it was about Halloween. My first thought was that your actions were dead wrong. You do not know the mental stability of these neighbors. A real fight could have broken out between them and if one, or both, of them were a bit unstable I shudder to think what you might have caused. Not funny. Not funny at all.

[Puckstop31]

I would have escorted the child home, and spoken to his parents. Because you know he's not just inventing that opinion - or language - on his own!


It is not the kind of neighborhood where it is safe to do that sort of thing. I totally get your drift, but doing something like that would only escalate things.

Now if our cars start getting keyed or they other wise vandalize our property... But for now, it is just not worth it to escalate.

Besides, i've seen some of the parents. They sit on their front porach all day, smoking and sometimes drinking. It is very sad. But we have a business to run. A business that supports my family.

[king2005]

It is not the kind of neighborhood where it is safe to do that sort of thing. I totally get your drift, but doing something like that would only escalate things.

Now if our cars start getting keyed or they other wise vandalize our property... But for now, it is just not worth it to escalate.

Besides, i've seen some of the parents. They sit on their front porach all day, smoking and sometimes drinking. It is very sad. But we have a business to run. A business that supports my family.

Here in Toronto you didn't have to worry about cars being keyed, you had to worry about your car breaks being cut!!!!!! I'm not joking :( This 1 area was hit bad.. Anyone with a Liberal sign on their lawn was a target for some hardcore vandilazing.

This is 1 reason I'll never be stupid enough to put a sign up.. There are too many nut bags out there & I'm not going to make myself an even bigger target. Mind you as things are going, I'll never support any of the parties as they are all liars & A-holes in the end... sooo I choose to spoil (this yr I didn't vote, but I had little choice).

[lizbud]

If someone put an "Obama" sign, sticker, ANYTHING anywhere NEAR me, I'd burn it. Our country is in SERIOUS trouble if he's elected. I don't normally get involved in politics, other than keeping myself informed of the issues at hand so I can make an educated opinion, and vote, if applicable.

I ALWAYS have very correct "gut feelings" and there is something seriously scaring me about the possibility of him becoming President. Just look at the people he chooses to surround himself with - I wont name names, but if you watch ANY news, or radio, you'll know what I mean.




I've never read so much BS in one post. Do America a favor and don't
vote at all.:rolleyes: Geeze.

[Puckstop31]

I've never read so much BS in one post. Do America a favor and don't
vote at all.:rolleyes: Geeze.


Liz, you never cease to entertain!!!

Don't vote at all? Because they do not think the way you do? Fascist much?

[NoahsMommy]

I've never read so much BS in one post. Do America a favor and don't
vote at all.:rolleyes: Geeze.

Not vote....sure, that's a fabulous solution, because I don't agree with you??

RE: Burning/Throwing Away anything "Obama" - in that I don't want my beliefs associated with him. While I'm not sure WHY I'm even clarifying this, but I don't hate or feel much towards him. I just wouldn't want ANYONE to think I thought/spoke/felt anything like he does, I just DON'T agree with nearly ANYTHING he says...when he's not saying uhm, ah, uh, well, oh, ahhh, uhhh, and those long a*s pregnant pauses that is. :rolleyes: I can't stand to hear ANYONE speak like that, let alone a Presidential candidate. I'm NOT going to go on and on...this is the very tip of the iceburg, but I forgot respectful conversations aren't "allowed" in the Dog House.

I'd thought my post was respectful and that you'd all know me enough that it indicated MY thoughts/feelings. I'm not making this stuff up...I actually spend a lot of my time getting education on the issues and the candidates - and not from biased newspapers or news channels that call our President "MR. BUSH". (And I'm sure I need to clarify this too: just because I tend to lean Republican, doesn't mean I'm a "Bush Fan" either. Its a matter of RESPECT. No matter WHO is in office, no one is going to agree with what is said or done.) I guess we've ALL lost our respect in this country, huh?

Don't drink the Kool-Aid. Think for yourself! You can still vote AND have your own thoughts - even negative thoughts about the candidate you support.

And yet again, because I don't like to offend: The posts I make are ALWAYS my feelings and mine ALONE. I've never tried to convince another PTer unless it was about declawing or debarking.

[Pam]

I've never read so much BS in one post. Do America a favor and don't
vote at all.:rolleyes: Geeze.

Liz, you and I have disagreed before on things but this takes the cake. I am totally shocked. Kelly is a respected member and deserves to have her voice heard. I guess people are not allowed to differ with you. :mad:

[caseysmom]

Have to agree with you Pam although I personally differ from Kelly on this she has every right to vote and I would defend her right in every way I can.

[JenBKR]

Wow.....I know that politics are a hot topic, but some responses can certainly get out of line fast. That is exactly why I have not stated some of my opinions here.....


and not from biased newspapers or news channels that call our President "MR. BUSH". (And I'm sure I need to clarify this too: just because I tend to lean Republican, doesn't mean I'm a "Bush Fan" either. Its a matter of RESPECT. No matter WHO is in office, no one is going to agree with what is said or done.) I guess we've ALL lost our respect in this country, huh?

Don't drink the Kool-Aid. Think for yourself! You can still vote AND have your own thoughts - even negative thoughts about the candidate you support.


Totally agree with you here. That's why there's more than one candidate, people have different opinions! Imagine what the world would be like if we were all the same...:(

[king2005]

Imagine what the world would be like if we were all the same...:(

Emo?
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I would go crazy if we were all Emo's!!! Such a horrible horrible world it would be :eek:

.
.
.
.
Hopefully that lighten things up a little in here :p

EDIT: ^_^ woah, how did I become a jr. writer with grammar like that!

[Lady's Human]

I've never read so much BS in one post. Do America a favor and don't
vote at all. Geeze.


That statement is truly reprehensible.

While I have expressed to some on this board my concerns (in private) that the franchise is overly open, I would never, ever tell someone not to vote, especially in such an insulting manner.

Quite to the contrary, I encourage people to vote, as I personally believe that if you don't vote, I don't want to hear you complaining about decisions made by government.

Being engaged in the political process is a necessary part of citizenship. Comments such as the one above are one of many reasons too many people say "chuck it, why bother getting involved"

Can the elitist bull, Liz.

[jennielynn1970]

I ALWAYS have very correct "gut feelings" and there is something seriously scaring me about the possibility of him becoming President. Just look at the people he chooses to surround himself with - I wont name names, but if you watch ANY news, or radio, you'll know what I mean.



Just to play devil's advocate here.
Would those people happen to be black or muslim? which of those are scaring you?? Just asking, because you're leaving that one wide open to any interpretation. (not saying that either scare you, but wanting you to state exactly what you mean)


On another note:
I love the little speech out takes that Letterman does on his show "Famous Speeches in Presidential History". He'll have some powerful JFK speech on, then some other thing that Reagan said, then like the other night, one of Bush's.... "I like to fish." Silly and stupid, but they crack me up.

[jennielynn1970]

Oh, and just for the record.. I'm voting Nader.

[K9soul]

I was just wondering why it is that so often if a person personally doesn't find something funny that someone else does, they are often accused of not having a sense of humor? I feel I have a great sense of humor, I love to laugh, I love one-liners and sarcasm and irony. I've never been much of a practical joke person. I didn't even find the practical jokes on the old Bloopers TV show that funny as a kid. Not because I have no sense of humor, but because my sense of humor is different. I really don't enjoy having pranks pulled on me, so I likewise don't do it.

As for politics issues, I don't discuss political candidates and only rarely political issues with anyone, even my family. I have my views and am confident and comfortable with them.

[lizbud]

If someone put an "Obama" sign, sticker, ANYTHING anywhere NEAR me, I'd burn it. Our country is in SERIOUS trouble if he's elected. I don't normally get involved in politics, other than keeping myself informed of the issues at hand so I can make an educated opinion, and vote, if applicable.

I ALWAYS have very correct "gut feelings" and there is something seriously scaring me about the possibility of him becoming President. Just look at the people he chooses to surround himself with - I wont name names, but if you watch ANY news, or radio, you'll know what I mean.




Everyone IS entitled to a opinion, even me. To say that you've informed
yourself before makeing a choice between candidates,sounds doubtful from
any statement you've made so far.(IMO) Your viseral reaction to anything
"Obama" & counting on your "gut" feelings to show you the truth, is absurd.

All this doesn't mean a hill of beans to me in the long run, but I certainly
believe I know BS when I hear it.

[Lady's Human]

Counting on gut feelings is absurd?

Let me guess, you're relying on their campaign promises....

:rolleyes:

[sparks19]

Everyone IS entitled to a opinion, even me. To say that you've informed
yourself before makeing a choice between candidates,sounds doubtful from
any statement you've made so far.(IMO) Your viseral reaction to anything
"Obama" & counting on your "gut" feelings to show you the truth, is absurd.

All this doesn't mean a hill of beans to me in the long run, but I certainly
believe I know BS when I hear it.


Absurd is the way you talk to people who don't share your views. Do you REALLY believe you are better than everyone else or do you just come across that way unintentionally?

Seems that you don't like it when others talk to you that way so why do you feel you are entitled to treat others like that?

And if we are talking about viseral reactions to a Candidate... I'm not sure YOU are the person to be calling anyone out on that.

[Marigold2]

I can honestly say I don't understand a lot of PT people here. :confused::confused: So maybe you didn't find humor in what I did.
But I did no harm. Nothing was broken, ruined, scraped, bashed, trashed. I took a sign and moved it two doors down and moved another two doors up.
I do not live in a low income neighborhood. My neighbors are Dr. Dentist, lawyer, computer progamers all white collar professionals. I know both couples, both are retired in their 60's professionals. No one was going to get bashed or their car keyed.
We are suppose to be America the United for one and all. Yes we disagree on whom shall be best to lead this country. Hence the signs. (LOL I don't care what any of you think it was very very funny.) Instead people are fighting and name calling and saying bad things, lies, half truths about both canidates. They are both good, intelligent, kind, hardworking, gifted people as are their wives. They disagree on what is best for us, we have the right to decide who will win. Many people died and are continuing to die for that right. Lets not soil it folks. Do I think Bush was the worst president ever, you bet, but American citizens have the right to vote for whomever they choose? The ballets are after all filled with a million men and woman's blood. So lets smile :D and try and be kind. And yea it was so funny.:)

[Alysser]

This is why I hate politics. Look what people fight over. :rolleyes: Though I did find her statement really uncalled for although I'm ALL for Obama because McCain annoys the CRAP out of me, but that's not for me to post right now.

I actually think the joke was pretty funny, it's not vandilism. Nothing was destroyed no harm done. Then again, I'm 15 so call my humor immature but I did think it was a little funny.

[NoahsMommy]

BS to me means the following: making something up, lying, content that makes it seem like someone is joking or is crazy

Is crazy:
-Taking from the people who have EARNED their money and their spot in life? I'm not in that class, other than I EARN what I recieve. Then GIVING that money to people who DON'T EARN what they have? Because this is aparently one of Obama's plans.
-Making people have socialized care - medically. You ALL know I'm riddled with this stupid Crohn's Disease. I'd NEVER, EVER take socialized care and I'm in an ER at least monthly! The care is bad enough as it is!!!!
-OKing partial birth abortion?? That is discusting!!!!! I give a crap WHO you are, its vatally mutaling a living thing!!! Abortion is A-OK with me, but that doesn't mean I personally would have it done and my disease is hereditary!
-Not voting or holding committee meetings when chairing the Iraq war committee??? Denying funding to the troops that are ALREADY in the Middle East????
-Attending a church with anyone remotely like Jeramiah Write (he could be orange with green polka dots, or PINK, my favorite color and I'd STILL believe that denying ANYONE their rights is WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!)
-Proposing tax refunds/checks to the 40% of people that DON'T pay taxes!?!?!?
-And now....his little campaign is under investigation for getting campaign contributions that were NOT authorized or even asked for!! When people have called to complain and insist they be removed, his volunteers have the nerve to say, "well, are you sure you want that $2300 charge removed??"

Would you like me to go on? You're completely right, I'm uneducated, I don't spend ANY time researching the issues and I completely ignore the candidates. Seems like this is not me you're talking about as I haven't seen a post from you REGARDING THE ISSUES, just rude, accusatory statements when anyone fails to agree with YOU!

Since it seems I'm being attacked for who I am with no reason whatsoever, let me illustrate how open-minded and thoughtful (in that I think, as well as being concerned about people) I am. I am a Christian, always have been:

I want prop 8, to FAIL. I feel gay/lesbian people are MORE than deserving of being married legally. We deserve equal rights!!

I also am OK with abortion, but not partial birth because of how cruel and vicous it is.

[sasvermont]

No fighting!

I was not offended by the sign switching, especially since the switcher knew the parties involved. Geeezzzzeeee, they're only signs....free signs, I do believe. I could care less who puts what sign on any lawn or corner. There are signs all over the place in my part of the country. They begin to all look the same.

Anyway, I don't see why people get so hot under the collar about what another person thinks when it comes to politics, religion, money, blah blah blah. You ain't never gonna change their minds.

So let's all agree that we aren't going to agree about those topics.

Oh, by the way, I am voting for Obama, for reasons I am not willing to share with you, but trust me, I have thought long and hard about who I want in office. I hope we all have.

I am thinking about going out tomorrow and switching some signs, just to see if anyone notices! I don't take this kind of activity personally. If I had it my way, there wouldn't be any blasted signs anywhere! What a waste of space and materials.

[caseysmom]

Those signs are not free they are purchased and they are someone's property and it is stealing.

[Daisy and Delilah]

Marigold, I really believe it was a harmless prank and done in good fun. I think it's really cool that you and your neighbors have such a good relationship. I'm pretty sure that all signs were returned to their proper places by now.:)

Jess: I really agree with you. What a brilliant thing to say, as always. I also think everyone has a sense of humor. I think our sense of humor is somewhat unique and that there probably aren't two exactly alike, just like people.:) Good point!!

[RICHARD]

lol,

What about the 'Anyone but (Republican) for President' people? Is that gut or is it just Ennie Meenie Minny Moe?


To tell you the truth I have never in my life been so interested in politics until this year. And there is only one reason. It's the idea that some dolt like BO may be my president.

I have the same feelings that Kelly has, there is something that does not sit right with me about his being. There is something about the way he conducts himself that makes me uneasy.


I agree 100 percent with Kelly's views on medical care. Her side is having to navigate the system and mine from working in it for years.

BO's ideas about health care are ridiculous, uneducated and very scary.

Government sponsored health care is a waste of money, time and a dangerous road to travel. Government needs to revise the laws pertaining to malpractice insurance and cap the awards given out by idiot jurors and sought after by money hungry AH lawyers. They also need to revise the laws regarding Med Care/Pharm and supply firms.
----------

About they 'joke'-
He may be watching out for his signs and god forbid someone walks by and ends up getting hassled because they are on his sidewalk?


P.S.

All the AHs that put up the signs should have to take them down after the election.
Nothing irks me more than seeing them cluttering up the streets afterwards.

[sasvermont]

Oh come on, no one is paying for the signs on their lawns! Of course, someone paid to have them printed, I know that, but they give them away! Lighten up a little! They are lawn art and then fodder once the election is over. I have to watch them wilt by the roadside for the next few months....

Yikes!

[caseysmom]

Oh come on, no one is paying for the signs on their lawns! Of course, someone paid to have them printed, I know that, but they give them away! Lighten up a little! They are lawn art and then fodder once the election is over. I have to watch them wilt by the roadside for the next few months....

Yikes!

You are incorrect they were selling those signs for ten dollars at several places I have been.

[sasvermont]

They are free in my part of the country! Sorry. Lighten up!

You can go on line and buy all the election items you'd like. They would love for folks to pay for their expenses, but you don't have to....... You can get the stuff for free!

I think you are missing the point here, anyway.

The entire topic was about a friend playing a prank on friends, right?

[caseysmom]

If you bothered to read my first post I was thinking of doing the same thing to my brother in law, I never criticized Marigold for this I just don't like it when facts are incorrect. And actually it doesn't matter if I pay for something or not once it is my property it is stealing if someone takes it.

[sasvermont]

Ok, I am not going to go on with this.

Have at each other.

[caseysmom]

Ok kiddo....

[sparks19]

Oh come on, no one is paying for the signs on their lawns! Of course, someone paid to have them printed, I know that, but they give them away! Lighten up a little! They are lawn art and then fodder once the election is over. I have to watch them wilt by the roadside for the next few months....

Yikes!

that's not true. just because YOU didn't pay for your sign doesn't mean that some people didn't pay for theirs.

I know LOTS of people that paid for their signs.

And it IS against the law to steal them... google it.

What a waste of money... I sure wouldn't pay any of our money for a sign... in fact I think they should pay ME... but the fact of the matter is... some people DO pay for them and it IS illegal to steal them... whether you like it or not.

I mean... I don't care if she played a prank as I don't care about the signs one way or another. But to some people... they matter AND they pay for them AND it is illegal to steal them. so if her neighbor happened to get a burr up his butt about it then it would be her fault and it would be theft. Just saying.

You don't have to like the law... you just have to abide by it :)

[Edwina's Secretary]

BS to me means the following: making something up, lying, content that makes it seem like someone is joking or is crazy

Is crazy:
-Taking from the people who have EARNED their money and their spot in life? I'm not in that class, other than I EARN what I recieve. Then GIVING that money to people who DON'T EARN what they have? Because this is aparently one of Obama's plans.
-Making people have socialized care - medically. You ALL know I'm riddled with this stupid Crohn's Disease. I'd NEVER, EVER take socialized care and I'm in an ER at least monthly! The care is bad enough as it is!!!!
-OKing partial birth abortion?? That is discusting!!!!! I give a crap WHO you are, its vatally mutaling a living thing!!! Abortion is A-OK with me, but that doesn't mean I personally would have it done and my disease is hereditary!
-Not voting or holding committee meetings when chairing the Iraq war committee??? Denying funding to the troops that are ALREADY in the Middle East????
-Attending a church with anyone remotely like Jeramiah Write (he could be orange with green polka dots, or PINK, my favorite color and I'd STILL believe that denying ANYONE their rights is WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!)
-Proposing tax refunds/checks to the 40% of people that DON'T pay taxes!?!?!?
-And now....his little campaign is under investigation for getting campaign contributions that were NOT authorized or even asked for!! When people have called to complain and insist they be removed, his volunteers have the nerve to say, "well, are you sure you want that $2300 charge removed??"

Would you like me to go on? You're completely right, I'm uneducated, I don't spend ANY time researching the issues and I completely ignore the candidates. Seems like this is not me you're talking about as I haven't seen a post from you REGARDING THE ISSUES, just rude, accusatory statements when anyone fails to agree with YOU!

Since it seems I'm being attacked for who I am with no reason whatsoever, let me illustrate how open-minded and thoughtful (in that I think, as well as being concerned about people) I am. I am a Christian, always have been:

I want prop 8, to FAIL. I feel gay/lesbian people are MORE than deserving of being married legally. We deserve equal rights!!

I also am OK with abortion, but not partial birth because of how cruel and vicous it is.

Kelly, you definitely need to do alot more reading.

Do you know the US Health Care system is rated 37th in the world? After most every so-called "socialized" country in the Western World. Our system is number one -- in cost.

No one is attacking you for who you are any more than you are attacking Obama for who he is. People are questioning what you say -- not who you are. There is a difference.

But you cannot say this...
I'm uneducated, I don't spend ANY time researching the issues and I completely ignore the candidates. and then express strong opinions without being question. If you ignore what the candidates are saying...where are you getting your information?

[blue]

But you cannot say this... and then express strong opinions without being question. If you ignore what the candidates are saying...where are you getting your information?

I think the fine art of sarcasm might be lost on you.

[NoahsMommy]

To tell you the truth I have never in my life been so interested in politics until this year. And there is only one reason. It's the idea that some dolt like BO may be my president.

I have the same feelings that Kelly has, there is something that does not sit right with me about his being. There is something about the way he conducts himself that makes me uneasy.

I agree 100 percent with Kelly's views on medical care. Her side is having to navigate the system and mine from working in it for years.

BO's ideas about health care are ridiculous, uneducated and very scary.

Government sponsored health care is a waste of money, time and a dangerous road to travel. Government needs to revise the laws pertaining to malpractice insurance and cap the awards given out by idiot jurors and sought after by money hungry AH lawyers. They also need to revise the laws regarding Med Care/Pharm and supply firms.


THIS is what I'm trying to say. You ALL know me, I DON'T start fights or attack unless I am attacked unfairly.

I'll admit that I tend to think people believe the same (especially here!) as I in the area of respectfulness and that I state MY opinion, its JUST that, MY OPINION. I neglect to realize that it can be taken wrong, and I'll be the first to admit that I'm sorry if it came accross another way.

I not only am a patient (nearly daily) constantly for 13+ years, but I've also worked in our medical industry for 6+ years! I'm currently paying nearly $650 in COBRA monthly and I STILL wouldn't want socialized care....even if I had to live in my car and pay only my COBRA!! Until you've been there, just like with ANYTHING ELSE, you really don't completely get the severity.

[NoahsMommy]

But you cannot say this... and then express strong opinions without being question. If you ignore what the candidates are saying...where are you getting your information?



I think the fine art of sarcasm might be lost on you.

Yea, thanks for explaining my comment, blue. :)

Sara, I meant it saracastically in response to a comment made by Lizbud. :D

[RICHARD]

The ignorance of our citizens regarding the health care system makes me want to crap my pants.

You want the government to stay out of your private lives, but allow them to dictate the length your hospital stays and what kind of treatment you receive.

In effing credible.

Should I ever become ill and have no positive outlook, I'll pack up a bag and go for a long hike in the mountains rather than having to navigate the HC system.


So, it you get ill with something that could have been treated sooner,remember, It's what you wanted.:rolleyes:

[NoahsMommy]

Just to play devil's advocate here.
Would those people happen to be black or muslim? which of those are scaring you?? Just asking, because you're leaving that one wide open to any interpretation. (not saying that either scare you, but wanting you to state exactly what you mean)

I guess I don't understand the question. Why on earth would I fear someone because of their race or religion? I have a TON of friends that are Muslim, and have many, many respectful, open discussions with them on their religion JUST so I can learn more about what the people I care about believe.

As far as race? Seriously? I hope this doesn't come out wrong, but I WISH I was born black. Honestly. I am infatuated with Maya Angelou and Toni Morrison. I've read EVERYTHING they've ever written or uttered. (along with many, many other authors that are similar, or write the same genre) I've even seen Maya Angelou speak at our local Civic Center and it was by far the GREATEST day! My bookshelves are full of nearly every book they sell at Borders or Barnes and Noble from the Black (used to be African American) History (and sometimes, Literature or Bios) section. I frequently volunteer for the Urban League Council (2 times yearly for 5 years thus far). The culture and family togetherness (I realize this isn't nearly always the case) appeal to me. I come from a very small English family and don't have anywhere near the traditions I've learned about in the black community.

All that to answer, no, those things don't scare me in the least.

Obama supports things I don't. That's basically it. He seems to be uneducated on a lot of things that matter to me. He frequently rubs me the wrong way, for many reasons.

There are things I do like about him as well. But when it comes down to it, I'm fearful about what will happen to our country war, money, healthcare-wise as well as ethically.

[jennielynn1970]

I ALWAYS have very correct "gut feelings" and there is something seriously scaring me about the possibility of him becoming President. Just look at the people he chooses to surround himself with - I wont name names, but if you watch ANY news, or radio, you'll know what I mean.



Kelly, you said this. In bold. That was my point. I watch the news. Who he "surrounds" himself with. That's why I was asking who exactly are you against him "surrounding" himself with. If you're talking about the guy they say did the terrorist stuff... eh. They've dealt with that, and that was just one person and it wasn't something that was going on when Obama was with him.

That was all. I wasn't even trying to say you were being racist or anything. I just want to know who you are referring to. I wasn't trying to be argumentative, I don't want it to come across that way!

[jennielynn1970]

You want the government to stay out of your private lives, but allow them to dictate the length your hospital stays and what kind of treatment you receive.

Should I ever become ill and have no positive outlook, I'll pack up a bag and go for a long hike in the mountains rather than having to navigate the HC system.


So, it you get ill with something that could have been treated sooner,remember, It's what you wanted.:rolleyes:

How long our hospital stays are, are already dictated. That's how they decide how much the insurance covers and all that happy stuff. "Your insurance pays for ___ number of days of care after the heart surgery." You're not going to be staying longer unless there's issues.

I worked in health care too. I did billing and collections.

Either way you look at it, it's dictated.

I also lived overseas and dealt with socialized healthcare. As a non-citizen (I was covered as I was a minor in Sweden). I never had an issue with it.

Not that we're Sweden, cause we're not. We're a lot larger. However, they did manage to handle their health care rather well.

[RICHARD]

How long our hospital stays are, are already dictated. .

So DRG means D*mned Regulatory Government?:confused:

[jennielynn1970]

I remember doing billing and coding and right in the ICD-9 book (what number are they up to now??) it would tell you how many days aftercare were covered by which procedure. So, if you had something done, and came in for a follow up, if there was a 10 day window, and you came in on day 11, the doc could bill a visit.

I guess DRG can mean whatever you want it to mean. It's all regulated. PPO, HMO... whatever. You get what you get by what the insurance will cover (or not cover), including length of hospital stay.

[shais_mom]

Everyone IS entitled to a opinion, even me. To say that you've informed
yourself before makeing a choice between candidates,sounds doubtful from
any statement you've made so far.(IMO) Your viseral reaction to anything
"Obama" & counting on your "gut" feelings to show you the truth, is absurd.

All this doesn't mean a hill of beans to me in the long run, but I certainly
believe I know BS when I hear it.

I haven't read thru the entire thread but I just wanted to say - that I totally agree - b/c the more I read your posts, Liz, that's exactly what I see.
B.
S.

[shais_mom]

This is why I hate politics. Look what people fight over. :rolleyes: Though I did find her statement really uncalled for although I'm ALL for Obama because McCain annoys the CRAP out of me, but that's not for me to post right now.



Now you know how Kelly and I feel about Obama.
Nuff Said.

[jazzcat]

Just standing here with my ten foot pole. :p


I agree with Kelly and Richard on a lot of this. I guess I finally understand all those celebrities who claimed they would move out of the country if Bush won. Well I'm feeling that way now about Obama. I've heard Costa Rica is nice.

I think Obama has shown a history of associating with questionable people and that shows a big flaw in his judgment. I need to know that my president has good judgment in all things, including character. I'd hate to see the positions of cabinet seats, supreme court justices and top aides being filled with the likes of Rev. Wright, Tony Rezko and William Ayers. It goes on to a bigger scale, what does that mean about his associations outside the US? Who is he willing to "sit down" with (i.e. Ahmadinejad)? My brain and my "gut" tell me to run away from Obama.

[Alysser]

Now you know how Kelly and I feel about Obama.
Nuff Said.

Oh by the way, I just realized what I said sounded like I was accusing Kelly of saying something wrong. I meant to say what Lizbud posted was uncalled for. I didn't measn for it to come across that way, Sorry if that's what you thought :o

My brother is HEAVILY into politics and works for votevets.org. His company rasied 5 millon $ for Obama's campaign. That's not the only reason I'm for Obama of course, I'm not always democratic, I don't like all their veiws, I'd actually say I'm more in between but I can't picture McCain in office and Sarah Palin for Vice pres.

By the way, I really don't see how putting the signs on someone elses lawn is theft? They were not actually stolen, it was a joke. Doesn't seem like theft to me.

For the record, I don't really either like any of the canditates for President at the point. I was really rooting for Hilary Clinton, but that didn't happen. I didn't really like politics much at all until my brother got into it and until I joined Junior Statesmen of America(JSA) at school. I just want to get more involved and educate myself more on the canditates really.

[Edwina's Secretary]

I'm currently paying nearly $650 in COBRA monthly and I STILL wouldn't want socialized care....even if I had to live in my car and pay only my COBRA!! Until you've been there, just like with ANYTHING ELSE, you really don't completely get the severity.

Have you ever been covered in a country with what you call socialized medicine. If not, how can you know what it is like?

And I am sorry I did not get your sarcasm. It was just that a number of the things you stated as "facts" were incorrect. So I assumed you hadn't done much research.

[shais_mom]

I just want to get more involved and educate myself more on the canditates really.

good for you :) and I mean that sincerely - and it is heartfelt.
if it sounds snide or sarcastic in anyway please accept my apology b/c that isn't my intent. I wish I would have paid more attention when I was younger.
((hugs))

[sparks19]

Have you ever been covered in a country with what you call socialized medicine. If not, how can you know what it is like?

.

I have :D

I know you weren't asking me.

[Edwina's Secretary]

I have :D

I know you weren't asking me.

Quite alright Sparky. I know you did not like the experience. And we have heard from Randi in Denmark who finds it a good experience. But
Until you've been there how can you know it is terrible?

[jennielynn1970]

I think it's all in how it's run, and which government is running it. I had no issues with it in Sweden, and they treated me amazingly. The families and friends I had there had no complaints either.


We complained about the price of alcohol, lol. And that you couldn't get much of anything in that department that wasn't Swedish. You had to go on the party boats between Sweden and Denmark to get foreign alcohol, and bring it back home with you. Fun, fun!!

Again, Sweden is a small country, as is Denmark. I don't know how it would work in the states, but I think if they took the models that are used, the ones that work well, it can be achieved.

[blue]

Since Sweden has been brought up at least once...

Ive been enjoying a tobbaco product of theirs for the last week or more. Its called Snus, its tobbaco pouches you put under your lip. Good stuff and helps keep me from smoking without the nastiness of chewing tobbaco.

[NoahsMommy]

Jen_Librarian,
I'm sorry I didn't read through your question correctly. I think this thread has my BP up and I have low BP, normally!! ;)

My response would not have been nearly as perfect as Jazzcat's:

I agree with Kelly and Richard on a lot of this. I guess I finally understand all those celebrities who claimed they would move out of the country if Bush won. Well I'm feeling that way now about Obama. I've heard Costa Rica is nice.

I think Obama has shown a history of associating with questionable people and that shows a big flaw in his judgment. I need to know that my president has good judgment in all things, including character. I'd hate to see the positions of cabinet seats, supreme court justices and top aides being filled with the likes of Rev. Wright, Tony Rezko and William Ayers. It goes on to a bigger scale, what does that mean about his associations outside the US? Who is he willing to "sit down" with (i.e. Ahmadinejad)? My brain and my "gut" tell me to run away from Obama.

I believe you can make excuses (truly valid ones) about a lot of things, but we CHOOSE who we spend our free time with. While open-mindedness is a good thing, associating with people that are dangerous or affiliated with danger/hate/evil will NEVER have a valid reason. We know a whole lot about the people we associate ourselves with...
**AGAIN, IMO. ;) **

Sara,
Talk to Nommilyn or Slick about their healthcare system. While geographically similar in size, but not exactly in population. Slick has to PAY for a supplement just to get into a Doctor WHEN SHE WANTS and for TESTS THAT SHE NORMALLY HAS TO WAIT FOR. Have YOU ever had an HMO? I don't have to try drugs to know they're bad for me....or go to a quack doctor to know its not a good idea.

You've had experience with American bureaucracy, have you seen many well-run, consumer/people-benefiting government agencies that actually DO what they're supposed to do? When ones health is at stake....you have NOTHING else without it.

I also never stated my examples as FACT, If I did, I'm sorry. I get my information from a large combination of magazines, online blogs/articles/newspapers, paper newspapers, radio and television - MUCH comes DIRECTLY from the candidates mouths. Such as: yesterday Obama SAID that he wants to make sure some waitress can pay her rent (because she's barely making her rent) while talking to "Joe (Samuel) the Plumber". He said, that if the people like this waitress had more money (from the GOVERNMENT, ie: your EXTRA tax dollars), she'd be able to thrive. What happened to MAKING YOUR OWN LIVING?? WORKING HARD??? BEING RESPONSIBLE FOR ONES SELF??? (I'm not yelling, just emphasizing. :D )

Do you make $250,000 (profit) per year? (DONT answer this one.) If you did, would you want your money going to people that refuse to get a better job and lease on life? People that just want to stay where they are, griping about how they don't make enough, but FAILING to DO ANYTHING about it?? NOT ME! If I start making that much, I would be HORRIFIED if MY money that I worked my butt off for was taken from me just so some lazy person can go get a new car this year - that they cannot afford. NO WAY!

SIGNS: My parents donated (along with many people in our areas - both Rep and Dem) money to the Republican Party and were given McCain/Palin signs and buttons. I would imagine they'd give them to you free if you asked to support that way. If someone took this from my parents front lawn, there'd be hell to pay. You don't mess with people's stuff...free or paid for. ESPECIALLY a neighbor regarding politics. I DO see the humor, this isn't my point, its that you've offended a neighbor (you said he got mad) that you have to live with for a long time. If he didn't get mad, it'd be different.

[RICHARD]

I believe you can make excuses (truly valid ones) about a lot of things, but we CHOOSE who we spend our free time with. While open-mindedness is a good thing, associating with people that are dangerous or affiliated with danger/hate/evil will NEVER have a valid reason. We know a whole lot about the people we associate ourselves with...
**AGAIN, IMO. ;) **

.


The thing that really turns me off is the "I was only 8 years old when Ayers was bombing shiat up" or his "That's not true" when confronted with the fact that he was in Ayers house to launch his 'career'. THe rev Wright problem? "I never heard him say anything about the U.S." Or, his ability to purchase a home with the help of Rezko.

I'd give him a break and would have considered voting for him-until he started to dodge the questions that came out of his associations-Why not man-up and get the doubt out into the open? Notice that all his buddies have gone to ground because they don't want to be held accountable for what they have said or done.

From Wiki-on the pub of his memoirs-
Much of the controversy about Ayers during the decade since 2000 stems from an interview he gave to The New York Times on the occasion of the memoir's publication.The reporter quoted him as saying "I don't regret setting bombs" and "I feel we didn't do enough", and, when asked if he would "do it all again," as saying "I don't want to discount the possibility." Ayers has not denied the quotes, but he protested the interviewer's characterizations in a Letter to the Editor published September 15, 2001: "This is not a question of being misunderstood or 'taken out of context', but of deliberate distortion"[/B]

LOLOL,
If I was BO I would have taken steps to make sure that the Ayers question would have never come up again. Of course, like any radical idiot, they become part of the 'system' that they plotted against for so long. THey found out that blowing themselves up and robbing banks put them in jail, where they were useless to their cause. That's the funniest part about old radical hippies- they sell out, but to keep their ideal, they clean up, take a bath and play it cool while they dream of taking down the same 'man' that they mirror so shamelessly.

All BO had to do was address the idiots that he was connected to. Just come out and say something contrite like "WA was a radical bomber in the 60's, I did have a connection with him and did launch my poli career at his home, I wasn't well versed in his background at the time and regret that there has been this kind of coverage in the media about that association"

No, Instead he acts like a lying school kid that was part of the window breaking spree at the local elementary school. "Well, It wasn't me.""I didn't know they were breaking windows until afterwards' "I didn't hear/see anything''

IT's a patently dishonest little sidestep and people are tagged as haters or racists when they push the issue.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Sara,
Talk to Nommilyn or Slick about their healthcare system. While geographically similar in size, but not exactly in population. Slick has to PAY for a supplement just to get into a Doctor WHEN SHE WANTS and for TESTS THAT SHE NORMALLY HAS TO WAIT FOR. Have YOU ever had an HMO? I don't have to try drugs to know they're bad for me....or go to a quack doctor to know its not a good idea.

You've had experience with American bureaucracy, have you seen many well-run, consumer/people-benefiting government agencies that actually DO what they're supposed to do? When ones health is at stake....you have NOTHING else without it.

I do have experience with Healthcare right here. If you want a PPO rather than an HMO...so you can see a doctor of your choice -- you pay more. The very same thing as Slick has to do. I fail to see the difference.



Kelly, have you ever been down on your luck and had to collect unemployment insurance? If so, you're welcome. My taxes pay for that. And I will not call you any of the names you have plastered on others who accept assistance from the government.

I don't like to see anyone -- especially children -- who cannot get medical care because of our system.

I think I can safely guarantee I pay more taxes than you do. Of course I do not enjoy paying them. But I consider it the price I pay to live in what I hope is a civilized society.

I have been fortunate in the parents to whom I was born, the education I receive, my ability to use my talents to make a good living. I do not take those things for granted.

But I do recognize not everyone has had the same advantages. And I have compassion for those who are less fortunate -- who have a more difficult time in life.

If some of the money I earn goes to helping them have adequate medical care -- I am okay with that.

[sparks19]

I think it's all in how it's run, and which government is running it. I had no issues with it in Sweden, and they treated me amazingly. The families and friends I had there had no complaints either.


We complained about the price of alcohol, lol. And that you couldn't get much of anything in that department that wasn't Swedish. You had to go on the party boats between Sweden and Denmark to get foreign alcohol, and bring it back home with you. Fun, fun!!

Again, Sweden is a small country, as is Denmark. I don't know how it would work in the states, but I think if they took the models that are used, the ones that work well, it can be achieved.


I hear ya on that one.

Back home a case of beer was over $40 :O and is supposedly going up to $50 last I heard.

[Puckstop31]

The health care thing.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D93SBEUG0&show_article=1

The most telling quote, IMHO.

"People who were already able to afford health care began to stop paying for it so they could get it for free," said Dr. Kenny Fink, the administrator for Med-QUEST at the Department of Human Services. "I don't believe that was the intent of the program."

Well, DUH.

Now, what do we think happens when this happens on a national scale?

I understand a need for a better way to cover more people. Whatever that answer is, it is NOT the government doing it.

[NoahsMommy]

Oh jeesh! You know very well what I mean....

Again, please take what I say with your knowledge of ME!

Sara, I love you to no end, but please, read what I write with some context in mind. I don't have time to argue each and every comment I make, although I stand by them.

I strictly stated that this was regarding people that CHOOSE to only work part-time and CHOOSE to rely on the government for the rest of whatever they owe, want or are responsible for. We ALL know these people. Also the people that complain they only make a certain amount of money, but don't TRY to get another p/t job or educate/train themselves to better their situation - WITH government help is FINE with me!!! I agree that we ALL need help now and then, but don't take $$ from people who've earned it the hard way to give to people that EXPECT IT.

I hope that's clear.

[NoahsMommy]

I understand a need for a better way to cover more people. Whatever that answer is, it is NOT the government doing it.

AGREED!!

I agree that EVERYONE deserves care and treatment - 500%!!! If you cannot afford it, there are programs, if they aren't in place, they SHOULD BE!

[beeniesmom]

Quite alright Sparky. I know you did not like the experience. And we have heard from Randi in Denmark who finds it a good experience. But how can you know it is terrible?

I experienced socialized healthcare in Italy, for 13 years of my life and it was a good experience. Never did me or my family ever spend sleepless nights thinking about how we were going to pay for drs. appointments and surgeries and general care, until we moved to the States. I love it here but the healthcare system is messed up. I really don't understand why people are afraid of it here. If organized correctly it can be a great thing, for everyone.
The only ones who should fear it are the insurance companies.

[sparks19]

I experienced socialized healthcare in Italy, for 13 years of my life and it was a good experience. Never did me or my family ever spend sleepless nights thinking about how we were going to pay for drs. appointments and surgeries and general care, until we moved to the States. I love it here but the healthcare system is messed up. I really don't understand why people are afraid of it here. If organized correctly it can be a great thing, for everyone.
The only ones who should fear it are the insurance companies.

that's a big if lol. I think that's why it doesn't work in Ontario (at least not for me or just about anyone I know... which isn't exactly a large part of the population lol). It has been so mismanaged and they have to keep cutting funding and cutting funding and that means less dr's, less nurses and A LOT less beds.

a friend of mine just had a baby and she was almost two weeks over due and she was supposed to be induced. The date of her induction she went in and they said "Oh sorry all our beds are full. come back tomorrow" so she went back the next day and they were still full so they told her to go home and they would call her when they were ready. 4 days after her original induction date she finally got in. Not ONE hospital in London had ONE bed open? they told her that if she went in to labor she would have to go to another town 45 minutes away and hope that they had beds. I'm not exaggerating this.

So... seeing how badly the system CAN be mismanaged with a population no where CLOSE to the US... and seeing how bad the government has screwed up just about every other program. I don't have a lot of faith that it will be organized correctly. :)

[beeniesmom]

I heard nightmare stories about Canadian and English healthcare in particular too. I really think the US can pull it off, if it's done the right way.
I'm sorry about the treatment your friend got. :(

[sparks19]

I heard nightmare stores about Canadian and English healthcare in particular too. I really think the US can pull it off, if it's done the right way.
I'm sorry about the treatment your friend got. :(

Thanks... it"s all good now. Now she has a happy and healthy baby boy... but I guess the dangers of being so far overdue... he was 10;bs 10 oz. YIKES :eek: lol

[RICHARD]

Not ONE hospital in London had ONE bed open? they told her that if she went in to labor she would have to go to another town 45 minutes away and hope that they had beds. I'm not exaggerating this.

So... seeing how badly the system CAN be mismanaged with a population no where CLOSE to the US... and seeing how bad the government has screwed up just about every other program. I don't have a lot of faith that it will be organized correctly. :)

That is incredible.

The least the facility could have done is placed her into an ER bed? A triage area bed? A post op bed?

The reason that physicians DO NOT WANT TO DEAL with the government is the turn around on the payments for services rendered, that and malpractice insurance for doctors is driving them out of certain specialties.

A good surgeon can do two cholecystectomies and two or three hernia repairs in a day. One heart surgeon will do one valve replacement and a couple of vein strippings on a person's leg.

The money is made on the hard operations, But, it's also lost on how many people you have in the room with the surgeon. For a simple hernia? One surgeon, an anesthesiologist, scrub and circulator. For a heart valve? 6? more?

If there is to be any kind of health care reform in the United States it has to be done from the top to the bottom. It's not without people fighting the system and the changes.

IF HCR means that your coverage will have to absorb or make room for government subsidised members, you will see a drop in the quality of your HC and the type of tests available to you.

The key to the problem that everyone brings up is AFFORDABILITY. I do whine and complain about it because no one else does. People continue to sign over large checks because they have to-they have no choice.

It's either go broke paying a monthly premium now or pass on it and go broke later if you don't have the coverage.

A shame.

[jackie]

I heard nightmare stories about Canadian and English healthcare in particular too. I really think the US can pull it off, if it's done the right way.
I'm sorry about the treatment your friend got. :(

I am Canadian, I never once had a problem with health care there.

I have vacationed in England and ended up in E.R., I was taken care of and sent on my way without paying a dime.

I live in Spain, they do make you wait around a lot, but at the end of the day I am not having to decide whether I can feed my children or pay for their medical care. Thank god.

:love:

[Edwina's Secretary]

France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica

[Edwina's Secretary]

I strictly stated that this was regarding people that CHOOSE to only work part-time and CHOOSE to rely on the government for the rest of whatever they owe, want or are responsible for. We ALL know these people. Also the people that complain they only make a certain amount of money, but don't TRY to get another p/t job or educate/train themselves to better their situation - WITH government help is FINE with me!!! I agree that we ALL need help now and then, but don't take $$ from people who've earned it the hard way to give to people that EXPECT IT.

I hope that's clear.

Sorry Kelly. I am not with you on this one. You are prepared to judge the worthiness of others' claims. I am not....nor will I not judge your worthiness to receive assistance from the government.

I don't expect other people to live the way I do, to want the things I want, to make the choices I made to get where I am.

Somewhere I read "Judge not lest you be judged." It seems to me to be a good rule to live by.

[lizbud]

France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica


This is amazing to me.:eek: I really didn't know there were that many countries.

[Nomilynn]

Since I am Canadian I won't be voting, but I feel the need to mention something about the Canadian health care system.

I am a diabetic, and have been for a long time now. I pay for basic health premiums (MSP), based on my income, that allows me to see a doctor at any time or go to a hospital at any time without having to concern myself with a hefty bill later on. It adds up to a piddly $54 a month. In my opinion, that is not a very large cost for piece of mind.

I was just laid off from my job, so I have now been unemployed for 2 weeks. I am looking for work every day, but I at least know that because I pay this premium, I will be able to continue to see my doctors, get blood tests, and go to the hospital if needed, even though I have no income.

When I get a job, I will hopefully be able to sign up for an extended medical program through the employer that will cover any medications that aren't covered by my MSP (such as antibiotics, etc). However, even if I can't get an extended plan, I will still be covered by MSP once I have paid my deductable, which I believe is $500. Since I pay that in one month for medication, I would be fine after January of next year. I just have to keep paying my $54 per month.

I had surgery last year that was covered, I will be seeing a specialist in a month or so due to a knee injury that will be covered, and when that needs surgery, I won't have to pay for that either. I would be in a very serious condition if I didn't have this MSP to help. This system can and does work - I don't know about other countries or even other provinces but I know that without this program, I would not be able to afford the medication needed to keep me alive.

[Glacier]

This system can and does work - I don't know about other countries or even other provinces but I know that without this program, I would not be able to afford the medication needed to keep me alive.


We don't pay health care premiums in the Yukon. We did when we lived in Alberta. Each province sets that up differently. I can say that the system works when it's truly needed. My husband suffered a serious head and neck injury last fall, potentially life threatening. We did not wait in the ER. We went straight in, had a doctor in with him immediately, a CT scan in under 30 minutes, pain control almost immediately, a hospital stay.....no bill when we left.

Because of where we live we have limited access to specialists locally. A few come up here throughout the year for clinics and surgeries. However, costs are covered to fly to Vancouver or Calgary to see specialist. The wait list for non-urgent referrals, about 3 months. For urgent referrals, serious injuries ect, a medi-vac plane is on stand-by 24/7, 365 days a year.

I have a 15 year old nephew currently battling cancer. The time from initial suspicions to diagnosis to starting treatment...72 hours. Financial cost to his family, nothing. No risk that they will loose their savings, their home, ect while they try to save their son. I can't imagine having to worry about the hospital bills when my child or my spouse is fighting for their life.

I have a great benefit plan at work that covers 80% of all prescriptions. If a Yukon resident develops a chronic disease, like diabetes, MS ect, all costs for drugs, adaptive equipment, doctors ect are covered under the Chronic Disease Program.

I won't drive to Alaska for the afternoon(an easy trip from my house) without buying medical coverage. Just not worth the risk.

The portion of my taxes that goes towards our medical system is the one part I don't mind paying at all!

[Catlady711]

Ron Paul for President!


If that fails.....

Pat Pauson for President!


If that fails....

Gallagher for President!!!

[RICHARD]

This is amazing to me.:eek: I really didn't know there were that many countries.


There are more than 191 (about that number) of countries in the world.

The amusing thing about the 'rankings' is that most of these countries are far richer in per capita, per person than the U.S., they have a smaller populations and have a stronger HC system set up by the government.
THey have had years to perfect it.



lol, San Marino? Andorra? UAE? Saudi Arabia?

IN those countries they probably do not even consult a physician in that country? How many people fly to have surgeries or treatments in the U.S.? People with money or means will travel the earth for a cure.

IF you have oil or FU money, at what price health?

We fly kids with ortho problems, transplant and brain patients here-or fly our doctors out to them-because we are pioneers in the medical field.

Half (?)the vaccines and pioneer procedures are perfected here, most often on ill patients from other countries.


Stats/ranking/polls are great fun. And in the end they mean nothing more that being able to count from 1 to 100.


Show your work.:rolleyes:

[Catty1]

Glacier - Alberta is finally dumping its health care premiums as of January 2009.

It's difficult to discuss "Canadian" health care when each province and territory has its own laws governing its administration. Although - there is a Canada Health Act that none of the provincial jurisdictions had better contravene.

There is MUCH talk about adding private health care to our system. Some clinics are running now. This has led to an outcry that the 'rich' will get first-place treatment, and the rest of us will have to rely on the public system. That's not necessarily bad - but we are running woefully short of doctors and nurses all across the country.

The best system in the world won't necessarily cut waiting times...

[Edwina's Secretary]

Yes....analysis from a former hospital worker is far more valid than that of the World Health Organization.

Pleeeze....

[blue]

Since the WHO is part of the UN I would take the word of a
former hospital worker over them.

[RICHARD]

Since the WHO is part of the UN

I heard a talk show program tout the wonders and generosity of the Docs without Borders and other programs that send physicians to other countries to set up clinics to treat the indiges there.

I heard of docs being more than happy to make the trip so it would show up as a deduction on an income tax filing.

THere also is a program where docs fly patients back and forth to treatments, also a nice deduction in the end.

---------

I just want to wish the UN (UHN) a happy birthday and may they have many more years of mediocrity and impotence in the future.

I look forward to sharing the same pleasures as they do in my later years,:D:eek::rolleyes:

[JenBKR]

Somewhere I read "Judge not lest you be judged." It seems to me to be a good rule to live by.

It's from the bible, book of Matthew.


I do agree with you Kelly, in a sense. I think that welfare can be a good thing, but that it is abused by some people. I believe that people who can work, should work. I hope I can explain this well...I believe that you can't help someone who can't help themselves. People who can work, but choose not to and live on welfare, are actually hurting themselves by not getting out into the workplace. Earning your own money and place in the world gives one a sense of belonging and accomplishment.

I am not saying that welfare, unemployment, and other such programs are bad, and I want to make that clear. I think that there are lots of people who use them who seriously need them, and I don't look down on anyone who is on welfare or the like. I myself was on unemployment for three months years ago when the company I was working for suddenly closed. Personally, I didn't like it. To me, I get more of a sense of worth by earning my pay. I hope that what I am saying is making sense...it's making sense in my head but sometimes that's hard to convey in writing ;)

[Edwina's Secretary]

Since the WHO is part of the UN I would take the word of a over them.

Then may I wish you...should you ever be in need of medical help...a former Teamster clerk instead of a Doctor Without Borders.

Good luck and good night.

[caseysmom]

Then may I wish you...should you ever be in need of medical help...a former Teamster clerk instead of a Doctor Without Borders.

Good luck and good night.

Ignorance is bliss;)

[Edwina's Secretary]

IN those countries they probably do not even consult a physician in that country? How many people fly to have surgeries or treatments in the U.S.? You haven't been reading closely RICHARD...everyone goes to India for surgery now.

or fly our doctors out to them-because we are pioneers in the medical field.

Would that be...Doctors without Borders...a group you disparage?

Show your work.:rolleyes: Wouldn't that require you to .....WORK???

[blue]

Then may I wish you...should you ever be in need of medical help...a former Teamster clerk instead of a Doctor Without Borders.

Good luck and good night.


With the nasty infection Im dealing with right now, Ill stick with "Cash is King". The Teamsters and DWBs arent in my neighborhood.

[RICHARD]

Good luck and good night.



Please, could you try to get a sign off that's a little more original?

You and KO need a writer, or to stop hanging out with the BORG. NOw toss the wadded up paper at the screen, as if that will make you cool and hip, preceived image is everthing.


LOL,

What, you want me to go in search of stuff on the 'net, That way I can copy it and parrot it endlessly?


I did my 30 IN and AROUND HC, NOt pedaling it .


Sorry I cannot support my work and will admit it. I stoop tp stupidity, Ignorance requires a knowlegde that is left out of a conversation.

I'd rather go with what I do not know, rather than faking it.

LOL outsourcing in India? No one outsources to India? Are you thick?
Why would anyone on the planet use Indian elbow grease?

Talk about uninformed.:rolleyes:

[jennielynn1970]

I've heard Egypt is really cheap for medical care, Richard. You can get that laser eye surgery done for like, $100.

Not sure what you'll be seeing after that, but what the heck!


Seriously though, my one ex, who is from Egypt/Palestine/Syria(they aren't even sure what their background is, lol), his sister got a job in Saudi Arabia doing dentistry. It paid an OUTRAGEOUS amount. She stayed about a year and then left to come back to the US to get her license to practice here, not because of money, but because she didn't like the restrictions. After I heard what she was getting paid, hell, I would have worn a burqua and hijab and moved there! Well, not really, but you get my drift that it was awesome money.

[critters]

Returning to the original topic:

For the nothing it's worth, I think your trick was cute. You might find this article interesting re: how times have changed for pranks. http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2008/102008/10182008/417679 I have to say that some of the ones he describes, especially the cow in school, SHOULD have been criminalized!! :eek:

[Edwina's Secretary]

I did my 30 IN and AROUND HC, NOt pedaling it .



How does one pedal HC?


And thanks for finally admitting....
Sorry I cannot support my work and will admit it.

[caseysmom]

Suprising that some near genius level in the HC field would not be appreciated for that genius?

[RICHARD]

I've heard Egypt is really cheap for medical care, Richard. You can get that laser eye surgery done for like, $100.

Not sure what you'll be seeing after that, but what the heck!


Seriously though, my one ex, who is from Egypt/Palestine/Syria(they aren't even sure what their background is, lol), his sister got a job in Saudi Arabia doing dentistry. It paid an OUTRAGEOUS amount. She stayed about a year and then left to come back to the US to get her license to practice here, not because of money, but because she didn't like the restrictions. After I heard what she was getting paid, hell, I would have worn a burqua and hijab and moved there! Well, not really, but you get my drift that it was awesome money.
LOL
I can do laser surgery on myself, just the cost of the laser pointer thingy that I have for the cat.:eek:

Interesting about the SA pay scale. Do you know if it is an open system? Can people off the 'street' participate in it? THat is another feature about that area/FU/oil money. YOu can bet if one of the 'royal' family gets ill that some kind of full scale attempt at treatment will be implemented.

I knew a Philipino gal who worked in the ME - She was also a little out of her element there- her hubby was black and was subjected to the 'rules of the road' -so they decided to come to the U.S. and work here.

[Marigold2]

Returning to the original topic:

For the nothing it's worth, I think your trick was cute. You might find this article interesting re: how times have changed for pranks. http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2008/102008/10182008/417679 I have to say that some of the ones he describes, especially the cow in school, SHOULD have been criminalized!! :eek:
Ah thanks. I can't wait for April Fools Day :p:p:p

There was a segment on either 20/20 or 60 minutes on how people, including dentists are going to Mexico :eek::eek:
yes Mexico for good, cheap dental care.

Also I lived in Germany for two years back in 1977-1979 and we had socialized medicine. My oldest son was born there.
The differences were amazing. Average hospital stay for mom was 9 days.
No phone in room.
No bath or toliet.
No choice of menu
4 moms to a room
Cost billed to me for a 9 day stay, 9 months of OB visits and one week of ICU for my son who was sent to a childrens hospital........ $00.0000000000000
Nada, nix, nothing.
Care wonderful.
Food ok.
Company of 3 other woman, lovely.
Having to walk down the hall to the loo, cold.
If the USA ran their health care the same way this country would be in great shape.
But we Americans are so spoiled. We have to have private room decked out in frilly fabrics, and pretty colors, birthing rooms that look like a bedroom.
All of us pay for this. Lets cut the pork. Heck lets cut out the whole fat pig.
People who are on Caresource, Welfare and Medicaid having babies that we the tax payor have to support don't need private rooms with TV, phone, pink curtains, choice of menu, and private bath. Actually none of us do. I for one would love to see health care cut the pork but not the care and save us all bucka bucks.
Good care doesn't have to be wrapped in luxury, good care is enough. Everyone American citizen should have that right. If you want extra's you should have to pay for them. Like a hotel. This way the people who want the luxury have it and add to the hospital money and those that don't get simple, decent, first rate medicial care. :D:D:D
Oh and Puck you have been on my ignore list for a year so don't bother.

[Randi]

Marigold, a hospital stay in Denmark is pretty much the same as you descibed in Germany. I have been to a few different hospitals in Copenhagen and have visited friends and family there too. Depending how ill/sick? you are, you get to share a room with 3 or even 5 people, but you also get a room on your own, or share with one other person. These days, each room has a bathroom (like in a hotel) and if you want a TV in your room, that is possible too in most places, I believe. Also a cell phone. And there's a library who comes round with books you can borrow.

In recent years, it has been possible for rich people to go to private hospitals ... to cut the waiting list, but if you suffer from certain decieces?, your doctor can admit you to one of those free of cost, and you can also choose to go to a hospital in another European country to get treated there (if the waiting list is long).

I'll say it again, I'm happy to pay a bit more tax for everyone to be able to go to hospital (and your doctor) for free! :)

[lizbud]

Marigold, a hospital stay in Denmark is pretty much the same as you descibed in Germany. I have been to a few different hospitals in Copenhagen and have visited friends and family there too. Depending how ill/sick? you are, you get to share a room with 3 or even 5 people, but you also get a room on your own, or share with one other person. These days, each room has a bathroom (like in a hotel) and if you want a TV in your room, that is possible too in most places, I believe. Also a cell phone. And there's a library who comes round with books you can borrow.

In recent years, it has been possible for rich people to go to private hospitals ... to cut the waiting list, but if you suffer from certain decieces?, your doctor can admit you to one of those free of cost, and you can also choose to go to a hospital in another European country to get treated there (if the waiting list is long).

I'll say it again, I'm happy to pay a bit more tax for everyone to be able to go to hospital (and your doctor) for free! :)


Your description of a regular hospital room doesn't sound that bad to me.:)
The only bad part might be being stuck in a room with a obnoxious, loud
roommate.:p

[Puckstop31]

Oh and Puck you have been on my ignore list for a year so don't bother.

Well, you are still thinking about me. Score! ;)

[lizbud]

Well, you are still thinking about me. Score! ;)


Dream on little man.:D LOL

[sparks19]

hmmm maybe I'm just short... but he doesn't seem so small to me. Much taller than I am :D

[Puckstop31]

Dream on little man.:D LOL


My Dad can beat up your Dad. :D

[blue]

My dad has no arms.

JOKING!

[shepgirl]

I can honestly say I don't understand a lot of PT people here. :confused::confused: So maybe you didn't find humor in what I did.
But I did no harm. Nothing was broken, ruined, scraped, bashed, trashed. I took a sign and moved it two doors down and moved another two doors up.
I do not live in a low income neighborhood. My neighbors are Dr. Dentist, lawyer, computer progamers all white collar professionals. I know both couples, both are retired in their 60's professionals. No one was going to get bashed or their car keyed.
We are suppose to be America the United for one and all. Yes we disagree on whom shall be best to lead this country. Hence the signs. (LOL I don't care what any of you think it was very very funny.) Instead people are fighting and name calling and saying bad things, lies, half truths about both canidates. They are both good, intelligent, kind, hardworking, gifted people as are their wives. They disagree on what is best for us, we have the right to decide who will win. Many people died and are continuing to die for that right. Lets not soil it folks. Do I think Bush was the worst president ever, you bet, but American citizens have the right to vote for whomever they choose? The ballets are after all filled with a million men and woman's blood. So lets smile :D and try and be kind. And yea it was so funny.:)


Sorry Marigold, I laughed through your whole post. I did find it hilarious and didn't understand why the others thought it was so wrong. Out here it would be considered the funniest joke on the street. I was going to respond and say how I thought it was the greatest joke yet, but my buzzer went off and I had to close...happens a lot in my life...
Just so you know, I think your joke was funnier than the bickering over things we have no control over no matter how mad we might get.

[blue]

An Obama supporters response to having their sign stolen.

http://www.geocities.com/duffy7836/stolenobamasign.jpg

The response from a McCain supporter after having their sign stolen.

http://www.geocities.com/duffy7836/stolenmccainsign.jpg

[Edwina's Secretary]

hmmm maybe I'm just short... but he doesn't seem so small to me. Much taller than I am :D

Smallness is measured in many ways.:D

[Puckstop31]

Smallness is measured in many ways.:D

ES... I weep for you. I really, really do.

[Randi]

An Obama supporters response to having their sign stolen.

http://www.geocities.com/duffy7836/stolenobamasign.jpg

The response from a McCain supporter after having their sign stolen.

http://www.geocities.com/duffy7836/stolenmccainsign.jpg
As I'm Danish I had to look this up, but I had a feeling it was what I thought it would be:

(Amendment II) to the United States Constitution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Constitution) is a part of the United States Bill of Rights (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Bill_of_Rights) that protects the pre-existing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_right) individual right (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_rights) to possess and carry weapons (i.e. "keep and bear arms") in case of confrontation....

How sick... to threathen people with firearms for things like this! :( For me, these signs simply comfirm that the Obama supporter is a lot more intelligent than the Mc Cain supporter.

[RICHARD]

As I'm Danish I had to look this up, but I had a feeling it was what I thought it would be:


How sick... to threathen people with firearms for things like this! :( For me, these signs simply comfirm that the Obama supporter is a lot more intelligent than the Mc Cain supporter.


Randi,

You should see the things that stupid Americans do to each other with
Ordinary kitchen utensils, Fists, Automobiles, Baseball bats, Sticks, Bottles.

Another thing about Stupid Americans is that we have no respect for for each other, property, space and rights.

When we see something that bothers us, like a political sign, we stoop to the level of immature, ignorant and malicious children. We steal or vandalize things, then have to resort to threats when people take it upon themselves to "fix" something they cannot handle.

Be thankful you do not live in a society where people will scratch a car's paint because they see a political bumpersticker that they do not agree with, on it.

IT's a sad commentary about our society, Things would not get out of hand if people just respected each other and their property. You will hear about someone getting hurt or killed over a stupid sign for a stupid candidate.

And you know, It shouldn't happen.

People just have to behave. I can see why most of the world hates us.:(:confused::o

[lizbud]

ES... I weep for you. I really, really do.



ES, do you hear the buzzing of gnats around here? I think I did.:D

[Edwina's Secretary]

ES, do you hear the buzzing of gnats around here? I think I did.:D

Liz, I highly recommend the "Ignore" button. It keeps those pesky flies away! :D:D

[lizbud]

How sick... to threathen people with firearms for things like this! :( For me, these signs simply comfirm that the Obama supporter is a lot more intelligent than the Mc Cain supporter.

Randi, I believe the "far right" Republicans have gone over the top much more
in this election. I also think it's a matter of desparation on their part & maybe
because they lack clear answers to the economic mess this country is in now.

[RICHARD]

Randi, I believe the "far right" Republicans have gone over the top much more
in this election. I also think it's a matter of desparation on their part & maybe
because they lack clear answers to the economic mess this country is in now.

AH, ah, ah,

Don't forget to add the Democrats, who have control of the House of Representin' and have been totally impotent for a while.

Now, if only we could make those pesky GOP senators impotent, too.:eek:

[Edwina's Secretary]

As long as it is Silly Sunday....

The Obama backer blamed "you"...after all...who really knows? It could have been teenagers having "fun" or a Bob Barker Backer...or...

And their solution was...non-violent.

The McCain backer blamed "Obama supporters"...Do they know that for a fact or just assume?

And their solution is to threaten violence.

So...Obama backers have a sense of humor, do not jump to conclusion and look for solutions that do not involve violence. :D:D:D

McCain backers on the other hand....

[Randi]

When we see something that bothers us, like a political sign, we stoop to the level of immature, ignorant and malicious children. We steal or vandalize things, then have to resort to threats when people take it upon themselves to "fix" something they cannot handle.
Richard, I'm afraid Danes are not angels either, some will do the same here - mostly uneducated people - people who never learned to express themselves.


IT's a sad commentary about our society, Things would not get out of hand if people just respected each other and their property. You will hear about someone getting hurt or killed over a stupid sign for a stupid candidate.
Yes, it is sad! :( And I would not be surprised if someone did get killed.


Randi, I believe the "far right" Republicans have gone over the top much more in this election. I also think it's a matter of desparation on their part...Yes Liz, you can tell how desperate they are now.

[RICHARD]

Randi,

Here's an example of why people who threaten each other with guns aren't really a threat at all.


-----------------

This guy was interviewed afterwards and asked why he did it.


He answered, "I am a Democrat and was looking for change.......a change of lanes!" Tragically, he believed a politician.:(

[blue]

Four years ago I heard all the same rhetoric. That the far right is desperate and the left is going to come out on top in the ellection, I think we all remember the end result of that race.

Just like four years ago we have a group that dosent mind, even welcomes, more government intrusions on Americans and American business, and we have another group that wants less government intrusion in their lives.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Four years ago I heard all the same rhetoric. That the far right is desperate and the left is going to come out on top in the ellection, I think we all remember the end result of that race.



Sadly, we all not only remember it...we are living it. A DISASTER!!!!!!

[lizbud]

Just like four years ago we have a group that dosent mind, even welcomes, more government intrusions on Americans and American business, and we have another group that wants less government intrusion in their lives.


I think there are tons of people who would have LOVED to have the Gov. Agency/Agencies, better enforceing laws that could have stopped the whole
Wall Street mess from happening.:o

"Goverment intrusions" are not neccesaryly bad things.

[blue]

I am going to respectfully disagree with you.


There is no question that if one were to ask whether we Americans are moving towards more liberty or more government control over our lives, the answer would unambiguously be the latter -- more government control over our lives. We might have reached a point where the trend is irreversible and that is a true tragedy for if liberty is lost in America, it will be lost for all times and all places.

Source. (http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/wew/articles/08/Destroying%20Liberty.htm)

[sparks19]

ES, do you hear the buzzing of gnats around here? I think I did.:D


Liz, I highly recommend the "Ignore" button. It keeps those pesky flies away! :D:D

You know... I really don't understand you two.

You antagonize people non stop and then you get all p!ssy and cry foul when they return the favor. :rolleyes: and then you talk about how "childish" or "small" they are for doing the SAME thing you are doing.

Hello pot? this is kettle calling to tell you you're black.

[RICHARD]

Hello pot? this is kettle calling to tell you you're black.

HEY-You cannot use that analogy in politics....:eek:

And the politically correct term for pissy is incontinent.:confused::o

[Edwina's Secretary]

You know... I really don't understand you two.

You antagonize people non stop and then you get all p!ssy and cry foul when they return the favor. :rolleyes: and then you talk about how "childish" or "small" they are for doing the SAME thing you are doing.

Hello pot? this is kettle calling to tell you you're black.

I'm so sorry Sparky! I'm not the least bit pissy! Haven't cried foul either. You flatter yourself!

How about a little eye roll for me?

[blue]

I got one for you. :rolleyes: Passive-aggressive much? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive-aggressive_behavior)

[caseysmom]

An Obama supporters response to having their sign stolen.

http://www.geocities.com/duffy7836/stolenobamasign.jpg

The response from a McCain supporter after having their sign stolen.

http://www.geocities.com/duffy7836/stolenmccainsign.jpg

LMAO kind of sums up the whole thing doesn't it. Brains or brawn...which will serve us better...hmmm that is sure a hard one!

[Puckstop31]

LMAO kind of sums up the whole thing doesn't it. Brains or brawn...which will serve us better...hmmm that is sure a hard one!


I don't care so much for smart, I want wise. The POTUS can hire really SMART, expert people to put around him/her. I want a wise person who will take that advice and make wise choice.

James Buchanan was perhaps the smartest President to ever take office. Yet led us to Civil War.

All the brains of Woodrow Wilson... Yet he was the first overtly fascist President in US history. (I believe the next is coming soon....)

I believe our nation is where it is right now, in great part, due to the fact that we all now value "knowledge" over wisdom. Now this is not to say that knowledge is a bad thing. But when not used wisely, knowledge can destroy.

Oppenheimer...
Vladimir Lenin...
Benito Mussolini...

Etc....

[blue]

LMAO kind of sums up the whole thing doesn't it. Brains or brawn...which will serve us better...hmmm that is sure a hard one!

One set of voters dosent value our rights and laws, and the other set of voters does value our rights and laws.

[caseysmom]

One set of voters thinks its okay to shoot someone for taking their sign and the other set of voters will replace the sign....yep your right blue keep reaching.

[caseysmom]

I don't care so much for smart, I want wise. The POTUS can hire really SMART, expert people to put around him/her. I want a wise person who will take that advice and make wise choice.

James Buchanan was perhaps the smartest President to ever take office. Yet led us to Civil War.

All the brains of Woodrow Wilson... Yet he was the first overtly fascist President in US history. (I believe the next is coming soon....)

I believe our nation is where it is right now, in great part, due to the fact that we all now value "knowledge" over wisdom. Now this is not to say that knowledge is a bad thing. But when not used wisely, knowledge can destroy.

Oppenheimer...
Vladimir Lenin...
Benito Mussolini...

Etc....


Smart is your word, I never said smart.

[blue]

One set of voters thinks its okay to shoot someone for taking their sign and the other set of voters will replace the sign....yep your right blue keep reaching.

Not reaching at all. You may think it is right or OK to steal from somebody, I do not. You may think it is acceptable to violate the rights of your neighbor, I do not.

I do agree shooting someone for stealing your sign is way over the top, but where do we draw the line? If I have a "Posted No Trespassing" sign on my property, you can expect to be shot by entering my property uninvited.

[caseysmom]

Don't put words in my mouth please.

[sparks19]

I'm so sorry Sparky! I'm not the least bit pissy! Haven't cried foul either. You flatter yourself!

How about a little eye roll for me?

OH... of COURSE not. not YOU. How silly of me. it's everyone ELSE who is the problem. my mistake.

Flatter myself? Hmmm... not really a "flattery" kind of gal. Flattery usually consists of statements that are not the whole truth... and I may be a lot of things... but a liar is not one of them :)

You wouldn't happen to be in Egypt would you?

I already gave the eyeroll... did you miss it because I put it there just for you. I know it's your favorite.

[blue]

Don't put words in my mouth please.

Just following the logical outcome of your argument.

[caseysmom]

In your mind perhaps.

[blue]

In your mind perhaps.

How do you see the logical outcome to your argument then? That its OK to steal because the victim will replace the item?

[caseysmom]

Someone stole a sign...not the correct thing to do but no need to shoot someone....not that difficult.

[blue]

Someone stole a sign...not the correct thing to do but no need to shoot someone....not that difficult.

So you do feel it is OK to steal from somebody who can afford to replace what was stolen. You feel it is OK to violate the rights of others. That is difficult to fathom.

[Marigold2]

Come on guys. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
I thought both signs were really, really funny.:D:D
Why is everyone taking themselves so serious? :confused::confused:
Don't we all just want a better world? :confused:
Don't we all just want to be happy?
Let's just vote and try to be civil. :)
PT has lost it's funny bone.
That is so freaking sad.:(:(

[caseysmom]

So you do feel it is OK to steal from somebody who can afford to replace what was stolen. You feel it is OK to violate the rights of others. That is difficult to fathom.

OMG nevermind I feel like I am debating with a brick wall!

[caseysmom]

Come on guys. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
I thought both signs were really, really funny.:D:D
Why is everyone taking themselves so serious? :confused::confused:
Don't we all just want a better world? :confused:
Don't we all just want to be happy?
Let's just vote and try to be civil. :)
PT has lost it's funny bone.
That is so freaking sad.:(:(




Did you think your one post would turn into this? Things have changed recently no doubt about that.

[sparks19]

Come on guys. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
I thought both signs were really, really funny.:D:D
Why is everyone taking themselves so serious? :confused::confused:
Don't we all just want a better world? :confused:
Don't we all just want to be happy?
Let's just vote and try to be civil. :)
PT has lost it's funny bone.
That is so freaking sad.



I think we can actually agree with each other here :)

BTW... why do they call it a funny bone. it is the farthest THING from funny when you whack it on the corner of a table :D I say it's a cruel joke

[Marigold2]

You are way too young to act so old, go out and have some fun for goodness sake
So you do feel it is OK to steal from somebody who can afford to replace what was stolen. You feel it is OK to violate the rights of others. That is difficult to fathom.

[beeniesmom]

You know... I really don't understand you two.

You antagonize people non stop and then you get all p!ssy and cry foul when they return the favor. :rolleyes: and then you talk about how "childish" or "small" they are for doing the SAME thing you are doing.

Hello pot? this is kettle calling to tell you you're black.

Wow, who made you Ms. Thing? :rolleyes: If there is someone here who is antagonizing, it's you sweet heart. You really should keep the biatchy comments to yourself. Noone really cares what you think. :o

[sparks19]

Wow, who made you Ms. Thing? :rolleyes: If there is someone here who is antagonizing, it's you sweet heart. You really should keep the biatchy comments to yourself. Noone really cares what you think. :o

Aww dang it... you don't care?

I guess I must continue my search for the meaning of life :(

[Puckstop31]

Smart is your word, I never said smart.

Oh come on... :)

THAT is how you choose to respond? What did you mean by "brains" then? (Or, how would 99% of readers translate 'brains', in this context.) Granted, not a really fair question now that certain context has been applied, but I would still like to know.

[blue]

OMG nevermind I feel like I am debating with a brick wall!

I rest my case. When it comes to our rights I am inflexible, when it comes to our rights you are flexible.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Just came in from a motorcycle ride. Saw two teenage girls pull up to a stop light...one jumped out and grabbed two political signs out and ran off with them.

Thankfully they were only proposition signs! Should I have called the police??

[caseysmom]

I rest my case. When it comes to our rights I am inflexible, when it comes to our rights you are flexible.

Actually I am pretty old and stiff most of the time:D You are taking the sign thing way to serious I just can't relate.

[Puckstop31]

Ms. Thing?

That's MRS. Thing.

I made an honest woman of her 3 years and 3 months ago. LOL

:p

[caseysmom]

Just came in from a motorcycle ride. Saw two teenage girls pull up to a stop light...one jumped out and grabbed two political signs out and ran off with them.

Thankfully they were only proposition signs! Should I have called the police??

Could you please pay attention! You should have shot them! Otherwise you are condoning the whole damn thing and letting our rights get stomped all over!

[sparks19]

That's MRS. Thing.

I made an honest woman of her 3 years and 3 months ago. LOL

:p

Shoosh... no one cares what you think

:)

[caseysmom]

Wow, who made you Ms. Thing? :rolleyes: If there is someone here who is antagonizing, it's you sweet heart. You really should keep the biatchy comments to yourself. Noone really cares what you think. :o

Sparks is cool...she just hangs with the wrong crowd :D

(I hope you know I am joking!)

[sparks19]

Actually I am pretty old and stiff most of the time:D .


BenGay is your friend :) I know I should buy some of their stock lol

as Garth Brooks says "I'm much too young to feel this d@mn old" :D

[Puckstop31]

Shoosh... no one cares what you think

:)


Hi, my name is Brian. Have we met? ;)

[caseysmom]

BenGay is your friend :) I know I should buy some of their stock lol

as Garth Brooks says "I'm much too young to feel this d@mn old" :D

I have to get in shape I feel like I walk like I am 80 or something.

[caseysmom]

Hi, my name is Brian. Have we met? ;)

Hey keep the little bedroom games private:D

[sparks19]

Sparks is cool...she just hangs with the wrong crowd :D

(I hope you know I am joking!)


Maybe it's because my daddy didn't have a gun to clean when Brian took me on our first date

http://www.criticallayouts.com/images/rsgallery/original/laughing-so-hard-ag1.gif


Hey... if I don't laugh at my jokes who will:)

[blue]

You are way too young to act so old, go out and have some fun for goodness sake

Im over 30, thats old enough. Ive had my property stolen, and suffered the loss.

I fish, I shot, I go offroading, and I go rafting. I do those things for fun. I dont go out to mess with my neighbors, I respect them.

[caseysmom]

Maybe it's because my daddy didn't have a gun to clean when he took me on our first date

http://www.criticallayouts.com/images/rsgallery/original/laughing-so-hard-ag1.gif


Hey... if I don't laugh at my jokes who will:)

The offer of target practice for Brian still stands.....

[Puckstop31]

Sparks is cool...she just hangs with the wrong crowd :D

(I hope you know I am joking!)

LOL

Totally. I am the first to admit I can go off the deep end from time to time. (:eek:, I know...)

But God blessed me with this amazing woman. The ying to my, eeerrr, yang. (cue cheesy pron music)

We balance each other perfectly. Of course, I am biased. LOL

[beeniesmom]

That's MRS. Thing.

I made an honest woman of her 3 years and 3 months ago. LOL

:p

I was originally going to write Mrs. Thing but Ms. sounded better! :p

BTW, Sorry Sparks, my comment was uncalled for.
I just hate seeing everyone here at each others throughts (spelling) for something that really was kinda funny.

[caseysmom]

Puck...Your so likeable when you talk about your wife and daughter...we may disagree politically but your allright in my book.

[blue]

Could you please pay attention! You should have shot them! Otherwise you are condoning the whole damn thing and letting our rights get stomped all over!

Yes she should have called the cops, its not her property. Way to take things out of context.

[Puckstop31]

Hey keep the little bedroom games private:D

Games? There are supposed to be GAMES?

I musta been in the can at that meeting.


TANNNN-YAAAAA!!!! You got some 'splainin to do!!!

(In the intrest of the children and my sagging reputation, I will now disengage from this line of discussion. LOL)

[blue]

Actually I am pretty old and stiff most of the time:D You are taking the sign thing way to serious I just can't relate.

So by becoming physicaly inflexible you have become mentaly flexible.

[beeniesmom]

Puck...Your so likeable when you talk about your wife and daughter...we may disagree politically but your allright in my book.

True!

[sparks19]

The offer of target practice for Brian still stands.....


Yeah... especially now that you see what happens without the target practice... you get a BRIAN for a son in law :eek: (I guess the deck was stacked against me as I also have a BRIAN for a father and for a step father... no joke lol)



LOL

Totally. I am the first to admit I can go off the deep end from time to time. (:eek:, I know...)

But God blessed me with this amazing woman. The ying to my, eeerrr, yang. (cue cheesy pron music)

We balance each other perfectly. Of course, I am biased. LOL

^^^ he only says that because he's stuck with me now that he got me pregnant LOL

[sparks19]

I was originally going to write Mrs. Thing but Ms. sounded better! :p

BTW, Sorry Sparks, my comment was uncalled for.
I just hate seeing everyone here at each others throughts (spelling) for something that really was kinda funny.

No hard feelings :) but thank you for apologizing.

I am sorry for letting my emotions get the better of me as well.

[sparks19]

Games? There are supposed to be GAMES?

I musta been in the can at that meeting.


TANNNN-YAAAAA!!!! You got some 'splainin to do!!!

(In the intrest of the children and my sagging reputation, I will now disengage from this line of discussion. LOL)

Oh GREAT...

NOW look what you have done Caseysmom... :rolleyes:

NOW he has expectations. lol

P.S.- Marigold... you wanted funny bone... have we delivered? :D I mean... we couldn't be MORE off topic but it's still funny lol (but my sense of humor is not to be trusted lol)

[caseysmom]

Yeah... especially now that you see what happens without the target practice... you get a BRIAN for a son in law :eek: (I guess the deck was stacked against me as I also have a BRIAN for a father and for a step father... no joke lol)




^^^ he only says that because he's stuck with me now that he got me pregnant LOL

I would be honored to have someone like Brian for a son in law...from your mouth to gods ear.

[RICHARD]

Everything is fun and games until it's your property.


And should someone get shot over a stupid sign we'd all have our respective Fruit of the Looms shoved so far up the clefts of our respective arses we would stop breathing.

Someone would post a thread and then we'd comment on the tragedy, the right to protect property, the families of both parties and how justice should deal with the situation.

And in all the conversations no one will think about the person that thought it was a good idea in the first place and started the whole mess.....

Can we start with don't eff with anyone's property, especially if it's something that makes people REALLY STUPID, like politics?

Carry on, but remember that you open yourself up to a whole world of shiat should you underestimate another's sense of humor..:rolleyes::eek:

[Puckstop31]

Puck...Your so likeable when you talk about your wife and daughter...we may disagree politically but your allright in my book.

:love:

Please keep this in mind when I am having one of my moments. LOL I NEVER mean to hurt, unless I tell you I mean to hurt.

One of the top 5 "things Brian needs to learn" is,

3 or 4 - Learn to communicate, non-verbally, BETTER.

(LH, I was a HORRIBLE PLDC and BNCOC student when it came to the non-tactical things. LOL)

[sparks19]

I would be honored to have someone like Brian for a son in law...from your mouth to gods ear.

Thank you :)

I know my mom loves him to bits. although that may be because he finally took me off her hands :eek: but she won't admit that's the reason haha.

No... he really spoils my parents when they come to visit... just like he spoils me.

[jennielynn1970]

Puck...Your so likeable when you talk about your wife and daughter...we may disagree politically but your allright in my book.


I agree. He was cracking me up with the I love Lucy spoof, lol.

You just ruined you reputation Brian. :p

[Puckstop31]

You just ruined you reputation Brian. :p

GOOD.

I ephed it all up, pretty much from the start.

Maybe life (well, internet 'life') DOES have a "restart" button afterall? LOL

[Edwina's Secretary]

Yes she should have called the cops, its not her property. Way to take things out of context.

Nothing taken out of context at all! Perhaps I should have leapt off the bike and shouted "Citizen's Arrest!" tackled her and help her down until the posse arrived.

Oh please.

When I lived in Chicago we were on a corner. During election season both parties would put signs on the easement (city property of course!) Most were polite enough to ring the bell and ask. I never said no to them. And sometimes the signs would disappear. Not ONCE did I think to call the cops. Or shoot anyone.

I just cannot believe anyone's mind is changed by the litter of pro-this and anti-that signs.

Now I do not like shows such as Candid Camera or Punk'd. I am not a fan of practical jokes. To each his own. But I just wonder if some of the folks who have expressed such deep concern for the sign swapping will be telling us sometime how funny those shows are (why don't those people ever get shot?)

[blue]

Nothing taken out of context at all! Perhaps I should have lept off the bike and shouted "Citizen's Arrest!" tackled her and help her down until the posse arrived.

With the exception of assaulting her, a citizens arrest would have been called for. You would rather look the other way it seems.


Oh please.

I agree.


When I lived in Chicago we were on a corner. During election season both parties would put signs on the easement (city property of course!) Most were polite enough to ring the bell and ask. I never said no to them. And sometimes the signs would disappear. Not ONCE did I think to call the cops. Or shoot anyone.

When you lived in Chicago you gave up your rights to protect yourself. My brother has lived there since the late 90's, and he feels the same as you seem to. Its better to be a victim then to take a stand and protect your rights.


I just cannot believe anyone's mind is changed by the litter of pro-this and anti-that signs.

And yet the signs actually do make a difference for those on the fence. Some people will go along with the majority without thinking for themselves, not everybody thinks for themselves the way you or I do.


Now I do not like shows such as Candid Camera or Punk'd. I am not a fan of practical jokes. To each his own. But I just wonder if some of the folks who have expressed such deep concern for the sign swapping will be telling us sometime how funny those shows are (why don't those people ever get shot?)

Because TV isnt reality.

[Edwina's Secretary]

When you lived in Chicago you gave up your rights to protect yourself. My brother has lived there since the late 90's, and he feels the same as you seem to. Its better to be a victim then to take a stand and protect your rights.


What?????? Talk about take out of context! Because I did not object to people expressing their First Amendment Rights I was a victim????? Of what? The Constitution?

Okee dokee.

[blue]

What?????? Talk about take out of context! Because I did not object to people expressing their First Amendment Rights I was a victim????? Of what? The Constitution?

Okee dokee.

When I visit my brother in Chicago, I have more 2nd amendment rights then he does or you did when you lived there.

You obviously do not value the 1rst amendment if you see the stealing of political signs as no big deal.

[Puckstop31]

What?????? Talk about take out of context! Because I did not object to people expressing their First Amendment Rights I was a victim????? Of what? The Constitution?

Okee dokee.

I thought you had to go to work?

But, anyway.... Expressing your first amendment rights, go for it. Just don't violate a person's property to do so.

Being the Libertarian I am, I believe your right to free speech ENDS at the borders of MY property. Just as my rights to free speech end at the borders of yours.

You have the right to make me leave your home, for any reason, just as I have the right to do likewise.

As PA law explains... I might feel threatened by a person violating my property, as my wife and my daugher live here. Take that as you will...

[Edwina's Secretary]

When I visit my brother in Chicago, I have more 2nd amendment rights then he does or you did when you lived there.



Oh, I get it! No, I did not belong to the militia in Chicago so I didn't need a gun. Does your brother belong to the militia?

[blue]

Oh, I get it! No, I did not belong to the militia in Chicago so I didn't need a gun. Does your brother belong to the militia?

Im begining to doubt you ever lived in Chicago if you arent familiar with the gun laws there.

[Puckstop31]

Oh, I get it! No, I did not belong to the militia in Chicago so I didn't need a gun. Does your brother belong to the militia?


Do you really want to go down the "militia" road? It leads us into discussion about the concept of militia, what it meant in the 18th century and what it means now.


Sara, you are a smart person. I am sure you have done your research. You should know what "the militia" meant to the founders. I feel that definition should not change. Do you?

[Edwina's Secretary]

Im begining to doubt you ever lived in Chicago if you arent familiar with the gun laws there.

Look, if you need your gun with you to feel complete...don't go to Chicago!

[NoahsMommy]

Someone stole a sign...not the correct thing to do but no need to shoot someone....not that difficult.

Do you REALLY think that the person who painted/wrote that sign was serious? That they'd go to prision for shooting someone over a sign?? It was making a statement.

I thought the comparison funny!!! GREAT pics and signs! Too FUNNY!!!! :D Just so I'm not picked apart for this comment too, I thought it funny....that's it. No, not funny because someone would get shot, no, not funny because someone stole an Obama sign. Any others I've left out? I forget how JUDGEMENTAL I am. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Puckstop31]

Look, if you need your gun with you to feel complete...don't go to Chicago!



If there ever was a person who did not understand the concept of personal liberty, it is YOU.

And don't worry... I will not ever go to Chicago again. WAY to much crime there for my taste. I will never trust a town that does not trust its people with their own Constitutional rights.

[blue]

Look, if you need your gun with you to feel complete...don't go to Chicago!

Ive been to Chicago a few times now. I dont need to carry to feel complete. I do know I can bring firearms there that residents cant legally own.

Im not sure why you feel the need to be condesending.

[blue]

Do you really want to go down the "militia" road? It leads us into discussion about the concept of militia, what it meant in the 18th century and what it means now.


Sara, you are a smart person. I am sure you have done your research. You should know what "the militia" meant to the founders. I feel that definition should not change. Do you?


If there ever was a person who did not understand the concept of personal liberty, it is YOU.

And don't worry... I will not ever go to Chicago again. WAY to much crime there for my taste. I will never trust a town that does not trust its people with their own Constitutional rights.

ES, since you have Puck on ignore, I wanted to make sure you saw this.

[NoahsMommy]

Everything is fun and games until it's your property.

This is a good point....if it were one of those decorative flags people fly on the front of their homes, what would the outcome be?

Although, I DO believe the intention wasn't cruel or to strip him of his rights...

[blue]

What would the intention be then?

[Edwina's Secretary]

Ive been to Chicago a few times now. I dont need to carry to feel complete. I do know I can bring firearms there that residents cant legally own.

Im not sure why you feel the need to be condesending.

Condescending! That's what Sparky would call the kettle black...or the pot or something! I am sure you would not like someone from Chicago telling you how you are a victim living in Wasilla because you have guns there, right?

I felt very safe living in a city where I did not have to worry about my neighbor "celebrating" New Year's Eve by shooting off his gun. And a stray bullet coming in my window. I did not worry about being robbed with the handgun stolen from the house down the block.

Trust I will not come to Wasilla and tell you that you are a victim. Perhaps you can extend the same courtesy to the citizens of Chicago? Without being condescending?

[Puckstop31]

This is a good point....if it were one of those decorative flags people fly on the front of their homes, what would the outcome be?

Although, I DO believe the intention wasn't cruel or to strip him of his rights...

Oh if people only played their cards straight up. How much violence could be avoided?

Who should get to define "intention?" I pray you say "the person who OWNS the place."

[sparks19]

Condescending! That's what Sparky would call the kettle black...or the pot or something! I am sure you would not like someone from Chicago telling you how you are a victim living in Wasilla because you have guns there, right?

I felt very safe living in a city where I did not have to worry about my neighbor "celebrating" New Year's Eve by shooting off his gun. And a stray bullet coming in my window. I did not worry about being robbed with the handgun stolen from the house down the block.

Trust I will not come to Wasilla and tell you that you are a victim. Perhaps you can extend the same courtesy to the citizens of Chicago? Without being condescending?[/ ?


Surely... in your infinite wisdom you can keep the common line "the pot calling the kettle black" straight without getting too confused or adding the usuall highschool girl's "or something" :)

I don't know... I lived in Canada where guns are a no no... and I certainly didn't believe I was beyond having to worry about stray bullets lol. Although it seems to usually happen in canada next to day care centers or strip clubs... yes quite the opposite ends of the spectrum but happened more often that one might like to admit :(

and you say that you don't force your views on wasilla and claim they are "victims" yet you seem to be quite the advocate on here about gun control laws and banning guns... is that not forcing your views on wasilla and other places that allow citizens to arm themselves?

I will await your "sparky... *add snarky remark about how right you are and how wrong everyone else without being condescending of COURSE* " here

:)

or should I add

:rolleyes:

[Puckstop31]

I felt very safe living in a city where I did not have to worry about my neighbor "celebrating" New Year's Eve by shooting off his gun. And a stray bullet coming in my window. I did not worry about being robbed with the handgun stolen from the house down the block.

LOL

What city might that be ES? Tell me and I shall google stats.

My point? All the gun control laws in the world won't do SQUAT to make you more safe.

ES, you are going to lose this one. Period. WAY, WAY to many facts arrayed against you. The "anti-gun" crowd is armed, but only with "feelings", not facts.

[blue]

Condescending! That's what Sparky would call the kettle black...or the pot or something! I am sure you would not like someone from Chicago telling you how you are a victim living in Wasilla because you have guns there, right?

Yes you are being condesending, i agree with Sparks. Someone from Chicago saying Im a victim is an oxymoron at the very least, sorry I dont follow your logic there.


I felt very safe living in a city where I did not have to worry about my neighbor "celebrating" New Year's Eve by shooting off his gun. And a stray bullet coming in my window. I did not worry about being robbed with the handgun stolen from the house down the block.

I felt safe in areas where AHs fire guns off on the 4th of July and New Years Eve. I have had guns fired at my appartment, with the rounds coming less then a foot from my head.


Trust I will not come to Wasilla and tell you that you are a victim. Perhaps you can extend the same courtesy to the citizens of Chicago? Without being condescending?

I can legally arm myself, citizens of Chicago cant. Im being realistic, not condesending.

[blue]

LOL

What city might that be ES? Tell me and I shall google stats.

My point? All the gun control laws in the world won't do SQUAT to make you more safe.

ES, you are going to lose this one. Period. WAY, WAY to many facts arrayed against you. The "anti-gun" crowd is armed, but only with "feelings", not facts.

Just to make sure ES sees this, I quote.

[Edwina's Secretary]

I felt safe in areas where AHs fire guns off on the 4th of July and New Years Eve. I have had guns fired at my appartment, with the rounds coming less then a foot from my head.


There you have it. You feel safe with bullets whizzing about your head.

You have finally left me speechless.

I hope you don't have any kids there do you? With all those bullets whizzing around? Maybe you should call the police?

[blue]

There you have it. You feel safe with bullets whizzing about your head.

You have finally left me speechless.

I should live in fear then?

[Puckstop31]

There you have it. You feel safe with bullets whizzing about your head.

You have finally left me speechless.

If only....

[blue]

There you have it. You feel safe with bullets whizzing about your head.

You have finally left me speechless.


If only....

Quoted for the ignoree.

[Puckstop31]

<sigh>

ES... Your complete unwilligness to resond to me, while you respond to others... Speaks volumes.

Its the new me. No more bullcrap. No more shallow personal stuff. Just facts.

[blue]

<sigh>

ES... Your complete unwilligness to resond to me, while you respond to others... Speaks volumes.

Its the new me. No more bullcrap. No more shallow personal stuff. Just facts.

Logic and facts>fear and the irational.

[blue]

I hope you don't have any kids there do you? With all those bullets whizzing around? Maybe you should call the police?

Nice edit, the passive aggressive is strong in you.

I live in the sticks now. I dont worry about gangs or teenagers with guns. If I did have kids they would know to respect firearms as the tools they are and not have the irrational fear of an inanimate object that you have.

[DJFyrewolf36]

I :love: this thread. :D

[jennielynn1970]

I felt very safe living in a city where I did not have to worry about my neighbor "celebrating" New Year's Eve by shooting off his gun. And a stray bullet coming in my window. I did not worry about being robbed with the handgun stolen from the house down the block.



Don't come to Allentown. We got all that and a bag a chips, lol.

The first thing my dad asked my neighbors when I moved here (and my last place in Bethlehem) was whether I needed a gun for protection. I think the really old people said no at both places. Honestly, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea, but I still have no interest in owning a gun. I'd probably get a security system before a gun.

[Puckstop31]

Don't come to Allentown. We got all that and a bag a chips, lol.

Chips? Would they be Gibbles? :love: I loves me some Gibbles, heart stoppers or not. LOL

That is a nice thing about PA. You are never more than 3 miles from a junk food factory. LOL

[lizbud]

Don't come to Allentown. We got all that and a bag a chips, lol.

The first thing my dad asked my neighbors when I moved here (and my last place in Bethlehem) was whether I needed a gun for protection. I think the really old people said no at both places. Honestly, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea, but I still have no interest in owning a gun. I'd probably get a security system before a gun.


How about a gun and a security system? :p There is noting wrong with owning a gun, IF the person has the good sense to use & store it properly.

p.s. I have a yard sign for a candidate in my yard too, but I wouldn't shoot someone for taking it.

[RICHARD]

Don't come to Allentown. We got all that and a bag a chips, lol.



You need a gun to open some bags of snacks.

I bought some Pop Tarts the other day and had to fight with the package to open it.

---------------

One thing I find amusing about the "whizzing bullets" and some such?

There is always the over dramatic representation of bullets and drive-bys.

"It's a war zone", "a battlefield", "bodies everywhere!" Those comments make me laugh and make me mad.

Most of the people who make those statements have never been to war, never seen what a bullet would looks like or have ever been around a shooting.


THey don't know and always s-t-r-e-t-c-h a word or saying to make the situation a little more intense than it really is.

Lost Angeles is a good example-the murder NUMBERS have gone down- You'd hear about someone getting snuffed at least once a week in the valley. Now it's not as often.


I do have a problem with the percentages tho.
When the murder totals for one year are 8, then drop to 4 the next year, the PD crows about reducing murder by 50%.

Just like the early season batting stats in baseball, they are a little skewed.
But, they really look good in front of the city council when it's time for the yearly budget.:cool:

[jennielynn1970]

Chips? Would they be Gibbles? :love: I loves me some Gibbles, heart stoppers or not. LOL

That is a nice thing about PA. You are never more than 3 miles from a junk food factory. LOL

Nope, don't eat Gibbles. Remember Golden Sun chips??? We used to get them at the dairy when I was little.

I'm not much of a chip person, but the ones I like are Utz Kettle chips (http://www.utzsnacks.com/c-10-chips.aspx), or this other brand that tastes like a Golden Sun did, called Middleswarth chips (http://www.pasnacks.com/middleswarthchips.htm). We can get them at some Redner's markets around here.

Ever have Puff'n Corn (http://www.utzsnacks.com/c-6-popcorn-and-puffn-corn.aspx)?? I love Puff'n Corn Carmel puffs. OMG.. can eat a bag of them easy! They're made by Utz too, but I never had them till about a month ago. OH, and Bachman's JAX cheese curls (http://www.bachmanco.com
/jax.html). YUMMMM!

I'm not big on junk food, but the junk that I like, I'm particular about, lol. :p

[jennielynn1970]

How about a gun and a security system? :p There is noting wrong with owning a gun, IF the person has the good sense to use & store it properly.



Other than maybe trying to shoot one when I was little (skeet shooting or whatever my dad and brother did), I have never used a gun. I wouldn't feel comfortable having one in my house since I don't know how to use it, and would only get one if I had taken a course or something in how to handle it properly.

[lizbud]

Other than maybe trying to shoot one when I was little (skeet shooting or whatever my dad and brother did), I have never used a gun. I wouldn't feel comfortable having one in my house since I don't know how to use it, and would only get one if I had taken a course or something in how to handle it properly.


They do give lessons at some gun shops & have their own practice ranges.
Nobody should have a gun if they don't feel completely confident they could
handle themselves & the weapon. Just saying.:)

[RICHARD]

I wouldn't feel comfortable having one in my house since I don't know how to use it, and would only get one if I had taken a course or something in how to handle it properly.

I suspect you have more than half a brain. If you do you can own a gun.

You just have to remember which end is the dangerous one and you too can own and use a firearm.

But wait, there's more!

If you choose to buy a firearm, some shops will throw in a firearms safety course. Purchase required!

And, if you call in the next 15 minutes you might be eligible to purchase a handsome hand tooled leather or nylon holster (styles may vary) and get a free box of bullets, too!

Call now! Operators are standing by!

[jennielynn1970]

Are the instructors handsome single men??

Or at least the operators that are standing by?? :p

[sparks19]

Nope, don't eat Gibbles. Remember Golden Sun chips??? We used to get them at the dairy when I was little.

I'm not much of a chip person, but the ones I like are Utz Kettle chips (http://www.utzsnacks.com/c-10-chips.aspx), or this other brand that tastes like a Golden Sun did, called Middleswarth chips (http://www.pasnacks.com/middleswarthchips.htm). We can get them at some Redner's markets around here.

Ever have Puff'n Corn (http://www.utzsnacks.com/c-6-popcorn-and-puffn-corn.aspx)?? I love Puff'n Corn Carmel puffs. OMG.. can eat a bag of them easy! They're made by Utz too, but I never had them till about a month ago. OH, and Bachman's JAX cheese curls (http://www.bachmanco.com
/jax.html). YUMMMM!

I'm not big on junk food, but the junk that I like, I'm particular about, lol. :p


OMG the UTZ chips are delicious

You like the puff n corn... Brian's aunt makes her own homemade caramel corn using the puff n corn.. OMG it's heavenly and I don't even like caramel corn lol

[Puckstop31]

Ever have Puff'n Corn (http://www.utzsnacks.com/c-6-popcorn-and-puffn-corn.aspx)?? I love Puff'n Corn Carmel puffs. OMG.. can eat a bag of them easy! They're made by Utz too, but I never had them till about a month ago. OH,

Read the stats on them.. LOVE them myself... Till I read the ingredients. LOL

[DJFyrewolf36]

You need a gun to open some bags of snacks.

I bought some Pop Tarts the other day and had to fight with the package to open it.

---------------

One thing I find amusing about the "whizzing bullets" and some such?

There is always the over dramatic representation of bullets and drive-bys.

"It's a war zone", "a battlefield", "bodies everywhere!" Those comments make me laugh and make me mad.

Most of the people who make those statements have never been to war, never seen what a bullet would looks like or have ever been around a shooting.


THey don't know and always s-t-r-e-t-c-h a word or saying to make the situation a little more intense than it really is.

Lost Angeles is a good example-the murder NUMBERS have gone down- You'd hear about someone getting snuffed at least once a week in the valley. Now it's not as often.


I do have a problem with the percentages tho.
When the murder totals for one year are 8, then drop to 4 the next year, the PD crows about reducing murder by 50%.

Just like the early season batting stats in baseball, they are a little skewed.
But, they really look good in front of the city council when it's time for the yearly budget.:cool:

The closest thing I ever got to a "warzone" was in my old place up in Reno. Some 13 yr old kid (everyone in the neighborhood knew him) got miffed at a drug deal gone south, left our apartment complex and came back with a gun. He hit the building itself with about 5 9mm rounds and hit a person in the leg. There was blood everywhere, it was pretty scary. What was scarier is the kid fired into an apartment (where his intended target was supposedly) that had a mother and her 3 todlers inside. In this spray of gunfire only one person was hit, but that guy ended up being ok after a couple days in the hospital and some physical therapy.
The law says you cant get a handgun in Nevada until you turn 21. Why/How did a 13 yr old gang member get a handgun? The person who got shot didn't have a gun. The family whos apartment got shot up didn't have a gun. My friend who took the victim to the hospital didn't have a gun. I don't think more guns are the answer here but it sure does show a huge problem.
Just sharing my personal experence. No bodies weren't everywhere but it sure was a scary experence for me, and Ive had live fire combat training! I can't immagine how scared those poor little kids were. :( Maybe if someone somewhere focused a bit more on personal responsibility instead of burocracy, this might not of happened. I think RESPONSIBLE people have every right in the world to own firearms, providing that they've been properly trained on how to use them and that they are mentally stable enough not to go killing people just because they get into an arguement.

Oh and Richard, be careful with Pop Tarts, they have guns now too ;)

[jennielynn1970]

Read the stats on them.. LOVE them myself... Till I read the ingredients. LOL

No!!!! That takes all the fun out of them!

In moderation they're not bad though.... just let me keep thinking that.

[Puckstop31]

<Self Edit> Double Post

[Puckstop31]

FWIW, to anybody in the Central PA area... If you are ever interested in learning to shoot, firearm safety or buying a gun, please feel free to PM me. I would happily teach you anything you wanted to know. Or, if you just want to "try it once", I can have guests at my club. You could try anything from a 9mm handgun, up to a high power deer rifle.

[RICHARD]

Are the instructors handsome single men??

Or at least the operators that are standing by?? :p

Better yet?

Learn to play a musical instrument....


Violinist's right to bear arms

A concert violinist has been given a gun permit so he can protect his £6million Stradivarius violin.

Matteo Fedeli, 36, travels all round Italy with his rare instrument and has been given police permission to protect it with a a 357 Smith and Wesson Magnum.

He said he also has a team of bodyguards wherever he goes with the instrument who plan his route meticulously and make sure he is not followed. And he also has an armed escort as he travels to his concerts.

"Thankfully I've never had to use my gun - but a 357 Magnum is certainly a useful deterrent," he said.

"I did once have a concert though where the crowd started to get a bit close to me and the violin and my bodyguards quickly made a human barrier around me.

"Anyone would tried to steal a rare instrument would be a bit silly though because they have satellite alarms built in and it's not as if they could just go and sell it at an auction without being noticed anyway."


OI!

[ILoveMyAbbyGirl]

Better yet?

Learn to play a musical instrument....


Violinist's right to bear arms

A concert violinist has been given a gun permit so he can protect his £6million Stradivarius violin.

Matteo Fedeli, 36, travels all round Italy with his rare instrument and has been given police permission to protect it with a a 357 Smith and Wesson Magnum.

He said he also has a team of bodyguards wherever he goes with the instrument who plan his route meticulously and make sure he is not followed. And he also has an armed escort as he travels to his concerts.

"Thankfully I've never had to use my gun - but a 357 Magnum is certainly a useful deterrent," he said.

"I did once have a concert though where the crowd started to get a bit close to me and the violin and my bodyguards quickly made a human barrier around me.

"Anyone would tried to steal a rare instrument would be a bit silly though because they have satellite alarms built in and it's not as if they could just go and sell it at an auction without being noticed anyway."


OI!


wowww....

[Kfamr]

Man, to think someone would have shot me over stealing the campaign signs I did a few years ago, making them into lost dog signs. :eek:

[lizbud]

Man, to think someone would have shot me over stealing the campaign signs I did a few years ago, making them into lost dog signs. :eek:


No way, Kay Ann. You had a much better use for them.:D

[sparks19]

All I know is....

I CANNOT WAIT UNTIL THIS ELECTION IS OVER.

I can't even enjoy the radio without hearing 3 or 4 political ads during every commercial break.

[shais_mom]

All I know is....

I CANNOT WAIT UNTIL THIS ELECTION IS OVER.

I can't even enjoy the radio without hearing 3 or 4 political ads during every commercial break.

YUP -
what she said!
I TOTALLY AGREE!