I'm almost at the end of my rope!!!! **Update**

[Catlady711]

I may have to rehome Cami!:eek:

I am running out of ideas. (major rant to follow)

Cami has been marking around the house. I rent, I cannot have cats peeing in my house or we'll all get kicked out and no one will rent to someone with cats if the previous landlord gives a bad pet reference.

This has been going on for a while now, pretty much since just before we lost Dusty (which will be a year ago tomorrow incidentally). Previously Cami, Jack, and Bear would pounce on and attack Dusty. Since Dusty has been gone; Jack, Bear, & Pooky now stalk and attack Cami and I'm constantly trying to protect her. I'm not sure if that is actually related to the urine marking but I wouldn't rule it out. I've done all the usual things including Feiliway. I've been following all the advice we give out to our own clients at work on this issue and still I'm hitting my head against a brick wall here.

When this first started I didn't know who was actually doing the spraying, although I had my suspicions it was either Cami or Bear because they spray the inside of the litterboxes.

I took in urine samples from all the cats, we gave antibiotics to the ones with signs of possible infections, and Cami was put on urinary PH food and Methioform tabs for her Ph balance.

I have found that Cami is definately spraying (although I'm at a loss to be 100% sure she's the only one).

I thought maybe I wasn't keeping the litterboxes clean enough so I've been cleaning the heck out of them. I thought maybe my housekeeping was slacking too much and made my house look like a potty to her so I've been cleaning the heck out of the house.

I have a $1,300 sectional sofa that smells horrible and I may have to trash it. Mostly musty smelling from all the odor eliminators I've sprayed on it to get rid of the cat urine smell, but unfortunately for me, I didn't realize the cleaning instructions on the sofa until I'd already bought it. It says DO NOT CLEAN WITH WATER. HUH?? So I'm not sure which is ruining it more, the cat pee or the cleaning products.

I've gotten so hyper sensitive to cat urine smells I swear my whole house smells like one giant litterbox even though honest and trusted people that come over tell me they don't smell it. I know these people would tell me if it did stink.

Today while I was putting on my work shoes to head out the door I see Cami sniffing around in the bathroom, I knew what she was up to and hollared but she ignored me and before I could get up she marked the bathroom wall. This afternoon mom came over. I went into the kitchen to get her a drink and as I round the corner coming back Cami jumped on the sectional (same wedge piece that stinks) and sniffed. I screamed bloody murder at her but she went ahead and marked the couch before I could grab her, all while someone is sitting on the other side of the same couch!!!!! :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::

I don't want to get rid of my cat, I don't want to get kicked out of my house, I don't want to have this cause me to lose all my cats, and I don't know anyone I trust to take Cami anyways (outside in my neighborhood is not a safe option) and I just can't take anymore.

I've been under a ridiculous amount of stress in the last year, particularly since Dec. Let's see...

Lost Dusty 1 year ago

Had to have $700 worth of dental work done

Got my ribs dislocated which hurt like the devil and cost $150

Jack has megacolon, and requires medicine, special diet. We did lab work and xrays on him (I forget the cost on all that), and took him to a specialist for a consultation, that part was $120. He lost alot of weight and is still not putting it back on and has me worried. Oh and inbetween all that he got a resp. infection with a 104 degree temp that required 14 days of antibiotics, shots etc for $112.

Got bit by a dog at work right before my vacation started, required 7 stitches and alot of needles (I HATE needles), the dr messed up taking stitches out and missed one. Had to wait for that to work out to get it pulled free, in the meantime my finger got infected. It's been about 2 months and it's still not completely healed right.

I won't even get into the full novel of complaints I have about the enormous amount of stress at work and with my hubby to top things all off. Don't take this shorter combined complaint lightly, both are causing me to lose my mind.

Because of all this stress I'm panic attacks, I have developed weird phobias, and Obsessive Compulsive behaviours. My dr several years back had already put me through all the major brands/types of antidepressants without any success and said he can do nothing further for me. He referred me to a specialist (read behavioural specialist) but my lousy insurance doesn't pay squat so I know there's no way I can afford that, I'm not going to bankrupt myself for sanity, and we make too much money to qualify for any type of assistance.

Anyways I don't really know why I'm posting any of this, but I'm about to explode or have a nervous breakdown or something.

[jazzcat]

I really wish I knew something to tell you but I don't. I'm dealing with what I'm afraid is multiple cats marking and peeing in the house and I don't know what to do. About 30 minutes ago I cleaned up a pee puddle in the dining room. Luckily it was on the plastic carpet runner I've had to place all around the room just for that problem. It hasn't gotten as bad as what you described but any inappropriate peeing is bad, PERIOD! I'm also dealing with several of the cats picking on Scout and making her life miserable (she may be one of my peeing cats - who knows).

I'm sure hearing me complain isn't helping you but I wanted you to know I understand and I offer my sympathy. (((HUGS)))

One thought, have you tried Clomicalm? I tried it for Rocky and it didn't seem to work but several people here have had luck with it. Or maybe kitty prozac might be worth a try as a last resort.

[aki]

awwwww! well first of all, you need to rest for a second. ;)

i think if cami is purposely (seems to be) doing this, and it's not to do with her health like a urine infection, it might just be attitude. and i know you love her, but you have to do what you have to do. and if that means re-homing her, so be it. what good would it be for you all to have to re-homed, yanno?

(((((((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))))

~Aki

[Catty1]

Hon - does your insurance cover ANY type of counselling? Venting here and also venting in person with someone will help.

Some houses of worship have lay counsellors, usually the clergy - sensible ones are there to walk the walk, and not talk you into joining.

Maybe there is a PT person who would take Cami. There have been transports done on PT before.

I really pray the answers come through for you just as you need them - and they will. It's unfortunate - but work stress seems to hit those who are the best and do the most, and go out of their way for their job.

I hope you can take a few days off and even go to a motel in another town for a couple of days. Doesn't have to be expensive - just a total change. Then you can come back with a clearer view of what's up and what you can do.

HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS:love::love::love::love:

[Anikaca77]

Oh dear...just try to breathe...a few deep breaths and just do that for a few minutes or so.

I know what you mean, you sound a lot like me with OCD and being on antidepressents.

As for the cat spraying, I'm not sure what to tell you, I've been through that just recently myself and found out I think it was using cheap cat litter because I've put several litter boxes around my house with the old stuff that I used to use and now Anika has finally stopped it (knock on wood).

If I had a bigger place and didn't rent either I would take her.

Melissa

[Medusa]

Boy, I can feel the frustration and nerves as I read your post. I've been there, several of us on PT have, so I know how you feel about the peeing and not wanting to rehome Cami. As a vet asst., you probably know about Clomicalm but, in the off chance that you may not, I'll mention it. It's given to dogs for behavior problems but my vet, who has since retired, started some of my cats on it because he'd read and heard good reports of it being safe for cats. Some vets say that it takes 6-12 weeks before it starts to work but I was fortunate; it started working immediately. Before Clomicalm, I was ready to rehome Specs. That cat peed whenever and wherever he felt like it. He was an outdoor cat that I rescued and I got so mad at him one time that I tossed him out the door and yelled "You lived outside before, by God, you can do it again!" Of course, he hung around the door and cried but I didn't relent for 3 days. I tried ametryptilene, which worked for a while, but then he started peeing again. I tried buspar w/no effect whatsoever. Clomicalm started working immediately; there have been no side effects whatsoever. I give 4 of my cats 5 mg. each before bed and there have been no incidents since then. You truly are nearly at the end of your rope and I would say that, before you decide to rehome Cami, give Clomicalm a whirl. Ask your vet and see what s/he says. It's been a godsend to me and this household and I don't worry about people walking in my house and wrinkling up their noses due to the acrid urine smell. I sure hope things work out for you. I know it's maddening. I know. I do know.

[Catty1]

The Clomicalm might work on the bullying behaviours of the other cats.

HUGS and huge prayers to you...

[Medusa]

[QUOTE=Catty1;2031230]The Clomicalm might work on the bullying behaviours of the other cats. QUOTE]

Exactly. And it's good for inappropriate spraying as well.

[jenluckenbach]

I hear you and I feel for you. :( NOT a happy situation to be in. (have been there and will be there again!) :rolleyes:

Suggestion 1.....Is there a room in your home that you can keep Cami by herself? Not having the stress of the other cats might be just what she needs. Also, "retraining" to the litter box always starts with confining to a small space.

#2.....have you tried Cat Attract litter?

#3.....Medicate Cami. There are several medicines to try for problem "pee-ers". It is the only thing that keeps me sane around here. I can't guarentee 100% success, but maybe pretty close. And maybe you'll have greater success.

[krazyaboutkatz]

I'm so sorry to hear this.:( I had some minor incidents last summer with Storm and Starr. I tried Clomicalm on Storm but it made him into a different cat and then he became immune to it so I had to wean him off of it. Using the feliway diffusers, cat attract litter, and adding more litter boxes has really helped me a lot.

Now Storm is on an herbal calming pill because he gets grumpy and snappy in his old age and Sunny is on a different herbal calming pill because he was attacking Storm, trying to become the alpha cat and cat calling at night. Things have greatly improved. I did take them to my holistic vet because I didn't want to guess at which pills would help them. I also used an herbal spray on Starr for a while but now he doesn't need it since things have calmed down.

I hope that something will work for Cami and the others that are attacking her. I had to rehome my cat Cirrus because he and Storm didn't get along and it was getting worse and worse and causing Storm to have health problems so I know how hard it is.:( Please try to relax and destress and take care of yourself. Good luck. ((((HUGS))))

[Freedom]

The frustration is quite evident in your post.

My Vita is spraying, she is stressed with all the comings and goings of animals here last year, and the arrival of Tommy & Tuppence in January did her in. I am using the Feliway on a strip of fabric I slip over her collar (so the scent is always with her) and that is working. I did that for a month and stopped, she was fine for 2 months and just started spraying again this week. So the fabric is back on her collar and getting sprayed daily.

I know someone asked if Cami could stay in one room be herself for a while to let her calm down. It does sound like stress on her part; having the other cats stalk her, and mommy hollering at her, is not good for any of you.

I wish I had a magic wand to make it all well for you. {{HUGS}}

[Moesha]

I've been under a ridiculous amount of stress in the last year, particularly since Dec. Let's see...


This has been going on for a while now, pretty much since just before we lost Dusty (which will be a year ago tomorrow incidentally

These were the two things that struck me. Do you think her actions could be a reaction to the stress that you are under?

[moosmom]

Sounds like he needs to be an only cat. I'm sorry you have to rehome him, but it IS in his best interest.

Good luck.

[Catlady711]

Thank you everyone for the support and suggestions.

I have been having a very stressful time lately and her doing that right in front of me twice was just too much.

I'm calmed down now. I cleaned up her marked spots (although couch still smells horribly musty) and scrubbed up all the sandboxes again. I think I'm gonna bring one more sandbox down in the dining room because that box seems to be everyone's favorite so it gets dirty very quickly compared to the others.

So far since my post I've not found any other pee, and Cami has been using the sandbox. I praise her to death after I see her use it. I think she thinks I'm crazy for that, but if it works so be it.

We're going away for the holiday weekend, and no one will be home to clean the boxes so we'll see what happens. With the added box in the dining room it might be good enough to hold her for the weekend. We free feed from many bowls through the house and have two water fountains so we don't have a pet sitter come by on long weekends. Although the cats usually over eat while we're gone because they're used to set meal times not freefeeding.

I'll see what happens Sunday when we come home and I'll post an update then.

Thanks again everyone, I'll keep this thread bookmarked for reference on the Calmacin stuff, we may have to give it a try.

[Catlady711]

Things are a bit better with the peeing outside the box, but not quite right yet.

That weekend I didn't find any pee outside the box YAY. But we're still finding pee where it shouldn't be, just not as often as before.

I bought some Cat Attract litter in addition to my normal litter. So far I've totally scrubbed down 2 cat boxes and completely replaced all the litter, one with the usual litter, and one with the Cat Attract.

I will say the Cat Attract must be good stuff because I had TWO and THREE cats at a time using it, and I mean at the SAME time. Dunno how they fit in there. It's seriously more expensive litter than my usual though. Don't see how I can afford to replace all 7 boxes with that stuff, especially since they seem to prefer the two in the dining room since I moved some there.

I'm planning on scrubbing down and changing litter on all the litterboxes in the house within the next week.

I tried leaving the hood off the boxes but I have at least two cats that like to spray inside the cat box, practically standing on their heads to squirt as high as possible. Well needless to say they can squirt over the edge of the high sided bottom of the box so I had to put the lid back on. I do have one litterbox upstairs that is unhooded but I have to keep a piece of plexiglass and a rag behind the box to catch the spray. They don't tend to spray over that one so often, but unfortunately they don't make a box like that one anymore.:(

I think we're making progress but it's still not right as I found cat pee on my stove this afternoon!:mad:

Anyways just wanted to update everyone.

[jenluckenbach]

Thanks for the update.

cat attract litter IS quite expensive, but I found some places offer it cheaper than others.

Also, there is a product to add to regular UNSCENTED litter. http://www.preciouscat.com/attract-litter-additivebronly-available-through-your-p-7.html

http://www.healthypets.com/catattract.html

http://www.amazon.com/Dr-Elseys-Precious-Cat-Litter/dp/B000IJ9MCU

[Husky_mom]

I have no clue here.. but just thought something to add....

have you tried litterboxes made for rabbits/ferrets.... they are built for corner and have a higher back side... that might work too....( to prevent spraying the wall while using the box)

[jennielynn1970]

This is such a familiar problem for me. I have been doing much the same with scrubbing, scrubbing, and scrubbing the boxes I have to get them as clean as possible and putting in all new litter.

I had tried the Dr. Elsley's Senior Cat Attract litter, but it was so darn dusty, I couldn't stand it.

What I'm using now is MIMI Crystals, which is a 4lb bag, and is about $4 from Walmart. I have those ginormous pans from PetSmart, and I put one bag in each box. I changed the entire contents of litter every 3-4 weeks. I've been finding as long as I keep the pans super clean, especially the one I have in the kitchen for Boris (my main pee-er outside the box), it's been much better. I thought I should have been buying stock in paper towels, as there had been pee on the stove and countertops at least 3-4 times a day. I was just so frustrated.

SO, new box in kitchen. It gets totally washed down every 2-3 days, and since it is a sifter box, I can change the bottoms and let the one air out really good as well.

Hope things will continue to improve on your front.

[krazyaboutkatz]

I'm glad to hear that things are starting to improve.:) When I tried the Cat Attract Litter, I just put some of it on top of the old litter that I was using. I also had to add 3 more litter boxes. Now I use Dr. Elsey's Precious Cat Litter For Muliple Cats and I only occasionally buy the Cat Attract Litter to put on top of it.

Most of my cats also prefer not to have covers on their litter boxes so now I only have 2 with covers. Sometimes they will spray over them but not as often as on the ones with the covers. I've been putting the puppy training pads under the litter boxes and also in the back of them so that if they do spray over it will catch most of the pee. So far this has been working well for me. Maybe you could also tape some puppy training pads to the wall in back of the litter boxes. Good luck.:)

[GILL]

We have been using storage bins their about 12 in. deep, no cover. Even with our big boys things stay in the box most of the time. The only problem we have is Little Bear and Bart. Bart has steam shovels for paws and I've seen litter go 3 feet in the air (big hand fulls). Little Bear likes too dig for China and makes sure that the litter does not fall back into the hole; she can shoot it almost 5 feet. Bart goes for altitude and LB goes for horizontal shots.
We only use 4 boxes for the 12. 3 are the bins and one is low (3 in) for LB and Lucky only. I did put plastic walls on 3 sides of LB's box, about 16 in high. This way with she with her bad leg and Lucky still a kitten they can get in and out, but the litter can only fly in one direction.
Any time we have tried covers we find more around the house than in the boxes.

[Catlady711]

Just thought I'd add an update for any interested.

It's a year later now. I did everything, more litterboxes, different litterboxes, different litterbox locations, new urine remover, different litter, and TONS of urinalysis tests on all 7 of the cats.

6 of the cats have problems with urinary crystals and occasional infections, the solution has been to put those cats on Hills C/D food, and do a urinalysis occasionally to check for infections, and treat with antibiotics those with infections.

The peeing slowed down but didn't stop. I mean I had pee on my fridge, my stove, my counters, my microwave, the walls, two sections of my sectional were trashed. :mad:

This all despite cleaning the litterboxes 5-6 times a day, and constantly putting cats in the box anytime they sniffed anything, and using generous amounts of Nature's Miracle. I was having panic attacks over it and had to take tranquilizers.

When I finally reached the point I could do nothing else I took my most suspected pee-er to work with me (Cami) and she had to live in a cage for 2 weeks.

Aside from finding some old pee spots we went those whole 2 weeks with no pee! That verified that she was my only active pee-er. And she used her box in her cage 100% of the time.

I brought Cami home after 2 weeks and put her in my spare room to see if having her noises and scent in the house would cause any peeing, or if her smelling/hearing the other cats would cause peeing.

So far it's been about 6 weeks and no pee outside the litterbox (despite Sassy having a UTI that we had to treat).

I hate having Cami shut up in a separate room, she's so lonely not being out in the main house where the activity is, but apparently she just plain doesn't get along with the male cats, particularly Bear.

I tried letting her out once and following her around constantly. It lasted about 20 minutes. The whole time she went from one spot to another that had been peed on in the past to sniff. In one area I stopped her from spraying (or at least it looked like she was going to.) The entire time she was out, Bear followed (rather stalked) her and she did not purr or seem happy until I put her back in her room again, at which point she started purring and being lovey again. I spend several blocks of time with her every day petting and playing with her and I think she sort of enjoys having my complete attention.

Sometimes certain cats just plain don't get along no matter what you do.

Now the question is, does she have to live in the spare room until Bear passes away (8-10 years) or can she be re-integrated into the house?

At this point I'm not rushing anything for fear of the peeing starting up again.

[Catty1]

Hard to say...could Bear be put on a mild tranny so he doesn't stalk her?

I am sure you have done the blacklight/deodorize the pee spots. Just a suggestion: get Bear treated (even try a mild tranny for a couple of weeks), find all the pee spots you can and neutralize them, and THEN try letting Cami out and gradually reintegrate her.

I think dealing with Bear's attitude might help. Or - he should be the one in the room. Is Cami the only one he bothers?

I am sure others here will have ideas too!

[Catlady711]

Is Cami the only one he bothers?


No, unfortunately.

All the male cats stalk and pounce on her.:( Bear is just the worst and most persistant one. So apparently spay/neuter doesn't help any here.

Everything was tolerable when Dusty was still alive because everyone (including Cami) pounced on her instead. Trooper that Dusty was she took it without problems until the last week when I separated her to spend her last days in peace. That's when they started turning on Cami and that's the week the peeing started.

[Catty1]

Gosh...give ALL the boys chill pills!

My take...keep Cami in a room with MAYBE another kitty that she gets along with?

Or - get Nancy Efrusy to do a reading on the gang. She's a pet psychic who proved amazingly helpful with another cat here on PT. Boo, who is owned by Laura's Babies (she's away on the boat right now).

Also, our own Brody's Mum does readings - you can PM her. Her rates are very reasonable - and the money goes directly to help animals.

[moosmom]

I have used the storage bins, like Gill, for a few years now and it is the best system I've used in a long time. The litter I use is Feline Pine pellets and it works like a charm.

[jenluckenbach]

I am proud and impressed at all the hard work you have done to try to alleviate this problem. MANY people would have given up long ago.

Some cats simply get picked on by everyone. Can't say why. :confused: But one of my fellow rescuers has the some problem. And her girl stays in her own separate room...ALWAYS.

That may end up being the best solution.

I wish you continued good luck.

[Catlady711]

I am proud and impressed at all the hard work you have done to try to alleviate this problem. MANY people would have given up long ago.

Some cats simply get picked on by everyone. Can't say why. :confused: But one of my fellow rescuers has the some problem. And her girl stays in her own separate room...ALWAYS.

That may end up being the best solution.

I wish you continued good luck.


I can't just give up on any of my kitties without trying everything within reason first.

So far it's been like 9-10 weeks and still no pee outside the box by anyone. :):):D

My mom has a theory that Cami marks because she's the only cat (other than Dusty who was first, and at one time only kitty) that came into the house as an adult. The rest of the kitties were added to the house as kittens.

Cami is bummed being away from the main activity in the house but seems calm and non stressed in her room. I discovered that she's apparently 'daddy's kitty'. It was my hubby who first found Cami, and he's the one that named her. I didn't realize how much she prefered him until the other day.

I mentioned that Cami no longer would eat any tid bits of people food I took her (she's ALWAYS been a food begger), and how she talks alot when I'm in there (not like her). I had hubby come in with me for some kitty time and she was like a whole different cat! She ate some goodies from him without hesitation and was non talkative and she paid no attention to me, only to hubby!!:eek:

Hmmm, have a cat for 4 years and never realize she's a daddy's cat. :rolleyes:lol I should have known that too, considering she'd always get in his lap not mine, but then again several of the kitties spend alot of time in his lap because he sits still longer than I do. I guess I just never realized it was a personal preference not who sits still the longest. lol

[Catty1]

Glad to hear things are better....who knew that Cami just wanted Daddy all to herself! :D

[GILL]

and gets really ticked off, at me. This is a girl that does not like litter, any kind. She likes news paper. So we have our standard storage bin with litter for the crew a next to the one in the front room there's a litter box with news paper. Even with that if she has decided that I am not doing what I'm supposed too do, she goes out side the box, right next to it. She likes to lay on my chest with her head on my shoulder. I if I try to move her I will get growled at and the nails dig in, then it's out side the box. If I don't go to bed on time, it's out side the box. By the way she does not sleep with me, but wants my chair to sleep in. If I don't give her a scratch in passing , it's out side the box. Some times I don’t even know what I did, but she does, because it’s out side the box. It keeps things interesting around here. She wants nothing to do with my wife. When Lucy gives her a hug, maybe thats why it's out side the box

[Taz_Zoee]

I know how you feel about having to have her confined to one room by herself all the time. I am dealing with that with my "loaner" cat, G. But when I let him out him and Paizly get into it and he chases her under the bed or chair (he's too big to fit). I don't want him stressing out the resident of the house so he gets put back in his room. Paizly doesn't seem too stressed with the occasional encounters with him so we will continue as is.

I am glad that your house is becoming pee-free. It sounds like Cami is enjoying her one on one time and being alone for the most part. What ever works, right?