Battle of the Headcollars - Halti vs. Gentle Leader

[theterrierman]

Fender is a TERRIBLE walker. I feel so sorry when I walk him because he chokes himself something awful. I've tried the walking in the opposite direction when he pulls, and using a martingale, and neither have worked taht great. The turning around method has alleviated the pulling somewhat, but the constant back and forth hurts his neck, even when I'm gentle, and it still doesn't give me control when he decides to go try to flush the robin across the street. I'm ready to go for a headcollar, despite the fact that he'll now be labeled "vicious" everywhere I go. My question to PT is, do I go with a Gentle Leader, Halti, or another brand/type, and why? Fender, if you don't know, is a 5 month old Brittany puppy, he's a touch dominant, but not really alpha, and can be quite strong willed for a Britt. I swear to god he has a terrier brain in there. Anyway, any thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Andy

[Tollers-n-Dobes]

I don't like head collars at all and unless you have to, I'd really opt not to use one. I've heard of too many accidents happening with them to feel safe using any. That, and when I did use one on Tango for a while I always felt really uncomfortable with it (and she didn't really like it much either - just tolerated it), especially when she'd turn her head suddenly to look at something. Have you thought of trying a no-pull harness (http://www.premier.com/pages.cfm?id=74)? Those are supposed to work really well for pullers.

If you do choose to go for a head collar, which one is best really depends on your dog. You'd have to try both on him and see which fits better and such.

[theterrierman]

I don't like head collars at all and unless you have to, I'd really opt not to use one. I've heard of too many accidents happening with them to feel safe using any. Have you thought of trying a no-pull harness (http://www.premier.com/pages.cfm?id=74)? Those are supposed to work really well for pullers.

If you do choose to go for a head collar, which one is best really depends on your dog. You'd have to try both on him and see which fits better and such.

What type of accidents if you don't mind me asking. PM me if it's graphic. I was considering that exact harness, but I'd never seen one used, and I knew headcollars worked well. Do you know anyone who's had success with one?

[mike001]

I'm not a fan of either halti or gentle leader. I have witnessed some not so good things with them. My choice is a prong collar...they do less harm that both and less harm than a choker. They might look medieval but they definitely are not. Once the dog has it on it's like something clicks in and the dog will refuse to pull. But you need to be shown how to use it properly. With a halti or gentle leader the dog never seems to learn and some dogs develop bad sores on their faces from the rubbing.

[NicoleLJ]

Halti's, just like any training aid, can have it's good points and bad. It is not for every dog or owner. Sheena loves her halti and even works with it on. Very few have mistaken it as a muzzle because we live in ranching and farming country so most people recognize it for what it is. Luca on the other hand never really took to it.

The trick is to find a training aid, collar or harness that not only works for you but also for the dog. Good luck with what ever you decide to use.
Nicole

[cali]

I like the Haltie, Misty has one, and I used it as a training tool, NOT a bandaid solution, the only time I use it now is when the girl that walks my dogs takes Misty, she maywalk fine for me now, but she still gets exited and yanks when she sees a park, and a little 11 year old CANNOT handle that lol. when it comes to Halie or GL, I am Haltie all the way, I tried a GL once....Misty had it off it seconds, because it lacks cheek straps, and Misty knows how to pull to get the thing off her nose, so without the cheekstraps she mid as well be wearing a normal collar.

[mike001]

I like the Haltie, Misty has one, and I used it as a training tool, NOT a bandaid solution, the only time I use it now is when the girl that walks my dogs takes Misty, she maywalk fine for me now, but she still gets exited and yanks when she sees a park, and a little 11 year old CANNOT handle that lol. when it comes to Halie or GL, I am Haltie all the way, I tried a GL once....Misty had it off it seconds, because it lacks cheek straps, and Misty knows how to pull to get the thing off her nose, so without the cheekstraps she mid as well be wearing a normal collar.



Cali you've just explained the dowside of haltis or Gentle leaders. The dogs just don't learn. You stated that you use it only for the 11 yr old girl to walk your dog because she still gets excited and pulls. if the dog was really trained that 11 yr old wouldn't have a problem with her pulling, hence the Halti is simply a restraint. Out here people using haltis use them for uncontrollable or aggressive dogs only. If a dog is properly trained, it walks obediently on a flat collar or at least on a choke chain. This is why I love the prongs, there is no yanking, pulling or misbehavior, and the dog can think and learn. In my opinion, the halti simply replaces the muzzle for safety reasons.

[NicoleLJ]

Cali you've just explained the dowside of haltis or Gentle leaders. The dogs just don't learn. You stated that you use it only for the 11 yr old girl to walk your dog because she still gets excited and pulls. if the dog was really trained that 11 yr old wouldn't have a problem with her pulling, hence the Halti is simply a restraint. Out here people using haltis use them for uncontrollable or aggressive dogs only. If a dog is properly trained, it walks obediently on a flat collar or at least on a choke chain. This is why I love the prongs, there is no yanking, pulling or misbehavior, and the dog can think and learn. In my opinion, the halti simply replaces the muzzle for safety reasons.


Mike this is false. Just because a dog and handler use a Gentle leader or halti does not in any way mean they are not trained. And it by no means is only for aggressive or uncontroled dogs. Sheena walks perfectly on a flat collar. The reason I use the halti is not for control. One it is part of her dress for when she is working. She knows that it is time to work not play or visit. Another reason is it gives me an idea, without looking at her of where her head is turned or looking. Because of my disability and my panic issues, esspecially around certian types of men(thanks to a past rape) she can alert me to someone coming up behind me in this way without me even having to turn or she having to change postition. There are many reason people continue to use them after the dog is trained. When I go out just for a walk around the block, to the park, flyball or agility or so on I have her on a regular collar. And guess what, she behaves perfectly then too on just the buckle.

Saying that it does not train the dogs or stereo typing people and their dogs who use them by saying they are aggresive and or uncontrolable it wrong, far fetch and totally in accurate. That would be like me saying all users or prong collars are inhumane, cruel and hate their dogs and the only reason they use a prong is because they can not control their dog with kind proper methods. Do I hate prongs. No it is a training aid just like a halti. Is saying bad things about teh aid and the people or dogs that use it correct? Nope. In some cases for both aids maybe but defiantely not the majority. Stereo typing anyone is wrong.
Nicole

[critter crazy]

I use a Halti on Duke. It is so far the only thing that works for him! He is an angel on the Halti lead, and even my 7yr old can walk him now. It took a little over a week of training, but it works fabulous. I could not imagine walking my dog without one now!
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c131/mjones77/Trips/100_9504.jpg

[mike001]

I use a Halti on Duke. It is so far the only thing that works for him! He is an angel on the Halti lead, and even my 7yr old can walk him now. It took a little over a week of training, but it works fabulous. I could not imagine walking my dog without one now!
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c131/mjones77/Trips/100_9504.jpg


Again it proves what I have just said about haltis. Critter crazy you stated that you could not imagine walking your dog without the halti and that your 7 yr old could now walk the dog. Why would you not be able to get the same result with a regular collar if the dog was in fact trained and not just restrained? That's exactly what I meant when I said the dogs don't really learn, they adapt because they have no choice. My shepherd can be walked on a flat collar by my 10 yr old grandaughter with no problem. I would not consider my dog trained if I had to strap a Halti on my dog. You posted a picture of your dog wearing the halti. Look closely at where the pressure points are...uncomfy?...you better believe it.

[NicoleLJ]

My daughter(8yrs) and my son (2 1/2yrs) can walk both my dogs on a halti or on a buckle collar. both with a nice loop in the leash to show a perfect heel with a loose leash. Usually Dedrick(son) ends up loosing intrest within a few minutes though and drops the leash. But do my two then stop heeling to him? Nope they will still follow at heel until I or hubby calls them to us or tells them to go play.

Isabeau(daughter) is actually know as our stand in trainer. When I am helping others train and am trying to explain to someone how it should look I will get Isabeau to do it with our dogs so while she is doing it I can explain in detail what the person needs to do. Isabeau loves training dogs.

So agian it proves nothing. Just because someone uses a certian training aid does not mean their dog is not controled or trained.
Nicole

[critter crazy]

Again it proves what I have just said about haltis. Critter crazy you stated that you could not imagine walking your dog without the halti and that your 7 yr old could now walk the dog. Why would you not be able to get the same result with a regular collar if the dog was in fact trained and not just restrained? That's exactly what I meant when I said the dogs don't really learn, they adapt because they have no choice. My shepherd can be walked on a flat collar by my 10 yr old grandaughter with no problem. I would not consider my dog trained if I had to strap a Halti on my dog. You posted a picture of your dog wearing the halti. Look closely at where the pressure points are...uncomfy?...you better believe it.
hey you believe what you want, and I will believe what I want!! If it was so painfull, why would my dog jump for joy when he sees me grab for the Halti??? He enjoys it! If he was miserable I wouldnt use it! I have worked with this dog the last 2yrs of his life, and this works plain and simple, If you dont like it then so be it! find something else to do, then to chastise me!

[BC_MoM]

I have to disagree with the no-pull harnesses. They do nothing but take the pressure off of the neck. And that's the only reason I liked it - because Molly wasn't hurting herself when she pulled.

The only way to get a dog to stop pulling to work on his leash skills. Although, even I am looking into getting a GL because I can't have her pulling me after my surgery.. otherwise, I say with GLs and haltis, you are just avoiding the issue and not DEALING with it.

[Seravieve]

Despite all the he said, she said... I would recommend a prong collar, as mike stated. Bunny and Zeke pull like mad with regular 'flat' collars on. Zeke has learned that pulling isnt acceptable and actually can walk rather well without a pronged collar. We've been using one with him for maybe a little over a year.. on and off.

Bunny was a MESS when we got her. She came with a dinky flat collar, so we bought a regular 'choke chain' collar and that didnt work. Tried the halti, and no-pull harness -- recommended for boxers... (Shes a mix.. so yea). Neither worked. She actually escaped from both of these! We even had the halti on as 'tight' as we could without defeating its purpose... We then tried the prong collar with her and she walks great. Correct her once or twice and she knows better than to keep it up. She'll walk right next to me.. turning when I do and so on.

I dont really think prong collars are as 'barbaric' as the stigma associated with them leads you to believe. I see a lot of people use them on 'bigger' or more 'aggressive' breeds.. I think they are actually better for their necks too.. they aren't just constantly sinched around their throat... just my .02.. and then some. =)

[critter crazy]

I'm not a fan of either halti or gentle leader. I have witnessed some not so good things with them. My choice is a prong collar...they do less harm that both and less harm than a choker. They might look medieval but they definitely are not. Once the dog has it on it's like something clicks in and the dog will refuse to pull. But you need to be shown how to use it properly. With a halti or gentle leader the dog never seems to learn and some dogs develop bad sores on their faces from the rubbing.

well when Prong collars nor Choke collars worked for my dog, I went with something that did. It causes no pain and he enjoys his walks. Just cause they work for your dogs, does not mean they work for all dogs. Each are different, this is why we have Options!

[Giselle]

Sorry, I'm a flat-buckle type of gal. I only use martingales on Giselle because a regular collar will slip off. If that were not the case with sighthounds, all my dogs would have flat-buckles.

I firmly believe that any and every dog can be taught loose-lead with a simple flat-buckle. The problem is that most people jump ahead of themselves. Before your dog learns to walk nicely outdoors, he has to do it well at home. It's like training Sit. Before your dog can do it in your front yard, he has to learn how to do it in your living room, in your bathroom, in your backyard, and, eventually, you add in distractions. The dog has to learn that there's only one way to walk. In order to teach that, you have to start from the very very very basics. Be consistent, be firm, and be patient. How about exercise Fender a bit before you go on walks so that he's not so amped up? Then, go through your loose-leash routine in your backyard. Work your way up to your front yard. Do some figure 8's down the street, and then go for your walk. Even if you don't make it past the neighbor's house, at least Fender will start to "click" with the idea. Good luck! It can be very hard at first, but the rewards are well worth it!

[Aspen and Misty]

Cali you've just explained the dowside of haltis or Gentle leaders. The dogs just don't learn.

I have to disagree and here is why:

Let me start off by saying that my biggest pet peeve is dog's that pull on a leash. It drives me NUTS and gets me infuriated within a minute of dealing with them. My dog Nova is that way and I used the Halti to help her learn how to walk good on a leash.

This is what we did:
For 2 weeks Nova and I walked with the Halti on. This allowed her to learn what I wanted. I taught her to walk by my side and she learned that if she walked nicely by my side she would have full motion of her head. If I had used just a regular leash there would have been a power struggle and I would have been extremely frustrated seconds into dealing with her. The halti made it so she didn't pull and she was learning all at the same time. Eventually when I felt she was ready I put the halti on for the first 2 minutes of the walk to allow her to calm down. Once she was calmed down I removed the Halti and walked her on her regular collar. It took a little bit, and a lot of patience from me, but she finally got it. She now walks like a pro and I no longer have to use the Halti. The halti can and was designed to be used as a training tool. If used properly it can work wonders. There were other solutions to Nova's problem but the halti made training bearable for the both of us.


Ashley

[crow_noir]

I prefer the Halti. Much softer material. A lot more comfortable for a sensitive dog.

When i was fitting them for Koli she was going spastic on on the Gentle Leader. I tried on a Halti and she did fine.

Also, a determined dog can easily slip out of a Gentle Leader.

Make sure you fit them right. If you pull up and the dog can struggle out of it, it's too loose. (Idiots at both stores didn't have a clue though they said it was fitted right. I had to have a professional trainer re-adjust it for me and show me how to properly use it. Even reading the inserted book didn't help for proper fitting... but it does have a LOT of great advice.)

[crow_noir]

Again, all dogs are different. If you use it properly you can still train using a Halti (or GL.) People put them on the dog and get lazy. The don't train... they just let the Halit control the dog. I think i used the Halti on Koli for two months. I taught her to not pull so darn much. How? I was committed to using the right timing with pull, praise, and commands. You can NOT forget to continue training every second you have that dog on leash. Just because you've hidden the symptoms, doesn't mean you found a cure. People tend to forget that the second their shoulder is no longer being yanked out of socket.

I'm sure there are some dogs that would just NEVER learn to quit pulling, but i think it's an abomination to say you can't train a dog when using the Halti or GL.


Cali you've just explained the dowside of haltis or Gentle leaders. The dogs just don't learn. You stated that you use it only for the 11 yr old girl to walk your dog because she still gets excited and pulls. if the dog was really trained that 11 yr old wouldn't have a problem with her pulling, hence the Halti is simply a restraint. Out here people using haltis use them for uncontrollable or aggressive dogs only. If a dog is properly trained, it walks obediently on a flat collar or at least on a choke chain. This is why I love the prongs, there is no yanking, pulling or misbehavior, and the dog can think and learn. In my opinion, the halti simply replaces the muzzle for safety reasons.

[cloverfdx]

Neither, i would rather take the time to train a dog than to put a 'band aid' over the problem.

[xVelvet_FuzzButtx]

I firmly believe that any and every dog can be taught loose-lead with a simple flat-buckle. The problem is that most people jump ahead of themselves. Before your dog learns to walk nicely outdoors, he has to do it well at home. It's like training Sit. Before your dog can do it in your front yard, he has to learn how to do it in your living room, in your bathroom, in your backyard, and, eventually, you add in distractions. The dog has to learn that there's only one way to walk. In order to teach that, you have to start from the very very very basics. Be consistent, be firm, and be patient. How about exercise Fender a bit before you go on walks so that he's not so amped up? Then, go through your loose-leash routine in your backyard. Work your way up to your front yard. Do some figure 8's down the street, and then go for your walk. Even if you don't make it past the neighbor's house, at least Fender will start to "click" with the idea. Good luck! It can be very hard at first, but the rewards are well worth it!
this is EXACTLY what I wanted to say!

We do choose to use harnesses for walks, but our dogs are trained to heel. We first were told by a trainer to get the gentle leader for the malamute, but went onto training. we can speed up(say jog or run) and say "hurry hurry" and when we slow down we use "easy easy" and you have your pup heeling good. we had to practice in petsmart, at our home and on busy street. we actually need to brush up on their skills as we've been slacking on walks. :o

[Pawsitive Thinking]

I use Gentle Leaders with both my boys and am very impressed with them. Archie no longer pulls like a train and I can stop Tobey jumping up on unsuspecting passers by

[mike001]

Sorry, I'm a flat-buckle type of gal. I only use martingales on Giselle because a regular collar will slip off. If that were not the case with sighthounds, all my dogs would have flat-buckles.

I firmly believe that any and every dog can be taught loose-lead with a simple flat-buckle. The problem is that most people jump ahead of themselves. Before your dog learns to walk nicely outdoors, he has to do it well at home. It's like training Sit. Before your dog can do it in your front yard, he has to learn how to do it in your living room, in your bathroom, in your backyard, and, eventually, you add in distractions. The dog has to learn that there's only one way to walk. In order to teach that, you have to start from the very very very basics. Be consistent, be firm, and be patient. How about exercise Fender a bit before you go on walks so that he's not so amped up? Then, go through your loose-leash routine in your backyard. Work your way up to your front yard. Do some figure 8's down the street, and then go for your walk. Even if you don't make it past the neighbor's house, at least Fender will start to "click" with the idea. Good luck! It can be very hard at first, but the rewards are well worth it!



Congratulations Giselle. You seem to know all about dog training. You're right on target about the flat collar, and the reason people have trouble is lack of homework. It was well worded and not defensive which proves your dedication and experience. The reason I prefer the prong for most people is that I have witnessed dogs getting hurt with Gentle leaders, Haltis and especially choke collars. People don't get the message of the "pop". The prong is also my favourite because many people have no strength in their arm, like elderly people or the disabled. Prongs are easy to use, cause no damage and even 75 yr olds can control a rambunctious dog, much to their delight. Thank you for a well worded and honest message.

[cyber-sibes]

Terrierman, I voted. Feel free to PM me if you would like to know my experience. ;)

[Suki Wingy]

Prongs are easy to use, cause no damage and even 75 yr olds can control a rambunctious dog, much to their delight.
Not mine. He knows no pain when we go out even in a propperly fitted prong. I've taken to walking him in a sporn harness and stopping everytime he pulls so he learns pulling= NOT moving. The fact that it physically restrained him instead of causing discomfort is why he is beginging to get the point. I use it because while I still work on healing in the yard, I believe he needs socialization even at 7 years, and as soon as we get onto the sidewalk he forgets all we did in the driveway. I'm trying to transfer over to something more convenient. In our 4-H obedience class he wears a slip or choke which is required (up right behind the ears or he barely feels it. We start out the lesson with a lot of pops, then he eventually gets tired and submits, going around the ring with his ears back, and head and tail down, but healing.

[theterrierman]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. I know a few have stated that the headcollar is more of a band-aid, but the thing is, my mom (who walks Fender when I'm at school) doesn't seem to want to try with him (a little cruel, I know, but it's true), so therefore, all the good work I do every evening is undone every morning. Even if I have something that we just use when my parents walk him until I have him good and trained on a flat collar, will be perfect. I probably should have clarified.

Andy

P.S. Mike, no need to press the prong collar issue. I appreciate your input, but my parents would never use something like that. I know it's nowhere near as painful as it looks, but I can't see my mom putting that around a little Brittany's neck.

[mike001]

he he, yes I can understand your mom's feelings about the prong. To inexperienced people they do look barbaric. But hey, whatever you can use and make it work is all you need.

[Giselle]

Terrierman, can you ask your parents to play fetch or something with your pup? How about frisbee or scent retrieving or some other type of fun game? That way, they can exercise Fender without utilizing a leash. Fender will get his fair share of exercise, and all your training will not be lost. Then, when you get home, you can tune up on his leash manners. It provides a good distraction from the monotony of leash walks, and it doesn't require much effort on the handler's part either. I have a feeling your parents would like that ;)

[cali]

I firmly believe that any and every dog can be taught loose-lead with a simple flat-buckle. The problem is that most people jump ahead of themselves. Before your dog learns to walk nicely outdoors, he has to do it well at home. It's like training Sit. Before your dog can do it in your front yard, he has to learn how to do it in your living room, in your bathroom, in your backyard, and, eventually, you add in distractions. The dog has to learn that there's only one way to walk. In order to teach that, you have to start from the very very very basics. Be consistent, be firm, and be patient. How about exercise Fender a bit before you go on walks so that he's not so amped up? Then, go through your loose-leash routine in your backyard. Work your way up to your front yard. Do some figure 8's down the street, and then go for your walk. Even if you don't make it past the neighbor's house, at least Fender will start to "click" with the idea. Good luck! It can be very hard at first, but the rewards are well worth it!

I dont agree at all, I tried consistantly for many many YEARS to to train her this way, I now have a dog that walks fantastic anywhere on our block lol I cannot walk a border collie around the block a few times and expect her to be tired. she will be 5 years old this year, thats 5 YEARS it took to get her to walk nice on my block only. it got to the point that I simply could not exersize her she yanked so hard, pressure and pinch type collars were usless, she simpley didnt care. I tryed the Halti, it worked, at first I used it all the time, then I would start to fade it(putting it on, but hooking the leash to flat collar etc.. until I didnt have to use it at all. does she still pull? yup. but now she listens, and a voice reminder alone will stop her pulling.

yes I put the haltie on for a scrawny 11 year old girl to walk her, when she gets exited she still pulls, I can stop her with a voice command, but I have no reason to belive she will listen 100% to a stranger, and I am NOT willing to test it.

[Jakesmom]

My 2 cents, from a sap who couldn't train a golden retriever or a cocker spaniel to "walk nice" on a leash. They are however, lovely, loving and extremely friendly dogs...

My golden is now 10 1/2 year old and too arthritic and weak in the back legs to be a problem (most of the time).

My ECS, however, is 2 1/2 and quite "energetic". I taught her to walk on lead with "clicker training", and she loves the walk, but she is a devil of a puller, especially when we get close to water or home. I tried clicker, I tried the turn and stop, I tried no forward movement, etc, but she is DETERMINED. Finally, I had herniated a disk in my neck (not because of the pulling) and had to do something. I got a gentle leader. IT IS GREAT. She can't pull too hard, and she listens better when it is on. She's not thrilled with it (rolls and such in the grass when its on), but she doesnt' fight at all when I put it on her, and it hasn't dampened her enthusiasm for walks in the least--she comes running when I pull out the leashes. No one has acted like she was wearing a muzzle (but, she is a cocker).

So, if you have the time and know-how to train your dogs to walk nice on a leash, go for it, but if you need a fix for an otherwise great dog who pulls,
I've been very happy with the gentle leader. Just read the instructions (or watch the video) to fit the thing right.

jakes mom

[SemaviLady]

What type of accidents if you don't mind me asking. PM me if it's graphic. I was considering that exact harness, but I'd never seen one used, and I knew headcollars worked well. Do you know anyone who's had success with one?
I have a website upon which there is one page that is dedicated to the prong collar. One reader that visited was Bonnie Dalzell (Borzoi) who has done postmortems on dogs and has viewed the results of collar injuries. I'll quote part of what she says here -

As an anatomist and a serious breeder I obtained thorough postmortem reports on many of my Borzois after they passed on and I was surprised to find that a number of them had healed fractures of the lateral bones of the larynx. This sort of injury narrows the opening into the trachea and, in extreme cases, could also produce respiratory insufficiency at heavy exercise.

A lateral radiograph read by some one who knows what they are looking at can reveal these injuries in a living dog.

Haltis and Easy Leaders have the potential to severely injure a dog's neck in the case of an out of control dog who bucks on the Halti. Dogs do not have the massive neck ligamentation of horses and, while their necks are stronger than ours, they still can be injured, especially if suddenly pulled up and back. Haltis do have their place in control of a powerful dog, I regularly use one on one of my best lure coursing Borzoi who has injured his trachea from his enthusiastic attempts to get at the lure while we are waiting for him to have his turn to run. However one needs to be careful that the dog does not get up speed and run to the end of a long leash while in a Halti, because the leverage on the neck that can be exerted by a high speed Halti stop could be very damaging. I would not use one on a dog working on the high obstacles of an agility course because if the dog fell from the A-frame or the elevated walk and was jerked by the Halti it could be severely injured.

In addition I have observed that since Haltis do not deliver much correction, they are good for control but not training.

I have found that a useful tool for leash breaking long necked sighthound pups without neck injury is. . . read the rest here (http://www.cobankopegi.com/prong.html#AStudy)

[Pawsitive Thinking]

Have just "googled" prong collars because I have never seen one and :eek:

While I respect everyone's choices on this thread I can't see myself ever using one on Tobey or Archie. Having said that, I am going to put a bit more effort into getting the boys to walk "nicely" instead of just ambling along behind them :D

[mike001]

Like I said...while they might look barbaric they are much less damaging than chokers and even Gentle leaders or Haltis...IF they are used properly.
But you're absolutely right, hard work is the better choice of any collar.

[PonyPup]

I like the Haltie, Misty has one, and I used it as a training tool, NOT a bandaid solution, the only time I use it now is when the girl that walks my dogs takes Misty, she maywalk fine for me now, but she still gets exited and yanks when she sees a park, and a little 11 year old CANNOT handle that lol. when it comes to Halie or GL, I am Haltie all the way, I tried a GL once....Misty had it off it seconds, because it lacks cheek straps, and Misty knows how to pull to get the thing off her nose, so without the cheekstraps she mid as well be wearing a normal collar.

Actually, the reason Misty had it off seconds was because you didn't fit the Gentle Leader properly. Headcollars don't really NEED cheek straps. :rolleyes:
As for me, I like the Gentle Leader better, because it applies pressure to accupressure points, which calms the dogs down. Maybe Halti does that, too, but I still like GL better. GL is also adjustable, so you can have a custom fit. ;)

[lauble]

Hi all,
Have to say I'm a fan of the Halti (have a dog that is headstrong when walking). I would like to add that my dog IS trained - but he is unpredictable when he sees something that looks like it needs to be chased. It bothers me a little to read someone berating someone else regarding their collar/halter choice - as far as I am concerned, if it helps you spend time with your dog in a way that is safe FOR BOTH OF YOU, what is the problem? As for the dog "not being trained" because a halter is used - if your dog IS trained, why are you using a pronged collar (isn't that the same solution in a differnt package)???

[king2005]

Some dogs will never be leash trained because of their personality. Digi is a great walker (heels), but if given the chance she will chase or run around like a crazy dog on speed. Digi always walks with a loose leash & she wears a halti. I use the Halti for those OMG WHATS THAT I WANNA SEE IT OMG OMG OMG, I see & hear nothing else.

It's just the type of dog she is. She will not obey when shes in that mindset & she can not be trusted either. She also doesn't pull on a collar, but due to her being a bag of bones, I can't keep her collar on tight as it'll choak the life out of her (no meat/fat to protect her throat).. it has to be a large dog collar & on loose. So when I walk her with it, the collar falls off & then she runs around like a dog on speed. Shes never managed to get the halti off, not even when she's scared & tries to back up hard. Its on her tight & it's fitted properly.

When it's time to go outside, she jumps trying to get her nose through the halti & is nothing but pure excitement.

I see the halti as a training device where the dog is less likely to get away & run over while being trained. Same with the Prong Collar. However the Prong Collar is too dangerous to use on Digi & she doesn't need it as shes not a puller.

Oh & sure some people think the halti is a muzzle, but I correct them. However most people don't even notice it (its red, hard not too) until they are already petting & getting kisses from her & then they ask, does she even need a muzzle? is she dog aggressive? .. nope & nope.. Just an alternative device to walk her with.. she likes it, doesn't hurt her & I'm always in control, so its great. She attracts crowds of people when we're downtown Toronto. I don't mean 1-2 people, I mean 10+ people.. it's nuts, I never gt anywhere I need to go :p :D So you can't tell me it's making her scary.. I'm fairly anti social so all those people are mostly unwanted within my bubble. But Digi does LOVE it & they love her, so why not..

[IRescue452]

I prefer to use a regular dog harness and loop a flat leash around the stomach. I've yet to meet a dog who has had to have the leash tighten around the stomach more than once before they walk nicely. It may seem mean because they normally overreact when they first get the sensation of tightening around the midsection, but I believe it is less harmful than the neck or head. It also allows them the freedom to sniff around a bit since their head isn't involved.

I do not consider controlled walks at heel to be enriching exercise, be it a walk around the block or 5 miles at heel. That kind of walk does nothing for the dog's brain and can hardly be expected as a release for their pent-up boredom. If you have a dog you simply can't walk on a loose lead then you need to find a way to get that dog some off-leash exercise in a safe area.