Andy Rooney Totally Said It!!

[cocker_luva]

(i got this in an email and totally agree!!)

Andy Rooney said on "60 Minutes" a few weeks back:

I don't think being a minority makes you a victim of anything except numbers. The only things I can think of that are truly discriminatory are things like the United Negro College Fund, Jet Magazine, Black Entertainment Television, and Miss Black America. Try to have things like the United Caucasian College Fund, Cloud Magazine, White Entertainment Television, or Miss White America; and see what happens...Jesse Jackson will be knocking down your door.

Guns do not make you a killer. I think killing makes you a killer. You can kill someone with a baseball bat or a car, but no one is trying to ban you from driving to the ball game.

I believe they are called the Boy Scouts for a reason, which is why there are no girls allowed. Girls belong in the Girl Scouts! ARE YOU LISTENING MARTHA BURKE?

I think that if you feel homosexuality is wrong, it is not a phobia, it is an opinion.

I have the right "NOT" to be tolerant of others because they are different, weird, or tick me off.

When 70% of the people who get arrested are black, in cities where 70% of the population is black, that is not racial profiling; it is the Law of Probability.

I believe that if you are selling me a milkshake, a pack of cigarettes, a newspaper or a hotel room, you must do it in English! As a matter of fact, if you want to be an American citizen, you should have to speak English!

My father and grandfather didn't die in vain so you can leave the countries you were born in to come over and disrespect ours.

I think the police should have every right to shoot your sorry ass if you threaten them after they tell you to stop. If you can't understand the word "freeze" or "stop" in English, see the above lines.

I don't think just because you were not born in this country, you are qualified for any special loan programs, government sponsored bank loans or tax breaks, etc., so you can open a hotel, coffee shop, trinket store, or any other business.

We did not go to the aid of certain foreign countries and risk our lives in wars to defend their freedoms, so that decades later they could come over here a nd tell us our constitution is a living document; and open to their interpretations.

I don't hate the rich I don't pity the poor.

I know pro wrestling is fake, but so are movies and television. That doesn't stop you from watching them.

I think Bill Gates has every right to keep every penny he made and continue to make more. If it ticks you off, go and invent the next operating system that's better, and put your name on the building.

It doesn't take a whole village to raise a child right, but it does take a parent to stand up to the kid; and smack their little behinds when necessary, and say "NO!"

I think tattoos and piercing are fine if you want them, but please don't pretend they are a political statement. And, please, stay home until that new lip ring heals. I don't want to look at your ugly infected mouth as you serve me French fries!

I am sick of "Political Correctness." I know a lot of black people, and not a single one of them w as born in Africa; so how can they be "African-Americans"? Besides, Africa is a continent. I don't go around saying I am a European-American because my great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather was from Europe. I am proud to be from America and nowhere else

And if you don't like my point of view, tough...

I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG, OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC, FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL!

I was asked to send this on if I agree or delete if I don't. It is said that 86% of Americans believe in God. Therefore I have a very hard time understanding why there is such a problem in having "In God We Trust" on our money and having "God" in the Pledge of Allegiance. Why don't we just tell the 14% to Shut Up and BE QUIET!!!

[Edwina's Secretary]

Are you SURE Andy Rooney said that on 60 Minutes a few weeks ago?

[Lady's Human]

He never said it, and he was a little upset when he found out it was going around.

(snopes)

That having been said, there are PIECES of it I agree with, but CBS would have thrown him off the air had he stated that on their show.

[Edwina's Secretary]

I have the right "NOT" to be tolerant of others because they are different, weird, or tick me off.



Right you are LH.....

today....INTOLERANCE rules!!!!

:D :rolleyes: :D

[Lady's Human]

Jeeze, 2 threads in the same week that we agree with each other?


What's this world coming to? :eek:

[Lady's Human]

Guns do not make you a killer. I think killing makes you a killer. You can kill someone with a baseball bat or a car, but no one is trying to ban you from driving to the ball game.


I DO love that part, though.

[Marigold2]

Actually he did say some of those things, I saw it on TV I am almost 100% sure. Do I agree with them? Yup every single one.

[lady_zana]

He never said it, and he was a little upset when he found out it was going around.

(snopes)

That having been said, there are PIECES of it I agree with, but CBS would have thrown him off the air had he stated that on their show.

I agree; there are PIECES of it that I agree with and pieces of it that I wholeheartedly DON'T.

[mugsy]

I had one of my "problem" children make a very profound statement today...

He asked me why we refer to African Americans as such when very few of them had been born in Africa. He said, "I wasn't born in Africa and don't know anything about it. I don't want to be called African American, although I'm not black either!" He made me giggle with the last one. What he wondered was why he couldn't just be referred to (pardon the grammatical error) as an American. I was shocked because this kid does absolutely NOTHING in class, but, once in a while he comes up with a jewel, but, this one beat all of them.

[dukedogsmom]

I love it! Things like this need to be said more often.

[Pembroke_Corgi]

Wow, I disagree with every item on this list!

And I doubt that anyone who wanted to stay on the air would actually say all this on TV.

[sparks19]

I remember watching CNN one day and there was a black guy (not african american. hey if I can be referred to as white they can be referred to as black) talking about how PC the US has become and how ridiculous it is. he basically said that you can't disagree with anyone's actions if they are a different race, creed, or religion. If you disagree with something they do you are a racist. He then went on to say that he can disagree with someone's actions no matter what color they are and NOT be racist. it has nothing to do with race. it has to do with disagreeing with their position.... I am allowed to do that am I not? or is that not part of the free speech thing anymore? You are only allowed free speech if it doesn't offend anyone?

he went on to say "I disagree with the muslim extremists actions.... that doesn't mean I hate muslims. I just dislike that particular group of muslims actions. that doesn't make me racist... or intolerant.... and it shouldn't offend anyone. This is what political correctness has turned us into. We are afraid to say anything because it will be twisted into something it isn't. I for one will continue to say what I feel and believe..... if that offends you in some way.... too bad. I am allowed to disagree."

I thought it was a wonderful speech. he also touched on the African American thing. he basically said that just because he is black does not mean he came from Africa. What if he came from Jamaica? He was born right here in the US. he is an AMERICAN. and there are lots of white people from Africa.... how come they don't call them African Americans?

And just a point of my own.... I like the Guns don't kill people part. How TRUE. Everyone wants to blame the object instead of the person operating the object. Guns don't go off on their own.... they don't have minds to think... they don't have free will.... they can not go out and kill someone all on their own. it takes a human to kill another human. So we ban guns.... whats next? Knives? then sticks and stones? baseball bats? cars? where will it end? If we aren't going to hold the HUMAN accountable then we might as well get rid of any material object that could possibly inflict any kind of harm because they MUST be to blame. Scotland is a perfect example. they banned guns a long time ago.... now stabbings have risen to an unbelievable number. NOW they want to ban knives. Where will it end? Hold the people that commit these crimes responsible. they have a brain... they have free will... they have the opposable digits to operate such a weapon. Banning guns will not stop murder.... sorry to break it to ya. it only hurts the law abiding citizens that get their guns legally and have them registered. How many thugs do you think register their guns or buy them legally? Banning guns will only take them out of the hands of the law abiders but the thugs will still be able to get them off the black market. If we are going to do that why don't we just take all the innocent people that have been robbed of their protection and line them up execution style.... might as well since you have taken away their ability to protect themselves from those thugs with the illegal weapons.

[Ceph]

I hate to say it (well, not really)...but I agree with most of this stuff....I dont espceially like political correctedness....

One of my favorite stories was there was a girl in HS with parents from south africa...she checked the african american box and when she went for interviews for college the interviewers got on her for lying...but she was african american.

I dont know...When I talk to my friends and I need to use a descriptor...I have a really hard time using any of them...one time I managed to stutter out african american to one of my fellow guardsmen and he said that he wasnt african, why not call him black...I dont feel comfortable with that either....we're all the same right? Isnt that the point...we may look a little different but I dunno...maybe they should have the Red head college fund....

As far as the people killing people....yeah

I dont necissarily believe in the boyscouts...I am a tomboy though...I actually kind of enjoy playing army in the woods....my girl scout troop went to a doll museum...yuck...I'd rather have played with the boys....but if I had I wouldnt have expected any special treatment...

and right now...I know I am young yet, and not a mom....but I cant believe the difference between my generation and the generations two years after me....these kids have no respect or discipline for anything...if I did something stupid when I was a kid my parents smacked my butt and I *never* did it again....Bill Engvall said it best on this...now adays parents send their kids to their rooms as discipline...but the average kid has a computer or tv or gameboy in their room....I wish I had gotten sent to my room more often :-/

And I think its kinda dumb that illegal aliens get more benefits in some places than citizens....

Just my two (or three or four cents)....I guess everyone is entitled to what they believe in...to their truths..these are just mine.

[Twisterdog]

This has been around a long, long time. I have no idea who originally said it ... I've also heard it attributed to George Carlin ... but I recall getting it in emails years ago.

I agree with a few things in there, but some of them are just mean, sad and ignorant. :(

[Killearn Kitties]

Scotland is a perfect example. they banned guns a long time ago.... now stabbings have risen to an unbelievable number. NOW they want to ban knives. Where will it end?

I think it is very misleading to link a handgun ban with knife crime figures. Yes, handguns were banned in the UK in 1997 (with the exception, I believe, of Northern Ireland), but Scotland, along with the rest of the UK has not historically had a gun culture.

Knife crime figures go up and down, depending on various factors, but knives have always been, and remain, the weapon of choice for the Scottish thug.

[sparks19]

I think it is very misleading to link a handgun ban with knife crime figures. Yes, handguns were banned in the UK in 1997 (with the exception, I believe, of Northern Ireland), but Scotland, along with the rest of the UK has not historically had a gun culture.

Knife crime figures go up and down, depending on various factors, but knives have always been, and remain, the weapon of choice for the Scottish thug.


I just read an article the other day (although it wasn't a brand new article it was a year old) saying that they now want to ban knives because of the knife crime going on. My point is... we can't ban everything that could possibly be used as a weapon just because people are idiots.


maybe they should have the Red head college fund....

Ceph, OH mY GOSH .... could you imagine the fighting :D get a bunch of tempermental red heads together in a kind of competition. LOL being a red head I know first hand the temper we can have lol, I couldn't imagine the blood bath that would result from that hahahaha.

[Ceph]

Ceph, OH mY GOSH .... could you imagine the fighting :D get a bunch of tempermental red heads together in a kind of competition. LOL being a red head I know first hand the temper we can have lol, I couldn't imagine the blood bath that would result from that hahahaha.

lol, actually my future roomie and I are both red...she's more ginger than I am (my hair gets red highlights in the summer...its moslty an auburn). She's alot more laid back than I am though...I get fired up sometimes....I think it would be hysterical though...The Ginger fund (ever get called that?....ugh....my buddies make fun of me all the time...)

[jackie]

.... I like the Guns don't kill people part. How TRUE. Everyone wants to blame the object instead of the person operating the object. Guns don't go off on their own.... they don't have minds to think... they don't have free will....

I can't think of one single reason why a civilian would need a hand gun...

I wonder who really wrote that?

[sparks19]

I can't think of one single reason why a civilian would need a hand gun...

I wonder who really wrote that?


fortunately I do not live in an area like this......

However, many people live in areas that are littered with gangs, thugs, and miscrients. how exactly would you defend yourself against someone with a gun? personally I am of the mind set "kill or be killed". If someone were threatening me with a gun and I had access to mine I would use it. I would not hope that the police show up in time. of course, you should never own a gun if youare not properly trained in how to use it AND you CAN use it. if you have any doubt that if your life were in danger that you could pull that trigger than no you should never own or operate a deadly weapon. I am not and would not ever recommend a gun to someone that has not been trained to use one. If you own a gun and are not fully trained in how to use it then you are as big a danger to yourself as you are to others. BUT if you are trained it is far more effective than praying the police will get there before you are killed. Of course, this weapon should ONLY be used in a life or death situation. You may not see a reason for a civilian to own a gun but until you are someone you love is put into that kind of situation I wouldn't expect you to see a reason. I hope that you never find a reason to be honest.... but in some places, sometimes.... it can save your life.

Not to mention.... people hunt. therefore they own guns. 9 times out of 10 these are not the people you should be worried about breaking into your home and threatening your life. Banning guns only takes them out of the hands of the responsible owners. It does nothing to stop the thugs that get them illegally and do not have them registered.

[Twisterdog]

I can't think of one single reason why a civilian would need a hand gun...

Nah, most people don't NEED a gun. (Thank goodness!) But people don't NEED golf clubs, snowmachines, or basketballs either. Some people enjoy owning, collecting and shooting guns as a hobby. I've "killed" a lot of clay pigeons and targets in my life, and it's fun. And most certainly dangerous to no one.

I take my 82 year old dad to the trap club so he can shoot skeet with his shotgun. He likes to still feel young doing it. It's quality time we spend together. It's just a hobby ... not a political statement or a danger to society at large.

[sparks19]

Nah, most people don't NEED a gun. (Thank goodness!) But people don't NEED golf clubs, snowmachines, or basketballs either. Some people enjoy owning, collecting and shooting guns as a hobby. I've "killed" a lot of clay pigeons and targets in my life, and it's fun. And most certainly dangerous to no one.

I take my 82 year old dad to the trap club so he can shoot skeet with his shotgun. He likes to still feel young doing it. It's quality time we spend together. It's just a hobby ... not a political statement or a danger to society at large.


Are you sure you aren't out using your registered weapon to rob convenience stores or do drive by shootings? I mean afterall isn't that what all gun owners are guilty of :p

[Twisterdog]

Are you sure you aren't out using your registered weapon to rob convenience stores or do drive by shootings? I mean afterall isn't that what all gun owners are guilty of :p

Dang ... my secret life exposed on Pet Talk! How DID you know??? ;)

[sparks19]

Dang ... my secret life exposed on Pet Talk! How DID you know??? ;)


LOL I just assumed since you own a gun you MUST be using it to harm others :D Plus I have been spying on you :p

and just to add. another good reason to not ban guns..... a little thing called the 2nd amendment. The right of the people to keep and bear arms. Now many will say that does not apply to the world today but think about it..... It was intended as protection against a tyrranous government. how far away from that do you really think we are ;)

So many people complain all the time about the government and it's ever more present infringment on the constitution and bill of rights etc etc.... funny how those same people wish they would take certain ones away.

[jackie]

fortunately I do not live in an area like this......

However, many people live in areas that are littered with gangs, thugs, and miscrients. how exactly would you defend yourself against someone with a gun? personally I am of the mind set "kill or be killed". If someone were threatening me with a gun and I had access to mine I would use it. I would not hope that the police show up in time. of course, you should never own a gun if youare not properly trained in how to use it AND you CAN use it. if you have any doubt that if your life were in danger that you could pull that trigger than no you should never own or operate a deadly weapon. I am not and would not ever recommend a gun to someone that has not been trained to use one. If you own a gun and are not fully trained in how to use it then you are as big a danger to yourself as you are to others. BUT if you are trained it is far more effective than praying the police will get there before you are killed. Of course, this weapon should ONLY be used in a life or death situation. You may not see a reason for a civilian to own a gun but until you are someone you love is put into that kind of situation I wouldn't expect you to see a reason. I hope that you never find a reason to be honest.... but in some places, sometimes.... it can save your life.

Not to mention.... people hunt. therefore they own guns. 9 times out of 10 these are not the people you should be worried about breaking into your home and threatening your life. Banning guns only takes them out of the hands of the responsible owners. It does nothing to stop the thugs that get them illegally and do not have them registered.

OK, we have different opinions.

I still can not think of one single reason civilians need HAND guns. I don't think people hunt with pistols. :p

I wont pull the thread further away from the OP's topic.

[sparks19]

OK, we have different opinions.

I still can not think of one single reason civilians need HAND guns. I don't think people hunt with pistols. :p

I wont pull the thread further away from the OP's topic.

Sorry I missed the HAND part. I thought you just meant guns in general.

We are of different opinions because I can definately see why people would want to own a handgun. OK they might not NEED it but we don't NEED a lot of things. I however, can see the reasoning for a hand gun. it prevented my husband from being car jacked and from being threatened by someone else with a gun (unregistered no doubt). Of course he has the knowledge and training to use a hand gun.

One might say "it's just a car... give it to him" but many don't realize that in some of these cases the person being car jacked is either beaten or shot and left for dead. Afterall they have seen the face of their car jacker.... they don't want to be idetified.

[Edwina's Secretary]

How interesting...this thread....like the invasion of Iraq.....based on lies....Andy Rooney did NOT say this....you do...except in very limited circumstances, have to know the english language to become a citizen of the US....anybody actually KNOW of any programs to set up non-citizens/non-residents in business?????....no....

Just more lies, lies, lies.....and hateful, ugly ones at that...old well...same old story....

[TamanduaGirl]

A dog is dangerous no one NEEDS a dog we should ban dogs... Oh wait that's already happening breed by breed just like guns are happening type by type.

Honestly it's the same thing. Just because it is potentially dangerous or scares people is no reason to take others right away to have it, whatever it is. Be it gun, dog or tiger.

We were just talking about guns on anther list. It's a homesteading group and someone in AU asked about people having guns since they can't but it had been mentioned. Farmers and ranchers do need gun and hand guns included. It's the quickest and fasted way to put already suffering live stock down.

I grew up on what is called a homestead now. I look back on it and say we were hill billies :) My father's dog was poisoned with antifreeze by a neighbor. She was suffering a lot of her blood already congealed from the forming crystals in the blood. He could have made her suffer more loading her up and riving off into town for a vet. Or he could have shot the neighbors. He got his gun and shot the dog to stop her suffering right then. So people do need guns as much as any person needs any modern thing.

We don't need hardly any thing we only need food and shelter. If only living based on need we all should be cave men or at least living as natives used to. Need is actually very subjective.

And yes the intial post was false but it turned into a real discussion of rights and curent events. I don't see it as bad it strayed from the original post especialy since it was false.

[cyber-sibes]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v432/cyber-sibes/blinkies/ShowLetter.gif Way to go, Andy! Great rant, whoever really said it.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Scotland is a perfect example. they banned guns a long time ago.... now stabbings have risen to an unbelievable number. NOW they want to ban knives.


Goodness! How will they address the haggis when all the knives in Scotland are banned? Or cut their meat for that matter. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: I assume this article was in MAD magazine?

Well...I've just been out for a walk in the blizzard and had a wonderful idea.

Let's issue a gun to everyone American when they graduate grade school. I don't know my handguns so I can't recommend a specific one...but something small and portable but that still packs a good wallop! Everyone....male, female, white, black, hispanic (legal only!), asian, native, middle eastern decent....everyone.

Think of the burden this would take off the courts....no more "he said...she said..." may the best...or at least the first...shot win! That annoying person in the grocery store who is talking on a cell phone....BAM! they won't be using that hand again!....those kids playing in your yard....the person who cuts you off in traffic...that dang door to door salesperson...the possibilites are endless.

Yes....forget about adequate healthcare...give EVERYONE a gun instead....

[sparks19]

Ah yes... focus on that and not what I REALLY said in my post. No one that is not properly trained and educated should never own a gun. Sorry but just because we own a gun does not mean we are out robbing liquor stores and threatening passer by's with it. But at least if all guns are registered you will know where the shot came from ;) If we can give 16 year olds licenses to drive (cars kill more people every year than guns BTW) and we haven't banned cars then I certainly don't see the logic for banning guns. Violent crimes will NOT stop with the ban of guns. Those who wish to harm and kill people will do so with or without guns.

A weapon is for protection (and hunting game) ONLY. I do not and will not ever advocate premiscuous use of a deadly weapon. In my eyes you MUST be fully trained and educated in gun safety. I think you should have to pass a test before being issued a weapon.... but bannishing guns does NOT take guns out of the hands of criminals. it takes guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens and only makes us prey to those who have no regard for the law. Sorry but I can't rely on the police to save me. They provide a wonderful service but they can't be everywhere at once. If someone is threatening my life you bet your a$$ I will do everything in MY power to protect myself.

HMMMM doesn't look like MAD magazine to me

http://news.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=579102005

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/4031405.stm Not a total ban here but tis the beginning

http://news.scotsman.com/politics.cfm?id=1180732006

So what wil they do when those criminals start using domestic knives? They will ban those too. then those criminals will start using bats.... they will ban those too. Then what?

[Edwina's Secretary]

No one that is not properly trained and educated should never own a gun.

Show me where in the second amendment....which you DID quote....says anything about trained and educated.


It it was good enough in 1776 it is good enough today, right?

[Edwina's Secretary]

I read your articles Sparky...some doctors said some stuff about knives and then there is some discussion of SWORDS....SWORDS....not knives.....

I see NOTHING about the Scottish government banning knives. Geez....

there is a BIG difference between a law about not carrying something on your person and not owning something. That does not a BAN make....

Maybe this will help you understand the difference...I cannot carry lip gel on an airplane...that does NOT mean lip gel is banned. I am still allowed to own lip gloss.

[sparks19]

I read your articles Sparky...some doctors said some stuff about knives and then there is some discussion of SWORDS....SWORDS....not knives.....

I see NOTHING about the Scottish government banning knives. Geez....

there is a BIG difference between a law about not carrying something on your person and not owning something. That does not a BAN make....

Maybe this will help you understand the difference...I cannot carry lip gel on an airplane...that does NOT mean lip gel is banned. I am still allowed to own lip gloss.

Please do not speak to me like I am stupid. I do not speak to you that way. I don't think it is too much to ask for the same respect from you. Just because you don't agree does not make me stupid. You are capable of having a discussion without resorting to such behaviour are you not?!

Anyway it states.... HUNTING KNIVES. Hunting knives are not swords. they are knives. Bowie knives are KNIVES. They are already starting a ban on certain swords and knives.... won't be long before thugs are using kitchen knives and then they will have to ban those too.

I also didn't say they were banned.... I said they WANT to ban them. It has been discussed and considered... just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean it won't.... it's already starting. It even says that swords only make up 1% of knife crime. When the sword ban makes no difference what do you think they will resort to next.

While the second amendment does not state training does not change the fact that MY OPINION is that you should be trained to own a gun for protection. If you own a gun and are not trained in how to use it ... that makes you irresponsible. I am not for the irresponsible ownership of anything. I was simply stating what I think. My quoting of the secone amendment was to answer the question of why we shouldn't ban guns. That aside I do not think just anyone should get a gun and start firing blindly into the night. AND if you are not positive that you could shoot someone who is threatening your life.... you are more of a danger to yourself than you realize.

[wombat2u2004]

Edwinas Secretary wrote : "" I am still allowed to own lip gloss ""

What for ????

[Ceph]

lol, as far as guns go...

Some of us just like to go up to the Range and shoot. It's fun...it's all very safe, we take precautions, and no one gets hurt...It sometimes turns into a game (who can shoot the most of the dollar store little green men), and sometimes its just because we want to focus on something (aiming, zeroing...the concentration is sometimes welcome when you are feeling very spread thin).

And for handguns...I will be getting one soon...but not for protection...again...its mostly for the fun of shooting with my buddies at the Range....though, I think everyone who owns a gun should know how to opperate it...its kind of stupid if you dont

[wombat2u2004]

""Not to mention.... people hunt. therefore they own guns. 9 times out of 10 these are not the people you should be worried about breaking into your home and threatening your life. Banning guns only takes them out of the hands of the responsible owners. It does nothing to stop the thugs that get them illegally and do not have them registered.""

That is SO true !!!!!

[Edwina's Secretary]

Edwinas Secretary wrote : "" I am still allowed to own lip gloss ""

What for ????

Why to defend myself of course!

[jackie]

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

I still see no valid argument for owning a handgun.

For personal protection? I would think if you were being mugged or car jack, pulling out a gun would escalate the violence much more then simply handing over the money or keys. Wouldn't most criminals be much more "handy" at using weapons? Pulling a gun out in real life is much different to the shooting range, and I am sure the guy trying to rob you would have a lot more experience. That is the same reason I never carry the mace my ex gave me. I could see some guy trying to attack me, I pull out my mace, fumble, he grabs the mace and sprays me. Much more fun if it was a lethal weapon.

BTW comparing hand guns to cars/golf clubs/baseball bats because those things could possibly kill is a ridiculous argument. A car's/club's/bat's main purpose is not to kill, while a guns purpose is to kill.

[sparks19]

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

I still see no valid argument for owning a handgun.

For personal protection? I would think if you were being mugged or car jack, pulling out a gun would escalate the violence much more then simply handing over the money or keys. Wouldn't most criminals be much more "handy" at using weapons? Pulling a gun out in real life is much different to the shooting range, and I am sure the guy trying to rob you would have a lot more experience. That is the same reason I never carry the mace my ex gave me. I could see some guy trying to attack me, I pull out my mace, fumble, he grabs the mace and sprays me. Much more fun if it was a lethal weapon.

BTW comparing hand guns to cars/golf clubs/baseball bats because those things could possibly kill is a ridiculous argument. A car's/club's/bat's main purpose is not to kill, while a guns purpose is to kill.

Ah now you are just assuming a criminal has more experience with a gun. My husband has over 12 years of training with guns, marksmanship, safety....etc etc. and has used it in a combat environment. now I know you can't get that kind of training whenever you buy a gun but I am certainly confident in his ability to use his weapon if needed. I highly doubt your run of the mill criminal has that kind of experience. Heck... the average police officer doesn't have that kind of experience and often has their weapon holstered incorrectly.... that then becomes a danger to themselves.

and like I said.... all too often your run of the mill carjacking ends up in the beating or death of the innocent driver (in this day and age). It has happened to people I know who willingly complied with what the criminal wanted.... unfortunately hey had seen the criminals face and the criminal did not want to be turned into the police so they tried to rid my friends of the ability to do so.

See I would never recommend a gun for you. I clearly stated that you SHOULD be TRAINED in how to properly use such a weapon so THAT type of thing would NOT happen. If you cannot use your weapon correctly then you should not own one.

If you cannot operate a can of Mace properly than you have no business owning that either. Anything that is a weapon should come with TRAINING.

[jackie]

Ah now you are just assuming a criminal has more experience with a gun. My husband has over 12 years of training with guns, marksmanship, safety....etc etc. and has used it in a combat environment. now I know you can't get that kind of training whenever you buy a gun but I am certainly confident in his ability to use his weapon if needed. I highly doubt your run of the mill criminal has that kind of experience. Heck... the average police officer doesn't have that kind of experience and often has their weapon holstered incorrectly.... that then becomes a danger to themselves.

Ah now you are just assuming that I am talking specifically about you or your spose. Or you are just assuming the average gun owner has had the training your hubby has had.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and I still believe that hand guns should not be privately owned. :)

Can you give your opinion on these comments?

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

[sparks19]

Ah now you are just assuming that I am talking specifically about you or your spose. Or you are just assuming the average gun owner has had the training your hubby has had.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and I still believe that hand guns should not be privately owned. :)

Can you give your opinion on these comments?

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

I will have to look up the following statistics to answer that :D

Domestic violence.... well if one spouse wants to kill another it will happen with or without a gun. Unfortunately a woman I used to know (I actually knew her daughter and heard about this tragedy) was brutally beaten by her husband with her own crutches. No guns won't stop murder. Accidents .... result of improper training. Suicides... again they would happen with our without guns. When someone is determined to kill themselves or someone else... lack of a gun will not stop them. My grandfather killed himself by locking himself in the car with a hose going from the exhaust into the car window. Unfortunately I never got to meet him. he had a gun but chose to do it this way. So again... guns can't be blamed for these happenings. determination is a powerful thing and not having a gun is not enough to squash determination.

[Ceph]

I know alot of states require people to get training. Mine does....plus I get the added training from the military.

[Pembroke_Corgi]

I just wanted to point out that saying that because anything can kill a person, guns are fine is a logical fallacy. Like Jackie said, guns are designed to kill things, cars, golf clubs, etc, are not. And, people may be the ones to pull the trigger, but they'd have a much harder time killing anything without a gun. What about all the unintentional injuries and casualties that occur- such as children getting into guns...is that just the "people" not the guns?

[Ceph]

I just wanted to point out that saying that because anything can kill a person, guns are fine is a logical fallacy. Like Jackie said, guns are designed to kill things, cars, golf clubs, etc, are not. And, people may be the ones to pull the trigger, but they'd have a much harder time killing anything without a gun. What about all the unintentional injuries and casualties that occur- such as children getting into guns...is that just the "people" not the guns?


There are a few things designed to kill people also...knives...bows and arrows...Nuclear power....lol, I cant even imagine banning nuclear power...the state of virginia would loose all power.

[critter crazy]

Ugghhhh...I hate all this crap about guns! Guns dont kill people, people kill people! It is rediculous, cause all of us responsible gun owners suffer. Just cause you dont like guns, does not make them bad. I have been around guns all of my life, and so have my children. My boys are 7 and 11 eleven, they know about gun safety, but have yet to touch or fire a real gun. they wont until they are old enough and responsible enough. We are hunters, and target shooters, and both hubby and I have served our time in the Army, hubby 20 yrs and myself 10 years.

and even if guns were illegal, the crime rate wouldnt go down, because criminals import weapons from other countries. Also if people didnt have guns, they would just use something else.

[sparks19]

LOL so we should ban guns so people have to WORK at killing others? As far as I know a stab wound CAN kill just as effectivly as a gun shot wound. A baseball bat to the head can kill just as effectively as a gun shot wound.

As for kids getting into guns. that is parents trying to shelter their kids from guns. curiousity killed the cat. Kids should be taught IMMEDIATELY about gun safety. I can't say I know of too many kids who were taught about gun safety and taught to respect guns that got into the gun cabinet and used it as a toy. so YES it is human error. If you hide it from them and teach them nothing about it how do you expect them to know they shouldn't play with it.... just because you tell them not to? HA. TEACH your children... don't ever let them use guns as a toy.... take away that vantage point immediately. a gun is NEVER a toy.... I don't care if it is plastic or not. A gun is a weapon and they should be taught to respect it. If you are up front and honest with them about guns they are far less likely to misuse it. We will teach our child gun safety from a very young age. People say that is irresponsible but I think parents who try to hide the truth from their kids are more irresponsible. Kids aren't stupid and you shouldn't try to shelter them. I would rather my child learn gun safety from his/her parents than from some punk on the street or some TV show.

Again..... guns don't kill people.... PEOPLE kill people.

but what about kids.... what about old people... what about.... what about. That is YOUR responsibility as a parent and/or as a gun owner. YOU need to learn gun safety... you need to teach gun safety.

The world is full of what if's. If you live your life wondering what if everytime you do something that must be stressful. what if I fall in the shower and hit my head.... that's not enough reason for me to stop showering. What if I go to the store and get hit by another driver? that's not enough reason for me to stop going outside. Life is full of what if's. But we shouldn't all be punished because SOME people are morons... because some people are irresponsible.

Again, if you ban guns you aren't hurting anyone but law abiding citizens. Gun crime will still happen. Criminals are criminals. Don't make excuses for them. they kill people.... the sickest murderers in history never used a gun. Sh1t happens. but I will not have people take away my right to defend myself because they are afraid and misinformed

[cassiesmom]

tonight (2/25) he was talking about papers and files he has kept in his office that he never looks at ... a famous person with a pack-rat tendency ... lol

[sparks19]

tonight (2/25) he was talking about papers and files he has kept in his office that he never looks at ... a famous person with a pack-rat tendency ... lol


LOL you haven't seen pack rat tendancy until you see my boss's parents house. There are literally alleyways between box upon box of junk. They have boxes filling the basement... boxes on the dining table. Boxes under the dining table... boxes AROUND the dining table. Boxes that line all the walkways in the house.... it's like a maze LOL

[Edwina's Secretary]

How many drive by stabbings have you ever heard of? How many children killed by a stray knife that came flying through the air?

I say again...let's give everyone a gun when they graduate from grade school...to satisfy those worried about training....give then a gun class!....

there...now we have a level playing field!

[Cinder & Smoke]

How many drive by stabbings have you ever heard of?
How many children killed by a stray knife that came flying through the air?


Or ...
"I didn't know the KNIFE was 'loaded' ... it just went off by itself." :rolleyes:

Guns take most of the work out of killing a fellow being. :(

[wombat2u2004]

You can't disarm the public, just because of a few idiots.
Because if you do...those very same idiots will find some more guns.
So.....why disarm the public ?????

[wombat2u2004]

Why to defend myself of course!

You wouldn't have to...they'd run a mile anyway !!!! :D

[Edwina's Secretary]

You wouldn't have to...they'd run a mile anyway !!!! :D

I'm not sure I understand Wombat. Why would lip gloss cause someone to run a mile?

[critter crazy]

How many drive by stabbings have you ever heard of? How many children killed by a stray knife that came flying through the air?

I say again...let's give everyone a gun when they graduate from grade school...to satisfy those worried about training....give then a gun class!....

there...now we have a level playing field!
Do you think that disarming Citizens, that this is going to stop?? most weapons in driveby shootings, are illegal, and imported anyways! Taking guns away from everyone isnt going to solve any problems! and it is rediculous to think so!

[ramanth]

Andy and I own hand guns. Best if everyone kept their distance from us.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Do you think that disarming Citizens, that this is going to stop?? most weapons in driveby shootings, are illegal, and imported anyways! Taking guns away from everyone isnt going to solve any problems! and it is rediculous to think so!

But I am suggesting giving EVERYONE a gun...male, female, black, white, hispanic....everyone! Where do I suggest disarming citizens?

ps...is calling me rediculous ...or even ridiculous very nice? :D

[Puckstop31]

I wonder how many of the guns used to commit crimes were stolen from someone who owned it legally?

I wonder why most gun related deaths are a result of domestic violence, accidents, and suicides.

I am the infamous "Spark's Hubby"

- So the weapon used in a crime was stolen from a legal owner. How does this justify punishing the legal owner?

- It is sad that guns are used in domestic violence and that accidents happen etc... This is still not enough reason, to me at least, to let the government take away yet another one of our freedoms. Indeed the one freedom that can protect us from that very government that supposedly "serves" us. If you take away hand guns, you set precedent for further action. You really think the government would stop at just hand guns?

From what I read in this thread, there are going to be a great many victims here when the government fails to respond to the inevitable major, natiowide disaster. What are your plans for such an occurance?

Think about it, humans are a mere 9 meals away from barbaric acts becoming commonplace. Think about what happens when New Orleans happens on a national scale?

[critter crazy]

[QUOTE=jackie]OK, we have different opinions.

I still can not think of one single reason civilians need HAND guns. I don't think people hunt with pistols. :p

QUOTE]
Actually many handguns are used in hunting! Some areas allow them and some dont, but they are used.

[Puckstop31]

I just wanted to point out that saying that because anything can kill a person, guns are fine is a logical fallacy. Like Jackie said, guns are designed to kill things, cars, golf clubs, etc, are not. And, people may be the ones to pull the trigger, but they'd have a much harder time killing anything without a gun. What about all the unintentional injuries and casualties that occur- such as children getting into guns...is that just the "people" not the guns?

Giving up freedoms in the name of "security". Doesn't the government already control to much of our lives?

I think you are naive and a victim to be....

[Puckstop31]

I say again...let's give everyone a gun when they graduate from grade school...to satisfy those worried about training....give then a gun class!....

there...now we have a level playing field!

Fine by me, as long as I don't have to pay for those weapons or the ammunition.

[Puckstop31]

But I am suggesting giving EVERYONE a gun...male, female, black, white, hispanic....everyone! Where do I suggest disarming citizens?

ps...is calling me rediculous ...or even ridiculous very nice? :D

Oh no... You are one of THOSE kind of liberals.

Sweet....

[Randi]

I can't think of one single reason why a civilian would need a hand gun...
Neither can I! The more guns there are around, the more tend to be used - even with good education. Sad but true.

I'm glad that people are not alowed to have a gun in Denmark, except the ones you use for hunting. At the moment there are discusions about whether to allow "pepper" sprays here.

[Ceph]

wow, pepper spray, that falls under the category of stupid.

So what's a girl gonna do when someone twice her weight attacks her...smack him with her purse? Pepper spray is one of the most effective, efficient ways of protecting yourself.

[Pembroke_Corgi]

Giving up freedoms in the name of "security". Doesn't the government already control to much of our lives?

I think you are naive and a victim to be....
Wow, it is so interesting to me how, when presented with an opposing viewpoint, you will go to such lengths to disagree. Everyone is "up in arms" about someone disagreeing with handguns, which in this country WE ARE ALLOWED TO DO, ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, and you suggest that I will one day be victim of violence. That is lovely, so eloquently spoken by a pro-gun advocate. Up until now I have been civil, and have taken the time to think out my responses. Well I quit trying to use reason, it's obviously ineffective.

I thought guns were harmless, why should I be a victim? Or are you threatening me?

[Edwina's Secretary]

Fine by me, as long as I don't have to pay for those weapons or the ammunition.

The government will use the money that would otherwise be spent on...oh adequate medical care for everyone and Aid to Dependent Children.....you know...all those silly programs....

Heck...with a national debt of $9 trillion ...what's a little more?

[DrKym]

I will happily keep my gun holstered for now. Since I have a permit to carry concealed, I will just keep it with me.

[sparks19]

wow, pepper spray, that falls under the category of stupid.

So what's a girl gonna do when someone twice her weight attacks her...smack him with her purse? Pepper spray is one of the most effective, efficient ways of protecting yourself.


Call the police and hope they get there in time LOL. Tell the perp to hold on a minute while I dial 911. I'm sure they will let you :rolleyes: people who rely on others to save them are only setting themselves up for failure. the only one that can protect you is YOU.

I've said it once and I will say it again....Taking away a legal owners right to own a handgun or pepper spray or whatever else does nothing but hurt the legal owners. gun crime will still happen.

LOL Look at Canada. it basically takes an act of GOD to get a gun yet gun crime is only on a the rise. Hmmmm a lot of good banning hand guns have done. Except NOW the victims can't protect themselves. Like the guy that shot up a strip club next to a day care center (YES I don't understand why the two would be anywhere near each other but they are) Stray bullets collected.... low and behold... the weapon USED to fire those bullets is not registered and was obtained illegally. He wasn't caught.... not a week later the same man (suspected) shot up another club. he still has not been apprehended. How did gun control help prevent this from happening? OH that's right.....it DIDN'T!!!

More and more often in Toronto we are hearing of drive by shootings, armed robberies, shootings at night clubs. and only a fraction of these shootings have led to an arrest ONLY because there was a witness the identified the shooter well enough that the police were able to find them. and guess what.... these thugs weapons are not registered and were obtained illegally. I see gun control really works LOL

[Puckstop31]

Wow, it is so interesting to me how, when presented with an opposing viewpoint, you will go to such lengths to disagree. Everyone is "up in arms" about someone disagreeing with handguns, which in this country WE ARE ALLOWED TO DO, ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, and you suggest that I will one day be victim of violence. That is lovely, so eloquently spoken by a pro-gun advocate. Up until now I have been civil, and have taken the time to think out my responses. Well I quit trying to use reason, it's obviously ineffective.

I thought guns were harmless, why should I be a victim? Or are you threatening me?

LOL...

Such an emotional responce, I wonder what that means? ;) If you think these were "great lengths" to disagree with you... I say what I mean and I mean what I say. You might disagree with me but you will always know what I mean. If you cannot handle that, tough.

You will be a victim because you seem to be the type that would rely on others to keep you safe. If not, what are your plans to protect yourself and those you love if/when civil disorder happens, even if only for a short time.

Banning JUST handguns, I believe, would not end there. Our "government" takes a mile when you give them an inch.

Threatening you?? PUH-LEASE. Get over yourself, honey. Keep off my property and don't try to harm me or my family and you ain't got a thing to worry about.

C, wee unedukated hiks dunna leyek ween u beeg talkin sity peeple cum neer our stuf.

Now THAT is going to great lengths to mess with ya. :)

[Puckstop31]

The government will use the money that would otherwise be spent on...oh adequate medical care for everyone and Aid to Dependent Children.....you know...all those silly programs....

Heck...with a national debt of $9 trillion ...what's a little more?

OK by me... Better to teach a person to fish than to give them one.

I am all for better health coverage for all. But the answer is NOT anything the government can/will do. Take all the money flushed down the can in Medicare/Medicade and give it to all the great, PRIVATE, organizations who really make things happen with it.

We are promised the ability to pursue happiness, not the happiness itself. Also, I do not believe healthcare to be a RIGHT. If it is, lets see some of our wonderful politicians offer up a Constitutional Amendment to make it so.

I know, insert your "where is your compassion" line. I am open to any answer, as long as it does not involve government.

[Husky15]

I agree with most of those, except a few. One of them was this one:

I believe that if you are selling me a milkshake, a pack of cigarettes, a newspaper or a hotel room, you must do it in English! As a matter of fact, if you want to be an American citizen, you should have to speak English!
To me, that sounds a little arrogant...

From what I gathered, there are four - and probably more - different languages spoken in the United States (English and Spanish being two of the most common). So English is not the only one spoken. I believe it is best that everyone would be able to speak English, but they don't.

[DrKym]

I agree with most of those, except a few. One of them was this one:

To me, that sounds a little arrogant...

From what I gathered, there are four - and probably more - different languages spoken in the United States (English and Spanish being two of the most common). So English is not the only one spoken. I believe it is best that everyone would be able to speak English, but they don't.


However English is our native language.................When in rome do as the romans do.

[sparks19]

I agree with most of those, except a few. One of them was this one:

To me, that sounds a little arrogant...

From what I gathered, there are four - and probably more - different languages spoken in the United States (English and Spanish being two of the most common). So English is not the only one spoken. I believe it is best that everyone would be able to speak English, but they don't.


but warning signs, road signs etc etc are printed in English... therefore you SHOULD at least have an understanding of the language IMO

[critter crazy]

I am one who definitely thinks, that you should be able to read and speak english. I am not saying perfectly, but should definitely have a good understanding!

[sparks19]

I am one who definitely thinks, that you should be able to read and speak english. I am not saying perfectly, but should definitely have a good understanding!


I knew a couple who moved to Ontario from Colombia. they only spoke Spanish but upon arrival in Canada they bought as many books, tapes and whatever they could about learning the english language. They watched as much tv as they could so they could listen to the language even when not out with people. they would ONLY speak english to each other at home and were determined to learn the language because everyone around them spoke english and it just didn't make sense for them to not be able to understand anyone around them or not be understood. their english is still very broken but I just thought it was so amazing that they wanted to learn so badly. they did not speak a lick of English upon arrival but now they have a basic understanding of the language and all self taught.

After seeing their determination I wonder why anyone would refuse to learn the language spoken around them. If they could do it all self taught what is stopping others?

[critter crazy]

I knew a couple who moved to Ontario from Colombia. they only spoke Spanish but upon arrival in Canada they bought as many books, tapes and whatever they could about learning the english language. They watched as much tv as they could so they could listen to the language even when not out with people. they would ONLY speak english to each other at home and were determined to learn the language because everyone around them spoke english and it just didn't make sense for them to not be able to understand anyone around them or not be understood. their english is still very broken but I just thought it was so amazing that they wanted to learn so badly. they did not speak a lick of English upon arrival but now they have a basic understanding of the language and all self taught.

After seeing their determination I wonder why anyone would refuse to learn the language spoken around them. If they could do it all self taught what is stopping others?
Exactly! I grew up in a Huge Mexican family, and neighborhood, but every one knew and spoke english, if they didnt they were at least trying to learn. If I moved to a different country, i sure as heck would try to learn the laguage! I spent some Time in Honduras, with the Army, and Boy did my spanish come in handy.

[Pembroke_Corgi]

You will be a victim because you seem to be the type that would rely on others to keep you safe. If not, what are your plans to protect yourself and those you love if/when civil disorder happens, even if only for a short time.
My plan is to stay away from guns, and keep away from "unedukated hiks!" ;)

[sparks19]

My plan is to stay away from guns, and keep away from "unedukated hiks!" ;)

unedukated hiks aren't the ones you should be worried about ;) tis' the people who get fed up with them and begin civil disorder. I said it earlier.... the second amendment is the right to keep and bare arms (not the sleeveless kind) to protect ourselves against a tyrranous government... how far away from that do you really see us being?

[lizbud]

unedukated hiks aren't the ones you should be worried about ;) tis' the people who get fed up with them and begin civil disorder. I said it earlier.... the second amendment is the right to keep and bare arms (not the sleeveless kind) to protect ourselves against a tyrranous government... how far away from that do you really see us being?


Wow, a radical Canadian. Didn't know they existed :eek:

[cyber-sibes]

We live near a gun club so I hear them every day. People here like to hunt, even youngsters. There are many many people with legal firearms here, and very few accidents or intentional killings (although they do happen once in a while) What I worry about are things like assault rifles illegally making their way into our streets & neighborhoods. Those weapons have no purpose other than to be used to kill human beings. Resources should be directed at confiscating illegal weapons such as these. Of course, we're talking about a legal system that demands little old grandmas be searched at airports just to be sure the terrorists are getting a fair shake. :rolleyes:

[DrKym]

We live near a gun club so I hear them every day. People here like to hunt, even youngsters. There are many many people with legal firearms here, and very few accidents or intentional killings (although they do happen once in a while) What I worry about are things like assault rifles illegally making their way into our streets & neighborhoods. Those weapons have no purpose other than to be used to kill human beings. Resources should be directed at confiscating illegal weapons such as these. Of course, we're talking about a legal system that demands little old grandmas be searched at airports just to be sure the terrorists are getting a fair shake. :rolleyes:
Very well said.

[cassiesmom]

He never said it, and he was a little upset when he found out it was going around.

(snopes)



Neither did George Carlin

[jackie]

C, wee unedukated hiks dunna leyek ween u beeg talkin sity peeple cum neer our stuf.

Now THAT is going to great lengths to mess with ya. :)

OK, That made me LOL!

As for arming myself when "the revolution" comes, I am glad I don't live in America is all I have to say. And if worse comes to worse, I have ten huge bags of dog food in the basement, and I am not afraid to eat it! :p

I think I am done with this thread. Still haven't changed my mind, but it was interesting hearing the other point of view.

[Puckstop31]

My plan is to stay away from guns, and keep away from "unedukated hiks!" ;)

Seriously, that is your plan?

[Puckstop31]

Wow, a radical Canadian. Didn't know they existed :eek:


Oh, there are more of then than you think. Micheal Moore wants everyone to think all Canadians are tree hugging hippys. Indeed, we in the USA could learn a lot from our northern friends. The thing that jumps out at me most is the wonderfully strong work ethic up there. I honestly cannot recall a time in my many, many visits where I recieved bad customer service at a fast food place or gas station, you know the places where you are lucky to get 3 seconds of decent attention here. Of course, I spend as little time as possible in the bigger cities, London is where I go the most.

[Puckstop31]

OK, That made me LOL!

As for arming myself when "the revolution" comes, I am glad I don't live in America is all I have to say. And if worse comes to worse, I have ten huge bags of dog food in the basement, and I am not afraid to eat it! :p

I think I am done with this thread. Still haven't changed my mind, but it was interesting hearing the other point of view.

Fair enough... To me this issue is about freedom. The more freedom we give to our governments, the less our lives are our own. Ability to own a weapon gives us all the ability to take back those freedoms should it come to it. See, everybody likes to bitch about freedom being taken away, but how many people would actually be ready, as the founding fathers of the USA were, to actually DO something about it? This guy IS. Of course, I pray all the time it never comes to that. Eternal vigilence is the price of freedom.

[moosmom]

Andy Rooney is my hero!!!

[Twisterdog]

I am one who definitely thinks, that you should be able to read and speak english. I am not saying perfectly, but should definitely have a good understanding!

I, too, agree with this. I do not think it is arrogant in the least. I think it is common sense.

If I were moving to France or Germany or Mexico, I would most certainly learn the language! I would probably never be perfectly fluent, but I would do the best I possibly could to learn the language.

I would not for one minute expect the government of another country to make concessions for me and duplicate signs, instructions, etc. in English. I think THAT is extremely arrogant!