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leansnslobbers
09-28-2006, 10:37 PM
This was written pertaining to danes, but obviously you can substitute any breed.

Okay, the moment has arrived. You have decided that you are ready for a great dane. There are a couple of different avenues you can take...

1) You pick up a local paper and cruise the Pets section
2) You have been in contact with a reputable breeder and are now ready to get on their waiting list
3) You go to the nearest GD Rescue site and start browsing

Let's take a look at how each avenue may progress...

1) You've found a local breeder in your paper and you're on your way to looking at the pups. You get there, and you immediately fall in love. You are so smitten with your new friend that you forget to ask the breeder about health testing or temperament. In fact, the breeder is busy talking about what great pups "ZENA" and "TINY" always produce that you forget almost everything you had read in the books. You fork over the cash and come home with your new puppy that day.
2) You talk to the reputable breeder. He/She informs you that they have a planned breeding coming up in 3 months. He/She also informs you that the Sire just completed his championship and has also gotten his CHIC number. He has cleared all testing for common inherited diseases. The Dam has been cleared for months, and they have been waiting for the best sire they could possibly find to compliment any faults the dam had. Because the breeding has not yet occured, you go ahead and place yourself on the waiting list. You talk to the breeder several times in the interim, and you're SO excited to get your pup. In the meantime, you continue to do research, you go to shows where you see relatives of your upcoming pup. You beam with pride.

3) You hear about a rescue from a person you work with. You decide to check it out. After all, saving a life is a wonderful thing. You contact your area coordinator and spend quite a while on the phone with her. You tell her of your specific needs, and she tells you of a few of the foster danes. She sends you an application. You fill it out and send it back in. You may or may not be perfectly matched with another dane immediately. But you're on your way.

So, now you have taken one of the three avenues. What happens next? Let’s fast forward six months.

1) Your backyard bred pup is now 7 ½ months old. Your breeder had told you how great his/her pups did on “X” kibble from the local grocer, so you decided to stick with it. At 5 months, your puppy had severe pains in his joints, but you called the breeder and were told it was just growing pains, don’t worry. At six months, he could hardly walk, and his feet look funny. You called the breeder again, but now your calls are being avoided. You take puppy to the vet only to find out he has severe HOD. While doing the x-rays, they also found that your puppy is dysplastic in both hips. The vet prescribes the appropriate treatment for the HOD, which your pup will eventually conquer, but prepares you for the hard life of problems ahead with the hip problems. He discusses surgery options with you for the future. You try to contact the breeder to tell him/her how upset you are, but surprise, your calls are still being avoided.

We’ll also touch base on the behavioral issues your pup is having. Because he wasn’t with mom until he was at least eight weeks old, he did not learn the appropriate socialization skills that mom would have taught him, as well as bite inhibition. Now he is 100 pounds and has fear aggression. Again, you try the breeder, and again you are ignored. You have no breeder support.
2) Your new pup from the reputable breeder has only been with you for a short time. The litter was born successfully and your breeder sent you pictures by email of the pups every week, along with updates. Through many conversations with your breeder, you both picked out a pup that would be suitable for your family.

The breeder also sent you home with tons of information about feeding your pup, health care, the name and number of a good trainer, and a cell phone number you could call anytime you had a question. This is breeder support, and a reputable breeder offers it for the life of your pup.

At three months of age, your dane pup is everything you could’ve hoped for. You are very happy and satisfied with your puppy and he’s healthy and happy and is a great representation of the breed.

3) Your adoption application was approved, and you have met several danes up for adoption. Two weeks ago, you received a call about a dane that would be a perfect match for your family. He’s been vet checked, and temperament tested and after meeting him, you couldn’t resist him. You brought him home where he took great interest in becoming part of the family. Your rescue volunteer has called to check on him, and you report that he is doing great, you can’t imagine why someone would’ve given him up. The volunteer also gives you a phone number you can call, anytime, should you have any concerns.

You can see how much making ONE decision can influence the life you share with your dane.

Let’s fast forward a few more years…..

1) Your backyard bred great dane suffered horribly from his hip problems. The pain of that on top of his temperament issues made him a biter. After your son accidentally tripped over your dane, the dane bit him causing extensive damage. You had to release him to the Bridge because he was not only in misery, but no longer trustworthy. He never made it to his fifth birthday. Your breeder never returned your calls.
2) Your pup from the responsible breeder went on to become a registered therapy dog, a Canine Good Citizen, and an agility champion. Your breeder was there every step of the way giving you support. When your dane reached the age of ten, you called your breeder again. “Jess, Apollo is getting old, he sleeps most of the time and has trouble getting up.” Your breeder is there for you, and offers support, and when it’s Apollo’s time to go to the Bridge, she even goes with you too the hospital.

After Apollo is gone, you remain in contact with the breeder. Then the day comes when another litter is planned. You put your name on the list. You’re going to be a mom again.

3) Your rescued dane shared 4 more years with you. Four wonderful years. In the space of that four years, you adopted two others. You now know that you will never be without a rescued dane. When you had problems with separation anxiety on the latest adoption, you contacted the rescue volunteer who gave you great advice, and together, you worked through it.

You now volunteer with the rescue as well. The first dane you adopted inspired you so much, you have become a wonderful asset to the rescue organization.

************************************************** ********************************

Let’s take a look at a different perspective now.

The Backyard Breeder -
The backyard breeder has taken no steps whatsoever to make any improvements. Though she knew she was breeding faulty dogs, she continued to do so. She put very little money into raising the dogs, but sold them for hundreds of dollars. She has made quite a little pile of money at the expense of the dogs and the owner’s pain.
How do we stop this from happening? SIMPLE - do NOT buy from them. Educate yourself, and others about the pitfalls of buying from a BYB.

The Reputable Breeder -
The reputable breeder consistently works to improve her lines. Health testing is done to insure that the risk of inheritable health problems are minimized. The reputable breeder has continued to take steps to ensure that she is breeding only the best. She makes no money from the breedings but continues to do so because of her love for the breed. It was never about money.
The Rescue Organization -
The rescue has just celebrated their 15th year as an organization. Homes for over 800 great danes have been found, with great success. They take so much time and make so much effort to assure that the danes they place go to great forever homes, that they rarely have any danes returned to them. They continue to help save danes, educate owners and backyard breeders, and make life an option for many danes.


************************************************** ********************************

One decision, it doesn’t seem like much. But it can mean the world to you down the road. Please choose wisely.

** Backyard bred danes (Scenario number 1) can be substituted with Pet Store Dane for the same effect and outcome. Pet store dogs are typically supplied by mills or back yard breeders. No reputable breeder would ever sell a dog to a pet store.

Please email me or PM me for permission to crosspost. :)

Danegirl2208
09-29-2006, 05:36 PM
great post Keri ;)

timlewis
09-30-2006, 02:41 PM
Exactly What Do U Consider A Backyard Breeder?? Just Wondering?

BC_MoM
09-30-2006, 02:49 PM
Exactly What Do U Consider A Backyard Breeder?? Just Wondering?

Some who does it for fun, IMO. Someone who has no idea how to be reputable, and doesn't even care about being reputable. They don't do it for the best of the breed.

John Grogan described BYB's in Marley & Me: "BYB's produce puppies like FORD produces Taurus'."

CathyBogart
09-30-2006, 02:55 PM
Exactly What Do U Consider A Backyard Breeder?? Just Wondering?

Someone who breeds because "they're cute" or "they're AKC registered" or "for the money".

A reputable breeder is someone who breeds a pair of dogs because "His traits plus her traits would produce outstanding examples of this breed. We've tested for genetic health problems this breed is prone to and not found any in either parent. I really feel like the puppies from this litter will contribute to bettering the breed" or something like that. :) A reputable breeder is also someone who carefully screens potential adopters of their puppies. They aren't the ones who advertise on craigslist or in the newspaper.

binka_nugget
09-30-2006, 03:18 PM
Exactly What Do U Consider A Backyard Breeder?? Just Wondering?

If the breeder isn't a reputable breeder, then s/he's a byb or puppy mill. Puppy mills mass produce. Bybs can range from someone who breeds their dog once because their dog has a nice temperment to someone who breeds every single heat for a bit of extra cash.

timlewis
09-30-2006, 06:36 PM
Well I Was Thinking Of Breeding And If I Do I Wont Have Any Test Run, So I Guess I Will Be A Backyard Breeder, But I Do Have A Big Backyard. Lololol Just Kidding Im Thinking Of Breeding But That Is A Long Time Away Dont Know What Will Happen By Then. The Only Thing People Say Around Here About Breeding Is, Are They Akc Registered And Skip Every Other Time The Dog Comes In Heat. What All Do I Need To Know If I Do And As I Said That Is A Long Time Away And I Dont Know Positively If I Will.

CathyBogart
09-30-2006, 06:48 PM
Why do you capitalize every word in your posts?

timlewis
09-30-2006, 07:00 PM
I dont know do you want me to stop?

CathyBogart
09-30-2006, 07:03 PM
Doesn't bother me, pure curiosity.:)

To avoid thread-stealing...

I really really liked this story. It strikes me as being a pretty accurate description of the likely results of those three choices. THanks for posting, I'm going to save this!

timlewis
09-30-2006, 07:27 PM
To be honest i dont agree just because someone sells a dog for money or whatever doesnt mean that u will get a crappy dog. tests r good but doesnt mean anything all the tests in the world cant tell u how pups will turn out. and just because they come from a less fortunate (someone who doesnt have the money for all these tests) person doesnt mean u wont get a great dog. a lot of people cant afford stuff like this, i live in a real low income area. i myself have a great job i work in the coal mines making $22.10 an hour and work 60 to 70 hours a week but a lot of people dont. so dont throw off on them for not having it done when they cant afford it. AND IM NOT TRYING TO STEAL THIS OR ANY THREAD I HARDLY EVER POST ON ANYONES THREAD.

animal_rescue
09-30-2006, 07:29 PM
I think if people can't afford to buy or adopt a dog, they shouldn't have a dog. How can they pay vet fees if they get sick or hurt?

wolf_Q
09-30-2006, 07:36 PM
To be honest i dont agree just because someone sells a dog for money or whatever doesnt mean that u will get a crappy dog. tests r good but doesnt mean anything all the tests in the world cant tell u how pups will turn out. and just because they come from a less fortunate (someone who doesnt have the money for all these tests) person doesnt mean u wont get a great dog. a lot of people cant afford stuff like this, i live in a real low income area. i myself have a great job i work in the coal mines making $22.10 an hour and work 60 to 70 hours a week but a lot of people dont. so dont throw off on them for not having it done when they cant afford it. AND IM NOT TRYING TO STEAL THIS OR ANY THREAD I HARDLY EVER POST ON ANYONES THREAD.

Yes the tests can tell you to a certain extent how the pups will turn out. If the parents of the puppies have a disease that can be inherited (like hip/elbow dysplasia, eye conditions, etc.) then it is very likely the pups will have that as well. A good breeder would CARE if they may be breeding dogs that would pass these problems on to their pups. They would want their puppies to be as healthy and the best examples of their breed as possible. They are not in it for the money. Getting a dog from a backyard breeder may not get you a "crappy dog" but its quite likely you will end up with a dog costing you money in vet bills. Not to mention there are THOUSANDS of perfectly adoptable dogs dying in shelters every DAY because there are just not enough homes for them. Can you justify adding to that just to make a few bucks? Your dog will be happier and healthier if spayed!

And as stated above, if a person can't afford testing then they can't afford a dog in the first place! A dog is not just a one time investment you have to pay for vet care, food, etc. for the lifetime of the dog! What if the dog has complications during pregnancy that require treatment?

CathyBogart
09-30-2006, 07:38 PM
Tests don't mean anything? Testing the parents for genetic traits that cause the disease can't indicate if the puppies are likely to develop that disease? If a person can't afford to have the dogs tested to make sure they aren't going to pass on epilepsy or such, and can't afford top-quality breeding stick to begin with, what are they going to do the night when the mother dog suddenly needs a C-section? IMO, any breeding should be done by people with the knowledge and experience and the top-quality dogs to IMPROVE THE BREED. If they can't afford the appropriate screening for the dogs, they shouldn't be making more of them.

Oh, and I wasn't accusing YOU of thread-stealing, I was referring to my random comment that should have been PMed as it had nothing to do with the original topic. So don't "throw off" on me before clarifying what I meant.

Danegirl2208
09-30-2006, 07:41 PM
Tests don't mean anything? Testing the parents for genetic traits that cause the disease can't indicate if the puppies are likely to develop that disease? If a person can't afford to have the dogs tested to make sure they aren't going to pass on epilepsy or such, and can't afford top-quality breeding stick to begin with, what are they going to do the night when the mother dog suddenly needs a C-section? IMO, any breeding should be done by people with the knowledge and experience and the top-quality dogs to IMPROVE THE BREED. If they can't afford the appropriate screening for the dogs, they shouldn't be making more of them.


I could not agree more Cathy..you took the words right out of my mouth.

timlewis
09-30-2006, 08:22 PM
well sorry i do apologize about the tests but i still think that what u all call a backyard breeder is fine most of the time. and if i understand this right u think that just because someones mom and dad cant afford tests and all the stuff that vets do they shuldnt get their children a dog? thats cheating the kids, around here u can go and buy the shots for parvo and any other shot u can get at the vet. now if i went to a house and the dogs didnt have any food or water and were filthy then i wouldn't buy the dog. i agree with that but just because someone doesnt have tests run and feed them name brand dog food doesnt mean that dog is going to have a bunch of disease and die at a early age. i dont even know of a breeder ( as u all describe it) around here as i said i live in a very low income area. and maybe u all r right about the tests need to be done but i have never heard of anyone who has done anything like that before. of course i dont come from a rich family and i dont know any rich people personally. so sorry if im wrong.

animal_rescue
09-30-2006, 08:32 PM
You don't need to be rich, but you should have money set aside for the dog and it's tests. It can get expensive. Besides caring about the tests will help with problems in the long run. We had 2 German Shepherds bought from a byb and both turned out extremely aggressive and untrustworthy.

If a family can't afford a dog once again how will they pay the vet bills? Just because a child wants a dog doesn't mean they should get it. A dog isn't a toy, it's a living breathing creature.

sabies
10-01-2006, 11:59 AM
There is no place I would go but a shelter for a dog. I love my pound puppy (now in her senior years) and it pains me to think of all the dogs still without homes, all the cute mutts and purebreds you can look up on petfinder.

It would be great to live in a world where "my dog is cute" was enough of a reason to breed your dog but we have a severe overpopulation problem. So many die every day for no reason other than there isn't a spot for them in this world.