BABIES! What a night

[king2005]

Vodka had 10 little ones 2 days ago. Shes a great mommy & still loves to be patted & doesn't care about me handling the little ones.. I was checking to make sure all were ok & were getting milk & they are just fine :)

Bailey was due around the sametime, so she popped lastnight. However the whole giving birth thing scared her & she was dropping babies on the cage floor (she wouldn't stay in her nest). She also wasn't cleaning the babies, but Vodka took over & so all was ok..
Wrong..
I senced Baileys fear, so I picked her up & put her into my sink with a face cloth (I was petting her head the whole time she was in the sink). She dropped a baby & wouldn't clean it, so I peeled the sack off & cut the cord 1/2 way up. The baby was fiesty, so I gave it to Vodka to finish cleaning. Bailey dropped another & this one was pail :( I picked it up anyways & tried to get him to breath.. I had no luck, so I gave it to Vodka in hopes she could save it.. the next was the same story.. then the following 3 were squeeking as soon as the sac was removed YAY!

Once Bailey was relaxed & eatting the plecenta's I put her back into her cage & she stayed in her nesting box & delivered more babies on her own. Tonight I'll see if she was able to keep these babies alive & fed. If they are ok, I'll split the litters in 1/2 & give each mother 1 1/2, so they can manage better. I'm also going to try to make a larger nesting box so Vodka & Bailey can share the sameone (they are very close).

The other girls are not very fat, so I don't think they are due this week. Vixy should be due next week & Squeeks might not even be preg, as thes still a normal size.

edit
other post (http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?t=107399)

[Khay]

.......What in the WORLD are you breeding so many of?

[king2005]

.......What in the WORLD are you breeding so many of?
read the posted link (was posted after you posted your message)

[Corinna]

Jess you need to post the link , this is why Karen wants us just to update the old ones . I would have been confused if I hadn't seen the old ones.
Congrats to both moms .

[king2005]

Jess you need to post the link , this is why Karen wants us just to update the old ones . I would have been confused if I hadn't seen the old ones.
Congrats to both moms .

I didn't want to update the other thread cause it has too many nasty pages. I wanted a clean on topic thread.. But I posted a link to the other thread regardless.

[JenBKR]

Wow lots of babies! Congrats to the mommies and good luck!

[moosmom]

Turtles, right???

[buttercup132]

Turtles, right???
No I think they are rats, turtles babies dont drink milk lol

[Logan]

Jess, Axle has to eat, so I completely understand why you do what you do, and I'm sure you do it with as much compassion as is possible. I hope the mom rats will be just fine. You hang in there and I hope you will get some sleep!

Logan

[DrKym]

Jess I am so happy to hear that they did well! My rats all live in colony housing so it's a safe bet that Vodka will adopt all of them if bailey well bails (hahaha pun not intended) but if this is Baileys first time with pups she will learn a lot.Just be careful even though they are close that with so many that one of the moms doesnt hide a few of the smaller ones. Also while mine are nursing I always add some chopped boiled egg including shell and some cottage cheese or yougurt my ladies prefer blueberry,along with their pellets and fresh veggies and fruits. Good luck and post a few pics :D

[moosmom]

Ooops, sorry! :(

[Khay]

Why in hell would you post about that here?

Talk about your pets here, not your pets' food. I don't see why breeding food is welcome to talk about here......

I find it quite offensive, and don't see this as responsible breeding in any way. Better to buy frozen food for snakes etc. than trying your hand at breeding it yourself. Poor animals.

[sasvermont]

This thread is exactly what we were driving at when someone created the "Fluffy" thread.

What the hell is this about? :confused:

[king2005]

Khay,
Vodka, Bailey & the other girls are my pets, so why is it so wrong to post about the experience I had with Bailey last night?
I'm also excited that their are babies, I shower them with as much love as I give to my pets, right up until the end. If 1 comes out stillborn, then I'll work my butt of trying to save its life, saddly those 2 didn't make it, but I did try my best & was sad that they died.

moosmom,
No sorry needed, its my fault, I didn't state what I was talking about.. my bad.

Dr.Goodnow,
Your saying egg for protein correct? I feed the gals kitten kibble for protein.. is egg better? I did give them all an egg last week, as I dropped it on the floor & I'm picky hehe I washed it off & cut it into chunks so each one could get some.

Will they eat the shell? Thats something I didn't know! Do I have to grind it up & then mix it in, or will they eat the shell on their own? I have a HUGE stock pile of egg shells that I freeze for Axle, so I have lots of that :)

Logan,
Thanks Logan, I really do care for the babies right to the last moment. I was covered in blood & goo lastnight until quite late & will do it again when the time comes.

buttercup132,
Of course turtles drink milk, you should know that! *runs of giggling*

[.sarah]

I find it quite offensive, and don't see this as responsible breeding in any way. Better to buy frozen food for snakes etc. than trying your hand at breeding it yourself. Poor animals.
So you're saying you'd rather buy an animal that has an unknown history? It could have been beaten to death and lived a cruel life, and this is better than humanely raising the feeder animals yourself?

:confused:

[king2005]

So you're saying you'd rather buy an animal that has an unknown history? It could have been beaten to death and lived a cruel life, and this is better than humanely raising the feeder animals yourself?

:confused:

Thank you. I tried getting that across in my other post.
Axle also cannot have any toxins in his food, as it effects turtles faster & more deadly then it does to cats & dogs (BHA & BHT is what I'm talking about.. just look at the Bald Eagle & what it did to their eggs). I have to feed him & hes been on a fish diet for far too long & it shows (too thin & not as healthy looking). I do welcome people to my home to see the rats, I have nothing to hide.. well maybe the clean shavings that fell onto the floor that i didn't clean up & then tracked all over my apt. So just don't look on the floor until I sweep it up! lol

[DrKym]

Yes just crush up the egg a bit with a fork and shell also, I dont use kitty kibble anymore for the girls I have better results with coat and births keeping them on a rat pellet and adding in lots of goodies like apples banana chips eggs certain cereals ( their fave is shredded wheat) of course any healthy leftovers from your dinner bones meats etc can all be given my girls and my boys are in amazing health and their vet teases me that we are breeding super rats! we have a unbelievably low rate of infant mortality so I think we must have hit something rightLOL. and use up those frozen egg shells! :D

[JenBKR]

So you're saying you'd rather buy an animal that has an unknown history? It could have been beaten to death and lived a cruel life, and this is better than humanely raising the feeder animals yourself?

:confused:

I'm with you on that sarah

[king2005]

Yes just crush up the egg a bit with a fork and shell also, I dont use kitty kibble anymore for the girls I have better results with coat and births keeping them on a rat pellet and adding in lots of goodies like apples banana chips eggs certain cereals ( their fave is shredded wheat) of course any healthy leftovers from your dinner bones meats etc can all be given my girls and my boys are in amazing health and their vet teases me that we are breeding super rats! we have a unbelievably low rate of infant mortality so I think we must have hit something rightLOL. and use up those frozen egg shells! :D

Neat, I'll make an egg & shells for them tonight!
I found this really neat mixed Rat food. It has all kinds of grains, & dried fruits in it. Also has those rat pellets & seeds. But I add frozen veggies..On hot days I give it to them frozen & they like to play with them lol I also give them the heels of my 12 grain bread (I hate the heels). I do keep healthy scraps from dinner for them. & I spoiled them with a french fry, I swear it was ONLY 1 lol I couldn't resist they could smell it & all of them were squeeking & hanging off the cage lol

I have also been spoiling the 2 mommies. I gave them breakfast in bed this morning!! I gave them 4 different kinds of veggies (put them in their nest so they wouldn't have to get up lol, it was a little chilly & i didn't want them getting up to get breakfast).

I was collecting the egg shells cause I had saved up to get a blender. I wanted to make Axle Fish Gelleton Cubes & load them with egg shell bits & add his vitamins to it. Now I just need the gelleton (I hope that stuff isn't some stupid price lol).

[IRescue452]

I'm sorry you have to go through ignorant people putting you down because of what you have to do. Its not like snapping turtles in the wild go looking for frozen and processed foods. Some people need to put their emotions asside and deal with life as it is. Congrats on the babies. I have been reading up on raw diets for animals other than dogs lately. I read an interesting study that show rats on a processed diet and on raw and their pancreas size. On raw it was .165% of body weight, on processed pellets it was.521% (very enlarged). Perhaps giving more fresh foods will provide more healthy litters to come. I'll bet that eating real prey is better for the turtle too.

[Khay]

So you're saying you'd rather buy an animal that has an unknown history? It could have been beaten to death and lived a cruel life, and this is better than humanely raising the feeder animals yourself?

:confused:

Actually my main point of my post was to not post about this here.

I come to these pet websites for enjoyment, not to hear about breeding animals for food :rolleyes: I'm sure there are forums around like that somewhere else. :rolleyes:

[king2005]

I'm sorry you have to go through ignorant people putting you down because of what you have to do. Its not like snapping turtles in the wild go looking for frozen and processed foods. Some people need to put their emotions asside and deal with life as it is. Congrats on the babies. I have been reading up on raw diets for animals other than dogs lately. I read an interesting study that show rats on a processed diet and on raw and their pancreas size. On raw it was .165% of body weight, on processed pellets it was.521% (very enlarged). Perhaps giving more fresh foods will provide more healthy litters to come. I'll bet that eating real prey is better for the turtle too.

Well isn't that super neat info!
So what would be considered a raw diet? Besides removing the kitten kibble? Should I stop using the mixed food aswell? The only processed stuff in it are these green O's & the rat pellets (those inch long greyish ones, not those green rabbit ones). Would my 12 grain bread be healthy for them on a more regular bases? I already give them veggies & banana. Would raw or cooked chicken be good for proteins? I cannot eat chicken, but I already buy it for Axle & in bulk its dirt cheap. I think hamburger would be too fattning for the rats & I know chicken is healthier for people.. What about fish? I buy frozen Sardeans for Axle, so I have those.

I;m almost finished my bag of mixed food, so if I can get lots of info on raw, I'll go that way instead!

Its funny how all my pets eat better then i do lol

[JenBKR]

Actually my main point of my post was to not post about this here.

I come to these pet websites for enjoyment, not to hear about breeding animals for food :rolleyes: I'm sure there are forums around like that somewhere else. :rolleyes:


Then perhaps you should have PM'd her about it. Personally, I see nothing wrong with her posting about it here, especially since the momma rats are pets.

[Khay]

Then perhaps you should have PM'd her about it. Personally, I see nothing wrong with her posting about it here, especially since the momma rats are pets.

Well if posting about breeding pets for food is fine around here, perhaps this is simply not the forum for me. I see it as nothing but respect to keep something like that off the boards of avid pet lovers.

Good luck to everyone and their...."pets."

[JenBKR]

Well if posting about breeding pets for food is fine around here, perhaps this is simply not the forum for me. I see it as nothing but respect to keep something like that off the boards of avid pet lovers.

Good luck to everyone and their...."pets."

Bye

[buttercup132]

Some people just dont get PT:rolleyes:

So when do we get pictures?!:D

[Logan]

Well if posting about breeding pets for food is fine around here, perhaps this is simply not the forum for me. I see it as nothing but respect to keep something like that off the boards of avid pet lovers.

Good luck to everyone and their...."pets."

There are plenty of discussions on this forum that would probably suit you fine. Why not just avoid this one? I couldn't do what Jess is having to do, but I completely understand why she does do it. But then, I don't have a turtle or a snake for a pet, either. The reason I even read her thread was that I like Jess and was interested in what she had going on.

Logan

[Jods]

Pictures are in order!!

[IRescue452]

I don't know enough about rats to know what they need. I just saw you two discussing about eggs and thought I'd share the study. I plan to have at least one guinea pig after I graduate and move so I'll probably be mixing my own food because I saw this study. I hadn't thought past dog and cat processed food before then.

[DrKym]

Jess your diet sounds great for them! I would however add the cottage cheese or yougurt. I realize axle needs healthy food also and my babies come out so nice and plump. I am not sure at what stage pinky hopper jumper etc he eats at but it may help him to gain his weight. also as a preventative as you said earlier any toxin in his diet would be very damaging (im sure you already do this but,) sterilize their water bottles at least once a week in the dishwasher and freeze all potentially harmful foods (like eggshells) so that the pets you breed are healthier and her their babies are also! again if I can help you any other way about the rats pm me. I have never lost a snake due to food related issues and have always raised their dinners. :D

[molucass]

http://ratsrule.com/diet.html

This is actually a good diet for rats, and what I fed mine when I had them.

If you can't find all the ingredients where you live, add some different things that you want to put in there. I did that too.

Instead of the innova senior dog food that she puts in it, I used another high quality brand of senior food.

The raw diet sounds like a great plan, but I also wanted to offer this up incase you still wanted to feed them a grain mix.

I've found that most premade mixes you can buy at pet stores for ratties aren't that good for them.

[DrKym]

agreed thats why i use just the pellet for teeth and add all the rest lol

[king2005]

Thanks for all the great info guys!! Its awesome!

I'll defently be going to that site later today! I used the last of the mixed food, so I'll have to buy raw foods prob by sun or mon (I have a huge dog dish & i just fill it 1/2 with food & it lasts for many days).

List of what I'll feed them (may change after i go to that site), let me know if you dissagree with anything.

-12 grain bread
-egg with shells
-frozen veggies - left frozen if its hot, otherwise thawd
-cooked chicken
-cooked chicken bones (can they eat the leg bones? cause chicken legs are cheaper as I can get them in bulk)
-cottage cheese (I ALWAYS have it in the house, I eat so much of it lol)
-Potato (would the starch be good for them when they have babies?)
-Mixed bird seed, with sunflower seeds & peanuts (I used this with my old rats & they liked it)
-Alfalfa (sp?) - only a small handfull when I clean the cages, as I know its very fatning.

Hows that so far?
I will update the list as I go on & learn..

All the wet foods will be in a different dish, then the dry foods, so they don't make the dry foods mushy & gross. I was thinking of slowly buying several of those hanging dishes, so each type of food can stay in its own dish & then I cam just change & fill that one kind of food. Would this be better? It wont be for some time, as those dishes cost 8.00 each & I just bought Mango's new tank. its a 70g for 100.00 with a stand!! My poor fish can finally have a large tank again!! My poor baby has been so mad in his tiny tank (his 55g tank blew up a couple weeks ago, been saving up for a new tank & found one yesterday!)


I'll take pictures tomorrow (going to the bar tonight with the girls to rate the guys hehehe) I did take a video of Bailey giving birth (kinda), you cannot see a baby, but you can see her contractions & her eatting a plensenta (ewww).. This was my first birth that I got to see, so I was a typical family member, HAD to take a video & ooo & aww :D I'm still all gitty from seeing it & helping out.

However there is some bad news. Bailey wasn't able to care for her babies & only 5 survived. I had to end one as its hips were dislocated & there was internal bellding & it was in a lot of pain :( This is why I check on the babies daily. A rats first litter doesn't always go well, as the mother isn't sure what to do & I know from the past, they accidently hurt the babies. I have a total of 13 babies (I removed 2 from Vodka's first litter, as they were not eatting & sickly looking & 10 was too much for Vodka's first)..

Vodka must have been teaching Bailey how to care for the babies, as BOTH females are in the 1 nest feeding the babies & they are also taking turns. The 13 remaining babies are SOOOOO fat with milk & look good :D

I checked the other 3 girls & 2 of them should be due next week, as they are tubby & putting on weight fast (I really noticed it lastnight when i was chasing them around my room (darn things love to get out when I'm cleaning & make me chase them lol).

oh I have trained them all to respond & come to me when I say "rat rat rat".. I started saying that when I added food, so now they are all coming to that, so when they get out & run off, they come when i say "rat rat rat" hehe Far easier then trying to teach them all their names & remembering which one i'm chasing lol

[molucass]

You can't give rats alfalfa because they cannot digest it. Most of them won't eat it anyway, so its usually just left in the food bowl.

[king2005]

You can't give rats alfalfa because they cannot digest it. Most of them won't eat it anyway, so its usually just left in the food bowl.

Did not know that. I wont give them the last bag I got for free.. I'll give it to someone with a bunny